ITT games that are great if you try to complete them but mediocre otherwise. The opposite is also allowed.

File: 141 KB, 660x463, Smw2-front.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Sun Oct 26 13:38:58 2014 No.2029982 [Reply] [Original]

ITT games that are great if you try to complete them but mediocre otherwise. The opposite is also allowed.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 13:47:52 2014 No.2030002 >>2029982 You just posted the opposite. Getting 100% on that game is frustrating as hell. Too much shit to collect, and you have to watch out for you life points.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 13:53:14 2014 No.2030017 >>2030002 This is where the challenge comes from. It's a complete walk in the park and sucks dick if you go for a straight run. Also you can't even get the cool bonus levels if you don't go for completion. Git gud.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 13:57:35 2014 No.2030025 >>2030002 >too much shit to collect 20 red coins and 5 flower heads and you shouldn't get hit although in most levels they give you enough room to get your star meter up no matter what. That's really not that much.

>>	bububanana Sun Oct 26 14:29:47 2014 No.2030075 >>2029982 Poochie is stupid

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 14:29:55 2014 No.2030078 Yoshi's Island is mediocre whether you're going for 100% or not.

>>	bububanana Sun Oct 26 14:31:02 2014 No.2030084 >>2030025 Try 100%ing the bonus snow level l0l

>>	MATT BROWN Sun Oct 26 14:53:28 2014 No.2030162 >>2030075 Fuck Poochie

Anonymous Sun Oct 26 15:00:36 2014 No.2030181
File: 230 KB, 381x277, Yoshi's_Story_-_Screenshot_-_Cloud_Cruising.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Yoshi's Island is a great game even if you don't go for 100%.
In fact, 100%ing it can be bothersome for some people as already said.

On the other hand. Yoshi's Story's story mode sucks ass (only 6 levels), but if you unlock all 24 levels and go for a melon run it can be a decent collecthaton platformer.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 17:44:16 2014 No.2030494 >>2030002 You only really need to watch your star count on boss fights. On all the other levels, you can use a star refill item right before the goal.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 22:29:52 2014 No.2031052 >>2030002 This. Fuck Poochie, you're a stupid fuck

Anonymous Sun Oct 26 23:38:34 2014 No.2031160

>>2029982
YI is the cutesy and childish gamie for the little kiddies that we got instead of Super Mario Bros. 5 that would fuse together all that was best about SMB3 and SMW, because Nintendo decided to fuck over 80s kids and cater to 90s kids (preschoolers at that time) instead. So yea, not only fuck Poochie, but fuck YI in general.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 23:47:48 2014 No.2031174 >>2031160 Is this the birth of a new epic meme? Seriously dude, give up.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 26 23:49:07 2014 No.2031176 >>2031160 >Actually thinking Mario games were made for anyone but kids >Being this much of a tryard idiot

Anonymous Sun Oct 26 23:57:05 2014 No.2031192

>>2031176
Super Mario Bros. was directed at everyone, Miyamoto explicitly said that he picked a character who wasn't a hero in the traditional sense, but an ordinary person *everyone* could identify with. On the other hand, the fact that YI was directed at kiddies primarily is glaringly obvious (just the crayon beyond-cutesy art style is enough), if you don't realize that, noone can help you.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:02:10 2014 No.2031198

>>2031192

Considering this is /vr/ and giving yourself the benefit of the doubt that you're not a shitty /v/ troll... what makes you use the graphics argument (crayon) to say Yoshi's Island is for kids? I mean, it's also rated K-A (Kids to Adults), and it's still a fun game to play, it was when I was 10, and it still is now that I'm 30.
What's the problem with YI having that particular art style?

Also, calm down. Yoshi's Island wasn't meant to be SMB5, the SMW2 subtitle was given only in the west.

next you're gonna complain about Wario being a game for jews and bitching about Nintendo not giving a proper Super Mario Land 3 to the hardcore 80s kids Mario fans.

Give me a break dude.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:02:46 2014 No.2031202 I think I got 100% on the GBA version of Yoshi's Island. I really liked that game but that secret level with Poochie and the lake of fire was just hard man.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:04:47 2014 No.2031205 >>2031202 it was kinda easy when you figured out how to use Poochie (unless you're refering to another extra level exclusive to the GBA ver., I only played SNES)

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:06:43 2014 No.2031210 >>2031205 It was probably a level exclusive to the GBA version. I remember it being hard as hell.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:07:54 2014 No.2031214 >>2031210 There is a level with poochie that is basically all lava, it's the first extra level of world 1. Is there another one like that on GBA?

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:09:42 2014 No.2031216

>>2031198
>Yoshi's Island wasn't meant to be SMB5, the SMW2 subtitle was given only in the west.

Obviously. Nintendo of America marketeers used that made-up and shoehorned subtitle as a crutch, precisely because the were well aware that older players would be put off by the game's style.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:21:01 2014 No.2031230

>>2031198
Fact of the matter is that the last proper Mario game was Super Mario Land 2 - at least until 2006 when they returned in the form of the NSMB series.

