What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8? I only played it once long long ago, I don't remember much besides the fact I wasn't having fun,

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Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:18:34 2014 No.1982171 [Reply] [Original]

What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8?

I only played it once long long ago, I don't remember much besides the fact I wasn't having fun,

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:25:04 2014 No.1982174

>>1982171
Shit story mostly.
Its super breakable. Which makes it pretty replayable. Junction is completely fucking busted. You can have a low levle game (1-10) with maxed stats because you played cards and got Enc-None on Diablos as fast as possible. You can also get a Lionheart on disc 1.

Its just really fucking dumb story wise which is why people hate it. Its actually probably the most fun to replay on PS1. FF7 is kinda equal in that regard but you can't break materia nearly as early or as easily.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:34:52 2014 No.1982179 ff is shit period

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:36:46 2014 No.1982182 >>1982179 You're your mother's shitty period, and the best part of you dried up on her thigh.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:37:50 2014 No.1982183

I sometimes wonder if there was just some lost-in-translation problem with the story. So many things happen in that game that don't feel explained enough. I think the moment where everyone collectively groaned was stumbling upon a super-charged space ship just floating with the keys in the ignition ready to go.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:42:18 2014 No.1982190 It always felt like the story was being made up as it went, and the characters were pretty uninteresting too. Also fuck the junction system

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:48:45 2014 No.1982195 >>1982183 Nah, people groaned at the orphanage revelation bullshit, and how guardian forces erase the memory of its users so they couldn't remember that they all fucking grew up together in the same house.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 00:51:02 2014 No.1982197

>>1982195
Fair enough. That's a great example of a plot point that was never well explained. So GFs cause you to lose your memory, but what are the long term ramifications of that? The game never goes anywhere with it and the whole concept is immediately forgotten (heh) as the plot chugs forward.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:05:32 2014 No.1982216

I remember a friend of mine somehow gaming the salary system to where he was getting max pay super early on.

Personally, I think I bought it mostly because the cinematic were pretty, but I didn't care for the characters. Everyone except for Selphie was angsty as all get-out. I forgave the cast of 7 because their government were asses who covered up their neighborhoods from the sun and killing the planet. But these pretty future kids with free room and board had very little to be frowning about.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:06:24 2014 No.1982217 >>1982197 well thats part of the problem with the world in general. It introduces characters and elements that it completely discards immediately. >Seifer wants to be the sorcererss knight >Okay now he's just a cunt you fight a couple of times

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:09:06 2014 No.1982220

>>1982216

>I remember a friend of mine somehow gaming the salary system to where he was getting max pay super early on.

If you had the strategy guide for it at the time, or looked online I guess, you could get all the answers for the SEED tests, so you could get a super high rank pretty early, and rake in the gil, though it was based on your level, think the max was like 30? I don't really recall.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:10:00 2014 No.1982223
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>>1982216
>But these pretty future kids with free room and board had very little to be frowning about.

that was my big problem. For as angsty and antisocial a cunt Squall is you'd think he'd have some huge dramatic back story or huge problem beyond

>grew up in an orphanage surrounded by people who love him then went to expensive and prestigious military academy

there's also the issue that everyone goes well out of the way to hand him shit.

for instance he becomes the leader of Garden bot because he really earned it, Cid just up and says Squall your in charge now

The characters do stupid things to ensure he an Rinoa hook up. Zell lets Rinoa dangle from a ledge just to tell Squall to save her instead of just you know tossing her a rope

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:12:47 2014 No.1982230

The story is so filled with plot holes that it lead to some pretty amusing theories.

I enjoyed the gameplay though and how easy it was to break. On the flip side though, it also could make for a really difficult game if you chose to not use junctions, you'd find it one of the hardest games in the series by the time lunatic pandora came around.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:22:08 2014 No.1982246 The problem is that Square's writers were simply out of their league. see: Xenogears, Chrono Cross, and every other Square game that tried to be deep.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:27:04 2014 No.1982249 >>1982216 >free room and board I had the idea that they were either on a scholarship or someone was footing the bill. E.g. Laguna paying for Squall's edumacation. Only he forgot because guardian forces.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:31:04 2014 No.1982252 >>1982246 Most video games have terrible writing. Even western crpgs relied on established lore. I don't expect much from rpgs though, and they seem to have totally given up since that power of friendship shit is still going on to this day.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:31:47 2014 No.1982253 The only thing that made me stop playing it is that the battles are levelled. Literally what is the fucking point of the random encounters then? I could just run from every single battle and beat the gane at lv. 1

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:34:28 2014 No.1982258 >>1982253 AP grinding and spell drawing

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:36:55 2014 No.1982261 Fun game, but really strange combo of realism and ridiculous. There's a line somewhere where over-the-top blurs into nonsense, and that's where FF8 danced. It was a reasonably-realistic world, filled with really strange shit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:40:03 2014 No.1982265 >>1982249 >I had the idea that they were either on a scholarship or someone was footing the bill. and you never thought to ask WHO was paying the scholarship? That shit doesn't come from nowhere

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 01:55:55 2014 No.1982280
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A lot of the problems have been addressed in this thread, but I think one of the biggest ones has been glossed over.

The villain is never well-established. On the first disc, Edea is presented as a villain. It turns out that she's merely being possessed. On the third disc, Adel is presented as the villain. Surprise, it turns out she's being possessed too (although she was kind of a cunt anyway). Then, only near the end of the game are you told who the real villain is, and sent to go beat her. But who is Ultimecia? Why does she care so much about time compression? Why does she have a magical Castlevania floating at the end of time?

Of course, fan theories like Rinoa=Ultimecia come up because of this. It's the fans desperately searching for answers and explanations from a game that doesn't provide any. I think R=U makes the game more interesting if only because it turns a baseless final villain with no development and no motivation into a zany plot twist.

Moreover, most other characters in the game suffer from the same problems. Why is Squall so mopey all the time anyway? We've never seen any traumatic events that make him rely on only himself. Why is Seifer such a dick? Why does he have an obsession with getting Sorceress pussy? Why is Rinoa a sorceress at all and what bearing does it have on the storyline other than her getting kidnapped?

In summary, FF8 is a game that begs dozens of questions and never answers any of them. It also doesn't help that the magic system encourages not using spells.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:09:40 2014 No.1982295 File: 26 KB, 491x365, seifer.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1982280 >Why does he have an obsession with getting Sorceress pussy? once you go sorceress everything else seems torturous

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:12:17 2014 No.1982297 File: 182 KB, 1030x796, ff8pcsx-rogl2c.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1982265 This guy?

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:12:57 2014 No.1982298 >>1982280 I like the Squall is dead theory, because it makes the game into a pseudo-Jacobs Ladder style story. Also Zell eats his god damn hotdogs at the end.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:13:26 2014 No.1982301 >>1982171 Pacing and Plotholes It grinds to a stop constantly and a lot of stuff happens just because they couldn't think of a real transition in the story.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:17:06 2014 No.1982304 >>1982301 Yeah the story skipping around is kinda shit, but the pacing is decent if you're using enc-none and know where to go.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:17:44 2014 No.1982307

>>1982230
I remember I could not make heads or tails out of the Junction system when I was a kid, which resulted in the game being hard as hell for me. By the time I got to Disc 3, my Junctions were still extremely shit, and I was still relying on GFs to win me battles. I believe it was only about halfway through Disc 3 that I said "ok, fucking hell, this shit is tedious, what can I do to make my life easier?" and actually read up on how Junction works, and finally realized I had been doing it wrong the entire fucking time.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:19:21 2014 No.1982308

>>1982307
>Be a kid
>Find out that I can be low level and get HP-J and junction my strongest magic to my health
>End up with 9999 health at like level 10 by card-mod and shit
>end up getting into critical health at like what, 2000? 1500? When characters are still in their hundreds
>spamming limits all day erryd ay

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:24:11 2014 No.1982313

>>1982280
>this
this is my biggest problem with the game. nothing makes any sense, and none of it matters. I play RPGs for the story, and this game had none of it.

none of the characters had a lick of backstory. The game recognizes that it is written by complete hacks, and tries to handwave it away by lolamnesia!! The problem is, that could have been a fascinating plot element, but it was never explored. Imagine, using Espers eats away your memories. where were the legions of amnesiac sorcerers wandering the world? where were the classes on the dangers of Esper usage? why didn't it play a part anywhere else in the game? once I realized the game in my head was more interesting than the game I was playing, I put the controller down.

that, and being level 99 and still getting slapped around like a bitch by a Malboro just pissed me off. FF9 could not come soon enough

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:28:17 2014 No.1982323

>>1982304
Even when you know where to go the number of hey lets stop and point out how retarded parts of the plot are moments are fairly long. I lose major interest everytime I have to play as Laguna and the forgetables.

Or the part when the game is like oh suppose you when need a key for the secret base huh well you had it because we forgot to write that part.

I often feel I judge 8 too harsh as it came on the heels of 7, which people can say what the will and I will admit the story was generic and a copy of 6, but god damn did it have atmosphere.

Then I try to play 8 again separately this time, and I just check the fuck out during one of those long ass boring talking segments, and when the dialogue in an rpg is boring you got a problem. I actually liked the combat though, imperfect, but it tried new directions.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:31:55 2014 No.1982327

>>1982223
wasn't Cid's rationale something like "you would be the worst at it, so I think you will struggle to become the best" or some horseshit?

I love it when everyone tells him that despite him constantly being an ass, they know he really cares about people. I almost shouted at the television "how do you know this, when he is constantly being an ass?"

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:32:02 2014 No.1982328 They should have expanded heavily on the Galbadian army. They used to be the "good' guys who fought a war against Esthar and their sorceres for years. They could have played with their tragic fall of becoming what they fought against for so long

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:40:22 2014 No.1982337
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There are two things that are factually wrong in this game:

- Every character aside from Squall, Seifer and Laguna are fucking useless regarding the story. They can't get shit done for themselves, even the fucking director of the garden is depending on a 20 years old dude.

- Story goes to shit at the end of the 2nd disc.

Aside from that, the gameplay I guess is a hit or miss for a lot of people, but I liked it. It can be dense and repetitive at the beginning when you don't have another option more than draw magic, but a few hours in and you are granted more freedom to do almost whatever you want.
Also an amazing OST and good graphics.

Since 4chan is a hive mind I think hating on this game got popular the last few years, yet because is not as good as your favorite FF it doesn't mean is total trash.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:47:21 2014 No.1982349 >>1982280 >time compression Fuck off you kunt

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:57:19 2014 No.1982359

>>1982337
Look, my problems with this game are that, while the story seemed to have potential in the beginning(basically right before Squall went to assassinate the sorceress and got an icicle in his chest), it never explained any of the characters motivations in depth enough to make them seem to be anything more than walking talking cardboard cut outs; Things are never explained that you would think would have a MAJOR impact on the story.
And things are never explained. Is Laguna Rinoa or Squalls father? Who is Ultimecia? Why is Squall so withdrawn? Does he have a personality disorder or depression? Why is this never dealt with?

But that's only the story.
The leveling system was so fucking bad. What is the point of even gaining experience if your enemies gain experience right along with you?

Why the fuck are wild animals leveling up constantly? It's not like they're facing new challenges like you are.
Also the love story between Squall and Rinoa was so fucking cliche, melodramatic, and retarded.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 02:59:20 2014 No.1982360
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>>1982280
Squall is the way he is because everyone left him when he was younger so he man up and started to take things on his own without giving a fuck what the others wanted.

Seifer, although the game presented him as a careless dick was actually a pretty smart dude that liked to read and his favorite book was about 'the sorcerer's knight' and it inspired him somehow. The drawback is that he likes to rush things and fuck with people, but you can see the dude actually isn't a bad guy... some early examples that come to mind are the mission in Dollet when yeah, he is a dick but you can see that at last he cares for his team and tries to not get them killed (although not in a ver polite manner). Also after you return to Balamb and they announce which students passed he is the first to start clapping at them.

Aaand don't forget that he was almost the entire game (end of the 1st disc to end of the 3rd disc) being controlled by Ultimecia.

I agree that the plot of the game is convoluted as fuck but come on, there are some silly claims in this thread which can be properly addressed if you replay the game.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:02:24 2014 No.1982363 >>1982359 >Laguna Rinoa or Squalls father? Who is Ultimecia? Why is Squall so withdrawn? Does he have a personality disorder or depression? Why is this never dealt with? This is all explained in the game.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:19:20 2014 No.1982384 >>1982360 Just because a story is complicated doesn't really make it a good one. There are literally too many plot holes in the story as a result.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:26:03 2014 No.1982395 >>1982249 >>1982265 >>1982297 Garden is a home for mercs, thats where all the money comes from

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:30:57 2014 No.1982405 >>1982249 Free room and board to Become mercenaries that will risk their lives for their employers

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:33:16 2014 No.1982409

>>1982359
>Is Laguna Rinoa or Squalls father?

Are you retarded? Laguna is very clearly Squalls father and Raine is his mother. She died in childbirth and instead of one of the locals taking the kid in they shipped him off to the ass end of nowhere. Laguna wasn't present because he was off trying to save Elone. Rinoas mother was the singer in the bar who fell in love with Laguna and because he never came back moved on to be with that general dude.

This is one of the only plot points in the game that makes any damn sense.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:33:43 2014 No.1982410

>>1982337
>Every character aside from Squall, Seifer and Laguna are fucking useless regarding the story.

The characters are probably my biggest gripe with the game. Almost everyone acts like such an incompetent fuck, it's maddening. It's no wonder Squall acts the way he does when he's surrounded by fucking morons on all sides.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:38:24 2014 No.1982418

>>1982363
Okay, that dude already explained that Laguna was Squalls dad.
>Who is Ultimecia?
No it's not.
>Why is Squall so withdrawn? Does he have a personality disorder or depression? Why is this never dealt with?
Okay, so his dad died and he was shipped off to live in an orphanage. Then his sister died and he was all alone in the world.
But for as much loss he experience when he was a little kid, he always had other people that cared about him and loved him.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:40:46 2014 No.1982424

>>1982410
From 8 onward it really felt like most of the characters were there to fill a slot quota. It was there a bit before, but at least most before had some motivation.

Its like from that point on they wrote the story around 3 characters and filled in the other tropes. Which would be fine in that doesn't force in painfully the other 6 slots.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:46:18 2014 No.1982435 >>1982424 I can see that. I think IX was definitely a step up in characters, but they definitely didn't give much of a shit about a few of them. I didn't play much of X, but I know XII had it real bad.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:50:29 2014 No.1982446 >>1982435 IX's handling of its characters is a bit maddening in its own way, in that a few of them are built up at first, then become completely irrelevant after the first half of the game. Looking at you, Freya.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 03:55:44 2014 No.1982453 >>1982446 I love IX, but the way they handled Freya is something I'll never get over.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 04:05:40 2014 No.1982462

>>1982453
I hear you. She is the one character who does not get any closure other than the ending, and even then it's half-assed and still leaves a bitter taste.

How hard would it have been to include a sidequest that wrapped up her loose ends with Burmecia/Cleyra and Sir Fratley? Even Vivi and fucking Quina got their loose ends with Quan and Quale wrapped up.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 04:09:17 2014 No.1982465 So, what makes an RPG a good RPG?

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 04:10:58 2014 No.1982470

>>1982435
I would say nearly all of them in IX. Steiner was comic relief, Quina was comic relief, Amarant was pointless, Freya started out with a point but gives up on having character part way through, and Eiko was there only to explain what Garnet is and fill the young female spot. It only had 3 that mattered as well.

Zidane had screen time, Garnet a plot driver, and Vivi actually had some complex emotional depth on the purpose of life etc. The rest you could write out entirely.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 04:18:41 2014 No.1982476

>>1982470
Steiner had his moments as well, though. He didn't have Vivi's complexity or the extent of Zidane and Garnet's importance to the plot, but he still had a character arc that was ultimately resolved.

I do agree Eiko was mostly there as exposition as to the origins of the Eidolons and Garnet, but even so, she also had an arc which was also resolved for the most part.

I still maintain Freya was the character who was most criminally neglected past her initial prominence. Amarant didn't amount to much, either, but at least they didn't bother with much of a build up with him or tried to get you to identify with him. Freya's arc just ended with a total whimper and blue balled anyone who gave a fuck about her.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 04:55:08 2014 No.1982504 >>1982195 This. Especially Irvine in the whole revelation thing. >Oh, I don't use GFs so I remembered everything. Why didn't I say anything? Oh, you guys didn't mention us all being orphanage siblings together, so I figured I wouldn't either.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 05:03:07 2014 No.1982510 >>1982504 If I hadn't known about that scene beforehand, I probably would have shut the game off at that point. A huge plot point turned into a fucking joke.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 05:06:42 2014 No.1982513

>>1982410
I played the game again some months ago and it gets really obnoxious watching how the only approach for a problem is "Squall wat do".

>>1982418
The game tells you who is Ultimecia. It doesn't really go in-depth about her motivations and that stuff.

Squall never met his parents and the only people who gave a fuck about him was Eleone (his 'sis') who was taken away to Esthar and Edea who left once her witch powers "awaken" or something like that, I can't remember exactly. He was frustrated because every person who he cared left and decided to take things on his own.

So yeah, I'd recommend you to give it a go again, or read in the wiki if you're really interested.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 10:29:40 2014 No.1982697 >>1982384 Nobody said it was good, the guy was just refuting the claim that none of the things mentioned were established, when many were. FF8's plot was stupid, but it's not nearly as confusing as some people make it out to be.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 10:40:38 2014 No.1982712

>>1982280
>The villain is never well-established
This complaint always shows up when discussing FF8, and it makes no sense. Yes, she is well-established. You said it yourself: it appears to be Edea, who's possessed, and then Adel, who's possessed. You're just glossing over who's possessing them: Ultimecia. She's always the antagonist, it's not like she just shows up at the end. Just because you're told her name and her origin near the end doesn't mean she isn't always there.

Her castle is kind of a superficial complaint (what building's architecture was ever explained besides the Lunatic Pandora?), but you are right in that the game glosses over her motivations for time compression, they literally tell you "who cares". But it's still something you can easily imply from what she says when she's possessing Edea.

Really, in a game with amnesiac protagonists and where time distorsions can be overcome by the power of friendship, having the villain's name unrevealed until near the end is not a real problem. She's still always there from the beginning.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 10:49:05 2014 No.1982727 >>1982712 Can't you just say the same thing about Necron though? And Necron as seen as a giant whatever, fuck you to people who played FF9

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 10:53:34 2014 No.1982734 >>1982727 No, because Necron doesn't appear at all before the final battle, while Ultimecia is the main antagonist throughout the entire story of FFVIII.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:10:51 2014 No.1982750 Is their a place online to purchase just single discs from retro games that isnt ebay? I lost the third disc of fantasy VIII so I've never beat it

NESfag Sat Oct 4 11:12:26 2014 No.1982753

>>1982280
>Why does she care so much about time compression?

Ultimecia lives in the future, a future which knows of the events of the present of the game. Therefore she knows that 'a legendary SeeD from the past' (that's pretty much her words) will come to kill her, it's her fate (fate being one of the main theme of the game). So, she does everything she can to prevent that, and since it's written in fate that she is going to get killed, she thinks the only way to prevent that is to control time and space itself, hence time compression. (Little does she know that it's exactly her actions which will be responsible of her death, which is the beauty of it)

>We've never seen any traumatic events that make him rely on only himself
Yes we do see that. At the beginning of Disc 2, we see Squall's past and how traumatized he was as a kid from Ellone being taken from him. this is established again in Disc3 during the orphanage dialogue.

