/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9815078
I was 15 and it was the best thing ever. I watched a camrip with my friends on an old laptop and it was surreal. FF7 was our favourite game and the sheer idea of a film made based on it was absolutely crazy.

I'm a big fan of VII and I have yet to watch this. Probably never will.

>>9815078
I watched it before I played FF7. Didn't know what was happening, but I liked the CG. Don't remember any of the story because my dad came in with a book about sex education and awkwardly tried to give me the talk before just leaving.

Looked into this again now after having played FF7 and I think it's a horribly stupid waste of time that blows and it pisses me off that everyone pretends like AC Cloud's costume is better than the original.

My autism was being satiated by Dragon Ball fighting games, so I didn't really care about an RPG I played when I was eight getting a movie.

OP if you think Sephiroth coming back was stupid you're going to hate the remake.

>>9815245
Actually I was wholly uninterested in the remake until I actually learned it's not a remake at all but a sequel. I'm generally dismissive of multiverseshit as a creative framework, but in this case it seems like a pretty clever and potentially interesting usage of the approach.

>>9815078
It was great. Only complaint is that everyone looked gay.

>>9815362
>everyone looked gay.
unfortunately a constant problem whenever Nomura is in involved.
If you want to enjoy the story, or cool action and music, you have to endure all the girly men.

>>9815078
Didn't hate it, but it was definitely a popcorn flick that didn't stand up to even a little bit of questioning.
>very first spoken word was a retcon
Nomura and Nojima laid the groundwork for their approach to storytelling early.

>>9815370
Thats the whole Jrpg industry. All MCs look girly no matter who designed them.

>>9815370
>whenever Nomura is in involved.
anon, i'm in inlove with you

>>9815078
It was the fucking best movie ever for my 15 year old brain, I was very into linking park, chemical romance, the rasmus, anime and JRPGs, like every single thing on the movie clicked with all that shit for whatever reason, the line where Cloud says "there's nothing I don't love" and Vincent voice mail had me like wow.
15 years later and I can't even see the cover of the DVD without cringing, same with my music taste from back in the day.

>why is Cloud a whiny emo
>who is this pedo boyband
>ugh Bahamut scene was fucking stupid surely it can't get any dumber
>boyband leader combines with Jenova head to turn into Sephiroth

>>9815078
I was living in florida at the time and this couple ran a comic book shop and I had stopped in and the lady owner was watching it so I just sat down and wtched it with her. I dont remember much cept when cloud and serphy fight at the end and cloud lectured him about getting stronger and stuff and kicked his ass. than the movie ended I bought a comic and went home. wild that I can date that to 15yrs ago like that now since alot of the era of my life is a blur now

before it came out i was very excited and rewatched the trailer a bunch of times...then it got delayed and by the time i watched it i found it pretty underwhelming. rufus being alive was pure cringe, and the comic relief with the turks was retarded. i really love the original ps1 game but the entire ff7 universe outside of that really doesnt do anything for me anymore. i didnt even bother with the remake

I was 20 and thought it was based. So much so that I actually got excited for Kingsglaive in 2016.

>>9815078
This was where Nomura was drunken with corporate power.

>>9815901
Amazing metaphorical liver then because he's been on a binge for almost 20 years now

I've never fully watched it, only seen the Cloud and Sephiroth fight.

>>9815901
>>9815906
>corporate power
>never held a title higher than producer
>never been on the board
>always shuffled around between projects and overruled on major decisions even when he's a veteran

Nomura doesn't really have much pull if you stop to think. His name gets put on things because his characters are popular.

>>9815945
Let it go Sakaguchi, he won.

>>9815983
But seriously, this thing making a shitload of money was probably the last nail in HS's emotional coffin. The fact that it got terrible reviews wouldn't be a consolation since that was also the case for Spirits Within.

>>9815370
>>9815425
>>9815901
I generally see talk about "artist regression" as just entitled-consumer bullshit but Nomura is the one artist for whom I believe it unironically applies with 100% accuracy

I watched it before ever playing the game because we didn't have a PS1. I remember being impressed by the visuals, but not really liking the story.

It actually put me off from playing FF7 because I thought it would be boring as well. Only later found out that the game has much more charm than the movie. I still haven't played it yet, but probably will once my backlog is cleared a bit.

>>9816130
Yeah, for me the problem was the self-seriousness of the movie; the original story managed to be dramatic and epic while still being off-the-wall wacky at points.

I'm glad they learned they lesson and kept the humor for the remake, though I'm not really that interested in it anyway..

>>9816140
>the original story managed to be dramatic and epic while still being off-the-wall wacky at points.
yeah and for me the suspension of disbelief to enjoy this kind of thing can only be done with primitive graphics. i stopped playing jrpgs altogether after the ps1 era. realistic 3d graphics and voice acting is not something i want in these games.

>>9815078
Saw it when I was 18 and, while liking the graphics and the action, I still ended up disliking the plot and the characters. It was just a lazy excuse of a story to cram the movie full of either action scenes or "remember this?" moments, and I already got that way back then. It was a 'member berries movie years before it was a thing.
I also remember antagonizing posers on forums who became the "biggest FF7 fans" due to this movie despite never having played the game.

>>9816173
Reminder that the 1939 Wizard of Oz was a remake.

>>9816198
Not really, it was a second adaptation of the same source material.

Wasn't that familiar with the series and so nothing in the film made any impact.

If Star Wars had Palpatine return played by three different shades of his personality, and is fought by
all previous characters from Star Wars, with Luke doing a limit break on him at the end.

Star Wars would have been kino too.

Guess they couldn't think of that.

>>9815078
>What was your reaction to it back in 2005
Holy shit, that's cool as fuck.

>>9815264
I hate you faggots so fucking much. The FFVII Remake isn't a fucking sequel you fat fuck mouth breathing american. Are you seriously implying all of the events of FFVII took place prior to the FFVII Remake? That Sephiroth was defeated at the end of FFVII and then they all go back to Midgar and pretend nothing happened? That they just start repeating what they did in the original game? You're a stupid faggot, holy fucking shit.

The FFVII Remake is a REBOOT, moron, not a fucking sequel. The FFVII Remake doesn't take place after the events of the original FFVII. It's a REBOOT. It's a reimagining of the original game with many, many different plot elements.