After 1992, the Mario series was just diluted into

- Wario spinoffs (Wario Land etc.)
- Yoshi spinoffs (Yoshi's Island, Yoshi's Story, Yoshi Topsy-Turvy, etc.)
- 3D spinoffs (yes, Mario 64/Sunshine/Galaxy aren't normal Mario games, gameplay is totally different)
- RPG spinoffs (Mario RPG, Paper Mario, Thousand Year Door, M&L: Partners in Time, etc.)
- remakes/rehashes/rewhatever (Mario All-Stars, Mario Bros. Deluxe, Mario Advance series, etc.)

The only piece of new proper Mario gameplay between 1993 and 2005 were the e-reader levels for SMA4 in 2004, and it was a great waste given how unknown they were and still are, and how much more could be done with the potential given by implemetation of all that stuff in the SMB3 engine, see vid below.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy-9FAwwMvM

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:29:56 2014 No.2031251

>>2031230

Yeah I've seen the e-reader stuff, looks like a mix of SMB2, SMB3 and SMW. But mostly it's SMB3 with elements of 2 and World.
Looks like some ROMhack, I bet there are better ROMhacks out there, in fact.

Anyway, I think the fact Nintendo decided to experiment with other kind of gameplay and concepts, rather than rehashing the safe Mario formula over and over, is a positive thing.
I think a SMB5 that was just a mix of SMB3 and World would have felt unoriginal, and people would have started yelling the rehash thing even back then, like they did with the NSMB series.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:39:33 2014 No.2031265 >>2031251 And still they decided to rehash the NSMB games that are uglier and just worse than the original Mario games.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:42:55 2014 No.2031269

>>2031230
Mario 64 and Sunshine aren't different from the previous Mario games, they all follow a natural trend of increasing the amount of exploration and navigation available to the player for clearing levels, with a big focus on finding the unseen (the series has this in the form of hidden blocks, alternate exits, secret areas, hidden levels, and hidden worlds). Mario 64 and Sunshine push the bar by taking the 'choose your path' element of the Mario Bros. 3/Mario World map system and expanding it to a mission-based system where you can decide not only what levels to do but also how much of a level you want to do as requirement for beating the game (you can effectively skip 50 stars, or the equivalent of 7 whole stages and a hidden star, and still beat the game, if you so desire).

It's very different on a superficial level and I completely understand why you would say that they're different games, because I used to think the same thing. It's only recently that I reflected on the matter and found that the games really are just the next step on Miyamoto's quest toward his vision of Mario.

Personally, I think that this vision was lost after 64, that Sunshine was more of just a 'me too' game, and that Galaxy and beyond were very toned down in the exploration/discovery element to instead focus on platforming. Not a bad decision, but personally I find more value in the Miyamoto style of an exploration/discovery game than in the newer action platformer style.

I also agree with >>2031251, the constant drive to remodel Mario is what makes the classic half of the series shine compared to the last 7 years of the series. The games constantly push the boundaries of what Mario is, and in doing so creates games which are both innovative to the series and quality games in their own right. It's also what helps each game have its own identity, something that is sadly lost on modern Mario games.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 00:59:58 2014 No.2031306

>>2031251
>Looks like some ROMhack

Well, that stuff was officially made by Nintendo themselves (unfortunately released extremely poorly and then discontinued due to the failure of the e-reader), so it's tough to call it a "hack" (by that logic you'd need to call SMB2j a hack of SMB1, and SMB2us/e a hack of Doki-Doki Panic).

>I bet there are better ROMhacks out there, in fact.

There are indeed some quality hacks around which are in a similar vain, the most notable arguably being Super Mario Bros. 3 X and Super Mario Omega:

http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=section&a=images&id=6764
http://www.smwcentral.net/?p=section&a=images&id=5252

Whether they are better than the SMA4 e-reader levels is hard to say, but they do fuse SMW and SMAS in many ways just as the e-reader levels did, and are definitely some of the finest SMW hacks in existence.

>I think a SMB5 that was just a mix of SMB3 and World would have felt unoriginal

I believe that a SMB5 on the SNES was something that Nintendo kinda owed players, at least because of the fact that SMW's development team did not have the time to flesh the game out and polish it properly due to it having had to be ready for the Super Famicom's launch - it's really noticable if you're objective, especially so if you do complete runs of SMB3 and SMW back to back.

