/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9383181
Meme

It depends. If you get one for cheap or happened to score one before they became meme'd to $1000? Sure, have at it. But you're not getting $1000 worth of a better image compared to a free consumer TV that could be upwards 36" compared to the roughly 14"-20" PVMs.

Personally I don't think they look right. Sure, they're crisp as hell but for they're made for editing and broadcasting live action television, not playing video games. For video games I much prefer to match what they were made to be viewed on, which is an arcade monitor or the closest consumer equivalent. In other words, a curved consumer grade slot mask. You can't get much more authentic than that.

I never really cared much about 'em until I played on one in person. I went out and got an SSM (same exact tube in a different case) and love mine to death. Mostly, I appreciate that it has flat sides so that I can easily flip it and play vertically-orientated games. I've also never owned a 14" tube that had s-video before.

>>9383208
Yes, the boxy chassis is a nice feature if you want to play TATE or even just have to carry it around a lot. They're just way too expensive now compared to what they provide. Even a 9" Ikegami is a good $200 now. As someone who picks up excellent TVs from the curb, I'd have some serious buyer's remorse paying for that.

>>9383214
That's crazy. I got on the bandwagon pretty late and paid a little over $100 for my 14" SSM, but it was worth it to me. I use it often. I figured if I waited around any longer that they would only get more expensive.

>>9383181
>2015
>get BVM-20F1U with 5k hours off craigslist for free

>>9383231
MLiG's video caused them to shoot up and then they surged again along with everything else gaming related recently. Several years ago I helped a friend pick up a PVM-2030 he paid $600 for. Even then I thought it was outrageous for a slightly better television set but whatever, I could just barely understand the logic. But now that same model is twice that. At this point you may as well just by a nice OLED and use filters.

>>9383181
Depends on the game. A PVM can be too sharp for some games IMO. Better to play on a low TVL count tube. Overall I think high TVL count and muh scanlines are highly overrated.

That said, PVMs do have other advantages such as better color accuracy and geometry. Then again, a good quality PC monitor will do just as fine (if not better) on most of these specs.

I have a bunch of CRTs, but in the end I play about 80% of my retro games on a comparatively cheap JVC security monitor.

>>9383251
I wouldn't be surprised if that security monitor was basically a rebranded TM.

That small screen looks uncomfy. I prefer a normal Trinitron, but with a big screen instead. Also, mine only costed 20$ and I could get it from some boomers next town.

>>9383257
You're right. It's a Philips LTC2917/90, which is actually a rebranded JVC TM-1700PN. I wrote a wiki entry on consolemods about it.

I think JVC had some sort of deal with tube manufacturers that allowed them to get tubes in exchange for a rebranding license. They didn't have their own tube factory so you'll find all kinds of tubes in JVC monitors.

>>9383181
Yes, PVMs are great and games look incredible on them. That being said it's not really something I would recommend unless you are a serious enthusiast, not just of reteo gaming but also for CRTs and vintage electronics in general. It's akin to hifi audio, if you are an enthusiast you will certainly get more enjoyment from upgrading your stereo components, but for the average person who just wants to enjoy music at a high quality a consumer level stereo is good enough. The same would apply to CRT televisions.

>>9383257
Yeah, they usually are. They are similar tubes built to the same specs as PVMs to withstand the long running conditions, just usually just have less bells and whistles to save of costs and be simple.

>>9383181
>Let's settle this once and for all.
>Are all X identical?
The answer is almost always no
If asking a question, consider that before posting
If shitposting, back to le /v/

Can PVMs do this?

>>9383181
200% meme

>>9383181
PVMs are a meme. Nobody actually used these for gaming back in the 90s. 99.99% of people were using regular CRTs.

You forget about all this shit after like 20 minutes of actually playing a game.

Yes they're great. They have value over a consumer CRT, and a consumer CRT has some value over a PVM. You choose on a case by case basis per game.
>B-But developer intended consumer CRT
True. I have a consumer CRT too. I use both. Some games benefit from PVM color accuracy and fidelity though. The only CRT users who say don't get a PVM are sour grapes losers, or spacelets in tiny apartments.

>>9383181
I got 5 PVMs ranging from 9 to 20 inches for free or close to it, and I still prefer my 32 inch D-Series JVC using S Video over all of them. so, yeah, PVMs are pretty much a meme and definitely not worth it now.

>>9383262
JVC's D-Series line is notorious for this. The tubes come from a good half dozen manufacturers. They're all consistently "good" to the point that it doesn't really matter but they're all over the place with it if you want a very specific look.

>>9383181
They're a meme. We played games on TVs, not security monitors.

>>9383365
Damn that looks so good.
Got any more pics?

>>9383271
>The same would apply to CRT televisions.
I think this has to come with caveats though. Because it's not a linear scale. What counts as "better" is often in the eye of the beholder. It depends on what you prefer. I for example am over the Trinitron hype. I realize I much prefer the look of a slot mask vs an aperture grille for video games. Maybe it's because that's what arcade cabs used but nevertheless it means a technically "better" screen isn't necessarily better for my specific goals. I think people come in wanting PVMs thinking it's some kind of linear scale where everything is better or worse in orderly fashion but it doesn't really work that way.

