Honorable savescumming in Doom

[Anonymous No.10155439]

How often do you allow yourself to save, and under what circumstances?

Now, yeah, before I start, of course it's /vr/, and we're going to have a bunch of faggots in here screaming, "It's cheating to save at all! If you die, you have to start from the beginning of the level!" Faggots who have to play everything with a mouse, faggots who never played a Doom WAD before Brutal Doom, faggots who aren't aware that the autosaving feature at the beginning of each level didn't exist before source ports, faggots who have never completed a slaughtermap on anything higher than HMP (or at all), faggots who think that using the save menu in Doom is morally equivalent to using the RetroArch menu to savescum halfway through a Castlevania level. We're going to disregard their opinions.

You might be able to get away with playing that way if you're playing Doom II's vanilla maps, but as someone who plays more challenging maps on UV with a keyboard, saving at least a couple of times per level can be mandatory on some WADs.

Fact of the matter is, these early FPS engines were outright designed for savescumming; it's not like using savestates in an emulator where the game's designers didn't consider it or balance around it, because the ability to savescum is built right into the pause menu, but I also feel like there's still a point where it just starts to get cheap, so I'm trying to rely on it less and less. (1/2)

[Anonymous No.10155447]

>>10155439
(2/2)
My personal rule is that if I've cleared out a room, or it's during any moment of relative peace (for example, I just saved ten seconds ago, but then I picked up a stimpack and save then found some shotgun shells and then save), I can save as much as I want. If something is just plain tedious and has a 100% success rate if I didn't fuck anything up horrendously (shotgunning a Spider Mastermind from behind a corner), and the main purpose of saving is to save time, I can save. It's generally wrong to save right in the middle of combat. I also keep an extra save slot specifically for saving with extremely low health/ammo so that I can save after a tough encounter, but if there happens to be no stimpacks left in the entire level and I'm unknowingly about the round the corner into a firefight with six cyberdemons with 5% health and no ammo, my entire run isn't shot.

I will sometimes allow myself to save during combat in extreme situations, but I always feel dirty about it. Currently replaying BTSXE1, since my Doom skills have gotten a little bit rusty, and the only place I've allowed myself to save during combat so far (I'm on the Spider Mastermind level - you know the one) was that one hallway where you have to fight three arch-viles and a bunch of zombies, revenants, and mancubi in close quarters mostly with the rocket launcher (blew myself up more than a few times). That said, I really, really try to avoid it unless it's a map like Stardate 20X6 or something of a similar magnitude) and even then I try to limit myself.

I'll also not save at all if it's a modern WAD that has checkpoints built in with scripting. I assume that most WAD authors are well aware that I'm going to save whenever I want, but if they've specifically built in an alternative to the save menu, then it's cheating.

[Anonymous No.10155470]

NEEEEEEEEEEERD

[Anonymous No.10155472]

NEEEEEEEEEEERD

[Anonymous No.10155508]

>>10155470
>>10155472
Yeah, well, I've been playing Doom for more the two-thirds of my life at this point, and I've had a lot of time to think about it.

But, hey, nobody's judging you if you can only play on HNTR by circlestrafing with a mouse. Thanks for the bump, fag.

[Anonymous No.10155513]

>>10155447
>the Spider Mastermind level - you know the one
I really don't.
I really, really don't.
BTSX1 is just a blur, a giant featureless flatline.
the fact that you found writing a wall of text (on a beaten to death topic) a better use of time than continuing your playthrough, should speak for itself. get some taste!

on topic: just save whenever. if you reload and later feel that a level would have played better in one go, simply replay it. it's not rocket science, get over yourself.

[Anonymous No.10155516]

Bump.
Just use 'god2' in gzdoom. Then you won't need to savescum.

[Anonymous No.10155528]

When I open the next colored door. Those are generally spaced out to be the checkpoints on each map.

[Anonymous No.10155534]

Usually once per level at a key.

[Anonymous No.10155574]

>>10155439
If it's some big fuck off megaWAD where UV is essentially 2 or 3 times harder than Doom 2's UV, I'll probably be saving after every major encounter past the first couple levels. I don't have the patience to replay half or more of a level just cuz I couldn't handle 3 separate slaughter map-tier ambushes in a row.