The new game wouldn't of course have to be mix of SMB3 and SMW only, it's just that these two are to this date regarded as the most important classic Mario titles. An idea of using the SMW engine and porting SMAS stuff to it (akin the what the e-reader levels did, albeit it was porting of SMAS SMB1/LL/SMB2 and SMW stuff to SMAS SMB3), along with including some ideas that were implemented in YI, could (and probably would, if it were done) have resulted in what were to be remembered as the definitive classic Mario title.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:00:33 2014 No.2031309 I just have one question for this entire thread... Who the fuck hates Yoshi's Island? Like, seriously. That shit is fun AF and I love it. I don't understand at all.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:01:21 2014 No.2031314 File: 34 KB, 421x359, 1413727822345.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2031269 >Mario 64 and Sunshine aren't different from the previous Mario games

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:03:29 2014 No.2031320 >>2031306 >akin the what *akin TO what

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:06:42 2014 No.2031328

>>2031314
They obviously are, extremely different at that.

>>2031230
>After 1992, the Mario series was just diluted into
>- Wario spinoffs (Wario Land etc.)
>- Yoshi spinoffs (Yoshi's Island, Yoshi's Story, Yoshi Topsy-Turvy, etc.)
>- 3D spinoffs (yes, Mario 64/Sunshine/Galaxy aren't normal Mario games, gameplay is totally different)
>- RPG spinoffs (Mario RPG, Paper Mario, Thousand Year Door, M&L: Partners in Time, etc.)
>- remakes/rehashes/rewhatever (Mario All-Stars, Mario Bros. Deluxe, Mario Advance series, etc.)

Another more recent family of Mario games that might be added to that list are hybrids between NSMB and the 3D branch, with titles such as Super Mario 3D Land and 3D World (some might want to include Super Paper Mario as well).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:12:38 2014 No.2031341 >>2031328 >They obviously are, extremely different at that. Extremely different doesn't even begin to describe it. The similarities can be counted on a single hand.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:17:15 2014 No.2031352 >>2031309 SMB3 shitters who hate it for ruining their "hardcore Mario series" who wanted Mario to become Mega Man where the same game (SMB3) is made every few years with only the most minor of changes.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:19:11 2014 No.2031359 >>2031352 And still a series called NSMB exists.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:19:38 2014 No.2031362

>>2031309
There's hardly any "hate towards YI" per se around here. However, YI is the result of a specific decision that was made by Nintendo at what arguably was a major turning point for the Mario series in general, and that's what the discussion is really about when happens to more or less directly reference YI.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:21:07 2014 No.2031367 >>2031359 Yes they did get exactly what they wanted. SMB3 style worlds (too many powerups, crowded and cluttered overworld) rehashed for "le classic Mario experience!". They're just mad they got it in 2006 instead of 1992

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:22:28 2014 No.2031374 >>2031367 Except that NSMB is complete shit compared to SMB3.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:23:41 2014 No.2031378 >>2031374 It's on par with classic marios (with the exception of the original and the DS one) and U offers a pretty great challenge. They're rehashes no doubt but they're decent rehashes

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:23:45 2014 No.2031381 >>2031362 >YI is the result of a specific decision that was made by Nintendo at what arguably was a major turning point for the Mario series in general What? YI was a spinoff. The next proper installment on the main Mario games after World was 64.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:26:32 2014 No.2031386 >>2031378 >It's on par with classic marios Not really. Aesthetics and music is undeniable worse while the settings don't even compare to the ones in SMB3. Challenge is also not even close to SMB3. Those games just belong in the trash.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:29:12 2014 No.2031395

>>2031386

>muh SMB3!
>muh difficulty!
>muh aesthetics!

Get over yourself, anyone with half a brain can beat SMB3, Mario games were never "hard" with the exception of 2

Aesthetics are a personal preference issue. Personally I think 3 has the worst looking ANYTHING in the series

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:30:39 2014 No.2031396 >>2031386 I thought NSMB Wii was a lot like SMB3, aesthetic-wise, except in 3D. it even has similar worlds and all, like world 2 being the egyptian world, etc.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:34:10 2014 No.2031401 >>2031381 >What? YI was a spinoff. Yes, exactly. A spinoff that took place of a SMB5 title (and that was even mislabeled as "SMW2" in the west to try and salvage some sales that otherwise wouldn't have been made due to how different it was).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:35:22 2014 No.2031403 >>2031395 You sound like a /v/ toddler but anyway, it's difference if a game provides a challenge or if it's walk in the park like NSMB. They belong to the kind of Mario games where lives are merely a running gag.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:35:55 2014 No.2031404 >>2031401 Just stop dude. I know you're trying to force your own vision, but stop. Just stop, you are wrong. it didn't took place of any SMB5 because Miyamoto wasn't going to make any SMB5 in the first place.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:35:57 2014 No.2031405 >>2031401 Are you honestly saying if they hadn't made YI they would have made this mythical SMB5 you have built up in your head?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:37:33 2014 No.2031409 >>2031403 >lives weren't a joke in SMB3 >the game which literally throws extra lives at you at any opportunity possible across the overworld Sure

