age old unsettled debate...

[Anonymous No.1157328]

Chrono Cross?

Good or bad? This has been debating at length on boards forever but I think I have the answer.

If: You go into play this game and look at it as an alternate timeline story that has very little to do with the events in Chrono Trigger than we will think it's an awesome game. The story/graphics/gameplay is cool. (think of it like Dragon Ball Z android saga where like all the heroes die in trunks alternate timeline)

If: You love Trigger and go into this game thinking it's the sequel to the coolest game you played as a kid...then you will HATE it.

It's all relative I guess. So, yeah. Don't look at it as a Chrono Trigger sequel and just as a game with certain universal elements related between both games and you should like it.

[Anonymous No.1157627]

>>1157328
>You love Trigger and go into this game thinking it's the sequel to the coolest game you played as a kid...then you will HATE it.
I don't hate it. As far as the overall story goes and how it relates to Trigger, I like it. I just have a problem with the execution of the game. It has a lot of little problems all over the place and I feel the game suffers for it. I think it's a completely average JRPG for the PSX.

[Anonymous No.1160084]

If you're angry at Cross for MUH DEAD TRIGGER HEROES you clearly missed the most basic concept of the game.

[Anonymous No.1160089]

Since we are talking about chrono cross, what you guys use to emulate the game?

[Anonymous No.1160092]

>>1157328
>Chrono Cross?
>Good or bad?

Good. Convoluted, unrelated to CT although pretends to be in a shitty way, second half is stupid, so it's not stellar, but good? Of course, definitely.

[Anonymous No.1160097]

>>1160092
>unrelated to CT

>being this wrong

[Anonymous No.1160123]

I loved it but the story made no sense to me, as with most JRPGs. Also, how the hell would anyone know how to beat the boss the correct way and get the good ending without a guide is beyond me.

[Anonymous No.1160130]

>>1160123
>Also, how the hell would anyone know how to beat the boss the correct way and get the good ending without a guide is beyond me.

>Element makes a fucking sound every time magic is cast
>pelted by the melody and colors the whole time in terra tower
>Crono himself tells you that the CC can produce a healing melody
>Balthasar send you off to release Schala not kill her

It helps to pay attention.

[Anonymous No.1160138]

>>1160092
>Kid was raised by Lucca
>Crono, Marle, and Lucca die inbetween both games
>Lynx/FATE kills Lucca and Robo/Prometheus
>The entire story revolves around the failure of Crono gang's inability to completely destroy Lavos because of alternate universes and Lavos's Space-Time manipulation powers
>Serge is only alive in his universe because Schala saved him
>The Dragons are from one of the alternate universes established in one of Trigger's multiple endings
>Lucca and Belthasar are the ones running a gambit to destroy Lavos/Time Devourer across all universes
>Rescuing Schala from Lavos is how you get the good ending
>Kid is Schala
>unrelated to CT
The entire last third of the game makes no sense at all without having played Chrono Trigger. Cross's entire main story is completely dependent upon Trigger.

[Anonymous No.1160148]

Claiming that CC has no real connection to CT is like claiming that time travel has no point in CT. It would be actually easier to separate CT from time travel than CC from CT.

[Anonymous No.1160153]

The story is batshit insane, but I fucking loved it.

[Anonymous No.1160156]

>>1160148
>It would be actually easier to separate CT from time travel than CC from CT
You get an A for ambition

[Anonymous No.1160158]

>>1160138
No. Rather, Cross's entire main story is completely unrelated to CT for 2/3 of it and then it's a pointless bastardization of CT's style and substance. CC's story is like a nonsensical edgy fanfic, complete with silly pseudophilosophy and jarring stylistical dissonance with the original.

[Anonymous No.1160164]

>>1160156
>VISION FROM THE FUTURE AT THE FAIR
>TRAVEL UNDERGROUND TO FIND LAVOS
>FIND PREHISTORIC CAVE ON THE WAY, PICK UP CAVEGIRL
>FIND SECRET ADVANCED CIVILIZATION HIDING UNDERGROUND STUDYING HIM
>CAN'T BEAT LAVOS
>HE FUCKS UP ADVANCED CIVILIZATION
>MUST FIND MAGIC AND WEAPONS TO BEAT HIM
>WARRIOR VILLAGE, GET FROG
>MAGICAL VILLAGE, GET MAGUS
>CLICHE ABANDONED RUINS OF ADVANCED CIVILIZATION, GET ROBO
>NOW WE'RE STRONK
>TRAVEL TO LAVOS
>KILL HIM

There, zero time travel necessary.

[Anonymous No.1160170]

>>1160164
And it completely loses all substance. Time travel had a higher metaphorical meaning in CT towards whicht eh cliche was geared. That's whyt eh story worked. Your version is just a random fantasy story.

[Anonymous No.1160171]

>>1160170
What substance does time travel add that can't be told with a conventional story?

[Anonymous No.1160175]

>>1160171
The whole thing is framed as a life story of the planet, yet it's "remembered" in the lifespan of several human-like characters. It's not just a bunch of random fantasy locations and happenings, it's a cross-section of the most important places and events in the planet's history flashing through it's mind at the End of Time.

See the metaphor? It's not in your version, yet it's what adds some substance to CT's otherwise simple plot.

[Anonymous No.1160181]

>>1160158
>Toma in starter village
>meet prophet of time
>Lynx straight out calls you the Chrono Trigger in Viper Manor
>Talk about the evil flame that sought to engulf the world
>all of this in the first few hours of the game
>unrelated to CT

Were you actually playing the game or just hitting buttons in hope you'll unlock Crono and fight a recolored Lavos?

[Anonymous No.1160189]

>>1160175
Easily replaced by a "different ways of life, but still sharing the same world" theme. Time travel is never a necessity in CT, but a choice.

[Anonymous No.1160191]

>>1160189
A device. It's called a device. Other devices can be utilized to the same end, but >>1160164 uses none.

