/vr/ - Retro Games

[Anonymous No.10726319]

Why do people hate edge smoothing filters? it's probably what devs had in mind back then if not for hardware limitations. This is probable by looking at 2D games from the 6th gen like Odin Sphere, no hint of traditional blocky pixel-art.

[Anonymous No.10726326]

>>10726319
Because most people have eyes, OP.

[Anonymous No.10726331]

>>10726319
I see it as kinda like AI upscaling. There's decent intentions behind it but you really need to have a human redraw everything manually for it to look good.

[Anonymous No.10726341]

Only use it on female sprites because it helps me cum and get my head into the zone. But for gaming I find those filters to be distracting

[Anonymous No.10726354]

Because it looks terrible in its attempt to fill the gaps, so it's not the same as Vanillaware art style which is done like that from the beginning.

[Anonymous No.10726358]

>>10726319
Because they look awful. But I'll be nice and actually explain.

These games were made for CRT televisions and 99% of consumers used composite cables (or in the earlier days, RF). The result is that these games were played on fuzzy displays over a fuzzy connection. And devs designed with that in mind, they used the fuzzy image to their advantage to bypass hardware limitations and create transparent objects when they shouldn't have been able to.

So no, those awful filters are not what the devs intended. Those are sharp and flat, there's no blur and there's no blending. It's worse than sharp pixels. It's like watching a movie with a negative filture turned on.

When the games are properly blurred, they look less pixelated and the visual effects intended by the devs are able to be viewed.

[Anonymous No.10726360]

>>10726319
Because as long as you play games on your TV across the room instead of bam right up in your face, a lot of raw pixels already look alright and visually blend. A lot of people's problems with raw pixels comes from the fact that they're playing it blown up on their huge desktop screens. Then smoothing or being a certain distance away still doesn't address the rest of what's designed for CRTs, like transparency n' such, so there's no point in using smoothing.

[Anonymous No.10726368]

>>10726358
>And devs designed with that in mind

[Anonymous No.10726380]

>>10726360
Like this

[Anonymous No.10726451]

>>10726319
Because they're lonely incels, what other reason would there be? No normal human being obsesses, frets, and stamps his feet over how other people play video games than bitter virgins who have no personalities and nothing going on in their lives but their "video game fandom", so they take it as an insult to their "religion" when they see anyone enjoying a game in any different manner than how they did. It's pretty much the saddest existence a human being can face. They're not real people: they live as a reaction to other people, they're literally shadows of men rather than men themselves.

All their excuses are pointless and irrelevant.
>tHe dEvS dEsIgNed iT tHaT wAy!
nope
>iT hAs tO bE CrT-aCcUrAtE!!
there were millions of crts, they all looked different and most looked like shit. don't care
>y-you like X? oh yeah well here's ultra extreme cheap strawman version of that! L-LOOKIN GOOD H-HEh... bet you feel silly now huh!
peak moron

Get a personality, go outside, touch grass, get a girlfriend, and stop getting mad over how other people play video games. You've accomplished nothing.

[Anonymous No.10726486]

>>10726319

[Anonymous No.10726492]

>>10726486
Just wait until real time AI sprite replacements become a thing

[Anonymous No.10726495]

>>10726451
Who the fuck are you talking to?

[Anonymous No.10726502]

>>10726495
me. he was intensely debating with a version of myself from an alternate future where I posed those very same questions at that anon. unfortunately in my case, he came prepared...

[Anonymous No.10726524]

The Game Boy came out in 1986 and they were so proud of their sharp square pixels, it was such a selling point for them, that they advertised it on the top of the console itself

[Anonymous No.10726526]

The Game Boy came out in 1989 and they were so proud of their sharp square pixels, it was such a selling point for them, that they advertised it on the top of the console itself

[Anonymous No.10726527]

>>10726451
>frets, and stamps his feet
that'd be you bud.
it's okay to have bad taste. doesn't make you a bad person. just be prepared for some light ribbing for it.

[Anonymous No.10726528]

>>10726319
The answer should be obvious from lookin_good.jpg: Filters don't make Funky's eyes look more eye-shaped, nor do they stop his glasses from blending into his bandana when he lifts them up.

[Anonymous No.10726534]

>>10726527
>fragile, ego-driven seething
I'm so sorry you have no personality and can't do anything but get upset at how other people play video games.
There is no cure for this. You will always be obsessed. You literally could not stop yourself even if you wanted at this point.

