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/vr/ - Retro Games


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File: 201 KB, 500x372, gasp-N64-emulation-glitch.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2164876 No.2164876 [Reply] [Original]

I used to be all into emulation and tweaking settings, but that was for like just Dolphin or PCSX2, then I moved onto more emus and I just got tired of fiddling per system per game, especially on older systems like PSX which somehow felt like it needs more dicking than newer system emulators. I tried going 14" PVM CRT but I found that too small for comfort, and hacking most disc based consoles is lots of trial and error and following barely coherent internet guides.

Should I give emulation another try? And is getting it to look like a CRT possible? (I have a 144Hz 2560x1440 monitor, I heard you can emulate CRT-like 240p or some shit on it)

>> No.2164958

every console is a different story. Some have lots of options, some don't. Some work beautifully, some are basically jerry rigged to play as many games as possible to the end, even if they look kind of fucked up sometimes and won't play without good enough hardware.

you'll have to be more specific man

>> No.2164979

>>2164876
N64 emulation will never get anywhere because people only care about the Mario, Zelda, and Rareware titles, and those all work fine with the current hacked to shit HLE emulators.

Playstation has proper emulators by now, or at least close to, but still none of them are half as simple to use as psxfin.

>> No.2165000

I find everything easy to emulate cept pc engine cd. Doesnt read iso/bin cue files. Only disks and I can't get it to find my virtual drive and i dont wanna fucking burn cds

>> No.2165007

> tfw want to write an emulator
> it's about a million times too hard
> I don't even have a clue how to reverse engineer hardware, endless hours debugging low level instruction sets..
it's just insane, how does anyone write the first emulator? or one that's better than existing ones.. I can get people just comparing their one against traces of an already written one but from scratch?

>> No.2165032

Complaining about the dicking around you have to do to get free games to work?

Then just go spend thousands on the real shit.

>> No.2165045

All depends on the system. NES and SNES are perfectly emulated, Genesis is pretty close. Playstation 1 still suffers from its PSEmu Pro heritage though projects like Mednafen are really coming around.

>> No.2165046

>>2165000
Use mednafen for PC Engine.

>> No.2165048

just play the dam game

>> No.2165065

>>2165007

Emulate something very well documented to start out.

>> No.2165269

>>2164979
>N64 emulation will never get anywhere because people only care about the Mario, Zelda, and Rareware titles, and those all work fine with the current hacked to shit HLE emulators.
mupen64plus just needs a good video plugin. GLideN64 is that plugin. The emulator has run Rogue Squadron\Naboo\Infernal Machine since 2013, yet for some reason people keep pissing and moaning about how N64 emulation will never be usable.

Cen64 will handle the "accuracy" side of things.

>> No.2165272

Depends on the emulator.

>SNES, Mega Genedrive, NES, GameCube, Neo Geo

Sure, at least on PCs

>N64, Saturn

Welcome to hell.

>> No.2165328

>>2165272
The Saturn is an instance where I believe it's better just to buy the original hardware. The swap trick is SUPER easy if you don't want to pay for games, and the consoles are $30 or less most places in my experience.

>> No.2165334

>>2165269
Custom microcodes make N64 emulation hell. Nintendo/Rare games are always the first to be emulated in a new emulator because their microcode is known.

And even in the "easier" games, like Mario 64, there are a few accuracy issues.

>> No.2165352

>>2165334
Yes, but these issues aren't unresolvable.

Cen64 will offer near-flawless N64 emulation which looks like a real N64 right down to running at native N64 resolutions.

mupen64plus and a decent video plugin will offer reasonably accurate emulation with both HLE and LLE video emulation. GLideN64 will emulate the graphics for just about every single N64 game. And while mupen64plus has core inaccuracies, these can be possibly resolved.

Mario 64's issues are also mostly understood. GLideN64 supports N64 mipmapping, meaning that stuff like Peach's painting will work without issue. It should also handle transparencies properly. Plus the plugin has vastly better framebuffer support than Glide64 and Jabo and Rice. That's just in HLE mode. As mentioned, GLideN64 will support LLE, too.

>> No.2165371 [DELETED] 
File: 56 KB, 563x542, 1417526963661.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2165371

>>2164979

>implying the N64 had other titles

The rest are either obscure, multi-plat, Had better equivalents else where.

>> No.2165383 [DELETED] 

>>2165371
Underage go home. Then play some Factor 5 games, Rocket: Robot on Wheels, Doom 64, The World is Not Enough, Duke Nukem: Zero Hour, Harvest Moon 64, Top Gear games, the RE2 N64 port with superior controls, San Francisco Rush 2049, Beetle Adventure Racing, Space Station Silicon Valley, the Vigilante 8 games, Body Harvest, Ogre Battle 64, etc, etc, etc.

>> No.2165427 [DELETED] 
File: 38 KB, 346x229, no games.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2165427

>>2165371

>> No.2165429 [DELETED] 

>>2165383

you just proved him right

The n64 was terrible

>> No.2165440 [DELETED] 

>>2165383

>Rocket: Robot on Wheels
wow, I bet people picked up the n64 just for this game, better platforms for lower budget on ps1
> Doom 64
better equivalents else where, its a multi-plat
>RE2 N64
looks like someone smeared Vaseline over the screen, its a multi-plat
>The World is Not Enough
Neither was the game, over hyped due to lack of any other games like it for the n64, way better equivalents else where.
> Duke Nukem: Zero Hour
Ps1 had better equivalents, including Duke Nukem 3D
>Harvest Moon 64
Ps1
>Top Gear games
No, way better racing games else where
>San Francisco Rush 2049
another racing game, better equivalents on ps1
>Beetle Adventure Racing
another racing game, better equivalents on ps1

On top of the carts being more expensive offering little variety blurry visuals and compressed or lack of sounds, the n64 was terrible out side of the few games that were not developed by Nintendo

ontop of that ps1 games have held up extremely well due to emulation while n64 games look like ass on the system and emulated.

>> No.2165448

>>2165440
As a kid I had a ps1 and was always jelly of my friends who had a n64 because I loved mario 64.

My dad married someone around the time the dreamcast xame out and my step brother had an n64. It didn't take long to discover I had the better system by far the entire time.

>> No.2165452

I wish I could emulate all of the n64 titles too.
But not because I think they're great, they're just games I haven't played and want to

>> No.2165456 [DELETED] 

>>2165448
>>2165440
Alright, I don't want to make this about which console is better, but I honestly never even wanted a PS1 as a kid. Sure, you guys has Marvel vs. Capcom, the Crash Bandicoot Games, Spyro, Metal Gear Solid, and... RPGs? What other games were worthwhile that weren't ports?

>> No.2165460

>>2165440
this is true

>>2165456
But so is this.

Now in the age of emulation, you can get a superior equivalent of just about anything on either system pretty easily

>> No.2165461

>>2165456

All the arcade and puzzle games

>> No.2165465

>>2165456
Dude there were like a million ps1 games

I remember going to the rental store and looking at walls of things I'd never heard of. And I read magazines back then.

It was a great time to be a gamer the hidden gems and amazing low budget titles were everywhere.

>> No.2165468

>>2165456
ps1 has monster rancher, gundam, digimon world, yu gi oh and all the best chinese cartoon shit.

n64 had shit tier chinese cartoon licenses. pokemon panel de pon, stadium is good but its limited.

>> No.2165469

>>2165461
There's literally a whole thread up about how great N64 arcade ports are and there's puzzle games too. >>2160440

>>2165465
Quantity != quality. I'd rather go to a score, pick up a game I never heard of that was fairly cheap, and have a pretty good chance of it being pretty good than buying five games for PS1 at the same price and have one mediocre one.

>> No.2165471

>>2165469
You realize ps1 had more titles widely considered as good than n64 had titles total

>> No.2165476

>>2165469

More gems and actually critically acclaimed games on the ps1 than the n64 had in it entire library.

The ps1 was quality and quantity.

The n64 also lacked any light gun games, like time crisis or point-blank, Another genre the n64 lacked

>> No.2165489

>>2165471
that's the delusion of n64 kids they think only mario 64, zelda and rareshit was good.

>> No.2165497

>>2165476
That never really bothered me too much. I owned an N64 and a PS1 as a kid, the latter had a light gun. However, I barely used it because I thought light gun games at home just wasn't as fun as going down to the arcade. Didn't help that it was really shitty to boot.

That out of the way, both consoles have amazing titles on them. Arguing about which is better is dumb when what you really should be doing is playing games on both.

