/vr/ - Retro Games

[null No.2175252]

So can we agree that Rinoa is Ultimacea in the future? She becomes what she is destined to be, a sorceress, an immortal being. She is compressing time because she wants to see her childhood friends from the past again. And can we agree that Ultimacea could hace easily killed Squall and his friends if it wasnt for the love of Squall... Also Zell is Cloud and Tifas grandson.

[Anonymous No.2175268]

Holy shit, are you being serious? If so, what the fuck is wrong with you, man?

[Anonymous No.2175279]

>>2175252
I feel like I'm back in my early teens talking to my classmates.

Chill, OP, what the fuck have you been smoking all this time?

[Anonymous No.2175282]

>>2175252

FF8's storlyine, especially near the end is really stupid and poorly written.

I have a suspicion that this may have been something they thought as a possibility, but didn't impliment. Having Ultimecia as a kind of possible Rinoa future would be neat.

The whole ending sequence, and hell the plot of the entire game needs a re-write.

[Anonymous No.2175310]

>2014
>people still talk for R=U bullshit

Go back to gamefags message boards, that's where your retarded theory originated from:
http://www.scribd.com/doc/21295162/Rinoa-Ultimecia-Part-1
http://www.scribd.com/doc/21297685/Rinoa-Ultimecia-Part-2

Oh wait, even the guys who came up with the theory in the first place have figured out it doesn't hold up at all and have made an entire FAQ about it:
http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/197343-final-fantasy-viii/faqs/34215

Let it fucking go already, every single aspect of it has already been proved wrong either by the people that came up with the theory in the first place, the people who made the fucking game and most importantly the actual game itself.

Ultimecia is Rinoa's foil just like Seifer is Squall's and that is all there is to it. The only and I do mean the ONLY possible implication for R=U left in the actual game is being able to name Griever and I'm convinced its there for the exact same reason you can name Rinoa and her dog to your liking, for the potentially funny dialogue, in Griever's case try naming him to Dicks. On more serious note the possibility to name Griever was most likely intended to give a WTF?!? mindfuck moment during the fight against Ultimecia but it didn't really work out as intended as Griever was never even mentioned again between the time you named it and Ultimecia Drawing it out from Squall's mind.

tl;dr: let it go already, it being true would be nice for giving RINOA a reason to exist instead of her simply being the most annoying forced love interest ever but that simply isn't the case.

[Anonymous No.2175315]

>>2175252
Doomtrain is Thomas the tank engine in the future.

[Anonymous No.2175318]

>>2175315
Fuck you fagget, I liked Thomas the Tank Engine.

[Anonymous No.2175319]

>Rinoa is Ultimacea

Are you fucking retarded? Everyone knows that Zell = Ultimecia nowadays.

Out of constant frustration with the cafeteria being always out of hotdogs, Zell eventually starts to hate Garden and all of SeeD. So he plots his revenge. He starts of by killing Rinoa in order to inherit her sorceress powers. And we all know that sorceress powers changes your body, so in the same way that Adel's body became masculine, Zell's turned feminine. The tattoo on his face slowly changes to the markings on Ultimecia's, and ever so slowly, Zell became Ultimecia. Zell, as he demonstrates in The Deep Sea Research Facility, has knowledge of machinery, so he works Adel's seal in order to preserve himself till the future. His past GF usage causes him to forget that he was ever Zell, which is why Ultimecia asks you to reflect on your childhood, because he doesn't remember his. Find in-game contradictions that proves that Zell doesn't become Ultimecia. This would also explain why he made Seifer his knight as Edea, to get back at the years of picking on him. Make him a servant.

This makes much more sense than R=U not to mention causing less plotholes of it's own.

[Anonymous No.2175321]

>>2175319
Zell also has a hemorroid that gives him magical powers.

[Anonymous No.2175323]

come up with the next retarded FFVIII fan-theory that people will eat up and start posting everywhere as truth.

This should be easy soldier, after all people have been stupid enough to believe both R=U and Squall is dead.

[null No.2175334]

Ok but check this out. What are the chances that Kuja, Ultimicea, and Sephiroth are all related? They all have the long silver hair.. is it possible that they are all the same person?!

[Anonymous No.2175339]

>>2175319
>The entire of Final Fantasy 8 is caused by a lack of hotdogs in the cafeteria

I'm ok with this.

[Anonymous No.2175341]

Squall died in the opening cinematic. That's how he survives the iceicle through the chest. He's and unsent.

[Anonymous No.2175343]

>>2175334
i think u might be onto something

[Anonymous No.2175346]

>>2175334
>same person

Nope, the 3 are a happy family.

[Anonymous No.2175348]

>>2175343
great minds...

[Anonymous No.2175358]

>2014
>people still don't know what FF8's story was about

Edea and Cid are, essentially, the progenitors of all conflict in the story, having started the Gardens and creating the prophecy that would eventually bring about Ultimecia. The cause of Ellone's powers, the last critical piece of the puzzle, is unknown, but here's my reasoning.

Cid and Edea are sexual deviants and general wackjobs who rounded up children from across the devastated wastes of Centra. They then created all manner of abusive situations to satisfy their sick fantasies. They beat the everliving fuck out of Selphie, they kept Irvine locked outside, they institutionalized abuse of Zell, they locked Quistis in isolation, they sexually abused Squall, and they let Seifer do whatever he wanted. Ellone was the witness; she was forced to watch everything. After Ultimecia creates the time loop by giving Edea her powers, Edea is driven even madder and takes her abuses to a global scale. Using mind domination and strong-arming, she creates the Gardens, from which she seeds international conflict to create pain and suffering for all mankind.

