/vr/ - Retro Games

>>8338751
eww just fucking use the original art you faggot gross, now i have to hide another thread

probably because the vidya crash and "video games are a fad" mindset was still in western people's minds and for a while they expected the same thing that happened to atari to happen to nintendo

>>8338751
japs where only better at platformers

>>8338759
And racers, shmups, adventures, run n gun, beat em ups, multiplayer games, fighters, the list goes on...

>>8338751
Were they really? The Japs had little to no counterparts to things like First Person Shooters, and for RPGs they actually just copied the older Wizardry games slavishly, which is perhaps one of the most tedious WRPGs of their era.

>>8338756
The vidya crash wasn't noticed or known about by most people, it was only really felt on the industry side and the majority of it was born by Atari and those little fly by night companies making unlicensed 2600 games.

>>8338773
>FPS
Read OP again. Until the mid 90s all you played was Doom and... Doom.

>>8338751
That's not true. Fans of the strategy, FPS, RPG, simulator, and management genres were all lavished with a plethora of great and influential games from Western developers. The games were so influential that Japanese developers, in a few instances, took the ideas and mechanics and made really great games. Doom, Smash TV, Theme Hospital, the original XCOM, Wizardry 7, Ultima 7, Nethack, Civilization 2, Rogue Spear, and many other games are without a great Japanese equal because there's little to improve.

Lemme just get this out of the way, British games suck ass.

>>8338791
Brits are only good at making racing games.

>>8338791
Bullfrog was a great developer. You don't know shit.

>>8338781
>Wolfenstein 3D
>Catacomb 3D
>Hovertank 3D
>Doom
>Doom 2
>Rise Of The Triad
>Heretic
>Shadowcaster
>Corporation
>System Shock
>Terminator Rampage
>Pathways Into Darkness
>Marathon
>Blake Stone
>Cyclones
>Zero Tolerance
>Alien Vs. Predator
These games are all from 1994 or earlier, many of them are good, too.

>>8338791
Fuck you, those limey shits are forever based for making Syndicate and Syndicate Wars

>>8338791

Because they have better imagination

>>8338791
Yeah, Grand Theft Auto sucked. And Carmageddon. And lemmings, Rome total war, dungeon keeper, the list goes on...

>>8338815
I don't fully agree with that, they're very often highly content with following the same formulas they've done many times already.

Western games have been traditionally overlooked because we just haven't learned to appreciate the intentions of European or American developers. Especially Word games which are much more popular in the West (and board games or games based off of gameshows).

Eventually people will appreciate developers Core Design and Psygnosis and SCE Cambridge. Publishers like Microsoft also brought The Neverhood into existence, so you should be able to download titles like that for your system. Disney hopefully will re-enter the gaming market with a team of animators, there's too much incentive for them not to.

>>8338815
>better imagination
Dude everything they make are basically collages of American films, nevermind all the music they imitate.

1997 is probably the first year where Western competition keeps pace with Japanese design. In 1998, the Japanese release better simulations or cinematic-games, but the West crafted better games for the adult market. In 1999, the west was holding on with sports titles but lost many of its major developers.

Actually many failed British and American developers should've been nationalized but this would've required a lot of foresight. Do Western countries have nationalized developers, even for the purpose of education?

>>8338879
or the catalogues of European writing they copied for their stories.
Asians are basically wage bugs and look to the west for anything artistic to imitate.

>>8338881
>Actually many failed British and American developers should've been nationalized but this would've required a lot of foresight. Do Western countries have nationalized developers, even for the purpose of education?
Ubisoft isn't nationalized but gets a fucking lot of gibs from the french government

>>8338751
I assume you're talking about post-crash home gaming.

The answer is that Nintendo introduced quality control. This had a cascade effect that uplifted Japan. It was a long time before Western devs snapped out of their "depression" and reclaimed gaming dominance.

>>8338751
>Just to early to mid 90s
Try since the late 70s to now, faggot.

>>8338751
Because the japanese made simple games for retarded children, but with high budget. To play the best western games, one needed to read manuals, experiment with the mechanics, and really immerse themselves in the atmosphere.

>>8338773
>Muh fps
Fuck off with that garbage.

>>8338751
Funny how Japan could also produce the worst games you’ve ever played in your life at the exact same rate. For every high quality platformer there’s unplayable shit like Super Monkey Daibouken or endless mahjong game

US developers are currently stronger than Japan

>>8338907
Not retro

They focused on having fun gameplay, as opposed to western games that wanted to simulate baking bread in their horrible looking RPGs for the sake of "immersion".

>>8338907
>Us market also includes Japanese games sold by their U.S. branches
Uh oh
Also, Pokemon is the biggest franchise ever, Westcuck.

>>8338914
Crpgs are the ugliest pieces of Derek I've ever had the misfortune of playing. Glad they're dead.
>>8338904
Never played old school Koei games, huh? How's your Japanese? I guarantee their management sim is more involved than anything from Maxis.

I hate weebs so much it's unreal

Most western devs are more concerned with showing off their programming skills than making a fun game.

>>8338751
Western games are in the absolute shitter currently. The only time the West really had an advantage was in the dark ages of 2008-2012, when Japanese developers were transitioning to HD and farming out franchises to absolutely shite Western companies. Eventually, they got their act together and stuff like the Souls games would revolutionize the industry.

>>8338917
Even Poland is more relevant than Japan now you dumb weeb

>>8338924
>On 4chan
>Hates weebs
???

>>8338935
Lololol
Now this is shit posting.
Has CDR imploded yet from shitting the bed with Cyberpunk? Stay mad, potato-san.

>>8338791
Suck ass and shite

>>8338887
the best thing that the French ever did was prevent EA from acquiring Ubisoft.

>>8338943
Japanese gaming industry is finished. All talented people are moving to China. Cope and seethe dumb weeb
>>8338939
Yes

>>8338925
Well, they *were* concerned with that, once. Now most games are based on Unreal or Unity (which are western, but still).

>>8338934
>Eventually, they got their act together
By giving up and using Western-developed engines lol

>>8338791
There's more than just Speccy and Amiga you know

>>8338954
Taiwan is an independent nation.

>>8338935
Could have been, but they just had to conform to American degeneracy.

Depends on which genre you're talking about.

Also, many Japan's best games are their riffs on western games. Final Fantasy, Phantasy Star, Dragon Quest, and basically the entire JRPG genre were their attempts to clone everything they liked about Ultima and Wizardry.

guesses pulled from my ass

>Western devs saw video games as somewhere between gambling machines and children's toys. what mattered was getting people to part with their money, and there was no point in cultivating a loyal audience because there was always a new crop of kids with allowances
>the rise of Blockbuster actively discouraged publishers from releasing games that could be completed in one rental
>British dev studios were often staffed by literal teenagers with no experience, no mentors and who were more interested in the "fun" parts of game development than bugfixing and level design (rip 90% of /agdg/ games)

It would explain why American computer games were noticeably better in the 80s than either their work on home consoles or British computer games, and the difference between Tiger and Nintendo's approaches to LCD games.

>>8338751
>80s and early to mid 90s?
You pretent like these are the only times they were superior.
I will shit on everyone's face who seriously debates they are doing worse now or during the 7th gen. It was always Japan who brought out great and worthwhile games.

It's simply that they grew up in arcade times and wasted coins to PLAY and not to get some stupid narrative exploration bullshit.
The west grew up with shit like Pen&Paper and D&D, hence why their games are all about minmaxing stupid values or having elaborate narrative components.

TL;DR japan makes games, the west makes number generators and movies.

>>8338925

You can trace the demoscene mindset in European devs from the C64 to the Amiga to 20 years of Nintendo portable consoles and even to a couple of modern studios like VD-Dev and Shin'en. It's always obvious, and their destiny is inevitably to end up in some e-celeb's "20 GameSphere Micro Games That Punched Above Their Weight" video

Why were Japanese threads so much better than their western counteparts during the 80s and early to mid 90s?

>>8338751
weeb generalization, expected from a weeb board on a weeb site

>>8338763
>racers
no
>adventures
no
>multiplayer games
no
>the list goes on...
but does it

>>8338881
>1997 is probably the first year where Western competition keeps pace with Japanese design
t. zoomer weeb

I genuinely think people over the age of 15 or 16 who can still play and enjoy Japanese video games all have some legitimate cognitive disorder.
There are some exceptions to this, but for the most part the average jap game is so mindnumblingly easy, so derivative, so without player input and so railroaded that I can't see how anyone with a fully formed brain could enjoy them.

>>8339158
you didn't play much then. I don't remember stuff like DMC, KH2, God Hand, several Tales games or the countless fightans from Japan being easy or braindead. If anything something like Devil May Cry 3 has an extremely crazy skill barrier to be played perfectly optimal.

If we're talking about shit like visual novels or srpg's/turn based rpg's then yea, i can somewhat see your point. But i can't really think of any western game from 2021 that would in any possible way rival the complexity of a Tales of Arise

>>8339260
>crazy high skill barrier
>lists a bunch of single player games
Everyone knows they make the best fighting games which is why I said there are exceptions.
Even those games you listed are laughable. The best and most optimal way to beat DMC is basic-basic-basic-stinger. It has the quickest animations, the longest reach, the lowest recovery, the least risk, and does acceptable damage. The only reason to do anything else is to get your style meter up, so you can get more orbs to buy other moves, that aren't as good as trianglex3-stinger. The entire gameplay system of DMC is basic ass boring bullshit, masked by mountains of "cuhrazzzzy" anime bullshit style over subtance so your average 15 year old can feel so badass and cool for beating up an AI bot.
Every single actual skill based multiplayer game that anyone has ever given a shit about (with the exception of fighting games) is made in the west, because they make actual gameplay, and structure the game around it as opposed to letting you play out some anime fantasy.
My god imagine talking about high skill gameplay and then listing fucking Kingdom Hearts, a menu based ARPG, with push triangle to do epic move gameplay

>>8338905
Low test.

>>8338924
Then you're in the wrong neighborhood, Redditor.

>>8338914
Which Western retro RPGs features bread baking mechanics?

>>8339406
>Which Western retro RPGs features bread baking mechanics?
Ultima, fucking zoomer

1) Arcade hardware was always better than whatever "PC" people had at home.
2) Atari and Midway were the only western developers interest in making games for the arcade.
3) Western developers were more interest in realism, violence, and digitizing content.
4) Japanese developers had high quality pixel artists and animators who focused on fantasy.
5) People play video games to escape real life.

Please like and subscribe. Thank you!

>>8338791
I disagree the brits had some very innovative games that at the time were amazing, especially in how they stretched systems like ZX Spectrum.

>>8339289
>Every single actual skill based multiplayer game

Lol! Clicking really fast doesn't that much "skill" dude.

