/vr/ - Retro Games

Soul is a buzzword used only by people who lack the cognitive ability to actually describe why they like something and fall back on emotion, or know that it's objectively bad but can't rationalize that with the fact they like it anyway.
It is the equivalent of your mother telling you you're a handsome young man, and any girl would be lucky to have you.

>>8439441
For some yes, but for people who actually know art, we know it because we just feel it instinctually.

>>8439417
Soul means some product you like that wasn't completely corporate schlock designed to attract the lowest common denominator of retards. And it has at least some passion or thought put into it.

>>8439417
Not the game in your pic, that's for sure.

>>8439417

>>8439441
Spoken like a true soulless heathen

>>8439474
Is this truly a fair comparison though? One is a render of concept art and the other is taken from actual gameplay.

>>8439474
16 bits, SON.

>>8439441
FPBP

>>8439441
t. Zoomer who grew up in a soulless world

>>8439417
LA is shit you leftist cuckold.

>>8439441
fpbp as always

>>8439417
>What is Soul?
A gay meme for homsexuals that need to fuck off back to /v/

>>8439676
"Muh soul!!" is nu-speak zoomer lingo. Kill yourself

>>8439417
MM has more soul

>>8439458

Nobody refers to indie games as having soul despite fitting all your criteria.

>>8439441
>robotic fingers typed this post

>>8439960
Are there any well known retro indie games? I have no doubt that people are gonna spam SOVL in 30 years in a cuphead thread.

>>8439441
t. Regularly gets called out for being soulless

>>8439417
I think it's a combination of being able to tell that a game was a genuine labor of love and not just an attempt at cashing in on a trend or something like that, along with said game inspiring one's imagination.

Games with more simplistic graphics also tend to have more 'soul' because some things are left to the imagination, it's a bit more like reading a book than it is watching a movie adaption where you can imagine the game's world, characters etc to your own liking to some degree. Modern games tend to 'spell everything out' for the player, providing an experience that may be more engaging in the short term, but is less memorable/cherishable in the long term.

>>8439441
You are a fat generic soi most probably. I bet you unironically buy funco pop and watch marvel movies.
>>8439474
This is pretty much it.

>>8439417
Passion is Soul
LA was made by some lower rank employees and was essentially a fan project that they pitched to the higher ups themselves
This is the real reason that LA is probably the most soulful Zelda ever made

>>8440215
True. Also, LA is great but I always say, if you like LA, you will absolutely love the Oracle games (Seasons and Ages). Those games are truly peak soul, and should be experienced by everyone at least once. Best 2D Zelda games, no doubt about it.

>>8440215
You can really tell that people cared to make Links Awakening. For their competitor Ys didn't get a soulful game in Ys, it was a side project Nayuta no Kiseki made for PSP decades later.

>>8440230
this reads like bait

>>8439417
Soul is ashy ankles and rusty knees, nigger.

>>8440230
I think Oracels are a tad weaker than LA, but Oracles games were made when Capcom was at their utmost height and was bleeding soul. They of course would make a wonderful title(or titles in this case), and I will always recommend play Oracles instead of LA:DX

>>8439417
I like the explanation given by Yusuke in Persona 5, where soul can be understood as another word of heart, which makes even more sense.

>>8439441
You're an absolute fucking retard

>>8440057
Cave Story, most famously.

>>8440241
Hi! This is just a friendly post to remind you that you're currently posting on four channel dot org. Based on your language, I believe you intended to visit four chan dot org, specifically the /b/ board.
Thank you and have a nice day!

>>8440268
Funny that persona games are a great example of lacking soul. Devil survivor games at least had some, and SMTIV some as well.

>>8439441
legitimately low iq

>>8440057
Even some of the more corporate indie games ooze soul
Hotline Miami comes to mind

>>8439417
soul is when a video game atmosphere crafted with passion makes you feel good, it works with 8 bit too, I think it has to do with the architecture and the colors palette
you could make a 8 bit looking game on ps5, with soul it works

>>8440473
Then why does everyone claim all new games lack soul? There are lots of games that people put passion into, from Mario Rabbids to Indie games. Games were just as much about making money back in the 80s and 90s as they are now. It's just that as a child playing the game your brain didn't immediately think it was made solely to get money out of your parents.

