/vr/ - Retro Games

Capcom are their worst enemies.
>made Mega Man 2/3 and X
>let the series go to complete and utter shit until 9
>get a huge hit with Street Fighter 2
>waste it all with SF3 and EX
>get a huge hit with Final Fight
>waste it all on mediocre sequels
>make a fuckload of great arcade beat em ups in the 90s
>never port them anywhere
>be the king of arcades in the early 90s
>fuck it all up with CPS-3 while staying 2D meme till the end, while Namco made their name on 3D
>get a huge hit with RE1-3
>couldn't get their shit together in 6th gen until RE4
>start an IP with Dino Crisis
>let it go waste
>score a lot of hits with Onimusha
>the series is dead and gathers dust
it's a miracle those retards still have a company, and you want them to make their own console?

Capcom are their own worst enemies.
>made Mega Man 2/3 and X
>let the series go to complete and utter shit until 9
>get a huge hit with Street Fighter 2
>waste it all with SF3 and EX
>get a huge hit with Final Fight
>waste it all on mediocre sequels
>make a fuckload of great arcade beat em ups in the 90s
>never port them anywhere
>be the king of arcades in the early 90s
>fuck it all up with CPS-3 while staying 2D meme till the end, while Namco made their name on 3D
>get a huge hit with RE1-3
>couldn't get their shit together in 6th gen until RE4
>start an IP with Dino Crisis
>let it go waste
>score a lot of hits with Onimusha
>the series is dead and gathers dust
it's a miracle those retards still have a company, and you want them to make their own console?

>>9862618
What the fuck... I was just thinking about it yesterday while replaying RE1, some paranormal shit right here, OP. But yeah, Capcom's own consoles would be absolutely on par with the best Nintendo consoles after the SNES

Would you have preferred 3 consoles each generation with 700 games or 8 consoles each with under 100 games?

>>9862668
Konami & Namco would have filled in the gaps

>>9862618
Haha nope. Capcom's good, but they're no system seller.

>>9862618
It would've literally just been the Neo Geo, in fact they kind of tried this with the CPS Changer. Remember Capcom is an arcade company like Namco and SNK. Mega Man is just their "secondary" mascot to Street Fighter, Final Fight, MvC, etc. We can still see the effects of this today

>>9862618
They had their own arcade systems, and that was more than good enough throughout the 90s. It was a better idea to forgo becoming yet another console competitor (and risking a 1983 crash scenario), in favor of working with the biggest console manufacturers.

>>9862734
>Remember Capcom is an arcade company like Namco and SNK
And Sega, but here we go.

>>9862743
That's ironically part of why they ended up third-party, but it's not really worth getting into

>>9862734
MegaMan was their CONSOLE mascot. They were absolutely an arcade company first and foremost. The mid-2000s were a testament to how lost they were without the support of the arcades.

Capcom can't make hardware. They'd have to collaborate with an actual hardware manufacturer.
At that point, you'd be splitting your revenue 50/50 at best as opposed to your usual 70/30 on other consoles. And that's ignoring the part where a CapcomStation would be a huge failure almost guaranteed

>>9862656
>miracle those retards still have a company
First off, Capcom carried the Dreamcast with all their might. Without Capcom the Dreamcast would have fell WAY harder than anticipated.
Second…
>Power Stone 1&2 was almost as good Super Smash Bros.
>RPG: Monster Hunter
>Side Scrolling: Mega Man
>Fighting: Street Fighter
>Capom gave Nintendo Zelda Minish Cap, Oracle of Seasons & Ages
Not to mention their Shoot ‘Em Up line ups
Capcom could’ve clearly hold their own weight bro. Stop acting otherwise
>Devil May Cry
>Viewtiful Joe
The list goes on faggot.

>>9863876
>Power Strone
lel
>Monster Hunter
only one that you have a point on
>Mega Man
lel
>Street Fighter
rip Street Fighter if it's on an exclusive machine that no one wants. It's not like Street Fighter hasn't been ignored before. SF6 will be middling probably
>Devil May Cry
boomer franchise. It's not relevant anymore
>Viewtiful Joe
come on now

>>9863876
>Power Stone 1&2 was almost as good Super Smash Bros.