Ellone develops her powers of hindsight by her exposure to trauma; she develops the ability to literally live in the past, where events of the present cannot harm her. Due in part to the magical interference by Edea, her powers manifest for others, making her a conduit to her memories.

[Anonymous No.2175362]

>>2175358
Squall and Co., whose memories have been blocked out as a defense mechanism, not GFs, pursue Ellone to reach further into the past and hopefully undue what has been done to Rinoa, symbolizing Squall's blind attempt to free himself from past abuse. This fails because the only people capable of affecting time are sorceresses. Rinoa becomes a sorceress, whereupon Squall forms a relationship to her due in part to his sexual devastation by sorceresses earlier in life. They then travel to the future to face their insecurities. Edea is symbolized by Ultimecia's vagina form, Cid by the whatever that he named his ring. They kill them, dispel them into time, and then must navigate the emptiness of their memories to attempt to find meaning in their lives now that they're free of the trauma. However, in doing so they ensure another generation of abuse as Squall creates the prophecy and enables Ellone to develop her power.

So in the end it was all about Cid sticking his dick in Squall's pooper.

[Anonymous No.2175363]

>>2175358
>>2175362

Nice pasta but didn't read.

a tl;dr for non-autists is in order

[Anonymous No.2175379]

>>2175252
Well no, we can't, because of course after Squall gets that ice spike in his chest at the one of disk 1, the whole rest of the game is a hallucination going on within his dying brain. I mean, DUH.

[Anonymous No.2175382]

>>2175346
>dat SNES trio
no, Kefka, don't do that, no world would be able to withstand that amount of chaos.

[Anonymous No.2175383]

>>2175379
You fucking idiot, Squall died during the opening FMV from the wound he got from taking Seifer's gunblade to his head when he got distracted from the battle by daydreaming about random fields and women.

[Anonymous No.2175387]

>>2175383

You're a fucking retard bitch stupid shit cunt pussy asshole motherfucker

if you really think that, Sir.

[Anonymous No.2175393]

>>2175252
>>2175319
You are both wrong, Ultimecia is a cheeseburger and she wanted to compress time to prevent herself from rotting, growing mold, or any other such things that happen to uneaten cheeseburgers which are subject to the passage of time. And of course, she'd want to get rid of all other beings in the universe seeing as they could potentially eat her.

[Anonymous No.2175401]

>>2175379
Your entire party gets shot, stabbed, electrocuted, set on fire and frozen in blocks of ice to name just a few of the things that happen to them on a daily basis. Since no normal human could survive all this, it's now clear to me that SeeDs are all zombies. Or androids. Or anthropomorphic personifications.

This also means that Ultimecia is a hero as she is trying to destroy all SeeDs in order to save the world from this menace.

Is this a theory we can all agree with?

[Anonymous No.2175775]

>>2175252
nah, the sorceress junction with Hyne goes through a stable line and is unique and the only reason there are two sorceresses in Squall's time is because Edea got it from Ultimecia through time. If Rinoa was Ultimecia her power would go through a stable time loop (Rinoa-Edea-Rinoa-etc...) and have no origin and a second, Hyne-junctioned sorceress would exist in the future. But since there's only the one and we know her power is Hyne's then that means the line has to go from Adel through unknown future sorceresses to Ultimecia, then to Edea and finally to Rinoa.

[Anonymous No.2175815]

>>2175315
This thread was doomed the moment OP created it, but this post makes up for it

[Anonymous No.2175838]

I never played FF8 passed disc 3.
I really don't remember much of the story. All I know is I really liked the Laguna parts.
Squall is a pretty bland main character, but at least he's not as annoying and retarded as Vaan in FF12. Holy fuck I hate Vaan so much.

[Anonymous No.2175856]

>>2175838
That's Basch Von Robsemburg of Dalmasca to you buddy. CAPTAIN Basch.

[Anonymous No.2175947]

>>2175315
He's more of a Gordon, though.

[Anonymous No.2176031]

>>2175334
>tfw she's *almost* attractive and bangable but those feet ruin it all.

[Anonymous No.2176408]

Overly interpreting stories is a sign of autism. Sometimes a crazy ass time traveling witch is just a crazy ass time traveling witch.

[Anonymous No.2176520]

Literally pierced through the heart with a giant block of ice

Even Tuxedo Mask had to become a zombie to survive that kind of shit

[Anonymous No.2176536]

>>2175315
Doomtrain is Blaine the Mono

[Anonymous No.2176595]

>>2175315

[Anonymous No.2176620]

Shes just a bitch from the future who wants to kill all Seed because they are destined to stop her

She caused this herself by sending her conciousness back into the past and possessing Edea in the first place. I blame all these theories on the fact that FF8 is poorly written trash

[Anonymous No.2176691]

>>2175252
She isn't, but the story would be better if she was, so I don't blame you for the headcanon.

[Anonymous No.2176880]

>>2176408
That was basically the plot of FF1 too when you think about it.

[Anonymous No.2178602]

>>2176520
Someone nearby had a curaga?