>Why is Seifer such a dick? Why does he have an obsession with getting Sorceress pussy?
Your thing is video games (maybe other things too), Seifer's thing is becoming a sorceress knight. He borrowed a book at the Garden library called 'The Sorceress Knight', he saw a movie about a knight sorceress, the movie that Laguna himself shot in which he played the role
of the knight and that's where Seifer got the way he holds and uses his sword.
Imagine you are being brought up in a world with sorceresses and knights, and since early age you are given military education, it is not farfetched to want to become a sorceress knight. it's a pretty big and honorable status.
Furthermore, the notion of fate (omnipresent in the game) can be brought to the table here again. Each sorceress has a knight, and both are linked by fate, Linoa has Squall and Ultimecia has Seifer.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:14:09 2014 No.1982756 >>1982750 just emulate it nobody is going to break a set of discs for cheap price anyway.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:15:29 2014 No.1982759 >they rushed Xenogears to work on this

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:15:30 2014 No.1982760 >>1982750 Emulate it or pick up the pc re release. Or Torrent the old pc port.

NESfag Sat Oct 4 11:20:06 2014 No.1982770

>>1982280
>>1982753
But finally let me tell you why Ultimecia is such a shitty villain:
Because she isn't a real villain and she isn't supposed to. Both sides only fight each others because the others want to kill them, that's it. Squall&Co want to protect the world from time compression, while Ultimecia wants to protect herself with time compression because it's written in her fate that Squall&co is coming to kill her, it was written even before she was born (and since in the game past, present and future events are chained together for them to exist as such, it can't be changed, it was written in the past before she was born already)
Ultimecia is not evil, she has no motives other than her own survival; only her mean (tiem compression) is very extreme, but what can you do when it's written in fate that you're going to die?! Squall&Co are ready to kill other people too, other soldiers, sorceresses, etc. Both are the same.

It is even said in the game itself at the end of Disc1, by Squall, that there is no bad guys, only 2 sides fighting because they have opposing views.
The game itself tells you there is no villain.

The beauty of FF8 is exactly that it does things differently, it doesn't use the typical 'good vs evil' thing. Its storytelling too is different, it doesn't mouth feed the player, it's up to the player to find all the information (from mandatory dialogues to NPCs to the school computer, even the game menus; from what is said and implied etc) and to put 2 and 2 together to understand it all.
That is why most people are confused, they're not used of being asked to look for information and actually THINK.
Now, if you think the story is shit without doing that effort of finding and putting the information together; you're everything that's wrong and you're the reason why FF games (and games in general) are now linear corridors filled with mandatory 'Let me spell it out for you' cutscenes.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:22:27 2014 No.1982776 ok so lets back away for a minute about 8 heres a question i have. >who is the light warrior from FF1 i saw him fight a red dragon in my ps1 and he never showed up again unless hes garland

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:23:10 2014 No.1982780

I hate how god damn slow it was moving around the world in the garden. Seriously...just getting from Point A to Point B took forever, and god help you if you wanted to explore the world to find a side quest.

Other than that...I really liked the game actually.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:36:10 2014 No.1982803

>>1982223
>For as angsty and antisocial a cunt Squall is you'd think he'd have some huge dramatic back story or huge problem beyond

he felt abandoned by elone, so he became withdrawn to protect himself from people leaving him.

>he becomes the leader of Garden bot because he really earned it, Cid just up and says Squall your in charge now

kind of. Cid knew it was squalls fate. remember squall visited edea at the end of the game, and tells her he's a member of seed. edea knows its him from the future. I cant remember if squall tells her to found seed or not, but that was the catalyst for cid and edea founding seed. it creates self fulfilling a time loop. and yea its time travel so its probably riddled with paradoxes and inconsistencies

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:39:40 2014 No.1982807

It always bothers me that people always give you shit for being emo even when all of the choices you pick are the non faggy choices. Everytime you pick the most positive option some faggot in your part goes "OH MY GOSH THATS NOT LIKE YOU AT ALL." Its bullshit. I know squall is mopey at times and doesn't talk much but the majority of his emo talk is his internal shit. A lot of his dialogue is just neutral and if you choose the nongay options I see know reason for every goddamn character in this universe to be riding your dick for being emo.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 11:55:14 2014 No.1982831 >>1982776 He's just a Warrior of Light with an uncertain past. You're supposed to project your own idea onto him and the rest of the party.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 15:06:29 2014 No.1983171 >>1982249 >E.g. Laguna paying for Squall's edumacation. Only he forgot because guardian forces. Made me laugh.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 15:09:14 2014 No.1983181

>>1982280
This.
For me, the game ended before the time compression. The hero found love, his friends, his father,... Seriously, IDGAF about Ultimecia after that.

Though, as backstory-lacking as the characters may be, I still like them. I like their personalities and how they come in contact together. I think Nomura (or someone else) said in an interview that they wanted to give a "highschool" feel and that's what I got from this game.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 15:13:55 2014 No.1983195

>>1982462
>How hard would it have been to include a sidequest that wrapped up her loose ends with Burmecia/Cleyra and Sir Fratley? Even Vivi and fucking Quina got their loose ends with Quan and Quale wrapped up.

>>1982476
>I still maintain Freya was the character who was most criminally neglected past her initial prominence.

Maybe Freya's got a hidden sidequest we've never heard about. Remember the one that was found less than two years ago?

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 15:37:47 2014 No.1983260

>>1982183
Well theres one major plot point in the story which annoyed people cause you find out out by chance not by a cut scene. its when you talk to all the NPCs in the Ragnarok (airship) til you run into Kiros and Ward you find out that Laguna is Squall's daddy

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:09:58 2014 No.1983508

>>1983195

You mean the one where you had to leave the final dungeon after every boss and talk to someone? If so that makes sense cause who the fuck would even want to do that much less think of it.

Especially if you are trying for the perfect game while getting excalibur 2.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:14:12 2014 No.1983517

>>1982280
>Why is Squall so mopey all the time anyway? We've never seen any traumatic events that make him rely on only himself.

Except for that huge scene with him as a kid losing Ellone and vowing that he'll never rely on anyone else again.

>Why is Seifer such a dick? Why does he have an obsession with getting Sorceress pussy?

This might come as a shock, but some people have abrasive personalities. His childhood dream was to be the Sorceress' knight because it ran counter to the prevailing opinion that Sorceresses are evil tyrants - basically he's a contrarian with an inferiority complex regarding Squall.

>Why is Rinoa a sorceress at all and what bearing does it have on the storyline other than her getting kidnapped?

Why is anyone a Sorceress? It doesn't have a huge impact on her character because her powers are nascent.

Pay attention, I remembered all this and it's been nearly a decade since I played it.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:23:41 2014 No.1983534

>>1982171

Lots of morons couldn't figure out the junction system and or thought that Guardian forces made the game too easy. Many of these morons STILL think that "HURR! I can't use a spell or my stats go down!" (when there's almost always alternative spells, or multiple characters can have the same spells, so there's no reason to think this way at all...)

Later on, other morons used guides to "break" the game, and then claimed it was too easy. You know, even though they didn't figure it out on their own and literally needed a step by step guide to do anything remotely like "breaking" the game.

In reality, it's an interesting set of systems that work together fairly well, but it definitely needed more dev time for balancing. But in the game's defense, when Squaresoft spends fuck-tons of time balancing games, they get fuck all easy anyway (Like the PSP version of FFII) or automated to death (like FFXIII). So the vague lack of polish actually helps the game a lot.

It's a fun game to play around with if you like spending lots of time in menus, not so much if you're of the Skyrim generation.

FFVIII's gameplay consists mostly of:

>refining magic from cards
>refining magic from items
>refining magic from weaker magic
>customizing character stats
>fiddle-fucking with GF's, setting what skills and stats to learn
>taking exams to get paid more
>drawing magic in-combat
>grinding for items

It's a fairly meticulous game, but it gives you more or less 100% control over stats, skills, spells, ect. So that has appeal to some people e(like me). and if you avoid guides and just fuck around with it yourself, you can have even more fun.

Realistically, I'd call it a 7/10 game. Above average on a lot of levels, but very specialized and really only appeals to certain people.

Personally, it's one of my all time favorite games, and I'll always have tons of fun with it. But I fucking love micromanagement and the degree of control the game gives you.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:36:53 2014 No.1983557 >>1982513 >Squall never met his parents and the only people who gave a fuck about him was Eleone and Edea and Cid and the orphanage kids. You can say a lot about Squall but he was never, EVER alone.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:37:57 2014 No.1983559 >>1983534 >Lots of morons stopped reading. Protip. If you ever open your argument with EVERYONE IS A MORON, than the only moron is you.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:46:07 2014 No.1983574

>>1982734
No, Ultimecia appears later, for the longest time we were t think that the main antag was The Sorceress, or Edea. Until we free her of control we aren't given any indication that Ultimecia was the real boss. Still better than Necron by miles though.

The real problem with the Ultimecia and the villains in FF8 really stem from Adel. Now we hear about Adel really early, right after Timber when someone mentions the last Sorceress who was in power. She is built up as someone who was so powerful and evil that she was sealed in fucking space. Then we learn that if Adel is released than Ultimecia's plan will be activated, and you get hyped knowing you are going to fight this insanely powerful evil entity.

Then you see her twice, she has no dialogue and you whip her ass. It's such a fucking letdown, hell, we don't even get a good fight against her as Laguna, we just hear that he beat her. For me, that was the game's ultimate cop-out, building up this awesome, intimidating villain and then not just treating her like a regular old boss fight against a minor character.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:57:19 2014 No.1983590 >>1983574 >Still better than Necron by miles though. Necron was done in part as a joke to make fun of how old games end bosses would come out of nowhere. Like Zemus

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 18:57:55 2014 No.1983591

>>1983559

>"lots of morons"
>implying that lots of people (but not all) are morons
>"LITERALLY EVERYONE IS A MORON!!!!!"
>What is reading comprehension?

Let me guess: you were one of those morons?

I'll give you that my opening sentence wasn't the best, but my points still stand. If you can't deal with it, then go fuck yourself like a good little man-child. If you CAN deal with it, then fucking deal with it.

>>	shilohx88 Sat Oct 4 20:59:41 2014 No.1983821 I just hated the draw system and back when I played it the junctioning magic was confusing to me. And I sucked at Triple Triad. And I thought Rinoa was a bossy jerk. Literally the second Final Fantasy game I had played at the time.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 21:13:28 2014 No.1983843 >>1983534 That would all be fine if the game didn't literally dock your salary for tinkering around too much.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 21:40:27 2014 No.1983874

>>1982195
I thought the idea of the Guardian Forces erasing part of a user's memory was a neat idea. Give Summons an, at the very least a story, draw back. Unlike most other FF games where using powers like Magic, Summons, etc had no negative effects. Just that FFVIII handled it poorly. But it's been a long while since I've played an FF so I might be remembering things wrong.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:14:49 2014 No.1983942

>>1982220
The highest rank was A. Which I still think is strange. A bunch of numbered ranks and then just A out of no where. There were 30 written test you could take to increase your rank and paygrade. Which test you had access to was determined by Sqaull's level.

Though I don't really know why you would care about rank and paygrade. I don't remember there being a point to buying anything, just upgrading weapons and you should have more than enough for that without even bothering with ranks.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:18:06 2014 No.1983950 >>1982249 For all we know Cid and his wife were paying for Squall's group specifically. Since they know about them from the timeloop bullshit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:20:59 2014 No.1983954 >>1982280 >Why does he have an obsession with getting Sorceress pussy? Remember that movie Laguna played a Sorceress Knight in, when he fought that Ruby Dragon? Seifer loved that move as a kid.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:25:27 2014 No.1983962

>>1982313
>where were the classes on the dangers of Esper usage?

From what I remember only Balamb Garden used Guardian Forces that much. And something like losing memories would get in the way of them making that mercenary money. So they covered it up. You can't make an omelet without cracking a few heads/eggs.

Either that or the people that Balamb were fucking idiots and had no idea about it. Been years since I played it.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:36:03 2014 No.1983978

I remember liking FFVIII's world. They just never properly built anything up. Most of the time you don't hear about anything until it's right in your face.

Like that artificial island where you fight Bahamut and Ultima Weapon. Was there anything in the game talking about that even existing or talking about some group looking for some giant draw point before you landed on the place and Squall or Zell just dropped info in your lap?

Or those Ruins where you fight Odin? Did the characters even say anything about the place/the civilization that built it when you get there?

Why was the orphanage put in some ruins in the middle of no where?

What about Lunatic Pandora and how it could call monsters from the moon, where did that come from and why was it on the bottom of the ocean when Esther found it?

Why were there monsters on the moon? Does the moon even have an atmosphere? It looks like a barren, lifeless hunk of rock like our moon.

I think VIII could actually benefit from a compilation like VII's if shit actually got explained in sequels, spin offs, whatever.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:39:51 2014 No.1983981 >>1982360 I thought Seifer was just being manipulated, not right out mind controlled like Kain in FFIV. Weren't his two buddies able to snap him out of it?

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:42:17 2014 No.1983984 If you got a couple hours to burn, Spoony's video series on FF8 points out most of the flaws of the game pretty well. http://spoonyexperiment.com/game-reviews/final-fantasy-series/final-fantasy-viii/page/2/

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:44:19 2014 No.1983987

>>1982476
Maybe Freya's arc not being wrapped up, at least not completely, was the point? Isn't the game's theme mortality and doing what you can with the time you have? Not everyone gets to finish everything in the time they have. But I haven't played the game in a good number of years.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:48:02 2014 No.1983994 The only think about Freya that pisses me off is there more hentai of her than any other FF9 character. Fuck the furries, man.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:48:12 2014 No.1983995 >>1983987 It does get wrapped up, it's just there could have been much more done with her character. She ends up being totally irrelevant to everything immediately after Cleyra.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:50:09 2014 No.1984000 >>1982753 If people of the world know about some Sorceress named Ultimecia that will be born sometime in the future and fuck with time. Why would they name anyone Ultimecia? Is that a name she gave herself?

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 22:56:25 2014 No.1984009

I remember reading on, I think, the wiki and hearing about this character from FF8 named Hyne and how they were the source of the Sorceress powers.

I don't ever remember hearing about him in 8 though and I must have played through the game at least 6 times.

Is there a hidden Hyne boss fight the makers of the official guide weren't told about?

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:05:08 2014 No.1984016

>>1982470
Steiner was comic relief, until it became clear that Queen Brahn was corrupted with evil, and a pawn of Kuja. then he became a fairly tragic character, as the life he had dedicated himself to came crashing down. I really felt bad for Steiner, by the middle of the game. he is one of my favorite FF characters

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:07:24 2014 No.1984020 >>1984016 Tru that, man. One great little touch in this game was where, to help rescue Garnet, he had to fight past his fellow Alexandrian knights. While doing so he did not raise his sword in celebration after the battles were won.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:20:40 2014 No.1984048

>>1982465
the same as any game: interesting game play, a sense of progression and reward for hard work, beautiful music and visuals, a style that is coherent with all the elements working together toward a single design goal. One extra requirement for RPGs (as opposed to racing games or platformers) is the need for well drawn characters and a well told story.

FF8 had a poorly thought out story, with new elements dropping in randomly and old ones being completely forgotten. It had poorly drawn characters with unclear motivation, little back story, and erratic behavior. Squall is also pissy and moody for the sake of being pissy and moody. its as if the game were written by someone who had never worked on a Final
Fantasy game, but played a few minutes of FF7 for research.

Final Fantasy games are not the most brilliantly written things you have ever played. It is understandable, since they are usually 40-80 hours long. I am playing FF12, and am 90 hours in, with two more dungeons to go. Still, they usually have a logical flow and interesting, charismatic characters. they aren't always Shakespeare, but they are usually loveable and fun. FF9 was as loveable as a schizophrenic porcupine with a bad case of gass

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:25:36 2014 No.1984053

>>1982435
the characters in XII played a different purpose, than characters in most games. the story is not actually about THEM. it is about their attempts to prevent/start a war between two continents.

there is no beginning or ending for them. the story has a beginning and an end, but this is just a chapter in their lives. Not very satisfying, I know. I would love to learn more about Balthier and Fran's relationship, or see what happens to Basch, since all of Dalmasca thinks he murdered the king. but, once you see how the story is structured, the apparent shortcomings are a little easier to accept

>>	shilohx88 Sat Oct 4 23:27:52 2014 No.1984062 >>1983821 Oh and I forgot. Penalized for leveling up. I still can't wrap my head around it. I grind to get ahead of enemies not on the same higher level.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:40:49 2014 No.1984087

>>1984053
What's tragic about 12 is the Bache was originally meant to be the main character of the game, with the story centering around him. But he wasn't enough of a bishie prettyboy for Japanese test audiences, thus we got Vaan, a literal paperweight of a character who was there for no other reason than to be a pretty face.

Anonymous Sat Oct 4 23:41:43 2014 No.1984090

>>1982770
being asked to think, and being lead down the wrong path and laughed at for not being precognisant are two different things.

when I played FF9, I had already played 1, 4, 6 and 7, so I was used to complicated villains with clearly laid out motivations. hell, those two main baddies, Keftka and Sephiroth both appeared in their games hours after the start. Kefka is actually in the opening cinema!

The game hypes Edea as being the main bad pretty hard, so when it swaps her out for another sorceress, who was never mentioned before, its a little disorienting. Ultimecia, i think, was never even mentioned until after the second sorceress is beaten. also, unlike Garland, Kefka, and Sephiroth, Ultimecia has zero influence on the challenges our heroes face. we are told she is mind controlling people and monsters, but we never see it. she is background noise, like the Three Goddesses in 6, or The Planet, in 7. She doesn't pop out of nowhere, so much as she pops out of the last place she is supposed to be, the background.

coming out of nowhere is amateurish writing. we can accept someone not knowing what they are doing. coming out of the background is shitty writing. that guy should know better

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 00:57:47 2014 No.1984214

>>1984062

You know FF8 isn't the only game in existence with scaling enemies right?

You do realize that just because enemies "scale" with you, doesn't mean they will be equal to or stronger than you right? For instance, the shit at the start of the game, may be your level due to the scale but are still weak when compared to a ruby dragon or any of the shit on the island of heaven/hell.

Cannon fodder is still cannon fodder, only a few enemies are truly hard in the game regardless of the scaling.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 01:03:05 2014 No.1984229 >>1982223 handsome motherfucker, no homo.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 01:07:00 2014 No.1984238 >>1983995 And the fact that her arc is only wrapped up in the fucking ending. Like you said, after Cleyra, she does and matters fuck all, and you don't even find out what happened to Sir Fratley (and Puck, for that matter) until the ending.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 01:27:36 2014 No.1984265
File: 74 KB, 1000x1000, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1982171
I really enjoy it, always have and always will. I also enjoy the story, makes sense to me and is much different than most RPGs in it's methods of telling the story and the subject matter. Also the love arc between rinoa and squall was welcomed by me. The FMVs were beautiful, and the opener is my all time favorite opener to any game. Triple triad is also the shit! Best mini game of all time.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 01:44:40 2014 No.1984282 I think I'm a little late to the party, but I suppose people hate it is because of the transition from VII (which had alot of real-life inspiration) and VIII which was made much more casually than most final fantasy games.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 02:13:01 2014 No.1984314

Always had a hunch that aside from the usual complaints, 8 was disliked by the crowd that got into it with 7. I imagine few of those types realized that FF doesn't do sequels in the expected ways, and as a result they likely were turned off when 8 wasn't a continuation of 7. Just a hunch.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 02:58:56 2014 No.1984367 >>1984314 >>FF doesn't do sequels in expected ways >>implying that FF's are inherently different Most of them are incredibly similar, more so then most sequels

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:00:41 2014 No.1984372 >>1984367 man... you know you've been debugging code too long when you're using the >> instead of >

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:24:38 2014 No.1984392

>>1982513
I mentioned Edea already in my post. Squall only forges a relation with Cid within the events of the game, and is shown that he didn't have a good relation with the other kids at the orphanage.

