/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9495731
another chart (from https://www.gavas.jp/user_data/megadrive_game_ranking.php )

>>9495731
Sonic 1 only sold 260000?? Fucking hell man, even Yoshi's Island sold like 2 million there. It's like the entire classic Sonic lineup sold less than Yoshi's Island in Japan, it's crazy. Sega knows jackshit about marketing apparently. It's sort of making me angry because I feel like it's their fault again and not because people there didn't care about Sonic

I follow japanese retro channels and they copy disinformation from here.

>>9495735
>>9495731
A chart comparing the console sales also sheds some light on the subject. Basically, MD was more or less doing ok, competing with PCE until around 1991-92. But then, SFC released and quickly overtook both of them. Sega CD helped slightly, but then again, PCE also had the CD add-on and Turbo Duo, which did better.
All in all, I guess Sega's arcade titles didn't really mean that much in Japan. What people wanted was Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy, and they continued buying the console that gave it to them until mid 2000s. Also, Nintendo was still strong after the success of the Famicom, and basically the competition had no chance going toe to toe with them.

>>9495753
>What people wanted was Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy
Pokemon too. Japan's top sales charts consist almost entirely of Dragon Quest, Pokemon and Mario games

>>9495753
Then they got a ton of weebs for sponsoring Evangelion, the release of VF2 becoming a cultural phenomenon and by having a huge red arcade building in Akihabara.

>>9495748
MD itself sold 3.5 mln units. That's 5 times less the total of SFC. Also, from what I've seen, Ninty has always had very good games sales for their 1st party IPs. So yes, that's just how it goes.
Picrel is the chart I've found for SFC game sales figures. In the top 20, half of them were RPGs. Rest is the likes of Mario, DKC, Mario Kart, Street Fighter 2, etc. Goes to show how big the Square / Enix RPGs were back then.

>>9495771
Saturn's top seller was evident. It was the Virtua Fighter machine for them. Sega's big hyped stuff like Sega Racing / Daytona and Virtua Cop also sold relatively well. Rest was literal weebshit like Super Robot Taise, Evangelion and eroge / VNs.

>>9495772
It's so surprising that DKC is popular there. It's not a cute series at all and is also made by westerners which shows.
> Ninty has always had very good games sales for their 1st party IPs
Not all of them, Japan doesn't give a shit about Zelda or Metroid. They are also obsessed with Kirby but the games themselves don't sell that much there. I swear I think Kirby merch sells more than the actual games in Japan

>>9495767
The case of N64 is very interesting though. It showed that Japan didn't care about Mario nearly enough to buy a whole console for him. N64 sold less units than Saturn in Japan. That said, it still had strong game sales. But nowhere near PSX.

>>9495792
I was also surprised about DKC at first, but then again, Crash also sold very well in Japan on PSX. I guess Japan doesn't really care, they just like good platformers.
>Not all of them, Japan doesn't give a shit about Zelda or Metroid.
They don't like Metroid much, yes. Zelda sold pretty well though, just less than in the West.
What I meant was that despite N64 selling just 5.5 mln units or so, both MK64, SM64 and Smash 64 all sold around 2 mln units. And Zelda wasn't far behind.

>>9495797
Yeah, they fucking loved the Saturn.
>it still had strong game sales
I'm checking the sales and apparently MK64 and SM64 sold more than the best selling Saturn game which is VF2

Dragon Quest 7 was in the top 10 biggest selling PS1 games in Japan. So yes they did prioritize that over Mario.

>>9495820
Dragon Quest 7 is a late PS1 game and Dragon Quest usually comes out on the most popular console (the Call of Duty of Japan meme is real except Dragon Quest is actually good). So if Japanese were lured into buying N64's like crazy because of SM64, Dragon Quest 7 would most likely be an N64 game. I believe Final Fantasy 7 is the game that made PS1 popular there because not even Mario can compete with JRPGs in that country

>>9495820
>>9495840
The PSX game sales figures kinda speak for themselves, FFVII-VIII-IX sold a metric fuckton and likely were the turning point for many to buy the system.

>>9495849
>resi 2 in top 10
Nice, it's the best

>>9495731
It was third place and basically played catchup with the PCE its whole life

>>9495816
>>9495849
Japan loves storyshit that's why JRPG and VN are their favorite genres. I was once watching Japanese youtube and one guy had Other M as his favorite Metroid game. The story doesn't even have to be good it just has to be 'emotional' with someone dying, sad music and all that shit. Whether

>>9495895
I'm pretty sure Japan hates FPS, and in general Metroid was never big there. From the list in >>9495772 , Super Metroid was like the #38 best selling game on Super Famicom, which isn't exactly high for a Nintendo first party title. So I guess them liking Other M makes some sense

what do Americans like? anthro character they can self insert as who goes around and beats people up.

>>9495905
FPS has always had a niche audience in Japan but it's never been close to mainstream.

>>9495731
>Anyone who can contribute on this topic?
Yeah, I've got a few Japanese friends who love the Megadrive/32X in particular. I can ask them. Generally the impression I get is it was not popular with average consumers, and appealed mostly to gamers who were very much into the hobby. This has even been parodied in some magazines. While there are plenty of people who enjoy the SFC in Japan, it seems none are as dedicated as the Sega 16-bit fans I've talked to.