A good example I played recently was "The Magenta Spire," ammo is extremely tight, then it transitions into a slaughter arena with you being completely surrounded, and not all that many health pick ups. You don't have to play perfectly, but you really can't afford to eat more than a couple fireballs in the arena and the first section requires you to make the most out of your ammo against a shitload of hitscanners and save a soul sphere + medkits for when you're almost dead to be able to handle the arena. This was just the first level and going down to HMP it was still a ball buster.

If it's a bit more "casual" in its difficulty I'll probably only save at the start of a level and maybe halfway through if it seems kind of long.

[Anonymous No.10155593]

>>10155439
>>10155447

>Saving to counter unbalanced gotchas in custom WADs
Bruh, if level designers expect you to perfectly manage some complex bullshit then just IDDQD that shit.
Saving just to die 100+ times from overly hazardous challenges is straight indication that WAD is either shit or for tryhards only and should be avoided / dropped hard.

[Anonymous No.10155676]

Everytime after I kill an enemy

[Anonymous No.10155682]

>>10155439
I quicksave everytime i kill an enemy
If it's not prevented it's intended

[Anonymous No.10155736]

>>10155513
>BTSX1 is just a blur,
Why? Because it uses the same textures in every level? Gameplay-wise, it's pretty diverse.
I didn't remember much of it until I started playing... but then I'll walk into a room and remember where everything is. Especially the goddamn arch-viles.
>a wall of text
Y'know, there was a time before marijuana-brained zoomers with smartphones took over the internet when five or six paragraphs was considered par for starting a conversation. When was the last time you read a book, cover-to-cover? If the answer wasn't "within the past 60 days", now might be the time.
>better use of time than continuing your playthrough
Oh, so I spent the past six months playing video games without making a single post on /vr/, and some dipshit wants to come along and tell me I'm reading/writing too much and not playing enough video games. Sure. Thanks for the advice, asshole.
>just save whenever
But if I'm doing that, I'm not building any skills.
Unlike this retarded zoomer here (I told you they were coming):
>>10155682
I understand that there is a difference between quicksaving every time I fire a rocket and autistically playing an entire megawad without saving once. Save too much and you're only cheating yourself, but there's no need to torture yourself, either.
>>10155528
>>10155534
These are good takes. I usually save more than that, but.
>>10155574
>where UV is essentially 2 or 3 times harder than Doom 2's UV, I'll probably be saving after every major encounter
Yeah, this is the way I usually do it. I try not to save in the middle of the encounter unless the enemy count is absolutely insane, and I'll always do it behind a corner or something so I'm not actively cheating the RNG by trying to dodge projectiles or whatever. Even then, I try to avoid it - in very few cases is it justified.

[Anonymous No.10155739]

>>10155736
*I understand that there is a something between quicksaving

[Anonymous No.10155770]

I only save scum when I already spent 15 minutes on a map and I need to leave the house. Otherwise, it's always no save scum pistol start.

[Anonymous No.10155782]

>>10155439
>How often do you allow yourself to save, and under what circumstances?
whenever the fuck i feel like it. stopped reading 16th post best post

[Anonymous No.10155806]

>>10155736
>I spent the past six months playing video games without making a single post on /vr/
hey, that's me! haven't posted since december, got back last week.
same time next year, gramps?

[Anonymous No.10155810]

>>10155770
Aren't there a bunch of levels even in the originals that aren't really balanced around a pistol start? E3M2 sticks out to me as being abysmally stingy with ammo even without a pistol start. I guess you can punch out or try to run past all the lost souls and pinkies/specters in it.

[Anonymous No.10155863]

>>10155770
That's fine if you're playing the original levels or megawads that are balanced around pistol start, but most newer levels these days aren't. You're either never dying at all, or you're not playing anything interesting yet.
>>10155810
Was just about to say this. Except, no, I think all of the levels in Doom and Doom II are balanced around pistol start. I think there are a few in TNT and Plutonia where you might run into trouble.

Yeah, I think there's a good portion of E2 and maybe a level or two in E3 where you're gonna have a really hard time with ammo if you're trying to shoot everything, but those levels usually give you berserk packs/chainsaws. Even if they don't, you should make a habit punching out pinkies if there's nothing shooting at you (or just take out the imps/hitscanners first and then punch out the demons - you can wiggle back and forth between a wall behind you as you punch, and they won't be able to get a bite in).
>>10155806
I'm usually pretty active on this board around Halloween. I have a backlog that'd take years to get through and already know exactly what I'm going to be playing, but that won't stop me from making 80 threads asking everyone for recommendations.