>>1983981
Yes.

>>1984009
In Balamb there is an optional conversation that you can hear and it tells its origins.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Great_Hyne

That said, I'd recommend taking a look the wiki since there are a lot of posts here asking questions that can be easily checked there.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:33:31 2014 No.1984407
File: 100 KB, 594x820, Edea.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1982753
>>1982770
I think you're giving Square way too much credit. FF8 was rushed out the door and its story had a lot of unfinished plotlines. Just because you've got a boner for minimalist storytelling doesn't excuse FF8's lack of it.

FF has never been a series about the player making up their own story by piecing together blurbs from hidden NPCs and snippets from the in-game datalog. If that's what you perceive FF8 as, it is only a flaw and a severe one at that.

If you think things like "he saw a movie one time, that's his character establishment" are acceptable in an FF title, I dunno what to say. Look at a supporting villain from another FF game, someone like Hojo gets a far more elaborate backstory than Seifer. Hell, every member of the Shinra board does, to say nothing of even more minor characters like Dyne.

You said it yourself why Ultimecia is such a pathetic villain. She exists only to protect herself from SeeD who exist only to kill her because she's protecting herself? Idiotic circular logic. If that's the main theme of the game it makes FF8's plot even worse than I first conceived. I'd rather headcanon Squall's Dead over that tripe - at least it makes sense out of an absent plot.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:36:04 2014 No.1984408

>What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8?

1. booring storyline
2. emotionless "emo" protagonist that probably started the whole Emo-goth thing
3. no side quests
4. full of lenghty boring cinematics and shit
5. almost endgame and all you can say is "is this all?"
6. managed to get odin on my side and make him insta-win any battles. seifer

replaced it with girugamesh. yeah cool!
7. younger brother keeps on yelling at me "buy some fucking pots already!" and I say

"I STILL NEED TO WAIT FOR 2 MORE HOURS TO GET MY NEXT 300G SeeD SALARY!!!!!!!"
8. Fight hard to defeat Ultima weapon. Only to get Eden's censored devourer.
I could fill an entire book about why ff8 sucks but i'm tired already

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:41:22 2014 No.1984412 >>1984408 9. oh and that select + square button booster thing ar yahhhh--ratatatatattatatatatatatatatattatata... raatatatatatatatatatta... ratatatatatatatatatata... ratatatatatatattatata... toink*resets ..fuuuuuuuuuuu

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:44:27 2014 No.1984418
File: 37 KB, 640x480, PSOGL2_510.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

As far as FFVIII is concerned there is more wrong with players than the game itself:

>You have to Draw 100 of every magic from every enemy with every party member in every battle!
You DON'T have to do that but many people did because they never tried out the refine abilities.

>But if I don't Draw I have to spend ages playing that shitty card game!
Not if you refine useless items and cards you get as drops to magic. Refining the useless crap you get as drops is more than enough to get you through the whole game.

>But I still insist to Draw for magic!
Have a decent magic stat then, the success rate of Draw and how many spells you get is linked to your magic stat.

>You have to fight by spamming GFs over and over again!
Again most people did this because they didn't realize you are better of using your physical attacks and limit breaks provided you have semi-decent junctions.

>Junction system is overly complicated!
There is an auto-junction option and it actually does a pretty good job.

>Junction system is (easily) broken!
True but you DON'T have to break it if being overpowered makes the game less fun for you.

>You have to redo all your junctions each time the game forces you to switch party members!
There is a option to switch GFs/junctions between party members for this exact purpose, use it!

>Card command is useless and never works!
It works on enemies that are low on HP.

>But the game never tells you that!
Yes, it does. Pic related.

>Level scaling makes leveling up pointless!
WHY is this a problem? You actually like pointless level grinding?

>But it punishes you for leveling up!
You are aware that you get better drops/magic/steals from higher level enemies? However there is absolutely no point in leveling past lv.45 as the drops don't get any better anymore but there is no real reason in trying to purposely avoid leveling up. However there is one valid complaint about level scaling; the game doesn't tell you about it being there.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 03:58:42 2014 No.1984425
File: 30 KB, 658x274, gfs.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1983874
>I thought the idea of the Guardian Forces erasing part of a user's memory was a neat idea. Give Summons an, at the very least a story, draw back.

It';s weird though for as much as you use them you never really seem to experience any memory loss after the fact.

the characters have so little experience with them that's it's strange that there memories would have such a huge blank that they never call into question and if the few times they use it take away that much memory why don't they forget everything after the fact?

Talk about inconsistent rules.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 04:09:16 2014 No.1984432

>>1982174
>SE
>in charge of stories
they're infamous for terrible stories with wacky shit and plot holes mate. Even Chains of Promathia which is their best was full of either random shit/appearances that made no sense and tangents that seemed fucking pointless

shilohx88 Sun Oct 5 05:09:43 2014 No.1984475

My main issue was hitting the higher 60s and not wanting to grind anymore. Didn't know I didn't have to grind. Didn't know the enemies got skills faster than I did.
The game never told me anything about it.
My second Final Fantasy and I didn't know anything even with the guide.
I need to replay this the right way.

NESfag Sun Oct 5 05:21:29 2014 No.1984484

>>1984407
I'm not giving "too much credit" to Square, it's you who isn't giving enough.
What you don't understand is that with FF8 they were trying to do something different, to go further and to put the player directly as an actor of the game rather than has the audiance (in other FF games you pretty much are the audiance of the story).
You can clearly see this with the gameplay system and how much freedom and choice it gives to the player, as well as letting the player figuring it out things by himself. Gameplay-wise FF8 lets a lot of small things to the player to understand, it took me at least 5 or 6 playthroughs to figure out every little gameplay subtlety.
It is the same for the story, except that for the story I was still discovering small things on my 8th playthrough. This doesn't mean that you need to play the game 8 times to understand the story, you can understand it with 1 playthrough; though due to the nature of the 'time travel story looping back on itself' 2 playthroughs is better to understand the grand scheme perfectly as some things make more sense once you know the ending (quite logical considering in such a time travel story, past present and future are all linked); but this is the same with any time travel story and that is the beauty of them.

NESfag Sun Oct 5 05:27:11 2014 No.1984487

>>1984484
Because you don't like this kind of storytelling and because you're rather be mouthfed FF4 or FF13 style doesn't mean it's a flaw. My opinion is that you don't like being told that you didn't understand a story that needs a little more thinking to be understood, you think it insults your intelligence, so you reject it and tell yourself it's the story which is flawed.
If you ask me, FF8's storytelling was a step towards the right direction as far as video games are concerned, becauses your understand of the story is directly connected to your actions gameplay-wise; and that is a kind of storytelling unique to video games that puts the player as actor. Unlike other FF games and the vast majority of modern games that just try as fucking hard as they can to be like movies (which if you ask me never works, because a movie is a movie, a game is a game, and a game trying to be a movie will always come out as a pale wanabee).

And as far as "giving too much credit go"; if anything it's the contrary, it's Squaresoft which gave too much credit to its audiance. They thought its audiance would be mature and intelligent enough to understand the kind of story that asks them to make 2+2 and the kind of gameplay that takes to understand a fucking tutorial. They were wrong. Tons of players had no idea what junctionning was about and the vast majority had no idea what was going on in the ending (even though it is clearly TOLD to you at the end of Disc3 what is going on in the ending).

When I think about that I get sad because it makes think video game will never reach their unique storytelling potential, because all player wants or are able to understand are wanabee movies.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 05:40:18 2014 No.1984496
File: 217 KB, 975x1200, a9c65ccd7f45d6056c0a169e35984378.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1984418
That's because you're answering complaints by people who don't know what they're saying.

Here are real problems with gameplay (and I'm not even talking about hideous script):

- The difficulty level is to low to bother with any of the convoluted mechanics the game offers.

- Mechanics are needlessly convoluted. You are expected to equip GFs to enable equipping magic, which you need to draw. If you don't do that, which you don't have to, because the game is so easy, the whole affair turns into "press X repeatedly to win."

- Per-character mechanics are often questionable. They are also useless with the exception of Squall's whatever it's called omnislash thing and Zell's. Meanwhile, there are not nearly enough unique per-character mechanics - everyone's the same, and the minor stat differencies are completely nullified through junctioning.

- GFs are a broken mechanic: you either use them in combat and watch those cutscenes instead of actually playing, or you don't and they're just spreadsheet gameplay in the menus, which is achievable through a single button press - autojunctioning doesn't provide the best possible result, but it provides more than enough to beat the game without any possible trouble.

- Level scaling DOES make the level-up process pointless. You only gain a couple of abilities from levelling up your GFs. Levelling up your characters is mostly a meaningless affair.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 05:47:18 2014 No.1984504

>>1984484
>with FF8 they were trying to do something different
They were trying to make a cinematic experience where gameplay is a mild and inconsequential distraction, and, yes, they succeeded.

>put the player directly as an actor of the game
What? FFVIII? Stop spewing your shit, nesfag, you need to take your medicine again. FVIII is the opposite of what you're claiming it is.

> as well as letting the player figuring it out things by himself
Everything is in the tutorials. Nobody reads them, because the game's too easy to bother.

>It is the same for the story
The worst mess from the PlayStation era. FFVIII has painfully amateurish script. It's trite and overwritten, it convolutes the simplest things needlessly, it repeatedly writes itself into holes and then saves itself with inane ass-pulls. The whole thing reads like somebody's first draft of a sci-fantasy first novel they've written when they were 14.

We get it, you were impressed by NPCs saying plot-related things. It's uncommon for Final Fantasy games where everyone in towns used to same fucking line, because Square never fucking cared. But it really shows how limited your experience with games, or literature, while we're at it, is, if you honest-to-god believe that FFVIII is an achievement in anything whatsoever. Even for 1998, it was a humongous step backwards both in gamedesign and storytelling.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 05:51:53 2014 No.1984510

>>1984487
>If you ask me, FF8's storytelling was a step towards the right direction as far as video games are concerned
Long cutscenes and inconsequential gameplay did become standard for a while, that's true. FFVIII even had a couple of proto-QTE sequences in the form of some action minigames.

FFVIII did look int he future in that regard. In the worst way possible, that is.

Your ideas on how its storytelling works are plain old ass-backwards. You see glaring, offensive non-interactivity and pronounce it paragon of interactive storytelling for some truly fucked-up mental burp that you always have whenever FFVIII is mentioned.

NESfag Sun Oct 5 05:57:26 2014 No.1984519

>>1984425
It is said that any Balamb Garden student used GF as part of their traning since early childhood. So that leaves Irvinie and Selphie, we know Irvinie didn't lose his memory and Selphie said she captured one even earlier when she was still at the orphanage.
So that's why they don't question it or realize it, it was a pretty smooth process since early childhood.
Also how can one realize a memory loss? If it's not there, it's simply not there anymore for anyone to ask question on.

Finally I'd like to say that the memory loss is either told or hinted that several times throughout the game, and that since the VERY beginning of the game. People say it's a shitty 'plot twist', except it is not a plot twist.
The first thing you do in the game is check Squall's computer, in that computer it is said by the not to trust the rumours saying GF cause memory loss because it was never proven.
Later on in the game it's implied several times as well (through Cid who wants to tell but can't due to Norg's guards; or with Squall in disc2 forgetting the name of the student that was with him in Dollet in Disc1, etc) and IIRC Selphie discusses it in her journal as well.

This is a pretty good example of what I meant, it asks the player to look for the information a little bit and to put that together with other things that are said (even in mandatory dialogues); the thing is overshadowed in the entire game, yet tons of players claim it's a shitty plot "twist" even though it's only if twist if they are too stupid to understand what is told to them in the game.

I'd also say that it's an RPG, RPG are adventure games, by definition adventure games should (and do) ask you to look for stuff by yourself. You can't claim that's bad mechanics, and if it's not your thing, don't play an adventure game, but watch a movie.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:03:24 2014 No.1984527

>>1984519
It's a terrible plot device terribly executed. It's the good old JRPG amnesia backstory, but here it's somehow botched. EVERYONE has amnesia here, except for a guy who doesn't, but never tells anybody. My god, the whole plot is fucked up beyond repair.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:05:21 2014 No.1984529

>>1984519
>by definition adventure games should (and do) ask you to look for stuff by yourself. You can't claim that's bad mechanics, and if it's not your thing, don't play an adventure game
FFVIII is not an adventure game, it's a linear cartoon with occasional battle sequences that win themselves. Whenever you're given control, you're told exactly where to go and what to do.

People don't hate FFVIII for too much freedom, they lack it for the perfect absence of freedom. They don't say the plot is too complex, they say it's stupid as fuck and the characters are terrible. You stupid, ass-backwards goddamn motherfucker.

NESfag Sun Oct 5 06:06:26 2014 No.1984531

>>1984510
I didn't say it was the epitome of interactivity. I said it was a STEP towards the right direction.

For instance NPCs in previous FF would only tell useless or funny informations; or things not related to the main story. In FF8 NPCs can give precious informations regarding the understanding of important plot elements, like for example when you talk to NPCs in Deiling City you will understand Edea's brainwashing powers and why all those citizens let her be their leader and why they weren't shocked by her killing the mayor.

This is just one example among many others but that's asking the player to look for information and to put together with other elements, and sometimes to read between the lines. That's an adventure gameplay mechanic that puts the player in the center. Like I said if you think that's a bad mechanic, don't play adventure games; and if you think it's not there you're only fooling yourself because you have a hard time admitting that you were unable to understand a story aimed at teenagers.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:07:37 2014 No.1984534 >>1984527 Not only is it dumb as hell, but the reveal is played off like a fucking joke. They may as well have had everyone turn and say "Irvine!" a la Carlos from the fucking Magic School Bus.

>>	NESfag Sun Oct 5 06:09:32 2014 No.1984536 >>1984527 I find it more better and more belieable than Cloud's fake memory thing and the fact that Tifa knew the truth since the beginning but never wanted to tell.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:13:19 2014 No.1984538

>>1984531
>I didn't say it was the epitome of interactivity
What it was, though, - the epitome of non-interactivity, which is the point. It was offensively linear and simplistic gameplay-wise. It almost literally did play itself, what with the combination of level scaling, auto-junctioning and killing practically everything by pressing the X button of summoning GFs. (In b4 don't use the only available gameplay mechanics if you think they're stupid and invent your own instead!)

>>1984534
Now watch that nutter tell you that if that cutscene's too complex and uniquely gives you too much freedom, don't play it.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:14:45 2014 No.1984539

>>1984531
>For instance NPCs in previous FF would only tell useless or funny informations
Yes, that's because Final Fantasy was always terrible like that. FFVIII is almost exactly as terrible. Being better than FFIV is not big achievement, especially when you compare it to games like, say, Dragon Quest, where almost everything everyone says is panimportant to adventure gameplay and exploration.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:16:58 2014 No.1984541 >>1984536 >I find it more better and more belieable than Cloud's fake memory thing Meanwhile, I find it equally idiotic. Absolutely, though. Both examples are so fucking stupid it hurts. Square writers weren't writers. At all.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:17:44 2014 No.1984545 >>1982337 >Since 4chan is a hive mind I think hating on this game got popular the last few years, yet because is not as good as your favorite FF it doesn't mean is total trash. And this thread is a great example of that.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:21:17 2014 No.1984550

>>1982337
>hating on this game got popular the last few years
It was hated on release. You're just too young (or perhaps too ignorant or confused) to remember.

>the gameplay I guess is a hit or miss for a lot of people, but I liked it
You may have liked it, but it's all-around bad. See >>1984496 or any other post listing numerous problems with gameplay.

NESfag Sun Oct 5 06:23:25 2014 No.1984552

>>1984538
Yeah, you're right, but that's because what you're using as a comparison point is 'some inexistant game that would all about interactivity'. Except that this isn't the discussion we're having, you're switching discussion so that things can be looked through another bigger angle, angle which of course puts FF8 in a bad position. Anyone could do the same with any discussion.

The point is I'm comparing FF8 to what it can be compared: other FF games. Of course it's still a FF game with long cutscenes and mandatory dialogues, but compared to other FF games it's a huge step towards the direction of gameplay-linked storytelling and putting the player in the center of his story, which asks of the player to look for info and put it together.
My point is not that FF8 is a prime example of that, my point is that it was a STEP in the right direction, a step which failed either because people didn't expect that or because they were too stupid to understand it; and that it's exactly because of it that games nowadays don't even dare to try and just want to be movies.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:29:37 2014 No.1984557 >>1984552 >or because they were too stupid to understand it I really wish you would quit pulling this "lol2deep4u" shit. It's entirely possible someone can completely understand the story and still think it's a goddamn mess.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:29:41 2014 No.1984558

>>1984552
>but compared to other FF games it's a huge step towards the direction of gameplay-linked storytelling and putting the player in the center of his story, which asks of the player to look for info and put it together.
It had bigger, longer cutscenes than any FF before it, and a messier, crazier plot contortions than any of them. It had less interactivity than any Final Fantasy before it, period. Even less (slightly) than the goddamn FFVII, which already was a travesty both in terms of gameplay and story.

>The point is I'm comparing FF8 to what it can be compared: other FF games
That's arbitrary. In actuality, it can be compared to any JRPG, and its script can be compared to any work of literature. And it compares unfavourably, to put it politely.

Please answer this question: have you played a lot of non-Square JRPGs?

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:32:10 2014 No.1984563 >>1984087 My problem with Vaan being the main character is that his brother existed and you got to play him for the intro. So if they didn't kill off his brother, suddenly you have a bishi pretty boy who is relevant to the plot at the very least.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:34:15 2014 No.1984568 >>1984087 What's tragic about FF12 was that Square-Enix owned it.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 06:47:18 2014 No.1984578

I must have played FFVIII when I was about 9 and I never found it difficult.

It seemed plain to me that junctioning magic was better then casting it, and that even early on I could do more substantial damage using junction physical attacks and limit breaks, than casting and summoning.

