4 vs 6 button

[Anonymous No.10144027]

No arcade stick discussion; I'm talking about a controller in your palms.

When is scooting your thumb two buttons across more convenient than pressing a trigger/bumper you're already holding onto?

[Anonymous No.10144086]

>>10144027
It's only Bill Gates' xinput that has forced the 'ether/or' dichotomy we are discussing. Why not have more use out of the controller? It's surely an obvious answer? And for those who want to keep it more simple, use a NES pad. Games can be afforded more innovation with more buttons. And this doesn't necessarily have to be at the expense of ergonomics or simple controls.

[Anonymous No.10144121]

>>10144086
>Why not have more use out of the controller?
Okay but you can extract more use from your other fingers. Plenty of controllers now even have ring and pinky buttons

[Anonymous No.10144132]

>>10144086
When has there ever been needs for more buttons?
Even in PC games, none needs more than 10-14 buttons at a time, and that's a device with 104 buttons.

[Anonymous No.10144143]

>>10144027
just take the dualsense pill. use two fingers on shoulder/trigger and you have easy access to much more buttons.

[Anonymous No.10144158]

>>10144027
Why is it an OR sitation for you? Why not both? Never understood this reason of thinking.

>>10144132
PC games have to be controller friendly too, thus 'limiting' the control scheme.
However shortcuts for weapons/skills is a big one for more buttons.

[Anonymous No.10144162]

>>10144158
Go play Starcraft 2 and tell me how many of the 104 buttons you used in a game. And that's a PC only game.

[Anonymous No.10144170]

>>10144143
Because the DS4 works fine for the majority of games I play. Maybe I'll switch if they ever do an anniversary version

[Anonymous No.10144176]

Fighting game players could probably make good use of a controller with three shoulders on the right. Maybe even four.

[Anonymous No.10144215]

>>10144027

[Anonymous No.10144246]

>>10144176

[Anonymous No.10144259]

>>10144162
Discussion is about adding 2 buttons to a controller, counter argument:
>Name me one PC game that uses all 104 keyboard buttons

[Anonymous No.10144261]

>>10144121
Designs like those also make controllers increasingly more complex to use properly. Forcing more fingers to be used adds complexity without (much) added value.

[Anonymous No.10144286]

>>10144027
six is only useful for stinky nonces who play fighters

[Anonymous No.10144290]

>>10144170
you can't go wrong with either, they are very similar.

[Anonymous No.10144291]

>>10144246
Would have been neat to play ffxi with this and have easy controller macros.

[Anonymous No.10144294]

>>10144259
My point is that the amount of buttons currently on controllers is more than enough. Even a gaming device with no lack of buttons struggles to use more buttons than a controller already has.
Typer Shark Deluxe

[Anonymous No.10144304]

>>10144294
Games evolve with the number of buttons available, look at e.g. Zelda from the nes with its 2 action buttons all the way to botw where even the l3 and r3 have unique functionality assigned to them.

The n64 was effectively a 6 button controller and OOT was still starved for more button inputs, they could not even afford to have a dedicated jump button any longer.

[Anonymous No.10144343]

>>10144259
some roguelikes use every letter key twice or more, and it's easy to run out of inputs playing sims

[Anonymous No.10144382]

>>10144286
Who you calling stinky, son?
We can't all smell like Japanese women..

[Anonymous No.10144495]

>>10144286
>>10144294
Literally ANY action game would benefit from 2 more buttons. They have to be standard on the console though or else they just end up being redundant buttons.

Kingdom hearts, metal gear solid 5, Devil may cry 5. Those are all great examples of games where you can do so much shit, 2 more buttons would have been great.

[Anonymous No.10144523]

>>10144162
>sc2
Fuck that casualized trash, in broodwar if you aren't using at least 20 buttons then you are D rank. Don't even get me started on MMOs or old school SIM games.

[Anonymous No.10144638]

>>10144523
Starcraft 1 is console casual trash. Literally on the nintendo 64. Don't need more than 5 buttons.