>> No.2165505

>>2165456
Ape Escape
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
Cool Boarders (series)
Dino Crisis (series)
Dynasty Warriors
Front Mission (series)
Gran Turismo (series)
Jet Moto (series)
MediEvil (series)
Oddworld: Abe's (series)
PaRappa the Rapper
Policenauts
Ridge Racer (series)
RPG Maker
Silent Hill
Syphon Filter (series)
Tekken (series)
Tenchu (series)
Tomba! (series)
Twisted Metal (series)
Umihara Kawase: Shun (series)

keep going or no?

>> No.2165537

>>2165456
Just go on the recommended Wiki list and realise what a ridiculous comment you've made when it takes you an hour to scroll through it.

>> No.2165713
File: 14 KB, 259x289, 1410490609021.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2165713

>>2165440
>The World is Not Enough
>Neither was the game

>> No.2165732

Its not like the N64 didn't have good games, it was just that they were far and few between and after the constant delays the graphics at the time failed to impress me. I could count on 1 hand the games I wanted for it back then, which is why most people just bought a playstation because it had so much variety in its vast library and the games were cheaper to boot.

>> No.2165737

>>2165383
>Space Station Silicon Valley,
thats on ps1 as evos space adventures
and unlike the n64 version its actually beatable

>> No.2165745

Let's be realistic here. PS1 kids and N64 kids will never see eye to eye. PS1 kids hate the free roaming collectathons and FPS games of the N64. N64 kids hate the JRPGs and such of the PS1.

>> No.2165747

>>2165737
>>Space Station Silicon Valley,
>thats on ps1 as evos space adventures
>and unlike the n64 version its actually beatable
The PS1 port was outsourced, and is terrible.

>Axed draw distance.
>Removed levels.
>Terrible controls.
>Terrible framerate.
>Worse graphics, even during the pre-rendered cutscenes.

>> No.2165749

>>2165747
fair enough, i never played it for very long
i did play the shit out of the n64 version though

>> No.2165750

>>2165745
reality is that they are both pretty shit

>> No.2165753

>>2165732
The N64 was afflicted by a strange curse where people would rather buy the shit PS1 version of a game like Rayman 2 instead of the vastly superior N64 version. The GameCube was similarly afflicted by people preferring the awful PS2 versions of games over the vastly superior GameCube versions. The N64 has a shitload of amazing games, as does the GC, but 3rd party titles never sold all that well, despite a decent library of them.

>> No.2165754

>>2165753
>vastly superior N64
if only it didnt take the fucking memory pak
the truly superior rayman 2 was on pc/ps2/dc

>> No.2165756

>>2165745
>not being an idort

Sorry to hear about your parents' divorce, anon.

>> No.2165760

>>2165440
>>Rocket: Robot on Wheels
>wow, I bet people picked up the n64 just for this game, better platforms for lower budget on ps1
It didn't sell very well. But it is a TECHNOLOGY game. Bleeding edge tech at the time.
> Doom 64
>better equivalents else where, its a multi-plat
It's only on N64 and PC.
>The World is Not Enough
>Neither was the game, over hyped due to lack of any other games like it for the n64, way better equivalents else where.
TWINE is an excellent FPS game. Eurocom were a very good developer.
>RE2 N64
>looks like someone smeared Vaseline over the screen, its a multi-plat
Superior N64 controls make other versions less awesome to play.

>the n64 was terrible out side of the few games that were not developed by Nintendo
Untrue.

>ontop of that ps1 games have held up extremely well due to emulation while n64 games look like ass on the system and emulated.
99% of 3D PS1 games jiggle like crazy.

>> No.2165785

>>2165753

Its only a strange curse if you avoid logic. Expensive carts caused developers to stay away from making games for the N64. This was the start of Nintendo losing its biggest asset in 3rd party support that made it so dominate in the S/NES eras. In turn this caused the games to become very expensive in comparison to the CD based systems.

Again, its a testament that outside platform warrior fanboys the vast majority of consumers just want to play great games for cheap and the PS1 was far better than any system at the time at doing this.

>> No.2165790

>>2165785
That's where your logic is wrong. My entire point is the N64 had very good third party support. The problem is people didn't BUY third party games. The GC had strong third party support. People didn't generally buy third party games for the GC, either. The whole "third parties abandoned Nintendo" thing is nonsense. Despite Nintendo's best efforts to discourage "inferior" developers from making games for their consoles, heaps of devs were lining up. Stop to consider the fact that LOOKING GLASS made N64 games. Unless Sony had moneyhatted them, most of the big shot developers wanted to make N64 titles.

>> No.2165792

>>2165785
>Expensive carts caused developers to stay away from making games for the N64.
No, it just drove them to use the cheapest carts possible. That's why all 3DO games are 8MB and you had Konami cramming Castlevania: Legacy of Darkness onto a 16MB cartridge instead of a 32MB one.

>> No.2165794

NES, SNES, GB/GBC, Genesis/SEGA CD, and PS1 are all pretty much perfect. You've got Kega Fusion for all Sega consoles before Saturn. You've got puNES, Nintendulator, or Nestopia for NES; puNES being the newest (and best if you ask me, I get audio glitches in the other two). Gambatte for Gameboy. Now for PS1, you've got a mixed bag. The plugin based emulators are all fucking bad and you shouldn't use them. What you need is either Xebra (complicated to use, only works on x86, but clearly the best emulator) or Mednafen-PSX

n64, GBA, DS, PS2, Gamecube, and Wii all fall into the "OK but not quite perfect" category. n64 is notoriously bad to emulate because a lot of games require a lot of tweaking settings or just plain don't work right; the best is mupen64 for now, but Cen64 is on its way to becoming great, it's just not there yet. VBA-M is the only good GBA Emulator, and it's pretty nice, most stuff will just work; I can't speak for its accuracy though, since I've never heard it come up in a discussion. Desmume is the best DS emulator, and it's actually not bad at all if you set the CPU emulator to maximum accuracy; I've seen some graphical issues related to OpenGL/DirectX though, oddly the software rasterizer seems to produce the best picture. PCSX2 is a good emulator, but you'll definitely need to go into settings and do a bit of tweaking to get your games running well. Same deal with Dolphin, the Gamecube/Wii Emulator.

The easiest thing to do is just download Retroarch; it'll run most shit easily.

>> No.2165796

>>2165790
>The whole "third parties abandoned Nintendo" thing is nonsense.
What about square, capcom, enix, etc.
Suddenly Dragon Quest and Megaman, the biggest NES era names were on sony consoles.

>> No.2165797

>>2165792
That pretty much agrees with what he said, though.

>> No.2165798

>>2165792
If Nintendo had made use of Factor 5 and offered their tech to third parties for cheap, the n64 would have had better music and audio all round. Instead, Factor 5's pretty decent audio tech was mostly used in fucking licensed kid's games like Elmo and Tarzan and Rugrats.

Factor 5 themselves did an amazing job taking the 1GB+ Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine and compressing it down to 32MB. (Even Factor 5\Lucasarts weren't using 64MB cartridges. That's how bad the cost overheads were.)

Conker's Bad Fur Day and Perfect Dark used MP3 for voice acting, and they're the only N64 games to do so. I'm under the impression about half of Bad Fur Day's 64MB cartridge is voice acting.

>> No.2165801

>n64 had 375 total released titles
>ps1 had almost 3000

>> No.2165805

>>2165790
nice revisionism shit
u fags are in denial

>> No.2165807

>>2165797
>That pretty much agrees with what he said, though.
No, I'm saying they chose to put games on the N64 regardless of the fact they couldn't afford the larger cartridges needed to make their games shine or the codecs to compress audio. That's why Mega Man 64 is so shit. The game seems to be using uncompressed audio at a shockingly low sample rate.

>>2165796
>What about square, capcom, enix, etc.
Square's contract with Sony prohibited them from releasing games for competing platforms. Sony made Core sign a similar contract too keep Tomb Raider off Sega and Nintendo consoles until 2000. They also did stuff like acquire Psygnosis, gut them, then turn them into a Sony-exclusive studio churning out Wipeout games until they imploded.

Capcom signed a deal with Nintendo to release a number of games exclusive for Nintendo consoles. The first of these games was Resident Evil 0, an N64 games which was eventually released on the GC. Capcom spent a million dollars, allegedly, porting Resident Evil 2 to the N64.

tldr - Square stopped making Nintendo games because Sony offered them a contract that would give them a shitload of marketing but also ban them from making games for anyone else.

It's a pity Eternal Darkness was delayed and delayed, eventually becoming an excellent GC game. I think the N64 really needed those late-gen titles. Dinosaur Planet, too.

>> No.2165810

>>2165807
that just confirms what he said, no one wanted to spend money on expensive carts for a dead console

nevermind i gotta leave now

>> No.2165812

>>2165801
>>n64 had 375 total released titles
>>ps1 had almost 3000
So much shovelware. The entire point of the N64's library was to have some degree of quality control.

