/vr/ - Retro Games

>>8998181
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.
S-video was a thing during the 3rd gen which drastically removed blurring, RGB was possible by the fourth and Nintendo sold official SCART cables.
>b-but some companies used RF to their advantage
They were few and far between.

Back to your initial question though
>Why do people sperg out over bilinear filtering?
It looks like fucking shit on modern displays and in most if not all cases retro games look more appealing with sharp pixels on modern displays. The blurriness looked fine on CRTs.

fpbp

just play games the way they look nice to you
it doesn't have to be "accurate"
it doesn't have to be "muh developers intended"
you don't need to be a dumb retard slave to /vr/'s stillborn basement virgin opinions
you don't need to scourge yourself on the back for anyone's approval
just stop being an npc
decide for yourself

>>8998181
Bilinear filtering looks like shit when it's applied to an image with such a low resolution like 240p. It's best to do at least a 2x nearest neighbour upscale and then use bilinear filtering.

>>8998181
I don't know.
Actually I do know.
I just don't care enough to write up an explanation.
This thread sucks.

>>8998181
One kind of blur is not the same as another kind of blur. The gleam of white-hot phosphors bleeding onto each other is not quite the same as linearly interpolating across two adjacent data points.
You can play games any way you want though

>>8998181
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.

>>8998592
>LE MEANT TO BE PLAYED!!!!!! YOU HAVE TO LE PLAY IT THIS WAY BECAUSE YOU LE JUST DO OK!!!

>>8998601
You're the one that said it's "meant to be X". Just concede, you lost.

>>8998604
>>8998592

>>8998607
Show me evidence to the contrary.
...
None?
Your concession has been accepted.

>>8998604
>>8998610
>actual schizo meltdown because people aren't playing games the way they're "supposed" to
lmao

>>8998612
>Why do people sperg out over bilinear filtering? Pixel art was meant to be blurry. It's more faithful than the sharp pixel look. Is this just a zoomer thing?
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.
>meant to be blurry
>meant to be
>meant

>>8998619
>still melting down
lol
imagine feeling actual physical pain because people won't play games the way you say they have to
lmao

>>8998181
There's a way to blur it. That's more like it's "smudged", it looks all uniformly round like someone drew it with Sharpie dots.

>>8998181
I honestly hate bilinear filtering, it makes games looks like shit, i especially hate it with Doom, i think there is a reason why i like the PS1 crunchy pixels over the N64 smooth textures.

>>8998620
Not him, but you definitely have brain damage my man.

>>8998592
Yeah, the in game pixel art is meant to be blurry so you don't notice that it doesn't have as many colors or is as detailed as the cover art leads you to believe.

>>8998592
>Mario glitches through the wall in the cover art
Speedrunnersisters are we winning?

>>8998181
"pixel art" wasn't meant to be anything at the time and you could get varied results depending on your display model and setup

>dude let's make it look all blurry lmao
literal autism

>>8998181
because it looks like absolute shit. Were you dropped as a baby? That's the only way someone could think that looks OK.

>>8998181
It's fine when upscaling to smaller resolutions but the larger the resolution, the blurrier it gets. Sharp-bilinear does it better.

>>8998181
I rarely use it, but Game Gear games on a large HDTV are kind of too crisp and it hurts my eyes, so I turn on a filter.

because it's not 2005 on early LCD tech anymore. In those days your options were blurring for uniformity, integer scaling rarely multiplying to native res making things small, or max fuckiness via non-integer + non-filtered scaling. Sharp bilinear and decent CRT emulation are available now. Smudging sucks and should only be used on low spec machines/low res flat panels.

>>8998181
Both of those are kind of painful to look at
The way to go is first unfiltered scale to 2x or 3x, then bilinear scale to the target resolution

>>8999923
I get your point and that's fine for faking integer at non-integer, ie sharp bilinear, but you're really splitting hairs here by saying the integer one is 'painful'. It's essentially the same output as integer.

>>8998230
Literally no one had s-video in my poor suburb, we all used composite until the PS2 had component cables on those late CRTs/early flat screens

>>9000000

>>9000000

>>8998592
It's kind of funny how Nintendo did not really use the CRTs blurry effect. On the other hand, most of their games looks really good on raw pixels

>>9000000
I pity you, i know how it feels to lack S-Video for a long time. But then again i also played on a super small CRT

>>9000000

>>8998181
THAT LOOKS LIKE SHIT

i dont understand the RGB fags
image so oversharpened that you might as well play on an emulator

it looks horrible

Does this board talk about ANYTHING besides CRT pixel shit?

