/vr/ - Retro Games

>>9266791
It was only released on Japan and pretty much flopped over there. Nothing really interesting was released on it except Girl's Garden.

>>9266791
>I can not really place it in time.
It released the same day as the Famicom and was replaced a year later by the SG-1000 II, which itself was replaced the next year by the Mark III.
Think of the NES games you've played with 1983 copyright dates on them, that's what it was up against.

>>9266797
Nah, it has some gems. Pacar is my favorite of the exclusives, far more fun than Girl's Garden. It's like a mix of Pac-Man and Head On.

>>9266797
>It was only released on Japan
No it wasn't, zoom-zoom.

>>9266791
In Japan Master System was initially released as Mark III, being branded as the third revision of the SG-1000 console, so SG-1000's small library gets conflated with Master System's one there. One of the very last SG-1000 games was straight up disguised as a Mark III game, leading many to believe it was a Master System game years later.

>>9266847
This. SG-1000 is a ColecoVision clone which went up against Famicom and its early unexpanded NROM cartridge library. When Mark III was released two years later, Famicom games started using mapper chips and FDS was on its way, leveling the playfield in Nintendo's favor over time once again.

>>9266901
Mark-III did okay against the Famicom, it was the PC Engine that destroyed it hard.

>>9266904
Mark III was a clear second fiddle in Japan and PC Engine indeed destroyed its market share. There's a reason why Mark III was dropped immediately by Sega in Japan once Mega Drive hit the store shelves. Even in America Master System was still around three years later.

>>9266797
It got released in Europe, Brazil and NorthAmerica

>>9266791
This guy talks about every single sg-1000 game. https://youtu.be/UpkJ1y6fbxY

>>9266872
Extremely limited release in Australia and New Zealand. They sold like 10 of them over there. Not a big deal.
>>9266921
That's not the SG-1000, drooler. The Master System was only backwards compatible with it.

>>9266957
>Jeremy Faggish
No thanks

>>9266969
It was released in Europe too, a friend had one.

>>9266993
You're probably thinking of the SC-3000.

>>9266847
why did it have so many different versions when they all had the same games like what did it add and why would I even buy all those different versions?

I can already tell Sega was retarded back then and made terrible decisions.

>>9266921
you dumb fuck

>>9267020
Sega's gonna Sega.

>>9266991
Unfortunately, SG-1000 coverage on YouTube is limited to Jeremy "Rent Free" Parish and a single video by GameSuck. Not much choice here.

>>9267037
Not really. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTmqWSF2qXk

>>9266791
Star jacker is a pretty good shooter, like middle ground between galaxian and the newer sms and nes shooters.
A lot of konami msx games were converted back in the day also. The master system can play these games but with slightly wrong colours.

>>9266905
Just no reason to get the sms, either you want the cheap system or the one with good graphics. In the west the sms was the same price as the nes with cheaper games mostly. Most of the early pce games look basic but r-type demonstrated what to expect.
I think sms might have sold a million in japan which is probably more than the usa.

>>9266921
Must have been in specialty stores like the atari 7800. I've never seen old catalogs with the sg 1000 in it.

SO it released on the same day as the Famicom. The Famicom only had 9 games where SG1000 had 21.
Sega already had a history of arcade video games while Nintendo did not.

Why exactly did the Famicom win? I am seriously wondering because it looks like Sega had more to offer back then.

>>9267056
Both Sega and Nintendo wanted to keep third party publishers off their lawns, similar to 70s Atari. Hudson and Namco managed to break Nintendo, letting them publish games for Famicom themselves. Fast forward and Famicom is flourishing with multiple third party publishers releasing half a dozen games per year, while all SG-1000 games are still published by Sega.

>>9266791
im 37 and didnt know this existed until a few months ago

>>9267056
>Why exactly did the Famicom win?
look at the fukken "controller" in the op lmao

>>9267056
Better hardware and games. The SG-1000 is just a Colecovision, the Famicom's entire design goal was to be better than the Colecovision. Also >>9267070.

>>9267056
Did the SG-1000 have Donkey Kong?

>>9267229
Nintendo's next arcade hit Mario Bros. was also intentionally made on a weaker hardware for a 1983 arcade release, so it could be released on Famicom in nearly arcade perfect form just a few months later.

>>9267229
It had Congo Bongo, which is better. I used to play it all the time on my SC-3000.

>>9267252
SG-1000 port of Congo Bongo is surprisingly weak, especially when compared to ColecoVision port. They did not even attempt to portray arcade's isometric perspective.

>>9267259
Coleco port for comparison. Remember that these two consoles are extremely similar inside.

