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1960080 No.1960080 [Reply] [Original] [archived.moe]

I mean, i constantly see people playing Doom II online. imo, DN3D was a better game especially in multiplayer, I know it's old but I rarely see even a single server or two on the new Steam edition of Megaton, why is this?

>> No.1960131

>>1960080
>steam edition
That's your mistake.
Solution
1) Get Meltdown http://duke3donline.com/Players/index.php
2) Get YANG http://yang-online.com/
3) use both
4) ????
5) Douk is not ded, hail to the king

>> No.1960186

>>1960080
Doom is much easier than Duke (even if they're both piss easy games) and has more hipster cred. That's why you get all these kiddies playing Doom and don't bother with Duke. Also Doom is much easier to mod.

So casuals flock to Doom. Pretty simple.

>> No.1960302

>>1960186
neither of them are easy in multiplayer you cock shitting faggot, id rek u at duel32

>> No.1960306

>>1960302
I was talking about SP. Of course MP is going to be more competitive and harder, no shit genius.

But even still Doom is more primitive at a MP standpoint as well compared to other FPS's considering there is no Y-Axis aim and you get autoaim out the ass. Stay casual fruitcake :x

>> No.1960310

>>1960306
The autoaim is slower than the runspeed though so you have to turn it off for that shit, duke nukem has autoaim too bud. Both of them are fucking hard as shit though I have never played and multiplayer FPS as intense as either one of those games ever. Im sure shadow warrior and blood would be awesome too, sprite shooters just seem way harder than fully 3d realms with polygon enemies

>> No.1960320

>>1960310
Well most doom kiddies don't play that - and certainly not the majority of the cancerous /vr/oom community - so my point still stands.

Those fags can't even handle hitscan enemies in SP. I heard one kiddie say Doom hitscanners are CHEAP on UV and he doesn't play on it. Can you believe that shit? Instead of admitting that he's too pleb to handle simple as shit enemies, he'll claim the game itself is broken and 'cheap' - and he's speaking about Doom itself ffs. All the time these kids complain about hitscanner enemies and say shit like 'Duke isn't as good as Doom because it has too many hitscanners'. What a fucking joke. If they can't handle easy as piss hitscan enemies how would they ever even touch competitive MP? From what I've seen, that's why most of /vr/oomers flock to SP coop so they can hold each others dicks in the piss easy environment that is Doom SP rather than play something that actually takes skill. They actually think it's challenging, top lel.

>> No.1960321

There is a small but dedicated mapping/modding community for it.

http://forums.duke4.net/
http://www.scent-88.com/
http://msdn.duke4.net/

>> No.1960372

>>1960320
Oh lord yeah I tend to stay away from that thread, I know they would rather all talk about making doom animu than actually git gud.

>> No.1960393

>>1960372
Yeah. You're alright dude, you're not a Doom baby at all. You actually play other FPS's and appreciate them, rather than just play Doom and call everything else shitty. It's irritating how those kids blame game design for their own inadequacies. It's also incredibly irritating how, because they jumped on the Doom bandwagon due to this board's creation, they suddenly believe that they're FPS gurus that know everything there is to know about video games. Retards try to tell me about Doom and 'why it's the best FPS ever made' when I was playing that shit when they were still in diapers. It's really not a big fucking deal. All in all they're hipster children, nothing more nothing less, and that thread is one constant circle jerk of faggots that can't into vidya. /rant

>> No.1960705

>>1960131
You're not going to find players more easily using Yang and Metldown than Megaton. Though those are the better choices because they're not as laggy in multi as Megaton...

OP needs to join Steam groups for Megaton multiplayer if he wants to find players more easily. You can avoid the Yang/Metldown community unless you feel like getting your ass handed to you by players who play with steroids AND jetpack on 99% of the time.

>>1960310
Shadow Warrior is the best deathmatch FPS I've ever played, and that comes from someone who spent hundreds of hours in Q3A and UT.

>> No.1960724

I always found the levels in DN3D...lacking.

Like a lot of the levels just aren't fun to play which is what stops me from playing through it again very often.

>> No.1961004

>>1960186

>Duke
>piss easy

Nah. Even Doom manages to kick some ass at times before you've memorized everything.