[Anonymous No.10726538]

>>10726451
holy cope
go outside
touch grass

[Anonymous No.10726539]

>>10726534
Oh yeah, clearly I'm the one seething here.

[Anonymous No.10726541]

Because they look fucking hideous in all cases
>it's probably what devs had in mind back then if not for hardware limitations.
fucking no

[Anonymous No.10726542]

>>10726539
>gets called out
>tries to play "so above it all"
>will literally spend hours in this thread and every future thread seething
Mhm. Pathological.

[Anonymous No.10726547]

>>10726451
>anyone that has anything above a causal interest in a hobby is a lonely incel with no life and is miserable
Can’t tell if this is projecting, coping, or both. Either way you ironically come across as the biggest loser in this thread. >they weren’t designed with CRTs in mind, trust me bro
Pic related. Sorry you don’t have the money for a shitty CRT, or you think that since you’re a casual faggot that doesn’t care about picture quality of retro games in a retro game board then NO ONE should care about it, and that if they do then they are an incel loser.

[Anonymous No.10726556]

>>10726542
I'm not above making fun of your lack of functional eyeballs and will continue to do so, yes.

[Anonymous No.10726578]

>>10726547
>arrow hits its mark
>enraged because it got called out as being an obsessive loser fixated on how other people play video games
And you'll be stuck in every one of these threads until the end of time. You literally cannot stop yourself from getting thrown into a fury every time you see a screenshot that "isn't right".

>>10726556
Nope. You're stuck in these threads until the end of time, because you're too emotionally weak to escape them.

[Anonymous No.10726603]

>>10726578
>enraged because it got called out as being an obsessive loser fixated on how other people use 4chan

[Anonymous No.10726607]

>>10726319
Because they all look like shit compared to a CRT or a heavily-tweaked CRT shader

[Anonymous No.10726634]

>>10726368
Square is a special case. They get credited for movie effects all the time because they invested into tech that most companies don't have. But check out photos from other major companies from that era and you'll see 10 or 14 inch CRT's sitting on everyone's desks. Nintendo for example.

Most game devs were small back in those days and weren't buy multiple PVM's per dev.

[Anonymous No.10726647]

All of the algorithmic filters out there make some naive assumption about how the pixel art was intended to look and end up changing the art style of the game. It’s fine if you use it, just don’t try to claim it’s objectively good or the definitive way to play

[Anonymous No.10726657]

>>10726603
Nah, nice try but it doesn't work like that, ragechild. You're here because you HATE it that other people are having fun. We're here to enjoy what we love.
That difference is why you'll never be a real person with a personality of your own.

[Anonymous No.10726671]

>>10726657
>we're
you're the only person arguing in favor of terrible filters.
pointing at tasteless faggots and laughing is what I love and you bet I'm enjoying it.

[Anonymous No.10726676]

>>10726671
>literally being this fixated
It's amazing watching someone destroy his life like this.

[Anonymous No.10726683]

>>10726647
Nearest = EPBX > scale2x > HQ2x > the rest

[Anonymous No.10726773]

It works ok on some 8/16-bit games with limited pallete. Should not be used on games with smooth color transitions.

[Anonymous No.10727724]

>>10726486
this looks like the nic cage reaction face

[Anonymous No.10727729]

>>10726319
>it's probably what devs had in mind back then if not for hardware limitations.
Well, it wasn't.
Source: I know because I have done lots and lots and lots of autistic research on the matter. You should trust me.

[Anonymous No.10727741]

>>10726319
Modest smoothing eg the default bilinear filter that shipped with snes9x is fine. The shit you posted is overkill and looks bad more often than not.

[Anonymous No.10727754]

>>10726492
Her entire point is that she dresses like a slutty cheerleader but the effect is completely lost because of how creepy her eyes are. Because she's a vampire?

The filtered one just looks like a generic pornstar.

[Anonymous No.10727761]

>>10726528
The filters sort of work with really cartoony styles in 8bit. The more detailed the art the worse it looks.

>>10726451
It sort of looks okay with LTTP because the game is so cartoony, but it causes a million artifacts in a more shaded/painterly style, like Chrono Trigger.