>>9267259
I remember when I first played this, I thought it was a joke. Congo Bongo was one of Sega's biggest titles at the time, how the fuck did they screw this up?

>>9267056
The Famicom had 3 launch titles, Donkey Kong, DK Jr. and Popeye.
The SG-100 had, supposedly (not even Sega seem to know for sure), 12: Borderline, Safari Hunting, N-Sub, Mahjong, Champion Gold, Tsumeshogi, Congo Bongo, Yamato, Champion Tennis, Star Jacker, Champion Baseball and Sindbad Mystery.

There's a couple okay titles in there (Champion Baseball was a massive arcade hit and the SG-1000 port is quite good), but the Famicom lineup is just stronger in general.

>>9267273
It's really sad when even a TI-99/4A port (an outdated computer which has the same GPU as SG-1000) looks more faithful to the arcade.

>>9267259
Unfortunately, it happened a lot across many old consoles. Pac Man on the 2600 was the first, most noticeable deviation, Crystal Castles was a big disappointment as well.

>>9267318
It's not like there was another console with TIA graphics at the time which had a port of Crystal Castles with much better visuals.

>>9266869
oh so this shit was just some atari garbage trying to compete with the nes

>>9267381
What Famicom games from 1983-84 are not on the level of Atari garbage?

>>9266847
ah so they have a history of rushing out crap in a desperate attempt to compete only to immediately abandon the product for another piece of crap. I didnt realize they did this shit from the very beginning. man fuck sega.

>>9267382
pretty much all of them

Girls' Garden
That's it
Look at one of those videos showing clips of every game released for the console and you'll see they are pretty much universally mediocre garbage

>>9267391

many don't
the sg1000 is pretty much ignored and never talked about but maybe that's a problem in the west or the English speaking internet and there are loyal fans in Japan or something while here most people aren't even aware of the system, it's really weird.
maybe Brazil remembers?


also Congo Bongo wouldn't get released because of such a name anymore

>>9267037
Joe can be kinda hit and miss. I don't think he enjoyed the sg at all and the video ended up being more boring and repeatitive than he intended.

>>9267617
I think that if any region has nostalgia for SG-1000, it might be Taiwan. There were a bunch of unofficial Taiwanese SG games which were actually MSX ports.

>>9267056
Famicom had a better controller and looked more kawaii.

>>9266791
there are few good ones
but its better to get the mark iii
it will play master system, sg-1000 and the cards


gals garden
and a few cute shmups are on the original system
its more of a hardcore collectorfag item

>>9267128
Both the SG-1000 and NES were shittier than the Colecovision. The SG-1000 only had 1KB of Memory while the NES only had 4KB. The CV had 17K and much better games like Gateway to Apshai while the other two were still stuck with shitty arcade ports. However both the SG-1000 and the NES were cheaper than the Colecovision, and the NES was better than the SG-1000 by having a faster CPU, faster sprite processor, and more RAM. The SG-1000 was seriously handicapped by the small RAM as it was intended to be a cheap cut down version of Colecovision. But by 1985, RAM prices had tumbled down greatly. Hence Sega improved upon the SG1K and gave birth to The Master System, still a Colecovision-like console but equipped with a more powerful sprite processor and even more memory.

>>9267659
Most of those didn't even run without a RAM expansion unit. Because the MSX has a ton more RAM and they were too lazy to reprogram the game to use less RAM and rely more on cartridge space.

>>9267398
Dragonstomper stomped every NES game made before 1985.

>>9266791
girls garden

>>9266791
Supposedly it's sonic games are good but I don't like sonic. The only game I've played for it that I genuinely got any enjoyment out of is Alex Kidd in Shinobi World. All the other Alex Kidd games suck dick, as do the other 20-30 master system games I've tried out.

This had the same architecture as the Colecovision and they released clones that could play both systems games.

>>9268516
Wrong system anon.

>>9267761
Why were Sega too lazy to add more RAM?

>>9268527
But it didn't have any RAM. It's shit.

>>9267318
The problem is that Congo Bongo had much better ports on similarly powerful systems, the SG-1000 could've absolutely handled it.

The SG-1000 got a good Zaxxon port, at least.

>>9268647
Sega wasn't the one making bootleg MSX conversions in Taiwan.

List of actually good sg-1000/sc-3000 games:
Bomb Jack
C'so
Choplifter (my favorite version imo)
Doki Doki Penguin Land
Elevator Action (but youre better off playing any of the other ports)
Exerion
Flicky
Girl's Garden
H.E.R.O
Lode Runner
Pacar
Galaga
Space Invaders
Star Jacker
Zaxxon
Zoom 909
Most of the sg-1000 library is just kinda mediocre. Even a lot of the better titles have much better ports elsewhere. It was also released as a computer in japan, oceania, and some parts of europe. Here in australia, it did somewhat okay against the vic-20.
No one really talks about it because theres not much to talk about, it flopped and was very quickly replaced by the mark III/sms and it didn't really have any notable titles.
To place it in time, it launched on the exact same day as the famicom, which demolished it technically.
Just download a fullset and go through the library, iirc gen plus gx runs it fine. You'll see why ino one cares about it anymore.