>>9495946
It's always been mainstream.

>>9495951
they used to say the SFC was for everyone who wasn't a gamer which explains why it was full of shovelware licensed games, Mahjong, and horse racing sims. Mega Drive fans were more shmup and fighting game people who tended to be different and more hardcore than the more casual JRPG audience and the scene was also heavily import-focused as Japanese MD owners had no choice but to import a lot of US Genesis games.

to an extent this was true of the US as well with the SNES being marketed as a kid/family-friendly console and lacking Sega's tough guy image.

>>9495951
>While there are plenty of people who enjoy the SFC in Japan, it seems none are as dedicated as the Sega 16-bit fans I've talked to
there's a fair bit of modern MD homebrew from Japan as well while nobody does SFC homebrew

>>9495797
>>9495786
please post more chart in English about 4th and 5th gen sales in Japan and Europe.

good point that Japan never loved Zelda or Metroid that much. SMB was a huge Japanese hit but the later games slightly less so (SMB did come out early in the Famicom's run when the competition was slimmer while by SMB3 there were tons of other things you could play).

worth noting that Zelda II in particular and SMB3 were hugely influential on game design and you can notice numerous games that rip off one or more aspects of them, it's just that when it came to sales and the average Japanese gamer they were not close to as massive as Dragon Quest.

>>9496027
>worth noting that Zelda II in particular and SMB3 were hugely influential on game design and you can notice numerous games that rip off one or more aspects of them, it's just that when it came to sales and the average Japanese gamer they were not close to as massive as Dragon Quest.
You think it might help that Japan got essentially incomplete beta versions of both games?

How do we know if these sales numbers posted are accurate? What are the sources? Not saying they're fake but I'd be curious to know their provenance.

>>9496027
> were hugely influential on game design
The thing is, Zelda and Metroid games were popular among game developers but not regular people.
>Zelda 2
Yeah this and Faxanadu. Falcom ARPGs in general were big at the time. And so was the original Zelda. It seems to me that Japan sort of stopped caring about this type of vidya after the 80s. They almost always put Zelda 1 and 2 in their top 10 Famicom games. Also I like how BoTW is more similar to the first two games than ALttP and beyond and Japan's most recent poll now has it at #1. #2 is Dragon Quest 5 and I think this is literally the first time when a Dragon Quest game doesn't take the number one spot

Seems to me like 2d platformers with rpg elements were not that widespread after Zelda II. Seems more like it influenced much later happenings, like CV SotN and then through that more devs.

>>9496078
Super Metroid was the main source of inspiration for SoTN, IGA is just autistic. I remember talking about this with other anons some time ago and we came to the conclusion that Japanese developers do this shit all the time for no reason. They refuse to mention their BIGGEST influence. Ueda said he never owned a Nintendo console after SFC but you will never convince me that he hadn't played Ocarina of Time before making Shadow of the Colossus

>>9496119
>Shiggy: We do not play or care about our competitors' games or concern ourselves with what they're doing
>as there's a Mega Drive behind him

>>9496138
He spilled the beans once and said that Pac-Land inspired SMB

>>9496119
Probably fear of lawsuits for 'inspiration' from competition. Japan copyright law is scary.

>>9496138
There was some I terview where Shiggy stated that his sons enjoyed to play Sega at home. He saw that as an inspiration to do better himself.

>>9495748
>Sega knows jackshit about marketing apparently.
They destroyed SNES in the marketing department in the west. Nintendo looked like clowns in comparison. Its not even close. Admitting you were a nintendo kid in grade 7 meant admitting you are a baby. Now, people might say this isn't true but that means they were that kid wearing sweat pants in high school who had little streams of piss dribble while everyone else was wearing ripped jeans and smoking cigarettes with girls.

Maybe you meant to say Sega OF JAPAN.

https://youtu.be/dwl6WDR1_8c?t=7

>>9496138
didn't he say his one regret in life was not creating Nights Into Dreams?

>>9496158
>but that means they were that kid wearing sweat pants in high school who had little streams of piss dribble
but that's most of 4chan

>>9496158
Yeah we are talking about Japan here. Mega Drive did great in the west. Doesn't change the fact that Sega of America look like complete idiots in retrospect. Also I think that this attitude even influenced Sonic as a character in Sonic Adventure and the games that followed it. So even the Japanese branch decided to go full retard and forget about selling Sonic in his home country

>>9495816
Metroid isn't kawaii enough for them.

idk why people assume Japanese are all elite gamer gods when most of them have very shallow, terrible tastes in games

>>9495963
What were big mega drive imports for the japanese?

>>9495951
>Yeah, I've got a few Japanese friends who love the Megadrive/32X in particular. I can ask them.
Please do, if you can. That's a very interesting topic, not much info out there.
>>9495963
>Mega Drive fans were more shmup and fighting game people
fighting game? I thought MD had about same ports as SFC, if not less, and the SFC could be better anyway.
>the scene was also heavily import-focused as Japanese MD owners had no choice but to import a lot of US Genesis games.
what? really? that's just crazy, how did that ever happen?