>>1160175
Cross, plot-wise, tries a lot and fails at most. It attempts to establish connections with CT, but that ends up being the weakest aspect of it's script. As I said, CC is more like an edgy fanfic than a continuation or an elaboration on CT's story.

[Anonymous No.1160196]

>>1160191
>edgy fanfic

>game with the most positive message ever

[Anonymous No.1160207]

>>1160191
>>1160164 is full of plot devices, which, in essence, are the same ones used in CT.

[Anonymous No.1160217]

>>1160207
No. It's not "full of plot devices". It only has one and uses it repeatedly, unlike CT, which stacks an overarching storytelling technique onto it's simple fantasy adventure tropes. To use the space metaphor, that story is one-dimensional, while CT is two-dimensional.

[Anonymous No.1160219]

>>1160217
Trigger at its core is a simple search for the MacGuffin

[Anonymous No.1160253]

>>1160219
I've already explained what Trigger is clearly enough.

[Anonymous No.1160256]

Bad, and I didn't hate it. In fact I don't feel much of anything towards it.

Best way to describe what I feel about it is that it was a failed experiment.

[Anonymous No.1160261]

>>1160256
CC wasn't experimental, it was a tryhard. And yeah, it failed, but it wasn't bad and it was pretty lovable.

People who favourably compare it to CT or claim CC has an effective connection with CT are crazy, though.

[Anonymous No.1160314]

>>1160261
CC starts with the fall of Zeal, you tard. Your ultra-butthurt doesn't make the game less connected, non-canon or a failure. Also as >>1160181 said, there are references to CT strew out through the whole game since pretty much the start. But noticing that requires reading and being butthurt and reading seems to be mutually exclusive.

[Anonymous No.1160321]

These sorts of threads lead me to believe that CC fans are the biggest assholes around, berating it's precursor because it wasn't the same as what they cherish, and being autistic in their reaching for any story/plot elements that would somehow make it seem much more spectacular than it actually was in discussions with other people.

Face it, CC threads bring out the worst people on this board, more so than any other thread I periodically see spring up in /vr/

[Anonymous No.1160328]

It gets a billion points for not having Akira Toriyama involved

[Zangief !!YG0uo46UrxQ No.1160331]

>>1160321

I feel the same way except about CT fans

[Anonymous No.1160337]

>>1160097
wut? The game is barely connected to CT, so much that the plot doesnt make very much sense.

[Anonymous No.1160340]

>>1160321
These threads are always ruined by butthurt Trigger fanboys who are mad that it's not Trigger 1.1. In fact they're SO butthurt that they fail to see that in the home dimension the heroes' deeds allowed a future past 1999, which lead to the development of Project Kid, which in the end saves all of reality.

[Anonymous No.1160343]

>>1160158
THIS. the game could have been a masterpiece without all this "HOW DO I HOLD ALL THESE RANDOM PLOT POINTS?" rammed in. I mean what about that guy you kill in the dead sea? WHY? there was no point to killing him and HOW DID HE RECOGNIZE SERGE AS LYNX?

More drama that a daytime soap.

[Anonymous No.1160347]

>>1160314
>HURRR the plot says they are connected so it makes sense!!

[Anonymous No.1160352]

>>1160130
Yeah but old square is notorious for that kind of shit though

>advancing plot requires you talk to a completely out of the way npc
>you have to talk to them 2-3 times in a row
>you have to say the right thing
>20-30 npcs in the area all with the same likely hood of advancing the plot

kill me

[Anonymous No.1160356]

>>1160343
Miguel was forced to guard the frozen flame by FATE. Serge being there was predestined by fate, as Miguel says. It's like everyone who bitches and whines about things not making sense simply didn't read what the characters say. You guys are worse than fucking DSP, HOW AM I SUPPOSED TO KNOW THAT I SKIPPED THE DIALOG WOOOOOOOOW

[Anonymous No.1160361]

>>1160356
but thats retarded lol

[Anonymous No.1160367]

>>1160356
In a world where everyone has a lisp, one man must go down a path he never wanted.

Miguel: IT'S YOUR DESTINY SERGE, DETERMINED BY F.A.T.E.
SERGE: ...

This summer, prepare to shove your head up your own ass for the blockbuster JRPG experience that has no reason for existing.

[Anonymous No.1160387]

>>1160361
Still a better story than LOL REDHEAD KID THROWS A KNIFE AT A MACHINE WHICH TURNS INTO A SWORD FOR HIS FROG COMPANION

[Anonymous No.1160389]

I've tried playing it several times, forgetting the fact that it's different from Chrono Trigger... The visuals and music are both gorgeous. Stunning. But the gameplay is fucking annoying and pointless, it's not challenging at all, it's not fun, just weird. I just can't get into it.

[Anonymous No.1160410]

>>1160367
>blockbuster JRPG experience that has no reason for existing

Well it wouldn't have, if Crono and Co. weren't such fucking failures who not only failed to properly defeat the final boss, but also gave zero fucks about the fate of Schala. Porre steamrolling them with elements is nothing but karma getting back and their asshattery.

[Anonymous No.1160413]

>>1160410
Yes, because them not defeating the final boss was not a retcon performed by CC after the fact as a means to try and force itself to be part of CT's continuity.

CC could have been fine on it's own, but not seeing why people get pissed about it is a total lack of technical coherence on your part. Especially after seeing how they mashed the story from radical dreamers into whatever the hell CC was.

[Anonymous No.1160421]

>>1160413
>ignore the part where they give no fuck about Schala

True heroes, indeed. The only person worth a shit is Lucca, and only because CC gave her character development.

[Anonymous No.1160426]

>like FF7
>like CT
>like CC and how it spins CT's simple story into something worth being played by an audience that had 20 years to mature

>go on the internet
>talk to fans of said games
>start hating the games because of their insufferable fanbases

[Anonymous No.1160428]

>>1160421
Did you play chrono trigger well before playing Cross? Schala giving her life to save the party and giving reason to why magus wants to be super edgy vengance guy is the way that rolled out naturally in it's story. But CC tried pulling that shit out of it's ass, and then because it was really bad, they had to add an ending to the CT remake to fully tie it in that was really badly done all the same.