I also beat the mechanical spider thing in Dollet, although that boiled down to a day a friend came over to play and we just grinded outside the comms. tower for hours.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 10:28:17 2014 No.1984842 >>1984558 >That's arbitrary. In actuality, it can be compared to any JRPG, and its script can be compared to any work of literature. And it compares unfavourably, to put it politely. The number of JRPGs with non-trash writing can be counted on one hand

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 10:49:51 2014 No.1984869
File: 69 KB, 1280x1024, 20090101154214!Ff4_crystal.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

To be honest, most of the early Final Fantasy games were pretty shit in terms of story too. It was always something about an evil guy who is portrayed as the villain the whole time and then it turns out he is not the true villain, but just some pawn. And the only motivation for that true villain was always something simple like getting all the crystals and/or destroying the world.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 11:01:22 2014 No.1984876 >>1982253 There's an achievement for doing that in the steam version. No need to level when you can raise your stats with magicks and hurpa dhur.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 11:02:12 2014 No.1984882
File: 184 KB, 1200x700, Ragnarok~0.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

The main problem wasn't the story. Hell, most JRPG stories are incoherent messes, but you can forgive a lot if the mechanics are functional and the characters likable. FFVIII didn't have the later.
It's true that Squall's moping has been exaggerated throughout the years, but what's there is still annoying. Rinoa might just be the most dull female character in the history of video games and both Selphie and Zell were annoying as fuck. But the real kicker was the fact that there were way more interesting characters and story within the game you never got to explore fully. Fuck Squall and his cronies, I wanted to play as Laguna Loire and his team, would have made for a much more interesting game. Pic related was pretty cool though.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 11:02:58 2014 No.1984884

>>1984504
I think it was pretty damn good, not that guy, but what do you really think you're going to do? Convince people that like the game that it's bad? I just don't get it. So much of what you all are arguing about is dependent upon what an individual enjoys and viewpoint. It's actually funny watching you two both be incapable of understanding that people like different things.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 11:03:06 2014 No.1984885 >>1982265 It was the Sorceress footing the bill. Square pulled some Charles Dickens shit.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 11:13:12 2014 No.1984898 >>1984884 i support him yelling at nesfag because he's an idiot

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 15:18:02 2014 No.1985335

>>1984519
>This is a pretty good example of what I meant, it asks the player to look for the information a little bit and to put that together with other things that are said (even in mandatory dialogues); the thing is overshadowed in the entire game, yet tons of players claim it's a shitty plot "twist" even though it's only if twist if they are too stupid to understand what is told to them in the game.

that's idiotic. your powers causing you to lose your memory is too big a deal to just hand wave away with flavor text and a OH.

There should have been more of a reaction, have the party refuse to use them for a bit. These things fucked with their heads royally and no one cares?

More to the point why did the memory loss stop when they became older?

If they forget their childhood why don't they forget say all of disc 1 later? They where using the GFs way more then.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 15:25:51 2014 No.1985347

>>1984842
FFVIII is one of the worse offenders, though.

>>1984884
Basically, you're the kind of idiot who goes around proposing that people stop discussing art, because opinions are a thing. Nobody's arguing whether a person is allowed to like FF8 or not. I like FF8. What we're discussing is whether it can be considered questionably written or really terribly fucking written, worst in the genre-grade kind of badly written, that kind of thing. Then around comes the namefag, claiming that its long, perfectly non-interactive cutscenes are a genius, novel storytelling mechanism, because some random NPCs occasionally give non-interactive snippets of plot, which impresses him a lot.

Anonymous Sun Oct 5 15:30:29 2014 No.1985356

>>1982253
>Literally what is the fucking point of the random encounters then?
FFVIII is a hideous misunderstanding of Wizardry/Dragon Quest type random encounters indeed. From a really welcome amassing of exp that you could use to win further battles, by FFVIII it's finally become an inconsequential non-entity that has no reason to exist whatsoever, but persists because it used to be important, although the designers don't remember why.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 15:38:04 2014 No.1985371 >>1984496 Level scaling doesn't make leveling pointless. Strong enemies will remain strong and weak enemies will remain weak, the only significant difference is they get more magic to draw.

shilohx88 Sun Oct 5 21:58:47 2014 No.1986271
File: 102 KB, 500x500, squallselphie.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Okay I started a low level playthrough and have 100 spells of about everything I've drawn and junctioned it to STR but I still had problems with Evrolet. I beat him but it felt like it took WAY longer than it should have.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 22:06:04 2014 No.1986282 >>1985371 And higher HP.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 22:12:57 2014 No.1986293 >>1982246 What's wrong with Xenogears and Chrono Cross? I have not played either but I have heard both are really good. This is the first time I have heard a criticism towards either.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 22:24:56 2014 No.1986317 Are there any pictures of Selphie taking a selfie?

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 5 22:29:01 2014 No.1986325 File: 557 KB, 3535x4413, uF6Ceco.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1986317 like this?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 00:41:52 2014 No.1986538 >>1986325 more importantly are there any pics of her getting her ass reemed by that monster

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 00:43:25 2014 No.1986541
File: 569 KB, 648x960, 2331e9222deb95bc965184eef2dc82a2915cf745.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1986293
>What's wrong with Xenogears and Chrono Cross? I have not played either but I have heard both are really good.

well in simplest terms, let's just say the scope of the stories far exceeded what the design team and writing staff where capable with what they had to work on

they're certainly good but you can tell where the staff was shooting for more than could do

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 02:37:32 2014 No.1986690

>>1982174
>Its super breakable. Which makes it pretty replayable. Junction is completely fucking busted. You can have a low levle game (1-10) with maxed stats because you played cards and got Enc-None on Diablos as fast as possible. You can also get a Lionheart on disc 1.

This killed the fun in the game. It winds up having extremely simplistic and easy combat if you do this.

I think FF9 had the best system with diverse party-members, strengths and weaknesses. In 7 and 8 everybody is the same.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 02:44:36 2014 No.1986698 >>1986541 > fags talking about story The combat in xenogears is more user interactive than most games today. Especially the offline mmo trend. Gameplay is what really matters

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:03:54 2014 No.1986728 >>1984425 That's part of why I said FFVIII handed it so poorly.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:07:44 2014 No.1986732 >>1984392 You think something like "The source of the powers of the main villain" would be something that would come up in more than just a optional conversation.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:24:41 2014 No.1986751 >>1984882 Ragnarok is the best airship in FF hands down.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:27:49 2014 No.1986759 >>1984882 >FOX EN Now I want a peace walker type game set in FFVIII's world. Just replace Mother Base with Garden. Build it up, take on jobs to earn money, could either do them yourself or send some students to do it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:33:49 2014 No.1986764 >>1985335 They would have cared but they forgot. They should really stop using GF.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 03:56:04 2014 No.1986780 How did Selphie, Zell, and Quists know how to pilot the Ragnarok?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 04:49:14 2014 No.1986819 >>1982171 It was designed for system hardware that didn't yet exist.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 05:00:10 2014 No.1986829 >>1985371 >Level scaling doesn't make leveling pointless. Strong enemies will remain strong and weak enemies will remain weak, >the only significant difference is they get more magic to draw. I.e., it makes it pointless.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 05:06:59 2014 No.1986832 >>1982295 Hahaha!

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 05:27:04 2014 No.1986846 >>1982295 >Sorceress pussy He didn't need her pussy, he was looking for a mother figure.

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 05:33:18 2014 No.1986849

>>1984504
>They were trying to make a cinematic experience where gameplay is a mild and inconsequential distraction, and, yes, they succeeded.

Pretty much every FF falls into that category. All of them have very simple combat systems that are easily broken and offer no challenge or no depth. Either Square is terrible at actually making the gameplay interesting or they just don't care.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 05:36:39 2014 No.1986852 >>1986849 I dunno, I thought they did a pretty good job with V in the gameplay department

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 06:14:01 2014 No.1986902

>>1986541
That sounds like every anime ever. Based on some giant manga phone book or something. Normal story pacing till the end when they go oh shit how can we fit all this in. Also politics and money interfere with the natural creative process. Game development gets cut short all the time due to deadlines, having to release before the next generation, etc. Honestly I prefer something like what you described like Xenogears. Over something like elder scrolls where your walking around in a giant world of empty soulless characters just standing there.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 06:30:28 2014 No.1986918 If you focus on Triple Triad and travel the world collecting cards and seeking out challengers it's quite fun.

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 06:35:32 2014 No.1986930
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There were a lot of things wrong with VIII. Poor story, shitty love interest, easily manipulated mechanics, etc. But it wasn't all bad. My favorite aspect of the game was that it left the player to think for themselves and to figure out what was going on. The story wasn't handed to you in a neat little package. The world was open and great for exploring. The Deep Sea Research Center? That place was amazing! Fuck the Shumi village quest though. If you just want to run around and fight monsters, this game is great for it.

>>1986538
You're gonna want to look for "happy and lucky version 5" on any decent Hentai site

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 07:21:52 2014 No.1986968 >>1986849 >Either Square is terrible at actually making the gameplay interesting or they just don't care. At first they were terrible, then stopped even caring. The original Bushido Blade could be the only Squaresoft game with actually good gameplay.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 07:26:07 2014 No.1986971 File: 29 KB, 380x250, 1393831515787.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1986968 >tfw you will never see a game quite like bushido blade again

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 15:27:07 2014 No.1987647 I love FFVIII, it's my favorite!

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 15:58:01 2014 No.1987703 >>1986968 I'll have to just guess what you consider "actually good gameplay", but I'd throw in Vagrant Story, Einhänder, Tobal No.1 and Front Mission (3?) as contenders for good gameplay.

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 16:05:21 2014 No.1987710

>>1987703
Front Mission is a worse eample of its genre (compared to, say, Ogre Battle).

Tobal No. 1 is a poor man's Tekken, literally--I mean, literally.

Einhander is a third-rate shooter. Come the fuck on, it's not good. At all. It's the Battle Arena Toshinden of horishmups.

Vagrant Story is a Yasumi Matsuno game, first and foremost, and was designed by his team. Regardless, it's a very flawed experience gameplay-wise. The game gives off incredibly wrong signals about the way it's supposed to be played, including red herrings like chaining and affinities making you think you're supposed to either grind affinities (and keep seperate weapons for seperate enemies) or chain until you damage, both of which are the opposite of how the game actually works, and ruin the experience entirely.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 22:16:51 2014 No.1988403 >>1987710 >Tobal No. 1 is a poor man's Tekken, literally--I mean, literally. and tekken is a poor mans virtua fighter

Anonymous Mon Oct 6 22:24:34 2014 No.1988417

in Tales of Symphonia when they found out their special power macguffins where PLOT PLOT PLOTITY PLOT there was a moment where they considered getting rid of them and not using them at all. In the anime they even ran a boss fight without them and despite winning nearly got their shit kicked in

Im not saying FF8 needed to do the same thing and the stuff they find out is very different. I just wish gave the scene and problem more weight than "huh you don't say" they treat the shit they learn with all the weight and severity of a fun fact

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 23:16:39 2014 No.1988527 >>1988403 BAHAHAHA, no, Tekken is actually fun to play.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 6 23:18:50 2014 No.1988532 File: 6 KB, 222x225, 1393914187161.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1988527 >juggle simulator fun to play They are both shit.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 7 13:34:44 2014 No.1989598 >>1982770 Sephiroth wasn't a villain either and FF7 was paced much better and never got boring like FF8 did.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 7 15:09:10 2014 No.1989778 Nothing is wrong with it. I like it a lot exactly as it is.

Anonymous Tue Oct 7 15:09:32 2014 No.1989781

>>1989598

>drop a meteor on the planet, exterminating all life
>not a villain

Er, maybe you meant he didn't start out as one? And don't say his reaction was justified, he could've just wiped Shinra out and left it at that. Dude went too far, total villain.

Anonymous Tue Oct 7 15:14:32 2014 No.1989802

>>1989781

He was a hero at first and then just went totally fucking nutty after finding out the truth, and he nearly drove cloud insane too.

But I never understood why that happened anyway, why would someone with a seemingly strong moral core beforehand suddenly just have a mental breakdown? Did sephiroth have no willpower? He just changed completely the second he started uncovering everything.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 7 15:16:20 2014 No.1989806 >>1989802 I think the idea was that it turned out that the ideas he was basing that morality on turned out to be a lie, so he started questioning those morals. In an evil, psychopathic way

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 13:14:38 2014 No.1991525

>>1989806

that's all well and good but there should have been a slower build to that. He becomes distant and emotionless and over time becomes a lunatic.

way it's presented he reads a few books and then massacres a town immediately

speaking of that the whole Nibehlheim thing really isn't played up as much as it could be. Cloud and Tifa seem to take it in stride and barely bat an eye lid that people have rebuilt and are living there

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 18:02:52 2014 No.1991986
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Holy shit this thread actully explained what is bad and good about the game in a mannered way.

Also what do you guys think about Squall compared to other FF mcs? I think is the best FF mc to date.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 18:16:06 2014 No.1992000 >>1991525 You didn't actually finish the game did you?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 18:47:45 2014 No.1992062 >>1991986 He's so badly written that he's on the brink of not being a character at all, to be honest.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 18:48:27 2014 No.1992064 File: 39 KB, 666x457, squuual.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >this entire thread

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 18:55:49 2014 No.1992083 >>1991986 I don't think he's the best, but he's alright. Certainly better than a lot of people give him credit for. I felt like I could relate to him somewhat, since he seemed to think everyone around him was just as fucking stupid as I did.

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 19:00:41 2014 No.1992093

>>1992000
>You didn't actually finish the game did you?
>hur dur you didn't play the game

really?

>since he seemed to think everyone around him was just as fucking stupid as I did.

I think my problem was less Squall and more how very few people called Squall out on his shit. They where all lining up to be his friend or suck his dick when he treated them all worse than Seifer did.

There's a bit early on where Squall can't even give Zell so much as a hand shake and instead of being called out on this gross lack of manners everyone's all "OMG he's teh coolest"

I'd have been all 'WTF ya cunt"

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 19:11:02 2014 No.1992106 >>1992093 Welcome to GLORIOUS NIPPON. Enjoy your stay

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 21:44:48 2014 No.1992370 It's my favorite FF game and I love the junction system. > opinions I've never entertained any but my own.

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 22:23:06 2014 No.1992426

>>1991986
>Also what do you guys think about Squall compared to other FF mcs
Well let's analyze each MC a bit, starting with Cecil.
Cecil has a cool look as both dark knight and paladin, but he's generally a whiner no matter which form, BUT when shit hits the fan the whining stops and he at least tries to defend his friends. 6/10
Bartz is quite possibly the least memorable FF MC, but at least he isn't a whiner so points for that. 6/10
Terra whines big time, but at least for her it's warrented. She's torn in two from her human/esper heritage, and she was literally mindraped her entire life, being raised by the Empire. Her struggle to learn that the world is a place worth living in is slow and only achieved through the saint-like patience of her friends. It was also refreshing to see a female lead, and I had to choose between her or a carpet muncher like Lightning, I choose Terra. 8/10
Cloud. Fuck man what can I say that hasn't been said already? I mean he thinks he's a cool badass that's too good for everyone and its not until 25 hours into the game that we learn his whole memory was a lie, and I guess that's the point where he does become maybe sorta kinda likeable? Really, remove the spikey hair and the fuck-massive sword and he's pretty average. 5/10.
Squall can't hide behind an implanted memory. He really is a cunt who thinks he 2 cool 4 skool. I don't believe he cares for his so-called friends. I CERTAINLY don't believe he loves Riona because he only "fell" for her by caving into her relentless advances (Oh japan and your ideal fictional waifus). I always get the sense that he fights not because its the right thing to do, but because he's an employee of SEED and it's merely his job. I'm seriously trying to remember anything about his personality other than the fact he broods and I'm seriously at a loss. 2/10

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 22:25:00 2014 No.1992430

>>1992426
Zidane. Now HERE'S a bro. He sets himself apart from all other FF MCs. He's fun. He's easygoing. He likes people and tries to make friends whenever possible. He can crack a joke, and gets the girl by actually chasing after her, not having her inexplicably fall into his arms. It's his codex to help others. I still remember he helps cheer vivi up with a pep talk and then going "Come on bro, let's go pee together under the stars. It's what frineds do." How many FF characters do you see doing that for a friend? 10/10 would have a beer with.
Just for good measure, Tidus. Yep we got another whiner. He's a known crybaby, he has a stupid haircut, he's got major daddy issues... and he's my favorite character in FF10. No joke, because on top of all that he's also the funnyman, much like Zidane, and I always appreciate the funnyman. Simple acts like sniffing Auron when the farplane's stink is mentioned brings perfect levity to the game. Besides, once he learns the true identity of Sin he stops thinking about himself so much and starts being more concerned with the rest of the party. 7/10

So yes in conclusion... Squall is a twat and the worst Final Fantasy lead.

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 22:34:57 2014 No.1992452

>>1992426
>>1992430
Your fanboyism is showing.
Cecil isn't really a whiner, he just had his entire life shattered all around him. He took up the Dark Sword in service to the king doing what he thought was right but really he ended up just being an asshole and the king was a monster. So he gets a chance to redeem himself through his actions and fighting villains. He's actually a good character, but probably just a bit under developed mainly due to early SNES development constraints and a lack luster translation.

Cloud only comes off as the cool badass in fucking Midgar right after you blow up the Reactor which is in the first fucking 20 minutes of the game. Cloud is actually probably the best AND most memorable character because they weren't afraid to make him do campy shit like Squats in a fucking gay gym for a Wig so he can crossdress to save a girl, or go snowboarding.

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 22:41:08 2014 No.1992457

>>1992426
>Cloud. Fuck man what can I say that hasn't been said already? I mean he thinks he's a cool badass that's too good for everyone and its not until 25 hours into the game that we learn his whole memory was a lie, and I guess that's the point where he does become maybe sorta kinda likeable? Really, remove the spikey hair and the fuck-massive sword and he's pretty average. 5/10.

I kind of disagree with this. It's consistently implied that Cloud cares deeply about his friends. He has a nonchalant attitude in the very beginning of the game because he's imitating Zack. He's got that attitude in the compliation of ff7 stuff too, but that doesn't count.

I'd say that Cloud is a confident guy that cares a lot of about his companions.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 23:10:50 2014 No.1992486 >>1992452 >Your fanboyism is showing. >Now let me tell you how Squall is the best character because he snowboards

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 8 23:15:28 2014 No.1992494 >>1992452 >Your fanboyism is showing. >Now let me tell you how Cloud is the best character because he snowboards.

Anonymous Wed Oct 8 23:16:32 2014 No.1992498
File: 1.97 MB, 288x216, yuffie kiss.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1992457

Thing about cloud is the FF7 and 8 teams (and a lot of FF teams in general) lack chemistry.

most of the time the party members line up to compliment and talk about how great the hero is at the expense of becoming helpless drooling brain dead simps who can't blow their nose without the big awesome MC coming to their add.

It's defiantly worse in 8 as 7 took plenty of times to take the piss out of cloud in Midgar and have him say cornball stuff "lets mosey" but I can't really feel any tangible weight to his relationships.

Aerith dies before leaving a general impression one way or the other

Tifa is a doormat who blindly does whatever he tells her too.

Barret had some good potential for an ongoing rivalry over leadership roles and strategy that was never explored and most everyone else he just got on fine with it and thats that.

As weird as it sounds at least as far as I recall (havent played in a long time) he had better back and forth with Yuffie of all people, between the Wutai stuff and him helping her with airsickness. It was something stupid and small but it was something that gave the real impression that hey he's looking out for her.

Squall was just a black void where nothing really happened and no one had any reason to give two shits about him. But yeah Cloud for any faults at least wasn't a complete prick.