[Anonymous No.10144675]

>>10144286
How is it even useful though?

[Anonymous No.10144747]

>>10144261
Nah. Get good you fucking faggot.

[Anonymous No.10144983]

>>10144261
>without (much) added value.
???

[Anonymous No.10145067]

>>10144027
This feels like a trick question, anyway my favorite configuration is probably the 3-button as seen in Genesis and 3DO. The TurboGrafx 2-button is nice for shmups as well.

[Anonymous No.10145078]

>>10144747
>Noooo why take the elegant solution when we can also do it the hard way.
Fucking retard, sounds like these faggots that defend tank controls in shit like megaman legends

[Anonymous No.10145102]

>>10145078
Yeah you're a fucking scrub.
Also, mml only has tank controls if you pick control type B. Idiot

>less options is elegant!
Shut the fuck up. 2 extra buttons is not too complicated. Every action game would benefit from 2 more buttons.

[Anonymous No.10145406]

>>10144027
i just got a saturn controller and can't get used to it. it feels too small ad the LR placement feels off as do the extra 2 buttons

[Anonymous No.10145425]

Most genres have consolidated functionality into so few buttons, the only ones that use all the buttons on the controller anymore are fighters (arcade holdover) and autistic shit by people like kojima. the vast majority of video games have a couple spare buttons.

[Anonymous No.10145447]

>>10144027
The thumb is controlled by a bigger part of the brain, other fingers have a super simplified control scheme

[Anonymous No.10145457]

>>10145102
>less options is elegant!
That was about adding 2 face buttons vs extra triggers what the other guy was hinting at.
Same numer of buttons added, just a different location.

[Anonymous No.10145468]

>>10144027
I've never played a Saturn, but something about that controller looks extremely comfy. It's been a long time since I've held a Genesis controller, but I remember it being a bit bulky. I was a child, after all. That one looks nice in comparison.

[Anonymous No.10145507]

>>10144027
four buttons + triggers is obviously better for ergonomics, but the 6 button genesis controller is pure soul anyways

[Anonymous No.10145794]

>>10145507
lmao using L1 and R1 is way less ergonomic than hitting an extra button next to the others.

[Anonymous No.10145803]

>>10145794
Scooting your thumb from A to C is less ergonomic than pressing the shoulder button your other fingers are already hugging

[Anonymous No.10145807]

>>10145803
it has never been comfortable to rest your fingers on the shoulder buttons on a PS1 controller.

[Anonymous No.10145846]

>>10145807
Skill issue, plus dualshock isn't the only 4 button controller in existence
In any case, we have ring and pinky buttons now; what makes 6 face buttons superior to these?

[Anonymous No.10146005]

For the most part I prefer to use shoulders over 2 extra face buttons. Ideally I'd want both though, I'm still pissed off at retrobit for ruining the opportunity to make what would have been many people's perfect controller (6 buttons plus triggers, plus Saturn's dpad) by going for shitty joycon-style sticks.

[Anonymous No.10146024]

>>10146005
Prototype for comparison. Much better imo.

[Anonymous No.10146581]

any good 8-way pad controllers with 4button, preferably wireless? ds4 is still the god controller imo but want to see if a sega-style pad makes super metroid speedrunning any better

[Anonymous No.10146617]

>>10146581
Ironically Logitech F710. Yeah it's memed to death, but it is what it is, 8-way dpad 4 buttons wireless.