[Anonymous No.10727764]

[Anonymous No.10727784]

>>10726547
I don't get how the red in the eyes only leek in a horizontal line, it looks fake

[Anonymous No.10727794]

>>10727784
shitty connections = bigger horizontal blur = it's horizontal because of the way CRTs interpret 240p content

[Anonymous No.10727825]

>>10727794
>bigger
there is no vertical blending

[Anonymous No.10727837]

>>10726358
well, you can argue that may have been what they planned on in an artistic/conceptual/stylistic way, not necessarily working with limitations.
I imagine OP means: "If they didn't have to worry about hardware limitations they would have chosen to to just have the sprites be smoother," I get where you're coming from but I feel like you could sum that up as more a compromise or "working with what you got" kind of problem solving, not necessarily an extension of their artistic vision.

[Anonymous No.10729616]

>>10726492
I hope we get to the point where I can essentially play these classics with HD sprites that look like a proper revamp, like a few of those Mesen HD set of sprites and stuff, but time will tell, it's so cool.

[Anonymous No.10729808]

>>10727764
when are we getting AI upscale filters that can do this?

[Anonymous No.10729869]

>>10726492
Right looks like ass

[Anonymous No.10729875]

>>10729869
so does the left

[Anonymous No.10729896]

>>10727784
Just get a crt and the game and see for yourself and report back to us.

[Anonymous No.10729978]

>>10726547
TEEF

[Anonymous No.10730031]

>>10729875
You need to be over 18 to post here

[Anonymous No.10730087]

>>10726492
Left looks like a video game, right looks like a spam ad for a fake porn game

[Anonymous No.10730139]

>>10726547
I see this image all the time but I've never been able to replicate it either on real CRTs or in emulators with filters.

[Anonymous No.10730169]

>>10730139
here's a shader

[Anonymous No.10730176]

>>10730169
What shader is this

[Anonymous No.10730239]

>>10730176
https://pastebin.com/s4cnEktu

[Anonymous No.10730260]

>>10726492
>a slutty goth cheerleader [Amber Heard|Scarlett Johansson] in an open cropped blouse and miniskirt with a push-up bra and dark eye makeup and pigtails

[Anonymous No.10730263]

>>10730031
I'm 45 thats the problem. I didn't grow up with shitty 3D animated videogame cutscenes as the norm so it all looks nauseating to me.

[Anonymous No.10730268]

>>10726492
You're a fucking retard and have no idea how things work, you seem to think AI is magic.

[Anonymous No.10730275]

>>10729896
Something can be real and still look fake, Anon.

[Anonymous No.10730280]

>>10730268
Anon, I was mocking AI in this case

[Anonymous No.10730363]

>>10726319
Because they're retards that are nostalgic for a presentation that was never shown to them in the period. Blocky pixels didn't become a thing until people started ripping sprites from retro games and displaying them on a computer.

Large pixels look like ass, straight up, it will always be the worst possible presentation for any game.

CRT with composite is the most "correct", but requires access to a CRT and is going to have a lot of unintended/erratic blurring and color bleed.

CRT filters would be OK if they didn't make HD screens too dim to be enjoyable.

Filters like HQ4X are best because they do the equivalent of video upscaling (which no one complains about, BTW, go figure) and make the low res sprites look as they would if the hardware would've allowed them to be a higher res.

It's baffling to me that filtered graphics on emulators isn't the favorite method aside from 100% period correct CRT+composite+real hardware.

[Anonymous No.10730369]

>>10730363
shaders like >>10730169 make these algorithmic filters completely obsolete

[Anonymous No.10730370]

>>10726319
>it's probably what devs had in mind back then if not for hardware limitations
no it wasn't

[Anonymous No.10730374]

>>10730363
>CRT filters would be OK if they didn't make HD screens too dim to be enjoyable.
HDR solved this problem long ago. Also even without HDR, having a good screen that displays blacks well is enough to offset the dimming, just by increasing brightness.

[Anonymous No.10730386]

>>10730369
Nah, just dim and blurry, looks like shit. Upscalers look better, what the fuck is wrong with all of you?

[Anonymous No.10730396]

>>10730386
see >>10730374

basically exposed as having a shit monitor

[Anonymous No.10730403]

>>10730386
l o o k i n
g o o d

[Anonymous No.10730451]

>>10730403

[Anonymous No.10731073]

I got kinda tired of CRT filters/shaders and now I prefer sharp pixels with some interpolation method like sharp-bilinear

I know it's not "what developers intended" but sometimes simple sharp pixels have some kind of charm I can't explain

I like this know >>10730403

[Anonymous No.10731236]

>>10726492
Right looks worse once you acknowledge the hair clipping through her shoulder.

[Anonymous No.10732694]

>>10730403
What am I looking at here

[Anonymous No.10732731]

>>10730403
You vs. the guy she told you not to worry about.

