/vr/ - Retro Games

Because X & Y are coordinates in CAD.

>>8315814
the better question is why did they arrange the buttons in a way that makes Y and B the main ones

>>8315843
only if you're western fag

>>8315843
Miyamoto:
But we really worried about the arrangement of the A, B, X and Y Buttons. We couldn’t figure out whether to put the B Button diagonally above or below the A Button.

Sao:
And after some thought, you decided on below.

Miyamoto:
Yes. We decided on that placement to unify it with Game Boy, but that made it impossible for Mario to do a B Dash! (laughs)

Sao:
That’s why it’s a Y Dash in Super Mario World!

Miyamoto:
Yeah! (laughs) And we tried to divide the buttons into groups. We assigned priority, so the primary buttons are A and B, with X and Y as secondary. That’s why we decided to call them X and Y instead of C and D.

>>8315814
Grouping. A/B is a common formatting of "options" but four A/B/C/D options wasn't best suited for the circular layout, so they went for two separate groups: the rationale for X/Y instead of Y/Z was probably to leverage the also common model of graph directions, as pointed out in >>8315828

The standalone PS (△ ○ × □) is more accessible in my opinion though, as it comes free of positional preconceptions and it's easier for the player to build up muscle memory around.

>>8315850
the fuck are you talking about

>>8315851
yeah, I sort of guessed that they wanted to keep consistency with the Gameboy. But the Gameboy was their first mistake already, it makes it needlessly not trivial to press both at the same time or in quick succession, the only true consistency that was worth mantaining was having B on the left and A on the right, just move all the buttons on a SNES controller 90° clockwise and it's the best deal

>>8315814
why isnt it X/Y A/B, that always bugged me

>>8315814
Because they were johnny come lately who just copied what others had done before.

>>8315924
What? Super Famicom was the first console with 4 main buttons.

Because the SNES was released in 1990.
Nintendo wouldn't become known for C&Ds for a few more years.

>>8315861
Japanese have a kinda jewish ancestry on reading things from right to left unlike in western culture where it's the opposite.

>>8315949

Because SEGA does what NINTENDON'T

>>8315949
japs read horizontal text left-to-right same as we do. They only go right-to-left with vertical text.

>>8316484
This controller is awesome.

>>8316518
Three button is ergonomically better (unless your hands are too small).

>>8316561
I love the goldstar 3DO controller.
I don't like the 3DO though.....

>>8316561
But it sucks.

>>8316607
ˢᵐᵒˡ ʰᵃnᵈˢ

>>8315851
Then they realized their mistake and went back on it with the N64.

They're out of line with the A and B buttons.

>>8316491
Sometimes they do write horizontal text right to left, but I think it's a very old school practice these days and only used for style. I would guess computers helped standardize horizontal text as being read left to right over there, but I don't really know.

>>8315814
Better question: A is followed by B and Y is followed by Z, so what's with the X?

>>8317021
>A, B
>X, Y
Retard

>>8315851
And then Kirby Superstar Ultra went full retard and made the Y button actions of the original into B button ones on the DS.

>>8315814
They're the most commonly used variables in elementary-level math and science.

>>8315843
Because Japanese children have short thumbs.

>>8315859
I'm guessing he's an Asian guy with 1" thumbs.

>>8315859
>B on the left
That's one thing that always weirded me out, but maybe it's because I'm left-handed.

>>8315938
ahem

>>8317194
Super Famicom was the first with 4 buttons on a cross arrangement, retard.

>>8316484
Sucks for mario style plattformers and megaman

>>8317248
>be wrong
>cope
tale as old as zoom

>>8317058
>>8317058
What's retarded is that they used the first two letters of the alphabet then did the third and second to last. Layout should have been
>A,B
>Y,Z

>>8315814
A B C D is a set of 4
A B X Y is 2 sets of 2
Easier to compartmentalize the controls that way. The SNES controller emphasized that with the different button shapes.

>>8317479
What's retarded is you don't understand why

>>8317445
Where am I wrong?

>>8318696
>Where am I wrong?
>>8315938
>Super Famicom was the first console with 4 main buttons.

>>8315854
eventually any system creates positional preconceptions. This is the opposite situation (function vs. position) but just try to play any japanese playstation games after years of american games. the X/O switch will drive you insane for quite some time.

>>8317479
They were probably already thinking of possible future controllers with C and Z buttons.

>>8316727
left to right got standardized in the early 20th century due to industrialization and adopting more westernized practices. And then accelerated by american occupation post-WW2

The prototype layout makes way more sense

>>8315843
they didn't? even sony followed this paradigm:
circle = yes
cross = no
sqaure = menu
triangle = viewpoint
some moron in the west thought 'no' meant yes on the playstation which is why you have that notion now (but no was triangle then, before changing no to yes)

>>8315851
It's kinda ridiculous how you can dash with both Y and A in SMW actually

for the longest time I had no idea "Y" was supposed to be the default secondary button on SNES. I always just used A and B.

>>8315851
Sauce?

>>8315939
Based.

>>8319157
The problem is you would need to press X to spin jump, which isn't the end of the world in practice, but I think they imagined the spin jump getting much more use than it ultimately did.

>>8319138
So this counterarguments what >>8315851
said

>>8319138
>>8315859
dog bless
use X and Y if you want, but the A and B position is much better here

>>8319151
>some moron in the west thought 'no' meant yes on the playstation which is why you have that notion now
Any source you know confirming this? I thought this was due to the SNES' popular layout of Y and B being the main buttons, so Sony in America wanted to keep that layout for "player familiarity."