[Anonymous No.10146629]

>>10146617
wow I’m an idiot, I only knew about the f310 and didn’t know there was a wireless version – thanks anon

good thing it’s affordable enough to just give it a try, but fuck is it ugly

[Anonymous No.10146659]

>>10144027
how smol are your hands opie?
the distance between the A and Z buttons on a saturn/genny controller isnt that much more than the B and X buttons on a SNES controller. plus, the genny controller was designed in a way that made it very comfortable to lay you thumb mostly parallel to the rows of buttons, such that i could easily press C with the joint of my thumb, then quickly press either B or A with the tip/meat of my thumb while hardly moving my grip at all

as for
>why?
simple
fighting games
it was the arcade standard for FG controls, and using shoulder buttons for fierce attacks always sucked ass

[Anonymous No.10146695]

>>10146659
to add to this, some of my friends who were more into MK and SF used to hold the controller where their right hand was "upside-down" so they could use their pointer/middle/ring to always be covering A/B/C. similar to how you would play on an actual arcade cab. very very fast, and you simply cant do that if you need to use shoulder buttons

[Anonymous No.10146723]

>>10145807
it wasnt as bad before the analog sticks on the DS controllers imo
having to keep your thumbs on the sticks, with two fingers for each trigger was always a pain in the hand. usually id just use my pointer fingers for both R1/R2/L1/L2 respectively while keeping my middle fingers under the controller for support. but then that kinda fucks up the whole point of having two triggers

doesnt help that the controllers themselves are made for nip hands

[Anonymous No.10147406]

>>10146695
Were you friends trolling you or were they really retarded tryhards?

[Anonymous No.10147452]

>>10144523
MMO controls might benefit from 54 button inputs.

[Anonymous No.10147465]

>>10145406
Try the Bomberman one. Equal button size and really comfy shoulders.

[Anonymous No.10147560]

I think most Saturn games don't even use all 6 buttons. I would rather have the 6 nutton controller be an optional secondary controller that player 2 can also be forced to use

[Anonymous No.10148448]

>>10146024
this one is really good 6 face buttons + 4 triggers should be a standard.

[Anonymous No.10148517]

>>10144027
Never, because you're not supposed to use the right hand thumb on a 6 button controller.

[Anonymous No.10148525]

>>10147465
Get the 3D pad instead.

[Anonymous No.10148532]

>>10147406
>retarded tryhards
i mean i did say they were really into fighting games, no?

[Anonymous No.10150018]

>>10148532
>no?
No
You said they were into console versions of MK and SF. That would mean not really into fighting games at all.
But they still could have been trolling you. I do it all the time. When talking with some quite the retro gamers I love saying shit like "the snesz version of street fighter 2 is the best version of the game evar". Then watch as the NPCs all circle jerk in agreement. Then tell them I was just fucking with them and they say they were only pretending to be retarded. It's like /vr/ irl.

[Anonymous No.10150024]

>>10144027
I honestly prefer the 3d controller

[Anonymous No.10151569]

no wait
okay...
how about... 8 face buttons

[Anonymous No.10151594]

>>10144638
In anons defense, SC1 on the N64 was a miserable experience and essentially a meme. The proper way to play is obviously on PC with mkb.

[Anonymous No.10151950]

>>10145468
It feels quite nice in the hand. Better than the genesis 3 or 6 button version imo.
But the buttons being different sizes makes me rage so hard. I hate it.

[Anonymous No.10152142]

Hold my beer.

[Anonymous No.10152184]

I didn't realize until I got a genesis style controller for PC that the ABXY buttons match the xbox layout.

[Anonymous No.10153607]

>>10152184
The duke technically had the C and Z buttons too

[Anonymous No.10153619]

>>10144170
Damn I didnt know they made these in OG color.

[Anonymous No.10153632]

>>10145406
Get the Big 6 instead. Was originally going to recommend the Model 1 Saturn controller but then remember these exist

[Anonymous No.10153646]

>>10153632
The USB Big 6 has L and R buttons too

[Anonymous No.10153981]

>>10153632
>>10153646
I was going to buy the Genesis 6 button controller but so many people memed te saturn as the best 2d controller ever and an evolution of the genesis one that I decided to go for it but now I regret it.

[Anonymous No.10155724]

>>10144027
I like the idea behind 6 button controllers. They obviously lead to more options for controls in gaming. They don't even have to do it like Sega controllers either since Xbox OG had six buttons with two of them being small black/white buttons.