>> No.2165813

>>2165790
>The GC had strong third party support

If it existed in a vacuum then you could say it had strong 3rd party support. You could also say this about the Jaguar. The point you are missing is that the N64 had competition and that competition had a vastly superior 3rd party library and since the majority do not buy multiple consoles during a generation its not a stretch to say that people far more likely to buy 3rd party games had a playstation considering it had around 3x the install base.

>Despite Nintendo's best efforts to discourage "inferior" developers from making games for their consoles

Cute, so how hard did Nintendo try to stop those "inferior" developers from making crap for their 2 previous systems?

>heaps of devs were lining up

Did they line up and fall dead from waiting? N64 had less than half of the Snes's library of games. I guess publishers found out that consumers did't want to pay $70 dollars for games.

>> No.2165815

>>2165812
And they failed at that too. Iggy's wrecking balls? Superman 64? Rugrats? Aidyn Chronicles? All the terrible 3D fighters?

>> No.2165816

>>2165815
dont talk shit about iggy, faggot

>> No.2165821

>>2165810
It's not that they didn't want to, it's that they COULDN'T AFFORD IT. I know this from talking to one of the producers at 3DO.

The N64 sold 33 million units. That's far more units than the Xbox sold.

>>2165815
>And they failed at that too. Iggy's wrecking balls? Superman 64? Rugrats? Aidyn Chronicles? All the terrible 3D fighters?
Iggy's Wrecking Balls was an Acclaim Austin game. Acclaim Austin and Nintendo had a good relationship because Turok games were quality. Iggy's was an experimental game. Not for everyone, but not terrible.

Superman 64 is an odd duck. It was actually an okayish game until DC came along and completely fucked it shorty before release.

Aidyn Chronicles is... divisive. Ugly as sin, but not an awful game.

The N64's 3D fighting games are an acquired taste. Some were pretty decent.

>> No.2165824

>>2165821
>Turok games were quality.
Well, that's debatable.

>> No.2165827

>>2165824
Turok 1 was universally acclaimed.
Turok 2 was universally acclaimed.
Turok: Rage Wars was well received.
Turok 3 was also well received, despite selling poorly and being a buggy, rushed mess with glaring content cuts and completely broken enemy projectile attacks.

They are all very decent games.

>> No.2165835

As someone who grew up with an n64, I can definitively say it was shit. When I try to go back and play a lot of what I used to play as a kid, it's just awful. There are some real gems though, Zelda of course, Star Fox 64, Banjo Kazooie, Shadows of the Empire, Jet Force Gemini, Rampage-World/Universal Tour, etc. Quest 64 was OK but the game feels incomplete. I don't know if I could call them "good", but back in the day I really enjoyed Bio Freaks, Clay Fighters, and Battletanx. One of these days I need to get around to playing Ogre Battle 64; I never actually touched it because I have to finish the other games in the series first.

Goldeneye and Super Smash Brothers are two games which are just terrible to replay on n64. They make me wonder how the hell I ever enjoyed them.

>> No.2165851

>>2165835
>NO FACTOR 5 GAMES.
Pleb. But hey, at least you owned an N64.

>> No.2165852

>>2165440
>>2165760
> Doom 64
>better equivalents else where, its a multi-plat
>only N64 and PC
The 'PC version' is just a fan made mod, too.

>> No.2165859

>>2165827
acclaimed by who? players who enjoyed quake? doom? duke nukem? what? it was rather linear, level design was poor, enemy ai is shitty, and so much more. this is in every game, except rage wars which i am pretty sure was a multiplayer only game but i haven't played it yet so i am not sure. turok was praised because of it's graphics on the 64, the pc version which was superior in every way wasn't though because we had options

>> No.2165860

>>2165835
I still like battletanx though. But that's multiplat.

>> No.2165865

>>2165852
The EX version isn't just a fan made mod, it's a complete reverse engineering of the original game.

But yeah they're fucking retarded for saying that.

>> No.2165869

>>2165859
>acclaimed by who?
Critics and gamers. Turok 1 and 2 were extremely well received by both. Rage Wars was well received by critics and gamers. Turok 3 was moderately well received by critics, but since the game was a total flop, it was difficult to judge gamer reactions. Regardless, T3 has a certain following.

Turok 1 was extremely innovative. It was the first commercial game with motion capture animation, and it ran at a fast framerate thanks to short draw distance and no dynamic lighting.

Turok 2 is the chuggy Turok. Massive levels, cool weapons, very "organic" feel. Cool bosses, too.

Turok: Rage Wars is a cult classic MP game.

Turok 3 is Half Life with dinosaurs. It had terrible AI and terrible animations and was super rushed. But it has amazing character models and lots of fully voiced cutscenes.

>> No.2165898

>>2164876
"just werkz" is a fucktarded buzzword often used by loonix delusions who think there's a variant linux that can work on anything. or applefags. except for applefags it was true back when apple created everything in-house.

anyhoo forgive my ranting. megadrive and genesis emulators have matured to the point that there's a emulator that should work on even a toaster PC, or at least a pentium II. kega fusion seems to work anything modern, but there are simpler emus that have less annoying menus.

SNES is still kinda funky for a miniority of games. bsnes supposedly runs 99% of games as long as your CPU is fast enough.

PSX emus is in a similar position as SNES. but if you use only software emulation ,and don't dick around with direct X or openGL features, they're easy enough to use.

MAME still sounds horrible on many levels

nippon-only console emulators seems to be mostly neglected. that all i know.

>> No.2165904

>>2165898
dont fall for the /vr/ hype, snes9x 1.53 actually has the same accuracy as bsnes
most people probably use snes9x 1.49 from that purple outdated homepage
megadrive was one of the first systems to get emulated, over 10 years ago
epsxe 1.9 doesnt show a few background effects in obscure shit like LSD and one stage in ergheiz

>> No.2165997

>>2165898
>nippon-only console emulators seems to be mostly neglected. that all i know.

You mean Japanese-only consoles or Japanese emulators? Because I'd do some embarrassing shit a decent 3DO emulator and a N-Gage one.

>> No.2166006

>>2164876
>Deadly Arts
Interesting taste, OP. I honestly find it a bit too grindy for me, but I've had fun with it.

>> No.2166031

>>2165760
Honest question: what caused model/texture "jiggle" in PS1 games?

>> No.2166037

>>2166031
A lack of Z-buffering for starters.

>> No.2166234

>>2165904
Not entirely right. There are like 3 obscure games that have issues on everything except bsnes accurate. bsnes balanced and performance aren't worth using compared to up to date snes9x though.

So unless you're playing one of those obscure 3, or you want to emulate the Game Boy through a Super Game Boy (there may be other ways to do this I'm not aware of, but you can do it with bsnes), just use snes9x. Otherwise use bsnes accurate.

>> No.2166239

>>2166031
>>2166037
To clarify, the 3D hardware on the PS1 has no built in depth to it. Any sort of "this thing is in front of this other thing" had to be programmed in the software of the game. So just about every game does it differently, and the quality of the depth calculations had to be balanced with all the other work the CPU had to do for the game.

>> No.2166249

>>2166031
-No z-buffering
-Low precision fixed-point mathematics
-Affine texture mapping (not perspective correct)

it's barely a real 3D console because so many shortcuts are made in rendering, like saturn

nothing wrong with that of course, except from a technical perspective

>> No.2166250

>>2165794
>Xebra
>best

That shit has graphical inaccuracies Mednafen does not suffer from. It dithers stuff it shouldn't (such as backgrounds in FFIX), and even some effects are badly emulated (the motion blur effect in Silent Hill when you're loading a save file). Mednafen gets almost everything right.

>> No.2166256

>>2165835
I'll give you Goldeneye, but Smash 64 is still a solid game, even if it's completely trounced by Melee in almost every way. If anything brings down its enjoyment, it's probably the N64 pad.

>> No.2166262

>>2165904
>>2166234
http://wiki.libretro.com/index.php?title=Nintendo_SNES_Core_Compatibility

This is the full compatibility list for both Snes9x and bsnes. As you can see, Snes9x only has issues with a handful of mostly obscure titles. bsnes balanced has issues with only one game. bsnes performance is actually less compatible than Snes9x, and accuracy doubles system requirements for no gain on any game except Air Strike Patrol.

As such, the only ones worth using are Snes9x and bsnes balanced. Of the two, I still prefer balanced simply because its timings are more accurate, but for those without autism such as myself, Snes9x is more than a worthwhile alternative.