[Anonymous No.10155913]

>save at start of each level
>try to start from beginning pistol start
>if I see map doesn't allow for it, I go back to the save at start of level
>if level is too hard, I just make saves after clearing out rooms
I don't get what's the point of this thread desu. Trying to find this weird balance, of trying a hard level vs save scumming, is missing the point. The point is "what gives you the best experience" and "what is the intended experience"? Doom maps, the intended experience is to pistol start. Some wads's intended experience is to save scum. Just find something that works within your pace and go through it: this is just video games mate, nobody really cares if you save scum or not

[Anonymous No.10155920]

>>10155736
>using a game mechanic is cheating
Not really, no. If they didn't want me to use it, it wouldn't be there. If you want to create and artificial challenge for yourself, go ahead. Just don't claim that's that's the only REAL way to play

[Anonymous No.10155945]

>>10155913
The point is that I'm trying to overcome my own laziness and rely less on saving, and I was interested in hearing other peoples' perspectives since there's some chance somebody has some insight on it that I haven't thought of.
I wanna call you a liar and tell you that no one actually plays every or any level from pistol start anymore, but people do the same thing when I tell them I play slaughtermaps with a keyboard, which I do.
You may not care, and I definitely don't care that you don't care, but I want to sharpen my skill instead of just falling back on saving as a crutch when things get too hard.
>>10155920
I mean, I agree somewhat, but there is a point where it crosses the line from intended mechanic to outright savescumming. I think these games were designed so you can save your game at any point you're having serious trouble with any retry it, but you're not supposed to be saving every five seconds. Cheating? Sure, mostly cheating yourself out of an authentic experience.
The only REAL way to play is without a mouse, tho, and you can make a place up on that hill for my headstone.

[Anonymous No.10155961]

>>10155736
>Oh, so I spent the past six months playing video games without making a single post on /vr/, and some dipshit wants to come along and tell me I'm reading/writing too much and not playing enough video games. Sure. Thanks for the advice, asshole.
Same. I would browse /v/, get so irate, that I ban myself just to stop coming here.
>>10155945
>I wanna call you a liar and tell you that no one actually plays every or any level from pistol start anymore, but people do the same thing when I tell them I play slaughtermaps with a keyboard, which I do.
Mate, tell me what does this mean. I interpret it to mean that saving is a sliding scales, that go from rarely, to sometimes, to common.

[Anonymous No.10155983]

>>10155439
>How often do you allow yourself to s
You're an insecure faggot and your ridiculous overly verbose thread is just as retarded as the last time you did it.

>>10153976

Utterly moronic garbage thread, no reason for this to exist on the board.

[Anonymous No.10156030]

>>10155439
I typically only save at the start of a level to keep my weapons when I die. If I'm having a real tough time with a level and keep dying, I might sneak in a quicksave somewhere halfway through the level.
But recently I've been enjoying a playthrough of Doom 1 where I don't save at all, and if I die I lose all of my weapons. I like it a lot because it shakes up a game Im so familiar with and I have to be a lot more cautious cuz death is very punishing. It also makes looking for secrets actually worth it too.

[Anonymous No.10156037]

If devs didn't want us to "savescum", they wouldn't allow quicksaves.

[Anonymous No.10156051]

>>10155439
>How often do you allow yourself to save, and under what circumstances?
Either at the very beginning of the level/very end of the previous level or when I have to close the game and start doing something else, so that I won't lose the progress. Perhaps when there's something stupid that I want to test, but not enough to lose the progress for it.
That is, it's all when I'm actually playing the game and not just fucking around or when the set of levels is designed fair i.e. doesn't fuck over the player first time around with traps and other bullshit. Then savescumming isn't only fair, but I'd also encourage to drop the wad and spit in the eyes of the guy who made it, as it's not about your skill, but about learning the route of the level, which can be done by anyone.

[Anonymous No.10156053]

>>10155439
>texture filtering
Gross.
>How often do you allow yourself to save, and under what circumstances?
I save after I've done something that I don't want to do again. Just got past an easy part right before a hard part? Save. Why would I want to repeat the easy part every time I die at the hard part? Precious time wasted as punishment for fucking up isn't even difficulty. Just got past a hard part that I'm sick of repeating? Save. Because I said so.