[Anonymous No.10155912]

Why even have all those buttons
Genesis needed it for 6 button fighters and more complex games
Saturn had 3D without camera analog
N64 had no camera analog
What game have you ever played that needed more than the standard 4 once the 2nd analog stick became the rule?
It's just more confortable, less cramped, easier to locate by touch, easier to accomodate the analog stick on a confortable position

[Anonymous No.10156564]

>>10155724
>They obviously lead to more options for controls in gaming
How to additional face buttons give you more options than additional shoulder buttons?

[Anonymous No.10158113]

>>10144027
>>10144143
A DS controller with 6 face buttons but only triggers (no shoulder R1/L1) would be ideal for me. This would be similar to the Saturn one, but with analog sticks.
I should probably look into >>10146005

[Anonymous No.10159652]

>>10146024
If you like smashing your thumbs into each other, yeah.

[Anonymous No.10159915]

>>10159652
I never have my thumb hang past the end of the sticks so it'd be physically impossible for my thumbs to touch even when both sticks are facing together. I'm hoping 8bitdo will notice people's complaints about the tiny joycon sticks and release their own with proper sticks (picrel was just an April fools joke).

[Anonymous No.10160036]

>>10146024
This basically looks like if Sega and Sony decided to do a merger back before the start of the 5th gen to take on Nintendo. Imagine how different things would have been today had Sega decided to take Sony up on the partnership after Nintendo screwed Sony.

[Anonymous No.10160128]

>>10156564
Theoretically they would if they existed today assuming a controller also has four buttons. I guess I should have specified that. As for games back then though I can think of fighting games being better if you play with the Saturn controller vs say PS1 or N64. I could also imagine some more action heavy 2D games might be improved with such a controller.

If you ask me I think MS should have brought back the black/white buttons by now in addition to having the four face buttons, triggers and bumper buttons. Some games have to use dpad for hotkeys and there is plenty of games now where your character has all these powers and it would benefit from more buttons to actually use them. Imagine Devil May Cry for example it could be improved with how many buttons it uses during gameplay.

[Anonymous No.10160135]

>>10160128
>I can think of fighting games being better if you play with the Saturn controller
Why though? Why is scooting your thumb from A to C more convenient than pressing L2, which your middle finger is already hugging?

[Anonymous No.10160160]

>>10144027
i love the 6-button layout because i can both play the "regular" way with my thumbs and if the game requires fast or multiple inputs i can turn my right hand around and play with three fingers on the face buttons like an arcade stick

[Anonymous No.10160268]

>>10160135
The way I used to play fighting games with a pad isn't with thumb over all the face buttons I'd play with my fingers over the buttons. So some might say why not just use a fight stick? To that I say I prefer the dpad movement and smaller controller size compared to the stick. So Saturn's pad really gave imo one of the best controller setups for the genre. There is a reason why we see fight pads in this style with some even being very close to the Saturn in shape.

[Anonymous No.10161112]

>>10160036
I would have liked to have seen that outcome. As a Euro (Brit) I'm particularly curious because over here it was Sega that was top dog for consoles in gen 3 and 4, and in gen 5 when Saturn flopped it was Sony that most moved to, not Nintendo. If Sega had partnered with Sony to make something instead of the Saturn then it would have made a killing here. But instead most Euros if you asked them would probably tell you they weren't even aware of the Saturn because it did so poorly.

If you want to see a real-world example of controllers made in a Sega-Sony partnership though, picrel is a real thing made for the PS2. It's bizarre seeing the PlayStation logo on a Saturn controller (also the embossed labels above the buttons to show what they map to on the PS2 is a nice touch)

[Anonymous No.10161124]

Sega saturn controller is the best controller ever made

[Anonymous No.10161142]

>>10161112
They also made a wireless dual analog controller, picrel. Its overall shape and d-pad look like a strange hybrid between a Saturn and PS2 but sadly they didn't go for a 6-button layout.