Personally im waiting for the day when an RPG hero is a perpetually put upon well meaning grump

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 06:44:13 2014 No.1992868 >>1982171 I really love it. Incredibly comfy and just a feel-good game. I remember when those graphics were jaw staggering.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 06:46:59 2014 No.1992873 >>1982195 Yeah, that was felt pretty rushed, but I remember when I played that for the first time the idea that summons occupy a part of your mind ruining it like a magical cancer was actually cool.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 06:50:06 2014 No.1992876

>>1982216
>Everyone except for Selphie was angsty as all get-out.
What?
Zell was a retarded little go-get'em
Quistis was a bossy bitch full of her self and how great the was
Rinoa was always happy for no reason at all
Seifer was Draco Malfoy before Draco Malfoy

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 06:53:55 2014 No.1992881

>>1982216
>had very little to be frowning about.

>be you in FF8 world
>you're a good for nothing kid or you're an orphan
>too dumb for school
>too dumb to learn a trade
>off to school mercenary you go

I don't get all the "you'll never live in balamb garden", it all seemed like a place where inapt kids went waiting to be dispatch to some war.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 06:58:17 2014 No.1992886

>>1982223
>For as angsty and antisocial a cunt Squall is you'd think he'd have some huge dramatic back story or huge problem beyond

Abandonment issues and rejection anguish.
Squall has a flaw in the primary narcissism so he's essentially borderline.

It's really not that hard to understand.
What's the point of wanting realism or immersion if you're just treating your characters like cardboard cutout from a flick?

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 07:06:01 2014 No.1992895 >>1983559 >muh feelings were hurt i stopped reading get a pair of balls you thin skin retard

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 07:15:03 2014 No.1992903

>>1984550
>It was hated on release. You're just too young (or perhaps too ignorant or confused) to remember.
Not the guy you're replying to but I love the life-line you made there.
>if you disagree with me you're ignorant or confused because I can't be wrong.
Perhaps you're too young to remember, or you're one of those americans that get confused and frustrated when the story isn't completely explained in detail and they need to think for themselves. (I remember back then we people reported the american audience getting frustrated because Squall and Rinoa love wasn't explicit enough...that wasn't this big hollywood kiss)

FFVIII was and still is to this day one of the most beloved FF games in Japan. And that's a fact.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 07:16:18 2014 No.1992904 File: 11 KB, 280x210, op.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1984550 >You may have liked it, but it's all-around bad. >how dare you have a different opinion >how dare you enjoy what I defend is objectively bad

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 07:19:38 2014 No.1992909 I enjoyed it though it went to shit after Squall dies. The assassination and beach set pieces are great.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 07:55:51 2014 No.1992931 File: 493 KB, 389x762, 13581141207637.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1992909 >after Sqall dies

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 13:56:17 2014 No.1993337 File: 126 KB, 450x300, squall.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1992909 If only you didn't see Squall in the after credits, the only big hole in the theory. Fuck it FF8s story can never be saved

NESfag Thu Oct 9 15:03:34 2014 No.1993442

>>1993337
Every single argument put in that theory can easily be proven wrong by in game dialogues. The rest of the theory is a bad highschool grade literary "analysis".

But what can you do when FF fans are so stupid with their theories that the "iifatree=necron" bullshit was the 'official' stance on wikias for years....

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:10:09 2014 No.1993452

>>1984496
I'm not disagreeing with you overall but I just want to throw in some things
>- The difficulty level is to low to bother with any of the convoluted mechanics the game offers.
True, but this goes for every FF past 4.
>- Level scaling DOES make the level-up process pointless. You only gain a couple of abilities from levelling up your GFs. Levelling up your characters is mostly a meaningless affair.
I agree entirely. Level scaling is one of the worst ideas to ever be inflicted on RPGs.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:11:10 2014 No.1993456

>>1992904
>>1992903
Reading comprehension, please.

You are allowed to like it. I also like it for nostalgic reasons. But it's a bad game, badly designed and written.

>I love the life-line
It was hated on release. Even the goddamn PlayStation Magazine in my country gave it a 8.5 "weird boring thing, low point in the series" on release.

>you're one of those americans that get confused and frustrated when the story isn't completely explained in detail and they need to think for themselves
NESfag, please. It IS explained in minute detail, which is one of the downsides. Convolution is not complexity, and FFVIII's story is not complex. It's very simple and extremely stupid.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:12:12 2014 No.1993458 >>1993452 >True, but this goes for every FF past 4. That's not a valid excuse for bad design. At all.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:17:01 2014 No.1993463

>>1993442
>FF fans are so stupid
People who take Final Fantasy scripts seriously, or believe that Final Fantasy had been anything but three steps behind the genre at all times until 7, at which point it became a cutscene theatre with unlosable non-gameplay in-between, - those people are stupid, yes.

FF1-6 had silly scripts with slightly dated, but solid JRPG gameplay. 7-10 are really overwritten and amateurish, fanfic-grade attempts at serious drama, and among them 8 is truly the worst offender, and 9 the least.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:21:49 2014 No.1993474 >>1993458 Of course not. Never said it was. But it's a problem endemic to the series, not one specific to VIII.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:24:48 2014 No.1993478 >>1993474 5, 6 and, arguably, even 7 are still more challenging than 8. 9 is certainly more challenging than 8 (or 7). 12 is quite a bit more challenging than 8. I think that 8 is perhaps the most insultingly easy in the goddamn series pre-13.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:27:36 2014 No.1993483 >>1993478 It's not hard, yes. But you breaking the junction system making it even easier doesn't help.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:29:25 2014 No.1993486 >>1993483 It breaks itself. Press the goddamn auto button and shit's borderline unlosable.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:40:07 2014 No.1993504

>>1993486
Endgame can be difficult if you don't junction well or abuse stuff like auras. The game can be at least a bit challenging if you don't try to break it with 100 stocked magics, but anyways FF8 is definitely about immersion as opposed to a tight playing game. You either enjoy what's happening in the game or you're going to hate it because so much depends upon you liking the events happening.
I like the game's story and events and scenery and all that, so the easy as piss gameplay for most areas of the game really don't affect me.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:40:34 2014 No.1993506

>>1993478
>5, 6 and, arguably, even 7 are still more challenging than 8. 9 is certainly more challenging than 8 (or 7). 12 is quite a bit more challenging than 8.
Sure, but they're still not hard enough to justify the level of customization they have. That's the point I'm making.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:41:56 2014 No.1993508

>>1993478

Sorry nothing is more insulting than 6, that game is beyond piss easy, even 8 has more moments than that piece of shit overrated game.

Besides playing 8 without junctions at all is nearly unbeatable, but you probably didn't play much of the game.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:46:36 2014 No.1993516 >>1993504 >FF8 is definitely about immersion Is that why it has 10+ minute long cutscenes at every corner?

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:48:27 2014 No.1993521

>>1993508
Stop being ridiculous, please. FF6 is more challenging than FF8, period.

>playing 8 without junctions
Playing FF7 without materia with stock weapons is also challenging. Reading kids' fiction with high enough comprehension and wpm while riding a tricycle in a thunderstorm isn't particularly easy, too. But that has nothing to do with FF8's actual difficulty.

>>1993506
That's a valid point, of course.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:55:06 2014 No.1993527 >>1993516 Immersion into the characters and world, I think he meant

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 15:57:52 2014 No.1993530

>>1993527
If it's a cinematic experience, then JRPG gameplay is what breaks immersion at every step. Now you're watching the story unfold, now there are random fucking encounters. Now you're trying to enjoy the worldbuilding, and now you're managing junctions on an ugly-ass grey fucking screen.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 17:02:26 2014 No.1993653 >>1993516 >>1993527 He is correct with what I meant. >>1993530 I don't really look at it that way, I just view it as part of their journey if that makes sense. I'm not trying to make you agree, it's just how I look at it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 17:25:00 2014 No.1993707 >>1993456 > in my country See, /you/ need reading comprehension because your country, strangely, isn't the world. That's what I said. Everything else >opinions >opinions >opinions >muh r moar valid because Sound less assblasted.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 17:27:19 2014 No.1993712 >>1993521 >FF6 is more challenging Can you tell the difference? Both are piss easy. What's stupid is that FF8 mechanic is broken, and that makes it easy, FF6 is just easy for the sake of being easy.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:05:22 2014 No.1993774
File: 1.75 MB, 1536x2048, IMG_1744.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1993456
>It was hated on release. Even the goddamn PlayStation Magazine in my country gave it a 8.5 "weird boring thing, low point in the series" on release.
In MY country FFVIII got 95 out of 100 and was said to be a worthy sequel to FFVII. By your logic that makes it good.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:07:46 2014 No.1993781
File: 206 KB, 1264x693, GreatestFF.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1993774
Also see pic to see how hated FFVIII was on release. However you are right about FFVIII's story being very simple (and stupid) which makes it even more ridiculous that many people STILL don't get it.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:15:35 2014 No.1993803

>>1993707
You really need to have been there. Squall being a hate-worthy emo fuckwit is not a /v/ maymay, it was what people thought of him on release. FF8 and FF9 had a comparatively lukewarm reception, and, while FF9s reputation went slightly up, FF8's plummeted even further witht he years, people being increasingly frustrated with how storytelling and gameplay were handled.

Do you seriously disagree that FF8 is one of the least loved games in the series? Do you disagree that its cast is the most hated? I'm asking, because, chances are, that's you don't, and we're ust arguin about my word choice, that seems to have offended you. Because you're one defensive fucking pussy. Regardless, the first paragraph of my post stands. Even if you look at Metacritic scores, FFVIII has the lowest score of all modern FFs the (5th gen and up). Only XIII was hated more than it.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:22:23 2014 No.1993815 File: 5 KB, 179x84, Final Fantasy Squall quote.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8? whatever.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:41:42 2014 No.1993852 The real question is why is Squall so hot??? Best looking male FF character IMO

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 18:54:36 2014 No.1993879

>>1993781
> ridiculous that many people STILL don't get it
Have you ever seen a person who didn't get FFVIII's story? You're confused. It went through some random motions - like a 14 year old's vampire novella, it copied mood-marking cliche without actually storytelling - acted like it was building up or having a plot resolution or a culmination, but none of that was actually happening. The whole thing was like it was put together by a machine. The only script worse than that that I've experienced was FFXIII's.

It's not a story, it's an approximation of what a story is. It goes on the most random tangents, introduced and drops outrageous plot points, introduces and drops character motivations and backstories however it pleases, and then pulls a random villain out of nowhere, gets you to kill it and does a jarringly out of place postmodern dance, after which is just rolls the damn credits and fuck it, we're out.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 19:05:27 2014 No.1993917 >>1993879 This is why I enjoyed FF8. I was on a lot of drugs when I played through it and it certainly felt like the developers were too.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 9 19:29:04 2014 No.1993968 >>1993852 He would probably look better without that dumb-looking jacket.

Anonymous Thu Oct 9 19:31:14 2014 No.1993979

>>1993917
The developers were overworked Japanese officepeople who got stuck writing sci-fantasy plots even though they were neither qualified for that work, nor wanted to learn. The thing was made in the hopes that the visuals and sound would drown out the almost perfect lack of coherent storytelling or gameplay.

Square-Enix is a direct successor to that paradigm.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 03:03:30 2014 No.1994776
File: 68 KB, 945x463, ffviiitimeline.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1993879
>Have you ever seen a person who didn't get FFVIII's story?
YES, for the past decade I have seen arguments like these over and over again on internets:
>flying school is retarded!
>the orphanage scene makes no sense and comes out of nowhere!
>Ultimecia comes out of nowhere and has no motives or background!
>the plot has no resolution or culmination!

If you were to read the info-corner (that no one ever reads) you'd know that Centrans used to use Gardens as transport in the past.
Orphanage scene makes sense within the game's concepts (protip: one of the game's main themes is Liberi Fatali [children of Fate]), it's point is to form a bond between characters to survive the time kompression later on and the GF amnesia is constantly foreshadowed up to the point where it comes up.
Ultimecia is simply a sorceress that managed to fight back against SeeD (a organisition formed to murder sorceresses) and tries to prevent her long foretold death of getting killed by legendary SeeD.
FFVIII's main plot is about keeping the timeloop in FFVIII's going and is about the fates of two characters, Squall's fate is to become the leader of SeeD and to defeat Ultimecia (he seals his fate by succeeding in this) and it is Ultimecia's fate to get unjustly persecuted for things she hasn't even done yet and to trying to overcome her fate ironically causing the exact thing she tried to prevent in the first place.

Yes, the plot is pants on head retarded (like in any other FF game) but it kinda makes sense within the concepts in the game's world.

>B-but I didn't get any of that thereforce it's there and everything you posted is fanfiction you came up to defend this shitty game!
It IS there and if you have played through FFVIII more than once you have no excuse for not knowing any of this. Try reading some of the dialogue next time you play FFVIII.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 04:44:45 2014 No.1994878

I remember my friend let me borrow FF8 way back in middle school. I think I only got up to somewhere on the second disc. From my memory of playing it back then, it left me with an impression of an otherwise forgettable story but with great atmosphere.

So recently I purchased it on Steam to attempt to actually finish it. Playing it now I feel like I appreciate the game more. I think Squall is a pretty cool dude. In his mind, he voices out his concerns and all that other stuff a normal person would say out loud. And when he opens his mouth, only an apathetic remark comes out, "whatever". I think this is a good example of an introvert character. But being reserved doesn't mean being timid, not Squall, he gets shit done. Which unfortunately can't be said for the rest of the gang.

I definitely became attached to Selphie as the story progressed though. I want to protect that cheerfulness. ;_; Probably one of those rare instances where a character actually mains their party and gets shit done without being hand-held by Squall.

Playing it so far, it really does feel like the weight of the world rests on Squall's shoulders. A lesser man would've cracked by now. I mean, just look at what happened when Balamb Garden was assaulted by Galbadian troops, fucking everybody was paralyzed and needed Squall to micromanage everything (even to go find a kid himself). I don't think there's something wrong with Squall, something's wrong with everybody else!

The more I play, the more ridiculous the story gets, but somehow I can't stop playing. If I were to describe the story in one word, that would be: episodic.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 05:50:42 2014 No.1994951

>>1994776
Dear NESfag, you're one retarded motherfucker, so I'll humor you and explain again what I've seen explained to you a million times already. Here goes:

Explanation =/= good writing. It has nothing to do with good writing. Just saying that the school flies because the ancients made it so doesn't make the concept any less idiotic; rather, it aggravates the silliness further.

You've said it all yourself. Read your post and see what people call "an idiotic plot." People aren't calling it stupid becaus ethey don't get it. It's precisely after "getting it" when people start to see how retarded FFVIII actually is. Read your own post and see how derivative yet brutally hamfisted the ridiculous plot points and their justification really are.

As for "Ultimecia's fate to get unjustly persecuted," that would have been interesting, but she's literally a mass-murderer. Maybe play the game before you talk about it or something.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:05:13 2014 No.1994967 >>1994951 What's retarded about having a large, comfy, cool looking airship? Are you autistic? Damn, you must be really fun at parties.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:05:57 2014 No.1994969

>>1992881
Probably because the Gardens are the only schools we ever see in FF8. For all we know they could be the only schools and only a select few become mercenaries to make money for the place. Since we played as some of the mercenaries that side was the only one we saw.

Or we just never saw any other kinds of schools because they weren't important. Who the fuck knows.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:10:24 2014 No.1994973 >>1993456 Is that 8.5 out of 10?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:11:16 2014 No.1994974 >>1994776 isnt the whole 'creating a time loop before the player characters kill me' thing the exact same plan Garland pulled off back in FF1?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:12:13 2014 No.1994975 >>1993506 I think the system they use was an experiment. One I would like to see them try again and actually make it worth using beyond pressing auto.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:18:13 2014 No.1994985 >>1993803 While I didn't like Squall he didn't seem emo to me, an ass sure. But all you have to do is wear dark colored clothes and people start calling you that buzzword.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:20:51 2014 No.1994992 >>1993968 I think that's a lady's jacket. Maybe it was something Eilon, or whatever her name was, left at the orphanage after she just left all of a sudden and Squall designed his look around it.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 06:25:37 2014 No.1995000

>>1994985
>Squall didn't seem emo to me
Moping like a dumb fuck is what he does throughout the script. He barely brightens up after he kills a couple of ancient sorceresses. That's as emo as it gets. He's a very typical teenager, and teenagers are inherently anoying. Even as a teenager myself, I saw him as an imbecile, instead of emphasizing with him as I was apparently supposed to.

Perhaps there are people who watch Squall and think "well, he's fine, I can emphasize with that." Perhaps those people are just as stupid and annoying. The rest of the players, as you know, thought that Squall was an insufferable little prick.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:40:13 2014 No.1995139 >>1982171 I love the first disc of ff8. The school setting, card battles, the music, but then it turns to shit after that.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:44:29 2014 No.1995142
File: 662 KB, 800x1689, TheTruth.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1994951
>implying I'm NESfag
Notice the lack of "FFVIII doesn't have a villain" and the fact I never said FFVIII's story or storytelling were good which both are things he always brings up.

>You've said it all yourself. Read your post and see what people call "an idiotic plot." People aren't calling it stupid becaus ethey don't get it. It's precisely after "getting it" when people start to see how retarded FFVIII actually is. Read your own post and see how derivative yet brutally hamfisted the ridiculous plot points and their justification really are.
Exactly, I made a fucking point to say FFVIII's story is pants on retarded just like the stories of all FF games are. That never kept me from enjoying them through. Seriously read my post again and tell me where I said FFVIII story or story telling were good?

Also have some truth so you can get even more butthurt over nothing.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:46:00 2014 No.1995146

>>1992881
Yeah it's pretty scary when you think about it. The awesome music glossed over it all though and made it seem magical. It's like when people say they want to go to school at Hogwarts. The school where students die to giant beasts, has giant taranchula monsters 100ft away, has serial killers roaming the corridors and dementors that make you feel like you're on the worst come-down ever. Sounds fun.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:51:20 2014 No.1995153 >>1995000 The ironic part is that you sound like such a whiny little bastard yourself from this post alone. All doom and gloom, you must have been a little emo yourself growing up.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:55:03 2014 No.1995158 >>1995153 >deduce his life from one anonymous post Maybe he's having one bad morning. You're always happy are you?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 08:57:50 2014 No.1995160 >>1995158 No, but I don't claim to be either. I also don't claim that Squall is an emo just because he isn't the Tidus/Zidane happy go lucky all the time type. Which is why his post was ironic. I used his logic on his post, and that makes him an emo.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 09:00:08 2014 No.1995162 >>1995153 I was among the people roughing emos up, actually, but thanks for the concern.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 09:02:13 2014 No.1995164 >>1995162 Does that make you Seifer then? Follow your romantic dream bro!

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 09:07:16 2014 No.1995165 >>1995164 Shut up chicken wuss.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 09:14:17 2014 No.1995175

I never really saw Squall as emo, but he's the only FF main character that actually seems normal with somewhat human reactions to all the random things that go on in the FF worlds.
I think that's one of the reasons why people either love or hate him. For some he becomes a too big contrast to every other crazy character/thing that happens, but for others they can relate and therefore like him.
As cliche as it sounds, the people who write him off as an emo have probably misunderstood the whole character, or they simply don't care for that archetype. I'm that way with Zidane, I love FFIX but don't care for Zidane at all.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 09:16:24 2014 No.1995178 File: 481 KB, 751x563, FFVIII_Zell_Recording.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1995165 WHAT DID YOU SAY???

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 13:59:46 2014 No.1995572 >>1995178 chicken wuss! chicken wuss! chicken wuss!