>>9495987
I think the reason could be simple, as far as I know, MD was way easier to program for than SNES that was a notorious pain in the ass.
some anon said this about coding for the 2 platforms:
>Mega Drive: Easy. Great CPU and no bank switching.
>SNES: Painful. Shit CPU with segmented memory and only 16k sprite RAM.

>>9495994
If you want to, you can find ones in Japanese at https://entamedata.web.fc2.com/hobby/game_rank_sfc.html . That said, some of their data may be a little inaccurate, but by and large it paints the correct picture.
There's also https://sites.google.com/site/gamedatalibrary/game-search?authuser=0 , I was told this is more accurate for 5th gen upwards, but their MD data looks very off, as they say "for games released before 1996 shipment data is used when available". So for MD, they don't even have Sonic 1 on the list, the figures look very low, I don't really know where's their statistic from.

>>9496054
that's the problem, for MD there's very little info, and all of it is in Japanese. however, often these lists come from some valid statistic sources, like Famitsu or Media Create or other research companies, then never get credited as Japanese web is often like your Geocities pages. even if some of the lists are slightly inaccurate, they generally show about same general picture, with maybe some games go 1-2 positions higher or lower, or maybe slightly smaller / higher sales overall. The reason for this can be that they could have been compiled at different times and/or using different methodology (sales vs shipped games).
seeing 2 different lists showing about the same picture (2 first posts) looks convincing, and https://sites.google.com/site/gamedatalibrary/game-search?authuser=0 has incomplete data with lower numbers (later years of MD perhaps, as they don't have games made before '92 in there), but generally showing about same games in top 10, top 20, etc.
by all means, if someone has better data, be sure to post it, my goal is to understand it.

>>9495767
Funny, I actually went to the total database of game sales in Japan, and sorted games by the highest first week sales—so the stuff Japanese literally went crazy for on release and went to buy it on the 1st day. You can see it's just one unending list of Pokemon / Dragon Quest / Final Fantasy / Monster Hunter.

>>9497352
>total sales
AC New Horizons is now the best selling game in Japan. It's something that I just don't understand. Final Fantasy, Monster Hunter and Dragon Quest are cool but Pokemon and Animal Crossing are so boring. Japanese like mobile games and these titles are mobile-tier so it makes sense I guess. Like can you fucking imagine that there are people in Japan who bought a Switch, never touched Breath of the Wild or Metroid Dread but got the shitty Pokemon games and New Horizons

>>9496158
Japan cared more about Square / Enix, and way less so about arcade action, so SFC dominated there. But in the West, they cared way more about action, sports and mascot platformers, so one of Nintendo's biggest advantages meant very little there.
Also note that almost all of the best-selling SFC games in Japan were exclusives (save for a few like Street Fighter 2 or Puyo Puyo). But in the West, again due to popularity of the sports and cartoon games, a lot of the biggest sellers were multiplats. Mortal Kombat, NFL / NBA Jam, Aladdin, Lion King etc. came out on both platforms. So again, the gap narrowed hard. Genesis getting a lot of Western developer titles also didn't help.
And yes, Sega's marketing and Ninty's kiddy image in the West could've hurt too, but it's hard to say how much.
Regardless, data may vary, but according to NPD, Genesis was often beating SNES (albeit not by much) until late '94. It took DKC for Nintendo to truly give an answer to Sega. (see https://www.sega-16.com/forum/showthread.php?26110-January-December-1994-NPD-sales-data! ).

>>9497454
>Aladdin
It wasn't a multiplat but you are correct

>>9497467
Well yeah. I meant that it was a different game, but available for both platforms. Somewhat similar, although less so, situation with Konami games like Contra / Castlevania / TMNT.

>>9497454
thanks anon, post more charts

>>9497734
OK. Here's one for North America, a comparison of top selling games for N64 vs PSX. Interesting chart, since it confirms the popular opinion that "N64 didn't have that many games, but the few ones that were big were truly huge". Also perhaps explains the perception that N64 was bigger than PSX that some people have.
However, this also went the other way: PSX had 50+ games that sold 1 million copies or more in North America, while N64 had less than 30. And if you look at the world totals, it's even more drastic: PSX had 122 games that sold over a million, N64 had 46.
Also, I think it underscores just how big of a blow it was that GC never got any real successor to Goldeneye. It was their single biggest game that wasn't Zelda / Mario / etc.
For world totals, you can check these pages:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_PlayStation_video_games
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_Nintendo_64_video_games

>>9496160
Nobody ever said that

>>9495731
MD was the cool underground choice and as such didn't sell well but was known to have quality games, while nintendo which had bigger brand ofc was seen as the lame consumerist alternative. Normies just bought nintendo and didn't think about it too much.

>>9497454
>Japan cared more about Square / Enix, and way less so about arcade action, so SFC dominated there. But in the West, they cared way more about action, sports and mascot platformers, so
>Japan
>not caring about sports
you ever been to a used game store over there where it's like 60% baseball/golf/Mahjong shit?

>>9497267
the SNES has more features too, more graphics modes to consider. the one truly annoying part of MD programming is the sound just because the YM2612 is stupidly hard to use so you end up having to resort to the GEMS driver and then just get lame music that sounds like a DOS game with Adlib sound.