>>9267267
Colecovision seems really cool, I should look into it since I like those old arcade games

>>9269562
>no The Castle
Wrong and terrible list

>>9269574
Colecovision was great, but its strength was highly accurate arcade ports, and nowadays you can just emulate the actual arcade originals, removing a lot of the appeal.

>>9267259
>>9267267
>>9267273
1KB RAM vs 17KB RAM. Of course the sg1k port couldn't be anywhere as complex.

>>9269621
Then how come the SG-1000 port of Zaxxon is better than the Colecovision one?

>>9269574
Coleco was a weird case. They introduced their console in 1982, trashed competing consoles from Atari and Mattel in specs, stayed on the market for two years. Then in 1984 they were like "fuck this, I'm out" and just left. ColecoVision had no decline phase at all, they just stopped releasing games because they ran out of money. They could probably still take some punches from NES in 1985, had they remained on the market.

>>9269628
Is it really better? Looks slower.

>>9269638
>trashed competing consoles from Atari and Mattel in specs
Not really. Atari 5200 had a more powerful sprite system, hardware scrolling, and faster CPU. Colecovision couldn't possibly run Rescue on Fractalus, Star Raiders, and Ballblazer without serious graphical or performance downgrade. Intellivision had a better CPU.
>They could probably still take some punches from NES in 1985, had they remained on the market.
It depends. If they kept releasing arcade ports, that's unlikely. It needed original titles and probably remakes of computer games.

>>9267743
>>9269621
>17KB RAM
ColecoVision and SG-1000 have the identical amount of video RAM: 16KB. You are counting RAM+VRAM for Coleco and only RAM for SG-1000. What Coleco did have over Sega was a 8KB BIOS.

>>9269658
Thankfully for Coleco, Atari 5200 turned out as a total disaster with awful controllers, lack of backwards compatibility with 2600 (wink wink, Expansion Module #1, wink wink) and being little more than an Atari 800 computer from three years ago with no backwards compatibility with that system either.

>>9269660
Wikipedia only lists the amount of scratchpad RAM. If the VRAM size is the same, then it has exactly the same specs as Coleco. Not sure why the games are worse.
>What Coleco did have over Sega was a 8KB BIOS.
I guess that saved the cartridge some memory and the devs some work.

>>9269672
>awful controllers
Indeed. Not sure what they were thinking.
>lack of backwards compatibility with 2600
Not necessarily a bad thing, although it was a big deal apparently. They have completely different architecture. The 2600 was already a sorely aging console by that point anyway.
>being little more than an Atari 800 computer from three years ago with no backwards compatibility with that system either
This is probably the most baffling aspect of 5200, aside from the analog controller. They could've made something like Atari XEGS, a consolized Atari 8-bit with full compatibility with all cart games the computer had, but they didn't do it.

I guess it would be better for Atari back then to release something like an upgraded version of Atari 2600. Use the same hardware as the 2600 but give it like a 6K RAM and bankable ROM carts. That would give it a huge edge while still being affordable to produce.

>>9269720
From what I heard about 5200, Atari at the time was unofficially split internally into a console and a computer divisions (plus an arcade division which was completely detached from everything else) and there was a genuine fear that if one of them gets very successful, the other would be dissolved by Warner and employees would pointed at the door. Remember, home computers were a massive fad and were partly seen as the future of gaming. Computer people somehow effectively gaslit the console people to release a console with computer's guts, so that one division could not get all the credit for its success and destroy the other division. Console devs were producing "Super VCS" prototypes starting from all the way to 1977, yet they weren't able to use them for 5200.

>>9269596
Coleco smurfs was a big deal when it came out in 1982 (same year as pitfal). No home console game looked this good in 1982, plus the Beethoven soundtrack was a nice touch.

Gameplay was hard as fuck but every action adventure game in 1982 was like that. The weird double jump mechanic was awful though, they could have just mapped in a low jump and a high jump button.

>>9266791
>Released on the EXACT SAME DAY AS the Famicom
>Somehow be rather quickly kicked to the curb almost like the super cassette vision was.
How?

>>9267056
Super Mario Brothers.

>>9267267
truly the SG-1000 original and the SG-1000 MARK II are but Colecovisions with lighter colored plastic casing save for the different vRAM

>>9266791
It's the Primordial Ooze of Sega home consoles, if you want good Sega games you want to look to the arcades and the Sega Genesis.