>> No.1961007

>>1960320

To be fair, hitscanners are terrible in literally every game. Doom, Duke, Blood, SW, Half-Life, Serious Sam, or whatever, all shit. The only reason they're used is so that the player can't dodge literally everything.

>> No.1961008

>>1961007
>le literally

>> No.1961010

>>1961008
Lot of shitposting lately.
Did we get another influx of /v/?

>> No.1961032

>>1961010
Yeah, a bunch of /v/ got kicked out for participating in gamergate threads.

>> No.1961132

I don't follow the Duke3D scene because I'm only interested in vanilla/DOS stuff and everyone's using eduke32.

Well I'm the same way with Doom, except there's still a bunch of vanilla Doom activity.

>> No.1961138
File: 134 KB, 1280x1024, 246407-stranger.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1961138

>>1960080
I have the steam edition and there are always servers up but if I play coop I just host my own and plays with my friends. It might be your location, when I check there are always at least 2 coop servers up with players and always DM servers. I've been playing it a lot lately.

>> No.1961151

>>1961032
what the fuck is a gamergate?

Something like watergate?

>> No.1961213

>>1961007
>not being able to dodge hitscanners
This is why you're retarded.

>> No.1961261

>>1961007
You can dodge every hitscanner in DN3D except from the Battlelord.

>>1961132
There is still some vanilla maps made from times to times. For instance this brillant map released a couple of weeks ago : http://forums.duke4.net/topic/7657-release-insurance-overload/

and actually, since Megaton got released, there has been some maps made with Megaton compatibility in mind (some EDuke32 stuff wouldn't work in megaton), and quite a few of those should be vanilla compatible

And also, tons of mappers use EDuke32 but like to stay as close as possible to vanilla while using EDuke32, meaning that the only differences with vanilla is that the maps use the new building limits and that they may effects in a non intended way that only behave as such in EDuke32. So yeah it's definitly not vanilla, but it still feels close to it.

But as far as modding goes, there is no reason NOT to use EDuke32

>> No.1961376

>>1960186

This post is fucking retarded. Congratulations for making the worst post I've ever seen on /vr/

>> No.1961401

>>1961261
>dodging hitscanners
Is this a mere misunderstanding of what "hitscan" means or is there something I don't know - because as far as I know hitscan weapons are supposed to hit (or miss) practically the very moment they're fired.

>> No.1961413

>>1961401
In most FPSs there's a small delay between a hitscanner's aiming and firing. If you're moving fast enough they'll miss.

>> No.1961489

>>1961413
Playing le Doom PWAD.
All of a sudden, bars come down and block the only exit. Walls open up to reveal squads of chaingunners, and an archvile can be heard behind a window.
> le hitscanner dodge face
> le game over face

>> No.1961524

>>1961151

Some shitty indie choose your own adventure browser game got a bunch of "OUTSTANDING, MUST PLAY" reviews from gaming sites, then proof was discovered that the woman who created it had slept with all of the journalists who gave her game an obviously ridiculously high score/praise.

I don't expect this to be seen as a big deal on /vr/ because I'm sure most of us are adults who already realized that most gaming journalism is "corrupt" video game advertising. It was a sort of coming of age experience to a lot of the autists and teens on /v/ though, so it was a huge deal there until moot banned discussion of it.

>> No.1961537
File: 7 KB, 212x247, tom hall.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1961537

Lots of Tom Hall fans here, I see.

For those who don't know, Tom Hall was fired from Id during development of Doom because he insisted all the maps have a sense of logical progression from one to the other, and the maps he was making were story focused and full of scripted events and interactions that slowed down the action. John Carmack felt that story in a shooter is like story in a porno, and he wasn't interested in boring pornos.

Tom then went back to Apogee where he eventually became a lead designer for Duke Nukem 3D before leaving for Ion Storm where he helped make Deus Ex.

>> No.1961543

>>1961401
You can very easily dodge Pigcop shots with strafing. Same for Enforcers but a little harder. Same for Pigtanks but a little harder.
you just suck at the game

>> No.1961546
File: 1.49 MB, 640x480, dodge.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1961546

>>1961413
This. Webm is Douk on Damn I'm Good. You can even evade openly with the right circle strafe technique.