9 times out of 10 the soulless meme is always about artstyle. Of course 8 bit sprites and worlds leave a lot for your imagination to fill in. And if soul means using your imagination then all retrostyled indie games are soulful by that logic. But by that logic, books and board games have more soul than all games.

In the end it always comes down to what games you grew up with. 20 years from now, people will be talking about how soulful Skyrim, Mario Kart 8, and Fortnite were.

As you grow older, no games can recapture the magic of your youth, witnessing mechanics for the first time in your life.

>>8440610
not all new games lack soul, and not everybody claims they do
your argument falls apart right out of the gate

>>8440615
99% of the time they do. And for the 1% time that someone does say a new game has soul (Origami King, a few days ago) someone else says they are wrong.

I don't agree that all new games are "soulless" anymore than I agree all retro games are "soulful". My point was that it is mainly a generational thing. Every generation thinks it's music is better than the next. My Grandpa says nothing compares to the 60s music, and my Father says nothing can beats the 80s music.

In essence, this soul meme is a mixture of nostalgia and the need to feel that your time period is better than what comes after it.

>>8440647
your father is wrong most 80s music is almost as bad as most modern music
60s is better for the most part though, I like your gramps.

Don't fall into that line of thinking, if you understand what soul truly is, nostalgia doesn't come into play as much.
I played Outer Wilds for the first time just a month or two ago and it's one of the most soulful games I've ever played

>>8440661
>60s is better for the most part though
kek no it isnt you dumb nigger

>>8440673
synths are okay and I love the 80s for experimenting with them but I think we can all agree poptop100 music has pretty much always sucked ever since big bands went out of fashion

>>8440678
they had synths and electric keyboards in the 60s too, big chief retard. The 80s didn't invent the keyboard. This is what I'm talking about, your opinions aren't credible.

>>8440678
Classical music is better than all your modern trash from Jazz to Rock n Roll to Alternative.

Journey did rule the 80s though.

>>8440680
key word here is top100
people weren't really designing soundfonts and developing drum machines in the 60s and it certainly wasn't in fashion

>>8440687
>Classical music
top 20 composers?

>>8440692
hes not me, I'm shitting on top100 and defending soul, get it straight

>>8440691
>soundfonts
where did you hear this term lmao the word you're looking for is "patches" and yes they absolutely were designing them, 60s synths were almost exclusively modular units that linked together with *patch cables*. There were certainly Drum Machines in the 60s, too.

>>8440695
>autism: the reply
yeah I know he's not you spergo

>>8439417
>What is Soul?
Effort, and passion. It's that simple.
>>8439474
DKC is a great example as you have the soul (ie: effort, and passion) filled original trilogy but then you have the corporate cash-in later games that lack that soul. When you have developers who love what they're doing you're going to get lots of passion and effort to make a great product. Thus you get a game with soul. It's kinda why I'm happy Valve hasn't made Half-Life 3 because I don't think current Valve has the soul to make that game.

>>8440696
yes but not in mainstream use. traditional instruments garnered much more demand and electric keyboardists really picked up more steam with late 60s bands and even then they weren't the centerpiece like the 80s
I don't know where you got this autistic idea that I said synths didn't exist in the 60s I just mentioned them in passing as something I appreciated the 80s for

>>8440701
I was actually being sarcastic, but I suppose that's even worse

>>8440703
>yes but not in mainstream use.
they quite literally were. The Beatles for instance were early "mainstream" adopters of "electronic instruments". They were also quite literally the "biggest band" at the time.

>>8440706
doesn't change the fact that synths were more prevalent and more frontline in the 80s

>>8440708
>doesn't change the fact that synths were more prevalent and more frontline in the 80s
nobody was ever arguing that you arrogant moron

>>8440710
and I was never arguing synths weren't around before the 80s, I just said that but you keep being retarded

>>8440713
you literally did but I'll accept your concession since you seem ESL and maybe you're just poor at expressing yourself in english.

>>8439417
>What is Soul?