>>9497734
One more from https://entamedata.web.fc2.com/hobby/game_rank_ps2.html — PS2 Japanese game sales.
IMO, goes to show that gaming started going to shit from PS2. Predictably, the top is occupied by FF and KH, with obligatory DQVIII and DQV remake; but the rest is 7 entries of Koei shit like Dynasty Warriors, and 7 Konami soccer games. Then there are 3 Gundam games, 3 DBZ games, 2 SRT titles, and even one fucking pachinko game. Add some Taiko no Tatsujin and Tales Of games (2–3 of each), and that's like 80% of the list. The remaining 20% or so is Gran Turismo, Minna no Golf, Onimusha, and MGS. Now that's like 95% of it. I'm not exaggerating.
a big break from >>9495849 , where you had a fucking Parappa at #12 and way more variety overall.

>>9497734
GC. Pretty sad sight. Just one million seller. Lots of Naruto / One Piece games. You know your system is fucked you see that many anime games on the top 50 list. Btw, you have Zelda at #5, which shows that Japan actually cares more about the series than some seem to think in this thread—just not as much as America does.

>>9497798
What is sold in retro stores =/= what was actually top 50 games. I'm pretty sure you see those games because few people want them now, not because everyone owned them back in the day. Same how people now ask insane money even for stupidly popular games like SMB3 / Pokemon that sold gazillion copies.
Though as you can see, Japan did care about Derby Stallion and the like. They seemed to love Minna no Golf, too. And later in PS2 era it bought a fuckton of Konami footy games. On SFC though, you won't find that many sports games in top 50.
And there was NES of course, where all those super early games like Tennis / F1 / whatever sold a ton, but that was more like an exception.

>>9497734
Famicom. Fun list as there's a lot of those early games from 1983 and after like Tennis, Baseball, Golf, Mahjong, Spartan X, etc. A few arcade hits there like Xevious, Lode Runner. Predictably, Tetris. Btw, Zelda 1 and 2 were on Disk System, and it seems they sold pretty well, too.
Interesting how Final Fantasy didn't exactly start out huge, but was gaining steam by the 3rd installment. Also pretty surprising how high Ghosts 'n Goblins is on the list at #11, as well as seeing 3 Mega Man games there.

>>9497734
GBA. Obviously, Pokemon, Mario ports and NES classic games. Also, 5 fucking Mega Man EXE games, explaining why Capcom made so many of them. Cool seeing Kirby at #9 and #12 (I think >>9495792 might be wrong about him), as well WarioWare at #14. Rest is more or less predictable, DQ / KH / FF spinoffs, big 1st party games like Mario Kart / F-Zero etc., Starfy (even Kirby lite sold well), Yu-Gi-Oh, Super Robot Taisen, a few anime games like Hamtaro, Fire Emblem, 2 Mother games, and so on.

>>9497734
GB+GBC. Pokemon Red / Blue selling 8+ million in Japan alone reminds that Pokemon was a real phenomenon when it came out. Predictably, Tetris at #3, more Pokemon, SML games, Yu-Gi-Oh. Then you have Dr. Mario, Dragon Quest Monsters, Tamagotchi, SaGa, DQ ports, and Zelda. The era of Pokemon hit so hard that even Medarot sold well enough to make it on the list, and you have Pokemon Trading Card Game and Pinball at #18 and #25.

>>9497879
Trust me when I say a lot more people had Bases Loaded and Golf than Section Z, or else you wouldn't find enough Golf cartridges that you could build a chair or stool out of them. Lots and lots of gamers are NPCs who just play normie sports games, yet it's unavoidable because the "real" stuff like Section Z could never sell in enough numbers to pay the bills.

>>9497914
Many of the most fondly remembered/nostalgic Famicom games are earlier ones up to '86 because that was when the console was really hot and everyone had to get one. We tend to think more of MMC1/MMC3 games with big ROMs and lots of content, because we got NES stuff a lot later in the West.

>>9498004
I specifically mentioned that Famicom sports games were an exception though. See >>9497914 , I fully agree those early 1983-1985 titles like Tennis, Baseball, Golf, Mahjong, Soccer, etc. sold a shitload.
Wikipedia says there was just 28 games released on FC from 1983 to 1984. It was also a different time—remember that gaming was just moving from Atari times, when stuff that sold big was simple sports games. Much like Atari, Famicom started from stuff like that. Even having Mahjong on your telly was big enough. So no, it's not just "dumb normies".
You won't find that on SFC, go and check >>9495772 . Last time I checked, it only has Famista and Derby stallion games in top 50. No football, tennis, golf, mahjong or anything like that. Doesn't mean it didn't sell, just didn't make it to top 50.

>>9498020
This is absolutely true too. One has to remember that NES only released in late 1985 in America, but more like in late 1986 when it had a nationwide release. By then, the "black label" NES games were already looking dated.
Before 1985, there was very few games on FC to begin with. Nintendo only started allowing 3rd parties to publish their games on FC in 1984. 1985–1986 was when the system truly exploded in popularity in Japan.

the first Famicoms were faulty and had to be recalled anyway so it took a while to fix the problems with them and get them going.

>>9498020
the NES was being derided by Western game developers as outdated early 80s shit

>>9498056
nice to see that 1985-1986 years

>>9498003
Get the WonderSwan chart, they had some competing releases thing going on where Squaresoft was trying to sink the Game Boy Color and release ports strategically same month as the Dragon Quest GBC ports.