>>8339289
single player doesn't necessarily mean it's simple. I named few, these are great examples for how deep it can get in an offline campaign.
>best option is stinger
Having braindead options doesn't nullify all the other things you can do in that game. Not being forced to do them is such a silly way to invalidade everything else a game offers. If we go by that logic lots of mindgaming parts in competitive online games would also be null and void since there is always a cheese strategy to make use of and not everyone is familiar with.
>My god imagine talking about high skill gameplay and then listing fucking Kingdom Hearts, a menu based ARPG
1? Yes. Everything else? Yes. 2? Has a bit more to offer and unfortunately no other KH game will come close to that anytime soon judging by 3. 2 is missing some cool features but you can do all sorts of combos and interesting boss interactions.

>>8339410
Those are the ones I didn't play, they never sat quite right with me for some reason.
Millennial for that matter.

>>8339421
>realism
Only to a point, you had some devs paying a lot of attention to detail with PC games, for stuff like military sims primarily.

With stuff like Duke Nukem, Commander Keen, Wolfenstein 3D, to name the more famous stuff in the early 90s, the only time realism ever came up was for detailing, those games are still just all fast arcade-style stuff (then you've got stuff like Doom and Rise Of The Triad, where the realism was mainly in some of the visual, but the games are otherwise really fantastical and unrealistic).
For the 'adventure' genre, be it text parser or point and click, people did whatever the fuck they could imagine, the really popular ones were usually cartoony.

>>8339421
> Atari and Midway were the only western developers interest in making games for the arcade.
Absolutely. To a point where even their home console games where fun arcade-esque games you can still replay today. If you would ask me what western game i actually like the first thing comming to my mind would always be Team Buddies

>>8338751
They always were and still are to this day. The only debatable period was the 7th gen and I still wouldn't call Western games better during that time. They just got a headstart on Japanese devs who struggled with the hardware and hit the nail on the head when it comes to attracting casuals.

>>8339441
>Lol! Clicking really fast doesn't that much "skill" dude.
t. anon who can’t click fast

>>8339453
>the really popular ones were usually cartoony.
wrong

>>8339494
>They always were and still are to this day.
weeb talking out of his ass

>>8339504
Found the tranny. Don't you have some glorious Western games with impactful narrative to play instead of shitposting here?

>>8339504
cope eternally troon.

>>8339513
>Found the tranny
said the weeb

>>8339504
well you see
japan has: Tekken
the west has: no Tekken
checkmate troon

>>8339494
yea. And the 7th gen was btw the period with games like Metal Gear Rising, countless good Yakuza games and even some shit like Lightning Returns that did a complete 180. Saying that was their weakest is like saying "yeah they won but they didn't win so hard"

>>8339527
this. despite being behind that gen, the games you mentioned are pretty good, not to mention the Souls games. the only western game that measured to japanese games during that time is New Vegas, and thats because it had very goods writing, something that westerners hate and are also almost incapable of.

>>8339498
I can't think of many popular point and click or text parser adventures from the early 90s or late 80s which had a strong focus on realism. I guess Police Quest?

Why the hell are there so many weebs on this thread

Are we being raided by /v/

>>8339546
this isn't your commie discord hugbox.

>>8339548
you are a jarpig m8

go and circlejerk with your leftist tranny sisters on twitter

>>8339546
>>8339548
rekt

lmao, why did some posts disappear?
>>8339124
based. but you should now that Parasite Eve 2 is better. Next time post some PE2 Aya or i will call you cringe and white

>>8339573
jannies hate being called out.

>>8338791
Worms armageddon.

>>8338751
>80s and early to mid 90s
There has never been a time where japanese games weren't better, not Just in that time frame

>>8339453
>With stuff like Duke Nukem, Commander Keen, Wolfenstein 3D
Which takes us back to the arcade verses PC argument. Atari experimented with bit slicing and DSPs, but they either gave up or ran out money. Western developers weren't interested in the arcade and limited themselves to what was available at home. Meanwhile Japanese developers became seasoned veterans programming games for multi CPU hardware and would later delve into using DSPs for 3d. It was simply a better experience than what you could have at home.

>>8339593
>There has never been a time where japanese games weren't better
You have to be braindead to actually believe this
Japanese games fell off hard and their highest grossing games are now mobile phone gacha shit

>>8339452
>Having braindead options doesn't nullify all the other things you can do in that game.
yes it literally does. the only reason to not just do trianglex3-stinger is so you can call your mom into the room and show her how epic and super awesome your one-liner spouting, trechcoat wearing, half demon looks as he's juggling some retarded AI that died 5 minutes ago.
The epitome of style over actual substance gameplay, meant to look cool with 0 attention paid to how or why to actually incoorporate it into the game. A fucking CRPG has more in depth gameplay than DMC because you at least have to know how to utilize every class to clear some encounters.
>2 is missing some cool features but you can do all sorts of combos and interesting boss interactions.
Such amazing and incredible combos like hit X repeatdly after selecting attack on the menu, and then hit triangle when the game tells you to.

>>8338842
Core Designs were very mediocre in their time. Disney's "own" (through Virgin games" games were pretty bad, all their best games were made by Capcom and Sega.

This phenomenon was observed for console games and console games only

>>8338751
>>8339421
This and also:
1) Much finer/cohesive art direction
2) A graphic culture better suited to the medium
3) Close attention to tactile enjoyment (input/physics)

Always referring to consoles but anyway, consoles were absolute king from early aughties backwards

>>8338961
Well, you could replace programming skills with inane shit like lore and art and it'd still ring true.

PCs and their frame-buffer graphics cards being the default gaming (and everything else) platform really cramped their style.
Reminder that people actually played games like King's Quest in CGA.

>>8339616
Ah yes, not like the west is ever doing mobile shit, eh?
RAID: SHADOW LEGENDS
Also i hope Cyberpunk, the GTA Remaster and Warcraft 3 are working out fine for you.
>>8339618
Lmao. Imagine just being ignorant af to a whole gameplay mechanic because >"BROOOO YOU CAN JUST PRESS THIS ONE BUTTON TO WIN BRO YOU DON'T NEED TO LEARN COMPLEX COMBOS BRO JUST SPAM BUTTON BRO"
This man is giving you a car and you just chew on the wheels

>>8339738
Nothing better than seeing a response from a retard realizing he can't actually debate anything you said and vomiting out a /v/ tier shitpost

Why is that woman spammed everywhere, I don't get it

>>8338751
Westerners had shit art training (and still do mostly) and didn’t understand arcade game mechanics or how to make an action game fun just in moving your character around (and still don’t mostly)
Also westerners tended to get less help from Japanese manufacturers when it came to dev documentation, or had to deal with poor translations, and didn’t benefit from sharing of ideas with Japanese devs because of the physical and language barriers

>>8339616
Japanese game dev is pretty much dead in spirit aside from the few publishers/developers who learned to AAA and some scattered indie devs

>>8338763 - sorry this guy >>8339150 was right.

>>8339976
Basic bitches don't know any other 80's citypop or J-pop or even J-Fusion (which is the true "missing link" to the sound of video games and anime), but 'Plastic Love' immediately prompts the "OMG I love citypop, A E S T H E T I C..."

>>8339976
because she's extraordinarily kawaii

>>8340203
>Basic bitches
Being an expert on out of fashion foreign pop music doesn't make you a hero.

>>8338805
>all shit

>>8339495
got his ass

>>8340258
Does the lack of bing bing wahoos frighten you, anon-kun?

>>8340275
no i think it's mostly the lack a good aesthetic and fun gameplay in PC games

>>8338751
Arcades and home consoles were both made for gaming; few people perceived PCs as anything but work utilities back then, and old PC games were even designed like spreadsheets.

>>8340339
This is also why MSX games for the most part didn't have horizontal scrolling: the MSX computers were only designed with vertical scrolling for vertical data processing displays, the idea of games needing to scroll horizontally never occured to the hardware designers.

OP is wrong on so many levels.
>best platformer game: Flashback (French)
>best fighting game: Karateka (american)
>best sidescrolling shooter game: Turrican 2 (german)
>best top down shooter game: robotron 2084 (american)
>best RPG: ultima 4 and 7 (american)
>best strategy: sid meier games (american)
>best driving game: Driver (british)
And so on.

Sure the Japanese made tons of good games, but they're not better than western games. They did know how to market their games though.

8340291
here's your (you)
now go play some half life or any online shooter and tell me if you had fun, or come back and lie about having the worst time of your life

>>8338751

Because the west lacks creativity... There are some good American game franchises... Mortal kombat, Doom etc.... But the west caters to niggers, wiggers, sheep / npc, and jews... So the west makes a bunch of generic sports titles, trendy titles... The gooks have better imagination / creativity... But a lot of modern Anna Mays can all look the same now too

Tldr... West more niggers and jews

Japs... Way less niggers and jews

>>8338791
Battletoads the best NES game ever made was by Brits. Nes is also the best console ever.

>>8340434
This post brought to you by the CIA Internet Shill Organization!

>>8340382
The thing is the west certainly did the early innovation, but then the Japanese made them more streamlined with mass appeal. I forgot how influential French comic book design was to Japanese artists.

>>8340434
You're a fucking idiot. Stop posting.

>>8340465
I hated how they streamlined the contra series. I find all of the sequels to the first game unplayable, too much cinematic setpieces for the wow factor that ended up diluting the core gameplay. However others seem to enjoy them. I think the japanese are indeed good at unerstanding mass appeal. I'm not one of the masses unfortunately.

>>8340392
>half-life
Opinion discarded

>>8340494
Contra was killed off by being given to a western studio.

>>8338751
You say that as if Japanese games aren't still superior. Westerners still can't make good games. They killed the game industry in the 80s with oversaturating the market with low quality trash and they're doing the exact same thing today. Meanwhile Japanese companies like Nintendo are still making some of the greatest games of all time.

>>8340640
I hated super contra, contra 3, hard corps, etc. I'm sure they were developed by japanese studios. I've not played any of the western developed ones.

Why are many people so fanatical to japanese games? They're entitled to their opinions, but I just find it weird. I've never come across someone who loves western games but doesn't also enjoy japanese games. The reverse is popular position on the other hand, apparently.

>>8340660
*is a popular position

>>8340660
Because non-Japanese games suck and they know quality when they see it.

>>8340670
>when they see it
So they don't play it?

>>8340680
It's an expression, retard.

>>8338815
literally all they do is copy Westerners and ancient mythologies LOL i can't count the number of times i've seen vikang lore in anime. Somehow Vinland Saga is the most subtle Eastern work when it comes to Norse mythology

>>8340687
How can you play games when you can't stop noncing to anime girls?

>>8340382
>>best fighting game: Karateka (american)
come the fuck on

>>8339150
sad cope

I mean, most of the consoles were japanese, makes sense that most of the developers would be japanese? In contrast nearly all the PC studios were western and there were plenty of quality PC games. And I'd say those PC games were more influential on the japanese console games than japanese console games were on PC games.