>>9383393
a couple old ones, I really should take some more because this is a gorgeous display

>>9383419
for comparison, this is the 20 inch PVM over SCART

>>9383353
>The only CRT users who say don't get a PVM are sour grapes losers
And here we go. Didn't take long at all.

>>9383429
and the 9 inch over composite

>>9383181
they're great if you have binoculars attached to your head or if you play 4 inches away from the screen. I prefer my big D-series. Big, vibrant picture, not left on in a studio for 25,000 hours, and it has all the inputs I need.

I have both a PVM and a shadowmask set and i generally think the NES, SNES and Genesis look better on the PVM, and the Saturn, PS1 and N64 look better on the shadowmask
I use both all the time
The worst part of my PVM is that it whines like a motherfucker lol

>>9383181
PVMs sharpen the image too much desu. they get rid of the color blending that you'd get a crt for in the first place

>>9383312
Of course no one was using them for games back when they were new, insanely expensive, and only used in professional contexts.
The fuck does that have to do if they are good for games now?

I have four CRT monitors which I use for console gaming - my main one an NEC XP29, sub one used for older consoles (FC/NES and MSX) an Ikegami TM20-17R (I think that's the model number), a Sony KV1380R, and some large flat-screen Sony CRT.

Overall, the NEC is my favorite, and provides a good compromise between authenticity to the general eras of consoles I use it with, wide compatibility, and a great image quality overall. That said, the KV1380R is exactly the type of TV a lot of regular people would've used to play consoles back then (granted, not me, because through a large chunk of the 90s I was stuck using some RF only TV), so there's a special charm to it, even though it doesn't have the best image quality, on top of only supporting composite and RF.

At the end of the day, just use whatever looks best to you. In terms of "serious" game play, I prefer to fire up the NEC monitor, but in terms of comfy, before bedtime dicking around, the KV1380R is ideal.

>>9383684
>my main one an NEC XP29
I am jealous.

>>9383720
I got it off craigslist several years ago for relatively cheap, considering it was apparently almost unused.

>>9383294
no
but for titles that don't rely on composite-blur sony sets are great, albeit overpriced for what they actually are

>>9383181
like i said in the \bst\ thread
sony makes great sets
however they are not always best
depending on what system\game you are running

i do recommend a nice crt however
i think the sony sets can get outrageous in price
mostly due to youtube echo-chambers and redditors

>>9384058
>i think the sony sets can get outrageous in price mostly due to youtube echo-chambers and redditors
This is happening with all CRTs now. Almost every listing is now "great for gaming!" even if it's some random RF only bedroom TV. We're coming up against the end of freebies, too, because after 20 years most people have discarded them already. Give it another two or three years and watch how much consumer CRTs spike in price. Right now you can still find ordinary people who just want them gone and if someone doesn't take it then in the trash it goes. Once that source dries up and they're all in the hands of people who want them...

>>9383365
>>9383419
For a 32” set, that geometry and convergence is better than any other set I’ve seen
Does it do 480i just as well?

>>9384067
>This is happening with all CRTs now
i think it depends on where you live
i still find free \ insanely cheap crt often
but i also live in a metropolitan area

ignore all "i know what i have" shitposters
or better yet message them and ask them what their realistic price is; i would never pay more than $100 unless the unit is recapped\tested
check thrift stores often,
i find pink disney\hellokitty crt pretty often
i paid $4.99 for my disney tv, and its honestly pretty good for arcade shit, i might disassemble it and throw it in a cabinet kek

>>9383181
It was fine when could get a top of the line CRT with for cheap or free. Now that people vastly overcharge for them, you have to be a fool to pay 1000 bucks on a sub-20 inch set just for RGB which sorta neglects the appeal of the traditional CRT look.

>>9383181
They are nice, but ultimately a meme.
Consumer set composite-in is God’s way.

>>9384138
"Traditional" CRTs used to have RGB too, just not in America.

>>9384058
If I'm looking for a 20-25" CRT for everything from SNES/Genesis through PS2/Gamecube/Wii, is there an absolutely clear best choice for a CRT? Or maybe a good resource I could review. I'm willing to pay whatever I have to, really don't care, as long as I get a good option.

>>9384169
Where are you located?
Don't focus on brands, test the set you're getting and choose the one with the best picture/geometry.

>>9383181
>Are PVMs the best looking CRTs to use for retro consoles
There is no such thing.
There is no one-solution CRT for /vr/ games.
There are many types of PVMs anyway.
>or are they a meme used by people that don't care about authenticity?
No, they are excellent substitutes for an arcade monitor or genera purpose RGB monitor for those consoles games which benefit from RGB.

>>9384176
Large midwestern US city. Testing makes sense of course. Is there a set of years I'd be looking for? Late 90's to early 2000's?