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 14:57:20 2014 No.1995706 >>1995572 >>1995165 >Chicken wuss I really hope that was something harsher in the Japanese script because we where saying meaner shit in the 3rd grade

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 15:26:06 2014 No.1995762 >>1982216 >But these pretty future kids with free room and board had very little to be frowning about. >>1982223 >For as angsty and antisocial a cunt Squall is you'd think he'd have some huge dramatic back story or huge problem beyond Welcome to /r9k/

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 16:18:07 2014 No.1995875 >>1982223 >you'd think he'd have some huge dramatic back story Did you even play the game?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:06:38 2014 No.1996018 >>1992903 This just in: Nips have shit taste. More at 11.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:12:52 2014 No.1996027 >>1995875 >Did you even play the game? yeah boo hoo "I was an orphan who was surrounded by people who love me and never wanted for anything" isn't a hug revelation especially when he's the only one in the group who became such a whiny cunt

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:14:19 2014 No.1996029 File: 11 KB, 285x212, 1353087327011.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I just hated how forced the romance was. Rinoa was an annoying twat, and Squall even agreed with this sentiment until OH NOES SHE'S ACTUALLY GONE AND NOW I NEED HER.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:14:38 2014 No.1996030 >>1995706 It was no doubt Chicken Shit. Obviously censoring, which is weird because FF7 had lots of swears, although it must've been done by multiple people considering Cid says shit constantly and othertimes its just garbage.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:16:05 2014 No.1996032 The characters kind of sucked and the battle system was fundamentally broken.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 18:25:28 2014 No.1996043 >>1996030 Michael Baskett did the entire localization of FFVII by himself.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 19:14:25 2014 No.1996108 >>1996029 I don't know, I didn't find Rinoa annoying or the romance forced. Guess it's just not the game for you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 19:48:34 2014 No.1996159 >>1996108 or you're just poorly read

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 19:54:49 2014 No.1996169 >>1996159 Sure if that makes you feel better. A lot of people agree with me though and FFVIII has a lot of fans, but then again not everyone can be well read little special snowflakes like you I suppose.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 19:58:31 2014 No.1996180 >>1996169 >A lot of people agree with me though A lot of people tough the world was flat too.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 19:59:11 2014 No.1996182 >>1996169 A lot of people like Twilight too. That doesn't mean it's a good book.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:01:46 2014 No.1996186 >>1996182 No but it doesn't mean people can't enjoy it and like it, just because you don't.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:03:15 2014 No.1996189 >>1996180 Not really. A lot of people think a lot of people thought the world was flat though. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_Flat_Earth

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:07:06 2014 No.1996195 >>1996189 Using wikipedia as a source hahahahaha

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:11:16 2014 No.1996198 >>1996186 >No but it doesn't mean people can't enjoy it and like it, Enjoyable doesn't equal good.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:15:21 2014 No.1996203

>>1996198
Dependes on what you put in the word good really.

A game made with the aim to sell as much as possible and gain a lot of fan is concidered good if they can reach those goals. If the goals were to write a masterpiece of a story with amazing twists and no plot holes to impress the minority that actually cares about that sort of thing, then no FFVIII is not a good game. However, that was never the goal for any FF game, or something a lot of the playerbase care about. I mean FFVIII was aimed at what, 12+ kids?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:20:08 2014 No.1996214 >>1996203 >However, that was never the goal for any FF game, granted but very few of them where so pants on head retarded as 8 was. 8 was someone wanted to tell a story more complex than he could handle and it got completely out of his contrl

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:20:50 2014 No.1996215 >>1996198 This >>1996203 before you can start discussing wether something is good or not you have to decide on what premisses. This is basic analyzing stuff 123 ABC.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:24:18 2014 No.1996219

>>1996215
>before you can start discussing wether something is good or not you have to decide on what premisses

on the premises of having a story that's not a sloppily written, plot hole ridden pile of bunk with characters who have the collective depth of a puddle

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:36:43 2014 No.1996228

>>1996219
Well you also gotta compare it to something to back up that statement though.
Compared to other FFs? No the story isn't much worse in my opinion. I think it is better than FFVIIs on many points. Characters I kinda agree with you on, most of them aren't very fleshed out, but that can be a plus to some people. Gives it more room to fill out the blank spots themselves. Some people like to be told every little detail and others don't. So this is a bit of a subjective point I think. I wish there were more backstory for the some of the characters though.
Plotholes? Sure, but not anymore than you can find in any FF game.

Compare it to, say Wheel of Time(last thing I read). Yes the story is very simple and not as great. Characters? Yup so shallow you wont even get wet on your toenails. Plotholes? Yes very bad compared to WoT.
But WoT is like 14 huge books to develope characters and lore, it's unfear to compare the two. They're not even the same medium.

So if you're gonna say FF8 sucks! It's badly written, bad characters etc etc, then you gotta back it up a bit more and compare it to something that's relative and explain why you think it sucks or it sounds like it's just your personal taste.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:42:23 2014 No.1996238

>>1996228
>Well you also gotta compare it to something to back up that statement though.

No you don't. You should base works and stories on their own merits and weaknesses.

playing the comparison game is basically moving the goalposts and is completely idiotic.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:49:59 2014 No.1996245 >>1996029 You've never felt that way towards someone before? I've done that at least five times.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:52:25 2014 No.1996248 >>1996245 you should probably not date psychos

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 20:55:05 2014 No.1996254 >>1996238 You can do that but then it will be mainly personal opinipns. And nothing wrong with that, but it's not going to be an objective view if all you are judging it on are your own standards.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 21:00:50 2014 No.1996265 >>1996248 Man, you seem really condescending.

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 21:26:39 2014 No.1996296

>>1996254
>And nothing wrong with that, but it's not going to be an objective view if all you are judging it on are your own standards.

it's not standards it's an issue of noting and pinpointing obvious unquestionable flaws.

For instance it's an objective fact that leaving Rinoa to dangle over a cliff just so they can have squall go save her is retarded when they could probably find a rope or I don't know a whip faster

the game is full of dumb shit like that

Anonymous Fri Oct 10 21:48:01 2014 No.1996316

>>1996027
I'm asking because the loss of his "sis" is the reason he became a "gotta do everything by myself, can't rely on others" introvert and he developed a personal philosophy around that, (evident by his monologues).

plenty of reason if you ask me.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 10 22:32:32 2014 No.1996371 >>1996316 >I'm asking because the loss of his "sis" you mean the sister he doesn't remember ever having? and you're missing the bigger issue. There's a fine line between antisocial and emotional shut in asshole.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 00:40:03 2014 No.1996547 >>1996371 >He is an ashole Yes, and?. Byn the end of the game he is a better person (not by much though) A little character development us better than a perfect mister nice guy as the main character.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 02:15:47 2014 No.1996659
File: 183 KB, 812x1000, [animepaper.net]picture-standard-video-games-grandia-ryudo-42563-eternalfayth-preview-a13f74cc.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996547
>A little character development us better than a perfect mister nice guy as the main character.

sadly that character development was absent and instead what we got

>I AM A JERK
>HERE IS MY VAGINA
>I AM LESS OF A JERK

He's growth was at best artificial and at worst he was replaced by a wholly separate character

lets take one of those comparisons that people love so bloody much

This is Ryuudo. He's a cunt. A amusing funny cunt but a cunt all the same. As the game progresses people call him on shit, he begrudgingly lets his good side show now and again as the adventure goes on his past is explored and his issues (and they are actual issues) are faced and overcome as he forms bonds through shared experiences with people he comes to respect, rely on and in some cases love.

It's an actual characters journey. The problem with Squall isn't that he's not nice , it's that he's not interesting.

He's a boring twat who's all to happy to stand in a corner thinking how shit everyone but him sucks when the people around him all have nothing but nice things to say to or about him. It's simply disingenuous.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 02:21:12 2014 No.1996663
File: 32 KB, 320x224, 1257880540362.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8?
The romance subplot between Squall and Rinoa, it simply isn't good and feels like an after-through that they put in and then tried to make more important than it actully is. Now I kinda like the idea that their romance is continuation of one between Julia and Laguna that they couldn't have but please consider the following:

FFVIII's theme and main plot point is not love but fate and more specifically not being able to go against yours:
It's Laguna's fate to defeat Adel and to become president of Esthar.
It's Squall's fate to become the leader of SeeD and to defeat Ultimecia.
It's Zell's, Quistis', Selphie's and Irvine's fate as the children of fate to defeat Ultimecia with Squall and to become the "legendary SeeDs".
It's Ultimecia's fate to get unjustly persecuted for things she hasn't even done yet, to try to overcome her fate with the time compression and ironically causing the exact thing she tried to pretend.
Everyone's fate leads up to keeping the timeloop in game's world going and its important to note no one really wanted their respective fates which is best presented by Squall not being exactly enthusiastic about people forcing the position of leadership of SeeDs to him.

Now what does Rinoa and the "romance" with her has to do with any of this? Absolutely nothing apart from Rinoa being one of the sorceresses whose powers eventually pass on to Ultimecia and that role could have easily been filled by any other female character in the game with or without romance subplot with her.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 02:22:15 2014 No.1996665
File: 22 KB, 425x292, nobuo-uematsu.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996663
I can see the discussion about needing to add the romance sub-plot to FFVIII going like this:

>We have just finished the storyline for FFVIII, it's about not being able to go against your fate and time travel.

>Hmm... I don't think people can relate to that.
>WAIT
>NO
>OK
>I GOT THIS
>LETS PUT A ROMANCE SUBPLOT ON TOP OF IT!
>THEN LETS ADVERTISE THE GAME AS A LOVE STORY!
>NOMURA CAN YOU QUICKLY COME UP WITH A LOVE INTEREST FOR SQUALL?

>Well, I have this sketch of this girl I find cute. (BTW: Rinoa actually IS Nomura's vision of cute)

>PERFECT LET'S USE THAT!

>But sir we already have majority of the game done and we don't have enough time to modify it to include this romance subplot of yours!

>DO IT ANYWAY FAGGOT!

Seriously, think about all the scenes featuring Rinoa especially the ones you need to save her. I can't be the only one who thinks the game goes full-retard during them? Or that FFVIII could be improved a lot by having anyone but Rinoa as the forced love interest or simply by removing the whole romance sub-plot from it all-together? Rinoa really serves no purpose apart from being an eventual love interest for Squall or that the scenes that have focus on rescuing her really feel out of place?

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 02:23:19 2014 No.1996669
File: 32 KB, 636x424, 1291386262432.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996665
Here is an example of a scene about rescuing Rinoa going full-retard and feeling out of place during the battle of Gardens:

>Rinoa is a dump bitch and falls of the side of the Garden
>Hey Quistis, lets go bug Squall about this, it's not like we have anything resembling a rope on us do we?
>Good idea Zell, let's do that instead of trying to help her ourselves!
>Hey Squall, Rinoa is a dump bitch and fell on the side of garden! Go save her!
>Fuck you guys, I'm busy right now!
>10 minutes later
>But Squall, she'll die!
>Whatever, I don't give a fuck.
>But Squall, she is really going to die!
>Oh my god Zell, I'll go if you just STFU
>15 minutes later
>Squall! For fucks sake go save her!
>I don't wanna and I have a battle against Galbadians to lead here!
>Squall, she is going to die!!!
>Fine, I'll abandon all my duties and go if you guys STFU for real this time.
>Squall goes to save Rinoa by running in the OPPOSITE direction from her
>meanwhile Rinoa is still somehow holding herself at side of the garden with just two fingers despite the Gardens constantly ramming into each other at full speed
>elsewhere Squall gets hit by a giant flying platform
>slow paced fist fight ensues
>the opponent eventually falls off
>steal the device by leaning forward
>Rinoa, jump on this conveniently placed rid cord with a foot hole!
>Yay!!! I knew you'd save me Squall!
>Land in middle of battlefield as Balamb students use swords against niggahs with guns
>"I think we're winning, Squall. HURRRRRR!"
>"Yeah, looks that way... DURRRRRRRRRR"

This certainly feels like a part that is full retard just because they needed to add bullshit featuring Rinoa that originally wasn't there here.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 02:28:52 2014 No.1996676
File: 28 KB, 146x327, Xu.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996663
>Squall not being exactly enthusiastic about people forcing the position of leadership of SeeDs to him.

there's also the issue if there being any number of people more qualified to lead than he is.

I can only imagine there's some Garden students who have studied advanced strategy and war, students who literally shit pages out of the Art of War who just tossed their arms up in frustration.

Was Squall even a notably gifted student? I know he made SeeD but so didn't Zell and Selphie and the way Quistis talks early on made him seem like he wasn't really taking this shit seriously

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:01:53 2014 No.1996706 >>1996676 >A notably gifted student He was... A GUNBLADE USER as the late Robin Williams says at your graduation ceremony. I assume theres something special about the gunblade, in that its not just a sword and a gun put together.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:02:47 2014 No.1996707 >>1996706 Im not asking if he's a decent fighter though. His choice of weapon shouldn't make and difference in his ability to command

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:08:25 2014 No.1996710 >>1996706 >>1996707 But the prophecies foretold! The one who will lead will have a sword and a gun, PUT TOGETHER.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:11:13 2014 No.1996712 File: 32 KB, 602x390, knife gun.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1996710

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:13:04 2014 No.1996713 File: 85 KB, 896x315, GunThatShootsSwords.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1996712

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:18:00 2014 No.1996718 File: 58 KB, 898x498, 1263524153402.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1996712 >>1996713

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:21:38 2014 No.1996720
File: 67 KB, 320x240, edea1.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996676

Didn't you even finish the game? The entire plot is a time loop. Edea sees Squall came from the future and that he's part of a group that kills sorceresses (and is apparently pretty darn good because he dumps one right in her orphanage). Cid starts up the Garden using money from NORG and trains up Squall & co. for their inevitable destiny.

>>1996663

Maybe it's because the whole romance idea was poorly done, but I always assumed that Sorceresses had an insanely strong power of suggestion. Just look at what every sorceress in the game gets away with. Edea in Galbadia goes on a crazy rant / speech in front of cheering crowds, because they can't get enough of her. Murders the Galbadian president in front of thousands and goes on her merry way. Even Rinoa is helpless, she literally has no control of anything, not even a self-preservation instinct kicks in.

This even affects the main characters, the ones who are canon the strongest in the game. Seifer turns from an apathetic asshole to an obsessive sociopath when he meets Edea. Even Squall cracks eventually, goes a completely out-of-character turn and tries to take Rinoa all the way to Esthar by foot. He even asks himself what the heck he's doing on the way there, because I don't think he's acting completely with his free will by this point. Like Seifer, he's started to become obsessed with protecting the sorceress with his life.

The implication through the game is that sorceresses destroyed nations and ruined lives for decades, maybe even centuries. You don't do that unless you have a tight hold on the people. Just my interpretation anyway.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:25:47 2014 No.1996721

>>1996720
>Didn't you even finish the game? The entire plot is a time loop. Edea sees Squall came from the future and that he's part of a group that kills sorceresses (and is apparently pretty darn good because he dumps one right in her orphanage). Cid starts up the Garden using money from NORG and trains up Squall & co. for their inevitable destiny.

kay that still doesn't really explain Squall's lack of leadership credentials, is my point.

Liike he's probably a serviceable field leader when he's dealing with the 7 or so people in the team but leader of the whole Garden? That's a bit much a bit fast.

Like I can see him working his way up and by the time he's an older man, like Cid's age he;s the new Cid.

but there are people far better suited to lead garden in the here and now..or then and there..who and when? fucking time travel.

they just do this shit where they say "it's your destiny lad" and that's the end of it.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:26:35 2014 No.1996724 >>1996676 This is a good point but the reason for Squall becoming the leader of Garden has already been said many times in this thread: it was his fate that Cid was probably aware of.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:31:55 2014 No.1996728

>>1996724

and it was just stupid is all Im saying. Either Cid knew the whole time about this shit and didn't groom Squall like he should have or he found out after the fact and gave the job to someone who wasn't really qualified.

Can you imagine Squall at a desk doing all the paper work this mess is gonna entail? I can't.

Hell Squall never even has to make any hard decisions

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:36:00 2014 No.1996731
File: 2.73 MB, 1024x576, Seifer 3.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996721

He was trained from birth to be a leader. Cid & Edea weren't just planning on letting him use a weapon and go out as a common grunt, probably everything they did was to groom him as leadership potential. Cid had a personal reason for doing it as well, because failing in setting up Garden means failing to save his own wife. When all he had to go on is 'Squall is going to somehow kill the sorceress', then he did a pretty good job. The guy was just running an orphanage beforehand, you can't expect too much.

Also, to add on to >>1996720, even Fujin & Raijin could sense Seifer was being affected somehow. They even left him to Squall because there was nothing they could to help him.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 03:40:18 2014 No.1996734

>>1996731
>He was trained from birth to be a leader

the only training we saw was him in a fire cave and then commanding two jerks when Seifer fucked off to be an asshole

not exactly Zhuge Liang

>They even left him to Squall because there was nothing they could to help him.

they could have been party members. They where cooler than most of the ones we got. Why can't we have nice things

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 04:04:46 2014 No.1996750 I loved it. I'm not going to try to argue any of the points anybody made about why it's terrible, but even with all its flaws it's still my favorite of the series, as well as the soundtrack. playing it as we speak

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 04:09:37 2014 No.1996756 >>1996750 and I can respect that

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 05:29:12 2014 No.1996823

>>1996750
I'm one of the people providing heavy argumentation against the game, and I also love FFVIII and am nostalgic for its music, world and even parts of its story.

Understanding the game's gross, gross faults and finding positive aspects in it are not mutually exclusive. The game is a mess, but the trains were lovable, the cars were immersive, visuals and music were stunning, and the first disc wasn't even that terrible, story-wise.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 06:10:40 2014 No.1996857 >>1996720 >Cid starts up the Garden using money from NORG and trains up Squall & co. for their inevitable destiny. That the garden exists solely for that makes the backstory even more ridiculous.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 06:13:48 2014 No.1996860

>>1996721
>they just do this shit where they say "it's your destiny lad" and that's the end of it.
They do all sorts of shit, which is why FF8's story criticised so extensively. "It's your amnesia, lad." "It's your time travel, lad." "It's your out-of-nowhere ancient civilization, lad." "It's your father, lad." ]"It's your level scaling, lad."

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 06:15:14 2014 No.1996863 Where is the starting point of the loop?

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 07:01:04 2014 No.1996914

>>1996857

Why? The universe history shown that sorceresses was worse than 10 Hitlers, and there were quite a few of them at one point. Cid's wife took on the sorceress powers to protect the children, which meant that she was now a target, and just dangerous in general. Ultimecia ends up possessing her at some point afterwards which meant that Cid really had to make sure Garden was going to work.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 07:34:51 2014 No.1996937
File: 69 KB, 640x480, Don't leave any hot dogs for the enemy.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1996728
>Hell Squall never even has to make any hard decisions

He decides to ignore Rinoa during the battle of Gardens and goes to lead the fight against Galbadia instead. Assuming he actually gives a fuck about Rinoa at this point which is debatable this is a hard and correct decicion because if he had chocen otherwise Balamb would have lost against Galbadia (due to no one leading them) meaning everyone including Rinoa would have been killed. Needs of many outweighting needs of one is something found in mindset of a great leader.

On disc 3 Squall lets the Estharian take Rinoa away in order to seal her up. Again this is the correct desicion because if Rinoa were sealed away for good she wouldn't be able to pass on her sorceress powers to anyone meaning there wouldn't be a Ultimecia that becomes a threat to whole time/space continuum in the future. Again assuming Squall actually loves Rinoa this is a hard decicion showing leadership skills. Sacrificing your own happiness in sake of everyone else is something found in mindset of a great leader.