[Anonymous No.2178790]

>>2175252
>So can we agree that Rinoa is Ultimacea in the future?
No, because FF8 is the story of the death-dream of a schoolboy. Everything that happens after the first disc is just a hallucination of a mind that is slowly losing all of it's oxygen.

[Anonymous No.2178803]

>>2175310

FF8's storyline is really dumb and people are just trying to salvage it.

[Anonymous No.2179868]

The game would have been better if she was. It's too bad that she isn't and FF8's story is just shit. Honestly though, my biggest problem with FFVIII is the contrived love story. Are there any FF love stories done better than Locke & Celes'?

[Shitposting Tourneyfag No.2179891]

squallsdead.com

[Anonymous No.2179910]

FF8 is what happens when the group of FF7 is crammed into one room with a gas leak for three days with food supplies to make a plot for a game. Time Compression is the embodiment of all mcguffins in one.

The game itself? It's okay. I mean if you like micromanagement it's a holy grail and the cards are fun.

[Anonymous No.2179934]

>>2175319
No anon, the hotdogs are Ultimecea. Where do you think they all went? Why would a prestigious school like Balamb not have enough hotdogs? Wurst game of the FF series? I think so.

[Anonymous No.2179979]

Is it true that if I wish hard enough, I can live in Balamb Garden with all my friends just like in the dream I had?

[Anonymous No.2179985]

>>2179868
Han Solo and Chewbacca probably wasn't romantic, but it seemed like the most stable relationship in any FF game.

[Anonymous No.2179998]

>>2179868
FF9's is a far more believable love story. It starts off like most actual relationships - with Zidane just trying to get some but then develops some actual feelings for Garnet. And unlike Riona who just hits on Squall until Squall relents, Garnet resists at first, but she develops some real feelings too after Zidane slowly stops being a jokester and starts sharing personal secrets with her. As the story goes on it becomes a sort of "We've been through too much shit to deny how we feel." thing.

[Anonymous No.2180162]

It seems pretty apparent to me that FF8 is an endless time loop with Rinoa becoming Ultimecia just like Garland becomes Chaos in FF1.

Same storyline.

[Anonymous No.2180182]

>>2179998
Just like this thread

[Anonymous No.2180207]

>>2180162
>tfw Zell never gets his hotdogs.

[Anonymous No.2180209]

>>2175363
>being able to pay attention long enough to read four short paragraphs makes you an autist

[Anonymous No.2180379]

In FF7 people are blasted with fire and ice and attacked with all manner of terrifying machinery and snarling gnashing beasts

We can only assume that in these cases "dead" really means "unconscious" and that the somehow avoided taking a mortal wound, because when someone gets impaled in a cutscene, in a very definitive fashion with the object in question clearly entering one side of their body and exiting the other, they stay dead and are beyond the help of phoenix downs

in the very next game the main character is given the exact same sort of mortal wound, in fact, it looks like the thing that impales him is even larger, and he falls 50 feet of a parade float right after it happens

coming from one game to the next you would imagine that barring some very unique circumstances that deserve an explanation at some point, that he is dead

in fact, the first thing the character remarks upon waking up is about how his mortal wound has mysteriously vanished, in a way somewhat like the scar on his face hasn't. it is never mentioned again

the rest of the game is a sort of nonsense of a completely different caliber than the first disc that preceded it, almost eerily seeming to revolve around Squall and his friends and his specific mental fixations such as the Lions from his name or the girl he has a crush on or the imaginary creature he has a necklace of

the end of the game is not squall getting lost in time, it's his brain shutting down from lack of oxygen.

he dies on the street and thats when the rest of the game happens

[Anonymous No.2180401]

>>2180209

[Anonymous No.2180893]

>>2180379

Except that the ending sequence shows Riona's point of view and, after the credits, she meets Squall at the garden's balcony

[Anonymous No.2180928]

>>2180893
so your problem with it is that you don't think there's an afterlife in a fantasy videogame?

[Anonymous No.2181051]

>>2180209
Ignore him, nothing spawned from /v/ understands that most people have attention spans longer than nanoseconds.

[Anonymous No.2181169]

>>2175252
Having it be a twist that it was actually Rinoa is a hell of a lot cooler than just having her be some generic bad guy sorceress with no real backstory. I'm behind it.

[Anonymous No.2181809]

>>2175252
>Also Zell is Cloud and Tifas grandson
This guy.

[Anonymous No.2181883]

>>2181809
Okay but Edea is Terra's octaroon great grand daughter right.

[Anonymous No.2181997]

>>2180928

Not talking about afterlife. I'm talking about a girl that isn't dead meeting him, which implies neither is him.

[Anonymous No.2182010]

>>2181997
you think other people have to be dead for you to see them in your afterlife?

what if she's not real, and it's all just his hallucination of her, thinking shes real, wanting her to be real, when really, she still just wants seifer's dick instead

[Anonymous No.2182016]

>>2182010

Pretty sure they both have to be alive to hug and kiss

[Anonymous No.2182024]

>>2182016
have you ever had a dream where you were kissing a girl and totally put your dick in her vagina, but when you woke up you were still a virgin?

[Anonymous No.2182042]

>>2181997
What if this is to show that Rinoa died right after Squall and this is a new story starting from her perspective and going the way she wants it to go.

[Anonymous No.2182313]

>>2175319
If Zell-Ultimecia's GF usage caused himher to forget the past, then why would ZU punish Seifer for things he did in the past?