>>9384239
If money is absolutely not a problem, then look for a Wega and make sure it has a good geometry.
Just be aware that Wegas are becoming quite popular and some people are selling then for absurd prices. If it's too expensive, ask if it has been serviced.

Anyhow, get a TV with component if you want the best quality. Curved sets tend to have better geometry but are also older and might be easier to suddenly break. Toshibas and JVCs are also pretty good.

>>9384279
Thanks anon. Appreciate the starting point

Trinitrons suck due to those damper wires that are embedded in the screen. Also retro games were never meant to be seen with such thin scan lines. Looks like you're viewing them through a screen door.

>>9384586
It's a matter of preference.

>>9384586
>Also retro games were never meant to be seen with such thin scan lines.
I doubt that's true. Most common JP consumer sets were 14 inches and under. And most 14 inch sets have almost no scanlines.

>>9383181
just use any moderately decent crt you can get your hands on, that's what 99% of people did when those types of televisions were in use. people didn't have autism fits over the geometry or type of shadow mask, they just played the fucking games

The best CRTs for retro games are the ones with a subtle enough scanline effect that you forget it's even a thing. The image has a pleasing texture to it almost like woven fabric.

>>9383181
Honestly I think that most of this quest for authenticity stuff is just chasing the dragon to relive something that's never coming back. We're all sick on here, trying you get back to a time in our lives that is long gone, or worse, you could be a zoom zoom trying to capture the feeling of an era you never lived.

>>9384669
>The best CRTs for retro games are the ones with a subtle enough scanline effect that you forget it's even a thing
I disagree, I prefer it to look like these posts
>>9383365
>>9383419

>>9384683
this, I think the most "authentic" crt would be some sanyo or whatever the fuck crt a white middle-ish class family would have in the mid to late 90s. I don't know about anyone else here but I sure as FUCK didn't have any of this autistic tiny ass pvm shit in my house, nor did I know anyone with one in theirs. Oh, and throw in an RF modulator as well for anything that had to use composite cables. I didn't have a television that actually had composite inputs until well into the early 2000s, let alone s video. How's that for authentic??

>>9384683
nope, I enjoy playing games on a CRT
but you keep projecting

>>9384697
I used S-video on my N64 back when Ocarina came out.

>>9384706
That's dandy for you, Mr. Rockefeller, I was stuck using the rf adapter in my hand me down woodgrain POS from the early 80s (at least)

>>9384719
Really? My family was poor and we lived in shitty apartment complex with shootings and cops swarming the area back then and we still could get a decent TV from Circuit City. Only reason I used S-video is because I bought a cable that could be used for PS1 and N64 since I had both consoles.

I'd get one but the power draw seems to be really over the top and I don't need things to looks like that.
I have an old Sylvania TV that looks exactly how I remember it, and I'm fine with that.
Looks like shit and buzzes a lot bzzzzzzzz.

>>9384735
>My family was poor
>had a TV with S-video
>had specialized cables for S-video
>had more than 1 current generation console at once
You were not poor.

>>9384828
Or they were poor in the “make constant bad choices and be scrambling for rent money every month” kinda way

>>9383181
kids in the 90s didn't give a fuck about what TV they played games on.
the only real rule then was bigger was better.

>>9384735
I remember everyone using RF because it wasn't common to buy new TVs

>>9384697
>i was poor so everyone else was poor
poorfags. lol.

>>9384828
A TV with S-Video in 1998 isn't richfag status or even close.
The cable I got was some cheap cable with worse composite quality than the one's the consoles came with. I just wanted one cable for both consoles.
I had a PS1 first, but Gran Turismo killed the laser. I got an N64 for Christmas from my grandparents since they felt bad I had no console any more. Then I was able to fix the PS1 and had both consoles.

Surely prosumer sets like the PVM-2730 would be the middle ground here? It probably depends on the game, but if you had to pick one set, i mean.

>>9384854
>the only real rule then was bigger was better.
even then I knew that was retarded, I elected to play games on a smaller screen because the image was better than the giant console clunker we owned

>>9383181
You don't need more than 292 TV Lines to display SNES so they high line count PVM/BVMs for Retro Games are a meme.
Scanline gaps are gay and ruin the image quality.

>>9384058
>no
Yes they can
Most PVM/BVMs take composite

>>9383294
Pretty sure Sonic 2 Emerald Hill waterfalls aren't transparent like Sonic 1

>>9384669
There is zero scanline effect in that pic because there is no horizontal gap

>>9385367
nta but that's how my set is, could you elaborate?

you don't notice the difference if you actually play games instead of posting pictures of title screens on reddit

>>9385424
>Beat game
>Goes back to title screen
>Take picture
>some anon on /vr/ acts salty
many such cases

As someone who has 2 of them, and got them years ago before they became more expensive than they should be, yeah they are really high end sets and they look really good. But a good quality 2000s consumer CRT is like 75% of the way there and a LOT cheaper. I would only go for PVMs now if you have money to blow and REALLY care about having the best image quality. If you want to play games and have them look like they should have back in the day just get a later era consumer set.