How come weeaboos are such faggots with awful taste? Berzerk is the best golden age arcade game and is western so suck it faggot

>>8340802
>golden age
who gives a fuck about those TI-88 tier games lmao
arcade games weren't good until '89
kys larper

>>8340786
Realistic fighting game designed by a martial artist using rotoscoped graphics and movement. Can't get better than that.

>>8340802
I'd say the best game of the golden age of arcade games would be a toss up between Battlezone (first 3D graphics and realistic simulation, so realistic it was used as a Bradley tank training sim), Pac Man (sophisticated AI), and Robotron (best control scheme that inspired modern games). Berzerk is a damn fun game but it didn't do a lot of innovative things.

>>8340382
Anon pls

>>8340798
>PC
You mean micros? Well yes, most of the blueprint for Japanese console games was set in stone by the Atari 8 bit, Apple II, and IBM PC. However as japanese games became popular, they started influencing western micro games too. Still there are tons of gems in the micro library that the japanese couldn't replicate. Also, japanese games tended to be formulaic while western games broke new grounds. Hence japanese games tended to have a bigger audience.

>>8340813
Playing games for high scores can actually be fun zoomer faggot.
>>8340886
I just said berzerk cause I find it the most fun to play I wasn't going by how innovative it was haha. I also really like pepper 2 that game is fun as hell also western.

>>8339150
>racers
What good racers came out in the west? Did any racers come out from the west before the mid 90s?
>adventures
Define what you mean by this. If it's 'action adventure' games (Zelda and similar) then people only remember the Japanese ones. If it's point and click, did they even make any?
>multiplayer games
the biggest multiplayer game during the early 90s was Street Fighter 2 and all its clones, the majority of (and all the good ones) were Japanese.

>The west
>USA
>The entire anglosphere
>Western Europe
>Recently even eastern Europe is considered western

"The west" needs hundreds of millions of people to compare itself to one island nation. Sad!

>>8341041
>What good racers came out in the west?
Micro Machines, Stunt Car Racer, Indianapolis 500, Test Drive, The NFS, there's something for everyone and they're all fun. The west excelled at top down arcade racers, a genre barely touched by the japanese.
>If it's 'action adventure' games (Zelda and similar) then people only remember the Japanese ones.
Times of Lore was inspired by Zelda, and improved upon it by adding more complex character interaction. The greatest of the genre would be The Seven Cities of Gold, Pirates, Wing Commander Privateer, and Elite. These are the grand adventure games that transformed the genre for good.
>If it's point and click, did they even make any?
Lucasarts games? Dark Seed? Neuromancer? I honestly can't even name one Japanese point and click game.
>the biggest multiplayer game during the early 90s was Street Fighter 2 and all its clones
The biggest, but not the best. The best would be Moonstone: A Hard Days Knight, a hardcore highly competitive four player action RPG that can be completed within an hour. It's very ahead of its time, its like they took Mario Party and turned it into a highly violent ARPG brawler. Of course it came out before Mario Party.

>>8339540
>>cartoony
>strong focus on realism
shitposter moving the goalposts again

>>8341195
To be fair there are tens of thousands of undocumented western games. Most western games in the retro era were released on computers and independently published. Console games got a lot more publicity, even though for each console game there were 100 computer games.

Japan was free from niggers and Jewish influence during that period, which allowed them full artistic freedom

>>8341246
And you could argue that the Japanese had computers too. But even for the highly popular NEC PC series, there are only a few thousand games made for it. For the MSX, there are around 3000-5000, and it's consisted of Japanese and non Japanese titles. But for the C64 alone, it's estimated to have over 10,000 software in Europe and US. Nobody's got time to collect all of those.

>>8340660
>I've never come across someone who loves western games but doesn't also enjoy japanese games.
If you love trash you will naturaly also love good games. That doesn't go the other way around, if you love good games you won't find an appeal in trash.

Now i'm saying that like i'm shitposting, but anyone who has a deeper knowledge about video games and their gameplaytechnical side OR just enjoys playing an actual game that doesn't prioritise storytelling, will find more appeal in japanese games than in western games.
Some names have been dropped already, but i don't see any western equivalents of a DMC, Tekken, God Hand, Tales or even non-action games like Resident Evil that could potentially rival them in their complexity. These games will naturally age well and incentivize people to do replays, NG+s and tons of other gimmicks they constantly upload YouTube Videos of even to this day.
Something like a Half-Life that is mostly praised to high heaven for it's elaborate narrative components is fun once and then dies after there since there is no heavy emphasis on the gameplay to warrant replays. And that's the problem with western games right there: they focus way too much on story than on gameplay. And that's extremely contraproductive in a medium that is all about interaction.

Lots of Japanese games from all sorts of era's aged really well. You can still play the first Resident Evil game on PSOne with no additional effort. You can still play Devil May Cry 3 that even today holds it's ground very well against modern games. You can still play Metal Gear Solid whose tricks and interesting gameplay interactions still would easily be extremely appealing to people today. And you can definitely still play older Tekken games since even the most modern Tekken game's system is based around Tekken 5.
Western games? Alot of their fucking PS3 era games aged terribly gameplaywise. That's why nobody wants ports of things like for instance Dead Space but rather a Remake.

>>8338751
It depends if you're talking about consoles or PC.

If you're talking about consoles, we're dealing with the NES, SNES, Sega Genesis, Sega Saturn, Playstation, and N64. (and to a lesser extent, the Sega Master System and the Turbografx/PC Engine/CD) It's to be expected that generally speaking Japan produced more and better games, these consoles were Japanese, after all. There existed great games produced by American studios, some of the Sonic games even had a lot of American involvement if not being developed by Americans outright, but generally speaking American studios producing games comparable in quality wasn't always going to be the norm in the same way.

If we're talking about PC, most of the great games were made by American studios. Of course, Europeans had the ZX Spectrum, Japan had the PC-98, but it's pretty unanimously recognized that generally the greatest PC games of the 80's and 90's were produced in the U.S. for IBM/DOS. (and in the "mid 90's," taken to mean 1994 - 1997, we were already dealing with Windows.)

>>8338754
There's nothing wrong with this art you dumb fuck

>>8338825
Wasn't GTA made by Scots?

>>8340203
>being a vaporwave elitist
can't think of something sadder

>>8340203
Where the fuck did you go so wrong in life that you're now a citypop elitist on 4chan

>>8341259
>anyone who has a deeper knowledge about video games and their gameplaytechnical side OR just enjoys playing an actual game that doesn't prioritise storytelling
Western retro games have much longer manuals and more complex gameplay, sometimes hardly decipherable even, than Japanese games.
>but i don't see any western equivalents of a DMC, Tekken, God Hand, Tales or even non-action games like Resident Evil that could potentially rival them in their complexity
Those are pretty casual games that require more reaction time than strategy though. Maybe except for RE, but RE's gameplay was wholly inspired by a more complex French game, Alone in the Dark. Also have you played the Star Wars Jedi games, Severance BoD, Die by the Sword, Rune, or any western game with an emphasis on combat?
>These games will naturally age well and incentivize people to do replays, NG+s and tons of other gimmicks they constantly upload YouTube Videos of even to this day.
Gotta say they're very streamlined and accessible yet still require skill to play. And they're on consoles. Makes sense more people played them.
>Half-Life
Very overrated among western games. Though I wouldn't say it had a poor gameplay, it's got some great AI design for challenging gun fights.
>Alot of their fucking PS3 era games aged terribly gameplaywise
Crysis, FEAR, Just Cause 2, Splinter Cell, The Warriors, Vampire Masquerade, there are tons of games that aged fine from that era, and those are just the more popular ones.

I think you're just biased against non Japanese games because you've hardly played any.

>>8341279
Which is a part of..?

>>8341562
not a part of seppoid education
GTA is yet more proof that Scotland is the greatest

>>8341513
>Western retro games have much longer manuals and more complex gameplay, sometimes hardly decipherable even, than Japanese games.
We don't talk about being a complete fucking mess here. Western games usually only have shittons of superfluous stats and numbers people are minmaxing in the post game. That hardly passes as being deep or complex.
>Those are pretty casual games that require more reaction time than strategy though.
You don't get anywhere with those games just by having reaction time. They have strong executions and the sequencing of combos alone force you to be tactical. I don't see how these are supposed to be casual games and yet in the same context you try to sell me Rune and Star Wars game. There are characters in Tekken literal pro's can't play because they are too difficult to use. I don't see how any game you mentioned here goes above that.
>Crysis, FEAR, Just Cause 2, Splinter Cell, The Warriors, Vampire Masquerade, there are tons of games that aged fine from that era, and those are just the more popular ones.
I just assume based on Just Cause 2 you mean the first game of those? You know there are countless discussions about their successors fixing problems that made going back to the originals really hard, right?
>I think you're just biased against non Japanese games because you've hardly played any.
I will admit the bias, otherwise i wouldn't be so adamant about it. But i have quite the mileage behind me with western games and there has been barely anything that wanted to stick longer than the credits (if i ever made it that far). Weird controls, boring gameplay, strong narrative focus, bloated open world maps, very boring premises and settings...
Every time i've been at one of those i just thought to myself something like "i could just grind Geese on Tekken ranked instead". And it's generally not a good sign if i think about other games while playing one. That's one of my main exclusion criteria

>>8340258
If you can't enjoy Doom, that means there's something wrong with you.

>>8341243
That's not moving the goalposts, it's staying on the subject of the argument of if Western devs focused more on realism than Japanese devs or not, as seen in this post >>8339421

Cartoony and unrealistic games were extremely common in the west at the time.

>>8341606
>complete fucking mess here
Sounds like you got filtered by CRPGs.
>Western games usually only have shittons of superfluous stats and numbers people are minmaxing in the post game.
And that's a puzzle people enjoy solving. Minmaxing a western RPG or strategy involves a lot more understanding of the mechanics, experimentations, and mix and matches than most Japanese RPG. Genres like immersive sim even encourage you to minmax and exploit the game. That's an adventure in itself. I'm not sure what you mean by deep and complex. You want complexity yet you dismiss high level of details as "complete fucking mess". Memorizing movesets, reciting combos, or FPS corridors is not a matter of complexity, it's a minmaxing thing on its own.
>They have strong executions and the sequencing of combos alone force you to be tactical
And how is that different from Blade of Darkness, which has combos too? In fact that game has full 3D movement, realistic mocapped choreography, and more precise hitboxes in addition.
>Star Wars game
Mastering Jedi Academy is more or less the same as mastering other competitive games. Trying to use everything to your leverage, memorizing player behaviors, reciting movement patterns, and so on. It's not even an RNG game like csgo.
>There are characters in Tekken literal pro's can't play because they are too difficult to use
Because of their short reach? Or because their combos take too many buttons? Sounds like artificial complexity to me, if its meant to be complex. Same old mechanics and rules, with minor tweaks to make it more high level.
>you mean the first game of those?
My favorite SC game is Chaos Theory, but SC1 is a great game too. Crysis and FEAR 1 are the best in the series.
>"i could just grind Geese on Tekken ranked instead".
Sounds like you have an esports addict mentality. I don't think people like you truly enjoy video games, but whatever floats your boat.