>>9269808
decent graphics and varied level design
but in practice is absolutely horrible\unplayable

i think the cabbage kid game plays better but not well enough for me to buy the cart

>>9269562
forgot gulkave, very impressive early shooter by compile

most of the sg-1000's library has been ported to the colecovision at this point lol

>>9266791
>Are there any good games for it?

most of the "early" games are rudimentary arcade ports, but often the only versions of early sega arcade games

the more complicated "later" games generally came out on a smaller size "mycard" format, ironically enough

>>9269751
They wanted to make an Atari 3200, a 10 bit console which was apparently too hard to program for. That's stupid, just give the 2600 an extra 4 to 6KB RAM in 1980 to compete with the VIC-20, nobody wanted a wholly new console just yet.

>>9270156
Only because they advertised it along with Duck Hunt at the arcades.

>>9271102
And because it was an impressive game. Sega really had nothing like it.

>>9266791
Wolfenstein 3D is being made for it.

>>9270156
Super Mario Bros was released just a month before the Mark III, the Famicom had already destroyed the SG-1000 so hard Sega was putting out a new system as an actual answer to the SMB-less Famicom.

>>9269593
I found it confusing when I tried it, but ill give it another go
>>9271082
Somehow missed this one, thanks anon!

>>9267020
Current-day gaming does this too
>playstation 4
>playstation 4 pro
>playstation 5

All useless versions

>>9269808
meanwhile Atari
>are you watching the Smurfs?
>no we are playing the Smurfs
>holy shit it's like watching the Smurfs

one blue blot on screen
Atari has always been pathetic

coleco vision is weird too
why did it fail and what's the story?

>>9269912
I'm wondering myself

>>9267056
whoever this is looks 20 and 60 years old at the same time. not my cup of tea

>>9273071
>coleco vision is weird too
>why did it fail and what's the story?
Coleco got memed into creating a home computer, Coleco ADAM. It was essentially a slightly buffed ColecoVision with software stored on super fast cassette tapes with programs being read from two sides of the tape simultaneously (no other computer with cassette storage had this). It was even available as an expansion module for ColecoVision, turning your gaming console into a fully usable home computer. It was initially announced at a very attractive price and got a lot of attention from the press. When it was released it was much more expensive, manufacturing got plagued with delays and those few retail models which were delivered in time suffered from 90% failure rate. That computer diversion cost Coleco all the money they made from video games and put them on the very edge of bankruptcy.
ColecoVision itself had never failed. It had a strong consumer base, but Coleco had to pull out from home electronics business entirely to save themselves. As mentioned a few comments ago, it had no decline phase during its lifespan like Atari 2600 or Intellivision had till the late 1980s. It just suddenly died in 1985, a quick and painless death with nothing to regret except for deep hatred for its computer sibling.

>>9267287
damn, whoever did the shading work and lines knew wtf they doing. nice

>>9266791

>Are there any good games for it?

Great game for it (also its sequel, if you have a second controller)

>>9273071
Coleco smurfs was too hard for the age group and the double jump mechanic was not intuitive. Older kids thought smurfs were for babies and too proud to play it.

>>9273147
Great summary. I feel like it's interesting to note that the 1st New York Times Business Section report I can find of the Colecovision being discontinued (October 19, 1985) was a day after the NES was test released in New York.

>>9266886
My Nigga Gettin Litty

>>9274223
Sherlock Holmes and the Missing Waifu

>>9266791
>Are there any good games for it?
I enjoyed Space Slalom, Rock n' Bolt, Hustle Chumy, C-So!, Girl's Garden, Pacar. A big chunk of the library is arcade ports but I didn't bother with them.
The library is quite small so you should be able to give all of it a fair try in just one evening, especially if you ignore the arcade ports

>>9274735
a lot of the arcade ports never got ported to other platforms, id say check em out if only to try some of the more obscure sega arcade games

Why did Coleco allow MSX and Sega to copy their hardware?

>>9277492
The Colecovision was made entirely from off-the-shelf components, there's nothing they could legally do to prevent anyone from looking into their designs and then making something similar.

>>9274735
Based Compile carrying the console

>>9277656
I'm sad that they're gone.

>>9277850
At least they went out with a bang

>>9274735
>A big chunk of the library is arcade ports but I didn't bother with them

most of them never came to other platforms, and the most advanced arcade games are unique enough to check out

i kinda like the wonder boy port because despite the shit scrolling, its only 5 "long" levels instead of an obnoxiously boring 40 levels like the master system version

sega pitfall 2 is also dope as fuck