A buzzword that invent solely because because people are afraid to describe thing as "fun". Appearantly being subjective is to be shunned of in some board.

tldr; it means good/fun game.

>>8440702
>Effort, and passion. It's that simple.
I think passion is right on, but it is very hard thing to measure. Passion doesn't always translate into quality products.

I literally spent an hour trying to figure out how to get the sword before giving up.

The game makes it obvious to use the shield to like, push things, but you just bump off of them.

Eventually I looked up a guide and that's what you're supposed to do, despite the mixed signals.

Still don't want to go back and play it because of that horrible design right at the start.

>>8440750
>reddit spacing
>filtered by a childrens game
checks out

>>8440750
5 year old me understood this and I'm an ESL retard.
Never have kids.

>>8440750
I also had this issue of mixed messaging playing the remake. I spent over an hour trying to give the raccoon a mushroom only to look up the guide and find out he needs a powder made from the same fucking mushroom which makes zero fucking sense. I pissed my pants and sent the Switch flying out the window.

>>8439457
Video games aren't art.

>>8440824
I'll still never understand how we can all agree that games are made up of components that are art (music, graphic design, story, game design) but when you add all these together they aren't art. Pure contrarian retardation and/or baiting

>>8440835
Idiot

>>8440845
Okay so it's bait. Well I'm just gonna go jack off instead.

>>8440143
pretty good; I completely agree with the first point.

rather than imagination, I'd put more emphasis on the idea of the game being an underdog in comparison to other, more complex things, though.

>>8440610
this is what happens when you get mario drunk and talk him into fucking a koala.

>>8440845
Video Games are not art, there is no interpretation in an object you manipulate. They can not be art. However, many of the things that make up a videogame can be art.
Namely:
Writing
Signing
Music
Images

>>8440886
>there is no interpretation in an object you manipulate.
Then why do we assign meaning or get value out of the games we play?

>>8440886
Except there is

>>8439441
Based anon telling the truth. Glad I'm not the only one who knows

Kek, soul is where you realize that you can absolutely create something that you already knew existed but just wasn't a thing until you had the passion of uncovering it based on what had seen before and things that peaked your interest in different ways that you had to express it through blood sweat and tears

>>8440852
>>8440910
>>8440962
Do you consider toys art too?

>>8439441
That's all well and good but you unironically sound like the s*i meme so your opinion is worthless. Try again later

>>8441119
sure. most things made by humans can be considered art. you fucking retarded faggot.

>>8441119
Sure, they require artistry to make. But why are you so intent on comparing your hobby to something as lowly as toys? And why is toys your go to response to a question about the combination of music, graphics, story, and game design?

>>8441119
Yes you fucking retard how are they not? Do you have some complex that makes you a try hard "you must only like mature deep shit" type?

>>8441129
No, it sounds like he thinks art is pretentious and he doesn't want his hobby to be associated with it when his view of art, that it's some high thing on a pedestal, is actually the pretentious one.

>>8440886
>there is no interpretation in an object you manipulate
Who the fuck says? Your argument is a made up rule.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interactive_art

>>8441125
>>8441125
Why are you so angry? I was wondering if you considered basically anything art like some people do. I don't think there's anything wrong with toys.

>>8441138
I think video games have aspects of it integrated into it, but their purpose is usually primarily to engage others in achieving an arbitrary goal which is not the purpose of art. For me, a self help book is not art even though it might be written in a creative way that draws upon communicating human experiences.

>>8440879
kek

>>8441160
>but their purpose is usually primarily to engage others in achieving an arbitrary goal which is not the purpose of art.
Well that's a reasonable objection but I don't think it's right. I think part of the enjoyment of games isn't just the goal, but also the aesthetic experience. After all, this is a thread about soul, which is basically shorthand for that experience. And I don't agree that art isn't really about achieving a goal. For instance, Bach didn't write music just for the fun of it, he wrote it to spiritually uplift people in the church he worked for while they took communion and did whatever. It literally was conceived to accomplish a goal, but we all consider it to be art. Most art commissioned has a specific goal, an occasion for its use, even an outcome like profitability, but we enjoy it for the product that it is even outside of those contexts.