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:38:59 2014 No.2031413 >>2031395 SMB3 had that magic that no other Mario title has ever managed to genuinely capture again (SMW came closest, if it had the chance to be finished properly it might have succeeded).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:39:42 2014 No.2031414 >>2031386 >Challenge is also not even close to SMB3 And SMB3's challenge is not even close to the vast majority of other NES platformers. Guess that means it's shit huh?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:40:21 2014 No.2031418 Reminder that SMB3's levels with World's physics would be a piece of cake.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:43:41 2014 No.2031427 >>2031413 I must be missing it because SMB3 isn't magical for me, it just feels like an awkward halfway point between SMB and World in both mechanics and gameplay structure.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:45:16 2014 No.2031431

>>2031405
>this mythical SMB5

The SMA4 e-reader levels (see vid in >>2031230) were a step precisely in that direction - albeit, it was a decade later than it should have been, and the execution (making it an exlusivity for an obscure handheld accessory discontinued shortly thereafter) was abysmal and killed it before it had a chance grow into anything substantial in the first place.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:45:54 2014 No.2031434 >>2031414 There is a difference between toddler difficulty and offering a challenge. >>2031418 Most retarded argument in this thread. SMB3 would be a piece of cake with Kirby physics.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:46:39 2014 No.2031435 >>2031434 Kirby is Kirby. Mario is Mario.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:47:41 2014 No.2031437 >>2031435 SMB3 is SMB3. SMW is SMW.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:47:42 2014 No.2031438 >>2031431 Dude, I have a copy of SMB5, my dad works at Nintendo, I can't show it to anyone though but it's awesome.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:49:22 2014 No.2031440 >>2031418 Why do you think so? SMB3 physics isn't really much worse than SMW. If you want to find out for yourself, play the SMW hacks that have SMB3-style level design (like SMB3X or Omega) and you'll see that they aren't necessarily that easy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:52:54 2014 No.2031448 >>2031405 The saddest thing is that "this mythical SMB5" could only have happened precisely around the time when YI came out - it didn't, and all we'll ever get instead is the NSMB series.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:53:11 2014 No.2031449

>>2031440

Yes the physics are that different.

Mario has much more control over his speed, stopping and slowing down, his position in the air, it's much easier to move exactly where you need to go as SMW Mario and 3 feels like there's significant delay in movement and every level is an ice level in comparison

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:54:15 2014 No.2031450 >>2031448 SM64 was SMB5

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:56:51 2014 No.2031457 SMW would be easy as fuck even with SMB3 physics. Alone the gamebreaking cape and the easy as fuck level design are more than enough reasons.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:56:59 2014 No.2031458

>>2031437
The SMA4 e-reader levels and the SMAS-styled SMW hacks (such as mentioned by >>2031306) are an evidence that SMB3 and SMW aren't worlds apart. Quite to the contrary, they show that the best Mario experience emerges when they are merged together in a skillful way.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:58:12 2014 No.2031461 >>2031450 >SM64 was SMB5 >SMB >didn't even have Luigi in it

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 01:58:50 2014 No.2031462 >>2031458 Show me a hack that offers a better experience than the original games.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:00:35 2014 No.2031464 >>2031449 >every level is an ice level in comparison Dunno what you're smoking, I have good control in both SMB3 and SMW. SMB1/LL physics were a bitch though compared to either SMB3 or SMW, Mario himself felt like he was made of bricks too.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:01:06 2014 No.2031465 >>2031461 L is real 2401

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:07:03 2014 No.2031470

>>2031462
"Better experience" is highly subjective, but playing Super Mario Bros 3 X or even Omega you have the feeling you're playing an actual Mario game, as opposed to almost all other hacks (which, no matter how elaborate, have a constant hack vibe to them).

Another one which might make the cut is "Return to Dinosaur Land", but it's an older vanilla SMW hack, with no SMAS elements included. It's not really better than SMW itself, but almost feels like an original level pack.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:08:57 2014 No.2031472 >>2031465 OK, so let's play "SMB5-64" together, I play Mario, you play that piece of rock which says "L is real 2401" if you examine it while being drunk enough.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:11:04 2014 No.2031475 >>2031470 "Super Mario Odyssey" is awesome too, though sadly it's only a demo with no more than 20 levels.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:14:22 2014 No.2031480
File: 65 KB, 600x417, mmakers.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Back to OP's topic:

Pic related. When I first played through the game, I was thoroughly unimpressed. Easy platforming, easy puzzles, easy combat. I think I beat the game the day that I got it. Marina doesn't walk very fast, your natural inclination is to just kind of plod through the game, toss some shit around.