In fact many late 90s early 00s games were copying Power Stone more than Smashbros then anything, transformers transmetals, that one PPG game on n64 and ps1, those two tom and jerry games, the grim adventures of billy and mandy, yeah most of em were kiddy license crap, there's also that one weird xbox game with crud artsyle Kung Fu Chaos
, oh and one Spawn game made by capcom themselves probably with the same engine, even those two One Piece arena fighters were kinda trying to fit that mold.

Smash clones would not began until the likes of Battle Stadium D.O.N and that Konami/Hudson/Takara Gamecube game with Iga/Ayami Kojima Simon, Bomberman, Master higgins, that japanese barbie competitor Licca chan and Optimus and Megatron, those are specifically 2D.

>>9862618
I recall there was some brief talk in the era between ps1 and ps2 for 4 big game companies including Capcom and Konami to pool their money and make a console with their exclusives but it didn't go through.

>>9862618
MegamanX capsule technology were based on rush compatibility with megaman, that's why they only react to X and wait for him in every game.

>>9862656
>until 9
Mega Man 9 was shit. It pandered to the most cancerous part of the fanbase. Only good part about it was the cool and creative boss weapons. Everything else about it was intentionally uncreative, which is gay and pandering.

>>9863876
>Capcom carried the Dreamcast with all their might. Without Capcom the Dreamcast would have fell WAY harder than anticipated.
Not just the Dreamcast but the Saturn. Without Capcom it would've been almost useless

>>9862618
Controversial opinion perhaps, but Mega Man never had what it took to compete on Mario's level, which Sonic did. Mega Man games were just too jank to be that big of a hit with normies.

>>9864594
Not jank imo, but significantly more difficult until the X Series and 7.

>>9862656
>>9862656
how did Mega Man X fall off so hard after the first one? I'm played X2 for the first time and it feels like powerups, music, and level design all got worse, on top of tanks/capsules being far more cryptic compared to the first game.

>>9864601
X3 I could understand, X2 didn't really fall off until the Sigma stages.
Admittedly the weapons need buster parts before they're worth shit, but they do have the benefit of being unique.

>>9863876
>First off, Capcom carried the Dreamcast with all their might.
you mean "made some games for a failed console that lasted 2 years"? the only really big hit Capcom made for it was RE Code Veronica. all the fighting game ports were thanks to DC being virtually identical to Naomi arcade platform. and all those 2D fighters never sold much regardless.
Capcom loves to support failing consoles it seems, they also "carried the Gamecube with all their might", releasing a bunch of flopped games and RE remakes for it. then also put RE4 on it to make it sell less (because they hate making money, apparently).
>other games
Capcom lives off success of Monster Hunter. DMC was also successful, they tried to fuck it up still.
the rest that you named hardly was successful ever. Viewtiful Joe flopped and is remembered only by 2000s kids. Mega Man went to shit, got revived by EXE series in Japan, then went to shit again, then got a bit of a boost with 9 & 10, now it's back to being irrelevant—MMX is a mobile game now, MMZX series is dead. Street Fighter was in coma after SFA3 & 3rd Strike, until 4, then 5 came and underperformed hard. bunch of small games they made for Nintendo don't change much.
oh yeah, btw, I almost forgot: they also managed to kill Marvel VS Capcom, AT THE HEIGHT OF MCU POPULARITY (!). let this sink in. with Marvel 2 & 3 being iconic FGC games, they managed to fuck up so badly it was abandoned by most players.

>>9864585
you do realize only a minority of people cared about 2D fighter at that point, right?