However both of these correct decicions are ruined by the game's shit tier "romance" and everyone literally telling Squall how much he loves Rinoa until he finally goes to save her just to shut everyone up.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 10:50:17 2014 No.1997203 >>1983590 Don't you mean Zeromus?

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 13:21:40 2014 No.1997409 Started it recently, and I actually really enjoyed it during Disc 1. But somewhere during the first half of Disc 2 I lost all interest and it got hard to start it up. Can't put my finger on just what made me lose interest.

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 13:25:49 2014 No.1997418

SOMETHING went wrong. I don't know what, but something.

It's breakable from the very beginning. Fuck what everyone here is saying about cards and shit; just buy some Tents and refine them into 100 curagas as soon as you get to the item shop. Junction them to your HP. BAM, you're unkillable until the last disc basically with ~7000 HP.

And the story is only good until halfway through when things get to weird and colorful hard sci-fi for some reason

And the characters are fucking balls, barely characters at all. My dick has more depth than selphie

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 13:32:13 2014 No.1997429 Hmmm I didn't know there was something wrong with it. It's the FF game I enjoy the most to be honest. It's not perfect, but come on, no FF game is. They are all weird.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 13:38:46 2014 No.1997442 >>1997409 The sewers?

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 13:49:29 2014 No.1997461

>>1997442
The prison was really tedious, and then it got interesting with the Garden being under siege, but once I got to Fisherman's Haven I lost all interest. I'm going to keep working at it, and hopefully it'll catch my interest again. I'd hate to drop it after making it this far.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 14:01:41 2014 No.1997487 >>1982171 plot is a clusterfuck of stupid. i liked how you weren't forced to grind for xp to beat the game.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 14:39:32 2014 No.1997551 >>1982246 I'll agree with you on Chrono Cross, Anon. I replayed it again this past year and holy fuck was the writing bad. Still love that game, but I can admit that it's mostly nostalgia.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:02:38 2014 No.1997585 >>1997429 >Hmmm I didn't know there was something wrong with it >I did not read the thread we're a bit late in the discussion to say stupid shit like that

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:28:52 2014 No.1997654 >>1997585 I don't think so, no.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:33:33 2014 No.1997669 >>1996863 When Ultimecia goes back in time and Edea takes her powers.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:39:48 2014 No.1997680 >>1996756 >>1996823 >true /vr/ bros, they don't like the game but they'll defend your right to like it to death

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:41:09 2014 No.1997686 >>1997461 You should continu, yeah. Right after FH is the Gardens War.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:41:31 2014 No.1997687 >>1997418 >My dick has more depth than selphie That's not saying much, anon.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:41:43 2014 No.1997689 >>1997487 In a genre where grinding for xp is the centerpoint of gameplay, getting rid of grinding doesn't make it a better game, it makes it a non-game outright.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 15:43:23 2014 No.1997698 >>1997654 He's right, though. Jumping into a 300+ post thread and stating a non-opinion like that is silly.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 19:23:37 2014 No.1998240 >>1996663 When does that scene occur....? I don't remember that particular dialogue.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 20:41:55 2014 No.1998389 File: 60 KB, 500x500, 9e0d0_ORIG-1319417568397.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>1998240 It's shopped

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 21:51:50 2014 No.1998517

>>1996659
Can you blame him for that when everyone around him as the mental age of a 5 year old?

His party chouses the worst momenta to do some obnoxios shit like start figthin or flirting whith each other. Whiout him Selphie migth chase a butterfy of a cliff, Irvine wold be charged for sexual harrasment and zell idk he migth punch a cop while Rinoa is kidnaped by bowser.

Ans is not just his party. The entire garden is a tragedy waiting to happen. Like when you have to tell theadmaster that the garden is about to get nuked but you cant found him because he is in the enfermery because he as.diarea or something while his students are beating the crap out if each other. I gues you cant trust a guy that comands a military academy while wearing a sweater best. I mean you catch the guy cryng twise for gods sake. How does someone like that gets someone like Edea is beyoud my imagination.

Then you get to meet the garden master but it turns out he is some kind mutant monster and he flips his shit and wants to kill you. From that point Squall us made the leader for reasons that are unknow to him, and even though he bitchs about he does it anyway. Judging by looks he probably just wants to go home a listeng to his linkin park CD (is 1999 CDs are still around.

Then he goes to do leader stuff when they are like. "You should drop everyting to go save Rinoa it has to be you because we none of us something long like a WHIP to pull her up, besides is not like we are in the middle of a war.or someting"

If I was in Squall shoes I would sink the garden in the middle of the ocean. It would end my misery and it would save the world from the horrible the people that keep following me around mimicking everything I do.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 11 22:23:02 2014 No.1998581 >>1998517 >Can you blame him for that when everyone around him as the mental age of a 5 year old? I cam when he has the mental age of a three year old

Anonymous Sat Oct 11 23:59:51 2014 No.1998779

I know it's strange but I really don't care about the story in a videogame (in almost anything actually...) Besides gameplay, it's all about the atmosphere and the characters.

I think FF8 has a godlike atmosphere, my favorite OST by far and the settings are great.

For the characters, I don't know. I think it's nostalgia, but I always liked Irvine for his " I'm saying I'm a tough guy but in fact I'm weak " thing and I always liked is design (I must be a closeted fag...). Rinoa is quite boring but the others are fine I think.

Seifer and the Laguna trio are great though.

So in the end it's still my favorite FF, I really don't care about plot holes, the atmosphere is so good.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 12 00:26:59 2014 No.1998835 >2014 >still no Laguna/Kiros/Ward prequel Oh well, they'd probably fuck it up anyway.

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 12 00:47:18 2014 No.1998886 >>1998835 >probably You miss spelled "definitely"

Anonymous Sun Oct 12 13:01:37 2014 No.1999723

>>1982171
> Battles take too damn long (only 1-upped by FF9)
> Characters are cookie-cutter emo teenagers who only differ in limit breaks.
> Characters are uninteresting
> Story is bad
> Have to grind endlessly to obtain rare items to synthesize weapons
> Have to grind endlessly to draw spells to raise attributes, or play that stupid fucking card game
> Have to sit through lengthy GF animations 9 billion times.

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 03:00:56 2014 No.2001397

The thing that stood out for me is the relationship between Ultimecia and Griever, and Rinoa and Squall. Basically, the Sorceress and her Knight. I mean, how coincidental is it that Ultimecia (whom Squall has presumably never met before) has a GF with the same name as Squall's lion?

I don't think I would go as far as to say Rinoa = Ultimecia, but there is certainly some connection here.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 03:24:29 2014 No.2001426 File: 363 KB, 946x895, Griever.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2001397 >Griever to anyone who ever says Squall isn't Emo I present this evidence. He has an imaginary black lion named GRIEVEr and wears jewelry

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 05:00:23 2014 No.2001527

>>2001397
>how coincidental is it that Ultimecia (whom Squall has presumably never met before) has a GF with the same name as Squall's lion?
Ultimecia draws griever out of Squall mind, Griever is to Squall what Sonichu is to Chris-chan his vision of perfect being.

Also Ultimecia is Rinoa's foil just like Seifer is Squall's thats all there is to it.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 06:00:56 2014 No.2001571 http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/197343-final-fantasy-viii/faqs/34215 This is quite a read. I think I spent too much time on it, but it's good stuff.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 08:52:49 2014 No.2001714 >>1997689 oh there was grinding all right, but not necessarily for exp. in this game there was no forcing you to have a high character levels, because you could always work it around with junctions. That was actually pretty cool

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 08:54:38 2014 No.2001715 >>1999723 well, at least that game has a point (items/magic synthesis) - unlike ff9 where it's shoved down your throat at one point and is just a waste of time.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 11:54:36 2014 No.2001943 >>2001527 >Ultimecia draws griever out of Squall mind, if she could do that by herself she wouldn't need Ellone

>>	NESfag Mon Oct 13 12:02:27 2014 No.2001965 >>2001943 Except that the moment when Ultimecia draws Griever out is during time krompression, AFTER she used Ellone's power. All of Disk4 happens during time krompression.

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 12:12:48 2014 No.2001986

>>2001943
I don't see how how Ultimecia being able to go inside mind of someone near her and materializing GFs based of their throughs necassites her needing Ellone's power to possess sorceresses further in the past than JME allows her to. Please explain?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 12:27:27 2014 No.2002014 >>2001986 >Please explain? She's not telepathic you goon

>>	NESfag Mon Oct 13 12:28:36 2014 No.2002017 >>2001986 >>2002014 It doesn't even matter because she HAS Ellone's power at this point.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 12:36:33 2014 No.2002038 File: 41 KB, 694x468, emo_git.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2001426

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 13:08:52 2014 No.2002090
File: 24 KB, 357x327, Ellone_2.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Ellone and her powers seem to be a genuinely problem with FFVIII's plot: First of all where the fuck does her powers come from? Seriously this is NEVER explained anywhere.

Obviously the simplest answer would be to just say that Ellone is a sorceress and her powers work and passes on in similar fashion but this would also bring a problems due to them passing on to future generations meaning Ultimecia would already have them(assuming she is the last/only sorceress in the "distant future") or simply could go after someone else having them in her time (assuming they passed on to someone else). In short there would be no need for her to search for Ellone in Squall's time meaning she could simply skip that and perform the time kompression from get go.

>>	NESfag Mon Oct 13 14:55:13 2014 No.2002253 >>2002090 Magic.

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 15:19:37 2014 No.2002290

>>2002090
if you pay attention to the background stuff all powers in FF8's world come from junction, junction with GF for the SeeDs and junction with Hyne for the sorceresses. So obviously Ellone's power is some form of junction even though we don't know what exactly she junctioned with (or rather, going by how she says it works, *she* is the one being junctioned with).

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 17:55:17 2014 No.2002629 >>2002090 Im willing to bet that's less a hiccup to the Japanese. They seem to be more willing to buy into the whole "Esper" thing. Everyone else pretty muck would like to know why she's an X-man though

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 18:05:38 2014 No.2002653 Anyone find it weird that no one has a problem with the multiple schools that train child soldiers?

Anonymous Mon Oct 13 18:11:13 2014 No.2002673

>>1982174
>You can also get a Lionheart on disc 1.
This is a bit of a challenge in itself, though. I wouldn't look at a fun thing to try on replay as a negative. I looked over all the steps one time and was like, fuuuuck that. Has anyone here actually done it?

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 18:11:42 2014 No.2002674 >>2002653 Garden is basically a Military Academy. Its not like those don't exist. And theres also the fact that there are incredibly powerful sorceresses around so if they went rogue it'd be very bad if you didn't have some kind of fail safe.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 18:21:31 2014 No.2002690 >>2002290 >if you pay attention to the background stuff >background stuff yeah see that's the problem. Stuff that should be bigger deals is left into the background.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 13 22:37:03 2014 No.2003251 >>2002690 Take that problem even further and you got FF13 which made you read an entire encyclopedia if you wanted to make sense of the world you were presented.

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 06:19:11 2014 No.2003939

>>2002090
She has powers. She just has them. There's no need to explain it, she just has them. Accept it.

Her power is a form of Junctioning. Think of it as Auto-Junction. It's stated in-game that she's not a sorceress, she just has this special ability.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 06:35:26 2014 No.2003950 >>2002653 Child soldier usually means pre-puberty.

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 06:38:53 2014 No.2003954

>>2003950
Yeah but they star their training at garden pretty early eventhough I guess they are around 17 when they graduate.

I don't really have a problem with it, it's a FF game after all and to enjoy a FF game you have to accept a few things as you go.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 07:06:23 2014 No.2003981 Was it ever explained what happens to a sorceress if they die without passing on their powers? Do they become like those sorceresses you fight in that boss rush at the start of time compression?

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 07:17:56 2014 No.2003997 >>2003981 I always imagined they became these useless undead things, just wanting to die but not being able to do much. I don't know if it says anywhere in game or if that's just something I've made up. I've probably made it up:p

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 07:48:23 2014 No.2004020

>>2003981
When a sorceress is killed she is forced to pass on her powers to nearest potential sorceress, this is demonstrated in ending scene where Ultimecia ends up passing her powers to Edea even if she clearly want to keep them still try to fight against Squall. In other words they can't die without passing on their powers and they have no control over passing on their powers.

As for the time kompression sorceresses I like to think they are meant to represent the sorceresses between Rinoa and Ultimecia which makes sense if you think about the fact you are travelling from "present" to "distant future many generations in future" during it.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 07:55:18 2014 No.2004026 >>2004020 Now why do those sorceresses look the way they do? One was like a Maggot Naga.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 08:00:00 2014 No.2004030 Might as well ask this here. How's the steam version of FFVIII? I've beaten the PS1 version a few times so I know what I'd be getting into. I want it mainly for nostalgia reasons.

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 16:21:21 2014 No.2004803

>>2003954
18 is an arbitrary age to call someone "adult" so to me the difference between 17 and 18 is not important. I can believe that in the FF8 world, 17 is culturally an adult age.

>>2004030
well the story is all the same, so I guess you want to know about the technical aspects. first of all the music is not PSX quality. you will need to download that mod on your own, called Roses and Wine. Pretty straightforward (though I downloaded the latest dll file posted on that thread, not the one linked to on the first post). FMVs are another possible problem because they made them all blurry. Which is a problem to me because the background artwork is not blurry as well to they clash.

I love the high speed feature though, lets me go through GF animations quickly. There's also easy access to cheat mode "Assist" that you can turn on and off at any time if you feel like you need it.

There's probably some other stuff but these are the things that stood out to me.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 16:46:18 2014 No.2004828 What was right with FF8? The music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r8QfqMjv2q4

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 16:48:54 2014 No.2004832 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k35WLRopPL0

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 18:17:12 2014 No.2004996 >>2004832 that is pretty cool!

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 20:00:47 2014 No.2005162 >>2004803 Is there a mod to fix the blurry FMVs then?

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 20:39:16 2014 No.2005223 >>2005162 I saw one in the Steam community, I didn't download it because it honestly didn't really bother me that much.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 20:40:49 2014 No.2005228 I remember playing FF8 as a kid and attempting to do a run with no GF because I thought somehow that would make the characters not loose their memory. I thought it was part of the game mechanics and something cool would happen!

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 21:25:58 2014 No.2005310 >>1983534 If someone was a moron wouldn't they be thinking a game notoriously easy to break is really hard?

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 21:31:18 2014 No.2005330
File: 730 KB, 1000x1000, Ff8_amano11.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Why does ff8 incite so much controversy and arguments between /v/? From a gameplay standpoint, the game is basically solid. Once you figure out all the little tricks, the system is actually pretty interesting and rewardng. Get Card Mod early on and learning which magics junction best to which skills is actually pretty cool.

When people can't find anything functionally wrong with the game, they like to argue about the storyline, how there are asspulls, the relationships between characters seem forced, and it doesn't make any sense.

People need to look at ff8 in a different way. While there are undertones and sublplots that probably were lost in translation(i think the ultemecia rinoa connection would have been a cool storyline), the overall theme of the game is that is a coming of age story; in its simplest terms, each character represents some aspect of human nature or behavior. Squall is duty bound, dilligent. Zell is passionate. Seifer is romanticism, Rinoa is love, not just romantically but her family as well. Laguna is heroism. These and the other characters are meant to intentionally be foils to squall, but also meant to show the player that to grow up and be well rounded, you need some of each trait. Ultimately while squall sees his friends as losers/idiotic at first, he realizes this and takes something from each of them and this defines his character development into an adult, leader over the course of the game.

This made sense to me most recently is I played through it, but if you think about it like that, it doesnt seem so convoluted or stupid to me. FF8 is like literally going through highschool/college and learning about your true self, which is part of the reason they use the school days motif.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 14 22:34:54 2014 No.2005507 >>2003954 Military academies up through around WWI started at 13-14 and graduated 2nd LTs at 16.

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 22:38:06 2014 No.2005516

>>2005330
> The gameplay is pretty solid...

Disregarding that it was a complete departure from what Final Fantasy 'was' up until then, the battles take FOREVER and a silly card game was a significant part of how to obtain items. The only game that makes FF8 look properly paced in battle is FF9.

Then there's the way weapons are made by items randomly dropped from enemies, some of which are quite rare.

The game tried to get rid of grinding, but if you didn't want to spend hours playing cards then you spent hours hitting 'draw' in battle and fighting enemies for the 2% chance that they will drop the item that you need to make the next weapon.

Anonymous Tue Oct 14 22:44:36 2014 No.2005529

>>2005516
This is completely untrue. You just had to be smart. A lot of the stuff you can do in FF8 is amazing, simply learning the what, the refine things on all GF's means you can refine cards into items, then items into magic. Its a well designed system that people seem to think either needs to either be ignored or abused. Junction when played casually is just like materia or any other system in any other FF, you go through power dips and power spikes. You can spend 2 hours playing cards and doing some sidequests, get a Lionheart on Disc 1 and like 999 Tornado's junctioned to your health and be an unstoppable killing machine for the rest of the game, or whatever

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 00:05:26 2014 No.2005678 >>2005516 I've beaten the game with the starting weapons. And without abusing junctioning. You don't need to look for shit if you don't want to.

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 01:47:32 2014 No.2005831

>>2005529
What I said is exactly true. To Junction magic you first need to draw it. The alternative is to rely on the handful of spells that you find in the map throughout the game, but that's not enough. And the more powerful spells get drawn like 1 at a time IIRC, so you spend literally 90+ min in battle drawing to max them per spell. You can easily spend 4 hours per playthrough just drawing spells. Or you can play lots of cards, which never appealed to me.

Junctioning magic is an integral part of the game. The game may be easy enough to complete and ignore it, but that's discarding a significant part of what is supposed to make FF8 game play innovative and interesting.