[Anonymous No.10156103]

>>10155439
DOOM was perfectly designed for pistol starts and you’ll never be able to appreciate the level design when you save scum your way out. You can tell yourself whatever, but in my books it’s exactly the same thing as save scumming every room in Castlevania.

[Anonymous No.10156125]

>>10155439
whenever I want because I don't care about wasting my time for internet points

[Anonymous No.10156176]

>>10155439
every few steps, they put it in the game so that's how you're supposed to play.

[Anonymous No.10156214]

>>10155439
don't some source ports auto-save when you pick up a key?

[Anonymous No.10156249]

>>10155961
Part of me just really doesn't believe he pistol starts every level. That's all I mean. I think he's a casual who says that because he heard it somewhere, but he hasn't actually play many Doom WADs.
People have likewise said that there's no way I play certain maps with just a keyboard, even though that's exactly what I did, so.
>>10156030
I might try that. OG Doom (not counting episode four) is just way too easy on its own, even on UV.
>>10156051
Are you talking about slaughtermaps, or just stuff like Ghoul's Forest, or? I personally couldn't do slaughtermaps without saving. They do tend to fuck you over with some extremely mean ambushes, but you're supposed to expect that and save to compensate.
>>10156053
>texture filtering
You might be right. I think that's just on by default on hardware rendering on this version. I'll see turn that off. Compiled this version of GZDoom myself to avoid the resolution bug in 4.10 - are we ever going to get a new proper binary release?
Also agree with the rest of your reply 100%. Shooting 15 imps with the chaingun might not have been hard or a "major encounter", but I don't want to have to do it again.
>>10156103
I accept your retarded faggot opinion as valid, but only for the base game. Try doing that on a mapset like this and see how far you get: https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Resurgence
>>10156214
I hope not. At least, not if it deletes your previous autosave. Picking up a key is a prelude to the nastiest fights on a whole lot of maps - wouldn't want to pick up a key at 8% health and be stuck with that decision.

[Anonymous No.10156263]

>>10155439
>How often do you allow yourself to save
Only once at the start of every level. I'm not pistol starting any shit dude.

[Anonymous No.10156267]

>>10156249
>I hope not. At least, not if it deletes your previous autosave
i think it's optional anyway, i never tried

[Anonymous No.10156486]

If the map has less than 80 monsters no savescumming except for the beginning of the level
If the map has more than 80 monsters, after I kill half of them
If the map has over 200 monsters, once every locked door
If I die or get badly hurt like 3 times in the same battle I'll save when I win it too
Sometimes I just savescum my way though when I decide it's no fucks given day and I'm not gonna let a rogue skeleton make it worse

[Anonymous No.10156515]

>>10156486
That's a slapped-together photoshop of Soiboys and NPC groomers who lack just about all self-awareness.

[Anonymous No.10156529]

What the fuck is this thread?

[Anonymous No.10156580]

>>10155439
I usually play with so many mods nowadays that I don't really savescum. I either die, I cheat to progress a little further before quitting, or I tough it out, and then don't save my game because my mod order's gonna be different next time so no point.

[Anonymous No.10156607]

>>10155439
You are literally only making this thread to reaffirm your own opinions. You don't care about anyone's opinion on the matter, and are a waste of everyone's time. stfu and go play Doom retard.

[Anonymous No.10156705]

>>10156486
Yeah. Revenants are a pain in the ass in classic Doom. Funny how much easier they are to deal with in 2016 and Eternal. Cacodemons are the exact opposite: I can take a whole truckload of them on with the pistol in your average Doom II map, but I'd rather take ten Revenants and fifteen Imps than two Cacos in the newer games.
>>10156580
Yeah. I hate gameplay mods these days. I remember messing around with some DECORATE randomizer when I was 13. That was fun.
>>10156607
Not true. Several people here have made insightful posts. If you don't have anything to contribute, feel free to fuck off.

[Anonymous No.10156708]

>>10155439
PSA for any nerds that may be playing the dos version/chocolate doom like I do: original behavior is that monsters lose sight of player after loading a save, which is a significant cheese in wads like plutonia. I abuse it freely when sightseeing or nostalgia tripping, but when specifically playing for challenge I only save at the very start of each level.