>>9383181
You haven't lived until you've used a key to unlock a slide-out tray and turn on a test pattern. But yeah they're a meme. It is nice to have something so well made though

>>9383181
Everyone who's +30yo on this board threw out all their CRT's when flat panels got cheap, and we're not wrong for doing it. I had 2x 22" Mitsubishi DiamondPro monitors that would make the house lights flicker when I turned them on. They were huge awful things that took up valuable desk real estate and I'm glad they've gone the way of the dinosaur

>But muh pixel clarity
Nigga we had 1024x768 resolutions and sub-megahertz processors back then. Of course it looks better on a monitor that is deeper than it is wide, because it's a monitor made for ants. Play that shit through a modern emulator and throw the output onto a big 4K screen with a bluetooth controller that looks exactly like your old controller but costs $10 on Aliexpress

>>9385482
>Play that shit through a modern emulator and throw the output onto a big 4K screen with a bluetooth controller that looks exactly like your old controller but costs $10 on Aliexpress
This sounds like a fucking nightmare

>>9385482
>I’m going to speak for everyone because of my personal opinion
What is wrong with you people

>>9384683
>We're all sick on here, trying you get back to a time in our lives that is long gone,
Huge amounts of projection. Rarely do I ever feel "nostalgic" for this shit or think about its relation to my childhood. I just like video games, and most of the time I prefer /vr/ ones. I mostly play retro games I've never played before, not ones I played to death as a kid. Get over yourself.

>>9385364
pretty sure you need to delete this

>>9385360
wrong number of lines
"wrong" aka different scanlines
just because it 'can' take composite doesn't mean its the best at it


anyone saying otherwise has ebay buyers remorse

>>9384828
>>9384735
>>9384719
>>9384706
atleast you knew what it was
i was literally a dumbass kid &
we scored a used 3D0 at a yardsale
i never used anything other than RF or composite until i was already a man
the irony is i probably had atleast a couple sets with s-video

>>9385482
>Everyone who's older than me did blah blah blah

>>9385508
>people
implying

>>9383181
You can get near PVM picture clarity on a Sony Trinitron consumer TV. Adjust focus, convergeance and geometry. The result can be stunning and better than factory. However the phosphors are a bit weaker. But not that far off.

>>9385482
>sub-megahertz processors
This nigger hooking up 60s mainframes to his telly

>>9384697
>>9383391
>>9383312
There are plenty of legitimate reasons to criticize PVMs.
- Any at a reasonable price will be small
- Any at a reasonable size will be radically more expensive
- Too expensive in general for what you get
- Simply don't like the look
But "I didn't have one in the '90s, therefore it's bad" is reaching levels of nostalgia faggotry that shouldn't be possible.

>>9386416
It's not "I didn't have one in the 90's, therefore it's bad," it's "literally zero people had them ever because they're not designed for home use whatsoever, therefore it's absolutely pants on head retarded to use one if your goal is replicating the original intended experience of playing these games."

>>9385367
anon that pic has very clearly defined and visible scanlines

>>9383181
They're good, but people overstate them.
I used one with a TV broadcast camera for several years.

>>9384735
I had a 27 inch 4:3 JVC CRT with S-Video there abouts.

Good quality for NTSC but my dad bought a display model which meant it had to be repaired a couple times.

>>9386460
>original intended experience
Useless concept. Retro stuff looks good on normal CRTs and even better on PVMs, that's it

>>9383181
I play all my retro games off of a 4K resolution flat screen with a professional grade camera aimed at it outputting to a PVM, just like the developers intended.

PVMs are a meme at current prices. They're great for native RGB support, razor sharp, and flexible in many setups, but I can't justify paying >$500 for an experience I can get by modding a Trinitron I found on the street.

Get an NEC Multisync if you want a PVM without the price

>>9386590
Maybe I'm just biased because I just generally don't like the look of PVMs in the first place, so to me it's just paying a lot of money to get an inauthentic experience that looks weird. Younger people seem to like them because their idea of CRTs is having these really pronounced scanlines (probably because they grew up with shitty scanline filters in emulators and such) but to me it just looks weird and nothing like I remember.

>>9386787
Gaming magazines (picrel is the first famitsu, I think) always had images with pronounced scanlines. Many arcades also used high TVL monitors that produced this effect, so I think it's fair to say that even some boomers want them.

>>9383181
I think too many people treat CRT's like modern hardware looking for specific make and model on eBay, it's not like that. You just find whatever you stumble upon and use it. It's the kind of thing you basically have to buy in person anyway, so there's no point in trying to hunt down specific models. Personally I find them to be kind of overrated in general, yeah they were great in the 90's, but honestly setting them up is kind of a pain, you get like 60% screen real estate and 40% of just heavy plastic and metal. Much easier to just use a good CRT filter on your main TV instead

You dont need one to play games, but they're definitely not "memes", the colors and geometry are much better than a regular TV.