[Anonymous No.2182329]

>So can we agree that Rinoa is Ultimacea in the future?
I certainly do not. Even if you are joking, the theory is stupid and relies on ignoring parts of the game's story that contradict it. Squall isn't dead either, it's just as stupid and exists because people want to feel clever despite not understanding FFVIII.

[Anonymous No.2182365]

>>2175252
This is What really happened (this an old theory I posted here o vr some time ago):

The main point of the game is that you really can't change fate. Ultimecia was doomed since you started a new game, because no matter how hard she tried to change things, reality was like a river that would just go around whatever obstacle that she put in its way, and things would eventually have the same result.

In other words, Reality would ALWAYS counter whatever change Ultimecia tried to do to save in order to save herself from seeD. And you know why? because THERE CAN'T BE PARADOXES ON AN EXISTING REALITY. if it was possible for Ultimecia change the past altering the future, than paradoxes could exist, which would make this universe impossible. Because this universe exists, then every paradox is impossible. hence, every change she tries to make is already predetermined to fail.

And now for the evidence:

- She knew, by being a witch and all, that a young warrior, wielding a gunblade, with a scar on his face, that is enamored with a resistance figther that is secretly a witch, from a garden in balamb would kill her in battle. So what does she do? She ENLISTS the guy to be her (Timber tv station) knight...because she is already savy enough to realize that if she DOESN'T fight him, the prophecy CANNOT be fulfiled.

But you know what the fuck happens, ANOTHER FUCKING GUY APPEARS (SQUALL) APPEARS OUT OF NOWHERE.

She now HAS to look everywhere on existence to see if there's ANYBODY that fits the criteria of the warrior of the prophecy (Squal Torture on D-Prison). When that fails, she just straight up tries to murder everyone on balamb (Missile Base attack and Garden Fight).

- Do you notice how squall changes drastically after dealing with rinoa? Wanna know why? that's because SEIFER was originally the chosen hero to kill her, but because of her meddling in time space using Elone, REALITY COUNTERACTED and make SQUALL the new hero!

(cont)

[Anonymous No.2182369]

>>2182365
Now our emo asshole, by the power of his love for Rinoa, found strength in him that not even he knew he had (courage to save her by walking to Esthar, diving in space to save her, etc) and became A MUCH MORE CAPABLE LEADER and fighter, due to his newfound emotial growth. (does it not look weird when just a student, out of sudden, becomes the Garden leader?)

- Do you wanna know why this change was necessary? it's because Seifer was a more formidable warrior than squal ever was (the guy sliced odin in half - WITH NO GF JUNCTIONED) and squal could only beat him using - guess what - THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP (3 vs 1 battles).

Now, because seifer (the badass chosen hero) was on ultimecia's side, the new hero needed a little UPGRADE from the fates.

Rinoa (a witch) was the catalyst.

Well...fate could only act so directly through someone with 'magical' powers (Elone). so, the same way ultimecia, by virtue of being a 'witch', was able to affect reality to a certain extent, Reality - by using Rinoa - another witch - COUNTERACTED everything Ultimecia did.

The hero of the story was not squall. squal was merely the sword being used by fate itself to defend its own existence.

So, to remain in topic, Rinoa is not Ultimecia. It's her Opposite. and since the begining was destined to be so.

Sorry for the broken english, not my first language.

[Anonymous No.2182373]

>>2175310
>2014
I've got bad news, gramps.

[Anonymous No.2182395]

>>2182373
>2014
>2015
ISHYGDDT

[NESfag No.2182425]

>>2182365
>Do you notice how squall changes drastically after dealing with rinoa? Wanna know why? that's because SEIFER was originally the chosen hero to kill her

Bullshit. Seifer's dream was always to be a sorceress knight, even before Rinoa came in. He borrowed a book about sorceresses knights at the Balamb Garden library; his word stance is taken from the movie Laguna played in, movie talking about a knight protecting a sorceress. He talks about his 'dream' to Squall during the Dollet attack. He joins Edea at the end of disc1 just like that, and Edea felt he was made to be his knight. etc etc

[Anonymous No.2182438]

>>2175310
Their reasoning as to why the theory is wrong is just as flimsy as the theory itself.

This way at least we get something interesting outta the train wreck that was FFVIII.

I'd go as far as to throw Diablo in the equation as well; Squall might not be dead but he definitely has a strong affinity towards it, and it's fair to assume Diabolos is related to Lich considering both cause fractional damage.

A GF's 'raw' power is probably bigger than a witch's, meaning Squall paired with Diabolos could be the ones to break the cycle.

[Anonymous No.2182441]

>>2182425
The matter of fact is that Seifer is practically /v/ incarnated and would've been a far better protagonist.

[Anonymous No.2182675]

>>2182425
Dude i was forgeting about that whole seifer and knight thing...it's practically foreshadowing that he WAS INDEED the fated warrior. Something in his mind always drove him to sorceress (rinoa, edea), he just thought that thing was to be her knight...maybe because SORCERESS were persecuted on their society and he fancied himself as a hero, unable to hurt something that he thought was innocent. So he imagined protecting them.

>Seifer's dream was always to be a sorceress knight, even before Rinoa came in

I really didn't understand your post...i meant to say that squall only changed so much, because he was being elected, by fate or whetever, to be the new hero, since seifer, in this continuity, ceased to be the hero.