>>9000182
What were you expecting?

>>9000159
That image is literally taken from an emulator, what are you on about?

>>9000000

>>9000000
WITNESSED

>>9000000
Yeah, composite graphics looked wholesome in my opinion. Nice GET!

>>9000159
That's not what RGB on a CRT looks like, you dumb cuck. There's no grill or scanlines or glow or anything, there's more to it than just even sharp pixels. NO ONE KNOWS ANYTHING AAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>9000000

>>8998569
>you don't need to be a dumb retard slave to /vr/'s stillborn basement virgin opinions
like the one you're spouting, disgusting

>>8998181
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.
Wrong type of blur

>>9000000
yo what? i thought it was disabled
well, not complainin

>>9000000
Numbers don't lie, this anon speaks the truth

I don't care, Megaman X stopped being good after the first one.

>>8998181
Because bilinear filtering looks like smudgy dogshit. At least with a CRT display you get a better aesthetic.
Crisp and clear pixels or an actual CRT, no shitass inbetweens.

>>9000000
I miss when anons would flood threads to see who got the big gets. This place is so fucking gay these days

>>9000443
factually accurate

>>9000443
the series deteriorated after 4

>>9000443
megaman can't even shoot upwards
he's a fucking bitch lmao

>>9000510
See you in 24 hours, because you know it's coming.

>>9000000
I had a S-video capable port growin up. That being said, I had absolutely NOTHING that could work with it straight out, and no gaming shop actually carried a hook-up for S-video. I did use it later on when I was younger for gaming when I discovered how superior it was to composite at minimum of space it took up.

>>9000000
BASED COMPOSITE SHAT SHITTIN ON S-VIDEO AND RGB AUTISTS!

if it was meant to be blurry then it would have been designed blurry.
as it is, it's not. it's sharp clean cut pixels.

>>9000000

>>8998181
Then explain the Gameboy screen, faggotroon.

>>9000000
WITNESSED

>>9000000

>>8998230
>S-video was a thing during the 3rd gen
> In the history of video games, the third generation of game consoles, commonly referred to as the 8-bit era, began on July 15, 1983 with the Japanese release of two systems: Nintendo's Family Computer (commonly abbreviated to Famicom) and Sega's SG-1000. (Wikipedia)
The Famicom was RF-only and it stayed that way until the Sharp Twin and the New Famicom were released, that latter of which came out after the SNES was already on the market. The majority of Famicom owners had the original model.

These games were literally made to be played over RF on an early 1980s CRT.

Even in the fourth gen most people were using composite or RF.

>>8998181
I use a RetroTink and I use the blur settings to make it look more like the image on the right. It looks a lot better.

>>9001439
It's an LCD. Different technology, different look.

>>9000404
I don't know, I kind of agree with that anon.
I feel like thinking for yourself instead of trying to get the most internet points (especially on 4chan) is generally a good mindset.

>>9000000
Witnessed. And true. I only got S-Video later on. Like, way later on. I legit played the dreamcast with an RF adapter, gamecube with an NES rf adapter...etc...

>>9000437
Dubs are disabled except for 0's.

>>9001826
Same. I had a Gamecube and an Xbox, my friend had a Gamecube, another friend had a PS2, and one more friend had an Xbox. We all used composite to hook them up. When I got a Wii I used composite with that too. Friend got a 360 and he used component, soon after everything became HDMI.

I never even knew what s video was until years later when retro gaming became more of a thing. I hook my Gamecube up by s video now and it's literally the first time I've ever done it.

>>9001807
Nice cope. So I guess what you meant to say if it was a console game then pixels shouldn't be nearest neighbor.

The problem is, most sprite games now aren't console locked so what's the problem? If a fan game used Mega Man X as a art style, it should look like left, not right.

>>9000000
>Poorcuck waste GET
Fuck this board.