>>9385482
>Everyone who's +30yo on this board threw out all their CRT's when flat panels got cheap, and we're not wrong for doing it.
So true. I tried going back but the screens are so tiny and the boxes are so huge.
>Play that shit through a modern emulator and throw the output onto a big 4K screen with a bluetooth controller that looks exactly like your old controller but costs $10 on Aliexpress
This is basically how I play all of my games now. So much better

>>9386460
>"literally zero people had them ever because they're not designed for home use whatsoever, therefore it's absolutely pants on head retarded to use one if your goal is replicating the original intended experience of playing these games."
>period-accurate premium gear is for losers.
Why would you even want top of the line gear you'd've lusted after had you known it existed? Oh wait, i see why. That's why i have some now.

>>9387173
>Much easier to just use a good CRT filter on your main TV instead
You're a fucking idiot
Nobody listen to this anon

>>9383181
I think PVMs are cool and fun and I really like how they look both as a display and as furniture. I've personally switched back to using upscalers with a nice OLED and my childhood early 2000s sanyo TV. In the end it's all about the games, and authenticity doesn't really matter as long as the games run correctly.
For my money, having a convenient and streamlined setup is more important than the display tech. I only need 1 display to play literally everything from the NES to modern console games and the fact I don't have to switch setups or drag out a CRT to play makes me a lot more eager to try out old games.

My favorite way to play old games alone is definitely on my PVM that I have at my desk. It also doubles as a nice monitor stand for my PC whenever I'm not using it.
Whenever I have company over and want to play old games in the living room, I use an upscaler on my OLED TV.

>>9386765
>Get an NEC Multisync if you want a PVM without the price
Those are impossible to find. Sony PVMs are popular because despite their cost they're actually pretty easy to come by. NEC XM29s on the other hand...

>>9383240
>MLiG's video caused them to shoot up
Who the fuck is that? Why do people on /vr/ always insist everyone is obsessed with their shitty youtubers?

>>9383181
PVMs look like shit over composite the best video signal. Also squinting at a 14" screen is gay.

>>9387790
Youtubers really do affect the market these days. You can hate it but you can't ignore it.

>>9383181
No one cares you fucking nerd

>>9387814
>composite the best video signal
well since you insist on being retarded I'll leave you to it

>>9387182
fuck off samefag, that image is disgusting, you don't belong here

I always see people complaining about small screen size, but unless you are playing from several meters away a 20" is more than big enough.

Hell, I play most of my games on a 17". Granted I do sit quite close to the screen, but it's basically the same thing as you would do playing PC games. I even think a 14" can work if you put it on your desk and you sit close enough. It's not ideal, but it takes up less space as well.

Obviously this isn't going to work if you intend to sit on a sofa, but I'm thinking a lot of people put their gaming stuff in their office anyway because the wife doesn't want 12 different consoles in the living room.

>>9387984
I've got a 20" PVM, and I spend most of my time playing retro games on a 43" monitor instead because a 35" 4:3 picture is just better. Even when I was a kid, I much preferred using the much nicer 26" screen in the living room over my 14" one.

Bigger is better. There's only so close you can sit to a screen and be comfortable.

>>9383181
The gain is minimal, sometimes games will look worse through RGB, and the amount of negatives outweigh the positives massively. You're looking at a fucking tiny screen that can't be fixed once it goes, costs an arm and a leg and is somehow heavier than consumer CRTs.

PVMs could be cool if you got one for 50 bucks as a novelty and to benchmark image differences, but the diminishing returns are massive. A high quality consumer set with S-video, and component for 6th gen is the perfect stopping point.

>>9388004
>There's only so close you can sit to a screen and be comfortable.
You are taking 15 minute breaks each hour, right anon?

>>9388004

>43" monitor

You mean TV? Or what kind of monitor is that?

>>9388067
A 4k one. Technically it's commercial signage, but I'm pretty sure there are a few companies out there making legitimate monitors at a sensible size. This just happened to be the cheapest, and it's an RGB panel instead of the more common BGR junk. Lots of TVs won't properly go into standby mode when you turn off your computer, commercial monitors do because they don't have all the smartTV shitware bloat.

>>9387790
Because whether you like it or not almost a million people have watched that video.

>>9388148
correlation is not causation anon
a million clicks is not the same as a million consumers pretending to buy things

the news would have caught wind of it,
they would have caused the fatcats to move $ around and fan the flames of the frenzy even moreso

>>9388218
I don't think you understand exactly how small of a niche PVMs are.

>>9383236
>2015~
>After months of searching, finally see a PVM for sale, a 20M4U
>Some video production studio is getting rid of it
>$200
>Jeeze, that's a lot for a CRT...
>Check prices today: $1800
In my area, even decent consumer CRTs are going for $200+ because everyone knows about muh retro gaming. Pic related
>Random JVC TV, unknown model number, that was sitting in storage for a couple of decades?
>That'll be $100, goy.