If you play on computers the jap stuff is just arcade ports that you can emulate directly on mame so there's no reason to bother, western computers had original games so there's a reason to emulate the Amiga or Dos.
>But muh Sharpx68000.
Its last model got mogged hard by the Pentium 1 just like it once mogged the Amiga.

>>8340258
shut up while the adults are talking, zoomer.

>>8341276
the original art is far better and more soulful, this art is just cringe that tries to turn it into an aesthetic when it already was one

>>8341606
>Jap games are so deep and complex, you have to push two whole buttons on the controller sometimes while your spike haired 17 year old half demon chosen one world savior fights a super badass fallen angel with 3 entire attack patterns that are entirely telegraphed, and then you got the most amazing anime style cutscenes of the character actually fighting and killing the boss since the gameplay itself is wholly separate from the narrative.
Everytime you keep trying to defend these games you just reveal more and more that what you want is the exact opposite of what you claim. you hate actual depth and complexity, you hate actually having to learn skills at games, and you hate having to think tactically. you want the game to be mindlessly simple, with no depth at all, so you can play an interactive movie and live out your DBZ power fantasies like a child. And anything past that you get frustrated with and call an overly complicated mess.

>>8341259
>>8341975
in fact you bringing up Resident Evil as an example of a complex, intricate, gameplay focused game is one of the most glaring and obvious examples of just how opposite your tastes are to what you're pretending.
RE is one of my favorite series ever, and I can tell you in complete honesty that the gameplay of it is fucking awful. You can't aim, you have no gameplay options, there are no deep and complex strategies to anything in the game, they're incredibly easy, both mechanically and in the AIs behavior, and they present no challenge to the player at any time.
The RE games are one of the most glaring examples of games that are entirely style over actual gameplay, enjoyment of them comes entirely from the setting, narrative, and atmosphere, which hides everything else.

>>8340660
An overwhelming majority of weebs are Europeans, who I guess are using it as a coping mechanism.

>>8340660
more like why are you refusing this hard to acknowledge that japanese games have always been better? do you realize being a weeb has literally nothing to do with enjoying good games?

>>8341259
Cringe post

>>8342016
t. never played an RE game before
I guess RE3 and it's dodge mechanic against a tough ass Nemesis never happened.
Or the hardcore mercenaries scene that is scorehunting ever since RE4.
Westo's really never look deeper than the surface

>>8341769
i'm just gonna go ahead and say yea these are all valid points. Don't want to blow the conversation out of proportion, i do see your points and further debating about them would be just bitching about personal preference.
>Sounds like you have an esports addict mentality. I don't think people like you truly enjoy video games, but whatever floats your boat.
Not how i would put it, but i love to do some crazy shit with skills i accumulated over years. Imo alot more satisfying than roaming around an empty open world map and do meaningless quests. Something even modern japanese games are guilty of.
>>8341975
I don't know how to answer to this, that's alot of accusation i have no idea how you concluded to.

>>8341259
> but anyone who has a deeper knowledge about video games and their gameplaytechnical side OR just enjoys playing an actual game that doesn't prioritise storytelling, will find more appeal in japanese games than in western games.
Most popular and influential western games
>GTA3
A groundbreaking open world, and technical masterpiece that most game devs had no idea was even possible. Almost entirely focused on gameplay and game design with short cinematics before each mission telling you what to do.
>Wolfenstein, Doom and Quake
The birth of and popularization of pure gameplay focused FPS games, both in a single and multiplayer arena format
>Counterstrike
Pure gameplay focused title, that popularized competitive team based tactical shooters
>Halo
Combined the above two games and delivered them to the console audience while popularizing pure gameplay focused online multiplayer to the widest audience
>Madden/Fifa/NBA Jam/NFL Blitz
Entirely gameplay focused titles, that were a staple of couch co-op or VS games for everyone
Most popular and influential Japanese video games
>Final Fantasy/Dragon Quest
Narrative focused pseudo visual novels, with slow paced menu based combat, and lengthy cutscenes.
>Metal Gear Solid
A glorified boss rush mode, interrupted occasionally by a 2D game of hide and seek. The 3D aspect of the game is not used at all in actual gameplay and literally half the gameplay time will be spent either in a cutscene, or watching two heads talk to each other.
>Resident Evil
Atmospheric and narrative driven puzzle/adventure games, where gameplay is intentionally poor as to better fit the story.
Hmmmm interesting.

>>8342076
The tough ass Nemesis that you have to fight a total of two times the entire game, dies in 10 seconds to freeze rounds, and gets stuck on terrain while repeating the same attacks in an exploitable loop? The dodge that doesn't work half the time, or actually hinders you at times because it's mapped to the fire button, and enemies that leap at you are almost impossible to consistently shoot out of the air like you could in previous titles?
You clearly haven't played these games since you're defending the game that removed some of the few skill based aspects it had.

>Jump n run
japan
>jump n shoot
japan
>fps
west
>3rd person
japan
>shmup
japan
>fighting
japan
>best em up
japan
>stealth
west
>survival
west
>action adventure
japan
>survival horror
japan
>adventure
west
>rpg
west
>sandbox
west
>open world
west
>mmorpg
west
>simulations
west
>sports
west
>manager
west
>tb strategy
west
>rts strategy
west
>moba
west
>racing
west
>board
west
>puzzle
west
>two player
japan
>multi player
west
>mods
west

weebs are just delusional

>>8342173
>sandbox and open world listed as different genres
>simulations and manager listed as different genres
>tb strategy, rts strategy and mobalisted as different genres
>board and puzzle as different genres
>two player and multiplayer
>mods as a genre

>>8342179
are you retarded or just shitposting?

I really can't think of a great Euro game besides Tetris. Other than that their games are just ok at best. And all know American games are dogshit catered to the lowest, brownest common denominator. Japan wins by default

>>8342179
>Hitman and GTA are the same style of game
>Euro Truck Simulator and SimCity are the same style of game
>XCOM, StarCraft, and League of Legends are all the same style of game
>Monopoly and Tetris are the same style of game
>doesn't even understand the difference between co-op and multiplayer
>has no idea how much mods can change a game, when moba one of the genres he lists, is literally a mod.
Why is it that EVERY single time some weeb makes a post trying to actually talk about games they reveal they have no experience with or knowledge about anything related to them?

>>8342196
>bro janky euro god simulator which needs 6 official patches and 8 fan patches to not shit the bed is better than any weeb game!

>>8342204
You listed RPG as one single genre despite JRPGs and CRPGs being more different to each other than many of your divisions, because it suited your argument

>>8342224
Ok. point and click adventure. text adventure. both west.

>>8342221
weeb can’t even reply to the correct anon

>>8342224
I didn't make that post. jrpgs are barely games anyway, and they all are just copies of wizardry with anime characters.

westoids will never understand

>>8342221
You wot

>>8338751
Thread theme:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Gj47G2e1Jc

>>8338791
*blocks your path*

>>8338954
>Japanese gaming industry is finished. All talented people are moving to China. Cope and seethe dumb weeb

The nanking massacre was a meme and the comfort women were prostitutes.

Lads, what are some western 3rd and 4th gen games that have the polish of, for example, Megaman X?

>>8340203
>which is the true "missing link" to the sound of video games and anime

Please explain more.

>>8342278
>holy fucking shit, I just knocked this generic npc into the air, then bounced him off the ground then my fucking epic trenchcoat wearing badass did this epic atatatatatatata move and then punched him into the wall just like Goku does! mom get the video camera so I can bring this to show and tell!
Like I've been saying all thread, completely style over substance gameplay, and totally disconnected from and unrequited for actual progression in the game. Generic pandering movie game schlock just like gone home or heavy rain, only for a different audience.
A game like Doom is so well crafted and made so intelligently that you can take it and use it in any type of scenario or setting, and have it work because the gameplay itself is so excellent. In fact, games like Chex Quest or Noah's Ark did exactly that.
Remove wannabe Vash the Stampede here with a generic guy in boxing gloves and not a single weeb would fall all over themselves to talk about what incredible high technical gameplay the series has, they'd play it for 20 minutes, get bored, and call it another generic beat em up.

>>8341276
You have no idea what he's even talking about, do you zoomer?

>>8342307
>Kobe Japan, 1965
>Young Mariya Takeuchi skips through a park while humming a tune, enjoying the cherry blossoms and the brisk air of late march
>A gang of Koreans appear out of nowhere and accost her
>Their leader pulls out a switchblade and demands her money
>She hands over 50 yen, it's all she has
>A tear rolls down Mariya's face
>'Kon'nichihuwa'
>They turn around
>It's a 14 year old White kid in a Japanese school uniform, blue eyes burning with rage and passion
>The young huwhite boy stands a full head taller than the zainichi delinquents
>They demand to know who he is in their guttural kimchi speak
>He responds in perfect Japanese
>'Ore huwa Jaredo. Jaredo Teirā... Omae huwa mou, shinderu.'

why are we fighting about this stupid ass shit

>>8342486
Because /v/ infected this board with its mindless autism-for-the-sake-of-being-autistic-fuck-you attitude

>>8342307
>discord tranny image

>>8342496
I'm not a tranny
You're a tranny
Go ahead
Call the janny

>>8342352
yes you dumbfuck! that's what makes vidya fun!
that's what i live for!
i will die the day they stop making games like this!
I don't care if it is needed or essential for progressing the game, as long as i have these options i am DANDY!

>>8342505
>>8342504
>>8342496
This is what I meant by the mindless autism-for-the-sake-of-being-autistic-fuck-you attitude btw. Consider a vasectomy, gents.

>>8342517
good morning sir i used a template and made your post more epic win (:

>>8342352
Fuck me, who knew somebody could be so insufferable over a 30-year-old game about a roided up marine blasting demons

>>8342494
What kind of homo listens to these?

>>8342653
my gf.
not him but i'm surprised how many of these i recognize despite never actively searching them myself on youtube

>>8342582
Not a single point I've made in this thread has been refuted. All I've received is /v/ shitposts about nothing, with no actual argument or reasoning.
You idiots just spout out the exact same tired bullshit, "muh gameplay, western movie games, blah blah" endlessly and then someone actually presents arguments to you, or examples of how what you're saying is blatantly false, you can't even form a way to refute it. You're a worthless shitposter, making blanket statements with no foundation, and who's only here to stir shit up for no reason about something you clearly don't know anything about.