>>8315939
Underrated post.

>>8315939
Damn, you got me with that one anon.

>>8318928
The actually fucked up thing is that some newer Japanese games tend to default to your console's regional button placement. For example I expected circle to be confirm in my Japanese PS4 copy of Fatal Frame 5, but it's fucking X, because I'm playing on an EU console. This is what drives me crazy.
And now Sony forces X as confirm on PS5 even in Japan. They doubled down on the retardation from back in the 90s when they changed the controls from the default Japanese setting in the West.
Honestly at this point they should just let people choose in the console settings. They did that for Asian PS4s at some point, so why not do this for everyone if games can easily recognize this?

To always remind you of your chromosomes.

>>8319138
This, this thing... Is ..Perverse..Stop it..

>>8318696
Can you count?

I assume ABXY just came from the most commonly used symbols for constants/variables in algebra

>>8320705
It honestly makes more sense given how B/Y (on an actual snes controller) are the natural main position to rest your thumb and the majority of games use those as primary inputs rather than A/B. Just like how nintendo put A/B in that same position next gen on the n64.

>>8320670
Holy shit, never knew we had a L and R chromossomes…

why not use numbers like the master system? seems like a much more obvious choice. and sony's symbols are even more retarded than letters

>>8315814
Why are Nintendo buttons not arranged in any kind of logical order?

>>8322559
cringe

>>8319534
the original japanese layout reasoning is well known (even Wikipedia mentions) and the Japanese layout matches the SNES one. The change is bizarre with the top button being cancel originally.

>>8322869
>Why are I zoom?

>>8315814
X & Y feel like counterparts to A & B. I don't know, it feels more comfortable than C & D.

>>8322869
Gamecube layout was most logical of all

>>8315814
They represent axis'

everybody talking about forms, lines, intelligent design and muscle memory meanwhile my fave controller is just
>big green button = yes
>small red button = no

>>8324781
Same logic

>>8324637
No, face buttons are fucked

>>8317381
Why

>>8315814
https://retrovania-vgjunk.blogspot.com/2017/08/3rd-party-snes-controllers.html

>>8325772
>>8315814
What might have been.

>>8316561
then play with your finger tips instead od your thumbs. like an arcade cabnet (the place they got the 6 button layout from)

>>8325986
Looks like a bag of M&M's. Kinda wanna bite it.

>>8325986
Maybe this is what you should be going for.

>>8327124
>Is there such a thing as too many buttons?
There is such a thing as to few brain cells.

So you can't spell out CACA

>>8327182
lmao I saw something familiar earlier today
It's called the Hillbilly Cat, if the d-pad wasn't mush I might've gotten it for the sheer lol factor

>>8327221
Looks good.
The modern equivalent has weird assignable buttons on the back.

>>8315814
>>8319138
Why not use the Thrustmaster...

>>8327246
The thrushmastor is not simple enough. Just use the Polystation 3? It's hot garbage.

>>8327235
The L and R buttons should've been on the right side for it to have been good, just like other arcade pads. The left stick can switch from regular to having the knob on top like in the pic so you can use it like a fight stick and it's stored on the back of the absolute unit. I always loved the Saturn controller and wanted a modern version for the spaceship feel but I don't think this is it.

>>8327258
So have the L&R buttons a bit like the Black and white buttons on the original Xbox?

>>8327262
>>8327258
Or more like the Hori?

>>8327262
>>8327270
More like the Duke since I have that Hori pad and the right stick is a bit of a stretch to be comfy after a while of not using it. I really prefer the use of vertical space rather than stretching out the right side.

>>8327283
What about this variant of the 360 with B&W buttons?

>>8315814
Since we're posting hilariously derailing controllers we found..

>>8327342
That's just an odd placement
What I want to see is if RetroBit or 8bitDo finally release their dual analog six button saturn controllers, even though RetroBit can be a bit shit their model at least has analog triggers on theirs.

>>8325986
I actually want this one, where can I get it?
>>8315814
If you have a problem with their placement use numbers.

>>8327363
Would you want the clicky Analogues though? For retro they seem a bit out of place.

>>8327365
You can't I made it in M/S Paint :/

>>8327376
Well it's just more buttons which means more comfy custom options.

>>8327394
That D-pad is cringe-a-hol.

inb4 saying "Cringahol" is cringe, I know.

>>8315814
Just stick with the classics.

>>8327246
It's funny how over the years the D-pad shape has always gone through the 'Melted Pog slammer' phase. I mean, it looks like a Kinni left in the sun too long.
>>8327235
I think they come from here.

>>8325986
Fixed

>>8315851
>>8319195
Source:
Star Fox & Star Fox 2 Developer Interview (2017).
https://www.nintendo.com/super-nes-classic/interview-star-fox-2/
https://www.nintendo.co.uk/News/2017/September/Nintendo-Classic-Mini-SNES-developer-interview-Volume-1-Star-Fox-Star-Fox-2-1273086.html

>>8324918
What am I looking at? Is this a voting card

>>8327376
YES! and YES!, have you ever played a retro game that uses the shoulders for dashing? feel so fucking good you dont ever wanna go back!

>>8327989
Does Saints Row count?

>>8327989
>uses the shoulders for dashing
Back Dash in Castlevania.
Mega man Zero.

>>8328138
That is fucking disgusting

>>8328138
The other guy on the box receiving the STD special move. I bet these were banned in competitive play.

>>8325772
> press start button
> controller flies off