>>9001807
do you know how many gb games just directly port assets from the NES kek

>>9000000
>ebin get in a mega man thread

base

>>8998181
Because it's the absolute bottom-of-the-barrel upscaling technique par-excellence. It doesn't improve the image, nor does it make it look like a CRT - it just diffuses the fuck out of the pixel art and makes it look like you smeared vaseline on your screen.

One of the reasons blurriness works on a CRT and not on an LCD is because the scanlines and phosphors divide the image up some, so instead of one big block of blurriness, you have the image divided up into lines, and the lines themselves are divided up by the phosphor mask, so the blurriness appears less severe.

>>8998181
If you are allowed the choice between CRT shaders and bilinear filter you don't really have an excuse to go with bilinear, but as for people having an unnaturally violent reaction to it, I suspect it's because a lot of them grew up seeing sharp square pixels on computers (emulators, indie games, sprite comics/movies) and assumed that's what retro console sprites HAVE to look like
People will argue that bilinear looks bad when really, it's just their preference because it's what they're used to seeing
Exclusively talking about 3rd-4th gen consoles here of course, this all goes flying out the window when talking about GB/GBA games and other stuff that used LCDs and shouldn't be filtered save for an LCD shader to correct GBA colors

>>8998181
I used glasses all of my life, and regularly get headaches without them. Bilinear filtering makes me irrationally angry when I look at it for this reason. Same with motion blur and depth of field in modern games.

>>9002524
Also, my childhood gaming system were the gameboys. They were basically LCD.

>>9002527
>t. zoomer once again trying to pass his opinions as his childhood
Is that you again Mr. All Stars hater?

>>9000000
>HEXA wasted
Kys nigger

>>9000000
>Literally no one had s-video in my poor suburb
You don't know what other people had beyond your two or three little faggot friends.
Shit get.

filtering makes the colors pop on an lcd way less

>>9000000
You are poor in your wallet, but rich in your gets.

>>9002527
Gameboy is an lcd, running the game in its native resolution. Every pixel is individually defined on the dot matrix. Completely different situation.
Also it is dim and has massive ghosting problems that negate any sort of clarity advantage that provides.

>>9000000
Checked

>>9005286
On the plus side, it does mean it's even easier than usual to fake transparency by simply flickering the sprite on and off every frame

>>9000000
I kneel.

>>9000000
organic GET, nice

>>8999218
But the cover art is as detailed as the game in the example?

>>8998181
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.
Bilinear filtering isn't good for that. You need something that closely approximates the monitors/televisions of the time, and bilinear doesn't achieve this.

>>9000000
Best possible post for this get.

>>9006847
It might've looked ok way back when we used CRT monitors and emulated at 640x480 or whatever. It was either that or 2xSaI, SuperEagle, and such. But it's been a long time since I tried such a thing, so I might be talking out of my ass. I do know with a superwide resolution, you can do nearest neighbor and keep the proper 4:3 ratio without scaling artifacts, so that's ideal.

blue sky

>>9006936
>8:7

>>9006941

>>8998181
There's a difference between CRT smoothing and bilineal.

>>9006979

>>9007003

>>9007017

>>9000000
CHECKED

>>9000404
>>we should care less about approval from 4chan
>but you still browser 4chan, i am very smart

>>9006838
What do you mean, it's got more colors than the game is capable of.
It's even got shading in the overalls.

>>8998569
OP is just a troll and you're feeding him anon

>>9000404
>like the one you're spouting, disgusting
I'm very confused, so you think people SHOULD be slaves to /vr/'s stillborn basement virgin opinions? Can you elaborate? Personally, I'm not into it. I don't really consider most of this board humans. I'm certainly not going to change the way I play games because it causes THEM physical pain, lmao

>>9000000

I can't emulate on a flatscreen without bilinear, I just can't take raw pixels and CRT meme filters seriously, makes you feel like a redditor

>>8998181
It's mostly people who have only played old games on modern displays via emulators.

>>9009131
You could've just said you don't like the look of those things and leave it at that. Now you just look like a bandwagonner that cannot like thing because leddit likes it.

>>8998181
>I want my games to look like shit because that's how it was in the old days
This is the /vr/ equivalent of cassette fags

>>9008697
>doesn't realize every game does this

>>9009131
This. The only genuine improvement CRT shaders bring is the blur, which bilinear does without the screendoor look. Now NTSC shaders are a different story but most people don't use them.