>>9817170
>he never played FFVII Remake
kek
can't wait til you have to eat shit at the reveal

>>9815078
It was the best movie I ever watched at the time.
I was a kid, I liked Final Fantasy 7 and there was no other video game movie like it at the time. It's also FULL OF FANSERVICE. Pretty much all you could ask for as a 7 fan.

>>9817170
based
I will never understand the people who go 'oh yeah aerith died in ffvii but she's magically back in the sequel ffviir and she meets everyone for the first time.. again. guess they forgot about her

>>9817170
The weirdest thing the sequel supporters say is
>yeah aerith and sephiroth have memories of the original game and see the future and know they're gonna die which is why they know things they shouldn't yet in the remake
But how does that work??? is aerith just having visions of the future, the future of the original game? so she's trying to avoid it? why does she think those visions are true and why would you trust in them as being 100% fact?

>>9817170
It's a sequel. Square already did the same twist with Valkyrie Profile 2.

>>9817234
The concept of timeloops isn't new. Even the very first FF had timeloops.

>>9815078
Felt like they were about the kingdom hearts versions and not the ff7 versions of the characters. Also thought it was super lame to do a movie as a "sequel" to the game so as far as im concerned, its non canon if its not in a game.

>>9815078
Well when it came out I was only 18 so needless to say I thought this was the coolest fucking shit in the world.
I rewatched it recently and even during half the fights I was bored out of my skull. Kickass JENOVA remix though
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyEpW-RvY2w

>>9815375
Moody Cloud didn't start with AC, it started in KH1 where they basically combined him and Vincent into one character.

>>9815439
Hey I don't fucking care who knows it, I still think Hybrid Theory is a good album even if no one would be caught dead making something like it today

>>9815998
>The fact that it got terrible reviews wouldn't be a consolation since that was also the case for Spirits Within.
Let's be completely honest, Advent Children was what we all WANTED Spirits Within to be when we were kids.

>>9817170
It's just a timeloop anon, calm down

>>9816772
You know, now that you put it like that, if they did then I would've actually seen Rise of Skywalker

>>9817170
Kek, the reveal was fun and interesting enough, but I confess I'm morally weak enough to also get a kick of how much I knew it would upset a part of the fandom. Case in point.

To be fair, the game is literally titled "Final Fantasy VII REMAKE", but that's the gag: "remake" was intended not as a media descriptor, but eventually revealed as a narrative concept. The whole thing is even more obvious since the second chapter will drop that label altogether.

The irony is that "fans" should be glad the project isn't intended to replace the original game at all, but that somehow managed to upset some factions even more. The mind of the consumer is a wonderfully complex and often embarrassing cognitive maze.

>>9817437
It's more of a parallel universe kind of deal it seems.

>>9817234
>sequel supporters
You mean the developers?

>>9817434
True. But that would be more uncomfortable to admit if Spirit Within had any real "misunderstood" value to it; in the end it's just a simplistic and dull attempt at epic blockbustering. Even if it hadn't had to live up to a massive set of expectations it would have been inconsequential.

>>9817170
The time jannies show them the end of the first game

>>9817704
All i ever wanted was a remake of 7 that brought all the graphics up to par with the 2D art/pre render models from the 90s. Fuck, i would have taken a late ps1 directors cut that looked like ff8 and used the 7 battle models for over world stuff. I knew any remake by merger Square would be 2000s interpretation of the characters so then i didn't want it, but still screw them for trying to be clever, quirky bitches with Remake. Its sad the closest thing to what most people wanted is a fucking phone game.

>>9816109
have you ever heard of the Type-Moon artist, Takeuchi Takashi? rhetorical question btw

Everyone online hated Advent Children back when it came out. I was mostly with them. It did look amazing though. Still does probably.

The best part is the Red XIII intro.
And the final fight with Sephiroth.
The rest of the movie is pretty garbage though

That said... at least it's not a ridiculous plot rewrite like FF7R is

>>9817882
It's certainly ridiculous if you for some reason force yourself to believe it's a "rewrite" lol

>>9817887
what is it if not a rewrite?
>repeat the events of the game
>but it's ridiculous nonsense now

It's a blatant "we want the boomers to buy this but also we wanna do our own thing". It's practically false advertising if you ask me. It says remake on the box.

>>9817903
lol

>>9817905
>no argument
exactly

>>9817906
Nta but the "same thing but it's bad now" this post >>9817903 boiled down to barely counts as argumentation either, anon. It's specially funny because the nonsense alluded to is just nonsense BECAUSE a refusal to acknowledge it's not really the same story, but a different one built on the original.

>>9817938
>game called remake
>let's just put random time shit that wasn't in the original
>No it's not nonsense, it's just because you're not a shill and aren't willing to go along with it
Yes anon, a game called FF7 Remake not following the plot of FF7 is definitely me "refusing to acknowledge" something

>>9817423
I was referring to Elena calling out to Tseng, who had been stabbed and crushed inside the Temple of the Ancients in the original game.

>>9817951
>game called remake
See >>9817704. Originally people even commented of how uncreative was literally titling the game "remake", something that I'd say has in fact never been done for any piece of media elsewhere.
>let's just put random time shit that wasn't in the original
It's not the original, or means to replace it.
>No it's not nonsense, it's just because you're not a shill and aren't willing to go along with it
Aaand there it is. You could have just started with the automatic buzzwords if that's all you've got, anon.

At most you could complain about it from a "false advertising" angle, and that would at least be a somewhat valid point. As things stand, you and most people complaining about this seem to simply be struggling to wrap your heads around a very simple creative concept (specially simple and not particularly creative given current storytelling trends) and doubling down on weird selective blindness to argue there's something "objectively" wrong with it.

>>9817985
>bro it's a GAG
Fuck off. A title is not a gag. It's the product you're selling. For $60.
And on top of that, their rewrite of the plot and "gag" is not good. At all. Like I said it's a blatant, "we wanna do our thing but we still want the money from the word 'remake' being in the title". Imagine actually defending this

Square-enix doesn't have a "deep" message about the nature of consumerism to give to people. Square-enix is not Hideo Kojima and MGS2. (although people were still right to be upset about MGS2). This is Square wanting your money. And you gladly being suckered into giving it. It worked out for you because you liked it, but that's not the case for most fans of FF7

>As things stand, you and most people complaining about this seem to simply be struggling to wrap your heads around a very simple creative concept
yes, the creative concept of
>we said it's X it's actually Y! Haha, isn't it great? Thank you for your patronage! $$
You're a fool

>>9817756
Same here, the remake was a huge letdown, i couldn’t even bring myself to finish it. Super boring and bizarre in comparison to the original.