>> No.1961557

>>1961213
>>1961261

>you can dodge hitscanners

No, you can't. You can't dodge Doom 2's Chaingunners, you can't dodge Pig Cops and those minigun aliens in Duke, you can't dodge arachnoids in Serious Sam. You can't dodge hitscanners by nature. If it were a really fast projectile weapon, then sure, you can dodge that shit, but a hitscanner is up to the RNG whether you get hit unless you duck behind a wall.

>> No.1961562

>>1961557
Hahahahaha

>> No.1961563

>>1960393
you sound like a fucking fag

>> No.1961564

>>1961537
Dunno if Doom would have be better with a more developed story (something like Strife maybe?) but I always liked his levels, even E2M3. Actually I like all the maps in the Doom IWAD. It's Doom 2 that I tend to skip around instead of playing straight through.

>> No.1961565

>>1961524

It was a big deal because there was finally cut and dry proof of corruption, which was lacking beforehand. That said, it shouldn't have been a big deal. Chick slept around to forward her own causes, so it should have stopped at that. She would've been fired and forgotten about. But instead there was a backlash of people defending her for some inexplicable reason.

Also, her game Depression Quest came out on Steam for like $20 when it was free, which is enough reason in my book to hate her.

>> No.1961581

>>1961557
I don't know about chaingunners (not that they're difficult enemies anyway considering how slow their reaction speed to actually shoot you is) but Pig Cops are easy as piss to dodge. It's hardly a RNG at all. You can reliably dodge them pretty much every shot they take.

You might want to look at the webm above your post. If you think that's merely RNG you're totally wrong. Duke standing still in that situation would have undoubtedly gotten significantly nailed. I chose an example with enforcers because they take more skill to evade than Pig Cops do.

>> No.1962052
File: 3.00 MB, 640x480, pig dodge.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962052

>>1961546

>>1961557
>you can't dodge Pig Cops
Webm is on DIG difficulty. In the end I let him shoot me just to show no cheats are on.

>> No.1962247

>>1961581
Chaingunners have slow reaction time, but the only way to dodge is to get behind hard cover. Between the time they start firing and the time you get out of sight, every bullet has a chance to hit immediately when it's fired. Of course if they somehow end up in their pain state from some attack, they'll stop firing for a bit. Also if you're so far away as to be out of range, they'll keep firing but all bullets will miss (this can happen in Doom 2 MAP15 since there's lots of open space). But there's no way to "outrun" their bullets, as they're not actual projectiles (unlike fireballs or plasma). Same deal with the sergeants and troopers, but they have faster reaction times than chaingunners.

I guess quickly crouching down in Duke3D has nearly the same effect as getting behind cover, because the pigs tend to fire as if you were still standing (if you time it right).

>> No.1962265

>>1962247
>I guess quickly crouching down in Duke3D has nearly the same effect as getting behind cover, because the pigs tend to fire as if you were still standing (if you time it right).
lol. There's no crouching being done in >>1962052
>>1961546

>> No.1962346

>>1962052
I hate you. The entire time was I waiting for the build up finally popping him with a rocket to end the video.

>> No.1962353

>>1961557
You can't dodge a hitscan shot, but you can dodge enemy aim is what they're saying. Though honestly, lagged aim tends to be less of a thing than added inaccuracy in my experience. Usually lagged aim is more of a natural occurrence with projectile weapons enemies shoot that don't aim for where you're going, but where you are. Most games I find just add in a randomization faction to the accuracy and just lock your shit.

>> No.1962371

>>1961524
not a big deal sjw pls go back to tumblr

>> No.1962386

>>1961537
>he insisted all the maps have a sense of logical progression from one to the other, and the maps he was making were story focused and full of scripted events and interactions that slowed down the action

That's complete bullshit. "Scripted events," lol. The only time the "interactions" stuff was ever present was in the Doom bible design document, he wasn't magically making new engine features in his maps. And the only thing about his levels being "logical" was the fact that he was making flat realistic military base-style levels instead of the weird room shapes and interesting height differences that Romero started making.

He left because he wasn't happy about the direction Doom (and id) was taking and was unhappy, yeah, that part is true.