[Anonymous No.10734413]

>>10727784
>>10727794
it's because the color TV signal (including composite) has much lower resolution for chroma than for luma as a compromise when color TV was invented
although in this specific case it may be a shader

[Anonymous No.10734417]

>>10726319
Because they look like garbage and your image proves it. It's like someone colored outside the lines and then smudged it with a shitty eraser

[Anonymous No.10734418]

>>10726331
this
its a "good enough" solution to a modern problem
problem is, its NOT very good

[Anonymous No.10734420]

>>10726451
>stamps his feet
Hello disingenuous leftist
I just want you to know your taste is as shit as your ideology

[Anonymous No.10734421]

>>10734420
you will never touch a boob

[Anonymous No.10734423]

>>10726451
I don't get angry when retards like yourself use pixel smoothing, though it does amounts to defacement of art
I do get angry when I buy a rerelease of a game that has decided for some godawful reason to add pixel smoothing because someone as retarded as yourself was put in charge of something they don't understand
This happened to me back when CDs were still sold without steam codes, but it left an impression on me forever

[Anonymous No.10734424]

>>10726451
lmao
this guy
this guy is in like 20 different threads getting his ass reamed out for playing a dozen different games like a dweeb
id prolly be pretty mad too. maybe even start tl;dring responses to arguments no ones having with me

[Anonymous No.10734425]

>>10726657
You can use whatever filters you like but I want you to know that they look stupid, so you don't come away from your diminished experience thinking that's how the game is supposed to look

[Anonymous No.10734427]

>>10734421
Untrue. I touched you with my post, even though you'll never admit it.

[Anonymous No.10734435]

>>10734427
Anon, that's rude. I expect you to take full responsibility.

[Anonymous No.10734438]

>>10734435
I take full responsibility for my clever wordplay and the eternal victory it wrought

[Anonymous No.10734447]

Lookin' Good™

[Anonymous No.10734502]

>>10731236
the hair clips through the shoulder on both retard. its the same model with different textures

[Anonymous No.10734552]

It's downright crazy how computer illiterate consolefags have convinced themselves that square and sharp pixels didn't exist until the 00s because all they've known all their lifes are low grade consumer CRT TVs.
What's worse is that they will tell you that it is a "fact" that devs built their games with that in mind, even though for every example of that being the case you can find more examples of it not being the case when you know a little bit of how things work, especially when it comes to old 8-16bit tile based backgrounds. For sprites sure it's easy, but for background tiles, even if you're drawing using rectangle pixels, if you want to make a perfect circle within a tile or set of tiles without leaving any empty space (a requirement for gemaply), you can't. It's only possible with square pixels. Only exception being things like cutscenes or title screens. Try to find a round gameplay related background element in a tile based game which is perfectly round with rectangle pixels. You won't because it's not possible.

[Anonymous No.10734564]

>>10734552
Are you trying to say games weren't made with CRTs in mind because round objects use square pixels? Or are you trying to say games weren't made for CRTs because Pokemon was made for the Gameboy's LCD screen?
I don't think anybody is saying 'square and sharp pixels didn't exist until the 00s'...
Please help me understand your post.

[Anonymous No.10734571]

>>10734552
None of what you said matters. 90% of people in the 90s played their console on a cheap consumer-grade CRT using a composite AV cable, therefore I'm going to recreate that experience.

[Anonymous No.10734574]

>>10734552
>muh gameboy informs the way to play SNES/MD games!
are you for real?

[Anonymous No.10734870]

>>10734574
NTA but is it bad that I really like how this looks?

[Anonymous No.10734954]

>>10726319
Peak internet retardation comes in when someone posts a screenshot of a DS game and complain when CRT filter isn't applied.
A CRT filter.
On a DS.

[Anonymous No.10735096]

>>10726368
you should also listen to music on studio monitors

[Anonymous No.10735430]

>>10726683
i wish dosbox filters were updated to these standards, i want proper high res privateer until a saint updates Gemini Gold

[Anonymous No.10735486]

>>10735430
Several DOSBox forks have shader support.

[Anonymous No.10735494]

>>10726526
>sharp
>it was actually a blurry mess

[Anonymous No.10735501]

>>10727761
That's one of the things lost in arguments like these. People act like sabr or whatever is the only filter but fact is that different filters can make different games look better, if you want to use them.