>>9386460
>therefore it's absolutely pants on head retarded to use one if your goal is replicating the original intended experience of playing these games
The original experience sucked. I always wished my TV at home looked as sharp as arcade game monitors / computer monitors did, I just didn't have the know-how or money to make it happen back then.
I'm not attempting to recapture anything. I just want to find cool hardware and play cool games on it.

>>9383181
I have a 2950QM and 2 other PVMs. They’re incredible. However, I would never pay 2022 prices for one. They’re not worth it.

>>9388218
I can't even begin to explain how monumentally stupid this post.

>>9388304
>Random JVC, unknown model
that's an i'art, a great JVC CRT second only to the D-series

>>9387790
It's the truth, those fuckfaces ruined everything.

>>9387709
>>9387723
>>9387182
>>9383240
umm, schizo bros??

>>9383181
They look better than consumer sets. There's no denying that. but they are NOT worth the price tag nowadays. You seriously start getting diminishing returns past good consumer sets with component.

>>9388850
I'm the second guy and I don't exactly know what you're getting at

>>9388708
Aren't flat screen CRTs prone to bad geometry issues?

Dumb retard here
I recently found a PVM-1390 which has a DB25 port for component and I have no idea what to do with it. Am I supposed to find a DB25 to SCART and then plug that into my consoles? It seems a bit unwieldly but I can't find a DB25 to component cable anywhere I've searched.

>>9389127
Ascend to the S-video master race and help us to purge the RGBrews.

>>9389127
>PVM-1390
Looks like the best output there is the s-video, at least it's better than composite which is all I find these days, aka the leftovers BVM and PVM.

>>9389127
this is what you need

>>9389126
That's just an adage that's been repeated ad nauseum by redditors trying to sound like they know what they're talking about. These TVs are all decades old. They all can be prone to bad geometry. That's dependent of lifetime usage and storage conditions.

>>9389162
Yeah, but weren't these known for geometry issues when they were brand new?

>>9389162
Nah they’ve got worse geometry because of how refraction works

>>9389126
I don't know about that, but I know they're prone to being heavier than your mother after a night at the buffet.

>>9389201
In general they do but most times it's only marginally worse. Still worse, but all CRTs are going to have minor geometry issues somewhere. None of them are perfect. Flat screen are just a little less so. I've seen bad ones and I've seen ones I'd never complain about, same as curved sets.

>>9385482
LCDs were a direct downgrade from CRTs in nearly every aspect except for resolution (that was fixed) and space until recently. Only now are LCDs finally starting to surpass CRTs but even then they still aren't idea for original hardware. Playing any video game, modern or not, on a flat panel made more than 2 years ago is a nightmare riddled with input lag and washed out colors.

>>9389135
>>9389136
I'd love to use S-Video instead but I mostly play on a Model 1 Genesis and I don't have the heart to mod it yet.
>>9389146
Seems like this is my best bet. Thanks, anons.

>>9389403
>I'd love to use S-Video instead but I mostly play on a Model 1 Genesis and I don't have the heart to mod it yet.
Yeah, I know what you mean. The bitch of it is that the model 1 has better sound... but you also have to get stereo audio out of the front headphone jack. My MiSTer is going to show up tomorrow and all of my 8/16-bit systems are going into storage, along with the Saturn. PS2, N64, Gamecube and XBOX are going to have to stick around.

>>9383187
fpbp

>>9389127
>>9389136
The PVM-1390 accepts RGB with that strange connector at the right. There is guy that sells the adapter for that to SCART

>>9388218
>We interrupt Ukraine war coverage to bring you breaking news: PVMs have gone up in price in the retro gaming community.

Assuming money was no problem at all, what CRT would you to play vidya?

>>9391038
Probably something like the KX-34HV2.
Giant Trinitron with JP21 input. Don't actually know any details about it, but I see ones like it on auction sites sometimes and it looks awesome.
Space is a concern as well as price, though.

>>9391038
Sony FW900.

>>9391038
Really any new old stock, major brands, though a Mitsubishi would be nice.

>he doesnt play videogames on pro equipment that used to cost thousands of dollars

>>9391038
There is a vid on yt where a jap shows a jap only Sony-crt, one of the latest models, playing some Gayass visual novel with insane picture quality.

That one, but can’t find the vid.

>>9389573
Different guy, but ironically this is mostly why I still keep a Sega CD around. I also don’t really have it in me to mod it for S-video, though. It looks good enough over composite that I can’t be bothered to do it, at least not yet.

>>9391038
Toshiba A series. Curved, component, shadowmask tube that looks as good as any arcade cabinet.

They're being slept on and it's a shame.

>>9389749
>We interrupt Ukraine war coverage to bring you breaking news: PVMs have gone up in price in the retro gaming community.

>>9391658
This?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKRY2U_N9XI

>>9387656
He actually makes a valid point, and he's right for the most part.
I have a small Dell flat screen monitor from around 2005 hooked up to my desktop, and I use it with retroarch and filters. It's fine for the most part, and it's much more convenient to use than my Atari sc monitor or my Trinitron crt.