>> No.1962408
File: 3.00 MB, 640x480, satisfaction.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962408

>>1962346
Dude, I did. Of course I did.

shitty webm for retards cut the ending off

>> No.1962419
File: 3.00 MB, 640x480, pig cops e1m2.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962419

Here's some more cookie cutter pig cop gameplay from the same playthrough, and again webm for retards spliced off the ending. not that it's particularly interesting anyway.

>> No.1962436

>>1962247

Chaingunners are pretty slow on the uptake, but you have to be VERY far away before they're not a threat. They got nicknamed chaingun snipers for a reason. They're not that inaccurate and seem to have a tighter spread than zombiemen and sergeants. Well, either that or they brute force past their inaccuracy with rate of fire, which is also possible.

>>1962353

Dodging aim =/= dodging the shot.

Even then, it depends on the game. Duke apparently DOES allow you to doge their aim, so I was wrong there, but Doom's chaingunners will follow you in a circle strafe (not that they're dangerous outside of a swarm of them, but they're still an infamous hitscanner) as will Serious Sam's Arachnoids. I can't remember in regards to Blood, but Blood was more claustrophobic to my memory without much room to circlestrafe.

>> No.1962468

>>1962436
Chaingunners are fucking easy. To call them cheap, or to call any enemies in Doom cheap, shows how pathetic you are video games.

And Doom is much, much easier than the BUILD engine games. Everything excluding your movement is fucking slow. Enemies are like grandpas with their reaction time, movement, the time it takes them to shoot you (and the hitscanners miss out the ass) and their projectiles travel at a snail's pace.

If you have problems with Doom and think it's challenging you are a literal retard.

>> No.1962502

>>1962468

I never said any of that. My first post ITT was >>1961007. My only point was that hitscanners suck, even if they're not hard.

>Doom enemies are slow

Who is arguing against this? I agreed they're pretty slow on the uptake, and projectiles are indeed slow. The only real difficulty in DOOM is if a map maker goes full bullet hell on you or shoves you in a tight space with A LOT of enemies. Or NUTS.WAD, though that one's a joke more than anything.

>> No.1962547
File: 2.86 MB, 640x480, e5m3p2.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962547

>>1962436
You can dodge hitscanners in Blood as well, contrary to what most people think. Not all the time but certainly much more than the average player seems to think, especially if you don't approach an area like a #yolo, run and gun retard. You don't play Blood that way. It's more about quick evasion and being ready to do it, intelligent approach, pop shots, using the right weapon, using them as effectively as possible (for ammo management) and enemy suppression.

In this webm Fanatics catch me completely off-guard and unload right in front of me but I still evade their bullets. I also do a secondary flare jump-shot to a bunch of them around the corner and they miss me as I do it.

>>1962502
I think hitscanners make gameplay much more interesting. If everything was just projectile shit it would be wayyy too easy and there would be far less variety. Actually from a gameplay perspective you're still essentially doing the same thing you do against projectiles - dodging shots usually via strafing back and forth - but you're doing it from a position of cover and the threat is enhanced than from much slower projectiles. I'm not really saying one is better than the other. A good shooter would have both projectiles and hitscanners.

>> No.1962552
File: 1.41 MB, 640x480, sdfssss.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962552

>>1962547
Here's another example of cultist bullet dodging.

>> No.1962736
File: 2.86 MB, 640x480, e5m3.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1962736

>>1962552
I have many more examples but of course this is a Duke thread so I won't post anymore unless requested. Sorry if you guys are tired of these webms. Polite sage.

>> No.1963195

>>1962052
>>1962419
theres no way this is damn I'm good. you're full of shit

>> No.1963643

>>1962547
>>1962552
>>1962736
That's not really dodging though, you're just taking cover. I know it's possible to dodge them though, but like you said, it's a lot harder than in Doom or Duke.

>> No.1963705
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 1.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963705

>>1963195
What makes you say that?

>> No.1963707
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 2.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963707

>>1963705

>> No.1963709
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 3.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963709

>>1963707

>> No.1963715
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 4.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963715

>>1963709

>> No.1963720
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 5.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963720

>>1963715

>> No.1963723
File: 3.00 MB, 320x240, 6.webm [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] [report]
1963723

>>1963720

>> No.1963736

>>1961563
He definitely does.