>>9818019
It's fine to simply not like things anon. That doesn't say more about those things than it says about you, so it's not really something worth acting so insecure and desperately vocal about, specially on mostly a level of simple semantics.

>>9818087
>no counter-argument
>you're insecure!
Good job pretending you're not out of arguments. If the game was just bad but still honest about itself, I wouldn't shit on it so hard. But it's not even that. So it deservers to get shit on. And no, that's not semantics. That's the game. The plot of FF7 (and of any JRPG really) is very important and probably the main reason people like FF7.

>>9818107
There's a limited number of times I'm willing to repeat that "it's bad" doesn't really count as argumentation anon, but by all means if your worldview hinges on parsing this as Total Internet Victory, do embrace it.

With semantics though I meant that you tend to anchor on stuff like the "gag" remark and refuse to acknowledge context, intent and follow through, EXACTLY like your essential problem with the game being titled "Remake."

>>9818161
Yes, because the game being called Remake incurs a level of expectation that the game doesn't deliver on. In fact, it lies to the customer about what it is. You think this is a stroke of genius on their part when in reality it's about making more money. They didn't want to follow the plot of FF7, but they still "had to" because that's the game they had to sell. That's how you end up with FF7R. That's not semantics and it's not me failing to acknowledge anything.

>>9815078
I wanted to like this movie so much that I almost convinced myself I did, but I just hate anime shit where characters can ignore gravity without any explanation.
Story sucked, as well.

>>9817953
Yeah my bad, I meant to reply to someone else there

>>9815078
Personally I found it pointless to invest the will and resources to continue the story into a movie instead of another game. After watching the results though, I'm kind of glad they made sure this mess was its own thing rather than actually linking it with the original on a deeper level by using the same medium.

>>9815264
>I'm generally dismissive of multiverseshit as a creative framework, but in this case it seems like a pretty clever and potentially interesting usage of the approach.
It's fucking shit, dumbass.

>>9818350
Counterpoint: no it's not. Just imagine I also posted a gif.

>>9817170
>The FFVII Remake isn't a fucking sequel you fat fuck mouth breathing american.
NTA, but it absolutely is.
You really should go and play it in order to earn the right to criticize it.
All the shitty universe hopping time travelling shenanigans in it are a way to avoid the bad ending that the original FF7's timeline ultimately had where humanity is implied to go fully extinct with only Nanaki's family surviving.
It's not a direct sequel in the sense that it happens in the same universe as the original game (it doesn't) and after its events.
It's a new timeline with a Sephiroth that likely came from the original FF7 timeline, and a Zack from some other 3rd timeline both barging in.

>>9818357
You would be right if you weren't wrong.
It's objectively trash.
If you like it, you have a gigantic shit taste.
Enough said.

>>9818361
This post is amazing regardless of whether it's self aware or not.

>>9818359
It's a bit soon to extrapolate all that about the original timeline leading to disaster. Also I don't think there's an implication either about Sephiroth coming "from the original timeline", because that would imply Aerith also did somehow. I think it's more about the Lifestream having a fourth/multi-dimensional component and those attuned to it having access to that larger perspective (Sephiroth loves the idea obviously, but Aerith has displayed open misgivings about what the fuck is going to happen because of how they've messed with things already)

More on topic, I just hope they don't link stuff from the extended media like Advent Children into it.

>>9817705
It's literally just a timeloop and honestly it's a less convoluted one than FF1 because it doesn't require infinite recursion of something creating something else. The part where it gets real fucking wonky is the fact that apparently there's 3 sephiroths in the remake
>the one from the original game doing the original game's stuff
>the one that was killed at the end of AC and is possessing the Sephiroth clones in hopes that he can prevent his death in the future
>the one you fight at the end that is apparently not either of them and is a mysterious third one that we don't know his motives or goals
As for why you were able to beat that Sephiroth at what's effectively 3 hours into the original game, the canon answer is because you fought him in a place where it was effectively all points in time simultaneously since that lets the ghosts manipulate the timeline, which means in that world you would be as strong as you would've ever become in your life, which for the team was their strength at the end of AC. Which they lost that strength once they left that dimension. It's dumb but it's not like a plot hole or anything

>>9818504
Where did you get the second Sephiroth from?

>>9818516
He's the one who keeps showing up to talk to Cloud and knows him. We thought he was the one at the end too but then Square said nah, different dude, never encountered that one before

>>9818519
But Sephiroth does know Cloud already at that point of the story in every version, including the original. Does this notion come from any book or interview or something?

I really no see a problem of undertanding all these >>9818504 as just the same entity; it's simply the one Sephiroth native of that reality acting on multidimensional knowledge (including time/4th dimension) extracted from the Lifestream. He's just more proactively messing with Cloud because in this version he knows he's by definition the key to change his own fate.

>>9817876
>Takeuchi Takashi
Mr. Saberface? Can't stop drawing Saber over and over? Imagine if he was in charge of drawing every single character in FGO. Wonder what Ibaraki and Shuten would look like with a saber face.

>>9817876
>>9818571
I don't get it, is the problem that this guy draws always the same thing, or that he's gotten worse (which I thought was what >>9816109 implied)?

>>9818634
Not him but the latter, what the dude is arguing is that he has regressed in his style from how he used to be compared to now because his sameface issue has somehow gotten even worse over time.

>>9818681
It's not just the same face, he draws a lot of them in the same damn pose too.

>>9818571
>Wonder what Ibaraki and Shuten would look like with a saber face.
They would look like saber

>>9816109
Why post this picture when talking about nomura? Surely this was Amano concept art.

>>9815235
Good. You're honestly lucky for never having seen it. It's such dumb anime shit, in a bad way.

>>9816173
>'member berries movie years before it was a thing
Aside from that specific South Park thing, you have to be blind to how pop culture cycles have worked for years to think this was in any way a new phenomenon.