>>9498150
They did release FF1 on WS in Dec 2000, same month as DQ3 for GB. DQ1+2 was already released in Sep 1999. That said, FF2 released in May 2002, not sure if it was scheduled or anything, as it released 1 / 2 months after the 2 versions of DQ Monsters 2.

>>9497252
Sure, I've asked a friend. I'll see what he says and I may ask another friend.

>>9497734
PS3. Not retro, but perhaps the most revealing (and upsetting) list of them all. Note how there's just 1 game that sold over a million copies on it, and it's FFXIII. As far as I know, starting with PS3 Japan slowly stopped giving a fuck about home consoles. Wii posted below.

>>9495937
We like good games. Unfortunately, you can't get that anywhere other than America (or in the case of Tetris, Russia).

>>9496950
Five minutes on >>>/vt/ makes that painfully obvious.

The Mega Drive is commonly known as the sports console but actually the SNES has more sports games in total if you count its Japanese library. Difference is the vast majority of MD sports games were Western developed and you could count on your fingers the number of Japanese developed ones.

>>9497734
Wii. As is pretty evident, Wii's console sales numbers (12 million in Japan, 48 million in NA, 40 million in other regions) were driven mostly by the casual games. NSMB and Mario Kart Wii were kind of in-between, and they sold big; but then it's all Wii Play, Wii Sports, Wii Fit, Wii Party, Mario Party, and other stuff like that (note though that many of those games were bundled). You have Brawl at #9, which again is in-between casual and hardcore, then you have Animal Crossing at #11, and finally something that more or less fits the definition of a "hardcore audience" game in Monster Hunter 3 at a little over 1 mln sold.
Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 both sit right under it, also selling slightly over 1 mln. So basically each one sold less than SM64 (1.9 mln) (that's considering N64 sold about 5.5 mln in Japan, and Wii did 12 mln). Zelda TP at #27 with 540k sold (OoT did 1.46 mln).

>>9497914
Holy shit SMB2J sold a fuckton, looks like more people bought FDS for this and not Zelda

>>9498205
Thanks, hopefully he will respond. I'll be sure to check the answer if you post it.

>>9498247
I expected Dragon Quest 25th anniversary collection to be in top 5 honestly but it's only number 33

>>9498056
SMB3 was called outdated by some game magazines as it was already two years old when we got it.

>>9497868
Nintendo also made Square put out a GC game in exchange for being allowed to develop GBA stuff.

>>9498215
>Sega: we didn't release Yakuza Kenzan in the West because it wouldn't sell
>it didn't sell in Japan as well
lmao

>>9496158
so if Nintendo was already seen as gay with the SNES, why did that turn around with the N64? or was that only in certain areas? I remember normie kids here having N64 and talking about games like OoT and SSB

>>9498276
LOL you clearly weren't there. The N64 was very much derided as a babby console back then.

>>9498281
I was there and never saw that, which is why I ask if it was certain areas. I definitely remember normie kids being into OoT and SSB in particular.
everyone was also into Pokemon then, but of course that became gay in gen 2-3

IDK but in my area I've always found a lot more Genesis games (and consoles too) in secondhand stores. SNES stuff is kind of hard to find in my experience.

>>9497454
>Japan cared more about Square / Enix, and way less so about arcade action
well no, they loved arcades just not home versions of arcade games (unless it was Xevious)

biggest selling licensed NES game was TMNT. biggest selling Famicom one I think was DQ2 which says a lot.

>>9498303
It depends a lot on the area. You got people saying everyone they knew owned a SNES when they were a kid and others saying everyone they knew owned a Genesis. There's probably places with far more SNES games in secondhand stores.

>>9498327
>biggest selling licensed NES game was TMNT
*licensed third party game I mean

I think the typical SNES owner was more gated suburbia kind of people while Genesis owners were blue collar and lower income bracket.

>>9498270
Interesting. I guess that's part of why everyone got sick of Nintendo in the first place. Their conditions were always retarded and bordering on being illegal.

>>9498303
Maybe resellers have bought out everything for SNES already.
>>9498315
Well yes, I meant the consoles. Not sure what the arcade market in Japan was like—like, how popular were STGs compared to console games, for example. I know SF2 was huge, not sure about the rest, especially in 4th gen. Also I do know that VF2 was judge when it came out.
>>9498335
There was a discussion here once, and as expected, everyone said that all the black kids owned Genesis and all the white middle class kids had SNES.
As for PSX, people said they hardly knew anyone who owned it and that everyone had N64. Some anon said the only guy he knew who had PSX was a low life stoner who smoked weed (or something like that).

>>9498357
>Maybe resellers have bought out everything for SNES already.
it was like that 15-20 years ago

>>9498357
Everyone I knew as a kid had a PS1. My sister had one friend whose little brother had a N64 and that was it.

>>9498362
Are you from US or somewhere else?

>>9498367
The US.

>>9496158
hey anon im sorry sega's defeat makes you insecure

>>9498374
OK, I guess it could've been just someone's particular circle, or maybe just a regional difference. Maybe age difference played a role too, I can see high schoolers and college guys owning PSX and vice versa.
I actually find it hard to believe "no one owned" PSX, when it sold 40 mln units in America, while N64 did 20. There are even tards who took the "PS2 was bought for the DVD player" meme and spun it into "PSX was bought for the CD player" meme. I guess it's just Nintendo fans' cope that Sony has consistently outsold their favorite consoles for decades.