Trying to S rank every level somehow makes this game godlike. It's like the game was really truly meant to be played as fast as you fucking can, SPEED BOOSTIN SLIDE JUMPIN WAR MACHINE MARINA. Fighting Cerberus Alpha like a madman on crack is about as fun as screaming full blast through Mega Man X.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:15:19 2014 No.2031482 File: 12 KB, 176x152, 1414262395157.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2031450

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:21:03 2014 No.2031494 >>2031480 OP here. It's hilarious to see a genuine post after 68 shitposts. Thank you.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:29:32 2014 No.2031514 >>2031494 A discussion that goes off on a tangent isn't necessarily "shitposts". That's more what pointless trolling is, but admittedly I haven't hardly seen any in this thread.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:37:27 2014 No.2031521

>>2031514
Nah, fuck everyone. I expected deviations from the main topic in the form of discussion and telling stories about completing games in general. How it's sometimes worth it and sometimes just a giant unchallenging time sink. What kind of mechanics make completing games hell and what kind of mechanics and details make it enjoyable and motivating.

What I got was the typical SMB3/SMW/YI shitpost orgy.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:42:35 2014 No.2031526 >>2031521 > deez ppl wont talk about wut I want :( fuk every1 Boo hoo.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:46:36 2014 No.2031530 File: 11 KB, 251x226, 1396622293166.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2031526

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:46:58 2014 No.2031532 >>2031494 I tried OP.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:50:42 2014 No.2031539 >>2031530 No, Pooh. I said "boo hoo." Get your ears checked.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:52:20 2014 No.2031542 >>2030078 This.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:53:55 2014 No.2031546

>>2031521
>What I got was the typical SMB3/SMW/YI shitpost orgy.

Again, while I agree the discussion went off on a tangent, I don't frankly see much classic "shitposting" in there. For the most part it seems to be a valid discussion with lots of good arguments and points made on what the "definitive Mario experience" is, how Yoshi (YI in particular) and other Mario spinoffs differ from it, and what could have been different and how if Nintendo had made different choices somewhere down the path.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:57:46 2014 No.2031556

I would say most games offer a better experience if you at least try to complete them. Resident Evil 2 for example isn't bad or mediocre if you go for a single run, but I would say it gets several times better if you complete it. Games like Pokemon Snap don't even offer much of a game if you don try to complete them. Digimon World 1 was a game where I gave up on completing it because it was obvious that it was more a tedious chore than something fun to do.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:57:49 2014 No.2031557 >>2031542 Seconded.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 02:59:13 2014 No.2031558 >>2031542 >>2031557 >3edgy5me Feeding the trolls, but what exactly didn't you like about it?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:00:48 2014 No.2031562 >>2031427 Yes, you must be missing it then, sadly. And to me SMW feels like the awkward game that tried (and admittedly had the potential) to become a SMB3 on steroids, but didn't quite cut it due to time constraints and whatnot.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:02:17 2014 No.2031569

>>2031546
You seem to be new on /v/. This discussion is already a meme on here. Those arguments were posted already a hundred times. Just a few days back there was the famous SMW vs SMB3 thread. SMW vs YI is also pretty common.

I posted the thread because I hated Yoshi's Island when I went for a plain playtrough but it was an entirely different experience trying to complete it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:02:42 2014 No.2031570 >>2031558 >inb4 "it wasn't SMB5"

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:04:28 2014 No.2031572 >>2031569 >new on /v/ >/v/ go back to /v/

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:06:50 2014 No.2031578 File: 879 KB, 229x188, 568694946.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2031572

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:10:56 2014 No.2031585

>>2031558
Mainly, it preoccupying Nintendo who could take SMW, SMAS, and the SMA4 e-reader levels concept that occured to them a decade too late, and make the definitive SMB game.

Apart from that:

- Yoshi being the main character
- silly art style going way over itself with the cutieness and "muh kindergarten art"
- silly story shoehorning into the Mario canon the idea that Yoshi had always played a role in it
- SHUT THE FUCK UP BABY MARIO

I probably missed something, but the above are probably the most significant points anyway.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:11:23 2014 No.2031586 File: 313 KB, 608x459, pokemonsnaptitle.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:13:46 2014 No.2031591

>>2031585
alright... well that's reasonable, actually.
baby mario is perhaps the most annoying sound in all of SNES history.., I suppose I see where you're coming from... but you have to admit the level design and soundtrack were impressive, which is more important to me enough to merit forgiving the rest

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:15:16 2014 No.2031592

>>2031558
Most of the levels still aren't difficult on a 100% run. You just have to spend more time in them scouring the level for red coins and keys, which is even more tedious than the main game. A few solid challenges at the end don't make up for all the bullshit. Yoshi's Island is a subpar platformer and people just let it slide because it's pretty.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:20:27 2014 No.2031597 >>2031592 >Most of the levels still aren't difficult on a 100% run The opinion of a guy who didn't even try to complete most of the levels.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:23:05 2014 No.2031601

>>2031592
I'll admit it was easy, but it was fun. If you're judging it based solely off of difficulty alone it's probably one of the worst platformers made. But the transformations, the egg tossing, baby mario (although annoying) I think was a great mechanic (even though it was an obvious Sonic rip)
overall, i think it had a lot of charm and it's easy difficulty made it great to play casually

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:27:41 2014 No.2031608

I'll never understand the "Yoshi's Island is easy" argument against it. Fact of the matter is that all of the Mario games are painfully easy, especially World. Thinking about it, with its enormous levels with one checkpoint and a lot of one-hit deaths, Yoshi's Island is honestly the hardest Mario game there is, after Lost Levels, anyway.