The fact that he always dreamed to be a knight was just exploited by ultimecia in seducing him easily. maybe she even implanted this fantasy in him, since you know, she was around when he was a kid (as edea).

>>2182441
Seifer was so much more interesting and layered than the Cloud 2.0 we got on ff8....

[NESfag No.2183360]

>>2182675
Your Seifer=hero thing goes completely AGAINST the story of Seifer and of the entire game.
if Seifer was the one killing ultimecia, Squall doesn't go back in time at the end of the game and doesn't tell Edea about SeeD and everything; therefore Edea doesn't get the idea of creating a SeeD school, therefore nothing in the story happens and nobody comes to kill Ultimecia.
It is an impossible paradox.

Are you going to tell me Seifer ALSO told Edea after killing Ultimecia, right?! Except that'd be entirely supposition with nothing to back it up.

Besides the whole point of the story is exactly that fate cannot be changed. Each person is destined for a role and none of that can changed. Why would that stand for Ultimecia and for Squall but not for Seifer?!

All the in game hints I mentionned >>2182425
go into the direction that Seifer was meant to be a sorceress knight, while your hypotethis is the opposite of that.

[NESfag No.2183369]

Besides, when you meet Seifer when he's at the side of Edea; he tells Squall that THIS (being a sorceress knight) is and was always his dream.

I don't believe he would be so sure of it if he was meant to be the contrary of that...

[Anonymous No.2183390]

>R=U
>Squall is dead
Both are very weak theories that don't even really work within the concepts in the game. If you must support a FFVIII fan-theory support this one because it at least makes sense and actually works within the game's world.

[Anonymous No.2183519]

>>2183390
This is just as convoluted.

[Anonymous No.2183724]

>>2183360
>Your Seifer=hero thing goes completely AGAINST the story of Seifer and of the entire game

Seifer was just MEANT to be the hero, in the story line we play, he isn't anymore. Ultimecia changed that using her powers of plot device and whatevs...game never explains.

I meant to say He was supposed to be the hero in a previous loop, that never came to be, in which everything was different, a universe in which squall was just an emo recluse and never got out of his shell, he (seifer) realized at some point (maybe after graduating to Seed) that sorcerers were bad and his infatutation with them should be altered, Rinoa married Seifer, and instead of Squall doing the final blow, it was seifer. this path was foreseen by Ultimecia and she CHANGED IT. hence, it never really came to exist.

The changes resulted in our own time line. In which Seifer never gets to change his dream, Rinoa ends up with emo, and in the end, another gunblade warrior kills ultimecia.

Here's the thing that I didn't explained before.
The different time lines are just the way FATE found to go around ultimecia meddlings so paradoxes were averted. In the end, the predetermined outcome has always been defined. Seifer was merelly MEANT to be the hero, then ultimecia would change that because she knew she would die by gunblade and thought he was the one, but then it became squall.

Ultimecia, though as powerful as she was, couldn't create paradoxes, and was limited in what she could see in the past. I think she could never have predicted that TIME could behave like that.

>Each person is destined for a role and none of that can changed. Why would that stand for Ultimecia and for Squall but not for Seifer?!

But it did! His fate and Squall's was just more convoluted, but in the end of the time line, Seifer has always been determined to fail, because his 'possible path' of being an hero would be blocked by ultimecia.

Fuck dude, I wish we were having this debate on portuguese...

[Anonymous No.2183741]

>>2181169
>implying Ultimecia is just some generic bad guy sorceress with no real backstory

>>2182313
For the same reason that RU would try to compress time to be with her past boyfriend that she doesn't remember about anymore?
Also even if she did remember him her succesfully compressing time would kill anyone but her including Squall.

[Anonymous No.2183765]

>>2183519
Not really, the only problems I see here is Rinoa not being aware of being a potential sorceress and frankly not being smart enough to plan shit like this out.

Meanwhile R=U requires several superman sized leaps of faith to be anyway plausible and you'd have to be retarded to take Squall is dead seriously when even the author of the theory says he has no real proof for his theory and specifically states this in his website:
>At the end of the article we concede that there is no real "proof", merely suggestions and hints
>The truth is, I don’t think there is a substantial amount of evidence to conclude whether or not the writers intended for the audience to interpret the game in this fashion

[NESfag No.2183772]

>>2183724
This is a pretty cool theory but there is nothing hinting at that in the game, it's all supposition.

I don't believe Ultimecia took Seifer on her side because she thought HE would kill her.
It is said in the game that each Sorceresse is linked to a knight by fate. For Ultimecia, it's Seifer, and fate brought them together just like Squall is Rinoa's knight (which explains his sudden change of behaviour as soon as she becomes a sorceress)

Of course there is always the question of "how it all started?", that you're trying to explain (though it doesn't really explains it, just changes roles around) but that's the same question one could wonder in ANY time travel story in which past and future are linked together. It's the limit of this kind of stories that we have to accept.

[Anonymous No.2183817]

when I was 14 I stopped playing at the end of disc one

he got impaled and woke up with talking lion people

obviously dead

[Anonymous No.2183820]

>>2183772
>This is a pretty cool theory but there is nothing hinting at that in the game, it's all supposition.

I agree. That's just my personal faggotry. I just enjoyed the game a lot at my teen years and I like to pretend the story was greater than the mind of the guy who created it.

Somehow it makes me feel a tiny part of the awe I felt when I first played FF8, that sense of adventure and heroism that is just impossible to feel when you are an adult and cannot look away from all the plot holes and story telling devices being used.