>>9497734
Somewhat forgot to post this list. These are the world totals for GC and Wii games. Interesting to compare Melee to Brawl, Sunshine to Galaxy and Wind Waker to TP. You can see that the three Wii games sold 1.5–2 times more than the three GC ones. That said, Wii sold ~100 mln units around the world, while GC only did 21.74. So just another proof that about 2/3 of those Wiis were likely purchased for the elderly homes.

>>9498401
Playstation consoles (1-3 and PSP in particular, PS4 is fine actually, never owned a Vita or a PS5 so don't know about these) break all the time so most of the sales come from people rebuying the consoles

>>9498401
>while N64 did 20
20 mil and 90% of those owners had the same 3-4 games on them.

>>9498420
gamecube had less piracy

>>9498420
Why do NSMB games sell that much all the time? They are not pack-in titles with the exception of special edition consoles which not a lot of people bought but even NSMB2 outsold 64, both Galaxy games and Sunshine. People rarely even talk about them. Hell, NSMB DS and NSMB Wii are still the best selling mainline Mario games except for the very first one

>>9498448
I always thought they had the normie of appeal of "the old SMB nostalgia". Plus, they are deliberately simpler and allow multiplayer. This makes them have both wider appeal and accessibility (as well as the factor that you can play them at parties, at least NSMB on Wii). As you can see, targeting casuals and non-gamers paid off.

>>9498446
From what I understand, piracy never has been a huge factor in console / game sales, and makes only a fraction of lost sales. Unless we're talking about 3rd world countries.

>>9498479
>I always thought they had the normie of appeal of "the old SMB nostalgia"
Yeah my thoughts exactly but then again, it's pretty weird that there were Wii owners who bought NSMBWii but not Galaxy 1 or 2. It's like how can you look at Galaxy games and choose generic shit like NSMB over it? It's always interesting to observe video game sales because people are weird like that sometimes

>>9498526
Simply put, it's a more complex game. You forget that your average normie wouldn't even understand rotating camera / the whole Mario moveset / complicated puzzles / etc. Have you seen women play video games? They often can't even figure out basic stuff like holding B to run.
Every lost dummy like that is a lost sale on the market. That's the big reason a lot of the modern games have been dumbed down so much, with hour long tutorials like "press up to go forward".
Whole genres have seen this fate, like e.g. death of RTS and switch to MOBA. Because of increased budgets, you need to sell at least a million or more units just to break even. You have to target more people, and reach out to non-gamers. Appealing to a bunch of hardcore nerds isn't feasible in these conditions.

>>9498542
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbDLuDRgnkM&ab_channel=SamTheEnglishGamer
Reminds me of this. This tutorial video will never stop being funny

>>9498550
Holy shit. Well yeah, I get a feeling this stuff was made for elderly homes

>>9498020
by the time you get to games with MMC3 and 256k ROM the Famicom was coming to a close in Japan and being replaced by next gen consoles. developers still continued to make games for the Western market but peak Famicom was between 85-88, while in the West you had peak NES from 88-91.

>>9498056
The first run of Famicoms in 83 were faulty so Nintendo recalled them and suspended production for a few months to fix the problem. That interval momentarily allowed the SG-1000 to get ahead, and also because its games were cheaper.

>>9497252
>what? really? that's just crazy, how did that ever happen?
There were 869 total Mega Drive games but only 200 or so were sold in Japan.

>>9498874
the SNES had 1727 games. it's impressive just how huge of a gap in the game library there was.

>>9498887
The Genesis had a larger US library by a mere five games (719 against 714 SNES games)

>>9498887
Mostly due to the lopsided Japanese library, although a vast amount of that is shovelware. When you exclude all the trash Bandai/Banpresto anime/manga games, second rate Dragon Quest clones, sports/board game bullshit, and horse racing sims, the SNES's library gets a lot smaller.

>>9496158
You clearly weren’t there. The popular/mainstream view was that all gamers were nerds. It was kinda changing in the 90’s but the PS2 really pushed it all mainstream. Nobody cares about nerd hierarchy in the 90’s. All the “cool” gamers were from money, and owned both consoles. I get it, you were 4 when this was happening so you really don’t remember. Not your fault.

>>9498559
By the time we’re in our 70’s-80’s trying to replay old games we’ll be thankful

>>9498020
Lode Runner was a huge Famicom hit while in the US it was some outdated bullshit you rented for a weekend and nobody actually owned.

>>9498985
well come on, the game came out in Japan in 84 and we got it in 87?

>>9498629
not familiar with that but what was the issue with them?

>>9499071
The initial run of Famicoms had an incomplete and not fully debugged chipset, and they would overheat and lock up so Nintendo recalled them. They had the PPU heat sinked on those first Famicoms so apparently an issue there. I guess Ricoh took a while to figure out the process for the chips.

>>9499075
the first SNESes also had issues with faulty CPUs. i don't think Ricoh were as good at designing chips as, say, Sharp or Hitachi--took them a few revisions to have stable ones.