[Anonymous No.1160434]

>>1160428
A tragedy for tragedy's sake that nobody wants to avert? Like the fall of Guardia?

[Anonymous No.1160439]

it;s fine if you like it on its own merits, that;s fine, you;re weird, sure, but it;s fine

if you like it just because you think Chrono Trigger is "too mainstream" or some bullshit, get out

[Anonymous No.1160443]

What's funny is that CC actually has more elements of its predecessor than most so-called sequels.

[Anonymous No.1160450]

>>1160413
I liked both games. Played CT in 94, and then CC when it came out. They were both goddamned epic and my sister and I can play scars of time as a violin guitar duet.

How would we make CC better then? What factors urked you?
What plothole would you fix?
What scenes would have fleshed out the story?

>>1160428

I would suggest including the main plot of Radical Dreamers was necessary for any of the plot to make any sense with Project Kid.
Would an scene or two of Chrono and Marle in flashback have helped?

>>1160428
I would suggest that schala falling through time and surviving the cataclysm is just about as inplausible as magus falling through time.

[Anonymous No.1160453]

>fags butthurt about CC when RD killed off Crono years before

[Anonymous No.1160457]

Wow, I can't believe people are still arguing about this stuff. I played CT for SNES ages ago, and CC when I graudated HS in 02. I love both games. I like CC's story slightly more, but I prefer CT's battle system. Still, they're both awesome

[Anonymous No.1160505]

>>1160457
CT has a shitty battle system. It's a glorified ATB that pretends to be more open that it actually is. Not a huge fan of CC's either but overall it at least tried and somewhat succeeded in bringing something new to the table.

[Anonymous No.1160525]

>>1160413
>CC could have been fine on it's own
No it couldn't have been.
If it wasn't linked to Chrono Trigger nobody would have given a shit about it. It would have just been another cruddy mid-rate JRPG among the many that the Playstation was flooded with.

[Anonymous No.1160526]

>>1160450
>my sister and I can play scars of time as a violin guitar duet.
Goddamn Anon, I'm fucking jealous. I wish I knew someone who played violin to do that with. Scars of time was the first song I learned to play on Guitar.

Can everyone at least agree that the CC soundtrack is pretty god-like?

[Anonymous No.1160535]

I couldn't get into Chrono Cross's battle system, mostly because having both completely customizable movesets and 40 different playable characters seemed pointless. All it did was make everyone completely interchangeable beyond their accents. It also felt a little slow to me, but that's a problem most PS1 Square RPGs have.

As for the story, it's good until the last third. I don't care about how it tied into Trigger, but I care about the execution. The way the game handled it was a fucking mess and convoluted as hell, and it was obvious the game was unfinished. The fact they needed to add a giant exposition dump explaining the storyline right before the final boss in the international release is inexcusable. Maybe if they had an extra 10-12 hours to develop it it could have worked, but in its current state it drops the ball.

The music and atmosphere are incredible though, and it has some of the nicest visuals on the PS1. It's an average game, but I still prefer Trigger for being most consistent and more polished.

[Anonymous No.1160536]

>>1160525
>implying CC isn't an awesome game on its own

Your Triggerbutthurt knows no limits

[Anonymous No.1160626]

Chrono Cross is sort of like a silent interactive animated movie or a synaesthetic graphic novel with rudimentary RPG elements grafted on. You'll recall how Final Fantasy VII went double, triple, and quadruple platinum, prompting SquareSoft to make a policy of developing and marketing its renowned RPG properties as experiences instead of puerile little games. The results were idiosyncratic, to say the least. Chrono Cross, like many games of the PSX/Saturn/Dreamcast era, is a multimedia mutant, belonging to of a breed of mainstream video game that could only exist in the videogame industry's pupal stage between the end of the cartridge and the onset of the DVD-rom console.

Chrono Cross falls far short of Trigger. Even when considered independently of its predecessor, Cross barely stacks up as an above-average RPG. Still, it's a very interesting game, owing to how ambitious, inconsistent, and downright weird it is.

[Anonymous No.1160728]

>>1160536
Y'know while I do think CC is a GOOD game despite some minor rough edges, the ties in with CT was still just a superficial connection. The dragons, enemies, environments and (most) characters were all foreign to CT. They changed some names yes but it was still arbitrary when you introduce a character and later and say "it was another character all along" Its like on bobs burgers where they lie to the audience and call it a "plot twist". They could have slimmed it down a little and it still would have been a great game.

[Anonymous No.1160745]

>>1160426
then why are you here lol

[Anonymous No.1160759]

Holy shit what is with you babbies? Chrono Cross earned GOTY back in 2001, and that's absolutely deserved. It's a great game. Chrono Trigger is also a great game. They're two very different great games, much like FF7 and FF8 are very different gameplay-wise and story-wise, but nonetheless able to stand on their own.

The only thing Cross haters are doing in this thread is hiding behind the weak criticism of "loldeep," and the only thing Trigger haters are doing is saying "wut r u stupid?" Give it a rest. You're all equally faggots.

[Anonymous No.1160772]

>>1160759
thanks, DAD

>CC fags cant come up with a valid argument against CC's plot being notably retarded and unnecessarily convoluted compared to other square titles.

[Anonymous No.1160786]

>>1160759
>Chrono Cross earned GOTY back in 2001
According to whom exactly?

[Anonymous No.1160813]

I'm actually replaying it right now. Just made it to Disc2.

I feel like I enjoyed the game a ton more when I was younger. I find myself confused on a few points (Like where to find the Green Dragon) but all-in-all, I really enjoy the game. The story is convoluted as all shit, but it's still really enjoyable.

The main thing I think that CC suffers from is having too many characters...and not enough Dual/Triple techs. Because...let's face it. That's what was cool about CT's battle system. The rest of it was just an ATB system that gave you the illusion you could move around. It was all about the dual techs.