That shit is so easily achieved when you are a teenager.

>inb4 you're a fagget.

Well..i think I am.

[Anonymous No.2184242]

>>2183741
so ff8 was predestiantio paradox: the game all along?

[Anonymous No.2185007]

>>2176536
THIS

[Anonymous No.2185198]

>>2182365
>>2182369
>Now our emo asshole, by the power of his love for Rinoa, found strength in him that not even he knew he had (courage to save her by walking to Esthar, diving in space to save her, etc) and became A MUCH MORE CAPABLE LEADER and fighter, due to his newfound emotial growth. (does it not look weird when just a student, out of sudden, becomes the Garden leader?)
Squall becomes better, more capable leader because of Rinoa? Nope, Squall taking his comatose girlfriend to piggyback ride to Esthar and completely abandoning his leadership position and duties is the total opposite of good leadership, IIRC he even point this out himself during his walk to the salt plains.

For sake of argument let's say Balamb Garden got attacked by someone while Squall is taking his walk to Esthar. Squall who is currently assigned with leadership position is nowhere to be found to lead the people at the BG, Cid (the other leadership figure at BG) is at Edea's orphanage across the ocean and since Squall didn't assign anyone to be in charge while he is away (like a good leader would do) there would be no one there to take charge of the situation and the attack to BG would most likely be sucessful especially when Squall's buddies followed him.

What makes Squall's COMPLETE LACK of leadership and duties stand out at this time is the fact just prior to this Squall showed good leadership during the battle of Gardens when he insisted staying there to lead to counterattack instead of rushing over to save Rinoa who was a stupid bitch who fell down a cliff until his buddies literally bullied him to do that instead. This was the correct decision for various reasons the most important being that if the defense of BG were to fail due to someone taking a change of the situation everyone including Rinoa would have been killed.

[Anonymous No.2185218]

>>2185198
As for Cid "weirdly" giving Squall the leadership position of Balamb Garden it's because he knows that Squall is the "legendary SeeD" destined to defeat Ultimecia because of the time-loop in FFVIII's world. Remember it was future Squall who gave the idea of SeeDs and Garden to Edea in the past. Even if it wasn't for that concider the other candidates to take up the leadership position for a while:
Zell and Selphie are hyperactive retards, Irvine only gets shit done when bullied by someone to do things and while Quistis had the potential she lacks self confidence and fucked up badly by abanboning her duties DURING A MILITARY MISSION to apogize to Rinoa when she could have done that afterwards. Squall is actually ther only competent candidate that actually strategizes shit out, focuses on the mission and generally just gets shit done. However he basically loses all his good qualities when he suddenly start loving Rinoa when she goes into coma.
tl; dr: Squall may have grown emotionally due to Rinoa's influence but he also became worse leader because of it

Apart from that I really like your Seifer was the original destined hero theory even if only because it's the only somewhat original idea in FFVIII threads I have seen in years.

>Reality would ALWAYS counter whatever change Ultimecia tried to do to save in order to save herself from seeD
>Rinoa is not Ultimecia. It's her Opposite. and since the begining was destined to be so
This is all people need to know about Ultimecia, she tries to go against her fate but fate/reality simply doesn't allow her to win and she ends up causing the exact thing she tried to prevent in the first place. And just like someone said earlier in this thread:
Ultimecia is Rinoa's foil just like Seifer is Squall's and that is all there is to it.

[Anonymous No.2185281]

>>2175856
Why is Ondor always LYING around?

[Anonymous No.2185303]

>>2180893
>the ending sequence shows Riona's point of view

Have you ever had a dream where you were not you or you switch between different characters point of views in the same dream?

[Anonymous No.2185305]

>>2182675
So Seifer is a waifuing white knight?

[Anonymous No.2185313]

I wish FFVIII explained some more shit than it did. Like what was Elone's thing and how did it work, just what was needed for someone to be a potential sorceress, were there test for this, and I'm sure there's more but I'm too tired to think of shit.

[NESfag No.2185323]

>>2185313
Ellone's power is the biggest mystery, the one thing that's not explained at all, not a single hint is given.

We can guess that Ellone's powered is not a sorceress power, it does not come from Hyne. If it did that would mean that her power would pass through time, which would mean that Ultimecia wouldn't need to go back in time to get that power as she could get it in her own time.
that's all we can guess; but if it does not come from Hyne, where does it come from? The only answer to this is "MAGIC !".
The problem is that a power like this goes far beyond the realm of regular magic found in the world of FF8, and it is so powerful that only a God may have a power like this, yet, the story infers that it does not come from God.

I think any woman is a potential sorceress. After all, Ultimecia possessed Edea, Rinoa, and wants to possess Ellone.
Adel, too, is a woman.
My point is, it would be a huge coincidence if only those girls from the story could be sorceresses... i think any woman can become one, any woman can be possessed by other sorceresses and can inherit a dying sorceress' powers. Edea says that she inherited Ultimecia's powers because she was scared that a kid at the orphanage would get it instead, to me that implies that any (female) kid could get it.
And a woman is labeled a 'sorceress' as soon as she inherits the power OR was possessed, even though she isn't possessed anymore and don't have sorceresses powers anymore.