>>9498874
I'm reading that 450 were released in Japan in total. Why did they need to import? I thought Japanese didn't care for Western games much.

>>9498985
I guess that again, gaming was still partly in Atari era, and having ports of popular arcade hits was a big enough of a deal (like it was with Pac-Man on 2600). Hell, we're talking gaming before SMB here.
Ghosts'N'Goblins was pretty huge apparently, in the list in >>9497914 it's at #11. There's also Xevious, Commando, Twinbee, Gradius and Star Soldier in top 50. Obviously, Donkey Kong is on the list too (surprisingly low at #46, way lower than the other '83 games).

>>9499489
It was probably easier to get your hands on Castlevanis Bloodlines than Vampire Killer.

>>9499557
How so? There wasn't enough supply or something? I thought imports were always expensive in Japan. Pretty weird they'd have to import from the West and not the other way around.

>>9495731
>Langrisser 2 (Mega CD)
That was a cartridge game

>>9495772
>Moon runes
I feel like a weeb for still being able to read that shit -_-
I spent like 2 weeks learning nip so I could translate Ryuuki Denshou as I played like 20 years ago and I have not found a single use for it since

>>9498874
>There were 869 total Mega Drive games
add to those the MEGACD ones

>>9497780
I did

>>9499650
And the few from the 32x

>>9499610
How the fuck in 2 weeks?

>>9495963
>and the scene was also heavily import-focused as Japanese MD owners had no choice but to import a lot of US Genesis games.
Just like western Saturn consumers having to import snk and capcom fighters. Shows how mismanaged Sega was under Bernie Stolar. Sony didn't even want that 2D crap on their platform

>>9500021
32x only had 36 games

>>9500063
SCEA and SCEE were retards obsessed with flexing 3D. They didn't "ban" 2D games per se however all games had to have at least some 3D content to pass Q/C. Thus the reason for the museum rooms in the otherwise 2D Namco Museum.

I imagine MD was seen in japan the same way the TG16 is seen in the west.

>>9500263
TG16 was much much more of a nonfactor in the West. It got like 20 games total and was only sold in large cities.

>>9500269
in that case akin to the saturn in the west

>>9498887
NES/FC has 1380 games total. most of you probably thought the NES library was bigger but it's actually not.

>>9500298
The SFC kept going in Japan into the late 90s, one reason being the N64's non-success there.

>>9500269
More like 138 games (if you count carts + CDs). Certainly was small, just not that small.

>>9498253
He'll get back soon, it's a complicated question.

>>9495731
9. There is NO langrisser game on mega cd. I also say shining in the darkness sold 200.000+ copies

>>9500063ì
>Sony didn't even want that 2D crap on their platform
Because the playstation has very limited 2D capabilities. Once devs found out how to fake 2D games via polygon engines, and once those games sold too, Sony didnt oppose 2D games any longer.

>>9501419
Sony didn't oppose 2D games in Japan, it was the Western branches that had a beef with them.

>>9497734
GBA game world totals. Posting this one because I haven't yet and it's somewhat interesting.
Obviously, the top positions are Pokemon, SNES ports of Mario / Zelda / DKC, and NES Classics games. Still Mario Kart at #4, though I don't know if many played it via link cable—but I guess MK is always MK and will sell anywhere. At #8 you have Namco Museum, that series actually sold a fuckton back in the day; and after that at #9 Pac-Man collection. Kinda sad that today most of those ports / collections don't really hold much value (especially with their washed out colors).
Pretty good though that they are followed by Wario Land 4, Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga, Kirby: Nightmare in Dream Land, proving that GBA wasn't just for ports and Pokemon.
Sadly though, you have Finding Nemo immediately after those. You also have such gems on the list as The Incredibles (#31), Frogger's Adventures: Temple of the Frog (#33) (I still don't know how the fuck that series managed to make such a resurgence in late '90s–early '00s), Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (#34), and Disney Princess (#35), which is perhaps what your average kid on the school bus played. I think the 2000s were the heyday of licensed shovelware, it prospered on PS2 too.
On the positive note, there's still a big number of good games on the list, like The Legend of Zelda: The Minish Cap, Golden Sun, FFTA, Metroid Fusion, and even the 2 WarioWare games.
Alas, some of the best games like the 3 Castlevanias, Advance Wars, Mega Man Zero 1-4, and many others are not on the list.
All in all, this reminds me that most people actually owned either Mario Advance games, Pokemon, or cartoon game shovelware for it.

>>9501419
>Because the playstation has very limited 2D capabilities.
wrong
the only real limitation is vram, otherwise it's fast enough to draw pretty much anything you can throw at it

>>9502034
Never doubt your brainwashing.

>>9501428
Yep, and just SCEA not SCEE. You'll never believe who was in charge of SCEA during this period.

As I believe was mentioned, 2D wasn't outright banned but SCEA insisted all games contain some 3D content even if they were mostly 2D (this rule was relaxed in the last years of the PS1). As one example Spot Goes To Hollywood has 3D cutscenes while the game itself is 2D.

>>9502721
Oh ironing

>>9502730
Frankly, I can see where Stolar was coming from though. You can look at >>9497767 , you won't find many 2D games there beside Namco Museum and Tetris.