There are like a dozen dual techs, and three triple techs, despite the game having some absurd number of characters. That renders some characters (Mojo, anyone) almost completely useless. In CT, most of the characters were viable. In CC? Ehhhh.

The game is very fun, and I enjoy it for its ridiculous plot, over-the-top characters, and its battle system (I like it a fair bit.) But if they ever just...remade it, added in some more dual/triple techs, smoothed out some plot bumps...I think it would be an excellent game.

I only barely would take CC over CT in the end.

>'I am the cancer' 4chan motif at the top.
>This might be the cancer for /vr/

[Anonymous No.1160856]

>>1157328
>has very little to do with chrono trigger

It's fucking shit comments like that that lead to believe that the person who says this is to fucking stupid to understand the intricacies of the story. IT HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH CHRONO TRIGGER for fucks sake.

[Anonymous No.1160880]

If you could harness the butthurt CC generates in CT fags you could power the sunstone so hard it would fling all of zeal into orbit

[Anonymous No.1160883]

>>1160772
>CC fags cant come up with a valid argument against CC's plot being notably retarded and unnecessarily convoluted

Because it isn't. What's however retarded are the CT fanboys trying to smear shit on this great game solely because it's not CT the after years.

[Anonymous No.1160892]

Always the same fucking retarded questions proving that everybody who bitches about the game obviously didn't read the dialogue. Since you cunts are obviously too dumb to google, here's a transcript of the whole thing for you to look up your stupid questions: http://www.gamefaqs.com/ps/196917-chrono-cross/faqs/37862

[Anonymous No.1160903]

>>1160883
Even if it was its own game it would be pretty weak in the most important departments for an RPG: story and characters. It has none. When one of the members of your party is literally a placeholder model for generic characters, you know you should reduce the number of available characters and work on them so they actually stand out. Not even in battle they were that much different asides from the element. And the plot just feels completely disconnected, as if the story was missing several in-between chapters.

Beautiful graphics and great music, though.

[Anonymous No.1160924]

>>1160903
>Cross has no story and characters

Just quit, you're beyond embarrassing yourself with the stupid shit you spout.

[Anonymous No.1160943]

>>1160903
...this didn't stop me from trying to have every single character at one time (+all of Sprig's transformations)

[Anonymous No.1160947]

>>1160924
The anon who thought another 10-12 hours would help, well I'm tempted to agree. Alot of the characters in Guldove just kind of join. Marbel had this same issue to a lesser degree. The Dragoons of Viper and their connected characters felt the most fleshed out of the people you encounter in El Nido.
Heck as >>1160813
said, more double/triple techs for characters to make some awesome combinations possible would have increased the battle potential of min/maxers.

Thanks to this thread I've been on chronocompendium trying to refresh my memory on things I've forgotten. And additional details that the devs should have likely included to make the plot more explicit at certain points.

[Anonymous No.1160951]

>>1160943
Superior party was Serge, Glenn, and Starkey voow.

[Anonymous No.1160970]

Chrono Cross has forty-four playable characters (tallying Serge and Lynx as a single character), but only allows for three in the active party. Since Serge, unlike Crono, cannot ever be relegated to the sidelines, the player only has the freedom to choose two characters to take along out of the thirty to forty-something they will likely amass before the game is over. Collecting so many characters and being unable to use or interact with most of them without going to a lot of time and trouble is frustrating, a little stressful, and somewhat pointless, since the difference between most of these people are pretty negligible. "NO!" you'll find yourself shouting at the screen after a while. "I don't need any more of you people!"

The only characters who really need to be in the game as party members are Serge and Kid. If we're feeling generous, we could also include Korcha, Fargo, Radius, Karsh, Norris, Harle, Starky, and maybe Nikki, since they're the only other ones who contribute anything to the wider plot after their "[name] JOINS YOUR PARTY" messages. The other thirty-four become footnotes from the moment they offer to put their lives on the line for Serge's inexplicable mission

Surrounded by so many names and faces that have no real reason to be there, the characters that actually serve a purpose are marginalized. Consider Starky, the beanie baby alien. Midway through the game, you fight him as a pop-up gag boss, and them recruit him seemingly as yet another pop-up gag character. After becoming part of the gang, he disappears completely unless you keep him in your active party (and why would you?), and you're likely to forget about him altogether. But once you arrive at the final dungeon, he suddenly leaps into center stage to provide the critical contrivance the heroes need to surmount an obstacle in the plot--only to vanish again afterwards. This can only be called sloppy.

[Anonymous No.1160976]

>>1160883
>CT fanboys trying to smear shit on this great game solely because it's not CT the after years.

No one said that. It is funny however that you are getting so defensive about it in that way though. The games story is just not that good by its self and makes even less sense as a sequel.

[Anonymous No.1160996]

>>1160181
Tap kok

[Anonymous No.1161765]

>>1160196
>CC's message
>Positive
>Built on the utter destruction of a previous, even more positive message

derp

[Anonymous No.1161804]

>>1160450
>How would we make CC better then?
Cut the roster by 4/5ths.

>What factors urked you?
The conclusion that more or less turned Lavos (Yes, Lavos. Fuck Schala, she was not important) from a simple intergalactic parasite into some Eldritch abomination super-edgy babby that could apparently fuck with the fabric of the entire cosmos. It didn't need to go that far. It was better when Lavos was simply a being cultivating a planet, killing it like a good parasite, and moving on to another host. Turning it into some lolunstoppable elder god time juggernaut was a dick move Square pulled because they couldn't outdo this one, simple character.

>What plothole would you fix?
The fact that the Millennial Fair still existed centuries after the fall of the kingdom that birthed its ceremony oops

Dalton not dying like the bitch he was when a pissed off Golemboss ate his head off

The characters introduced in Cross that are RELEVANT to Cross will not take a backseat just so jackass remnants shoehorning in a plot from CT can bloat the rising moment, climax, and finale with jargon that no one cared about or was even looking for. It's a fucking crime that, save for Lena, her dog, two fisherman brats, and the entirety of the House of Viper, no single character had any kind of vested interest or even genuine reason to go along with Serge's adventure. They were over-glorified spectators, every one of them (except the fairy).