>>8342681
>who's only here to stir shit up for no reason about something you clearly don't know anything about.
Aren't you doing the exact same thing right now? In fact I'd argue you instigated all of this with that opening statement.
I can't offer any arguments in God Hand's defense, I haven't played enough of it to really say much, other than I know the moveset customization is nuts.

I CAN argue that the gameplay of Chex Quest suffers slightly because it's too goddamn easy and the enemy roster is infinitely more limited compared to Doom's though. Also Noah's Ark 3D is an offshoot of Wolfenstein, not Doom.
Both of those games serve as a great "babby's first" entry though.

>>8342698
To add to this further, I wanna poke a hole in this argument here:

>A game like Doom is so well crafted and made so intelligently that you can take it and use it in any type of scenario or setting, and have it work because the gameplay itself is so excellent.

I would argue Doom wouldn't have been as massively influential as it is today if it didn't have the hell drenched aesthetics it has. Nowadays sure, we can all appreciate Doom in any flavor or context. But if it came out at launch with a family friendly tone or a bland aesthetic, it wouldn't have gotten its foot in the door the way it did, even with Id's pedigree.
In fact it probably would have backfired on them super hard going from Wolfenstein's violence to something more family friendly again. So while you argue if they replaced God Hand's protag with a generic boxing man and weebs would have snubbed it back in the day, people would have snubbed Doom if it didn't come out swinging with its hellish themes and over the top violence.

>>8342698
>Aren't you doing the exact same thing right now?
No, because I'm talking about games I've actually played, and making objective analysis between them, no matter what country they're from.
Japan destroys the west in fighting games, to an insane degree. Western fighting games are janky trash, with stiff boring gameplay made only to make things "cool." I already talked about Resident Evil, the classic RE games have dogshit gameplay, they're entirely aesthetic and immersion based, they don't hold up at all on actual gameplay. They're still some of my favorite games.
I'm sick of this idiotic narrative throughout this thread and of dumbasses who just mindlessly repeat it.
Japan is the country making movie games, they always have been. The entire goal of multiple people in the Japanese game industry was to make interactive movies..This is something multiple devs have stated. Japanese games are not about deep gameplay, they're not about complex mechanics, they're about streamlined and simplified gameplay and mechanics with large amounts of presentation, usually anime styled.
The retardation fest people on this website have with parroting generally acceptable viewpoints without actually thinking about them at all, isn't limited to jap games either. The same people who whine constantly about "muh gameplay" will then list mechanically horrible games like New Vegas, or Planescape. I'm sick of it, and most people who repeat this shit just make it apparent they've let their tastes and views be defined entirely by some strange need to fit in with the hive mind on a Chinese cartoon board. It's boring and exhausting to read, and degenerates all the threads here.

>>8342734
people would have snubbed Doom if it didn't come out swinging with its hellish themes and over the top violence.
No, not at all. This would apply perfectly to something like Mortal Kombat which plays like trash and had it's popularity defined entirely by its presentation and controversy.
Doom would have been lauded just the same and had the same impact, if it was about a wizard shooting magic at ghosts, because it was a technical marvel, with perfect gameplay.
The presentation helped reel in an older, audience, and helped it appeal to kids and teens desperate to be edgy, but it was the gameplay itself that got them to stick around. People weren't making daily updates on BBS and crashing entire server systems just because the game let you blow off a Pinky's head.

>>8342734
>people would have snubbed Doom if it didn't come out swinging with its hellish themes and over the top violence.
No, not at all. This would apply perfectly to something like Mortal Kombat which plays like trash and had it's popularity defined entirely by its presentation and controversy.
Doom would have been lauded just the same and had the same impact, if it was about a wizard shooting magic at ghosts, because it was a technical marvel, with perfect gameplay.
The presentation helped reel in an older, audience, and helped it appeal to kids and teens desperate to be edgy, but it was the gameplay itself that got them to stick around. People weren't making daily updates on BBS and crashing entire server systems just because the game let you blow off a Pinky's head.

>>8342768
Yeah but what I'm saying I don't think it would have left the same impact. Gameplay is extremely important, BUT. Gameplay alone isn't enough to draw in people by the droves like Doom did.
If it was a wizard shooting magic at ghosts, it would have become a niche title, a cult-classic. Even with deathmatch and its excellent single player gameplay.
I guess what I'm arguing for ultimately is aesthetics can definitely make or break a game's appeal for a lot of folks.

Also I've seen mechanically deep and mechanically satisfying games from both Japan and the US. I've also seen a lot of trash from both sides too. Sure there's a lot of idiots here saying stupid shit for the sake of getting a rise out of people, I just don't bother getting annoyed over those guys and I just play video games.

>>8338751
Western games didn't even have music so you don't get bored going through bits you already did. How lifeless would gradius be if it had no music.

>>8342698
Chex Quest to me is just a novelty, it's funny because it exists, because it's taking a violent and edgy action game full of blood and gore, made for adults, and sanitizing it for kids to push cereal.
On its own merits as a game, it's quite unremarkable, it lacks quite a lot of Doom's nuance in gameplay and level design. I think that Doom on its low skill levels is already so easy that it's friendly enough for noobs

Noah's Super 3D Ark is even more of a novelty to me, because it's straight up a reskin of Wolfenstein 3D, I'm pretty sure none of the mechanics are altered at all (hence goats 'kicking' you from long distances).

>>8342734
>I would argue Doom wouldn't have been as massively influential as it is today if it didn't have the hell drenched aesthetics it has.
You're basically right, a lot of what got Doom noticed was the shocking aesthetics and themes, but those themes are there to create a horror atmosphere (which occasionally works), and underneath it there's a fast and well crafted game which turned out to have basically endless potential once people got their hands on the tools an building blocks.
The themes in the games were pretty popular, there's strong influences from heavy metal music and its associated cover art, strong influences from horror movies, sci-fi movies, and action movies, as well as strong influences from roleplaying games like Dungeons & Dragons.

However, I think that even if Doom had been a lot more mundane and been really just about soldiers vs. soldiers in more grounded locales, it would have been a hit just because of the good design, the gameplay loop is just plain fun. Of course, all the heavy metal and horror stuff is part of the game's style, its personality, its 'flavor'. Take any of your favorite game, retain all the mechanics, but reduce all the visuals and sounds to distinguishable but impersonal colored shapes, the way the game plays may still be just the same, but it will not be close to as fun.

>>8342785
>Gameplay is extremely important, BUT. Gameplay alone isn't enough to draw in people by the droves like Doom did.
Absolutely, I'm not try to say it would have with public reception at large, but it had no effect on what the game actually is and how influential it was to video games as a whole.
I'm not trying to pretend gameplay ever was the #1 factor as far as popularity, I'm more pissed off about the fact that half the threads if not more are filled with people crying about how horrible games are when it comes to gameplay, whining about movie games, or whatever, and then turning around and praising games with shit gameplay, just so they can fit in with the hive mind here.

>>8342824
It sounds to me that you've let stupid people get under your skin. You gotta remember that some people here are either irreversibly stupid and/or are here to annoy you.
You're not doing yourself any favors letting them get to you.

>>8342334
Not him, but give bands like Casiopea, T-Square or Katsumi Horii Project a listen and it will be obvious how much of an inspiration that music was to creators of old games and anime.

>>8342834
Its not so much that I'm getting angry at them being idiots, more so that I'm just annoyed that you literally can't have a conversation about video games on this entire website anymore without half the thread being some retard from /v/ repeating the same bullshit.
Like this thread itself is a good concept for a thread, discussing the differences between Japanese and western development, but it's impossible to have any actual discussion about it. You're just gonna get people spouting off the exact same posts about movie games, pozzed games, Jews, whatever while always repeating the exact same games they've seen other people talk about like God Hand, and then when you point out why what they're talking about is stupid, you get nothing but hyperbolic nonsense replies like >>8339738
You literally cannot have an actual conversation on this website about video games, because a single board about them has molded half the people on it to these idiotic automatrons just repeating the exact same bullshit without any thought or reason or ability to back up what they say, because they have some insatiable need to fit in

>>8338751
because of plastic love

also
>In Japan during the 1980s, the economy was in a boom where buyers found themselves paying the highest prices for goods and commodities. As of March 1980, the unemployment rate in Japan was 4.9%; a very low number compared to the unemployment rate during the height of the 1990s

there was a big economy boom. it was great times, everyone was happy and feeling fine.

>>8342069
Why are you making a conclusion without any reasoning?

>>8338751
Western companies were constantly breaking down while Japanese were either copying Western games like Wizardry or rehashing existing genre's they were comfortable with.

>>8339124
>the west makes number generators
Disgaea and other RPGs
>and movies
Visual novels and again other RPGs

>>8339424
>>8338791
Most of the really bad Eurojank isn't British, it's continental Europeans especially Germans and Scandis who comprise the majority of demoscenefags. Britain can sometimes make a good game while Germany, Sweden, etc have nothing, just demos and forklift simulators.

>>8343160
I feel that to make good vidya you need to be a little bit wacky and anarchic. Brits are good at that, Japan is. Americans...sometimes we have a bit of a hard time with it and end up making dry dungeon crawlers or realistic war sims but we can make cartoony games like Day of the Tentacle when we're up to it. Germans and Scandis simply don't have the cultural equipment for that kind of thing, they're autistic social democrat collectivists.

If you said Japan was mediocre at PC games you would be right. Most of theirs are just menu simulators and games like Civilization or Diablo couldn't have come from there. They don't have it in them.

>>8341259
Interesting take since usually it's assumed that Japanese games excel at storytelling and art which I tend to agree. If you compare big games, Japanese ones (while they existed anyway - exactly the period discussed in this board) had deeper gameplay indeed, but they still pale in comparison to today's western indie games where's all the innovation is at.

>>8338751
Because back then the West despised video games, thinking they were dumb and pointless and dumbifying and only for children who are too poor to have an interest in culture or reading and too unhealthy to care for playing outside with the other kids. Japan had a less judgemental and conversative perspective on video games, for simple cultural reasons related to having lost the war and living in the shadow of the West's influence.

>>8343195
I think you forgot about the fact that Japan had their own PCs instead of IBM compatible where they had a lot of great games like us, metal gear, snatcher and a lot of cool shmups. And Japan also have RPG maker and doujin games like cave story and melty blood.

>>8343338
Far fewer than what the west made, and the quality is subpar in comparison too. You'll never see something like Elite and Starflight from Japanese computers.