>> No.2166263

>>2165272
>Saturn
SSF, Giri Giri if you're on a toaster

There, saturn emulated.

>> No.2166273

>>2166263
SSF is the very definition of Japware. A bunch of badly organized menus with options scattered all over the place, and you can't even load images directly without going through something like Daemon Tools or some shit. Also, in my experience, it tends to have issues with fullscreen, with the screen sometimes flickering or the gameplay lagging, or even outright crashes and other fuckery.

The actual emulation quality is great, but it is a pain in the ass to actually use. Even Yabause is more straightforward, despite its subpar emulation.

>> No.2166280

>>2165851

Muh factor5

>> No.2166284

>>2166273
>Mount game
>Launch emulator
THE HARDEST EMULATOR EVER

>> No.2166286

>>2165383
>Rocket: Robot on Wheels, Doom 64, The World is Not Enough, Duke Nukem: Zero Hour, Harvest Moon 64, Top Gear games
>San Francisco Rush 2049, Beetle Adventure Racing, Space Station Silicon Valley, the Vigilante 8 games, Body Harvest, Ogre Battle 64
These all run fine on Project64 you fucking faggot, Why do you fucks keep equating "feels slightly off to me" with "SHITTIEST EMULATOR DOESN'T WORK AT ALL"

>> No.2166289

>>2165852
still better equivalents else where even if its not doom

>> No.2166297

>>2165898
>hating on MAME
Let me guess: you can't get the ROMs to load?

>> No.2166302

>>2165269
>for some reason people keep pissing and moaning about how N64 emulation will never be usable.

Do I just download the emulator, config controls, and drag a rom file into it, and have every game work? Or do I need to config shit load of plugins and settings per every game to have them run glitch free (or at all)?

>> No.2166305

>>2166297
MAME is nothing but bloatware that's barely usable and should only be used for games that don't have another emulator handy, literally any other arcade emulator is far superior

>> No.2166309

>>2166273
>you can't even load images directly without going through something like Daemon Tools or some shit.

Have you ever tried writing a cd drive emulator? Shit is fucking complex. And you also have like 8 different formats to support, not to mention that sometimes the same format has completely different shit inside (bin/cue can come in single file, multi file, as binary data, as wavs, as mp3s or even APE or FLAC, with gap data, no gap data, etc).

>> No.2166312

>>2165429
It was more of a multiplayer console.

To this day college dorms play Smash and Mario patry.

>> No.2166314

>>2166302
Yes. Contrary to what fucking retards keep saying N64 emulation is easy as shit

>PJ64 1.6, with default Jabo plugin runs 70 percent of games fine
>Rice's plugin in case Jabo's has an issue with something

>Mupen64 with Glide for games that don't work with the above configuration
WOOOOW SO MANY CONFIGURATIONS N64 EMULATION IS DOOMED

>> No.2166315

>>2166297
Not him, but for the sake of the topic at hand I'll point out that FBA is probably the best example of what we're talking about when it comes to arcades.

>> No.2166319

>>2166305
MAME is one of the best emulators I've used, I am a mac user tho.

>> No.2166326

>>2166319
>MAME is one of the best emulators I've used
You must not have used literally any other emulator

>I am a mac user tho.
Opinion disregarded

>> No.2166328

>>2166297
Mame is a bloated piece of shit by elitist smug assholes who have Stallman-level "code must be free" fetish, fuck around with coders who try to actually *improve* the clusterfuck Mame became, steal from or lie to dumpers, keep fucking with the license to the point that it pisses off everyone who wants to contribute, have contributed, or wants to use MAME for some other project, and didn't get any meaningful progress for the past 6 years or so (ever since CPS3 got cracked) other than hooking up some newly dumped roms. Actually, I think they also set up that rare one-of-a-kind Sega racing game, but that was mostly by Haze who has to be like the only mame dev who is 1. active, and 2. is not an unbearable utter fucking cunt.

They can't even agree on a single proper CD image format to use (and all the CD dumps they add to MESS are just converted bin/cue from underground gamer...).

The last time MAME was good was when Aaron Giles decided to contribute 10 cents or so for every bug fixed, and suddenly they managed to clean up half the known bugs in like a week.

>> No.2166335

>>2166305
Ahh, a fine opinion. I can tell you put a lot of thought into it.

>> No.2166336
File: 21 KB, 600x300, multi.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2166336

>>2166312

More multilayer titles on ps1 though just because the n64 had 4 controller ports it only had a hand full of titles that had 4 player

But like what was said, only decent games on the n64 were by Nintendo

smashbros is a very good franchise

Also back to the original point, you don't really emulate the 4 player games

>> No.2166338

>>2166336
>only decent games on the n64 were by Nintendo

see >>2160440

>> No.2166339

>>2166319
>Mac user
>disregards OpenEmu

>> No.2166342 [DELETED] 
File: 173 KB, 640x372, xbox11.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2166342

What about Xbox emulators? I always see Dolphin and PCSX2 getting mentioned, but no Xbox emus.

>> No.2166346
File: 18 KB, 300x300, 1413935294645.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2166346

>>2166342

>> No.2166347

>>2166342
That would be because there are no usable ones.

>> No.2166349

>>2165794
What are the differences between Xebra and Mednafen-PSX? I hear the latter one has a more accurate sound and graphics core and there are still a couple of games which have minor issues.

>> No.2166356

>>2166342
Nope, Nada, and you'll probably see a c&d if you tried. also sage for not retro.

>> No.2166357

>>2164876
From my experience any emulator for a retro videogame (gba, snes, etc) "just werks". ps1 (epsxe) and n64 (I only played zelda) just werks too. ps2... mostly works (it's possible to complete any game but it may be slower or look glitchy). DS has a few annoying UI issues I have to google to fix so I wouldn't say it "just works" but it works and GC (dolphin) doesn't work (it's too slow wtf). I doubt any gen after that works.

>> No.2166368

>>2165898
>bsnes supposedly runs 99% of games

It's actually 100%

>> No.2166386

>>2166031
People will tell you it was a lack of a z-buffer because they have no idea what a z-buffer does. It was all due to low precision math using integers giving the geometry an unstable look in motion even if it wasn't textured.

PS1 had no FPU as they were too expensive at the time to integrate into CPUs that were going to be sold in embedded consoles (for a sane price).

The Geometry Transform Engine used fixed point math so you didn't get precision of floating point math for translating coordinates. Then the GTE would send the transform as integer pixel coordinates to the GPU for drawing thus a "snapping" effect would occur when vertices moved enough.

>> No.2166389

>>2166273

Whoa dog, double clicking cd images to mount them is so hard.

>> No.2166421
File: 37 KB, 1000x352, Perspective_correct_texture_mapping.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2166421

>>2166386
>It was all due to low precision math using integers giving the geometry an unstable look in motion even if it wasn't textured.

Low precision math was only part of the problem. The Playstation also had a strictly 2d gpu. It was drawing drawing 2d triangles, same way as the Saturn (just faster and without bugs). That meant no perspective correction and no z-buffer.

No perspective correction gave you extreme texture warping, especially in motion.

No z-buffer caused jiggling and popping polygons (they couldn't decide when should one be in front of the other when two of them overlapped, so they ended up popping in front of each other back and forth),

And low precision math caused models to jiggle and have awful animation. This last part however was dependant on the game - games done by more skilful coders would have way smoother animation.

>> No.2166519

No mention of no$psx I see.
Try that shit out. No plugins. Accurate as fuck.

>> No.2166523

>>2166339
Openemu is shit and you know it.

>> No.2166539

>>2166519
Also no fullscreen.

>> No.2166569

>>2165272
Saturn is super easy

>> No.2166578

>>2165328
swap trick?

>> No.2166586

>>2166569
>Saturn is super easy

THERE IS NO OPEN SOURCE SATURN EMULATOR FOR ANDROID THAT CAN OPEN CD IMAGES WITHOUT MOUNTING AND THAT MEANS THAT THERE ARE NO SATURN EMULATORS IN EXISTENCE

which is how all people who say "Saturn emulation is horrible" think.

>> No.2166650

>>2166309
I'd have thought emulating a CD drive would be a well solved problem by now, considering how many times it has been done.

>> No.2166743

>>2166650
I think Daemon and Alcohol are still the only usable ones. Despite all the mouth-breathing free software zealots raving about it, WinCDEmu still can't mount discs with more than 1 track. Windows 8 can mount ISOs natively, but not bin/cue. I've yet to actually find an open source alternative to Daemon that does what I need it to do.

>> No.2166781

>>2166314
>>PJ64 1.6, with default Jabo plugin runs 70 percent of games fine
"fine" is open to interpretation. Broken framebuffer, broken texture filtering, missing special graphics effects across a wide range of games.