>What scenes would have fleshed out the story?

See above.

[Anonymous No.1161839]

Game is garbage. The plot is convoluted and borderline nonsensical. Two dimensions instead of multiple time periods means the locations stay static and dull. Almost no character development.

[Anonymous No.1162301]

>>1161765
>Built on the utter destruction of a previous, even more positive message

But that's utterly wrong you humongous faggot. Have you even played the game?

[Anonymous No.1162316]

>>1157328
I beat Chrono Cross first and still liked Chrono Trigger much better. I played Chrono Cross as a kid when it was still new too so if I had any nostalgia goggles on, it would have been for Cross since I wasn't even familiar with Trigger. Beyond just being superior to Chrono Cross, Chrono Trigger is now my all time favorite RPG and one of my all time favorite games. That has to count for something.

[Anonymous No.1162326]

>>1157328
I beat Chrono Cross first (in 2009) and still liked Chrono Trigger, which I beat in 2010, much better. I played Chrono Cross a lot as a kid when it was still new too so if I had any nostalgia goggles on, it would have been for Cross since I wasn't even familiar with Trigger at the time. Beyond just being superior to Chrono Cross, Chrono Trigger is now my all favorite RPG and one of my all time favorite games. That has to count for something.

[Anonymous No.1162339]

>giving a fuck about butthurt CTards

>Don't let it bother you. It's just a distant echo from ones far gone..

[Anonymous No.1162342]

>>1162339
I've seen Trigger fans being called "butthurt" a few times already, but I don't get your logic. Trigger is regarded as one of the most important video games in history, while Cross is regarded as a failure. Are you sure you aren't projecting?

[Anonymous No.1162347]

>>1162342
Triggertards are infinitely butthurt that the sequel to their obsession isn't CT 1.01, with the same shit characters, doing the same shit they did 20 years ago. Also they obviously can't deal with the whole fall of Guardia because MUH CRONO

>Cross is regarded as a failure
By whom? Triggertards?

[Anonymous No.1162354]

Just like doki-doki panic before it, Chrono Trigger 2 was a game that was clearly reskinned to give it relevance. Almost all of the CT related material reads like post-hoc retconning.

Cross was a great game, but many of the Trigger related elements felt incredibly shoehorned.

Just as >>1161804 pointed out, the nature of Lavos has been entirely changed. It went from being a planet devouring parasite, to a trans-dimensional magical plot hole.

The sudden relevance of Porre always seemed strange to me. This busted ass tiny village is now a massive world power

The upgraded role of Schala was weird, and it felt entirely unnatural. She wasn't meant to be the focal point of the series, but the writers clearly wanted to use any loose ends they could find and just run with them.

I'm always leery of games that, in the name of creating a sequel, have to completely upend the cosmology in order to do it, but do it so sloppily that it becomes apparent that it was all done after-the-fact.

Chrono Cross; great game-shit sequel.

[Anonymous No.1162357]

>>1157328
I think its one of squares weaker ps1 JRPGs.

[Anonymous No.1162359]

>>1162347
>Triggertards are infinitely butthurt
You are projecting.

Don't feel so bad. Cross is a piece of s hit game, but it has some redeeming qualities. Some of the soundtrack is good, some of the characters are more or less fun, early locations are pretty. Don't feel so bad about your favourite game, it's not all shit.

[Anonymous No.1162360]

>>1157328


Good, but short and feels incomplete (where the fuck do the Porre come from?)

[Anonymous No.1162362]

>>1162354
>the nature of Lavos has been entirely changed

>a parasitic lifeform that assimilates everything it comes into contact with, matures and evolves

[Anonymous No.1162364]

>>1162360
>where the fuck do the Porre come from

It's clearly unheard of that a previous irrelevant region explodes with growth when a game-changing resource is discovered

[Anonymous No.1162368]

>>1162359
Oh please, every goddamn argument against Cross is either WAAAH IT'S NOT TRIGGER 1.1 or WAAAH I DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS BECAUSE I SKIPPED THE DIALOG

[Anonymous No.1162370]

Waching Trigger kids being mad at Cross is like watching elementary school kids being mad at Pynchon for "not making sense".

[Anonymous No.1162375]

>>1162368

see
>>1157627
>>1160138
>>1160535
>>1160626
>>1160813
>>1160947
>>1160970
>>1162326

[Anonymous No.1162384]

>>1160626
This.

[Anonymous No.1162408]

>>1162368
This is such a bad rebuttal and obvious strawman it's almost embarassing to read.

[Anonymous No.1162420]

>>1162370
or maybe it's just not as good a game as Trigger

[Anonymous No.1162863]

>>1160626
Sounds familiar...

http://socksmakepeoplesexy.net/index.php?a=cross

[Anonymous No.1162907]

Razzly a cute.

[Anonymous No.1162930]

>>1162863
Doesn't make it any less true.

[Anonymous No.1162972]

>>1157328
Chrono Cross had a boring combat engine, especially compared to Trigger's.
Cross had a strange plot, that would of been far better without the odd inclusion of so many pointless characters.
More obvious connections to Trigger would of been great, instead of "KILL OFF THE KIDS".
Chrono Cross is a solid 7/10, while Trigger is damn near 10/10.

[Anonymous No.1162989]

I love both CT and CC equally. Hell, even Radical Dreamers is great.

[Anonymous No.1162992]

>>1162989
I liked Radical Dreamers more than Chrono Cross.

[Anonymous No.1163019]

I was expecting CT part 2 so I didn't like it when it first came out, and over the years I forgot about it, until some friends told me to play it.

This second time around (about 3 months ago) I got into it with an opend mind, forgeting about CT almost completely, and, it's not a bad RPG but it has some minor details that made me uncomfortable, the element system for example bothers me, basicaly you can give any element to anyone so each character is just an empty canvas to fill with elements, and that makes it lose some of its purpose (of course there are a couple of them that are character specific, but still, they are very few), and the number of "useless" characters to choose from it's overwhelming.