I mean, have you seen the fucking Mad Magazine part shitting on people eating up nostalgia for the fucking 30s in the 60s, and then accurately predicting what shit from that era would be shoved down the throats of future generations, even if it was only making a joke?

Having said that, it is amusing to watch Stranger Things as seeing something do this so shamelessly.

>>9816772
Luuke

>>9819248
Anon, that's Nomura. Nomura started out as a monster designer

>>9817951
kek

>>9815078

The reason 1997 to 2005 felt like so long is because stuff was always happening. Stuff doesn't happen anymore. That's why 2014 and 2021 feel like the same bland soulless year.

>>9819248
Nah you can tell it's Nomura. Look at the character art for FF7, it has the same rough sketchiness from the penciling to it
>you mistyped the captcha
NO I DIDN'T YOU FUCK, I swear they just make you fail on purpose sometimes to trip up learning AI or something

>>9815078
>>9816772
I mean, Sephiroth ALREADY cheated death in the ORIGINAL FF7. And even AC had a reason why he came back again. They didn't make up a bullshit reason for Palpatine coming back. Someone just states "somehow" he's alive again.

>>9815078
They should have made this instead of Spirits Within. Sakacoochie would've tard-wrangled the whole team and some of the more talented FMV developers would've stuck around to make it on-par with FF8's cutscenes.

>>9820603
>All the characters used to look like battered and bruised working class folk to heroin addicts.

>Now all of Square's characters look like SFW pornstars or fashion models.

You can tell marketing agencies in Japan began meddling too much in the company post FF9.

>>9820185
Stranger Things wasn't the first 80's member berries in the 2010s. Shit started on Tumblr and the preMLP era of dA.

In a way, I feel Pokemon started it in some form. Not sure how or why. Something about the games kind of started it with style choices, especially BW2 and XY, which, ironically were released around the MLP and Adventure Time craze (both which obsessed over 80s schlop).

>>9817704
I think its definitely intended to be a sequel, and much as I'm annoyed by how they handled it overall, I'm curious to see how much of this train-wreck will pile on.

So far, we can't really critique this entry too hard at the moment until the next entry comes along. Its too wonky and unfinished at the moment to be looked at as a complete package (because Squeenix is an indie company ofc and its just too expensive to remake the 'whole' game at once).

>>9816109
Nomura is still a good artist, and he has gotten a lot better at drawing humans, but that's all he does these days. Humans, especially protagonists for mainstream stories, don't give you the kind of creative freedom that drawing monsters and machines do. ALL artists have this problem, just look at Toriyama. His non-human drawings are always much more fun to look at than the humans.

>>9820916
>Stranger Things wasn't the first 80's member berries in the 2010s.

I never claimed it was. 80s nostalgia has been persistently going on since the start of the 90s, it's like the era that people have been most specifically and consistently obsessed with nostalgia for, like its basic aesthetic is so idiosyncratic it stands out against every other decade and even zoomers have repurposed it all into vaporwave and the like. People will be nostalgic for the 80s for decades to come at this rate, because neon, puffy hair and primitive synth just seem to hit people with a specific kind of melancholy for 'the past' in the abstract regardless of if they lived through it, which isn't what people seem to nostalgia over for other decades they like the products of in the same way.

>>9821019
It stands out for the wrong reasons I think. As someone who has grown up around adults that came talk about the decade in a rather negative manner and millenials that somehow have a worse faux-nostalgia than raging zoomies, it always came across as extremely gaudy in some way, and vain even before the 'member-berries shit started.

Like, the whole decade, from years of anecdotal evidence and studies, feels almost like it was a blueprint of style for the neuroticism for later modern media in some way, and there was so much awful stuff happening in the world at the time that I almost get the suspicion it was a very over-engineered consumerist decade to distract people from the growing oligarchies around them, which might explain why so many adults who had to go through that time period hated it so much.
I feel the 2000s for a while, was almost a type of pushback against it and it was great for a time until around 2012 when we really wanted to drop back into that trend all over again.

>>9818504
The fact that there are three Sephiroths alone make it more convoluted than FF1's. FF1's is simple once you realize that Garland/Chaos is basically trapped in a bootstrap paradox, with the only two ways out of it being him killing the Warriors of Light in the present (so he won't get sent back) or the Warriors of Light killing him (so he can't cause the chain of events that destroy the world and, apparently, led to his fall from grace).

I’d say that Kingdom Hearts was more respectful to FFVII than Advent Children.

>>9821123
dangerously truthful post.

>>9817229
>>9817234
>Implying
Welcome to the non-sense cash grab milkage in the FF series that is the FF7 Compilation, anons! You've got homework to do.
https://thelifestream.net/novels-novellas/on-the-way-to-a-smile-lifestream-black-and-lifestream-white/

>>9817903
>>9817951
>>9818019
>>9818181
>They LIED to us!!
If you kept up with any news/info/trailers on the game before release at all you'd know that wasn't the case. Not saying it excuses the shitty twist, just that onsidering how overly attached and angry you're acting over this, makes you look like an autistic fanboy justifying their poor composure over being "betrayed" by daddy SE over a video game. There's being passionate while also being critical, then there's you.

TL;DR You rn:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF_Ca45JRFs&pp=ygUPc3Bvb25leSBiZXRyYWls

>>9821123
>Kingdom Hearts was more respectful to FFVII than Advent Children.
Partly true on account of this dumpster fire iteration of Cloud.

>>9821140
So would that mean FF7R is the MSG2 of RPGs?

>>9821150
Not the worst version of Cloud I’ve seen, but yeah, he looks ridiculous with Vincent’s cape.

>>9821150
He looks better ingame imo

>>9820890
Nah this is just Nomura's style changing over time because if you look at his designs from game to game, it wasn't some sudden change, you can see his changes gradually. Whether you think that's a positive or negative change is irrelevant, it was because of Nomura himself. Also, 10 was post 9, and 10 still had him doing shit like making the ridiculous belts in Lulu's dress to say "yeah, try and render THAT CG cutscene artists"

>>9821154
Albeit done very poorly and pretentiously, yes.