>>2005678
Who said anything about wanting to do a minimalist playthrough or not looking for things? Exploration makes RPGs fun. Grinding for that last randomly dropped item to manufacture a weapon doesn't. You're telling me that I'm stuck between two extremes: a LL game where I just don't get anything or grinding for hours and hours.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 02:05:40 2014 No.2005863 >>2005831 the big problem is there's never any reason to NOT junction the max amount of spells to a stat and Even doing 99 tier 1 spells will make you ridiculously OP maybe you could had level caps to say how much you can have on a stat.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 02:16:22 2014 No.2005876 >>2005831 Isn't the amount of spells drawn determined by the character's magic stat?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 02:20:04 2014 No.2005883 >>2005876 its still a moot point when you can draw an infinite number from the enemy

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 02:48:33 2014 No.2005915 >>2005883 I was just saying that having a high, I'm assuming, magic stat would cut down the time you spent drawing spells from enemies.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 05:04:25 2014 No.2005997 >>2004832 Whoa. Someone really did put an awful lot of work into this.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 07:03:01 2014 No.2006069 >>2005863 This is a problem in most JRPG's, the problem of grinding weak mobs to become OP. The only real difference is that the grind in FF8 is a lot more lenient and less time-consuming that killing 10,000 sewer rats in other games.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 07:08:46 2014 No.2006073 My problem with FF8 isn't the mechanics, it's the excessive amount of stupid "better have a guide book" shit that came to define Square RPGs. 1-6 had none or very little of that.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 07:21:22 2014 No.2006081 >>2006073 Mind giving a few examples please? Been years since I played FF8 so I don't remember much.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 07:28:13 2014 No.2006086 >>2006081 A lot of the card shit is like that

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 08:39:44 2014 No.2006123 >>2006081 Doom train

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 10:24:06 2014 No.2006242

Where did this "designed to sell guide books" myth even come from? People keep throwing it around eery now and then, even though no major game was ever designed to sell fucking guide books. In order for people like >>2006073 to mindlessly parrot urban myths, somebody has to be delusional enough to propagate the idea first. I wonder if the concept comes from some retarded blog post or something.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 11:15:34 2014 No.2006302 >>2006242 From the people who created the guidebooks?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 11:30:21 2014 No.2006326 >>2006302 Why're you asking me? I don't know, that's why I asked in the first place.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 11:51:00 2014 No.2006349 >>2006073 Lol. The final fantasies are babys first RPG. You don't need a guidebook for anything in FF4-10

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 13:56:16 2014 No.2006509 >>2006349 You can not find doom train by yourself.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 16:21:38 2014 No.2006737 >>1986759 I could totally play this.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 18:58:30 2014 No.2007061 >>2005831 You don't /have/ to Draw any Magic, you can always refine your extra items.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 20:44:48 2014 No.2007303 >>2006123 >occult fan magazines

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 20:53:21 2014 No.2007314 >>1982297 ok. so how the fuck do you read shit like this? with all those hypens. i could never figure out what that was supposed to be and figured it was some weird japanese thing, but i've seen it in other games

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 21:16:07 2014 No.2007357 File: 137 KB, 600x450, snes_maximum_carnage_01.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2007314 >All LJN games are shit

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 21:16:45 2014 No.2007359 >>2007357 yeah, thats more or less what i said...

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 21:24:10 2014 No.2007373 >>2007314 Think Brian Blessed

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 21:54:25 2014 No.2007448
File: 797 KB, 1024x768, rostrosprotagonistascop.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1982171
>What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8?

The concept of drawing magic rather than using MP ruined the pacing, giving players a poor experience with the story, which is the life-blood of the RPG genre. That's why the magic booster in the new PC version is so great, because you can skip all the gimmicky grindy bullshit and just play the story or a round of triple triad.

The story was above average for a Final Fantasy game, but it did get melodramatic at times. However, FF8 also has some of the best scripted sequences in the entire Final Fantasy series (the landing assult, the assassination, prison escape, the Galbadian attack on Balamb Garden, getting the Ragnarok, the Laguna dream sequences). It was also the last Final Fantasy with dieselpunk and distinctly European aesthetics. It's a shame Square pulled a 180 and opted for a weird futuro-Indo-Chinese art direction in FFX and took a step back into anime-land with the character designs.

If you ask me, FF8 should have been a PS2 launch title. All the assets were there... but Sony needed a holiday title in 99 to compete with the Dreamcast. Sony rushed the hell out of the FF8 development team, which is why I believe the battle system is so remarkably broken. If you remove the battle system from the FF8 equation, you get a fairly spectacular epic about war and love in my opinion.

Square made a PS2 tech demo:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgYGvjUHKkg

This article explains FF8 quite well:
http://www.pcgamer.com/reinstall-final-fantasy-viii/

HD character textures project (WIP):
http://forums.qhimm.com/index.php?topic=13345.0

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 22:16:54 2014 No.2007487
File: 106 KB, 708x600, 1412820113194.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1982216
>I forgave the cast of 7 because their government were asses who covered up their neighborhoods from the sun and killing the planet. But these pretty future kids with free room and board had very little to be frowning about.
>very little to be frowning about.

The entire story is about the ripple effect of war. This should be apparent when you see the shelling at Dollet about 30 minutes into the damn game. That's something to frown about.

I swear, most people hate FF8 because they expected a light-hearted fantasy story with anime characters and got a semi-realistic war epic interlaced with a romantic subplot. Then they overstate the melodrama because of their frustration with the broken battle system.

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 22:24:32 2014 No.2007504

>>2007487
>I swear, most people hate FF8 because they expected a light-hearted fantasy story

no we hate it because it's a poorly constructed story that we went into great detail in this very thread to point out why.

read the damn thread before talking out your ass

Anonymous Wed Oct 15 22:28:48 2014 No.2007510
File: 80 KB, 191x309, 1412919579324.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>1982513
>He was frustrated because every person who he cared left and decided to take things on his own.

This really is the crux of the story. It's about hardening the fuck up to survive alone in the world when entropy takes over and everyone leaves you. It's also about knowing when to open your heart up to love and risking heartbreak.

I'm beginning to think FF8 wasn't really made for teens at all. It's an adult's interpretation of what teens go through, funneled into a war story.

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 22:36:18 2014 No.2007527 >>2005330 Why is Seifer holding a computer monitor to his head?

>>	Anonymous Wed Oct 15 22:38:58 2014 No.2007530 >>2007487 >pic The irony is that the "original" image is already a bad redesign complete with bastardized characterization

Anonymous Thu Oct 16 03:51:43 2014 No.2007873

>triple triad

I must have beaten FFVIII at least a dozen times and I still don't understand how this works. I just have to randomly pick/place cards and hope for the best. Because of this I never bothered with any of the card quests or got the rare cards before I found some gameshark code that gives me 99 of every card.

Anonymous Thu Oct 16 04:37:36 2014 No.2007898

>>2006242
>Where did this "designed to sell guide books" myth even come from?

What about the Chrono Trigger ending you can get after opening a sealed door but not going through the hallway directly after it?

Don't get me wrong not every obscure secret is a guidebook seller but some stuff is pretty much impossible to figure out without having someone tell you about it (which is the same thing as needing a guide)

>>2006349
>The final fantasies are babys first RPG. You don't need a guidebook for anything in FF4-10

Considering FF9 has a sidequest nobody even knew about until last year when some people on GameFAQs dug it up by combing through old Japanese strategy guides, I'd say you're off the mark.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 06:52:28 2014 No.2007972 >>2007898 If something is popular than it's "baby's first X" to a lot of people. It could be the most complicated thing ever, if it's popular it's still "baby's first X"

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 07:37:07 2014 No.2008003 >>2007527 He's trying to hear it better

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 07:39:35 2014 No.2008005 >>2007873 It has a tutorial on how to play, did you read it? I think it's accessible from the menu at any time.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 10:14:32 2014 No.2008204 >>2008005 I honestly don't remember. Been years since I played it and my disc no longer work.

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 10:34:19 2014 No.2008231 >>2007487 >I swear, most people hate FF8 because they expected a light-hearted fantasy story with anime characters and got a semi-realistic war epic >semi-realistic war epic pppffffhahahaha no, it's a "war" "epic" with anime characters

Anonymous Thu Oct 16 16:04:38 2014 No.2008810

>>1996720
Waaaait...

waaaaaiiii a fucking second...

Could it be that Edea (Ultimecia) going after Seifer (a gunblade wielding warrior) was because she knew the 'legendary hero', destined to kill her, would be wearing such a weapon, and would have a distinctive scar across his face, and she, instead of trying to kill him in battle (thus allowing the prophecy she knew about, become true) tried to bring him to her side? Kinda like a loophole? as in, she couldn't fight him, because that could mean THE WARRIOR WOULD HAVE A CHANCE to fullfill the prophecy...however, if she tried to seduce him, than there would be no way the prophecy would happen (no fight).

but wair you guys, she never consider the small probability that two warriors, from the same military schools, with the same fucking scar, and about the same age, could exist.

But wait you guys...

Seifer read about sorcerer stuff...he watched movies, and whatnot.

So...my first guess was that seifer KNEW, somehoew, that the sorcerer would make this mistake, and became a DOUBLE AGENT. He thought something like "i will pretend i am on her side, while the real fated warrior is free to find the gfs, the magics drawpoint, and all the bullshit he needs to properly renzokuken that bitch to death?

But know that i See things differently...probably, the real hero here was FATE ITSELF..as in, seifer was INDEED the fated warrior. but when edea seduced him, well, fate fought back and elected squall as the real hero...

tHAT Would explain why things go completely different after the fight with the sorceress in deling city. squall changed. the story changed. he became a natural born leaderr, and the once recluse teenager discovered the strength in friendship and LOVE...

well...what makes squall change so much? Rinoa...a fucking sorcerer...and the change rinoa causes in squall is as strong and deep as the change ultimecia causes on seifer - but on diffferent sides. Like, rinoa is merely the reaction to ultimecias actions.

Anonymous Thu Oct 16 16:21:39 2014 No.2008850

>>2008810
(cont) - sorry..i am soooo high right bow...

So...in a way, Rinoa, having its magic powers out of the blue, (an apparrent plor hole) was because FATE was reacting to the changes made by ultimecia...and was ploting her defeat.

Guys..it was never a loop. or a self fulfiling prophecy...it was a fluid adaptation. Time-space itself was counteracting ultimecia's destructive behavior, by altering reality, and proving that you really can't fight fate.

so, squal was not the real hero, he was merely the sword to strike down the sorcerer...the hand moving the sword was REALITY.

it was the timespace continuum, threatened to have its existence ceased/altered by the time Kompression, that eventually destroyed ultimecia.

But reality has no consciensce. has not sense of self...

however, if it exists, it's because all the paradoxes in all time and space, that would result in its NON-EXISTANCE (time kompression) had to be dealt with. had to be avoided.

when she tried to alter the time space continuum, which would create impossibile paradoxes, the universe - because there can't be paradoxes in an existing universe - bent around such interference, and nullified all of her actions. Just like when you cross a river, the water will surround you and go around you, but your mere presence will not stop the normal flow of the river.

Ultimecia tried to change the course of the river, but in the end, her actions resulted in the river drowning her.

IT WAS A SUICIDE STORY!!!

fuck,,,i am soo damn high

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 16:24:08 2014 No.2008857 >>2008850 haha, yeah, you are. but it's still interesting thought

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 17:39:40 2014 No.2009028 >>2008810 >>2008850 High as you may be. I'm actually liking these ideas. Keep working on them. Also what if it wasn't fate but instead that Hyne fucker that gets mentioned once or twice?

>>	Anonymous Thu Oct 16 17:42:36 2014 No.2009035 >>2008810 >>2008850 smoke more! I like your ideas too

Anonymous Thu Oct 16 23:30:57 2014 No.2009778
File: 985 KB, 500x272, 1413241202545.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>2008850
>Time-space itself was counteracting ultimecia's destructive behavior, by altering reality, and proving that you really can't fight fate.

Holy fuck, that's amazing. You need to smoke more and come back because your logic is interesting. I want to hear more.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 17 03:10:15 2014 No.2010187 File: 154 KB, 498x428, Kain_Demigod.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2008850 >>2008810 you where playing Soul Reaver recently weren't you

Anonymous Fri Oct 17 06:19:01 2014 No.2010423

>>2008810
>>2008850
I guess what you're trying to say there is that fate is self-correcting.

Sort of like the speed of light and time dilation. No matter how fast you go, you will never reach the speed of light. In fact, speed will slow down for you (time dilation) to prevent you from ever reaching that speed. This is the universe's way of keeping you from breaking this fundamental law of physics.

So no matter how hard Ultimecia tries to break away from her fate, she will never be able to. The universe will correct itself to make sure she meets her fate.

In this case, "fate" is really fucking powerful. Who exactly foretold this prophecy in the first place? How did Ultimecia know it was referring to her specifically.?

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 17 06:41:36 2014 No.2010439 >>2010423 I think it's never told in game. It's just assumed by people like us that since she's from the future she learns about SeeD, what Squall's group did, etc through history books.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 17 07:02:04 2014 No.2010470 >>2010439 Why didn't she just pretend to be someone else? And if the people of the world knew this witch from the future named Ultimecia was going to try and kill everyone why would anyone name their child that?

Anonymous Fri Oct 17 07:42:51 2014 No.2010513

>>2010439
Dude, IRC, somewhere on Esthar is said that she was born and had to face hate and prejudice from society...that's why she became evil and stuff...

That is how she became interested about this prophecy in the first place...from there, well..she lives in the future doesn't she? It should be easier to find any kind of information...

>>2010187
I Never played Soul Reaver.

>>2010470
She did exatcly this: Possess Edea. Only we, the warrriors, eventually find out who she really was...

That's the point of the whole game....Ultimecia was trying to find a creative and unexpected way to stop its gunblade wielding killer from the past. the only catch was "NO BATTLES".....

Actually you guys...

Rinoa was a sorcerer right?

Seifer was close to her...maybe...there could have sort of connection...a very faint one between the two sorcerers...so, all the information she could find about the warrior was, 'he has a gunblade. a scar. studies on garden'...

Rinoa knew someone like this. Seifer. Seifer was involved on Forest owls shenanigans...so...

THAT'S WHY SHE DID THAT WHOLE PRESIDENT DELING SHIT.

Just so she could ATTRACT Seifer.

you know, because he's a rebel and all...and he was part of a resistence group...he would eventually TRY to kill deling...

Well...look what happens when Ultimecia (edea) finally seduces seifer... SHE WRECKS THE PRESIDENT, AND DID IT LIIIIVE...!

the plot was convoluted for a reason...ULTIMECIA NEEDED THE PLOT TO BE AS CONVOLUTED AS POSSIBLE. so that a battle..

Dude...I gotta find my dealer, there's so much shit I need to theorize about...

Anonymous Fri Oct 17 09:07:40 2014 No.2010572

>>2008810

Like I said in (>>1996731), I think it was heavily suggested throughout the game that Sorceresses could influence the people around them. Think of the indoctrination effect in the Mass Effect games; people think they're in control, but they're just puppets. A lot of people complained about the Squall about-turn characterization but I think Square was trying to not beat you over the head explaining the plot like you're a 5-year old.

I don't think Ultimecia had any idea about Squall specifically, SEED was just killing sorceresses for generations and she tried to do something about it. Seifer defects to Galbadia and Ultimecia has him working as her lackey. Same goes for Squall and Rinoa, he just starts doing her bidding, even if it's all on a subconscious level, because that's the sort of power sorceresses have.

>>	Anonymous Fri Oct 17 17:39:31 2014 No.2011316 Nothing was wrong with it. It's just as good as 7 and 9 in every way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 18 22:17:16 2014 No.2013892 >>2011316 No

>>	Anonymous Sat Oct 18 23:55:06 2014 No.2014047 File: 305 KB, 410x621, 17317693.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >What was wrong with Final Fantasy 8? No option to be Ultimecia's knight, why even play the game ;_;

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 19 00:07:39 2014 No.2014072 >>2014047 Ultimecia a kunt

>>	Anonymous Sun Oct 19 00:29:57 2014 No.2014092 File: 218 KB, 459x610, 3906087.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>2014072 just needs a good D

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 08:55:53 2014 No.2016714 >>2011316 This.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 09:21:43 2014 No.2016739 >>2011316 Yeah, 7 and 9 were complete trash.

Anonymous Mon Oct 20 13:52:48 2014 No.2017049

>>2011316
Nostalgia google on:
I really loved FF8..It was kinda like...wow...that intro man....that fucking lion growl when Squall strikes seifer...that shit was focused...

Also...that balamb garden theme...wow...fuck that shit man...Comfiest shit ever....actually too comfy to my brain even process.

Dude...you know what's the shit too? Triple Triad you mothafucka...jesus...almost greater than the game itself.

Also...Selphie...that skirt....damn.

The hero..welll...fuck him, don't even care if he starts as a emo fuck, I get to make the choices for him from now on...so...no biggie.

Nostalgia googles off:

You know what people always forget about FF8? square tried to do something different after FF7 was so praised and commecially successfull.

Look at how things are now: if FF7 was laucnhed today, you guys better be ready to make a pre purchase of some shitty FF7 - 2, THE LEGEND GETS REVENGE, or some shit, instead of a completely different game, with a LOT OF RISKS TAKEN.

Was it good?

well, fuck that kinda question...too much subjectivity...you should ask instead:

was it a well made game, with tons of times dedicated to immersion and atention do details?

of course it was: the first thing you got in the game is the realistic sprites (well, for the time), and the huge garden, full with places that serves very little purpose plotwise and are there just so you feel that you a student in a huge ass school...that shit is awesome. Look at your pc, selphie's journal, that server NO PURPOSE but only make you feel that she's not just a character in your party, and give you a AWESOME perspective of SHE (an npc) thinks about the events that are unfolding.

Look at that pseudo-side quest of the timber maniacs...gives you shit! just so you get to see laguna fooling around the places YOU have been.

go to a hotel...timber's for instance...there's a train moving around...just doing shit...nothing more...dude.

So

It has flaws, like, anything ever, but it's a damn good game

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 13:53:58 2014 No.2017051 >>2007448 why does this scares the shit out of me? Quistis' Gaze is aimed directly at my soul.

Anonymous Mon Oct 20 14:04:30 2014 No.2017082

>>1999723

> Characters are cookie-cutter emo teenagers who only differ in limit breaks.

It's true that in battle they have virtually no different except for limits...but c'mon...emo?! jesus, how many times have you see an emo teenager go straight to battle, full of confidence and no fear or regret, atop a flying boat, brandishing a fuckin sword-gun? it seems that you missed the point of the plot which is MATURING as not only a soldier, but as human. If that's not the case, than you just are repeating what others say and never had played the game for yourself.

> Have to sit through lengthy GF animations 9 billion times

only a faggot trusts GF's to do his fighting.

> or play that stupid fucking card game

I think you just hate fun and awesome then.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 16:52:44 2014 No.2017365 >>2017082 >It's true that in battle they have virtually no different except for limits...but c'mon...emo? pretend lion named Griever

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 17:08:28 2014 No.2017378 Fucking hell, FF threads are always the worst shit on /vr/.

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 23:44:55 2014 No.2018089 >>2017365 that's not "crawling in my skin" emo, though. just ring with a lion he calls griever. he doesn't go on and on about how he's the grieving lion and how depressed he is and wants to kill himself... that'd actually be really an annoying squall

>>	Anonymous Mon Oct 20 23:56:20 2014 No.2018115 >>2018089 >about how he's the grieving lion one of the tracks on the OST is called >maybe Im a lion

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 00:52:57 2014 No.2018216 What was right with it?

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 01:01:18 2014 No.2018227 >>2017378 >people have disagreed so this is a bad thread Fuck you on son? This has been one of the more interesting threads on vr.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 02:20:59 2014 No.2018318 I'm about to try FF8 for the first time. Unless of course I really shouldn't.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 02:23:06 2014 No.2018323 >>2018318 well if you already bothered getting it, it'd be dumb not too

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 02:35:56 2014 No.2018336 >>2018323 All I did was download it. It doesn't hurt to try it I guess. I just figured if there's a thread dedicated to what went wrong that it might be a waste of time.

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 03:13:59 2014 No.2018361 File: 21 KB, 248x335, 1332393355630.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >mfw FFVIII probably one of my most favorite games ever Guess i-im a pleb right?

Anonymous Tue Oct 21 04:31:20 2014 No.2018435

>>2018336
>I just figured if there's a thread dedicated to what went wrong that it might be a waste of time.

we're arguing a video game on 4chan well past midnight

even if you hate the game your time would be better spent exposing yourself to new things than reading what some assholes have to say about it

>>	Anonymous Tue Oct 21 04:32:21 2014 No.2018437 >>2018361 >Guess i-im a pleb right? Only because you care what others have to say about something that brings you joy.

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