Anyway, I like it, it's not the worst RPG ever, but it's nothing special, still pretty entertaining and fun to play

[Anonymous No.1163053]

>>1162972
>Chrono Cross had a boring combat engine, especially compared to Trigger's.

Trigger was just a fucking ATB that pretended to be more than it was. Character placing meant next to nothing since they just jumped back to where they were after an attack. The massive amount of dual/triple techs was completely pointless. In fact, you were almost always better off using each character on their own instead of waiting for 2 characters to be ready. Most of the battles could be won with mashing one button. The encounter mechanic was atrocious, fixed, respawning battles that take ages to escape from were a horrible idea.

[Anonymous No.1163063]

>>1163053
Trigger's ATB never, ever pretended to be more than what it was. It had dual/triple techs and it had position-based enemy attacks, both of which were incredibly effective additions to the formula. The rest was vanilla ATB in plain sight, progress bars and all.

[Anonymous No.1163097]

>>1163063
>It had dual/triple techs
Found in FF 4

>and it had position-based enemy attacks
Enemy grouping, found in the very first FF game

[Anonymous No.1163118]

What's with the extra character hate? Nobody is forcing you to use them. If you don't want to, just stick with those more involved with the plot. Even Turnip had more character development than Marle.

[Anonymous No.1163130]

>>1163118
The problem is that the extra characters used up some of the time that could have been better used for developing characters that were more important to the plot.

[Anonymous No.1163135]

>>1163097
...and?

[Anonymous No.1163140]

>>1163130
That's bullshit. I'm one of the people speaking against Cross, but this simply isn't true. The many characters were one of Cross's positive sides, part of it's openness - something it actually almost succeeded.

[Anonymous No.1163168]

CC is just as well connected to CT as
XCOM is to the original. No, THAT XCOM.

I managed to play CC to the point where some guy starts talking about the "chrono trigger". Never went back.

[Anonymous No.1163174]

>ultimate goal is to free Schala
>prep talk from CT crew before you leave
>this is somehow not connected to Trigger

[Anonymous No.1163508]

Loved the game.

The OST is one of the greatest I've ever heard. Mitsuda at his best.

And the backgrounds. So gorgeous. I replayed this game on my vita and the OLED screen makes them quite a treat.

[Anonymous No.1163626]

>>1162863
I was about to comment about how that the poster should write an article about CC, and then I saw this post.

[Anonymous No.1163629]

>>1162972
Cross isn't fantastic, but calling it boring with the elemental combo system doesn't seem fair. stacking elementals to change aura was akin to buildling up to a triple-tech attack in terms of effective damage.

One of the fun things about having the open grid system is that you could keep using the same characters you wanted even if tactics had to change. You weren't forced to drop Karsh just because you were facing a yellow elemental boss. Just increase his resistance to yellow and pile on the wind skills.

Like Zappa but facing a green boss? No worries, just switch his reds to yellow skills. True his skills are still red, but you know what? he can still swing his hammer build up combos and launch all kind of earth attacks. No worries.

[Anonymous No.1163938]

>>1162301
"Chrono Trigger: Become the force that dares to fight the greedy, the foolish, the overly-ambitious, the addictive, and, most of all, the inevitable.

And win. Across the timestream. Repeatedly."

Chrono Cross: "Defy fate by playing exactly into its hand almost every step of the way only to find out after the smoke has settled that you've played into some other faction's Xanatos gambit step for step and overcome THEM only to...save a girl that is literally standing right by you? Almost by complete accident. Meanwhile the entire world around you literally cannot give two fucks about the going ons of one self-contained and utterly fucked microcosm save for a handful of soldiers from what used to be a dinky port city.

Oh, and you shit all over the previous installment's effort, blood, sweat, tears, and poyo doll, in the process."

Nah, man. Never played either one.

[Anonymous No.1163957]

>>1163140
You can't be serious. The bloat of characters were hardly relevant to any aspect of the plot, and had almost nothing of which to endear themselves to most players. Very few of them had lines beyond what it would take to get them included into your roster and their third special element. It's not like Suikoden, where they're honestly and truthfully useful, or the likes of Shining Force where you don't much care about the bloat because they're pulling their weight on your roster. 80% of the roster could have been cut from the final release and it would have been a big improvement, as the developers could have used the time it took to copy and paste code for that bloat to further flesh out dynamics of the game.

[Anonymous No.1165076]

>>1163938
Trigger: FUCK YEAH LET'S RAMPAGE ACROSS TIME AND SMASH SUM SPACE ALIEN

Cross: wander across worlds, reflect on the careless actions of others and your own and the suffering they may bring, then choose a way to bring an end to it, without the crutch of power. Realize that even though fate may control you, you can defy and eventually overcome it. Then return to the world, with the lessons you learned, live, get out of the basement and get a girlfriend.

[Anonymous No.1165087]

>criticize Trigger
>get post deleted by butthurt janitor

[Anonymous No.1165091]

>>1163957
>The bloat of characters were hardly relevant to any aspect of the plot
It's a problem with the plot, not the characters. Open-endedness of CC is one of it's major virtues while it's plot is probably it's weakest aspect. You can't seriously say that freedom of character choice, something that keeps you going even through the silly second half of the game, is what makes Cross such a flawed game in teh first place.

Personally, I would never have managed Cross if not for the multitude of it's entertaining characters and the perceived nonlinearity of it's side quests.

[Anonymous No.1165093]

>>1165087
Huh, why was this deleted? It wasn't shitposting. Probably the poster thought his argumentation was too weak and removed their own post.

[Anonymous No.1165103]

>>1160138
CT originally had nothing to do with CC, but they tied it in at the last minute as a cash grab.

That's why the plot makes no goddamn sense.

[Anonymous No.1165120]

>>1165103
>CT originally had nothing to do with CC, but they tied it in at the last minute as a cash grab.
Is it true? I thought Radical Dreamers always had that retarded pathetic connection with Chrono Trigger.