>>8439441
Nailed it
>>8439474
This is so gay. Just stop

>>8439417
I mostly agree with the comments here referring to passion, but I feel like there's one thing a lot of people here also missed: There's a human element to most things I see as "soulful". Flaws, idiosyncracies. Things that tell you front-and-center that this was primarily one person's idea. This would also explain why so many modern games are "soulless": They're designed by-committee; They have no one voice guiding them. Even the directors for most games answer to CEO's, shareholders, and so on. Their flaws are the result of a mechanical failure, not a human misunderstanding of art, music, or interactivity. They feel so off because it's not one person sharing a lens to their world with you, but a corporation mashing together the countless little things that appear in successful games, and putting it out there without saying anything.

>>8440716
im not that anon but you objectively lost and are also a pedantic retard

>>8439816

>>8441119
lol you really thought you were making a point eh

>>8440057
Were you "filtered" by Cuphead? An archaic artstyle that must've taken ages to recreate. Hand drawn painstakingly for you to take a big dump on their work. What have you contributed to game art?

Why did you guys give him so many yous?

>>8441267
Go to bed.

>>8441284
just about to actually thank you

>>8441286
Nighty night anon

>>8439441
>t. not a handsome young man

>>8441272
I wasn't being ironic. I haven't played it but to me it looks like an Indie game that has the potential to have SOUL. I think a game needs to have a bit of nostalgia attached to it before it gains that status thus the 30 years comment.

>>8441276
>>8439441
About six of them are by me. When he sees this post and realises his bad take didn't cause as much outrage as he thought, he's going to kill himself (I hope).

>>8441345
You are a faggot bro

I've never seen the word "soulless" applied to a game from over 20 years ago that wasn't a remake.

>>8441346
cringe

>>8440319
Hot damn, Hotline is probably one of the best games I've ever played. It fucking oozed soul with the story, the soundtrack and insane replayability. You just know I had to be a fag and play it on a crt for maximum comf.

>>8441265
I like this. I think this is where I was trying to go with the underdog idea, some kind of flaw.

>>8439417
not DX, shit is soul less

>>8439441
Soul is a buzzword that means art originating from passion but backed up by skill and chance.
Its possible to have passion but no skill, and certainly possible to do something skillfully but have no passion.

soul arrives to the scene when the two beams crossover one another. They create something more than the sum of their parts.

>>8439960
Wrong.

>>8439474
>no one dreamed to make this
the black and white sections in tropical freeze disagree.

>>8440610
No game will probably be as impactful to me as undertale is and I've never played any of the earthbound games. My favorite formative games are stuff like Seiken densetsu and links awakening. They have very little in common. You are running aground because you are trying to quantify art. I will wholely agree with you that new games can be soul. but the reason /vr/ exists isn't because we all think
>nu game bad
but because all anyone on shitholes like /v/ and /vg/ talk about is the latest corporate schlock. They have no taste, they want to talk about what everyone else is hyped for in the current year. We want to talk about stuff we're interested in right now instead of what all the normalfags care about.

>>8442672
>no game will be as impactful to me as Undertale
AHAHAHAHAHAHAH

>>8443013

>>8439441
Cringiest, most autistic, sad, bitter zoomer on the board.

>>8439417
If you have to ask, you're missing the point. You can't objectively break it into component parts and compare it to some kind of arbitrary checklist. Art speaks to people. That's what art truly is, communication of ideas through the senses that don't (necessarily) rely on language (though that can certainly be a part of it). When something "has SOUL", it means the artists were successful in communicating the dreams and passion they had to you through the medium of their work. You connected, in some tiny way, with people you never met across time and space and came to know a bit of them and their joys and hardships through what they envisioned and infused into their project.

When something lacks soul, it's because it was either done with purely financial motivation in mind (we all need to eat, but a cynical emphasis on "this will make people buy it" rather than "this is a heartfelt idea I want to communicate" shows through. Most good, successful games have to, by necessity, strike a balance between the extremes to survive), or else is desperately trying to recommunicate someone else's ideas (e.g. most remakes) as a halfhearted attempt to recapture the past.
This is not to be a slight on nostalgia, which is a perfectly valid reason to enjoy something, but if you want to communicate that sense of nostalgia in a work, you have to do it "in your own words", not just copying someone else's past that made you feel a certain way and hoping it plays out the same way again.