>>Rice's plugin in case Jabo's has an issue with something
Rice is terrible. Glide64 is the go-to N64 video plugin which will soon be replaced by GLideN64.

>Mupen64 with Glide for games that don't work with the above configuration
Bad idea because Mupen64plus is outdated and Mupen64plus has a shitty version of Glide64 that doesn't work properly. mupen64plus with z64 is excellent for handling games that need LLE, though.

>>2166286
>>Rocket: Robot on Wheels, Doom 64, The World is Not Enough, Duke Nukem: Zero Hour, Harvest Moon 64, Top Gear games
>>San Francisco Rush 2049, Beetle Adventure Racing, Space Station Silicon Valley, the Vigilante 8 games, Body Harvest, Ogre Battle 64
>These all run fine on Project64 you fucking faggot, Why do you fucks keep equating "feels slightly off to me" with "SHITTIEST EMULATOR DOESN'T WORK AT ALL"
The World is Not enough has sound problems on PJ64, but they can be fixed.

Beetle Adventure Racing's main menu doesn't render correctly on most plugins. Plus the method it uses for fog doesn't render right on most plugins. GLideN64 will handle it properly, though.

Many of the Top Gear games have either broken audio or broken graphics on N64 emulators.

Harvest Moon 64 has shadow rendering errors, I believe. GLideN64 fixes them.

Neither of the Vigilante 8 games currently render properly without a pixel accurate plugin.

Body Harvest has a mysterious problem which is believed to be FPU-related. Your character clips through geometry, meaning you can't climb stairs\cross bridges. Affects all emulators. Will likely be fixed in Cen64 in due time.

Ogre Battle 64 needs Glide64 to render kinda-sorta right, but even then text is filtered wrong. GLideN64 will apparently support shader-based N64-like bilinear.

>> No.2166870

>>2166284
So you play the game with your mind?

>>2165790
>My entire point is the N64 had very good third party support.
Nintendrones are funny.

>> No.2166881

>>2166870
Capcom.
DMA Design.
Acclaim.
Midway.
Activision.
Ubisoft.

Plus Japanese companies avoided the N64, so minimal weeb trash.

>> No.2166886

>>2166881
>weeb trash
>>>/v/

>> No.2166889

>>2166881
Congratulations on naming a handful of Publishers, some of which supported Nintendo's rivals greater than Nintendo itself.

>weebshit
It's a Japanese console with Japanese 1st party games.

>> No.2166895

>>2166889
>>weebshit
>It's a Japanese console with Japanese 1st party games.
And yet many of the best selling and iconic titles were British.

>> No.2166901

>>2166881
>capcom
Only the RE2 port and that was outsourced too.
Unless you're counting the disney tetris game.

>> No.2166906

>>2166895
4 of the 5 best selling N64 games are Japanese

>> No.2166908

>>2166889
>Congratulations on naming a handful of Publishers, some of which supported Nintendo's rivals greater than Nintendo itself.
That's just the surface. There's also Konami and Disney and EA (EA made heaps of N64 games) and 3DO and Looking Glass and Psygnosis and a Factor 5\Lucasarts and Atlus and Treasure and Kemco and Infogrames and even Enix published\made N64 games.

>> No.2166932

>>2166901
>>capcom
>Only the RE2 port and that was outsourced too.
>Unless you're counting the disney tetris game.
Capcom planned RE0 for the N64. It was part of their exclusivity contract with Nintendo. They spent a lot of money porting the game to N64. They also made a shit N64 port of Mega Man 64, which gives some indication of Capcom's sub-par technological prowess. IMO, RE2 was outsourced to Angel Studios, now Rockstar San Diego, because they needed a team who could actually code. The game uses Factor 5's audio compression tech, too. Plus their music engine. But stuff like the FMV engine and the data compression and all that was coded by Angel Studios.

>> No.2166937

>>2166906
>4 of the 5 best selling N64 games are Japanese
That is a fair point.

>> No.2166954

>>2166908
Why bother naming Publishers that released a few scraps on the N64? Everyone knows Treasure had a love affair with Sega.

For example, here's a list of games Konami published for the PS1:

Gokujō Parodius Da! Deluxe Pack
TwinBee Taisen Puzzle Dama
Detana TwinBee Yahho! Deluxe Pack
Eisei Meijin
J-League Winning Eleven
Jikkyou Powerful Pro Baseball '95
NBA In The Zone
Suikoden
Tokimeki Memorial: Forever With You
Bottom of the 9th
Contra: Legacy of War
Eisei Meijin II
The Final Round
Goal Storm
Gradius Deluxe Pack
International Track & Field
J-League Jikkyō Winning Eleven 97
Jikkyou Oshaberi Parodius: Forever with Me
Konami Open Golf
Lightning Legend
NFL Full Contact
Pachinko Dream
Policenauts
Project Overkill
Sexy Parodius
Snatcher
Speed King
Susume! Taisen Pazurudama
Tokimeki Memorial Private Collection
Vandal Hearts
Broken Helix
Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
Crypt Killer
Goal Storm '97
Gradius Gaiden
International Super Star Soccer Pro
Lethal Enforcers I & II
Midnight Run
Nagano Winter Olympics '98
Paro Wars
Poy Poy
Vandal Hearts
Salamander Deluxe Pack Plus
Azure Dreams
Bishi Bashi Special
Bottom of The 9th '99
The Contra Adventure
Dancing Blade Katteni Momotenshi!
G-Shock
Hellnight
International Superstar Soccer '98
Kensei: Sacred Fist
Metal Gear Solid
Nagano Winter Olympics '98
NBA In The Zone '98
Poitter's Point 2
Tokimeki no Houkago
beatmania
beatmania APPEND 3rdMIX mini
beatmania APPEND 3rdMIX
Magical Medical
Blades of Steel '99
Dance Dance Revolution
Dance Dance Revolution 2ndReMix
Dance Dance Revolution 2ndReMix Append Club Version Vol.1
Dance Dance Revolution 2ndReMix Append Club Version Vol.2
Dancing Blade Katteni Momotenshi II ~Tears of Eden~
Dancing Stage featuring True Kiss Destination
Fisherman's Bait: A Bass Challenge
GuitarFreaks
Gungage
International Track & Field 2000
Konami Arcade Classics
Metal Gear Solid: VR Missions
NBA In The Zone '99
Poy Poy 2
Silent Hill
Soul of the Samurai (Ronin Blade)
Suikoden II

>> No.2166957

>>2166954
beatmania APPEND GOTTAMIX
beatmania APPEND 4thMIX
pop'n music
pop'n music 2
Glint Glitters
Goo! Goo! Soundy
Harlem Beat: You're the One
Dance Dance Revolution 3rdMix
Tokimeki Memorial 2
Vandal Hearts II
Dance Dance Revolution Best Hits
Dance Dance Revolution Disney's Rave
Dancing Stage EuroMix (Europe)
Dancing Stage EuroMix (Australia)
Dancing Stage featuring Dreams Come True
ESPN Great Outdoor Games: Bass Fishing
ESPN MLS Game Night
The Grinch
ISS Pro Evolution
The Mummy
Oha Star Dance Dance Revolution
NHL Blades of Steel 2000
Winning Eleven 2000
Woody Woodpecker Racing
beatmania APPEND 5thMIX
beatmania BEST HITS
beatmania APPEND ClubMIX
beatmania APPEND GOTTAMIX2 ~Going Global~
beatmania (Europe)
beatmania featuring Dreams Come True
pop'n music 3
pop'n music 4
Hyper Pachinko
Genso Suiko Gaiden Vol. 1: Harmonia no Kenshi
Castlevania Chronicles
Dance Dance Revolution
Dance Dance Revolution 4thMix
Dance Dance Revolution 5thMix
Dance Dance Revolution Disney Mix
Dancing Stage Disney Mix (Europe)
Dancing Stage Disney Mix (Australia)
F1 World Grand Prix 2000
ISS Pro Evolution 2
beatmania THE SOUND OF TOKYO
pop'n music 5
Tekunobībī
Captain Tsubasa: Aratanaru Densetsu Joshou
Dance Dance Revolution Konamix
Dancing Stage Party Edition
Martial Beat
Yu-Gi-Oh! Forbidden Memories
Winning Eleven 2002
beatmania 6thMIX + CORE REMIX
pop'n music 6
Dancing Stage Fever (Europe)
Dancing Stage Fever (Australia)
Pinobee
Dancing Stage Fusion

Konami gave Sega much greater support than Nintendo, and they were on bad terms with them at the time.

>> No.2167065

>>2166908
THQ supported the N64, too.