[Anonymous No.1165126]

>>1165093
how is it not shitposting?

[Anonymous No.1165138]

>>1165093
Dragon dildos, while hilarious, are best left on /v/.

[Anonymous No.1165139]

>>1165103
>CT originally had nothing to do with CC

What a fucking load of butthurt trigger fanboy bullshit, CC is based on RD.

[Anonymous No.1165150]

>>1165126
What's the matter, too much truth for you?

[Anonymous No.1165167]

>>1165150
This is you. This is how you sound.

[Anonymous No.1165625]

>>1165091
>Open-endedness of CC is one of it's major virtues while it's plot is probably it's weakest aspect.

This is the polar-opposite of a good thing. Chrono Cross wasn't some open world venture. This is not a sandbox game, so flecking off to do fuck-whatever as if it were Legend of Mana is a very bad idea.

Further the point, most of the characters available play as weak clones of one another, and hardly any of them are memorable. I stopped caring after the twelfth one showed up by sheer accident and, like the other eleven, absolutely fuck-all to the overall game experience. Put a gun to my head right now and I'd be dead before I could remember more than Sprig, the little alien, Razzly, and Lena. And I didn't even use them all that often.

[Anonymous No.1166280]

Triggertard criticism: MUH TRIGGER CHARACTERS WAAAH

Illiteratetard criticism: IT SUX CUZ I DIDN'T READ LOL

Reasonable criticism: the game suffers from a rushed production, as certain plot points get introduced too late (on top of that in massive chunks) and some more important characters are lacking a fleshed out background. Some characters are also not unique enough to justify their existence gameplay-wise.

[Anonymous No.1166540]

ccol, VR has less posters it actually feels like a real message board. I started this thread like a few weeks ago i think and it hasn't 404d yet.

great posts...read them all....I gotta say, all in all...

Cross is a failure of a game but it looks nice, sounds nice and makes you think a bit.

I feel compelled to replay chrono trigger sometimes (just beat the Impossible Hack) but i don;t feel the need to ever replay Cross.

[Anonymous No.1167310]

>>1166540
>I started this thread like a few weeks ago
It says five days

>Cross is a failure of a game
No big surprise coming from someone unable to even read the post date

[Anonymous No.1167750]

>>1167310

I think even the creator pretty much is on record admitting that Cross was a fucking mess.

[Anonymous No.1167959]

>>1167750
>mess

that is about the most accurate word to describe this game. Too much random crap, not enough sense.

[Anonymous No.1167986]

It was garbage with the only redeeming quality being the music.

Disjointed mess of a story, lame ass party members, lame combat system, even if I where to ignore its CT connection, its still a shitty game.

It also has an insufferable fanbase, they all act like arrogant twats because "THEY GET IT" and everyone else who doesn't is a huge faggot according to them.

[Anonymous No.1168009]

Razzly a cute.

[Anonymous No.1168060]

>>1157328
OP the truth is, there isn't an answer. That's what makes things like video games so wonderful. They're open to interpretation. So, while you may think, for instance, that Beyond Two Souls was shit, I may think it was awesome. And neither of us would be wrong.
Personally, I thought Cross was brilliant, and unique. But if you think differently, that's fine, because that just means we have different opinions on what makes a game good.

[Anonymous No.1168093]

>>1167986
>he doesn't get it

[Anonymous No.1168101]

Chrono Cross is a more divisive game, as reflected in this thread and on aggregate reviews. It's on par with Chrono trigger according to paid critics, but it's less than stellar according to user reviews. Far from failures, both games are at the forefront of their respective systems.

Triggerfags are just mad.

http://www.metacritic.com/game/ds/chrono-trigger

http://www.metacritic.com/game/playstation/chrono-cross

[Anonymous No.1168110]

don't listen to the hate:
Great Story
Great Gameplay
Great Music
Huge replay value
Its highly worth your time and energy. It starts off rather slow but once you get into it really takes off.
Classic game, back when Square actually tried to make different types of rpgs. I miss those days. Square Enix just needs to make a second smaller internal studio and start pumping out great rpgs again like the snes and ps1 eras.

[Anonymous No.1168121]

did no one mention that the this was one of the first square games where the dialogue was unique to each character? As in different dialects? The story is not convoluted, it makes perfect sense and it's connection to trigger is spot on.

[Anonymous No.1168140]

A well-reviewed Playstation game made by the creators of Chrono Trigger, featuring cameos of characters from that game, frequently described as needing a longer development time and having a "convoluted" story.

Oh that's right. I just described Xenogears. Nobody gets butthurt about Xenogears because it's not Chronogears.

[Anonymous No.1168156]

>muh need to have a stronger link to CT than dead ghosts from an alternate universe who more than decently explain themselves as to why they have any basis for existing in the CC universe

http://www.chronocompendium.com/Term/Chrono_Cross_Condensed_Plot_Summary.html

Just fucking read this, you shitheads. I guarantee that if nothing else, you'll at least come away with a better appreciation for the effort involved in both games.

[Anonymous No.1168158]

>>1168140
Anybody with two brain cells to rub together is perfectly aware that most of the criticism surrounding Cross is just massive Trigger fanboy butthurt.

What's also funny is how RD gets away with killing off Crono without them getting mad at it. But I guess they just missed that because Trigger fanboys, as proven time and time again by their inability to grasp a plot that is explained to them blatantly by the game, just can't read.

[Anonymous No.1168195]

this thread reminds me of old console wars threads

Chrono Trigger is the Wii, and Chrono Chross is the PS3

[Anonymous No.1168525]

>>1168140
>>1168156
>>1168158
promote your site elsewhere and stop samefagging.

[Anonymous No.1168527]

>>1168156
Chrono Cross is a mess. Creating a mess takes effort, but not the good kind of effort.

[Anonymous No.1169562]

>waaaaaaaah the game is a mess I don't understand anything
>someone posts a simple plot explanation for the mentally challenged
>waaaaaah go away
>waaaaaaaah the game is a mess I don't understand anything

Trigger fanboys, gentlemen.