>>8443064
This Is like if someone said Scream was their most impactful horror film

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_aWf_-aYm0

>>8443159
you seem to be mistaking the fandom for the game. thats fine, I dont care if retards don't like good video games.

>>8439441
it is a buzzword but it also describes a real concept

>>8443242
You're missing the point. It's a meta game, a game about games, a subversive parody.

Basically its the encapsulation of all postmodern cancer

>>8443254
... hence my analogy. Like an horror fan saying "my favorite horror film Is the film that takes the piss on horror films"

>>8440886
By that exclusion, games cannot be art, but watching people play games could be art. Seems a little like you're painting yourself into a corner to make a point.

Anyway, even if you accept the premise, games like Papers, Please shit all over it before we even start to tear it down.

>>8443254
>dude its a meta game
guess bravely defaults are shit now?
fuck off normalfag.

>>8443286
you realize the game in the op is a game about games right?

>>8439441
I like how the truth got this many asshurt replies. Never fails.

>>8444905
The way 'soul' gets used on this board/site is like a buzzword, yeah, but what it refers to is real.

Soul & Heart

>>8439441
>tryhards for the fpbp, but ends up being cringe

>>8439474
Okay I'll bite, this is a terrible example because the DKCR games are so full of cool little details, enviromental storytelling and atmosphere that yes, don't match the glory of the originals but are very great on their own. The very fact they made that little cutscene in the example as a transition instead of having Kong fall is a layer of effort that I don't think a "souless" product could have. Classic DKC has per-setting atmosphere which is great, but in the Returns game every level can and in most cases has its own theme, vibe and aesthetic. New Super Mario bros they are not. The way the setpieces and the platforming mesh together, especially in the minecart and rocket barrel levels, the monochrome stages, all the enemies having hit and attack animations, parts with dynamic music...

Shit negro, are you gonna tell me a stage with dynamic music tied to evolving obstacles like Horn Top Bop is souless? The rhythm stage in the factory world, that huge fish in the underwater caverns, the Gradius shit in the rocket volcano level, the crab pirates being a musical boss, the carnivorous plant eating the penguin dude at the end of the fruit jungle rocket barrel level all the ethnic/cultural inspiration the Tropical Freeze worlds have?

>>8443137
its easier to have soul when you have 4 people working on a project versus 150. Also, and this might sound autistic, but in the last 10 years there has been an artistic move towards being "quirky" which I don't really like and maybe other anons don't either...

>>8443137
One reason I always hated soul being used is because there's this feeling of superiority or fear of critique. As if people are fighting back against the present forgetting the future because "muh soul". If soul is as you're saying it, then people should be able to argue that a remake or something could in fact communicate things better.
People don't think that, though. It's not just that they disagree, but they feel like there is an objectiveness to this soul stuff. I like what >>8440728 says. People are afraid of being subjective and can't handle their feelings being hurt when someone disagrees or critiques their game.
>>8441265
On the one hand, committees really can hurt the creative vision of a work. On the other, to limit it to ONE person seems like some auteur shit. Most games are made by at minimum teams of 4, most of the time teams of 20 or so. The producer has a hand in it, the art director, the art team, the programmers, the director, sometimes even the QA team. To limit it to one person getting all the credit feels like a misstep, even though I know what you're talking about.

>>8445643
>this feeling of superiority or fear of critique
A natural consequence of the bitter, resentful 4chan culture being nothing BUT unnecessary critique.
>"aargh, that popular game you liked? actually IT WASN'T ANY GOOD! stop liking it!"
You're upset because the subjective term "soul" provides a bulwark against games being casually dismissed by people who have nothing better to do than try to feel superior by dismantling games for the flaws of their time. The very word hurts you because you know it's something you lack. You feel excluded because you're not able to experience the joy that people who find beloved old games soulful do.

>>8445680
This feels very obviously like bait. I'll give you your (you), but please try to be more subtle or genuine. For a second, I thought it would be some misunderstanding and started to type something up, but then it got to the point where I could feel like this was a smidge too much. A little too abrasive, which does suck somewhat since I wouldn't mind an honest reply.