>> No.2167076

>>2166954
>>2166957
It's not about how many games they released for the N64, it's the fact that they chose to release games on a console that was unpopular in Japan, had deliberately difficult to code for hardware, and had extremely high quality control standards that would see many games kicked firmly out the door.

>> No.2167098

>>2167076
Again, they released a greater number of higher quality titles for the Saturn, which sold slightly more in Japan and significantly less worldwide, and was harder to develop for.

>> No.2167101

>>2167098
>Again, they released a greater number of higher quality titles for the Saturn, which sold slightly more in Japan and significantly less worldwide, and was harder to develop for.
Some might argue the N64 is harder to develop effectively for. Plus weren't many of their Saturn titles 2D?

>> No.2167107

>>2167101
Never heard that argued before this thread. Some 2D, some 2D/3D, but I don't see how that's relevant.

>> No.2167116

>>2167107
It's relevant because almost nobody wanted 2D N64 games. You think N64 gamers would have been interested in 2D Castlevania games for N64? 2D JRPGs? 2D shmups?

I'm just saying that one reason the N64 library took the form it did was because that was what people wanted, in addition to the PS1 and Saturn pushing 2D into the late 90s because they had inferior hardware. The N64's could do very good 2D, but there simply wasn't the market or developer interest.

>> No.2167127
File: 12 KB, 296x296, 1332116832933.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2167127

>>2167116
>It's relevant because almost nobody wanted 2D N64 games
Oh really? Do you speak for all N64 owners?

>>2167116
>You think N64 gamers would have been interested in 2D Castlevania games for N64? 2D JRPGs? 2D shmups?

Yes?

>> No.2167136

>>2165272
>Gamecube
Come again? There's shit tons of problems with Dolphin. When I tried to play some motherfucking Target Terror, it looked like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbvuOme9vY8

>> No.2167305

>>2167116
>>2167127
Think about the reason you would develop for N64 over Playstation. It's harder to program for, it uses expensive space-limited cartridges, Nintendo's royalty rates are absolutely extreme. So why would you do it?

You'd only do it if the game you want to make is only possible on the N64 hardware.

That's why there are so many 3D platformers, 3D FPS, and 3D action-adventure games on N64 compared to its rivals. It's difficult to make those kind of games without a proper 3D GPU like only the N64 could provide at the time for consoles. The 3D platformers that were on PSX had worlds that were either very constrained (Croc, etc) or used a variety of artistic tricks to hide its limitations (Spyro's LOD engine for instance). Affine mapping et al totally mess up rendering big worlds with draw distance.

N64's perspective correction and more precise rendering doesn't require hacking together some crazy engine to make them work. That's the only reason why you'd prefer to work on N64 over PSX.

>> No.2167326

>>2167116
>You think N64 gamers would have been interested in 2D Castlevania games for N64?
Absolutely. I was jealous as fuck when I first saw Castlevania SotN, even moreso when we got our shitty Castlevania games. SotN would've been terrible on N64, they'd butcher that godly soundtrack.

>> No.2167375

>>2167326
>SotN would've been terrible on N64, they'd butcher that godly soundtrack.
With a big enough cartridge it may have been OK, but of course a sequenced remix

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuQSKUTe89g

>> No.2167386

>>2167326
>>2167375
And no loading times would speed the game up quite a bit.

>> No.2167389

>>2167386
because the corridors between areas was so slow, right

>> No.2167395

>>2167389
Right.

>> No.2167397

>>2167395
yea i know your the resident n64 autist
keep up the good work, anon

>> No.2167407

>>2167397
>your the resident n64 autist
Hey, he's not my autist.

>> No.2167425

>>2167407
yes your're are

>> No.2167431
File: 112 KB, 640x913, 57730_front.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2167431

>>2165790
>The GC had strong third party support

I wouldn't go that far. EA did strongly support the Gamecube though.

However, in recently emulating the Gamecube, I'm finding that there are a LOT of good/great games that just do not appear on the GC.

>> No.2167434

>>2165812
Yeah quality control in managing to not have a single good RPG or shmup in its entire line up.

>> No.2167732

>>2166539
nigga what

>> No.2167765

>>2167305
>N64's perspective correction and more precise rendering doesn't require hacking together some crazy engine to make them work.

The engine part would be about the same complexity on both since drawing is handled by the hardware itself, the engine is just passing the draw list to the hardware.

If anything the N64 version would be more complex since you'd have to account for the 4k texture limit and possibly for any new gfx effects as well (fogging, lightning, etc).

Also the N64 has fuck all 2d games because the 4k limit made it hard to do big sprites, you would need to subdivide a big sprite into several smaller ones. And that is always a problem since you have to hide where the sprites touch each other so they don't have any seams; made even more difficult by the mandatory bilinear filtering in early titles. Actually your best choice would be to have a character that is built out of several smaller sprites moving individually, Vectorman style, though I don't know if any games ever did that.

>> No.2167772

>>2167765
pretty sure yoshi story did that, you could confirm by dumping the textures with jabos 1.8 plugin
maybe rakugaku kids did too?

>> No.2167792
File: 37 KB, 200x200, i'm a massive fucking tool.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2167792

>N64 emulation

Just a reminder that this guy exists.

>> No.2167839

>>2167765
>The engine part would be about the same complexity on both since drawing is handled by the hardware itself, the engine is just passing the draw list to the hardware.
You do realize that drawing textured polygons far away from the camera results in affine texture perspective errors right? And potentially vertex errors as well for objects far away on the Z axis because of the low precision fixed maths?

You can't just "do it" on PSX because the renderer has so little precision. What gets drawn on the screen will not necessarily resemble what is logical in 3D because the renderer is not 100% 3D. There's a very good reason Spyro removes textures from distant polygons, and also culls the number of polygons, and it's not just to do with the polygon/fill limit.

You can just "do it" on N64 because the renderer (well, to be exact, the default microcode) is already set up to be precise 3D.

>> No.2167842

>>2167839
too bad few games used the increased draw distance then

>> No.2167853

>>2167842
Let's put it this way. When Spyro 1 was released, people were amazed that it was even possible on the hardware.

Mario 64 has longer draw distance than Spyro 1 in places.

N64 collectathons and games like OoT, do in fact have quite good draw distance.

>> No.2167858

>>2164979
Have you tried pSX?

>> No.2167861

>>2167853
I'm not disputing that, but it's still wasted potential because most 64 games had horrible pop in and thick fog all over the place.

>> No.2167862

>>2165007
Emulators may be one of the most though thing to code I suppose you have to know as much hardware as software

>> No.2167869

>>2167861
Most devs are lousy, and it was the early days of 3D programming. What's your point?

Are you pretending that the average PSX game wasn't an even great abomination?

>> No.2167872

>>2167869
jesus christ calm down my point is that no one bothered using the hardware to its full extent besides the first and second parties

>> No.2168067

>>2165007

It's much easier when you have access to SDKs and design documents.
As for starting to write an emulator, I think the Game Boy is a good place to start, though I'm not knowledgeable on the subject. The Z80 is extremely well documented and there are a lot of emulators for the Game Boy so there's a lot of reference material.

>> No.2168097

>>2166326
Instead of just blindly slamming MAME, how about recommending emulators that you don't think is complete horseshit

>> No.2168105
File: 11 KB, 300x300, dolphin.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2168105

I feel like I'm not getting the best experience out of Dolphin. Any tips?

Intel i5-3570k
Geforce GTX 660 Ti

>> No.2168107

>>2168105
you could try asking /vg/'s emulator general, this board is for old shit only

>> No.2168119

>>2166315
FBA is overrated trash used exclusively by casual assholes. 90% of MAME haters are FBA dickriders because they were too retarded to configure MAME by themselves correctly.

>> No.2168121

>>2166315
I dont get it, everything supported on fba runs at 1000% using mame on my machine and i have a toaster here

>> No.2168126

>>2165328
What about the Jaguar?

>> No.2168135

>>2166578

Swap tricks tend to be where you swap the real disc out with a burned disc after the authentication process is complete. Easy piracy.

>> No.2168136

>>2168119
Not to mention it's compatibility is way behind MAME's. FBA should only be used for CPS123/Neo-Geo roms, it's utter shit for anything else.

>> No.2168426 [DELETED] 

>>2167858
That's psxfin. [/spoiler]It's shit[/spoiler]

>> No.2168431

>>2167858
That's psxfin. It's shit

>> No.2170483

>>2168126
I don't know if Jag flashcarts exist, and Jag-CD drives are notorious for not working in general, even with official disks. Emulation is basically nonexistent outside of two or three emulators that only run Tempest 2000 (which is a great game). You basically have to have a Jaguar and the actual games to play anything but T2K and maybe AvP.