>were

>2D platformers
Japanese consoles win
>Fighting games, beatemups, shmups
Best in arcades but I guess console ports were better than nothing
>RPGs
Both JRPGs and WRPGs were at their height during this era
>racers
Only Outrun was good until the late 90s
>FPS
Western PC wins by a mile

>>8343338
Most of those Japanese PC games played as janky as western console games. Or they were basically just text games with menus and pictures. Don't think anyone's denying that 80s/90s anime style was way better than the literal programmer art coming out of most non-AAA western studios.

Maybe a cultural thing? Seems like there were a lot more amateur artists in Japan per capita. Even small groups putting out MSX games seemed to be able to pick up a competent artist. Meanwhile small western teams were maybe able to get one piece of quality artwork for their box art using their publisher's connections (if even that) while ingame sprites were extremely basic.

>>8343338
>>8343351
Japan had a stronger computer presence in the 80s and early 90s than america did, easily

>>8343526
Over 10,000 C64 titles which is over 10x more than the number of MSX titles. Obviously both aren't restricted to just Japan or just the west and 99.999% of both libraries are trash, but still.

>>8343526
lies, lies, lies

>>8340382
>best platformer game: Flashback (French)
stopped reading here

>>8343530
>>Over 10,000 C64 titles which is over 10x more than the number of MSX titles.
>another appeal to numbers fag

>>8343532
Based

Do you think on 2chan they have threads saying ‘why were western games so much better than their Japanese counterparts during the 80s and early to mid 90s’?

>>8343530
>Over 10,000 C64 titles which is over 10x more than the number of MSX titles.
Have you pulled the numbers from your ass or something?
Besides it doesn't matter when all C64 games with some exceptions are rudimentary and not worth playing. Like Ys or Dragon quest

>>8343571
Only the hardest of hard-core westabos.

I wouldn't say that's the case, a chunk of japanese games around the time were SHIT but us funny westerners remember the good ones

>>8343581
10,000 is a very conservative estimation. Actually there are, so far, almost 30,000 registered titles for the C64. Anyone can check the database by themselves at the gamebase64 website.

Ys is a pretty good game (dragon quest isn't honestly) but there are tons more CRPGs on the C64, plenty of which are both more technologically advanced and more critically acclaimed.

>>8343673
As for the MSX, the highest number I could find of registered games is less than 6000, and it includes non japanese releases too. I found PC-88 rompacks containing over 2000 games. Neither comes remotely close to the C64's library's size, as far as we know.

>>8343627
Learned about Stargazers from HG101. Some real serious kusoge.

Falcom games suck ass.

>>8342653
People that let youtube's robots dictate their taste in gaming and music

>>8343975
Yeah, nobody actually liked this sort of music until YouTube, this lady didn't make multiple records or anything.

>>8338751
it's incredible, but some things really never change.

>>8344037
It kinda fit with the general zeitgeist of weird '80s Japanese aesthetic nostalgia that had been slow burning all decade thanks to Vaporwave and its influence

>>8343863
They were pretty good, as far as jarpigs go. They were relatively more creative and imaginative, and some of their games are actually fun to play. Nu falcoom sucks BBC though.

Europlatformers seemed to always consist of collectathons while navigating huge, poorly laid-out mazes they never figured out like the Japanese did to make a nice tight obstacle course.

>>8344047
Of course, but that music was still recorded a long time ago and was appreciated by many before YouTube, which just exposed it to many zoomers and millennials. There's always been people interested in Japanese music in the realm of weebery, that's why Visual Key got big with scene girls.

>>8338751
Because Nintendo and Sega weren't as western-friendly as Atari was. Western developers still dominated the home computer market.

>>8344086
Euroshooters all had terrible bullet sponge enemies and nonexistent level design, and all seemed to be inspired by R-Type in some way without understanding what made it work

I wonder why Americans seemed to have given up on shmups after the early 80s?

>>8342737
This, this thread is made by a obsessed weeaboo as a echo chamber. The game goes to /v/ itself.

>>8342483
Based

>>8345447
>game
*same

>>8344086
What's collectathon in this context? Games like Turrican don't make collecting items necessary for anything but your survival. Obstacle courses are overrated, contra has none of those bullshit and it's the best game in the series. Likewise Turrican 1 and 2. They added Japanese style obstacle courses in the third game, and its simply not as fun.

>>8345362
I don't know many high profile shmups, but Apidya was inspired by Gradius instead of R Type and has some nice level design. Tyrian 2000 has bullet sponge enemies, but for a good reason, it's a risk vs reward thing because the bullet sponge enemies are dangerous, easily avoided, but drop the biggest amount of cash. And lets not forget Raid on Bungeling Bay, a shmup with excellent level design and the first to employ objective based gameplay in a grounded realistic way, it sold a million copies in japanese famicom and went on to inspire a number of japanese and western games.

>>8342483
>>8345457


>They rush him, big mistake
>'Huwatatatatatatatatatatata - Huwata!'
>Taylor-san beats the living shit out of them
>He grabs their leader by the scruff of his neck and forces him to apologize and give Mariya her money back
>Jared grabs a cherry blossom and presents it to m'lady
>She's speechless
>Police show up and execute the Koreans on the spot
>Random salaryman sucks his teeth and says 'You aight, hakujin'
>Mariya whispers 'he kawaii'
>They become... Friends? Mariya knows deep inside that it's something more, but the young girl doesn't know exactly what she feels
>3 years pass
>It comes time for Jared to leave Japan for his ethnic homeland, the USA
>They embrace before he steps on a newly built 707, the pinnacle of huwhite American engineering
>'Sayōnara, jereddo-senpai'

>>8342881
Nobody is talking normaly to you because you seriously come in here and claim Star Wars games are gameplaytechnically superior to DMC3.

>>8338791
based

>>8345998
It's superior in many ways. The controls feel a lot smoother, tighter, and more natural. Kyle moves at a warp speed next to Dante and is able to perform a lot more stunts. Attack moves feel organic rather than combo focused. Saber duels can end in 5 minutes or 15 seconds, there's a ton of risk involved and finding an enemy's opening is incredibly satisfying. DMC games are fun, but those Jedi games are something else.

>>8345362
>Euroshooters all had
lies lies lies

>>8345998
First off, I've never played a star wars game in my life, because I've never cared about the series or seen any of the movies. Stop thinking everyone who doesn't agree with you is the same person.
Secondly any game that you can't complete by doing 3 basic attacks against every single enemy is a better game than DMC3, so if Star Wars falls into that catagory, yes it is.

>>8345946
This makes a great visual novel or Mario romhack

>>8343581
>all C64 games with some exceptions are rudimentary and not worth playing
yeah, the MSX didn't have any of those

>>8346802
kek

>>8346809
lmao

>>8338954
China's flag looks like the covid virus.

>>8346839
that's why they designed the virus like that anon

>>8342483
>>8345946
>huwa
Well done.

Im so tired of this same adhere.
I swear, these people only played popular games like SMW or Elder Scrolls and thinks this is the ultimate truth. If you played ANY game ever, you will realize all of that country wars isn't just retarded but also voids the REAL problem. The biggest problem should we facing is the industry itself.
Both change their serieses to appeal a mass.
Both never played their games.
Both never listen to their fans.
And a name of few, weebs and mutts say their country makes great games and should be spreaded when in reality, they are no different than a polished shit. It's a horseshoe theory.
It's why i like some games when /v/ and /vr/ hates besides fuck jewtubers.

>>8344419
>Visual Key

It's visual kei you gay bitch negro

>>8346957
who cares, imagine being weeb for gay music instead of anime and games

>>8346809
>I'm not sure if I'm going to be able to do that, but I'm not going to be able to do that

>>8346957
based

>>8345946
>>8346738
>>8346847
>Rock Falls Illinois, 1972
>17 year old exchange student Mariya Takeuchi has been enjoying her time in 87% huwhite America
>She's kept in touch with her senpai over the years and can't wait to see him again
>He was accepted into Yale and has almost finished his Philosophy degree
>Sitting in the park, she writes an early draft of her letter for the school's yearbook, remembering to leave out her thoughts on a certain 11% of the population
>The barely legal Japanese schoolgirl waits for Jared in the park, preoccupied with her writing
>'Mariya? Is that you'
>Of course it's her, the 1965 immigration act hadn't kicked in yet. She's the only Asian in the county
>She looks up from her notepad
>It's Jared , now 21 years of age, dressed in an immaculate huwhite suit
>'Hollo.'
>Mariya embraces her senpai as a feeling she hasn't felt in years rushes over her
>She feels something else, for the first time in her life...

>>8340696
>literally all they do is copy Westerners and ancient mythologies
And they do a better job with them which is just embarrassing.
There's not a single more kino medieval game than Capcom's King of Dragons. Miss me with that nerdy Elder Scroll gayass shit.

There's no other game as faithful to the feel of the Universal Monster Movies as the Classicvania games.
It's embarrassing to see how a bunch of Japs appreciate this stuff more than Americans themselves.

I also like how creative they were at times like for example being influenced by Parcelsus and his mythology for the Seiken Densetsu series.

>>8342653
the "playlist to study like kant awakening from the dogmatic slumber in which his philosophy was immersed" one is actually pretty enjoyable.

>>8342653
stand the fuck back !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TA9LVzuC7z4&t=2193s

>Ultima IV-VI came out in the early to mid 90s
>original Warcraft
>Doom
>Heretic/Hexen
>Secret of Evermore
>Sim City
>Wasteland
>shitloads of great point-and-click adventures from both Lucas and Sierra
>Elite
There were plenty of great western games coming out at the time.

>>8341932
>>8342409
You idiots are retarded. Mariya Takeuchi herself asked for this art to be made and agreed she liked it. You two retards mean nothing and no one cares if you like the original more.

>>8347038
>animeshit is better
Sounds like it's you who's got the tism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcVqfR4SMzg
this is peak of melodic sounds

>>8347821
Italian cinema funk was much better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrGvDeuOd18

>>8346919
>weebs and mutts say their country makes great games and should be spreaded when in reality, they are no different than a polished shit
This tb-h. Especially for japanese games.

>>8340016
he really wasn't. Every game that holds up or was innovative from those eras are strictly jap.

>>8338751
Deja vu I swear ive seen this thread a million times in the paat month

>>8348439
>Mariya Takeuchi herself asked for this art to be made and agreed she liked it.
Who the fuck cares?
>You two retards mean nothing and no one cares if you like the original more.
Seems like retards mean something if they get you to reply

>>8349563
Because you've only played jap games.

>>8346802
>>8346809
They tried so hard to make it look epic but it's still just balls touching

Japan wrote the game design book around that time. Started in arcades but when it came to consoles it was more noticeable desu, light years ahead of a lot of West devs who really had no idea how to make games fun.
In the 90s the West started catching up with them and at the same time the japanese started losing it.

The last big gamechanger to come out of Japan was Resident Evil 4. Was a Pac-Man level masterpiece, influential as fuck.