>>8441345
The notion that something has to be old in order to have "soul" is absolutely ridiculous. It's all about the aesthetic value said game has.
Although it does seem that game developers nowadays are less focused on the artistic facet and moreso on gameplay and meaningless technical feats such as graphical fidelity.
Cuphead is probably one of the few exceptions that come to mind when I think about modern games.

>>8445978
Cuphead Is fake soul. Instead of doing their own style they said "hey lets blatantly copy that old famous style so people get the reference and feel nostalgic"

>>8439417
I do love that game.

>>8446089
>someone spent time making this p image

>>8439417
That game looks awful in “color”

>>8446012
you have an insanely low iq

>>8446091
Yes. It did not manifest itself.

>>8442672
undertale is 20 years of prior video game influences and internet injokes wrapped up into something where I am incapable of seeing it as more than the sum of its parts. But I guess that’s what happens when you get old

>>8446091
...and I found it quite amusing when I initially saw it, so I'll be posting it again. Seethe.

I feel the best way to describe it is "unnecessary effort". Like in Link's Awakening, they didn't need to make a pretty decent story in it, they didn't need to have stuff like the couple mini games in it, it didn't need the shell collecting quest. They could have basically made a GB version of NES Zelda but with different dungeons, but instead they went above and beyond and made something very unique.

>>8446095
Pathetic. Im sorry that just because the graphics are well done from a technical standpoint you can't see through another postmodern attempt at exploiting the past relying on cheap overt references to achieve emotional resonance

>>8446154
noooo don't pay homage to a great style that stealing wwwaaahhh

Soul, for me, is when either when I start caring about the characters or the setting.

>>8446154
All those words and you said nothing

>>8446202
I got his point

>>8446189
You missed it

>>8439441
>your mother telling you you're a handsome young man, and any girl would be lucky to have you
Thats because this is true. Some things are just better than others in nearly every way. Some games have undisputed SOUL just like I have undisputed value to women. I love my mom for teaching me this truth of the world.

>>8446208
>I got his point
There's no point. You're just another idiot who can only think in buzzwords and culture war shit you read on 4chan Twitter

>>8444905
>m-m-m-mad!

>>8446012
>hey lets blatantly copy that old famous style so people get the reference and feel nostalgic
Yup. I'm glad that didn't completely pass over your head. Now name five games that have that genuine 30's cartoon aesthetic; five titles that would be indistinguishable from the real thing upon initially looking at them.

>>8446560
God do you moros event listen to yourselves?

>OMG THEY DID AS GOOD JOB REPLICATING AN OLD THING I RECOGNIZE. I TOTALLY GET THE REFERENCE! SUCH AN EPIC HOMAGE. IT OOZES SO MUCH SOOOOOUUUL

>>8446712
yeah it's a cool style, and it's nice to see people still appreciate it. i'm glad you're finally starting to catch on

>>8446712
>sperging out like a little fag spaz is my idea of a reposte!
Rope. Ladder. Tree. I'm sure that even a window licking tranny 'tard like you can figure out the rest... Now get to it. Don't dawdle, mongoloid. Spare the world from another nanosecond of your profound and monumental stupidity.

>>8439417
Distinct, memorable art. One off flourishes. Doesn't look like it was made cheaply, or cynically for the lowest common denominator. Flawed, but great enough as a whole to ignore or deal with the flaws. You just know.

>>8439474
Promo render vs realtime is a liiittle unfair.

>>8442656
There were sections like that in the first game, and silhouette games were a thing. There was a big one prior to DKCR.
>what is Limbo

>>8439441
But being a loving mother IS peak soul.

>>8446145
This is a good point actually and I don't see this mentioned a lot. Developers going that extra mile to make something full of quality as opposed to simply making sure it has just enough content to sell and get popular. Pokemon Gold and Silver didn't absolutely need to let you revisit Kanto after beating the elite four, but they did it anyway. There used to be more stuff like this in older games I think.