>> No.2170678

>>2168431
I still found it easier to use than anything else. All those "better" emulators out there either couldn't read my gamepad (they read analog pad as movement and auto assigned every button to analog stick on setup), or had a GUI which made it completely impossible to launch a game at the desired window size, or they just had no way to even config them.

psxfin was still the only Playstation emulator that actually WORKED FINE, last year when I wanted to re-play Final Fantasy 7.

>>2168119
>90% of MAME haters are FBA dickriders because they were too retarded to configure MAME by themselves correctly.

Actually, most of them just hate how bloated MAME has become and how completely inept and arrogant the mamedev team is.

MAME could be something great and exemplary, and instead it is the biggest fucking joke in the emulation community. Actually, I'm saying it is a joke but it's more among the lines of somewhere between sad and outrageous depending on which direction you look at it.

>> No.2170683

>>2170678
No one denies psxfin is easy to use. Its compatibility and accuracy is subpar to almost everything else, though. Of course, if all you wanna play is FFVII, literally anything will work, since that's like the first game devs try to get working when writing a new emulator.

>> No.2170714

>>2170678
>how bloated MAME has become

Bloated how? Technical reasons please.

>it is the biggest fucking joke in the emulation community.

Who is the emulation community you speak of? Give examples.

>MAME could be something great and exemplary

How so, what could make it great and exemplary in your eyes?

>Actually, I'm saying it is a joke but it's more among the lines of somewhere between sad and outrageous depending on which direction you look at it.

Personal view. Which direction should people "look" to determine if MAME is sad and or outrageous?

>> No.2170819

>>2166342

Never happening. You're better off just buying one for under $50 and softmodding it. It's actually a pretty passable emubox too.

>> No.2170904

>>2170714
>hating on best emulator of all time literally preserving arcade history
how many patches have you submitted to mame champ

>> No.2170905

^ reply to other anon ofc

>> No.2170915

>>2167116
n64 couldnt do 2d if its life depended on it. Have you played mk trilogy?

>> No.2171039

>>2170915
>n64 couldnt do 2d if its life depended on it. Have you played mk trilogy?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czY3JDaEpRA

>> No.2171101

The no 2d games Nintendro tried to impose for its console was silly. They tried to force the whole industry into making only 3d games, or at least 2.5 games like Kirby, Yoshi, Killer Instinct or Mischief Makers.
Think of all the arcade 2d fighting games the Saturn has with 1/4 of the N64 install base.
Street Fighter and Mega Man wouldn't have left Nintendo for example.

>> No.2171259

>>2171101
I don't think Nintendo had any rules against 2D games. It's more that almost nobody wanted to make pure 2D games when they had access to a bleeding edge GPU. Why would you make a 2D sidescroller when you could make a 2.5D one with less effort?

>> No.2171265

>>2171259
>Why would you make a 2D sidescroller when you could make a 2.5D one with less effort?
Because 2D looks better. SNES games usually look much better than N64 games.

>> No.2171269

>>2171265
>>Why would you make a 2D sidescroller when you could make a 2.5D one with less effort?
>Because 2D looks better. SNES games usually look much better than N64 games.
That is... a matter of opinion.

>> No.2171281
File: 69 KB, 320x237, NUTJ0001.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171281

Why don't we post pics of pure 2D or highly 2D N64 games? (Using a pixel accurate plugin, preferably.)

Notice how most of the 2D games are Japanese exclusives almost nobody has heard of?

>> No.2171325
File: 75 KB, 320x240, Super Robot Taisen 64 (J) snap0000.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171325

Couldn't get game to boot without Jabo's plugin, unfortunately. It's a strategy game which seems to be mostly 2D.

>> No.2171328
File: 65 KB, 320x237, DanceDanceRevolution.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171328

>> No.2171329

>>2171269
>>2171265

Particularly when 3D is the hot new tech everybody wanted a piece of.

>> No.2171335

>>2171281
wut gaem?

>> No.2171341

>>2171335
Nushi Tsuri 64. It's a fishing RPG thingie. It has a sequel, also on the N64.

>> No.2171342
File: 174 KB, 640x480, Yakouchuu II.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171342

Now this one is... odd. It's some sort of "sound novel"? So basically it's a VN but without much in the way of graphics.

>> No.2171345
File: 127 KB, 779x570, 64S8F97.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171345

>>2171325
What emulator are you using? I played SRW64 on Mupen64, and it works fine.

>> No.2171350

>>2171345
I was using PJ64 because Mupen64plus has no pixel accurate plugins currently. I have mupen64 somewhere on my PC.

>> No.2171354

>>2171329
to not need to buy another console to play Street Fighter Alpha 2? The SNES had a port of that and the N64 not. There definitely was something on the N64 that made companies not make 2d games for it, games they were making for the Saturn with its small userbase.

The no 2d games of the N64 hurt it more than the Final Fantasy betrayalton imo.

>> No.2171358

>>2171354
continued..
Nintendo has not had a Street Fighter since SNES, when even the Saturn and the Dreamcast had Street Fighter games.
Snes Street Fighter II and II turbo are the best selling Street Fighters ever, there was no need for Nintendo to lose that market. They lost it all with the N64, cartridges were not the only mistake.

>> No.2171365

N64 developers had this craving for 3D. Even the 2D games generally have 3D in them in some form. This rabid desire to render SOMETHING in 3D.

I seriously doubt Capcom would have put a 2D Street Fighter game on N64 if they were going to put Street Fighter on N64. They would have made it fully 3D or sprites against 3D backgrounds.

>> No.2171370

>>2171350
what the hell is pixel accurate
mupen supports glide mk2 tho, thats generally good for 2D

>> No.2171373

>>2171365
i dont think its just a craving, there was some technical aspect aswell
maybe something to do with the small texture cache

>> No.2171378

>>2171373
>i dont think its just a craving, there was some technical aspect aswell
>maybe something to do with the small texture cache
Yes and no. The N64 cache just affects texture resolution. The N64's max individual texture size is 4kb, or 64x64. 2D games don't need mipmapping. The SNES, limited to 64x64 sprites, was incapable of handling higher resolution sprites than the N64.

>> No.2171382

>>2171265
Try to imagine it's 1996 though, I remember seeing Mario 64 running on one in a store - at that time all people cared about were awesome new 3d graphics. 2d was so yesterday, definitely wouldn't sell systems. People's tastes were way different back then.

Permed hair and shoulder pads look gay as and you would be laughed at walking down the street today but in the 80's you were hip and cool. See the point?

>> No.2171384

>>2171354
Possibly a contributor but would have been mainly the lack of strong 3rd party games. There were no where near the amount of killer blockbuster titles compared to psx.

>> No.2171386

>>2171373
Stop to consider the fact that Rareware didn't release a single 2D game for the N64. Rareware, who did whatever the fuck they wanted.

I think asking why people stopped making 2D games is like asking why people stopped making point and click adventure games. The market dried up. People might say in retrospect that they really wanted 2D games, and certainly the N64 has really good 2D chops if pushed hard, but the market at the time wanted 3D.

(The N64 is capable of running Doom using only its CPU, bypassing the GPU completely and rendering pixels directly to the framebuffer. This is one feasible method of rendering games without having to deal with texture cache limits.)

Maybe someday some enterprising soul will create a homebrew N64 Street Fighter 2 port to show what the N64 can do.

>> No.2171387

>>2171365
Also 2d sprites take up lots of valuable cartridge space - MK Trilogy had heaps of frames of animation dropped compared to PlayStation version. On the plus side though, loading times. I mean they could have opted for the next cartridge size up but it would look pretty stupid when it sold for several tens of dollars more.

>> No.2171389

>>2171386
Word.

>> No.2171394

>>2171384
>Possibly a contributor but would have been mainly the lack of strong 3rd party games. There were no where near the amount of killer blockbuster titles compared to psx.
The N64 had plenty. They just failed to sell. Just like the GC. Just like the Wii. It was a combination of "Too little, too late" and Nintendo's fuck-witted marketing budgets.

Examples:
Rayman 2.
Rainbow 6.
Resident Evil 2.
Rocket: Robot on Wheels.
Shadow Man. (Vastly superior to PS1 port.)
Starcraft 64.
The World is Not Enough.
The entire Turok series.
WWF No Mercy.
Vigilante 8.

I mean, the N64 had Tony Hawk. It had 1080 Snowboarding. It had NFL Blitz. It had Harvest Moon. It had Gex 64 and Gex 3. It had Duke Nukem: Zero Hour. It had Castlevania: Legacy of Darkness. It had Space Station Silicon Valley.