I can blow through SMW without really giving a shit about anything. In Yoshi's Island I at least have to pay attention to what I'm doing.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:28:28 2014 No.2031610

>>2031601
>the transformations
Those might actually have been ripped off of Plok, who had very similar powerups not strictly transforming himself into a vehicle (like was the case with Yoshi in YI), but giving him one (time trial bonus levels and the Flea Pit, also some of the powerups found in regular levels changed his abilities and control style significantly for a limited time).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:30:48 2014 No.2031618 >>2031608 maybe it's hard if you're going for 100% but just playing through the story is ridiculously easy for me.I find it a lot easier than SMW in terms of the platforming elements, but some of the puzzles did trip me up.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 03:31:53 2014 No.2031620 >>2031610 just to be clear my point wasn't that it was original, just entertaining. But still interesting nonetheless.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 04:06:00 2014 No.2031675 >>2031413 >SMB3 had that magic that no other Mario title has ever managed to genuinely capture again You mean nostalgia?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 04:32:59 2014 No.2031716 >>2030002 OP cannot be more right, Yoshi's Island, if you don't look for the trinklets and rush to the endboss, is an incredibly mediocre game and uninteresting experience.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 04:40:19 2014 No.2031719 >>2031716 I don't know if mediocre is the right word. It's a very well made game from a technical level. It's just kind of boring and way way way too easy.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 04:47:42 2014 No.2031730

>>2031719
>It's a very well made game from a technical level
Most Nintendo games are, the problem isn't here, the problem is the contents, level design just wasn't made to offer an action game, it's a collect a ton, the moment you refuse to follow the game's ideology there's barely anything of value left.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 05:11:15 2014 No.2031761 >>2031378 >It's on par with classic marios Not a chance.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 05:53:37 2014 No.2031791 >everyone bitching that this game isn't SMB5 >meanwhile on /v/ everyone bitches that every new Nintendo game is just a rehash >everyone bitching that this isn't like other Mario games >that's probably the reason why I like it so much

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 05:58:18 2014 No.2031801

>>2031675
Nope. It had the magic all the way back from day one when it was first released, so it hardly be attributed to nostalgia. I suppose it's a combination of the new elements it had, the sprites, the enemies, the powerups, the overworld, the minigames, the sher amount of levels, the mysterious black level endings, and foremostly its level design - where SMW introduced secret exits and with that fully-fledged secret levels, SMB3 was really about secret areas within levels themselves, the overwhelming majority had them.

As mentioned, if Miyamoto's team had another year to finish SMW properly, it might have been able to recapture that if level design was improved to the quality of SMB3. The e-reader levels for SMA4 actually come closer to that than most any SMW level.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 09:38:46 2014 No.2031962

>>2031514

To be honest that guy who is desperately trying to force everyone into thinking Miyamoto was planning SMB5 and it got cancelled due to "betraying the true old 80s mario fanbase" with yoshi's island is trolling, I don't believe he is typing all that with a straight face.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 09:55:03 2014 No.2031974 >>2031791 >everyone bitching that this game isn't SMB5 It's just one guy...

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 10:11:20 2014 No.2031987 >>2031974 In every thread.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 12:18:41 2014 No.2032113 Yoshi's Island SMW DKC2 DKC DKC3 Prove me wrong

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 14:08:12 2014 No.2032275 >>2029982 The DS sequel is awful without collecting stuff and a nightmare if you do.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 14:18:07 2014 No.2032298 >>2032113 DKC2 YI DKC3 SMW DKC

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 14:21:25 2014 No.2032306

>>2031962
It's not about what Nintendo might or might not have been planning to do, but what they should have done. The Zelda and Metroid franchises both got a SNES game of insane quality, while Mario not only got a half-finished game, but afterwards the series broke apart into a handful of spinoff subseries, as described in >>2031230.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 15:24:10 2014 No.2032420

>>2032306

The difference was that both SNES games on the Zelda and Metroid series was the 3rd.
If we have got yet another Mario game with the same formula as SMB3 and World but a bit better, it would have still felt like they were holding back and rehashing their stuff.

Yoshi's Island was a great spinoff and a great move on their part, and the game ended up being what is considered one of the greatest 2D platformers of all time, no matter how much you hate the crayon art style.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 15:35:30 2014 No.2032432 >>2031230 Wow a series that was already popular branched out what a surprise! Go troll somewhere else with this flimsy ass logic.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 15:50:31 2014 No.2032457 >>2032432 Normally a tree's trunk doesn't stop just because it has grown major branches.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 16:05:44 2014 No.2032471 >>2032457 Super Mario 64 happened in 1996, what are you talking about?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 16:12:05 2014 No.2032481 >>2032471 Are you going to say silly stuff like "sm64 was muh smb5 hurr" too? SM64 had started the 3D spinoff branch. No way it was a continuation of the SMB trunk, no matter how much you might want to believe in it.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 16:43:20 2014 No.2032513

>>2032481

>3D spinoff brand

No, Super Mario 64 was the next step in the main Mario series.