>>9821140
who said anything about me personally being betrayed? I didn't even buy the thing
and you're not really making much of an argument by saying that "I care about it too much". I am definitely pro-consumer, and so I am passionate about corporations not fucking over the consumer, that's about it. I like FF7 too, although it's not even my favorite game in the series
FF7R is a gross product
>but news/info
no. they hid the time shit. I was there so you can't pretend to me that was not the case. and besides, the game is a remake of ff7 so there was no reason to assume you'd get anything but a remake. or even have to follow news of any kind. you should already know what the product is, because that's what it's called.
>>9821150
that cloud fits the kh universe

>>9821048
Yeah I don't know why they had to have a third one, even just 2 where Sephiroth's memories from the future are influencing the current one would work well enough. Which makes me think the mysterious third one is from what I call the "Zack Lives" timeline which....I have thoughts on that. I buy into the idea that like half the shit we see in the ending pieces of Remake is the ZL timeline and not something in the Remake we played. Biggs is still dead in what we played (I know you'll say you see him wake up in the ending but I'm convinced that wasn't our timeline), but in the ZL timeline Zack didn't fail him because at that point in time Zack is a much stronger, more capable, more dependable and honestly much more of a hero than early FF7 Cloud was. I think they're actually going to explore this as an Elseworlds concept in the later games.

At least that's what I HOPE happens. What will probably actually happen is complete nonsense where the timelines merge, and Zack will reach out his hand, and the power of friendship will allow him to reach Cloud, and they grab the Buster Sword togerher, and defeat Sephiroth as one. That's what's probably going to happen because Nomura thinks shonen writing is the pinnacle of literature, and yet that's only the second-worst outcome. The worst outcome is something I dread even pondering.

>>9815078
Pre-ordered the DVD even though I was 18 yo and living in Egypt. It was a veritable hassle.
I was just happy to see the characters in fancy CGI. The story was meh at best but I still liked it because of the excitement. I didn’t like Nomura’s direction of course; he genuinely sucks and made the narration even cheesier.

>>9818560
You're right, it's super easy to say it's all just one entity with future knowledge and in fact that makes it even easier to write around, the problem is square said in the Ultimania that that's not what's happening and there's 3 of them so we have to just discount that

>>9821192
Alright, I'll bite since you clearly baited for a reply with how your post ended, what's your supposed worst outcome?

>>9821180
His work has been improving again recently, and he's not using as many belts as he normally has.

FFX apparently had to a redo of its character designs. Tidus and Yuna were the only ones from the initial game that retained their character design before they reboot the game during development. So you could say FFX was when he had that pastel-look start infiltrating his work (and the company).

>>9821183
>who said anything about me personally being betrayed?
>"Fuck off. A title is not a gag. It's the product you're selling. For $60."
>"You're a fool."
>"Imagine defending this"
>"Yes anon, a game called FF7 Remake not following the plot of FF7 is definitely me "refusing to acknowledge" something"
Hyperbolic for SURE and NOT upset.

>no. they hid the time shit. I was there
Clearly you weren't.
>The watchmen of fate (the black mist in the trailer) are mysterious beings that appear before the party wherever they go. I hope that even those who have played the original game will enjoy the new elements.
If you put two-and-two together from the trailers you'd know these things weren't a part of the OG at all and the name "WATCHMEN of FATE" implied some deeper contextual meaning.

>>9821243
in anons defense, there were og players out there that wanted to avoid getting spoiled on 7R. having a bait-and-switch with the ghosts wasn't too bad until they were constantly going out of their way to interfere with the story.

time-shenanigans aside, i just found them more annoying than anything.

>>9821229
>what's your supposed worst outcome?
Are you guys familiar with the concept of the "backdoor pilot"? If you're young I can forgive you for not knowing about it, it kinda died with traditional tv programming but it used to be really common. Basically the idea is you take a show that's already on tv, and then you make an episode that exists to be a pilot for a new show in hopes that the network will pick it up. Star Trek TOS famously did it with the episode Assignment: Earth (aka the Gary Seven episode) where it was a pilot for a Dr. Who ripoff they were tossing around at producers hoping for someone to take interest. Backdoor pilots are bad because usually the new main character is the center of attention and everyone in the original cast suffers, which means you have both a bad pilot and a bad episode of the main series. Assignment: Earth is a great example of why that's the case is because Kirk and Spock are written to be helpless idiots so that that Gary Seven can solve the episode's dilemma and look cool.

THAT is what I'm afraid of, that all the Zack shit in Remake is a form of advertisement for Square to later say "hey guys, you should buy The Zack Game! No not the one you played in 2007 and then again in 2022, the brand new one with his continued adventures in the Zack Lives timeline!" The fact that they remade Crisis Core to get everyone caught up with Zack as a character and get people more used to be new voices, leads me to think they'll actually do it. That it's all just cynical marketing inserted into the plot.

>>9821243
>The watchmen of fate
how are people supposed to draw the conclusion "they're gonna introduce time loops and alternate dimensions" from that?
Honestly, you're accusing me of caring too much about this but you seem more upset than me. The product is a clear bait-and-switch, and not a good one like MGS2 was. It has decent aspects of it, like the graphics and combat, but it's still gross what they did

>>9821256
That seems perfectly plausible. FF7 games are a steady source of income for Square-enix, it's in their best interest to make sure they never stop coming out

>>9821256
anon nails the complaints down perfectly.

i think all the fans don't really have much an issue with the Remake, but a lot of them are pissed because a lot of things in this 'game' are intentionally written with a KH2 element to warrant the excuse for numerous extra entries that nobody in their right mind would want.

its bad enough trying to keep on top of KH for those reasons alone. and i sure don't fucking want that in FF7 next. just keep it self-contained like a rational human being, otherwise we'll get another XV dilemma to go with it.

>>9821291
>>9821297
Like I said, second-worst outcome I mentioned here >>9821192, while stupid, is no stupider than shit I see in any given KH game and won't kill me, I won't come out a bitter cynical man if they pull the nonsense route. Again in a perfect world we would get the best outcome where again, it's an Elseworlds (comic concept where "what if X happened instead of Y" to see what changes) where we get to explore how much the timeline changes from Zack living. But we don't live in a perfect world.