>tfw I actually bought this like a dork
Its real pretty tho I don't regret it

>>8349981
>buying music in 2021
>buying meme music

>>8349552
Post your country's best games.

>>8338751
imo there're cultural differences to play here.
Western media I consoomed so far (books, movies games and etc...) are either centered around real life or christianity.
Meanwhile for the japanese media its shinto heavy. far eastern religions have this dream like property to them that I feel like made the media like that.

As someone in a muslim country. Dreaming is more or less discouraged (or not even known?) , its not explicitly told to say the least. And I believe its due to that the middle east only produced written media and music

And not out of possibility that it might be neurological differences between races.

>>8350131
Based and truthpilled. Even something as simple as a video game is built off of millenia of culture, as expressed by its' creators.

>>8341259
That's the only right take in this entire godforsaken thread. West fans play games solely to consume, wasting massive time with arbitrary achievements such as the aforementioned minmaxing stats that don't serve any purpose in the long run. Anything else that goes even remotely in the action direction is always leagues inferior to Devil May Cry or outright a bad fucking copy of it.
Japanese games on the other hand KNOW you want to stay longer than the staff roll and usually give you lots of good re-run options to spice up the game further. Achievements in those games usually serve the purpose of opening up possibilities, having one or two abilities more is not too seldom a massive game changer.
But westies will never understand that. They don't replay games, they don't spend time getting good in technical systems. They just want to consume and jump to the next 200h+ inflated open world rpg. That's why bonus modes, new game + options and special late-game items are really rare in western games. And the pacing of the main game is hence boring and slow, they are not designed to be enjoyed for a second time.

Anyway, pic for attention. I like Die Hard and it's not like there have been REALLY GOOD western games either, but they are all honestly from back during the PSOne era where devs were more focused on being fun and unique. Today it's those cocksucking little faggot's fault for where we are now with gaming. And it's not even the fact that they introduced DLC and Lootboxes into the market or that they are "pozzed" or some shit like that. It's moreover how games like Skyrim shifted the tonality of the scene to
>your game needs to be a massively inflated open world clusterfuck with 500+ hours playtime or you are trash
Many great ideas from the 7th gen died because of those fuckers, zoomer think games like Witcher 3 are good and not even japanese devs have soul left anymore.

>>8349987
>the 23 year old streamer
>just streams everything and never buys anything
>plays everything on PS Now
>just streams anything that isn't on PS Now
>music only exists for him as background music
>never listens to an album more than once
>anything not on Netflix might as well not exist
>happy to have all his money go to the big studios and military complex that Daniel Ek funds

>>8349978
>last
demon's souls

>>8350307
>West fans play games solely to consume, wasting massive time with arbitrary achievements such as the aforementioned minmaxing stats that don't serve any purpose in the long run

I didn't know Pokemon was Western.

>>8350307
>same generic post talking about "muh technical skills" always repeating the same 3 games, all of which are single player only, while every single skill focused multiplayer game that people grind for hours every day on is western made, and every actual complex and intricate single player game system is in western games.
Literally an automatron repeating programmed phrases.

>>8350352
>I didn't know [one exception to the rule] was wes-
yes. But Pokemon isn't designed around that. The gameplay is barebones turn base interaction so even the little Billy who turned 6 yesterday can play it with no effort.
Anyone who minmaxes in a Pokemon game absolutely lost control of his pathetic life

>>8349978
Americans were fine in the early 80s, I agree after the video game crash we kind of lost our ability to design a good action game (just adventures and CRPGs).

>>8350369
>every single skill focused multiplayer game that people grind for hours every day on is western made
Yep, check out all these western fighting games mate.
Also who the fuck cares about multiplayer.

>>8350369
aren't you the same guy who complains about people just shitposting as a reply?
I'm not saying every single western game is bad, there are really great ideas and settings they made strongly use of in the 90's. But that's where the good concepts are stuck now: in the 90's.
The west is pretty dominant with multiplayer games, i agree there. But that has nothing to do with quality and rather with how many are sucking that game's tity's rn. Otherwise Fortnite is by far the best and most technical multiplayer game there is out there.
Or LoL, i don't know the exact numbers. But anyone i know who is strongly addicted to League doesn't like that game and is completely stuck in a stockholm syndrom. They tell me on a regular basis that i should never ever start the game

>>8338825
All boring as shit.

>>8338751
>>8338763
besides shooters, they still are better than the west.

>>8350443
Yes, because you're literally shitposting vomiting out factually incorrect and illogical statements you can't even make an argument for just like you have the entire thread.
Japan has not had a game that did anything innovative or revolutionary since 1996. They have refined genres or game styles that others have made, usually by simplifying them.
They have fighting games and nothing else. They have no Counterstrike, no StarCraft, no DOTA, no BRs, no Quake, no sports games whether sim or arcade style. They have absolutely nothing outside of fighting games that requires and technical or mechanical skill. They have single player games focused on flash with absolutely no in depth mechanics, that appease the people who play them because it makes the main character look cool.

>>8340660
>I've never come across someone who loves western games but doesn't also enjoy japanese games.
Huh? I know many people like that nowadays.
Not in the /vr/ space because Japan dominated the 80s and 90s in terms of popular games, but nowadays the type of person who snubs anything Japanese made and only plays western games is common, ive socialized with many of them.

>>8341975
>so you can play an interactive movie and live out your DBZ power fantasies like a child
Unironically yes. I want to play something stimulating and fun with just a touch of complexity and a bit of challenge.
The last thing I want to do is make spreadsheets or look up minmax guides for some autistically complex and unfair game just to pretend Im smart.

Dunning Krugger in full effect in this thread:
>check out how many copies Goldeneye and Perfect Dark, Call of Duty, Apex Legend and Valorant sold in Japan, you'll be surprised
>Japan is good at maintaining a dehard loyal niche that can be served by small staff and production costs
>for this reason they have focused so much on mobile and retired from Triple A market as well as difficult get into genres like visual novel
Japan is a sakura blossom, it's extremely precious, shortly and intensely lived, old fashioned and it's permanently dying.
America is mass produced canned dog food.

Dunning Krugger in full effect in this thread:
>check out how many copies Goldeneye and Perfect Dark, Call of Duty, Apex Legend and Valorant sold in Japan, you'll be surprised
>Japan is good at maintaining a dehard loyal niche that can be served by small staff and production costs
>for this reason they have focused so much on mobile as well as difficult get into genres like visual novel, fighters and retired from Triple A market
Japan is a sakura blossom, it's extremely precious, shortly and intensely lived, old fashioned and it's permanently dying.
America is mass produced dime-a-dozen canned dog food.

There's no point in talking niche titles with 4chan as they only play mainstream basic bitch titles like Fortnite or Mario 3 for the millionth time.
If you're really interested in niche stuff go read PC Engine and Sega Saturn Fan magazines on archive.org, you can read them instantly on your browser.
Much like youth, Otaku culture will eventually fade. Rather than feeling bad we should be grateful for being given the rare opportunity of partaking in such fleeting beauty.
Meanwhile American ugliness will linger around forever polluting the environment like plastic at the bottom of the ocean.

>>8350956
>check out how many copies of free to play games have been sold
>Japan the home of mass produced gacha shit, waifu dating VNs, and kill evil god demon jrpg #3857589 is not dime a dozen generic dogfood
>>8351012
you will never be Japanese and your family is ashamed they gave birth to you

>>8351035
Jokes aside, look at Japanese Goldeneye, Call of Duty sales, Halo even had its own promotional anime over there. Diablo was super popular and the origin of the wwwww meme.
My point is that reality is much more blurred, seeing things as a competition with a clear winner and loser is a human cognitive error. And if it were a competition the west still loses anyway because everything that Americans put out is safe mass productions for everybody.

>>8351046
Such safe generic bland games like GTA, Deus Ex, Planescape, Doom, Portal, Myst.
Truly the barriers Japan breaks with such risky titles as Mario, Zelda, Final Fantasy, and Dragon Quest will never be reached

>>8351035
>Free-to-play
Meant in-game purchases of course. Apex and Valorant are massive hits.

>>8351057
I'm not gonna argue opinions anon. The depth of your argument is "game you like is not so good" and that's exactly my point whne Japanese media is difficult to get into in the first place, but if you're into that sort of niche they are very good at keeping you served. This is also where Koreans fail by trying to cater to western tastes when there's already too much western stuff getting made in the first place.

>>8351057
I'm not gonna argue opinions anon. The depth of your argument is "game you like is not so good" and that's exactly my point how Japanese media is difficult to get into, but if you're into that sort of niche they are very good at keeping you served. This is also where Koreans fail by trying to cater to western tastes when there's already too much western stuff getting made in the first place.

>>8342852
You mean all the music on YouTube that has over a million views from mainly zoomers?

>>8351067
>make stupid claim with no basis in fact
>get called out
>man I'm not gonna argue tastes man that's just your opinion man
You're a literal child. Shut the fuck up with your shit uninformed takes you waste everyone's time on.

>>8351074
Americans going "imagine paying full price for this objectively worse trash" is exactly my point, it's not for everybody and it's not intended for you. I can't help but feel honored for being part of an exclusive group that's currently in the process of disappearing and will be dearly missed. When Westoid mass production will be gone too no one will notice your absence. So enjoy the short moment while it lasts.

>>8350349
The most influential game of the 2010s, by far. After the awful Western dominated 2000s, it introduced an entire new generation to real video games.

>>8351101
Put it this way, the day Sega, Hudson, Treasure, Konami and Capcom CPS studios closed doors was a tragic, irreplaceable loss. If every Activision studio closed down who the fuck cares, really. Who even gives a shit. Just wait it out a year and a younger dev team will come up with the same product.

>>8351131
>>8351131
The most influential games of the 2010s was PUBG and Fortnite.
Dark Souls is a generic action adventure with RPG elements game with sparse save points, that did nothing to the industry.

>>8351148
I'm talking about actual games, though, not asset flips like pubg.

>>8351167
Games with asset flips aren't games? How? All soulsborne games are asset flips from demon souls and gameplay rehashing from DS1.

>>8351167
The game using PS3 assets to make a generic ARPG isn't an asset flip and is a real game, but PUBG which popularized an entire genre is a fake game.

>>8347035
Any more? This is pasta actually worth reading.

>>8351181
X game bad Y game good
Opinions are not facts and you need to ramp up your trolling.

>>8351185
I accept your concession. Now stay on topic and talk about retro games, which Japan also sucks at past the 16-bit era.

>>8351192
Even looking at objective metrics like critic reception or popularity isn't a good basis for judgement either since inane garbage like gone home or flappy bird get good reception sometimes, We should just agree to disagree and move on to a more productive discussion.

>>8351192
Didn't they suck in the 16-bit era as well? All they were making were a copious amount of fighting and shmup games while the west kept coming up with new genres and improved mechanics.