>muh smb5

We're makig fun of you for talking about a hypotetical game that, according to you, should have existed instead of Yoshi's Island.

The classic SMB formula was done for, it had 4 awesome games that we still play and enjoy today. I'm happy we got Yoshi's Island instead of another SMB game, it would have felt stale already, SMB3 and World are pretty much the pinnacle of 2D Mario games, no matter how much you want to add.

If you want more SMB3 stuff, go play ROMhacks. There's a lot of good ones.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 16:44:22 2014 No.2032515 >>2032481 epic maelstrom post

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:01:26 2014 No.2032543 This game is hard because Yoshi handles weird. It's kawaii as fug tho. I like the art style.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:26:33 2014 No.2032608

>>2032513
>No, Super Mario 64 was the next step in the main Mario series.

No. The separation of the SMB trunk and the 3D spinoff branch is now clearer than ever, with the first being represented by the NSMB series and the second by the Galaxy series (and the 3D Land / 3D World titles being hybrids between the two).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:28:44 2014 No.2032614 >>2031192 >just the crayon beyond-cutesy art style is enough They picked that art style because it's fitting for a game that's about Mario being a fucking baby. It had nothing to do with trying to appeal to preschoolers.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:29:04 2014 No.2032615 >>2032513 >Super Mario 64 was the next step in the main Mario series. While you could say that Ocarina of Time was the next step in the Zelda series, gameplay in the 3D Mario titles differs just too vastly from the classic SMB ones.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:33:32 2014 No.2032626 >>2032608 The NSMB games are the spinoffs, bud. The main Mario games are the 3D ones.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:33:44 2014 No.2032627

>>2032614
>Mario being a fucking baby in the first place had nothing to do with trying to appeal to preschoolers

Are you seriously suggesting that upon release the game was just as popular with adult folks who used to play the SMB titles as it was with pre-schoolers? Because I can tell you that it surely wasn't. Heck, I was still a teenager when it came out, and everybody my age I knew was heavily disappointed at what it was (especially that it was branded with the "SMW2" moniker).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:34:58 2014 No.2032631 >>2032626 By that logic, the classic SMB games were spinoffs too, and the Mario series proper hadn't started until SM64. Is this what you're trying to assert?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:38:38 2014 No.2032640 >>2032626 The only real Mario game is Hotel Mario CDi, bud. Everything else is just spinoffs, all the way down.

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 17:38:56 2014 No.2032642

>>2032631

No, what I'm saying you dense fucker is that the main Mario series went 3D in 96 and the NSMB series is simply a throwback spinoff to the classic 2D games made to appeal to fans.

Super Mario 64 was no less a spinoff because it was in 3D than SMW was a spinoff because it was on the SNES. The series changed directions and you still can't get over it what the fuck is wrong with you

Anonymous Mon Oct 27 18:14:46 2014 No.2032706

Hold the FUCK up.

Donkey Kong is a bastardized game, the REAL game was going to be a Popeye game and Mario was going to be Popeye, but instead we got the kiddy Mario games. Wow, thanks Miyamoto, thanks for betraying the Popeye fans withy our preschooler games!

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 27 18:16:23 2014 No.2032712 >>2032631 Are the 3D GTA games spinoffs, with the main series finishing with GTA2? Is everything after Final Fantasy 6 a spinoff? Just because it switched to 3D doesn't mean it's not part of the same series.

Anonymous Tue Oct 28 05:01:51 2014 No.2033989

>>2032642
You've got to be "dense" to actually assert that the 3D installments have the same gameplay as the original SMB line. The console or even rendering technology does not matter (NSMB is technically 3D as well), it's the fundamental gameplay elements that are decisive.

It's barely passable to say of Zelda that the series simply switched from the ALttP format to the OoT one, because the difference between the two is not nearly as vast as between SMW and SM64 (the environment is 3D, and there are no free enemy engagements anymore but instead "omg an enemy wtf bbq" complete with music change etc. but otherwise the game flow is very similar).

By your logic Metroid Prime would be "Metroid 4", which is evidently not the case - Metroid 4 is Metroid Fusion, the opening states that explicitly. The classical Metroid series is probaby over with Metroid: Zero Mission, but nobody in their right mind would claim the Prime trilogy to be the a continuation of the classic Metroid series - it's a 3D spinoff subseries as well. Other M is a an interesting special case, as officially it is being associated with the original series, but fans are somewhat reluctant to acknowledge this at least partly due to the lukewarm reception that game garnered upon release.