>>9821229
>since you clearly baited for a reply with how your post ended
And you'd be right. You're dealing with an aagressive copypasta autist.
https://arch.b4k.co/_/search/boards/v.vg.vrpg/text/The%20worst%20outcome%20is%20something%20I%20dread%20even%20pondering./

>how are people supposed to draw the conclusion "they're gonna introduce time loops and alternate dimensions" from that?
It's in their name, retard. Learn how words and their meanings work.

>>9821324
I am the one who made the original post and the followup, yes. And I've only made it one time before so I wouldn't say it's exactly aggressive, the last time I ever mentioned it was when the CC remake came out. It's easier to copypaste what I originally wrote than to try and come up with the same thoughts in different words. What, do you never copy from the archive something you've said before when it's relevant to the topic?

>>9821306
like i said, this kind of stuff wouldn't be an issue if it suffer the XV/KH dilemma of having multiple spinoffs, books, anime, tv shows and shit just to 'get' an idea of what the plots, story and themes are trying to tell in the world of the game.

the main reason OG FF7 (and SquareSoft) was so beloved was because they did their best to prevent this kind of shit happening, and was one of the reasons why all the crap with them after the merger started, and also a reason why FFX-2 happened.

do you really REALLY want the FF7 universe to go the marvelshit route?

>>9821324
>It's in their name, retard. Learn how words and their meanings work.
You seem incredibly mad for someone accusing me of caring too much.
And no, "watchmen of fate" might as well be "mystery n*ggas". They could've been anything.

>>9821332
>What, do you never copy from the archive something you've said before when it's relevant to the topic?
KEK Is the how shitposters cope with being autistic and lazy?

>>9821334
>do you really REALLY want the FF7 universe to go the marvelshit route?
Little late for that anon.
>Advent Children
>Dirge of Cerberus
>Crisis Core
>Before Crisis
>Last Order
>First Soldier
>that gacha game that keeps getting delayed

Only the last 2 came out after Remake, if anything FF7 went the marvel route before even KH did since Days came out in 2009, after the majority of the stuff I listed there. KH was basically a self-contained trilogy of 1>CoM>2 before then.

>was because they did their best to prevent this kind of shit happening, and was one of the reasons why all the crap with them after the merger started
The man who was so insistent on keeping out that shit, is also the man that caused the merger to happen because he bankrupted Square with Spirits Within.

>>9821348
Well I am autistic, so I feel the need to keep my thoughts straight. And it's not shitposting to share my actual beliefs on a topic, what did I say at all in those posts that was shitposting and not either genuine discussion or criticism?

I wonder what the drop-off in sales will be for FF7R 2. There's always a drop-off with FF sequels, but since this is a direct sequel, I wonder.

>>9821365
There'll be some without a doubt, simply because there won't have been so many years of waiting this time. But it's still going to sell millions.

>>9821349
the Spirits Within flopped because the server farms kept running into coding problems and he had to rely on shitty codemonkeys to fix the equipment, not to mention Hollywood kept interfering with the script.

on the FF7 point, its bad enough right now post merger. Remake will make it even worse and the narrative KH stuff with 'darkness' and 'light' should stay well-away from the franchise. Even if they didn't have that kind of stuff in FF7, the way the characters moved around and their personalities was dangerously reminiscent to KH, with the added pretense of XV thrown in.

take note, that Crisis Core on the PSP split the fans because of stuff like that. It should compliment the OG, not recontextualise further.

>>9821372
>the Spirits Within flopped because the server farms kept running into coding problems and he had to rely on shitty codemonkeys to fix the equipment, not to mention Hollywood kept interfering with the script.
And you know, because they invested a metric shitton of money in Aki Ross, the "virtual actress" that they hoped to license out to people and then that never fucking happened. That's up there with tulip mania in terms of bad investment ideas.

>>9821336
>You seem incredibly mad for someone accusing me of caring too much.
>N-No U

>n*ggas
This ain't Twitter, nigger. We can scream obscenities on here.

>Well I am autistic
Well that evident based on the usage of a Vtuber in your original post.

>>9821372
>the way the characters moved around and their personalities was dangerously reminiscent to KH
Really? Of all things wrong with the remake, I thought it was the closest to their original personalities since the original game and it's all the stuff made between the original and Remake that got their characterization completely wrong.

>>9821385
What are you even talking about? take meds

>>9821392
>I am the one who made the original post and the followup, yes.
>What are you even talking about? take meds
Insecure.
https://arch.b4k.co/v/thread/621540306/#q621583039

>>9821390
yeah, i'll agree on that front. they actually got the personalities down to a tee, with maybe the exception of Aeris. Even then, her personality was pretty accurate. More the voice actress than anything was trying too hard at times.

I think its more the body acting that looked XV/KH-esque, if that makes any sense?

>>9821382
Well, yeah, they were rolling hard on Aki Ross. They just weren't expecting that most of their time and effort was going to be spend on her and not trying to prevent the whole film from collapsing on itself from mismanagement both internally and externally. Film was supposed to have been a nightmare to work on, and if you're brushing shoulders with the film industry as a first timer, I can't exactly imagine it being smooth sailing.

You can always tell the amount of /v/irgin tourists that peruse this board with any 6th gen thread and discussing something as autistic as FF7 post compilation.

>>9821402
Anon why did you reply to two people as if they were one person? That's probably why he's asking what you're talking about, the first 2 parts are directed towards someone else while only the last part is directed at me because you didn't bother to put in the post number for both people you're quoting.

>>9821451
Because you're obviously samefagging.
>>9821365
>>9821370

>>9821476
meds

>>9821485
>meds

>>9821424
FF7 has kinda become like One Piece for me. I was born in 86 and yet despite being in my mid-30s, FF7 and OP have been an active thing in my life longer than they haven't because they won't stop making shit for them, and thus regardless of quality when it's finally all over I'm going to have a wierd feeling of something being missing that should be there.

>>9820185
I wasn't talking about basic nostalgia, genius. It's a very specific way to appeal to the masses by using and abusing character ingrained in recent pop-culture phenomena. You yourself brought in the ST example, which IS another example of it.

>>9821424
i have no problem with them so long as they just talk about games.

I was mad hyped to see Reno and Rude. thought the rest of the flick was decent

>>9815078
I loved it when I first watched it but it gets worse every time I rewatch it.