The N64 has so many fantastic 3rd party titles. Titles by respected developers. But there's this baffling blindness because... it doesn't have Sony exclusives? Because game X was better on Dreamcast or PC?

>> No.2171398

>>2171394
Not to mention Lucasarts\Factor 5 making four N64 titles. Episode 1 Racer, Rogue Squadron, Battle for Naboo, and Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine. None of those games were released on PS1. Only one of them was released on Dreamcast. The other three remained N64 exclusives.

Meanwhile the PS1 had a bunch of shovelware Star Wars titles.

>> No.2171402

>>2171394
half your list is ports
shouldnt the pc version of shadowman and turok be the superior ones?

>> No.2171404

>>2171402
scratch that, that entire list is ports

>> No.2171412

>>2171404
>scratch that, that entire list is ports
No, it's not.

>> No.2171413

>>2171412
i was just kidding

>> No.2171423

>>2171386

Developers didn't stop making them and publishers didn't stop selling them during N64s run. The fact was, it was not economically desirable take a chance at possible low selling 2D titles during the 3D transition because of the costs of developing, manufacturing and distributing carts in a CD age. Especially on a Nintendo console with a low (comparatively) install base. It was a far better deal to take the risk on a console with a huge install base and lower cost to market in the playstation.

If going all in on 3D was the only path then why did the Playstation have such a large diversity of software in many genres that sold well?

Sony dominated because they changed the game with a superior software distribution model and not even Nintendo's household name and superior (on paper) hardware could do anything about it.

>> No.2171428

>>2171423
>If going all in on 3D was the only path then why did the Playstation have such a large diversity of software in many genres that sold well?
Because marketing. DMA (now known as Rockstar Games) were annoyed by how incompetent Nintendo were when it came to marketing their games, Body Harvest and Space Station Silicon Valley. Nintendo had no clue how to market a 3rd party game. They only knew how to market their own stuff, which mostly sold well.

>> No.2171430

>>2171423
Sony offered a platform where you could release shit ports of N64 games and still make more money from the shit PS1 port than the N64 original.

Nintendo was in a lose-lose situation, and the problem wasn't cartridges - it was their own pig-headedness when it came to helping out third parties.

>> No.2171440 [DELETED] 

>>2171378
>2D games don't need mipmapping.
dont you need a custom microcode to turn off the mipmapping?
Wasn't that only available at the end of the console lifetime.

>> No.2171448

>>2171423
>If going all in on 3D was the only path then why did the Playstation have such a large diversity of software in many genres that sold well?
Think about this.

The PS1 shipped 962 million game units.
The Nintendo Wii shipped 895 million.
N64 shipped 224 million.
GC shipped 208 million.

You know what changed? Nintendo finally caved in and abandoned their precious notions of "quality control" and let their console be flooded with absolute shit. Just like the PS1. The PS1 sold 3.3 million copies of FUCKING FROGGER. Nintendo might have found this approach unacceptable back then, but it works. Shit games sell remarkably well. Just look at all the awful games on the DS that outsell the quality ones by an insane margin.

>>2171440
>>2D games don't need mipmapping.
>dont you need a custom microcode to turn off the mipmapping?
>Wasn't that only available at the end of the console lifetime.
I don't think so. You can actually do a fair bit using Nintendo's default ucode. Even turn off z-buffering.

If you rendered your 2D game on the CPU and drew it directly on the framebuffer, you wouldn't even need a ucode, AFAIK. But I dunno whether Nintendo would have allowed anyone to do that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2fXAZy09b0

From what I've read, the 64Doom homebrew doesn't use the RSP at all.

>> No.2171452

>>2171448
except the n64 was full of kusoge
your delusional

>> No.2171458

>>2171452
>except the n64 was full of kusoge
>your delusional
Games had to at least pass Nintendo's painful quality control tests. Look at Superman 64. It might be shitty, but it's STABLE and shitty. (Fact: It wasn't always quite so bad. DC came along late in development and demanded a list of shit changes to the game.)

>> No.2171486

>>2171458
No, Superman 64 isn't stable. You can't finish the game.

>> No.2171491

>>2171458

>Nintendo shit is better than other shit

>> No.2171502

>>2171448
>You know what changed? Nintendo finally caved in and abandoned their precious notions of "quality control" and let their console be flooded with absolute shit. Just like the PS1. The PS1 sold 3.3 million copies of FUCKING FROGGER. Nintendo might have found this approach unacceptable back then, but it works. Shit games sell remarkably well. Just look at all the awful games on the DS that outsell the quality ones by an insane margin.
Since you are using the tried and true "They only wanted quality!" line of reasoning, riddle me this. Why was Nintendo ok putting their seal of quality on every terrible NES game and SNES game but when the N64 comes around, has a fraction of the game library of their competition and past platforms they change their tune?

Oh yes, every platform holder in the lucrative licensing/royalty business just loves selling less licences! That has to be it!

>>2171430
>problem wasn't cartridges

Yeah, to the delusional fanboys who can't accept concrete, well documented evidence to the contrary. Remember that you are in /vr/ and unlike modern console fanboyism, past market and economic realities are well documented. Nintendo had an uncompetitive royalty system and high risk maskrom logistic business model. They held on to it only because it was lucrative for them and they felt their brand name would be enough to overcome its drawbacks for publishers, retail and consumers.

>> No.2171579

>>2170714
>Personal view. Which direction should people "look" to determine if MAME is sad and or outrageous?

The dumping crew ripping off guru $7000 and that recent outrage about modifying the code license so a coders contribution is not legally their code anymore.

for starters.

>> No.2171592

>>2171354
>There definitely was something on the N64 that made companies not make 2d games for it,

Yeah, the fact that their 2d games would be showcased next to Super Mario 64 and Zelda, your game would cost 2x as much due to cartridges, and 2/3 of your profits are eaten by Nintendo. Oh and most 2d games were made in japan, where the N64 sold worse than the Saturn.

PSX and Saturn gave you way bigger profit margins so it was worth making 2d games even if you sold less copies; and both machines had a fairly healthy gallery of 2d games already (so fans of 2d games most likely already had the machine - you had a bigger userbase).

>> No.2171594

>>2171378
>Yes and no. The N64 cache just affects texture resolution. The N64's max individual texture size is 4kb, or 64x64. 2D games don't need mipmapping. The SNES, limited to 64x64 sprites, was incapable of handling higher resolution sprites than the N64.

You could just handle bigger sprites by tiling. Puyo Puyo Sun did that, I think (not just on the N64).

>> No.2171598

>>2171398
>The other three remained N64 exclusives.

Pretty sure all of them had PC ports.

>> No.2171608

>>2171373
>maybe something to do with the small texture cache
Thinking that the texture cache would have an impact on making 2D games on N64 is a complete misunderstanding of how the texture cache works. It just means you can only load 4KB of textures per pass, it doesn't limit the number of passes you can draw. It's not a limitation on what you can draw on the screen, it's just both a performance-based and convenience-based limitation. if you want a 128x128 sprite, just split the data up into four pieces and make four 64x64 passes

.>>2171448
>I don't think so. You can actually do a fair bit using Nintendo's default ucode. Even turn off z-buffering.
Nintendo provided specialty ucodes for 2D, but I'm not sure if they were ever actually used.

Given the same amount of storage space and suitable ucodes, the N64 hardware is superior at 2D (and 3D for that matter) to the Playstation in every aspect - the Playstation is only better at sound as there is no dedicated sound chip on N64)

And it should be superior to the Saturn at it as well, except perhaps in very special situations involving backgrounds

>> No.2171624
File: 429 KB, 210x110, 1403732261572.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
2171624

>>2171394
tfw WWF No Mercy is still the most solid wrestling game to date

>> No.2171681

>>2171448
>From what I've read, the 64Doom homebrew doesn't use the RSP at all.
so this crappy port is able to retain weapon animations but the official one can't? lol

>> No.2171725

>>2165352
If it supports mipmapping, does that mean things like the jigsaw puzzles and jigsaw loading animations in banjo Kazooie/tooie will work correctly? Currently under Mupen64plus with glidemk2, these are visually broken, but ultimately function correctly.

>> No.2172305

>>2171350
The libretro version has incorporated its own fork of Angrylion's plugin, although it's still fairly buggy.

>> No.2172310

>>2171370
>what the hell is pixel accurate

A plugin that outputs, pixel for pixel, exactly what the N64 hardware does. The vast majority of N64 plugins are not pixel-accurate because they employ HLE graphics emulation, so they are approximations at best, where some are better at approximating the N64 than others.

http://emulation.gametechwiki.com/index.php/Nintendo_64_emulators#High-level_vs._low-level_graphics