/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9880554
What was it about Silent Hill 2 that made it feel more artistically impressive than SH1 and SH3? Silent Hill 2 really does feel otherworldly at times.

>>9880562
Far more personal/intimate, raw story. No cliche horror cults or summoning doomsday.

>>9880562
Because it ripped off movies more overtly, especially Lynch. It's really good but story wise it's hardly original.

>>9880562
The game is really well designed. There are tons of subtle little things that tie into the story, like a mannequin in the game wearing Mary's dress. I think most players don't notice this stuff on a first playthrough but it still leaves an impression, like when you feel like something's off but you can't quite put your finger on it.

>>9880581
I'd argue it's not a very good game either, really. It's a worthwhile experience but gameplay is just running from place to place solving simple puzzles. It's not bad but it's not special and really short if you know what you're doing. Level design, like the apartments, can be satisfying to navigate. The sound and visual design are excellent, stars of the show. The story definitely takes pages from Lynch but is also nowhere nearly as good as Lynch. Nowhere near as poignant as something like Blue Velvet.
I don't really get why it's so revered and I've kind of been fascinated with it because of that.

>>9880602
we get it you're so fucking learned and unique, whats your next trick? how it makes no sense to like OoT or FF7? that WoW is derivative? Tell me what to look forward to in your next youtube essay

>>9880602
>gameplay is just running from place to place solving simple puzzles
To be fair that's every SH game.

I do agree that SH2 is pretty short but I don't think that's a bad thing. I think the game would never have been as good if it was made to be longer. It's short but well paced, feels like the depression tension never lets up.

>>9880602
>I don't really get why it's so revered
Gamers are by and large media illiterate and this goofy horror game was likely the first time they'd been exposed to a story like that.

>>9880602
Because it has a transformative quality that can only possibly be done by a videogame. No amount of storytelling can come even come close to pulling the reader/player to insert themselves as a character. And I don't just mean narrative """"choices""", because those are cheap and arbitrary.
Things that are more nebulous and exclusive to the realm of ludo like you physically having to press buttons and see the character commit to those actions, even if said actions are predetermined add a layer of agency that passive mediums can never get, and it *can* be used to enhance the tone or message of a videogame. And I don't mean in game cutscenes with press X to smother your wife. Silent Hill does a decent job of allowing you to make organic, mechanics based decisions that will affect the end result of your run through.

It's also why games like Metal Gear Solid 2 work so fucking well and why that game has never been topped. Not because it's a flawless masterclass in game design, but because to this day it has told a story in a way *only* a videogame could have told. It doesn't fucking matter how many books touched the same themes before, and how much more in depth and articulate they are, they're fucking books. You can't truly get the sense of being bamboozled and played unless you were actually *playing*. That in itself, to me at least was much more effective and impactful than a movie or a book that had better, more concise writing.

>>9880683
Very interesting take, anon. I agree that games really allow you to insert yourself into another world, something I find really cool about vidya in general. I think it's one of the reasons why the first Silent Hill game is so good because of Harry Mason. He's just a guy who wants to protect the people he cares about, something everyone can relate to.

>>9880698
I agree anon. I protected the fuck out of the people. I do have strong opinions on videogame narratives but at the end of the day they're optional and games like MGS2, which is my all time favorite, should remain a novelty and an exception.

>>9880712
That screen is damn impressive. You only saved twice? Holy shit.
I wish more games did good narratives. I really enjoy a good narrative.

>>9880716
Yeah, to get a 10 star ranking you can only save twice. That's not the worst part, 1h30m was the time limit and I cut it really close.
The window of time where good narratives could be written without compromises or censorship is long gone, anon. The last game with truly solid writing I can think of is probably New Vegas. The future is bleak, you should explore /vr/ stories you haven't played through yet.

>>9880728
>The window of time where good narratives could be written without compromises or censorship is long gone
Sad but true. I believe some indie devs or small studios could still push out a good, unfiltered narrative if they tried but a big studio game with unfiltered narrative is a distant dream by now.

>>9880683
>Metal Gear Solid 2
Are you talking about the feeling of emasculation?
I don't see how the story of MGS2 couldn't have just been a movie (a sequel).
But if you mean that playing as Raiden gave a heightened sense of emasculation that watching him on the big screen wouldn't - I agree.