[Anonymous No.10735828]

>>10726319
I think having it smooth suffers from the same issue a lot of modern HD 2D titles suffer from, that it looks cheaper for some reason, as if it's some Flash video game from the 2000s where you play on your browser, the CRT look makes everything look way more premium I think, its smooth and you don't get ugly raw pixels, but doesn't feel cheap at all, so it's still ideal really.

[Anonymous No.10735957]

>>10726492
>soul/soulless

[Anonymous No.10735987]

>>10735828
The truth is that how a real CRT works is way more complex than how those shaders work, and not just mechanically, but also visually. You basically need a ray tracing engine to simulate a CRT properly.

[Anonymous No.10735997]

>>10735987
I've read you can already get very close results to a real CRT with a 4K OLED with HDR using purpose built shaders for HDR displays. I can't try it myself because I'm still stuck with a shitty LCD panel.

[Anonymous No.10736019]

>>10735987
>>10735997
I might be alone in this, but accuracy's not really my main priority, it doesn't need to look like real CRTs, just needs to look like my childhood CRTs, more specifically how I personally remember all of them to be, it's why I put so much glow on my shader settings despite real CRTs not looking at all like that, but it's how I recall that awe while I looked up to them from the floor, that matters.

I guess what I'm saying is that, to me, if it looks nice, then I don't care if its accurate to a CRT or not, because while accuracy is nice and desired, it's far from my #1 priority when using shaders.

[Anonymous No.10736052]

>>10726319
If you're playing something from the SNES on an emulator like ZSNES, just turn on the "25% scanlines" option. It will smooth the pixels and look just like a CRT.

[Anonymous No.10736067]

>>10726319
The better question is why do zoomers hate pixels so much?

[Anonymous No.10736074]

>>10736067
Most zoomers either love heckin' pixels (going full raw on big displays) or hate them (smoothing, AI, etc). What they seem to hate are CRT shaders and the actual look of CRTs. Just very weird.

[Anonymous No.10736076]

>>10736067
Most zoomers either love heckin' pixels (going full raw on big displays) or hate them (smoothing, AI, etc). But what they seem to hate the most are CRT shaders and the actual look of CRTs. Just very weird.

[Anonymous No.10736261]

>>10735494
The pixels are sharp. The screen is slow to update so it's blurry in motion, but that has nothing to do with how sharp the pixels are.

[Anonymous No.10737684]

>>10726451
When I got a gf I still preferred no smoothing filter

[Anonymous No.10737708]

doesn't yoshi's island actually look pretty good with smoothing? i think it's down to the artstyle of the game, 99% of the time it sucks though

[Anonymous No.10737710]

>>10737708
it looks good with everything

[Anonymous No.10737920]

>>10726319
Ill be honest, Ive always enjoyed edge smoothing, something about the somewhat failed attempt to make things looks less pixelated was really charming for me.

[Anonymous No.10738623]

>>10726451
I love the idea of them, but in practice it always look off for me and I don't know why that is...

Anyways, do what you want and don't take this stuff too seriously... and no, I'm not going to go outside and touch grass, it's too hot and there are bugs everywhere, it's genuinely awful there.

[Anonymous No.10738686]

>>10726319
Pixellated shit = orderly blocks, cubist like quality. Permits the imagination to fill in the gaps logically and efficiently.
Smoothing filters = warped blobules. Forces the imagination to fill in the gaps through trial and error without a coherent logical framework from which to work out of, ultimately unsatisfying.
>>10726492
Just wait until real time AI censors all text, video and audio on the internet in real time.

[Anonymous No.10738795]

>>10738686
What are your thoughts on CRT image?

[Anonymous No.10738796]

>>10736076
That makes sense to me.
I'm 45 and don't like CRT shaders or advanced smoothing algorithms. I prefer a simple bilinear filter to raw pixels. But out of them all, I dislike CRT shaders(fake scanlines, etc) the most.

[Anonymous No.10738808]

>>10730396
I'm not going to go in and adjust my screen brightness every time I fire up an emulator, especially when the smoothing filters look way better.

Scanlines and combing are intrinsically ass on any HD screen. They only work on CRT because of the organic blurring.

[Anonymous No.10740309]

>>10726451
CRT shaders just look better for most people, don't overthink so much, anon.

[Anonymous No.10740325]

>>10740309
ドナルドの尻穴に中出ししたい

[Anonymous No.10740353]

>>10726341
>get my head into the zone
To which zone are you referring to?

[Anonymous No.10741075]

>>10740309
>over 80 quarter pounders of ass