/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9938068
Doom is very limited in what kinds of hidden things are really possible in it, so level makers have to go out of their way to come up with means of obscuring things. This general problem applies to a lot of things in the game, like enemies, where the game's primitiveness forces the onus onto the designer to make up for its limitations.

>>9938128
The enemy roster of doom is probably the most robust in any FPS game. Instead of being a limitation, it offers countless possibilities.

>>9938131
This. Non-game designers (or shitty game designers) won't understand. Doom achieves immense gameplay success by focusing a limited but diverse collection of enemies each of which require different techniques to defeat optimally, and still different techniques to defeat when they occur in combination with other enemies.

>>9938142
Indeed. A Cacodemon alone poses little challenge unless in a cramped space with limited arsenal. Combine it with a soldier from a side door and that's another matter entirely. Enemy infighting elevates this further.

>>9938068
The only difficult doom was the 2nd about over halfway through because of the mazes. You can save though so not that bad compared to nes games

Why don't modern games have secrets anymore?

>>9938128
>>9938131
>>9938142
>>9938249
This is a literal circlejerk. Fuck off to your containment general, doomcucks.

>>9938068
Some of the secrets in this game piss me off, although I like the idea. The "door is open at start of level and closes 30 seconds afterward" is not a satisfying secret. You'd only have a chance at finding it if you were speedrunning the map and happened to be in the right place at the right time, and even then you might think that you had taken some path or activated some sector that you didn't normally cross.
Other than those, the secrets are usually quite satisfying to find. Finding entire hidden levels is awesome.

>>9940421
The tutorial would heave to show you how to find them all, then they would no longer be secrets

>>9940457
I specifically criticized the game and called it limited and primitive, because it is. Actually read shit for once.

>>9940513
it wouldnt HAVE to do that, surely. Zoomers must be capable of some insight too

>>9940421
Because modern games want to appeal to as many people as possible. They do this by designing the games as if only idiots will play them.

>>9940421
Because modern players

>How were you supposed to know?!
>What ?! This secret is HIDDEN and I didn't find it? UNACCEPTABLE I AM ENTITLED TO SEE ALL THE CONTENT NEGATIVE REVIEW ON STEAMWKWNX

>>9940421
I guess modern AAA are seen by the devs as more serious experiences where nothing should distract the player from the action and their current main goal.

I miss secrets and easter eggs or those entire secret levels.
That's what I like most about recent boomer shooters.

>>9940421
this tbqh >>9941093

>>9940421
"muh story telling"

>walk ten feet
>press x
>cinematic
>walk another ten feet. See rope
>press y
>scripted even
>press YXY!
>in-game cinematic bla bla bla yada yada yada
>follow a path for 5 minutes
>press
>in-game scipted event
>etc
>etc

Modern gaming just sucks. I bought a PS5 a few months ago, played for 3 weeks, then sold it again. Went back to my PS3 and retro pc box. Literally dont need more at this point.

>>9942239
I'm in the same boat, only I didn't even try ps5.
I do have a switch, tho.

>>9940421
They still do, but what modern games don't have are whole-ass secret levels. That's something I don't really ever see brought up.

>>9940421
They do. With such an ignorance, you guys think you're better than zoomies?

>>9940421
I don't play modern games, but didn't the new Doom have little hidden dolls that gave points for unlockables / upgrades or something like that? Seems like the very obvious counterexample, given the OP image.

>>9942275
Why would they give you something for free, when they could sell it to you as DLC.

>>9942275
Interesting how we lost secret locations but gained a ton of optional locations in every game. But secret ones are clearly better, the mystery of it, the almost non-canon nature of it, it can contain anything at all. Whereas an optional non-secret area is probably just more of the same, no accomplishment in discovering it, no thrill in going into it. Secret just became optional to appeal to normies.

>>9940421
you just don’t know about them because they’re… SECRET

>>9941019
>Zoomers must be capable of some insight too
Have you ever talked to one?

>>9940421
They do

>>9940421
Why bother putting in secrets when someone will just datamine or autistically comb the game then post a 30 second video online that exposes them all? Assuming the target audience even cared to begin with. Modern games based around exploring still have them, the last Red Dead game had a ton but that's an exception.

>>9940421
Because Gabe Newell said they were bad

>>9941093
That's bullshit excuse AAA use to braindedify their games and reach that additional 1% who gets pissed because they can't find a secret.

>>9942828
Who cares, secrets and cheats were always widely available via magazines. Maybe not as widely as they are with the internet but they certainly weren't all that secret. Shouldn't really bother you as a dev