[Anonymous No.10156719]

>Mfw my favorite Doom is on GBA and I can't save mid level anyway

[Anonymous No.10156742]

>>10155439
I don't know if it was someone at id software or 3D realms who said "you paid 50 bucks for the thing, you get to save as much as you want." The guy was probably drunk and I disagreed with him. Actually I don't know why I posted this at all, I hate you people.

[Anonymous No.10156876]

>>10156249
>Are you talking about slaughtermaps, or just stuff like Ghoul's Forest, or? I personally couldn't do slaughtermaps without saving. They do tend to fuck you over with some extremely mean ambushes, but you're supposed to expect that and save to compensate.
I'm talking about maps with shit encounter design. Or stuff like having a place you have to run to nearby a cyberdemon turret where depending on the RNG you have to take a heafty damage.
That bullshit tend to be in the maps with a dense monster population, but it's not a slaughtershit exclusive.

[Anonymous No.10156908]

i quick save at the beginning of the level so i dont have to do pistol only start if i die
that's pretty much it. i don't judge other people for using quicksaves differently, it's a video game after all it ain't that serious

[Anonymous No.10157271]

>>10155439
I've played doom like a million times and I can't even remember. It's probably a lot though, like after every few enemies. I know that in DeusEx on realistic difficulty i'll save basically after every kill. More egregious though is I'll savescum in RTS games too like age of mythology, but instead of saving it's more like pausescum, i'll just pause, then look around for a while, then unpause and really quickly do what i need to then pause again straight away. I just don't care though really about savescumming, like beating a game doesn't really feel like some achievement i should be proud of. And I know that at any time if I do feel like it I can choose to not save to make it a bit harder4wdxv

[Anonymous No.10157278]

>>10155439
I've played doom like a million times and I can't even remember. It's probably a lot though, like after every few enemies. I know that in DeusEx on realistic difficulty i'll save basically after every kill. More egregious though is I'll savescum in RTS games too like age of mythology, but instead of saving it's more like pausescum, i'll just pause, then look around for a while, then unpause and really quickly do what i need to then pause again straight away. I just don't care though really about savescumming, like beating a game doesn't really feel like some achievement i should be proud of. And I know that at any time if I do feel like it I can choose to not save to make it a bit harder

[Anonymous No.10157458]

>>10157278
After every few enemies? In... the vanilla base game?

[Anonymous No.10157481]

Stand in the ashes of a trillion wasted hours and ask the ghosts if honor matters.

[Anonymous No.10157496]

Why is this idiotic thread still up?

[Anonymous No.10157503]

>>10155470
Woah, nerds on a retro video game forum on website that was built around otaku culture. Never would have guessed. I thought only jocks post here.

[Anonymous No.10157507]

If people didn't use save checkpoints, there would be less than 10 people who have beaten Sunder. Yet it's one of most known wads. Save gatekeepers are hypocritical.

[Anonymous No.10157515]

>>10157507
unlike Sunlust, I never see anyone mention specific Sunder encounters or reference them in wads*. I suspect people who can even run the maps simply idclev+idclip around, gawk at the architecture and then go play something fun instead.
* maybe in total slaughtershit land, I wouldn't know

[Anonymous No.10157527]

guess what? it never matters. and it never mattered. stop letting imaginary vrfags dictate how you play a game. pathetic.

[Anonymous No.10157530]

>>10157458
probably yeah. Like at each safe spot. In a stage like the first stage, or something like Tower of Babel or something I wouldn't bother saving, but a stage like Perfect Hatred for example i'd probably save maybe 4 times or something, depends how hard i'm ripping and tearing demon face on that particular day

[Anonymous No.10157538]

>>10157507
That's fair. I did say
>I personally couldn't do slaughtermaps without saving
Have I tried Sunder? I know I've played all of most of Resurgence, Hell Revealed, Alien Vendetta, Deus Vult, the first Stardate. and one or two slaughter wads I absolutely don't remember the names of.
I'm currently replaying BTSXE1 and Resurgence, and while I remember BTSX being much easier, it's actually giving me a much harder time so far (but I think Resurgence gets really fucked up by the time you get into the mid-20s).
Downloaded Dark Tartarus and Dimensions just now, and the latter causes my casual laptop to slow down to 20fps because 3,000 enemies at a time - will need the gaming computer for that one. I'll have to come back to Dark Tartarus, and I do see myself savescumming on that.
>>10157515
I've played parts of Sunlust for sure. There are definitely people who have done both. I wonder if anyone has ever completed all of the Community Chest maps, though. Most of them are a reasonable difficulty, but the last few maps on a couple of those megawads looked impossible.