>> No.1963753

>>1961537
>full of scripted events that slowed down the action

You sure he didn't later work on Half-Life?

>> No.1963770

>>1963643
I take cover, sure, but before I do I'm directly in front of cultists/fanatics and they're unloading at me. I'm pretty sure that if I was standing still there for the same amount of time I would have undoubtedly been shot, that's why I think it's a form of bullet dodging. I jump a lot in Blood for that reason. Caleb moves fastest when you're jumping.

I haven't played Duke in a really long time and I was planning on just recording an instance of pig cop shotgun dodging to show that guy it's possible, but once I started playing I said fuck it, let's have some fun. Since it had been so long I'm still more in tune with playing as Caleb rather than Duke and try to use mechanics more suited to his playstyle in the game (in particular, jumping). If you see >>1963707 as an example I erroneously try to dodge pig cop shotgun by jumping when I'm behind that cashier thing about the 43 second mark. Something like that could work in Blood if you time it right but I don't think it's suited to Duke.

>> No.1963846

>>1960372
>git gud
>>>/v/ is the board you are looking for.

>> No.1963858

>>1962436
Actually there is a way to dodge shotgunners in doom and i've seen it been discussed on doomworld before but i can't find it atm.

>> No.1963869

Is there room on the indie market for a brand new ego shooter based on BUILD?

>> No.1963874

>>1963869
If there is, you'd never get the rights.

>> No.1963875

>>1963874
>>1963869
and actually, even if you do get the rights (very unlikely), you're better off hiring someone to make your own 2.5D engine than to use Build. It would cost you a LOT less.

>> No.1963898

>>1963869
>ego shooter
what do you mean by ego?

>> No.1963906

>>1963898
First person

>> No.1963912

>>1963906
oh lol xD

>> No.1963916

>>1963869
Tell me your ideas for your shooter young senpai. Setting, type of level design, speed, philosophy, enemies and their attacks, etc

More than anything you need satisfying as FUCK gunplay. Can you do that? HUH?

>> No.1963923

>>1963916
Everyone can have ideas. Doing it, and doing it well, is on a whole different level.

Because you want to make 'non linear exploration based levels, with settings that are a mix of realism and conceptual level design typical of the Doom era', doesn't mean that you're able to do it well.

>> No.1963931 [DELETED] 

>>1963923
I know that you jerkoff. That's why hardly anyone has actually made a truly classic shooter even among companies spending millions at it. I'm just interested in what he'd like to make and what his ideas are. Piss off NESfaggooty.

>> No.1964176 [DELETED] 

>>1963931
*When I say 'NESfaggooty' I mean it in the most affectionate way possible btw :3

>> No.1964637

>>1963916

Not that anon, but I have an idea for a retro ego shooter.

Basically a BUILD-style version of Risk of Rain: all the maps are pre-made, but there are different randomly chosen versions of them each play through, enemies teleport into the level, activating the exit spawns a boss and even more enemy spawnings until a timer runs down, and there's a clock running throughout the entire game that makes it harder and harder the longer you play in order to prevent people from grinding instead of speed running.

You get gold from killing enemies that you can spend on passive perks, which are also randomly dropped and can stack. There are multiple characters to play as, each having a unique primary/secondary/grenade weapons, as well as an "ultimate" skill that is deliberately OP but has a long cool-down between uses.

The "hunter" class would have bow/throwing knife/bear trap, and his ultimate would be riding monsters (essentially taking control of the monster, all damage going to the monster and not you).

The "space marine" class would have plasma rifle / laser pistol / plasma grenade with his ultimate being a BFG.

>> No.1964754 [DELETED] 

>>1964637
sounds shitty

>> No.1965547

>>1964637
This sounds like it'd have nothing to do with Build FPS or even oldschool FPS, so why choosing Build? You'd be shooting yourself in the foot to do this kind of games in Build.

>> No.1965721

>>1965547

Not necessarily in BUILD engine, I meant in terms of how it looks. Maybe I could digitize clay models of the enemies, like they did for Doom, but make it look a lot more photo realistic since better tech means not having to pixelate it.

>> No.1965725

>>1963923
YOU JUST HAVE TO BELIIEEEEEEVE IN YOURSELF

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