>>9880728
>>9880756
>The window of time where good narratives could be written without compromises or censorship is long gone
lmao. This board feels like a parody sometimes.

>>9880554
I put the new forgis on the jeep
I drive until my dead wife is underneath

>>9880828
this is the hardest I've ever laughed at a post on this board

>>9880562
Purity in every pursuit they took

>>9880619
Positively seething
>>9880683
>it's good because it's a video game

>>9880562
>>9880564
I don't like how praise for 2 has to come at the expense of 1 and 3.

>>9880806
>>9880821
>>9881217
You just know this is the same guy. And I'm also talking about videogame narratives specifically, I don't mean in general.
>it's good because it's a book
>me read book me smart
>heheh I'll repeatedly point how illiterate everyone is while asking /lit/ what to read and how to feel about books
Lol, lmao.

>>9881551
When there's nothing to praise you shit on everything else

>>9881557
Not involved in your /lit/ fight.
First post is a genuine question about what makes MGS2's story not possible in another medium.
Second is calling out "new bad, old good" rhetoric.

>>9880602
> but gameplay is just running from place to place solving simple puzzles
I actually enjoy this kind of gameplay. Silent Hill is more about simple exploration and atmosphere, sort of like Zelda in a sense. Maybe it's not true survival horror gameplay but it just works for me. For example, even though I'm a fan of Resident Evil, those games tend to be too tense with their resource management and tough enemies which actually discourages me from running around and exploring. REmake in particular with its crimson heads makes my butt clench throughout the whole experience. Also the reason why SH4 is my least favorite, I believe most Resi fans prefer it to SH1-3 though

>>9881636
If you have to ask why MGS2 wouldn't work as anything other than a game you either haven't played it or aren't as smart as you think you are. I don't know who you're trying to fool if you think a videogame story can be anything it wants to be in the current year, if you're a failing indie dev I can just pity you for your naivety. If you enjoy contemporary slop then kindly fuck off to /v/, where do you think you are?

>this shit going on again
If you want to start a Silent Hill thread DO NOT mention SH2 in OP, this should be the golden rule of SH threads on /vr/

>>9881660
this is why we can't have nice things

>>9881652
>A non-answer regarding mgs2
typical
>this level of seething and projecting over the thriving indie scene
hysterical

>>9881652
>I don't know who you're trying to fool if you think a videogame story can be anything it wants to be in the current year
Way to completely dodge the question.

>>9880602
That's the same gameplay of all the other classic Silent Hill, I always ignore the monsters and run past them when possible honestly, no need to fight them

>>9880756
nice lips

Did she died?

>>9882507
Depends on which ending you got.

>>9882507
In Homecoming that black police guy says that she disappeared and only her bike was found or something like that but to me Good+ is the canon ending

>>9880602
>Ackshully
Fuck off

>>9882013
I hate knowing they're out there so I try to kill them all.

>>9880828
fucking kek

I see people calling out SH2 as unoriginal or bad to be contrarians and I cringe. It's the kind of people that says James was some kind of sex pervert without playing the game and reading up on external material to know what they're talking about.

This game has some of the most brilliantly symbolic experiences in gaming. The references to mesoamerican religions in the form of the tablets in the prison, alchemy and even the parallel it makes between the main characters and Grimm's fairy tales is just the surface of what these people missed because they played this game like RE, instead of actually absorbing and researching every nook and cranny.

I don't like to use the pretentious "you don't like it cause you didn't get it" argument but if you didn't like SH2 for these stupid reasons then you didn't get it. It's leagues above the works that inspired it, handling topics such as spousal verbal abuse, and a lot more horrific, real dark sides of the human experience with profound understanding and maturity. Srsly stop trying to be different.

>>9880581
This. Didn't circulate around muh "The Order". More about a personal story built on top of bits and pieces of the SH lore. Also, was the first of it's kind for next gen SH and various other reasons. SH3 was still good but it goes back to the cult shit which is inherently less mysterious if you played the first game.

>>9880562
You were influenced by Yahtzee.

>>9880581
>it's hardly original
Nothing is original in an age of mass media consumption.