[Anonymous No.10157547]

>>10155439
>How often do you allow yourself to save, and under what circumstances?
Start of the level and if a level is long then I'll allow myself one save at a point of my choosing
Didn't read the rest of the post(s)

[Anonymous No.10157808]

I need to start doing this in rise of the triad
got to episode 3 which is getting devilish and I keep getting 75% of the way into a level and get crushed or bazooka'd

[Anonymous No.10157847]

>>10155439
play however the fuck you like. wanna do “save at start of level, nothing else”? go ahead. wanna save every 2 steps? go ahead. who’s gonna stop you? is it a recorded challenge run for some competition or clout? then follow those rules. wtf it’s your free time playing DOOM, who fucking cares what you do? install the hentai doom mod and blow a load all over your screen for all i care.

[Anonymous No.10158076]

>>10155439
It'd depend on the length and challenge of the map, but I don't really want to save more than a couple of times on average. I used to savescum really fucking badly, and I'm glad I trained that away because I really felt like I was robbing myself of challenge and adventure.

>Keyboard only
Literally why? The iD guys recorded the stock demos with a mouse.

>Fact of the matter is, these early FPS engines were outright designed for savescumming
I mean, not really. You can do it, the option is there, but so are cheat codes, you don't need to savescum and it's just a better experience if you don't.

You could also fuck with other people's pieces and money in Monopoly, the possibility is there, you can just interact with them physically, but you're not expected to play it that way. Free saving is a practical utility which you should restrain yourself from abusing as to not kill the fun of the game.

>>10155447
>My personal rule is that if I've cleared out a room, or it's during any moment of relative peace I can save as much as I want.
Every single time you clear a room? Seems a lot to me, like it'd really stunt the challenge and excitement, that's the kind of shit I used to do, and it really cheapened everything for me, I'm glad I'm more restrained now.

[Anonymous No.10158098]

>>10158076
>why would you play without a mouse when the option is there?
>you don't HAVE to save just because the option is there, just because it's in the menu doesn't mean it's intended
ok

[Anonymous No.10158104]

>>10155439
start of the level only. Technically, any level should be doable with a pistol start but I like having cool weapons.

[Anonymous No.10158134]

Since you mentioned keyboards, I'm gonna hijack your thread to say keyboard only is the best way to play doom. It feels distinct it gives a purpose to the autoaim hitscan, and it makes for unique gameplay compared to other fps. The no jump button is also fun in this regard

[Anonymous No.10158138]

>>10155810
Every level is beatable pistol start. You may be thinking of E4M1, which is very tight with health and ammo, but it's a very short map, and it's not like you absolutely have to go and find and kill the hidden barons (which to be fair, is an absolute fucking grind to actually do).

>>10158098
The difference being good controls isn't cheating and making the game boring, you know, like using IDDQD. You understand fully well why your argument is completely braindead, and you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

[Anonymous No.10158152]

>>10155863
TNT is a bit sloppy and rough around the edges overall. MAP29 is a tedious level to pistol start, especially if you want to max kills, because the Plasma Rifle doesn't spawn on HMP and UV (but the ammo still does, cruelly tantalizing you). It's doable, but it's very tedious.
Plutonia is overall much tighter in design, it's a lot tougher but never really unfair.

[Anonymous No.10158156]

>>10158134
The auto-aim still has purpose with the mouse because it's almost entirely vertical, to compensate for no up and down looking.

[Anonymous No.10158223]

>>10155920
Shameless sophistry. Go quarter feed an arcade machine why don't you.

>>10158152
River Styx is pretty fun in continuous play, and Sisyphusian if you Pistol Start it. A lot of the authors really were amateurs and a bunch of the levels flow atrociously if you aren't carrying over gear from previous ones, so I outright want to recommend against Pistol Starting TNT, it's such a drawn out chore. Plutonia really is much better for Pistol Starting.