As such, no matter how hard you're trying to convince yourself and others, the branch of Mario games which was started by SM64 and includes Sunshine and both Galaxy titles is just a spinoff series of the main trunk formed by the classic SMB games (and later continued by the NSMB subseries), just as the Prime subseries is a 3D/FPS spinoff within the Metroid series. A very glorified spinoff - of course, one that got pushed into the foreground - by all means (after all, "gotta promote muh latest technology"), but a spinoff series nevertheless. Remember that it's the fundamentla gameplay that dictates whether a game is a member of the original series or a spinoff, not whatever system or technology it's made for/in.

Anonymous Tue Oct 28 05:04:19 2014 No.2033992

>>2032712
They aren't spinoffs, because the gameplay mechanic and objectives are pretty much the same as in the games that were 2D/birdseye-view technically - this is pretty much the same case as with the Zelda series, which actually transitioned the main series onto the 3D systems initially (as opposed to Mario or Metroid, as outlined in the post above).

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 05:13:35 2014 No.2034002 >>2031521 You baited yourself with the YI cover in the OP, so don't get butthurt now over the direction the thread has actually taken.

>>	\|\|D.II.II\/II.\|\|D Tue Oct 28 05:15:50 2014 No.2034004 >>2031214 Nah you guys are talking about the same level The GBA has 6 extra levels but they're not Poochie ones

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 14:37:39 2014 No.2034597 >>2032513 >No, Super Mario 64 was the next step in the main Mario series Miyamoto pls go

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 16:33:59 2014 No.2034815 File: 1.55 MB, 352x198, 0MoqIBp.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2033989 Not that Anon, but holy shit. All this just because you don't like a game?

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 18:08:01 2014 No.2034979 >>2034815 Judging from 3D World sales it's obvious people don't consider 3D and 2D Mario to have much in common.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 20:43:40 2014 No.2035256 >>2032640 This. The best mario games are obviously Hotel Mario > second half of Super Mario Bros 2 > Mario Is Missing > Mario Tennis > Donkey Kong > Pretending you're controlling Mario in Punch-Out Everything else is shit and irrelevant

Anonymous Tue Oct 28 21:09:06 2014 No.2035341
File: 3.71 MB, 2100x1536, Banjo-Kazooie_Boxart_%28North_America%29[1].png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

I don't think Banjo is mediocre, but it's definitely better if you try to complete it. Trying to play it like a linear platformer just gets boring fast, especially when you already know where everything is. Super Mario 64 is similar. I'm not sure if I could say the same for DK64, only because the game involves so much backtracking as it is.

If it counts, I think some levels in Sonic Adventure can only be enjoyed as other characters. I prefer Knuckles' Casinopolis and Red Mountain over Sonic's, and probably Amy's Twinkle Park as well.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 21:13:59 2014 No.2035352 >>2035341 Kazooie is fun to complete but Tooie is a bit too much.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 28 21:27:01 2014 No.2035385 >>2032631 >the classic SMB games were spinoffs They are, actually. They spun off of Mario Bros. which in term spun off of the original Donkey Kong games. So going by your logic, the whole freakin Mario series is basically a clusterfuck of spinoffs.

Anonymous Wed Oct 29 00:45:19 2014 No.2035969

>>2035385
You gotta draw the line somewhere. Mario Bros. and Donkey Kong games were coparatively primitive (no scrolling whatsoever at that time, occured first in SMB which was a huge milestone) and if you imagine the Mario series as a tree, they would for the roots of it.

You can go as far as imagining SMB games as Mario Bros. spinoffs, but that's rather unpractical for the reasons named above, and because those series were short-lived and didn't evolve further in their own right.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 00:46:31 2014 No.2035971 >>2035969 >they would for *they would forM

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 00:58:50 2014 No.2035984 >>2034979 Go out Maelstrom.

Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:14:19 2014 No.2036009
File: 32 KB, 386x206, 1357413745834.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2029982
I cant really think of any that fit such a specific criteria of being a "meh" game only if you aren't serious about completing it.

I suppose I could tell you about the games I have absolutely completed 100% (sometimes with the help of a walkthrough) and got an amazing feeling of accomplishment from it

>snes shadowrun
>terrenigma
>Zelda OOT
>Fallout2
>Mario 64

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:15:55 2014 No.2036015 >>2036009 I forgot one >jeanne d' ark

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:19:35 2014 No.2036025 >>2036009 I've owned Fallout 2 since it was first released and I've never even completed it.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:20:39 2014 No.2036028 >>2036025 so much to do.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:21:12 2014 No.2036031 >>2036009 Why does the right one look much weirder than the left one if they're the same?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:22:32 2014 No.2036035 >>2036028 and so little time.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:24:39 2014 No.2036040 >>2034979 Why even reply to a moron who's proud of not having read what he himself was replying to? Fuck him.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 29 01:28:24 2014 No.2036046 >>2031052 Poochie ain't stupid

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