/vr/ - Retro Games

>>8937780
To create the illusion of having more colors than you do, and to hide the banding between otherwise solid fields of color.

>>8937780
Im glad n64 didn't have this shit

>>8937780
That's not dithering, this is dithering.

>>8937780

>>8937780
Those are scanlines, not dithering. The point of dithering is to create an illusion of "extra shades" between the two colours. This was especially effective on machines with limited colours like the ZX Spectrum. But to some extend all consoles upto the recent few gens has limited colour in some ways.

I like dithering. I think it can look really good when used well.

>>8937780
To hide color banding.

>>8937796
N64 did in fact have dithering, although the VI often smeared it.

>>8937780
To dither.

>>8937813
Those aren't scanlines.

>>8937802
>>8937786
Also keep in mind that on top of dithering for shading and expanding colors, the PS especially seems to always have a bit of dithering just everywhere on screen. It adds a bit of grit that is often lost if you turn it off.

>>8937818
It's also very noticeable in a few other consoles as well, GameCube and PSP to name two.

>>8937853
Reminds me of how that game Serious Sam on PC would invent texture noise up close to hide that you had exceeded the normal limit of the texture.

>>8937853
Funnily enough the PS has a forced dither step and devs often have higher than-16-bit textures just being shoved into it, so emulators can show the undithered textures with a setting. I like the effect overall because it gave the textures a 'rough' look that may not have been authorial vision but looked neat anyway. Something about the dithering algorithm used gives it a slight desaturating effect though, so it wasn't always good.

Unlike textures, untextured flats and gourad-shaded surfaces are actually allowed to be full color range without being dithered down to 16-bit. Crash's model is an example of well used gourad shading to dodge any dithering or discoloration. It's a bunch of untextured pieces with smooth, bright gradient colors.

>>8937780
You wouldn't get it.

>>8937796
>he doesn't know

>>8937805
God bless the PSX.

>>8937984
So if I play all my PSX games on PS2 with component cables am I missing out on dithering? I figured this would be a superior experience.

>>8938000
>So if I play all my PSX games on PS2 with component cables am I missing out on dithering?
No, with component you will see the dithering clearly.

>>8938000
This is a classic choice to be made with displaying retro graphics. Some look better sharp, some need a bit of the ol vaseline.

>>8937780
>there are people on /vr/ whose only experience with retro consoles is emulators 20+ years after the fact

>>8937805
That SOTN example really exemplifies the PS1 aesthetic.

>>8937802
So many zoomer questions lately
Dithering are meant to work in conjunction with CRT televisions.
During emulation you should turn this off.

>>8938000
With component cables the size and type of display will determine if the dithering works properly for you.

It was a trick that took advantage of the fact that standard display cables and the television/monitor they were output on were shit, so they could simulate more colors, shading or transparency. It became obsolete when game hardware got good enough where you could have true color and actual transparency.

>>8938000
I use component from a PS1 (HDRV) and you can see dithering clearly. I use a stupid high end CRT which shows it off well but still has the benefits of a nice CRT, 2D games look fucking stunning, Gradius Gaiden will blow your god damn mind with how good it looks, 3D games still look great. The benefits of component are colors, clarity, convenience (lots of devices will support it for capture/display/etc.)

Not all displays treat component the same mind you, some are softer, others filter it, sometimes the quality of the set just isn't great. This is PS1 capture of component, ignore the noise in the dark space that's not visible so it must be an artifact or something (I don't even see it in the OBS preview.) The dithering is all over the place in silent hill, I'd show you day time but I'm in the night section at the moment so too bad. Look at Harry's flash light, the environment has it visible too, however on my CRT I only really notice the flash light glow, everything else looks fine but the dithering is not apparent to me.

>>8937780
That's not dithering, you fucking zoomer.

>>8937802

>>8937843
correct, but they are some sort of fake effect added to mimic what someone thought might fool someone who didn't know what scanlines were into thinking they were scanlines.

Either way, not the dithering other threads/posts are trying to focus on..

>>8937796
The N64 has 3 or 4 dither modes, but one of them is “no dither” so you are partially correct.

>>8938136
it's difficult to make out when the n64 is dithering thanks to its very aggressive blurs and filters. Only way I saw it was on an hdmi modded system and it is AGGRESSIVE.

>>8937805
I gotta clarify this image because I feel like it missed saying so: both images are using 15 bit color depth on their textures. Dithering is a method of downgrading the color depth that is designed to avoid color-banding. The right side is 15-bit banded, the left is 15-bit dithered. The framebuffer can't be upgraded with just a code, in case someone thought the right side was 24 bit preserved.

>>8938108
what in the everloving fuck

>>8938108
we need bigger dithers

>>8938029
Time moves on bro. There are people old enough to vote that have never seen anything older than a PS2/GC/Xbox in person.

>>8937780
Google translate failed you again, emubaby.

>>8937780
>>8937786
This. Look at any PC98 game screenshot. They're pretty pieces of art. Then you realize how much art is truly in them because they could only display a maximum of 16 colors.

>>8938029
I didn't choose to be a zoomer

>>8937780
>What's the point of dithering?
to make colour transitions smooth or to create a transparency effect, the effects are only visible via composite because the signal is shit so it all gets blurred together, I think crts also have a part on smoothing the pixels together aswell. youre not supposed to see it

>>8937984
for me, every console gen 5 or earlier looks better on composite, especially PS1 and N64. You usually can't notice the dithering at all on composite unless your display is bigger which is why nobody talked about it back in the day, nobody owned component cables. Also makes sprite-based games look more like drawings than sprites when all the sprites blur together.

>>8937802
>>8938108
Now this is pod racing

>>8938085
>I'd show you day time but I'm in the night section at the moment so too bad.
start a new game faggot