[Anonymous No.2185331]

>>2185323
We don't really know much about the world of FFVIII or Hyne for that matter. In universe Hyne could be nothing but some character in a story. Even if Hyne did create the world of FFVIII that doesn't exactly make him God. Him creating the world of FFVIII could be interpreted in quite a few ways. Creating a planet and then life on it is a much lower scale of power than creating an entire universe and being the one to decide how physics, time, etc work in it. But wait, Time Kompression is a thing Ultimecia can do with just half of his body or something. Shit, I should probably head to bed.

[Anonymous No.2185515]

>>2185331
Regardless of which pronoun is used to refer to Hyne, I find it curious that he split into two and the half of him left behind persists as latent magicial ability in the female human population.

[Anonymous No.2185519]

>>2185218
Don't forget about Xu, she had a handle on the Balamb civil war and is generally less ridiculous in her decision making than Quistis. She may lose points for maybe being a non-combatant though.

[Anonymous No.2185558]

>>2185218
Xu was in charge while Squall was away.
Cid was never much of a leader anyways.

As for you not thinking he's a good leader, well, I can see your point, and the best I can come up with is 'gameplay and story segregation'. because if the game was to explore squall's leader abilities some more, then it would not be a JRPG, but some sorte of RTS, or even maybe Ff8 tatics.

>>2185218
>Squall may have grown emotionally due to Rinoa's influence but he also became worse leader because of it

Dude, I have to agree with you now...but I am certain the writer wanted to pass the idea that love and empathy made Squall evolve in all areas. Typical 'love is great' bullshit.

Squall is indeed a consumated professional much more before Rinoa's influence.

[Anonymous No.2185563]

>>2185198
I keked with the pic....forgot about that...

[Anonymous No.2186802]

>>2185218
Cid could have left it to Xu, or Nida. No one remembers poor Nida but someday he will rule this Garden.

[Anonymous No.2188580]

Seriously after all these years I still don't understand the dream scenarios. Why are they there? Whats the point of it?

[Anonymous No.2188593]

I beat this game in basically a flurry of DUEL spamming with that hot dog eatin' Zell and really didn't think much other than..."ok i beat it, good...movin' right along"

the only story parts I focused on were the Laguna/Kiros/Ward parts...the actual story with the kids got so stupid after a particular scene (where they just plumb remember they all went to kindergarten together for no reason)...was so bad, honestly you shouldn't focus on convuluted shit from this game.

This and Chrono Cross really took Square into a retarded place that i don't honestly think they ever recovered from.

[Anonymous No.2188605]

>>2188580
Obviously the main point of the dream scenarios is to tell the story of Laguna and co and show some events that happened in the past but they also foreshadow certain events that are going to happen to Squall and co in near future:

Laguna meets Julia during the first dream scenario and Squall meets Rinoa shortly afterwards.
At the end of second dream scenario Laguna's group is mortally wounded and ends up apart from each other just like what happens to Squall and co. at Deling City.
During the third dream scenario we see Laguna meeting up with Kiros again mirrowing Squall's group meeting each other again shortly afterwards.
etc...

[Anonymous No.2188615]

>>2188593
>the actual story with the kids got so stupid after a particular scene (where they just plumb remember they all went to kindergarten together for no reason)...was so bad
I honestly don't get people complaining about this scene so much when the GF amnesia is foreshadowed and hinted at all the way from the beginning of the game up to the moment it comes up. Also it's point plotwise is to develop trust/bond between Squall and others (apart from Rinoa who wasn't a part of the orphanage gang) who need it later on to survive the TIME KOMPRESSION which IMHO is something people should bring up and complain about more as it literally sweeps various plotpoints under the rug. Anyway one of the main themes of the game is "Liberi Fatali" which translates into children of fate obviously referring to the orphanage gang who grew up together, end up apart from each other, eventually find each other again and save the world with *sigh* power of friendship and love *sigh* towards each other.

[Anonymous No.2188619]

>>2188605
Was the story of Laguna really that important? The foreshadowing is cool and all but is it really necessary?

My point is that I never really feelt like the dream scenarios did much more than confuse the player.

[NESfag No.2189014]

>>2188615
There is also at least 2 instances in the game where Cid wants to talk to Squall about something important and gets interrupted by Norg's guys. To me that's definitly a hint as well.

>>2188605
>>2188619
I think the main reason why Laguna's story is important is to give more weight to Squall and Rinoa's love story.

Remember, Laguna and Julia love each other, but can not get together.

Squall is Laguna's son. Rinoa is Julia's daughter.
The love between the parents was so strong that it carried it between their respective children. It's like fate wants to bring the 2 families together.

Then of course, Laguna's parts also forshadow a lot of events, important story parts like Adel, and locations.

[NESfag No.2189030]

>>2189014
>>2188619
>>2188605
And obviously it showcases Ellone and her powers, which is a very important part of the story considering Ultimecia is in that timeline FOR those powers.

[Anonymous No.2189196]

>>2175252
>So can we agree that Rinoa is Ultimacea in the future? She becomes what she is destined to be, a sorceress, an immortal being.
NOPE

http://thelifestream.net/lifestream-projects/translations/5553/a-new-seed-has-grown-translations-from-the-final-fantasy-viii-keyword-section/
>WITCHES (aka SORCERESSES )
>A Witch’s lifespan is the same as a normal human’s, however they cannot die until they have passed on their power to the next Witch.
This alone debunks the R=U theory for good especially when the Ultimania guides are written by Square/the people that made the game.

Checkmate R=Utheists.