>>9388304
You just need patience, my Facebook Marketplace was dry only a couple months ago but I got a Sony KV-27TS36 from a guy for $40. He wasn't even some misguided boomer either, he asked me if I was gonna use it to play Melee.

>>9392547
>You just need patience
I already have my PVM, I just like keeping tabs on what's going on.

>>9391946
Yup that’s the one, probably one of, if not the best crt ever made.

>>9393409
Best CRT ever made is the BVM-D32E1WU.

>>9393786
If we go by the specs, it's the GDM-F520

>>9393801
Cant deal properly with HD content due to the aspect ratio, the FW900 is better.

>>9393813
I'm going by specs alone, if we go into something as subjective as the use case (widescreen content) the winner can vary. Subjectively speaking, the best CRT for me would be the KX-14CP1 because I like how it looks

>>9383190
>arcade monitor
Was there anything of the sort for sale, or were they manufactured exclusively for the cabinets?

I have RCA XL 100 crt monitor I got for free off of Craigslist, and apparently it goes for the triple digits In secondhand markets. Anyways I have a problem I need to solve, because I recently bought a Japanese ps2 in order to play imports, but no image appears on the screen. Anyone have any solution to fix this? Pic related are the specs for the crt

>>9394337
And here are the ps2's specs

>>9394337
Does the TV display other consoles, and does the PS2 work on other displays?

>>9394348
It displays my ntsc-u/c ps2, my wii console and n64, but no dice on the ntsc-j ps2

>>9394438
>and does the PS2 work on other displays?

>>9389749
>>We interrupt Ukraine war coverage to bring you breaking news: PVMs have gone up in price in the retro gaming community.

>>9394443
Nah

>>9394475
So the PS2 is broken.

Sounds like PVMs are a meme afterall...

It's over

Had one of these in better shape I got a couple fo years ago for 200 (which I later sold because I didn't like the tiny screen as a main display)

>>9393786
I'd like to try a Panasonic AT-H3017W myself. A multiformat curved widescreen master grade monitor, complete with a pull-out tray of controls for the wow factor. At 100tvl it might be a little too much, but I'd still sell a kidney to get one.

>>9392382
I can't understand how anyone is ok with it as a straight up replacement for CRTs, it always looks worse than real CRTs without fail. LCDs can't into real motion clarity.

>>9397501
for a lot of games it doesn't really matter

>>9383181
I think the crisp look you get with higher TVL and RGB is great. Is it worth spending hundreds of dollars for it when you can still find working CRTs with component on the side of the road? No.
>or are they a meme used by people that don't care about authenticity?
The argument over authenticity is dumb since it's a subjective metric regardless of how many times the Sonic 2 waterfall get posted. Europeans will think 50hz games over SCART look authentic. Nearly every single pro monitor supports a composite input anyway.
>>9391038
It's a little softer and less vibrant than a Trinitron, but I really like my MegaView 29. If it had a quieter fan and was less wonky with +480p output from consoles, it'd be perfect.

>>9396106
PVMeme and overall everyone jerking off to Sony made stuff is great.
Tons of high end sets sets around these parts with Philips Blackline tubes which were used in plenty of arcade monitors, high end sets and professional monitors.

>>9397613
It actually matters quite a bit when everything looks worse in motion. Eye doctor, now.

>emulationfags try to make their games look more like a cheap TV
>hardwarefags try to make their games look more emulated

>>9397280
Holy moly

>>9399057
anonkun
i have a 240hz gaming monitor
i spam the ufo test at everything from 60hz to 240hz
there is basically zero ghosting or blur and my monitor is an IPS panel

gaming monitors have come a LONG way even in the last 5-7 years
i still keep the crts around but not for motion clarity i keep them for phosphor bloom and blending effects in games where i know the visuals are beautiful

>>9397613
>for a lot of people with low standards it doesn't really matter
This

They're great if you can get a decent size for a reasonable price but honestly a good consumer crt with component support is perfectly fine and way easier to find. There is no reason to go out of your way to get a PVM, but if you ever happen to get the chance grab one.

t. Zoomer who fell for the PVM meme

>>9391038
Intergraph InterView 28hd96

Money isn't an issue they're just super rare.

>>9399645
> i keep them for phosphor bloom and blending effects in games where i know the visuals are beautiful
Which games?

If you want to be truly "authentic" then you'd just have whatever your parents get for you, so whatever cheap shit you laid your hands on.

>>9400147
This is the best takeaway. They're good but they aren't $1000 good. If you can get one cheap (at this point good luck) then more power to you.

would you rather have a real crt or a 4k monitor with a CRT shader like CRT-Royale?

>>9400890
I have both. If I could only have one, it'd obviously be the 4k monitor, it's useful for both retro gaming and everything else I use a PC for. But shaders can be a bit of a hassle if you run multiple setups. I still haven't found a nice triad filter for old PC and DOS games, same for a nice DC and newer 480p centric one. For 240p, it's great, very close to my PVM.