>>9501428
>>9502730
Back in the 90s there was this bit of news going through the mags, that sony japan rejected Metal Slug 1 for the playstation time and time again. And then they just caved in at some point. Anybody else remembers that?

>>9502034
ALL the neo-geo, CPS1, CPS2, CPS3 ports are shit on the playstation. Grainy jpeg movies where there should have been sprites. Polygons where there should have been sprites. Windowed, reduced resolution in almost all of them. Lag present when larger characters are on screen. Example the lag in SFA2 when Zangief vs Zangief. Sure blame the small ram, whatever. Fact is the ports suck balls. And even beyond that, there isnt a single visually impressive 2D game on the playstation. Its all just stuff that looked slightly outdated and empty for a mid 90s system. CPS, Neo Geo, PGM, F3, Saturn they all shit on the playstation in that regard.

>>9502752
I can't, good games are good games and what matter most.

>>9502761
>le Saturn was a 2D powerhouse
oh look, that meme again. if only it could do transparency

>>9502770
Are you a fucking bot script or something? Or just seriously retarded. I cannot tell.

>>9502026
nice

>>9498401
I did love playing CDs on my PSX though. But gaming was it's #1 function obvs.

>>9503515
PSX allegedly had excellent CD audio quality, to the point that audiophiles wanted it. Not sure about the difference between particular models though

>>9504268
>audiophiles
sick fucks

anyone have lists for PC Engine in Japan? I can't for the life of me find any

>>9504268
It's kind of a meme. The earliest JP models shared some components found in the higher end Sony CD players but the idea that it's secretly an audiophile grade CD player sold for $300 as a games machine isn't really true. But then again it's audiophiles, nothing they believe is really true.

>>9502761
>there isnt a single visually impressive 2D game on the playstation.
This is just flatout wrong

>>9502761
>there isnt a single visually impressive 2D game on the playstation.
Still has better SotN than Saturn. Still has MMX4. Still has great selection of 2D shmups and RPGs. I don't know what you're on about.
>CPS-3 ports
they were shit everywhere, not just Playstation.
>neo-geo
I think there was a special issue with these. Neo-Geo CD had shit slow 1x CD drive. Because of that, the loading times were horrendous. PSX loading times were just as bad. I guess these things were connected somehow.

>>9504538
Neo Geo used a traditional sprite engine fed directly by shittons of sprite ROM direct from the cartridge. Competing consoles with slow CD drives, limited RAM and framebuffer GPUs were almost designed to run Neo Geo games badly.
Neo Geo CD only managed to run the ports by blowing the budget on tons of RAM to use as a virtual cartridge.

>>9495797
Damn the Saturn was still ahead of the ps1 going into 97. Presumably the Dreamcast was announced by then and they dropped support for the Saturn.

>>9504538
Its sad that despite saturn sotn is a bad port, its still one of the best games of its type on it.
Some genres are so under represented on it

>>9504687
Sad that Saturn never got its Wonder Boy game. As well as its Sonic, Golden Axe, Streets of Rage, Phantasy Star…

>>9504606
I used to think Stolar made a good decision, but after looking at the charts I think otherwise. 1996 was Saturn still selling same numbers as PSX and N64 in Japan—what the fuck, Bernie? 1997–98 was when PSX really took off, too, so the same could have happened to Saturn. I even guess PSX basically became the only option for those who wanted a CD console with RPGs, so some of those numbers could have gone to Sega. Also, Sakura Taisen 2 came out in 1998 and was a big hit (see >>9495786 ).
I imagine they could still sell a few million Saturns there if they tried and didn't just pull the plug on it. Instead of spending money on R&D and advertisement for Dreamcast that sold 8.2 million units total (just 2.25 in Japan), they could've spent it on Saturn instead.

While we're at, Dreamcast. Pretty cool list. Sonic Adventure, RE Code Veronica, Seaman (!). Predictably, sequels to Saturn games did well too, with Sega Rally 2, Virtua Fighter 3 and Sakura Taisen 3 all in top 10. Predictable, you have Shenmue there too. Lots of fighters on the list, not just Soul Calibur but also Capcom vs SNK, Marvel vs Capcom 2, and Guilty Gear X (all three used Sega's Naomi board). That said, Sonic Adventure 2 is pretty low on the list, though it came out in 2001—but then again, other games like PSO ver.2, Sakura Taisen 3, Shemue 2 and even Capcom vs SNK 2 came out same year and still outsold it.

>>9504342
No one seems to have a clue on PCE sales beyond Tengai Makyo 2 "probably" being the best-selling game

>>9497805
Gems being bad is a bullshit myth with zero evidence that is mindlessly spread by everyone. If you look at contemporary game reviews, gems games music did not score worse on average. The whole gems sounding bad seems to have come from emulators. Gems sounds fine on real hardware.

>>9496950
The only people with worse taste in Japanese media than westerners are the Japs themselves.

>>9504550
>Neo Geo CD only managed to run the ports by blowing the budget on tons of RAM to use as a virtual cartridge.
Too bad that they went with 1x CD drive. The loading times were truly atrocious. https://youtu.be/64ArAUzvRGg
>loads before char select
>loads before pre-fight dialogue
>loads twice as long before the actual fight
in KoF, it loaded before each round.