I've been emulating since we were doing it on CRT monitors, and I always take raw pixels. Filters don't look like a TV unless you are doing the extreme CRT royale ones, but I don't use those either because I'm sitting 2 feet away from my screen and those have the same effect on the eye that playing a foot away from a TV would.

>>9001439
Gameboy screens had pixel grids at least. So raw pixels were never the intended way.

>>9010030
And yet, people like it. It's like saying low poly models were never intended to be low poly. Despite literally being used to this day for LODs. And just because some times the low poly looks appealing, people still want that look, so it has a purpose. That's why people like sprites.

>>9010074
This discussion is about what's intended though, not what you personally like. GB pixels are indeed sharp but they're also on a tiny screen. Many people aren't really going to notice that sharpness on such a small screen. There's a reason why a lot of people wanna keep emulation of portables to portable devices.

>>9010114
>This discussion is about what's intended though,
Yet said discussion is fueled by "what I like". OP just wants to hate pixels, when that's not anyone's problem but his and retards like him.

You fags already have a way to "see them as intended", yet you still want to gaslight what others want and will sake and attack anyone preferring otherwise. So cut the bullshit, these shitty threads are all about muhstalgiaism.

>>8998181
The right image makes it feel like you have a cornea disease. If you are not bothered by how this looks I do not respect your preferences.

Bilinear shading looks good, better than any bullshit SAI or Eagle or dot matrix or scanline bullshit. It also takes next to no resources.

I just keep using it and ignoring everyone. Looks good on my VGA CRT.

>>8998181
>is it a zoomer thing?
Yes. Everything is a zoomer thing, they are so dumb and prone to stupid opinions and they don't understand anything and look weird and want sharp pixels and oh GOD they don't like BILLINEAR FILTERING I hate the, Nd th eh are rwpaomsibel for,my umhappiness

>>9010825
CRT & filtering, huh. You must really hate your games.

>>9000000
Impressive

>>9000000

>>8998181
>Pixel art was meant to be blurry.
I demand you put more effort in your bait

>>8998230
>It looks like fucking shit on modern displays
It looks like fucking shit PERIOD
Even some of the worst CRTs I've seen through composite or RF were never as blurry as bilinear

>>9000429
This is complete grarbage
Can't even see his sclera anymore

>>9010030
That's literally raw pixels you moron
Integer upscaling =/= Raw Pixels

I hate you fucking troons and your retarded terminology so much

>>9009131
>>9009526
You actually need to kill yourself

>>9012095
Do you have eyes? Sprites look very different on a grid vs no grid. Part of the Gameboy's marketing jargon was the dot matrix grid. Shut the fuck up and don't talk shit if you're ignorant.

>>9012072
The CRT + RF is actually blurrier, zoom zoom.

>>9000000
nobody cared about s-video or rgb until retro gaming fans started aging and chasing nostalgia dragons since the games themselves were no longer fulfilling to them. nobody even knew about either of them back in the day. we had our shit tier rf signals and we LIKED it

>>8998181
I couldn't figure out why people liked 3D being blurry. It all started around GL Quake and 2D elements I noticed were not sharp. I was used to pixel art being sharp, since I plugged the MD/SFC/SS into RGB along with the DC being VGA. The sharp pixel look was what I am used to from the late 90s.

>>9012472
Based!

I already has astyctamism desu

Unless you lived in France or in fucking Cameroon and had enough money to play videogames, there's no chance you ever saw a RGB cable until the mid 2000s unless you were an enthusiast / absolute nerd. SECAM countries were the only ones to have them until the late 90s thanks to their retarded color encoding

21P RGB was absolutely niche in Japan, and no parent was going to buy you a SVideo cable when the RF modulator or composite video cable looked perfectly already

If you were old enough in the 90s to care about that shit and moreover be able to buy it by yourself, enjoy your retirement gramps

>>9013794
I had RGB cables for all since I Was 16 and sorta had my money. Then again I lived in switzerland. And France.

I dob't understand you nostalgia faggots tho. Why do people have to play in tve exact same shit they played as kids? I only had RF for my SEGA SYSTEM. Do I have to play my whole life with RF? Shit I always foget that everyngame and stage is sonic first stage waterfalls. What magic autism is that? Also,everyone saw RGB because arcades are a thing so everyone who isn't a zoomie saw it.
Who cares,play how you like. If you like composhit play on that. I dislike the look of BVMs so I don't play on them/try to recreate them. Wow so easy.