I would miss booting up light gun games on my PC CRT monitor, though. There's no other good way to play a lot of these titles yet, LCD based light gun solutions are still utter garbage, and I like doing a run through of HotD every few months. They're not good enough to forego the modern 4k computing experience, though.

>>9398907
Basically everything is "authentic". Does the console support cvbs,s-video, RGB natively etc well that's authentic.
>Noo you can only play on age appropriate sets
So when my parents were away and I decided to hook up my PS1 to a 2000s silverfish set it wasn't actually authentic.
This "community" is so goddamn retarded it's insane.

>>9398907
that black looks very red

>>9400890
Just a 4k monitor. I don’t miss CRTs at all. I would never use a shader. Looking sharp.

>>9401029
Get out.

>>9401019
So much this.
Getting the best signal possible out of your consoles while using the best pieces of display technology they were designed for, i.e. standard definition CRTs is as authentic as it gets.
Playing SFC games on a 2005 Trinitron or a PVM is authentic. Playing PS2 games on an old RF-only set your grand-grandmother used to watch Hitler's speeches on is authentic too.
Only emulating and playing on a modern digital display through a scaler is what's not authentic, but if you're using that then you surely don't give a shit about authenticity.

>>9401037
I blame it on youtube e-celeb tards. They have basically run out of content, so they have to start shilling the absolute most brain-dead retarded shit to keep the click dole running.

>>9401035
Never.

>>9401019
>So when my parents were away and I decided to hook up my PS1 to period correct technology it wasn't actually authentic.
What the fuck are you going on about? You're insane, not well.

>>9401021
That's part of the game.

>>9401303
>Period correct launch ps1
>2000s grey set
Get the fuck out zoomer.

>>9401410
Talking about CRTs in general you absolute troglodyte

>>9401410
Also guess what year this console revision released

>>9401637
>A poor fag buying the discount version in 2000
>Playing on some recently produced brand name telly
This is more accurate

>>9401668
You're being pedantic

>>9391310
You can still find them if you look hard enough and have patience. I actually got a NOS Mitsubishi Diamond Scan 90E a while back for 50€. Released in '99 so not state of the art, but still has decent specs. It's a 19" shadow mask, but it does go up to 96kHz horizontal and has a 0.25mm dot pitch.

I'm curious to see what it looks like, but on the other hand I kinda want to keep it in it's unused state just to preserve it.

>>9383181
If you live in the US they're worth it because they have RGB input. Pointless in Europe and Japan where consumer RGB was commonplace.

>>9403517
I don't think consumer RGB was very commonplace on Japanese TVs. At least these days it's very rare to find a TV with the 21 pin RGB port on it to the point where those that do have it are rare and sought after and go for as much as, if not more than PVMs.
Connecting consoles to computer monitors was probably more common for those that wanted RGB.

S-video looking aight

>>9403906
>Connecting consoles to computer monitors was probably more common for those that wanted RGB.
Didn't they mostly use use 31khz monitors in Japan since the PC98 and all that was mostly IBM-compatible? Computers that used TV compatible 15khz output mainly common in Europe.

>>9383181
It comes down to preference. You might prefer the scanline look, or the blurr that's inherent on composite displays. Different games look better with each. The best solution is to play em on an emulator first, see which aesthetic you prefer, then make the purchase.

>>9403906
Component over D-terminal is very common on later sets. Trinitrons starting from 1997 even have an AV multi in with the same connector that's found on PS1/2/3 and it's RGB capable.

>>9404110
I'm not really sure, I just see a lot of devices designed to let you play consoles on monitors. Mostly Micomsoft stuff.
>>9406615
Good point about that proprietary Sony connector. Forgot about that.

>>9389164
>Yeah, but weren't these known for geometry issues when they were brand new?
Yes, they were like this even when brand new. The greater the curve the more likely geometry won't be disgusting

I don't see a CRT general up so I'm just gonna ask here.
Has anybody here gotten PC HDMI to VGA to 240p component working? If so did you do it using super resolutions like 1280x240p? I'm fucking pulling my hair out trying to figure this shit out

No. Stop making these threads

>>9383181
there's nothing wrong with them but they're so expensive and price-gouged that buying one is no more than a status symbol when you could get a tv for 40-80$

>>9389162
Zoom zoom. Rediit weren't a thing when flat panel CRTs were already known for haveing geometry issues, even brand new ones. I juts love how zoomers on /vr/ always bring up jootubers and leddit all the time for the sake of fitting in.

>>9398907
>Europeans will think 50hz games over SCART look authentic.
You have no clue about what you're talking about.
Let me give you a hint. In europe if you were to import you had to use SCART RGB in order to get colors, otherwise NTSC games would be displayed in B&W. Console came by default with composite so most people used them. Let me give you another hint : SCART RGB blows compsohite out of water. The day I tried RGB to play my pirated imports I never came back to composhite. It's been 20+ years and I'm amazed that people in fucking 2022 still fucking defend composite daily 24/7/365 on /vr/.

Burger Composhite Defence Force = Euros 50Hz Apologist = mental gymnastics and mental illness.