>>9864601
MMX1-4 are good. MMX1 and 4 are great, rest is ok-ish. I mostly meant the death spiral of 5-8

>>9864745
Right, but the Saturn was basically made for these kinds of games, and Capcom was one of the few developers that made extensive use of the 4MB RAM cart. Was pretty much the reason to own a Saturn beyond Virtua Fighter 2 and other first-party games. I'm not even a huge Saturn apologist but I'll admit most Capcom games are better on it

>>9863937
The capcom spawn game didn't play like powerstone, it played like an improved version of another capcom dreamcast/naomi game based on heavy metal.
>>9864742
We're getting into /v/ territory but I think the marvel vs capcom fumble was from outside pressure from license holders to shove in characters that are tied to current cinematic IPs instead of old series mainstays, which I don't think is completely capcom's fault.

>>9862618
>Dude, I just realised that if Capcom spent millions of dollars releasing something nobody asked for, it'd be successful because I said so!

>>9864941
>Right, but the Saturn was basically made for these kinds of games
that being the reason why it failed so hard.
memes aside though, the question isn't that Capcom made some contribution to a consoles' library. it certainly did. the question is, did it make the console much more successful? in my opinion, not really.
you do have SOME point because SF Alpha 1 and 2 were relatively popular on Saturn in Japan. but being one of the top games on Saturn mattered very little, because it had few good games to begin with. selling 400k copies in a given region was outstanding for a Saturn game, but it was only "ok" for a PSX game.
and in the West, 2D fighters like SF quickly became a niche right after SNES. people hardly cared about them in general after Tekken 2. would they sell a console? no, but certainly they'd add to a library of good games.

>>9865158
>the marvel vs capcom fumble was from outside pressure from license holders to shove in characters that are tied to current cinematic IPs
that was the tip of the iceberg. the marketing, the graphics, story chars being DLC, stupid Battle fo the Stones, disappointing roster BESIDE Marvel characters, lack of assists and switch to 2x2 were all bad.

>>9862656
>>fuck it all up with CPS-3 while staying 2D meme till the end, while Namco made their name on 3D
They did have ZN-1/ZN-2, but that was OEM PS1 hardware.

>>9862618
To varying degrees of success Capcom, Konami, SNK, Sega, and EA did have their own base console. For Capcom, look up the CPS Changer, which was a pretty cool system with even its own exclusive but sadly it was hampered by being mail order only. Similar to Konami, I think Capcom tries with ports to all sorts of platforms like Japanese computers, as with Konami to the MSX there's Capcom on Sharp's X68000. There's even ports to DOS and Windows machines Capcom had trusted other development teams, and they also explored licensing out for Sega/NEC to "reprogram" for themselves like Ghouls n' Ghosts/Strider for the Genesis and PC-Engine. If anything, Capcom and Sega at one time made beautiful music together once Capcom was freed from Nintendo contracts. Capcom just embraces the 3rd party strategy for their success, maybe by just being exposed everywhere.

>>9868084
buy a new marker.

>>9864106
>Mega Man 9 was shit + intentionally uncreative
I marathoned the back end of the classic series a few months ago, and 9 was easily the one that felt the most fresh and memorable. There's a lot of strange shit in there that just sticks with you.
>floor breaking shot guys
>round uncurling ropes that retract
>flying welding masks
>retracting totems
>freezable magma beams
>balloon people that go out of control if you pop them
>rotating battery platforms
>shadow clones
>jumpy ceiling spiders
>spike room swings
>two way portal puzzles
>helicopter claws
>the pass-through lego blocks
>pot squids that ink you
>the draining water platform rooms
>illusion projectors
>anti-gravity rooms where you move by shooting

>>9862656
>let the series go to complete and utter shit until 9
Clearly you haven't actually played the games after 3.

>>9869806
I meant financially, mostly. Few cared about 7, 8 & Forte, though those games were actually good. MMX5 to 7 on the other hand was just progressively more shitty.

>>9864746
I replayed these games recently (don't agree with the anon who said only 2-3 were good, classic is way more consistent and the only outright bad one I can think of is 5). X4 really doesn't hold the fuck up. Y'all got suckered by the anime FMVs during the big 90's anime boom. X3 isn't that great either but in retrospect it has more meat to it than X4, but X in general went downhill after the first one all the way until X8, which was maybe quality-wise around X3 or X4 somehow and was a surprisingly decent sendoff for how far the series fell.