[Anonymous No.1169596]

>>1157328

Chrono Cross was the sort of game that benefited from its era. It got to be a little adventurous and look different. However, the ambitions behind the game were clearly lacking and just didn't pull through. But then again, it's hard to measure up to the creative forces behind Trigger.

It's still an enjoyable game, the story is just fucked in more ways than Nomura could devise given 40 Kingdom Hearts titles to create.

[Anonymous No.1169598]

>>1169562
but I'm a Trigger fanboy and I fucking love Cross

also let's face it Chrono Cross could have literally been the most broken game possible and it would have still been worth it just for the soundtrack, jesus christ

[Anonymous No.1169618]

I don't like jRPG's for the most part. FF3, Chrono Trigger, Chrono Cross, and Sikes of Arcadia are the only 4 I've tried and been able to play to the end. I've played nearly every jRPG for SNES and PS as well. I clearly liked the game quite a bit, but again I'm not big on jRPG's. Maybe Cross is the casual mans jRPG?

[Anonymous No.1169636]

i think this thread gave me an ulcer. CT fans explaining what was wrong with CC, and CC fans just screaming "LOL U DIDNT READ OMG BUTTHURT TRIGGER FANBOY"

[Anonymous No.1169653]

I think my problem with Chrono Cross was that it's sooooo boooring.
I think I've played it 3 seperate occasions and thought every time, "maybe it wasn't boring and I was just being stupid" but I just... get so bored.

Then again it's been quite a long time since I tried it... maybe the 4th time will be different.

[Anonymous No.1169667]

>>1169653
On my 6th attempt at getting into Morrowind I came to the conclusion that some games, even games that people seem to think are the greatest creation since creation itself, aren't for everyone.

Don't bother, the game just isn't for you.

[Anonymous No.1169679]

>>1169667
Yeah it's true, it just hurts when you want to like a game but can't.
Like the Ogre series. It has everything I love and is pretty popular but I just cant like it no matter how hard I try.

[Anonymous No.1169794]

>>1168525
>he doesn't know who's samefagging

[Anonymous No.1170251]

>>1168158
That's mainly because very few people have played the (until recently) japan-only text adventure spiritual sequel to a game on the snes.

[Anonymous No.1170367]

>>1169618
>FF3
For fuck's sake. And this is a /vr/ thing, too.

[Anonymous No.1170371]

>>1170251
Radical Dreamers was unapologetically horrible. CC is a masterpiece compared to it.

[Anonymous No.1170418]

>>1169636
>CT fans explaining

WAAH IT'S CONVOLUTED is not an explanation. Neither is failing to understand what the game says to you an excuse.

[Anonymous No.1170425]

>>1170418
There are several posts which offer constructive criticism of Cross's plot without belittling it. I see few posts in the thread arguing against those views that aren't saying "LOL 2 DEEP 4 YOU!" or "LOL TRIGGER FAGS CAN'T READ!"

[Anonymous No.1170448]

>>1170251
RD was hacked in 2005 and there has been a rudimentary text translation around since 2002 or so.

[Anonymous No.1170542]

>>1169653

it's true...to like CC, you need to try very hard to convince yourself it's good. You have to go through a lot of trouble and to find a way for it not to suck.

[Anonymous No.1170552]

>>1170542
Equaling CT to an acquired taste is ridiculous. Enjoying CC over CT is like enjoying a good book over an elementary school story. People tend to grow and mature and find engaging complex works of fiction more rewarding than a blatant Sunday morning cartoon (although if well done those will have a certain charm too). Cross is a game for people who had at least 20 years to mature. Sadly, the immature hardcore Trigger fanbase apparently refused to change.

[Anonymous No.1170614]

>>1170552
"Mature games for mature people such as myself"

[Anonymous No.1170615]

>>1170448
The point still stands that it not only got translated after Chrono Cross, few people would have known about it.

[Anonymous No.1170616]

>>1170552
>Enjoying CC over CT is like enjoying a good book over an elementary school story.

This is the most pretentious post I've read on the ENTIRE INTERNET in months. Not just /vr/. Not just 4chan. But the entire fucking internet.

[Anonymous No.1170620]

>>1170618

I don't even care for the series, bro.

[Anonymous No.1170618]

>>1170616
>This is the most pretentious post I've read on the ENTIRE INTERNET in months.

Overdramatic Trigggerfag detected

[Anonymous No.1170627]

>>1170552

You can either:

A) Eat a sack of dicks
B) Scale a wall of dicks in the himalayas.

or

C) Smoke 10 dicks their cigars

thank you very much. You pretentious little bourgeois shit.

[Anonymous No.1170648]

>>1170614
>>1170616
>>1170627

>being this cross

[Anonymous No.1170659]

>>1157328
Terrible combat, too many useless characters, completely shits on Chrono Trigger, that faggot in the speedo.

The soundtrack is overrated. There's only like two good songs out of like 40.

[Anonymous No.1170661]

>>1170659
also fucking horrible translation

[Anonymous No.1170669]

>>1170659
>completely shits on Chrono Trigger

>Thanks to the valiant efforts of the Trigger heroes, a future where Balthasar is able to create the Chronopolis and Project Kid exists, which would not be the case if Lavos were to emerge in 1999, saving Schala, who was completely abandoned by the "heroes" and in fact, all of existence itself.

[Anonymous No.1170716]

>>1170552

bahahaha

dude, the story of both are halfway decent, but they're still both vidya, and comparing either of them to a "good book" is pathetic.

how many anime posters do you have on your walls?

[Anonymous No.1170732]

>>1157328
its a very good game

god tier OST

[Anonymous No.1171702]

>>1170732

more liek gay tier OST

[Anonymous No.1171756]

>>1171702

honestly i agree

i like yasunori mitsuda but the soundtrack to Chrono Cross is pure cheese

[Anonymous No.1171770]

>>1170661

most squaresoft games have bad translations

"bad" meaning "inaccurate"