>>8445978
I would say older games just tend to have more soul because the 80s, 90s, and early 2000s were a more 'free' time creatively, the video game market was not as saturated back then, people making games had more freedom to experiment and make something based almost purely on passion & original ideas. It wasn't all about the 'what sells and what doesn't' mentality. There are still good modern releases of course, but the golden age of gaming has been and gone IMO.

>>8446145
/thread

>>8446145
They also didn't need to make those sick anime scenes. The remake at least did those justice even if they did give Link pants....

>>8443137
This sums it up nicely. You can go into more detail on certain individual aspects of what makes something 'have soul', but this is the main thing, I would say. It's something that can't really be defined in a specific way, which is why the word 'soul' works to describe it.

>>8446145
This, modern "AAA" studios are content with slapping on the bare minimum or less as long it gets people to buy the game. Commercials, trailers, hype, it's all designed to get people to buy the game, but the actual game itself has little substance.

Modern games are designed to be consumed, not played.

>>8440886
There are an uncountable number of games that prove you wrong.
It's okay to be retarded, but it's not okay to be okay with being retarded

>>8446712
>>8446012
finally someone who gets it

>>8446816
>sperging out like a little fag spaz is my idea of a reposte!
because making an overly elaborate ad hominem full of buzzwords is clearly better

>Rope. Ladder. Tree. I'm sure that even a window licking tranny 'tard like you can figure out the rest... Now get to it. Don't dawdle, mongoloid. Spare the world from another nanosecond of your profound and monumental stupidity.

>>8447865
It's funny as well because for the longest time, hardly anyone could accept that music is a form of art, now thats a bit more mainstream, but video games = art is still controversial for some it seems.

>>8446107
Undertale, in my opinion, requires enjoyment of touhou to be liked by anyone with taste. I don't blame anyone for not liking it, but they would have to be retarded to say a game passionately made by 1 guy and a comissioned artist with this own well renowned sound track for it isn't soul. It's soul incarnate. It's passion and skills. If you don't find the humor catchy or the serious bits heart string tugging, then it will fall flat on its face for anyone.

>>8439417

Are the Gordos a friendly hommage to the Kirby series or did Kirby take them from LOZ?

Who had them first?

>>8448701
>a friendly hommage to the Kirby series
yes. Link's Awakening is full of stuff like this. There's an enemy later in game called the Anti Kirby that swallows you

>>8439417
>posts the version with less soul
jfc

>>8442650
>undertranny
kys

>>8447939
>hardly anyone could accept that music is a form of art
I don't believe that. Classical music has been called art for centuries, even when it was contemporary. Every definition I've ever seen for art has included music as a "type of art", even writings from ancient times.

>>8440886
I think the point you're making is very similar to what Kojima said about it, which is that games cannot be art, because they must take into account the "acceptability" of the interaction. In other words, you cannot make an intentionally poor-playing game, while a painting can be "ugly" or a song can be "bad" and still gain broad acceptance.

I don't agree with him, and feel like the negative reaction to Raiden left a sour taste in his mouth.

>video games are art
>soul is not a buzzword

>>8449207
>In other words, you cannot make an intentionally poor-playing game, while a painting can be "ugly" or a song can be "bad" and still gain broad acceptance.
When that can never be true in a world where Deadly Premonition exists.

>>8448954
Yeah, almost made me not want to pop in especially because this was right after another thread praising the original and the DMG map compared to the remakes.

>>8448956
>>>/reddit/

>>8449272
post wrist and jaw

>>8449976
>undertale

>>8450105
Please stop posting wojaks. It’s just making this shithole board even worse

>>8450108
why make such thread?
why allow the year change?

place is dead

revert the rules

>>8443242
I hated the game before the fandom arose. I’m not surprised at how cringe they are, but I am surprised at how enduring and widespread they are.

>>8450126
>I hate what I don't understand.
Undertale is a short game. People got a tiny bag of the best chips they ever had and wanted moar. too bad for them their own attempts at mimmicking the fried perfection was not only pointless, but more would have made the chips become boring monotonous and overbearing.
and then there are some faggots like you that just don't like chips.

>>8449903
tuplatale is actually far more plebbit than here. We don't like the lgbtq community, they come here to fight with us, however they are at home on twatter and plebbit. You should go to either.