>>9870782
see >>9870687—I never meant that anything past 3 is bad. and I agree 5 is the only really "bad" one (though I'll say I'm not a huge fan of 8 either). It was a commentary on how Capcom let the series lose all of its mass popularity. Compare it to, say, Castlevania, that had ups and downs, but managed to hold up way better through years.

>>9865216
>Darkstalkers selling on par with Street Fighter Alpha
That's sure not the impression people seem to have nowadays.

>>9862618
They made their own NeoGeo AES.

>>9872140
That’s SNK

>>9872125
that's just Japan. plus, like I said, Saturn had no games, anything that came out on it would be relatively high in the charts. on PSX it'd be buried under 100 other popular games.
seeing a lot of anime games (beside Gundam and DBZ) in the top best sellers of a given console is a big sign it had nothing better to offer. pic very fucking related.

>>9862656
Don't forget
>Made the greatest masterpiece of all time (Asura's Wrath) and pulled some retarded monetization shit so it died off and will never be remastered/ported to PC, to my utmost dismay.

>>9862618
>Dude, I just realized that if Capcom released their own consoles and kept their titles to themselves, Sony, Nintendo, Microsoft, & Sega would’ve been blown out of the water.
Super Mario Bros 2 alone mogs all Capcom NES title sales put together.
If Capcom had made their own machine, no one would have bought it. History happened the way it did for a reason.

>>9874060
all they would have needed was a great marketing technique. Sega was utter diarrhea horse shit but they new how to sell it. Capcom had and still has more to offer.

>>9870782
>>9870796
Besides being easy, what's wrong with 5 and X4?

>>9874914
X4 is really the prototypical Zero game. X feels like an afterthought in his own game, to the extent that classic Rock has more of a presence on the original Saturn Rockman X4 cover. The stages are extremely weak, you can blitz past everything and still make it to checkpoints with little effort. The boss designs are better than the next two PS games at least but they're for the most part not as engaging as the first two SNES games.
5 almost has the opposite problem. Mega Man feels right and the game is generally eyecandy for an NES Mega Man game, but the enemies were not balanced right and mostly don't feel like deliberate placed obstacles like they do in the other NES games. The bosses and especially the weapons are both arguably the weakest in the series as well. The Game Boy game is more memorable, and if the two had swapped places then people would remember the latter half of the NES hexology (which it soured) more fondly.

>>9863876
>>9862618
this, OP is RIGHT.
>can make zeldarogues, which with MMZ/X basically carried nintendo mobiles
>in fact a console of them
>lots of other titles are now EXCLUSIVES
Who would even buy nintendo and what for? To play mario bros? lol.lmao, even. No one even likes the game that much, it's just usually comes with the console and mild enough to get, that thing would not carry anybody.
Zelda then? But capcom at best can now make zeldas. In fact, they have partnership with marvel too. Add to that SF and a mascot (megaman).
>they also managed to kill Marvel VS Capcom
wut? We're talking about retro games here, how does current nu-capcom after they killed all their titles count? You on the wrong board?

>>9870796
>though I'll say I'm not a huge fan of 8 either
For all of its faults, 8 does one thing and one thing very right - instead of making it so that special weapons either stun or don't stun bosses (see Shotgun Ice vs. Spark Mandrill, Slash Claw vs. Spring Man, etc), you can boss-stun only during key moments, often by using the bosses' own weapon against them to exploit their weakness (e.g. Thunder-Clawing Grenade Man's Flash Bomb back at him, Flash-Bombing Frost Man as he charges an Ice Wave or Tornado-Holding Clown Man's outstretched arms together). It takes a certain amount of creativity to do that, and it's a concept that could have been followed up on. "Do you attack now or wait to time it right" is an element of strategy rarely seen in Mega Man. Unfortunately, the next boss to do that would be Burner Man, which was the logical extreme that burned the idea entirely.

https://youtu.be/OFB3mjPRnBY

Imagine smoking literal crack

>>9862618
They should have made a Handheld, like SNK did.

>>9862618
if both capcom and konami did this, they could stand a chance