Why is this thread still up?
Is this a game?
No.
So, why is it still up?

I was twelve at the time and had just played FFVII, which I thought was the coolest shit and had me totally engrossed. I remember my edgy weeblet brain thinking the fights were awesome and being blown away by how good the CGI looked, but, coming right off the heels of playing the original, I picked up on the tone and characters being a lot more dour. And I wished that the party members other than Cloud and Tifa could've played a more prominent role in the plot.

This was also around the time when FFVII was seeing some backlash on vidya/anime forums for being overrated, so I remember feeling a bit of ire toward AC because a lot of the complaints people had (i.e., "Cloud is emo") were really more aimed at the movie than the original game. At the end of the day, though, I still watched the Evanescence and Linkin Park AMVs, I still set my desktop background to promotional art from the movie, and I still re-played the Cloud vs Sephiroth fight more times than I can count.

>>9824490
Why are people using words in their posts? Is this /lit/?

>>9824527
>Why are people using words in their posts? Is this /lit/?
That fallacy isn't the epic dunk you think it is, kiddo.

>>9824542
Equally substantiated counterpoint: it is.

>>9821250
Still wondering how did you manage to find the whispers so annoying, while during the game, they just appears as a mob to fight and nothing more.

>>9815078
I hated FF7 but I thought this movie was a lot of fun to watch. It was visually impressive back then and it still kind of is, all things considered. That's about it, I don't really have much attachment to this franchise's stupid plot.

>>9826379
It's safe to say something at the level of this movie could be done today with FFVIIR realtime graphics, right?

>>9815235
This ¬¬¬¬¬> >>9820175

>>9824886
because they're multi-dimensional ghosts (which runs the risk of creating dimension-hopping bs (which happened anyway because of their existence)) and even then, end up becoming a nuisance and ruining really good scenes in the game.

but, now they aren't a thing anymore (hopefully), im looking forward how the story handles their existence in 7R once Remind comes around. maybe they'll write the game in a way that makes them more interesting in hindsight. we'll just have to see.

>>9815078
it was lame to retcon sephiroth as the main villain when Jenova was the one pulling the strings in FF7.

>>9815078
I was 13 when it came out and had already played the game, so I was all over this shitty movie back then. It was like watching a feature-length AMV.

>>9829565
Lol is this the /vr/ equivalent of /tv/'s "the machine never worked in The Prestige"?

>>9829875
I have no idea how people would reason to conclude the latter, but Jenova being largely the catalyst for Sephiroth's complete change in motivations as things progress, if not being mostly 'in charge' of his will, makes way more sense and is supported by so much more than they idea that Sephiroth just spontaneously aligned with Jenova on his own accord and used her as a convenient puppet without being strongly influenced in return.

LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE-

LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE- SET IT OFF!!! SET IT OFF!!! LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE- LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE- SET IT OFF!!! SET IT OFF!!! Oo-In your face! Ass in your face!! So sick of this!!! Ass in your face!! LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE- LETS TALK JAPANESE, PETER PAN, NICOTINE- SET IT OFF!!! SET IT OFF!!!

PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES PANTY PANTY PANTYHOES SET IT OFF!!!
SET IT OFF!!!

>>9829896
I mean, she definitely plays a part in making Sephiroth what he was even before he was dipped into the Lifestream, but in the game she's mostly a symbol of his otherness for him rather than a real necessity or source of power. The implication that comes across is that he acts through her as a proxy, not the opposite.

For example, there wasn't a "Reunion" impulse in Sephiroth to go back to her in the backstory; he operated on his own until he stumbled upon her by chance and shit hit the fan. The Reunion during the events of the game is driven by Sephiroth waking up in his resting place and setting his plan in motion using the convenient logistic advantage of the "freebie" minions he has around due to Hojo's experiments.

>>9821324
You wouldn't believe it, but there's an autist who's shown to have a history of seething over Remake across multiple sites and on the vidya boards almost daily. He's gotten so anally ravaged over some people not sharing his level of seething and mocking his autism over it, he pretends to be sycophant 7R fanboys, attempting to make them and Remake look bad (as if that's even necessary) while also debating them -- literally arguing with himself. He copypastas, and sometimes plagiarizes, posts that he deems as giving remotely any lip service to Remake.

>>9826385
Oh yeah, it'd be easy

>>9830386
Thanks for you're unnecessary, useless fluff reply to an equally unnecessary, useless fluff question. Certainly worth a bump.


fluff reply.

>>9830386
Learn the difference between how video games and 3D animated movies are made before you make yourselves look uneducated, lil' Zoom Zoom.

>>9829942
the initial translation's handling of the sephiroth copies and the context around them is probably the hugest clusterfuck of them all in a script that played fairly fast and loose in the first place

>>9815078
Don't care about FF, but my older brother used to rewatch this movie A LOT.

>>9818359
Multiverse and timeline shit is always hack writing and trash. Always.

>ywnba millennial getting brutal head from an emo bitch with swoop bangs and elbow-length fingerless gloves after watching ff7 advent children
THE ZILLENNIAL IS OLD ENOUGH TO FALL IN LOVE WITH EMO GIRLS ONLINE BUT NOT OLD ENOUGH TO DATE THEM. AAAAAAH FUCK THIS LIFE

>>9831478
fuck off fake nigga, if you want girls with makeup you can find it in any spot, dont hop onto shit you werent into in the first place

>>9830578
Some ignoramuses over at /co/ do link one type of shading and lighting setup (and from two-decade old movies for some reason) to the general idea of quality, but I'm sure seasoned 3DCG savants such as you wouldn't make that mistake or cherrypick realtime examples to specifically "support" it.

>>9833169
>Muh cherrypicking
Your image is still nowhere even close to the movie's lighting.

>>9833424
I'm guilty of matching the confrontational tone you yourself displayed above, but this is a topic that do interest me. You're generally refusing (or simply failing) to separate specific intent and use cases from general features and potential of each toolset. Close-ups in TS (or in filmmaking in general in fact) tend to use ad hoc direct lighting and bounce tweaks even when they ignored what the "real" lighting conditions would really account for. In some cases, they actually WOULD account for it (like in this one >>9833424 on top of the bed and next to the window, but less so in this other one >>9830578 in which Woody is on the general floor area and they just added a strong key light because the shot would look better as he does his leader thing). In a more general shot in the same location of the room (see top screenshot in the pic, from TS1), the lighting would be more diffuse and based on general ambient lighting and—in more sophisticated rendering software that accounted from bounced lighting without a need to fake it—the warm reflected light from the wooden floor.