>>8440282
>REEEE don’t insult my VIDYA!!!
Kys

>>8440687
>rock sucks
>Journey is good though
Lol

>>8450162
>I'm a huge newfag
nobody cares.
go back
>>>/reddit/

>>8450180
>constantly spams “go back”
Holy shit dude, you’re so fucking cool

>>8450157
>redditale
>the best chips they ever had
LOL

>>8449037
Yes of course, I should have mentioned that, and specified that I meant recent times. Can't count the number of times I've heard people say that "music is not art, it's just music" or something along those lines. Also it gets kinda complicated when you think about different kinds of music and their target audiences etc, I mean, I could understand why someone might not want to consider a modern pop song to be art, for example. But I think music in general is a form of art, so even the more so called 'shallow' or very commercial types of music should be included in that definition. I mean, one might not enjoy the works of a certain painter for example, but it doesn't automatically become "not art" just because of that.

>>8440687
most classical stinks you pretentious dork

>>8439441
so what you're saying is you're an autist with issues identifying emotions in yourself and other people and prefer gloating about your IQ, which helps you stay comfy (alone) in the basement

Midway's 90s arcade games are a good example of soul. Most of them fucking suck as games when judged objectively, but they're loaded with random shit the developers threw in just for shits and giggles. Like in Cruis'n USA, if you're playing in first-person, your windshield will get covered in dead bugs on certain maps.

But at the same time, you'd still have to be a complete retard to play the original Mortal Kombat in 2021 for any reason other than nostalgia.

>>8440886
I don't think interpretation is vital to art. Art, in my opinion, is something whose primary aim is to evoke an emotion, thought, or feeling. Good art is something that conveys strong emotion.

Therefore Crazy Taxi is proof video games are art.

>>8440678
>>8440680
>>8440687
If you’re over the age of 18 the only music you should be listening too is jazz. Live and die by Agharta and Dark Magus. Which reminds me, is there any retro vidya (or any really) which has free jazz music in it

>>8440692
For me it's Bach, Telemann, Zelenka, Bruckner, Brahms, Wagner, Graupner, Handel, Vivaldi, Gisualdo, Dittersdorf, Haydn, Schubert, Mozart, Boccherini, Weiss, Geminiani, Purcell, Fasch, and Beethoven in that order.

No Russian composers because I hate them all.

>>8450601
>If you’re over the age of 18 the only music you should be listening too is jazz
I'm gonna listen to what I want to.

>>8439441
I think your analogy is bad but the first part is 100% correct.

>>8446145
/v/ used to have a lot of "TECHNOLOGY" threads which are the collection of unneccessary bell-and-whistle.

Come to think about it, I haven't seen those kind of thread anymore since mid ps3 gen.

Start Game, in the first 5 mins the following happens
>game starts with dad calling you a moron and throwing you out of the house to sleep on the street
>sneak back into the house when dad is away at work
>enter sister's bedroom, search her wardrobe
>find and keep her panties
>smell them

>go to the inn's 2nd floor
>push a flower pot down the window to smash on a NPC's head below
>no purpose except to be a comical effect

>the way to revive party members is to go ask a Dr Frankenstein look-a-like

>lot's of cool little details in the first town already

>charming graphics

>this music

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bCrOF82kP0

This is how you know you just entered a world of soul.

As far as I see it, two separate things are often refereed to as "soul".
Firstly, strong art direction that doesn't feel half assed or cookie cutter. If you want a modern game that does this, look to Nier Automata, Cuphead, or Splatoon.
Secondly, that space that retro games often tap into where visuals are just vague enough to engage the imagination, and don't overwhelm with superfluous detail. Subtitles are also more soulful than voice acting.

>>8449207
>you cannot make an intentionally poor-playing game
You absolutely can though. They aren't going to be as widely liked as other games, but that's also true of intentionally ugly art.
Arguably the entire No More Heroes series is a kind of experiment in intentionally aggravating and messing with the player, and those games have their niche.

>>8440886
Isn't "interactive art" an actual thing though? I know I've heard accounts of artists inviting people to come and punch them, and calling that a performance.

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