Is BURGERS DIDNT HAVE RGB the new sonic waterfalls?

>>8998181
Just quint your eyes. Filtering on demand

>>9013765

>>9013794
>>9013921
The implication you should play composite because it was most used is a real funny one. Imagine if 10 years later people on here argue that Minecraft should be played on iPhone because that's how most people experienced it.

>>9013765
SOVL
miles better than any of the tranny-tier shite posted on /bst/ threads with their gay neon lights

>>8998181
I would say it's only okay when it's the serendipity of the medium, not artificially induced. Something that looks soft because you made it look soft usually doesn't add a positive effect.

>>9000000
I can do you one better. I was using composite until the PS3/Xbox 360 because I didn't know there was anything better. You can't imagine how much the leap from component to HDMI blew my mind.

>>9014998
I had a friend who did the same thing with his PS3. I found an HDMI cable just lying around in his apartment this one time I was over, and decided I'd do him a solid and hooked it up to his PS3. He turned it on and he made no comment, so I told him what he thought about the picture quality, and he just goes like "what, I don't see a difference". Like, jesus, I know I'm highly autistic about this shit, but you have got to be blind not to notice the gulf in quality between composite 480i and HDMI 1080p.

This is basically a zoomer vs people who actually played them when they came out argument.

Only a complete zoomer would pick raw pixels because it's all they have ever known since emulating retro games on their computers.

People that actually enjoyed these games when they came out always use bilinear.

Cry about it I guess.

>>9001825
we are already in an anon chat, how much more i have to do show i dont care about your approval..... o right, i just keep moving forward.

Goodbye retards

>>9015673
you forgot to mention that nu-males would use CRT shaders

>>9013961
People forgets that bilinear of the old was sharp under CRT and 3dfx had working dithering with helped a lot.
all under 640x480 or 800x600

>>9014160
cringe
why don't you suck his dick faggot

>>9015673
There's no words for the idiocy of this post. The fact that you can only see this as a false dichotomy shows you to be the most ignorant one of all.

>>9015789
Yeah, bilinear gets blurrier the higher you upscale. If you're playing with a modern monitor, you should really be using something like quilez or sharp-bilinear. Blurs just enough to remove the jaggies.
>>9015007
Most people don't care about picture quality as long as it isn't shitty camrip tier. If you showed this thread to a normie they'd think we're all mentally ill (and they wouldn't entirely be wrong)

Just use a CRT shader bruv

>>9016720
there is the fact that 3dfx cards had some extras
like tv out with composite and S-Video

i hate every single person promoting ai upscaling. smeared shit everywhere is not an upgrade or a reason to buy it.

>>9014998
Component is perfectly fine for the 720p shit on 360/PS3. It can push 1080p, no problem. Maybe even more, but I don't kniw if any hardwase supports it. The difference between component and HDMI is minimal.

>>8998181
I just wear glasses I rub with vasaline

>>9019776
>It can push 1080p, no problem
can it?
I thought it can only do up to 1080i

>>9020850
Nah, it can do 1080p. I used to do it on my launch-window Xbawks Circle, which didn't have HDMI.

>>9020850
It depends on what the hardware is capable of. My 360 had the option to select 1080p over component. In theory you can even push 4K or whatever you want since it's an analog medium. Just at some point higher resolution won't improve quality and where exactly depends on DAC and cable quality. The other end might nit be able to decode such a signal or will sample it at lower resolution.

>>9019804
Nice

>>9013772
Who the hell is this guy?

>faithful
Yes, what a great idea, actually WANTING games to look like they did on fucking ancient eye cancer displays. I used that shit most of my goddamn life because I'm old, and fuck all of it. I'll take my goddamn pixels any goddamn day of the week over that blurred shit.

>>9012072
True but raw pixels look worse and most people aren't mentally ill enough to blow money on a memecrt.

>>9012472
I had rgb by 5th gen but not every TV supported it.

>>9013794
>mid-2000s
Late 90s in the US.

>>9004440
Not him and even “rich” kids used composite because at the time we were literal children and didn’t give a shit

It's only good for when you're scaling between 1x-2x, such as on a modded 3DS/Vita.