>>8351196
Anon what'd I just said about facts and opinions.

>>8351201
>fags and onions
Yes you are.

>>8351194
Western games being more complex isn't an opinion
Western games being more skillful isn't an opinion
Western games taking more risks isn't an opinion
Western games being more influential isn't an opinion
Stop posting inane bullshit with no factual basis and I will stop mocking you for doing so.

>>8351057
The fact that you listed Myst is fucking laughable

>>8351208
Anon some people say jeri ryan is the most attractive star trek crew member and others think patrick stewart is. These two will never look eye to eye no matter how much we brick about it so let's just agree to disagree. Some people think that chunsoft novels are proper games since they have a loss condition and warioland 2 doesn't.

>>8351221
Weren't Myst and Zork bigger surprise successes in Japan than in the west. That's the perk of having unique domestic markets rather than the same homogenized western catering mass they've become.

>>8351181
Really Dark Souls, moreso than Demons Souls, was (and is) hugely influential. The amount of indie games aping or taking influence from it is insane. Basically the Symphony of the Night of the 2010s.
Meanwhile, Fortnite is a fad, and the battle royale market is just winner takes all in terms of success.

>>8351221
Myst was the highest selling PC game of all time, and along with SoMI inspired an entire genre of narrative driven adventure games that were commonplace on the platform.
I'm sorry it didn't have enough screeching cartoon women flashing their panties at you to be a "real game" like a VN

>>8351245
I absolutely love using the existence of a loss condition as a definition for a videogame. Most of these non-interactive sound novels have a question ark and an answer ark, theoretically you're supposed to put information together and solve the case, if you guess wrong you've lost. Most VNs have unwinnable states where you're sutck on a screen until loading a previous save or consolation bad endings where you end up with a bad girl, meaning they are more proper videogames than Warioland 2 and Pokemon.

>>8351253
>most VNs have consolation bad endings where you end up without a girl
QuickFix,

>>8351241
>Generic ARPG that did nothing to change game design, game presentation, or the industry as a whole is massively influential
>Game that established an entire genre, established the idea of a full f2p with continuous new content support entirely funded by cosmetic purchases, inspired every single game to add a BR ripoff mode, and launched an entire storefront is a fad
I sometimes wonder how people can be so utterly retarded, and then I remember I'm literally talking to fucking teenagers who are only here because they played a couple SNES games.

>>8351265
Moreover if we're gonna be talking about modern games there's nothing to discuss since Japan doesn't make console games anymore, they have entirely focused on smartphones.

>>8351265
>established the idea of a full f2p with continuous new content support entirely funded by cosmetic purchases
Ever heard of a game called League of Legends?
Dark Souls inspires creators, Fortnite is a fad. You'd be telling me 10-15 years ago about how influential Kinect or Angry Birds was. Meanwhile, in reality no one cares about them anymore, no matter how many hundreds of millions of dollars they generated. That is literally what a fad is. Now please return to your very much non-retro normie shooters for kids and stop shitting up this board.

>>8351280
Dark Souls as much of a dead fad too.

This discussion is really gay because you're comparing a parry and circle strafe game to a walk around the map for 15 minutes looking for guns shooter. Comparing apples and oranges and honestly both are overrated turds.

>>8350012
>country's best game
fuck off nigger

>>8351245
I don’t give a shit how many copies it sold, that doesn’t make it anything more than a bland adventure game with pretty graphics.

>>8351280
LoL does not have continuous map updates, an entire custom user creation gameplay mode featuring games as simple as tag, to full on gameplay redesign making it a 3D shump, monthly crossover playlists spanning from a KotH variation mode with Thanos to literal live fucking musical concerts, and all while supporting the original BR mode.
Dark Souls inspired exactly jack and shit to the point the only people who make any games like it are From themselves.
You are at best delusional and at worst legitimately mentally retarded.

>>8351309
PUBG is a washed out has-been fad where you walk around an empty map for 20 minutes and die to a 2 minute gunfight and even the thing that replaced it, Fortnite, is now a washed out fad as well. The cool gen Z kids have moved on into Valorant.

>>8351303
I don't give a shit how many copies Super Mario Brothers sold, or how many games were influenced by it. It's still just a bland platformer with colorful graphics.

>>8351329
We've gone off the rails and the reason for that is because Japan doesn't make console games anymore. Platinum is dead and Nintendo is a Californian company. Japs have focused on low effort gacha for smartphones.

>>8351326
>>8351326
Fortnite and PUGB have over double Valorants average daily players.

>>8351331
>Platinum is dead and Nintendo is a Californian company
What a laughable self-entitlement lmao you delusional. Console's are pretty much a thing and it's why dogshit like Neptunia is still banging.

>>8351336
What's really good is Apex Legends. You should play that.

>>8351309
This is pure delusion. Same exact business model as LoL. There's more content because there's more money behind it.

>>8351329
yes, it's just a repetitive atari tier game

>>8351339
Banging in what year, 2011? Japs be playing PriCone and Uma Musume

To be fair Uma Musume is a much better game than Dark Souls and PUBG combined.

>>8351184
>They spend the day together, catching up and reminiscing
>They look out over the Mississippi river as the sun sets
>Mariya asks if she can stay the night in his hotel
>Jared hesitates for a moment, thinking something over
>'Of course'
>They go to Jared's hotel, he locks the door and hangs up his coat, revealing a chiseled body, built from years of lifting huweights
>Mariya bites her lip and begins to slide her turtleneck off
>'Senpai... Do you want to go to bed?'
>Jared pauses again
>'Is something wrong, senpai?'
>'Yes, something is very huwrong... But tonight it doesn't matter'
>He deflowers Mariya as a bald eagle named 'City Pop' flies overhead
>They make love all night
>The sun crests over the horizon as the two lay together
>Jared turns towards Mariya, knowing exactly what she is going to say
>Mariya breaks down
>'I love you! Please senpai, I want you to come back to Japan and marry me! I don't care what anyone thinks!'
>Jared mulls it over, trying to weigh his love with the knowledge that miscegenation will destroy both of their bloodlines
>'Mariya-chan... I... No, we can't'
>Mariya breaks down
>'WHY!?'
>He looks her square in the eye
>Jared sheds a single tear, he knows that he has a duty to his race and that he must sacrifice true love in the process
>'For East is East and Huwest is Huwest, and never the twain shall meet' says Jared, as he sheds a single tear

Fin

>>8351347
get a load of this nigger
https://www.gematsu.com/2021/11/compile-heart-launches-neptunia-sisters-new-title-teaser-website

>>8351339
Nintendo of America currently situated in California is the company big shots behind every decision. The Japan branch is just repetitive code monkey work. I adore how Japan collectively decided video-games is for manchildren and moved on while americans desperately try to convince themselves they are totally mature for saying the word fuck a lot and showing on-screen violence. Nothing ironic or compensating about that.

>>8351357
Still a better game than PUBG.

>>8351361
>Nintendo of America currently situated in California is the company big shots behind every decision.
Post evidence or hell fuck you.

>>8351375
Look it up. Your favorite game is made by commie trannies.

>>8351361
see in the old days Yamauchi never let NOA take any power like that because he was an old fashioned xenophobic nationalist who wouldn't let the gaijin have any say in anything. now he's gone so they gladly bowed the knee to NOA.

>>8351381
So you refuse. Making bullshit to make Nintendo worse than what they are.
My favorite game is Mega Man 8 btw

>>8351389
To be frank anyone with a real interest in Japanese media already looked up official magazines on archive.org, used the atwiki or if everything else failed looked the games up on youtube and nicodouga. The only point to these threads is really trying to annoy internet strangers. Who gives a shit what 4chan has to say. Thank God for the Chinese chad for scanning these mags.

>>8339017
America (blue states) are trying as hard as possible to be like your shithole, and proudly. Bin that knife.

>>8351403
And clap for the NHS death panels.

>>8351381
That's Sony and their ethics department.

>>8351361
real schizo hours, tell us more about your headcanon

>>8351417

>>8351398
>Who gives a shit what 4chan has to say
Also Twitter and Reddit.

Sure is strange how every thread about Japanese games will eventually degrade into the people who like them whining about jews, trannies, sjws and whatever schizo theory they've created this week.

>>8351505
Going back at the whole Japan is precious because it's dying thing, the nature of their single party parliament has a curbing effect on radical extremism. Sure they have nationalists and trannies but Japanese media in general as a much more relaxed stance on controversial politics which is refreshing.

>>8351517
You laugh but american media embarrassing themselves over the kyle rittenhouse thing is the type of thing that wouldn't fly in Japan. Am I saying Japanese culture is superior? Actually yes, absolutely, but when you're up against American media that's not a hard thing to achieve.

>>8351296
That's right, faggot. You think American games are shit and Japanese games are shit, what country are you from and what games from said country are you proud of?

>>8351628
Unironically Russia has the best good game ratio

>>8351635
That's what I was thinking too.

Aren't like 99% of Japanese games just time sinking autism fuel? Not too familiar with the genre but I swear most their games have a stupid amount of grind involved.

why do people conflate being influential with being good?

>>8352427
Because the faggot who makes these threads is a patriotic nigger who tries so hard to idolize his country by propaganize everyone on the internet that their games is good and should be spreaded like no tomorrow.

>>8351628
Here's some fun fact: everyone can make good games, even a pajeet can make a fun game than you ever do. AAA genre is filled with Americans and Japanese but that dosen't mean they automatically make good games, sure they can make one, but sometimes dosen't. Everyone isn't perfect and with the slip in you're toes you are going down. It's why Indie genre's are increasing even to this day.

>>8342173
This is reasonable

This is only the case for non-/vr/ games. Personally I think the 7th gen's push for massive budgets killed off both the smaller devs and the general interest in lower budget games among westerners. Shit like Timesplitters doesn't exist anymore, but smaller Japanese games continued to be developed on other platforms like handheld or mobile.

>>8350307
>That's why bonus modes, new game + options and special late-game items are really rare in western games. And the pacing of the main game is hence boring and slow, they are not designed to be enjoyed for a second time.
I never really fully grasped why i myself prefer japanese games more, but i think that pretty much nails it. Many modern games from both realms are also guilty of this, but especially with western games it always feels like they never consider someone new-game-plusing the game or offer bonus stuff to change up the game feeling a bit. Meanwhile every Resident Evil game rewards me with special weapons and other shit by solving certain conditions and the pacing of the games don't make second or third runs a chore.
I wish games like Team Buddies would have considered that too. They have some cool shit for couch-coop sessions but if you want to replay the main campaign again there is no additional incentive outside of having fun with the same thing again. Switching weapons set between the worlds alone would have been enough to make it 17 times more fun.

Japanese games were toys, western games just adaptations from table board games.

>>8342483
>>8345946
>>8347035
>>8351356
Beautiful