Kingdom Hearts III used UE4 iirc, and this >>9833169 example was the first screenshot I found that displayed a more dramatic lighting setup than the very neutral conditions you chose for your posts; for full disclosure, I haven't really played the game extensively myself. Even before raytracing kicked the door open and shat on the floor in triumph, modern-ish realtime engines used obviously cheaper memory-wise but still more believably realistic "approximated" lighting than what Toy Story 1 or 2 could easily pull off. It's way less accurate than how lighting worked in TS3 for example (bottom screenshot, featuring similar diffuse lighting conditions), but visually closer to that than to how lighting was approached before the early 2000s (since it was specifically modeled to mimic that sort of modern look, but taking as little as 1/60 of a sec rather than minutes or hours).

I thought it was cool as fuck(still do), but had no idea why the fuck any of it was happening(still don't).
>Where did these pale fucks come from?
>What the fuck is that ick on those kids?
>Who the fuck is this boy?
>Why the fuck is Tifa covering her chest with that leather vest?
Among many other questions.
Cloud's sword was sick as hell though, best thing in the entire movie.

>>9833727
Not retro.

>>9815078
Advent Children Complete almost feels like a different movie. The additional scenes really to a good job enhancing the story flow and explaining some of the headscratchers.

>We actually get to see how the Sephiroth remnants came to be, along with a better explanation of what they are, instead of just having 3 random dudes show up on motorcycles to fight Cloud.

>>9821485
No

>>9815078
I was one of those kids who loved FF7 but I had outgrown the series and pretty much forgotten about it by 2005. I never saw the movie or even touched any of the compilation stuff.

>>9821256
Personal theory how the remake will go down
Tifa will die in Aerith's place in the new timeline
With Tifa dead no one can save Cloud when he falls in the life stream essentially dooming the planet
Not sure about if Zack is a separate timeline or not, but it will all wrap up with Aerith and Zack accepting their deaths and restoring the original timeline, and hopefully tying into that damn Dirge of Cerberus cliffhanger in some way
I just want to see 4k Shelke

>>9833768
Toy Story is retro, so...

I waited to get it day 1 on one of those little discs for the PSP
It sucked

>>9815078
Was shitting my pants excited. Watched the trailer: a trillionntimes. A vietnam transfer kid burned us a sub. Itbwas fantastic. The dub is shit surprisingly. The story is pretty mengh. But the CG is awesome. At the time; loved it.

Would also say the anime short: the last order? Waa it called. Was pretty good.

>>9815078
my reaction was to ignore it completely bc I was too busy having sex with biological, assigned-female-at-birth women

>>9815264
as a guy who hasn’t and won’t play it, it seems pretty fucking gay
Final Fantasy is, was, and always will be extremely fuckin’ gay, and it’s getting gayer at an exponential rate. I say this as a fairly big fan who played every US release when it came out up through 8 and even played a translated ROM of the Famicom FF2

>>9837880
Compared to a lot of junk we get now in flower-power terms, Final Fantasy is testerone fuel compared to shit like Animal Crossing or Mario, imho.

>>9833118
They're not the same bro, and you know that. Zoomie egirls might blow your cock, but they can't blow your heart like an FF7pilled millennial

>>9839083
>Animal Crossing or Mario
Both of these games are an order of magnitude more heterosexual than FF is.

>>9840624
>Animal Crossing
>heterosexual

The older games? Maybe. Definitely not since New Leaf though. Kind of feel the same way with the new Mario games.
FF used to be pretty gay, but it actually is making improvements lately. Its not 'macho' masculine compared to something like Warcraft, but compared to BoTW, it comes across as more masculine, imo.

Banana.

>>9841565
Careful you don't sprain your wrist doing jazz hands, homo.

>>9841624
>nigga is trying to claim nu Animal Crossing isn't even remotely gay

>>9815078
I absolutely lost my shit while watching it. I didn't even care about the 'throwing Cloud' scene. I adored it from beginning to end. The Complete version sucks though and it's a shame we don't have it in HD.

>>9815370
It's not even the girly men, it's the people living in absolute squalor yet wearing ridiculous fashion accessories and having perfectly styled/groomed hair.

>>9830319
I'm just glad he doesn't come to this board at least I hope so. The copypasta fag in this thread was a little sus, but I'd chalk it up to a rare coincidence because the shitposting autist WAS in that very same thread too, throwing around his usual falseflags. The only difference here is there's no unusually immature behavior over being caught and then pretending to be the other person with these weird self-reflection posts.

>>9829896
Never forget, the game was being made first and the script came later. It makes no sense because the FMV's and other assets were built while they were writing the script. The game literally has retcons in it. "the white materia turns green after use" for example. The game probably was intended to be a subversion, that sephiroth was jenova the whole time. Jenova killed Aerith and so on. Then someone thought, nah, have Sephiroth be doing it, some how. The game really highlights his death and Cloud's turning point as a character was killing Sephiroth, proving his identity and worth. So much so the end of the game he kills Sephiroth again, as many say, in his mind. This is why sequels ruin things. I think this stuff is better left debated and unexplained.

>>9815370
Japanese media involving men sharing their feelings for each other without bis really an alien concept

You're forgetting that it 'was' considered normal back in the day in Japan for men to share each other's feelings for each other , compared to Western societies like America cannot comprehend it because any conceptual understanding of platonic romance is taken to the extreme.

>>9845319
>So much so the end of the game he kills Sephiroth again, as many say, in his mind.

It sounds schizo-tier (and this kind of supernatural shit usually is), but, what was occurring just before the end of the game was that the ghost of Sephy' was trying to bypass Cloud's memories via his latent Jenova cells that were on the verge of dying, because Holy was about to awaken.
Cloud wasn't "in his mind" in the end of the game, he was in his soul. He was literally about to lose his identity because Seph was trying to possess him and kill him from the inside.
The whole point of his breakdown and crisis' throughout the whole story was him trying to fend off the possession, and his final fight was him succeeding.