[Anonymous No.10159146]

>>10156249
>Part of me just really doesn't believe he pistol starts every level. That's all I mean. I think he's a casual who says that because he heard it somewhere, but he hasn't actually play many Doom WADs.
Here's a graph ESL-kun of my post, so you can read it and get better at english

[Anonymous No.10159153]

>>10158134
I played through Doom, Heretic and other Doomclones with my thinkpad using keyboard only. Best times in college

[Anonymous No.10159728]

>>10159146
I understood it fine. I just don't believe you.

[Anonymous No.10160009]

>>10159728
Why not?

[Anonymous No.10160938]

>>10155945
>I wanna call you a liar and tell you that no one actually plays every or any level from pistol start anymore,
I don't know why you'd doubt that, lots of people do it, even if not the majority, and there's almost 30 years of demo evidence of people pistol starting.

>but people do the same thing when I tell them I play slaughtermaps with a keyboard, which I do.
I'm guessing since that's actually pretty rare. You may very well be telling the truth, I'm aware of a few people who are good at keyboard only and can play the game well even at a high level, but keyboard only is widely considered an inferior input to keyboard and mouse, with extremely few people entertaining the idea of tryinh to build proficiency with that when using a mouse for turning is objectively better.

[Anonymous No.10161016]

>>10160938
>I don't know why you'd doubt that, lots of people do it, even if not the majority, and there's almost 30 years of demo evidence of people pistol starting.
That's literally not what I'm saying at all! Am I too retarded/ESL to say what I do?
I play a level on pistol start, then I slowly go from loading a save at the beginning, to making a save after each big room. It's not ONE thing, I'm just slowly moving the threshold of how much I'm willing to savescum.

[Anonymous No.10161017]

>>10155439
I just follow two primary rules for any game with quicksaving.
>save before platforming bullshit
>DO NOT save after starting a fight until the room is clear/encounter is finished
Optionally quicksave regularly or autosave on a timer(if the game has a function like that), if the game has potential to crash due to age/poor support/compatibility fuckery. Same thing with save states during emulation - reload to save state on crash, to memcard save on failstate.

[Anonymous No.10161106]

>>10155676
Based

[Anonymous No.10162109]

Only save at the beginning. That's it. Unless it's some massive four digit enemy count wad, but those usually have autosaves at specific points.
On the other hand, I've been playing some wad I don't quite recall the name of, and I just lost twenty minutes of progress after taking a leap of faith into a pit that turned out to be full of chaingunners. I wouldn't blame someone for not wanting to start all over again after something like that.

[Anonymous No.10162206]

>>10155439
I only save scum at the work

[Anonymous No.10163404]

Save at the start of the level. Save again at the end of the level before I check for 100% level completion. Except that one fuck you level in Doom64, that got save scummed.

[Anonymous No.10163464]

Why the fuck is OP talking about savescumming when he already said that he plays with keyboard and doesn't do pistol starts. Any semblance of being good or hardcore in Doom is thrown out of the window already, so go ahead and play however you want

[Anonymous No.10164021]

>>10163464
I'm assuming OP is talking about fan wads and such, even posting a screenshot of one. I'd imagine everyone who opened this thread is good enough to complete Doom itself without savescumming.

[Anonymous No.10166717]

bump

[Anonymous No.10167269]

>>10155682
Personally, I save everytime an enemy kills me.

If you don't play that way then you're playing wrong. My uncle works at John Romero and totally says that.

[Anonymous No.10167278]

I get into a section that I die in and then save the next time I run through.

I don't think there is dishonorable savescumming in this game, if it lets you save at any time then it's always fair.

[Anonymous No.10167351]

I save often, but I'll also reload again and again until I'm happy with how I've done in a section.

Unrelated, but I have severe OCD

[Anonymous No.10169705]

If a game has autosave, I respect that. Unless it's a rocket/grenade jump.
If there is no autosave, I save after I pick up a key.

[Anonymous No.10169714]

>>10155439
I always do ultra violence and save at the beginning of the level. So if I die I gotta do the level again but I get to keep my weapons. It can be annoying though if you die because of some bullshit right at the end.

[Anonymous No.10172091]

why are you worrying about save scumming when you're playing babby shit like btsx with texture smoothing on

[Anonymous No.10172454]

I think Doom is good. Saving is ok, it's just how the game is.
Eventually every player saves less and less as they get better. Eventually they challenge themselves more. Many turn into pistol start folk. Some of those decry saving, but really, no-save or low-saving is a state you grow into.