[Anonymous No.2189197]

YOURE ALL COCK-GUZZLING THUNDER-CUNTS!!!!

[Anonymous No.2191232]

>>2175252
People on this thread need to read more Manga. Japanese fantasy stories are written for the drama and fantasy elements. That is how the Asian world thinks when they think about fiction. Only in the west do we demand an dose of reality and a reasonably logical storyline. These games were initially made for Japanese audiences. They don't make sense because they didn't have to and weren't necessarily meant to. Stop hitting yourselves over nothing.

[Anonymous No.2191326]

>>2191232
More importantly we are talking about a fantasy game that even has the word fantasy in it's name. However for some reason FF8 is often criticized for not making sense in real world standards. Any other RPG (including other FF games) always seem to get a free pass as far this is concerned even if they have modern/futuristic theme like FF8 does. WHY is this again?

Also while R=U thing is bullshit at least it's an interesting idea and I can see why some people believed it. However I can't believe some people are actually taking Squall is dead seriously. It's very weak theory with nothing really backing it up (even it's author himself admits this) and it is a blatant rip-off of various works that use the idea of main character being dead so it doesn't get any points for originality either.

[Anonymous No.2191335]

>>2175315
real talk for a minute
did anyone actually get to Doomtrain without looking up how to do so? The hints in those magazines are too vague and I'm pretty sure those are the only in-game hints about it

[Anonymous No.2193073]

>>2175252
Rinoa = Asian

Ultimecia = NOT Asian

It's that simple.

They were briefly one and the same when Ultimecia possessed Rinoa to get her to free Sorceress Adel, but that's it.

[Anonymous No.2193108]

>>2193073
To add to that Ultimecia NOT being Rinoa is a cold raw fact. There's nothing in the game that suggest Ultimecia is Rinoa. NOTHING AT ALL. It's all baseless assumptions. The fact is:
Ultimecia looks different than Rinoa
Ultimecia talks different than Rinoa
Ultimecia comes from a different time many generations away from Rinoa
Ultimecia lives in a different place than Rinoa
Ultimecia has different memories and goals than Rinoa
Ultimecia doesn't recognize Squall or Rinoa.
Ultimecia tried to kill Squall and Rinoa
Ultimecia has a different name than Rinoa
Ultimecia doesn't use/junction GFs (till the end battle)
Ultimecia doesn't have or even know about Griever until she literally pulls it out from Squall's mind
Rinoa has no Ultimecia's akkent or delicious breasts
Rinoa has no way to live for many generations to become anyone if the distant future

To R=U fanboys:
If Ultimecia was Rinoa, WHY WOULD SHE SUMMON MONSTERS TO KILL RINOA at the end of disc 1? Then at disc 3 Rinoa is left by Ultimecia to die in space (after Ultimecia is through using Rinoa's body to release Adel, she leaves her possession on her and allows her to float off into space). If Rinoa is Ultimecia, and she kills herself while she is Rinoa, then Ultimecia would never have come to be Ultimecia. It is suicide, and she would not have taken that chance.

Finally as >>2183741 said the idea of Rinoamecia compressing time to be with Squall again doesn't make any sense to begin with because she wouldn't remember Squall and others due to GF usage and even if she did him her succesfully compressing time would kill anyone but her including Squall.

[Anonymous No.2193221]

Rinoa is squall from the future

[Anonymous No.2193769]

>>2193108
You can easily say that she just plain forgot her past life.

[Anonymous No.2193885]

>>2193108
It's like you missed the entire point of the game repeatedly stating that using GFs results in memory loss. Why else would they even come up with a random fact like that if it wasn't DIRECTLY RELEVANT TO THE PLOT.

[Anonymous No.2194262]

Given all the shit brewing on the moon that gets periodically barfed onto the planet, why didn't Laguna just nuke it from orbit and wash his hands of random monster holocausts forever?

[Anonymous No.2194270]

>>2179998
I agree
I wouldn't be mad if sony releases a ps4 HD port with no loading

[Anonymous No.2194301]

>>2193769
That's kinda the point as according to the supporters of R=U Ultimecia's motivation for wanting to compress time is to be with Squall again but if she just plain forgot her past life she would NOT remember Squall to begin with so R=U contradicts itself not to mention it doesn't work with the other concepts in the game.

>>2193885
How am I missing an entire point of the game? GFs do cause memory loss as demonstrated by the "We forgot that we grew up together" scene. Also the whole point of the orphanage scene is to create a bond between the characters so they can survive the time compression later on which is DIRECTLY RELEVANT TO THE PLOT.

[Anonymous No.2194306]

>>2194301
>That's kinda the point as according to the supporters of R=U Ultimecia's motivation for wanting to compress time is to be with Squall again but if she just plain forgot her past life she would NOT remember Squall to begin with so R=U contradicts itself not to mention it doesn't work with the other concepts in the game.
But you can also say that Rinoa got so obsessed with becoming more powerful and compressing time that she forgot the reason why she wanted to do it in the first place.

[NESfag No.2194380]

>>2194306
>But you can also say that Rinoa got so obsessed with becoming more powerful and compressing time that she forgot the reason why she wanted to do it in the first place.

No you can't, considering she mentions the "legendary knight" (=the one meant to come and kill her) before the final battle

[Anonymous No.2194776]

[Anonymous No.2194780]

>>2194776
Nautilus shell hair ornaments.