/vr/ - Retro Games

I can't, but I can't really find anything good about it either.

>>8251563
No good games

>>8251563
To be fair, it's difficult to find a (one) meaningful flaw

Most of it's good games are better played in the actual arcade version these days. Same issue with the Dreamcast.

Not a problem back then but it's a problem today. Still discovering its library thoug.

Another flaw is a massive amount of interesting games are Japan only.

>>8251563
You're right, i can't. It's a great system and constantly hooked up as i play it often.

>>8251563
Sega. That's the flaw right there. Doesn't stop me from liking it, hell, it is tied for my most favorite console of all time, but the reality is most people just don't like them.

>>8251563
Transparency effects

>>8251703
I always heard this shit that Saturn cant do transparency and literally the first Saturn game I play (guardian hero's) the girl healer character has a transparent yellow cloak. It's not ugly dithering or anything

>>8251709
It's not that it can't do them. It's that it can only do them in very specific situations when the stars align just right.

>>8251702
I’m honoured to have whole price of paper /vr/o in my presence

>>8251563
Region locked.

>>8251563
The Saturn is so fucking kino. It reminds me of the Ambassador Class starship in that it is literally the Platonic ideal of gaming consoles.

>>8251563
More expensive than a PS1.
Less interesting library than a PS1.
Couldn't do 3D as well as PS1 or N64.

>>8251765
As were most consoles, but this one has an easy bypass

>>8251563
It killed SEGA.

>inb4 Saturnfags try to shift the blame onto the Dreamcast instead of taking responsibility

I just bought one of these. How retarded am I

>>8251957
depends how many games you play, start with elevator action returns and psychic killer taromaru and work your way up. also make sure you set c to sub weapon in elevator action's options menu

>>8251563
>>inb4 muh arcade games
>>inb4 muh ram carts
2 of the best things about the Chadturn, I don't understand your post

>>8251957
not at all. literally all you need the play the entire catalogue is a stack of cs-r's and a piece of tape.

>>8251959
>>8251963
I'm psyched. I managed to get a good deal on a white JP console with a regular pad, a 3D pad and this sick Bomberman pad.

>>8251960
I’m saying inb4 someone complains it’s all arcade ports and that you need the ram cart. Those are in fact based features

>>8251957
Retarded? You’re the smartest man in the thread

>>8251702
What is the top left thing? Fenrir?

>>8251949
They only fell into huge losses starting from the 1998 fiscal year. They already stopped producing the Saturn by the start of the 1998 fiscal year (they only made the skeleton models in mid 1998).

So the losses you see on that graph? You can thank the Dreamcast for that.

>>8252067
But Saturn is where they started dipping into the red. Dreamcast slowed the extreme decline that was brought on by the Saturn, though not enough to make up for Saturn's failure.

there's nothing worth playing on this shitty thing. just inferior ports of arcade games that you can emulate perfectly now and cringey weeaboo garbage like grandia. what a piece of shit.

>>8251740
Dumb avatarfag cocksucker. Don't lose your leash before you you find him in another thread.

>>8251969
Get a pseudo Kai all in one or an action replay for saves as well and your golden

>>8252067
You have posted this in like 5 different Sega related threads just in this last month and you keep repeating it even after I've posted this every time.

>>8252085
yeah but he’s got some cool Saturn games AND a whole piece of paper

>>8252071
>Dreamcast slowed the extreme decline that was brought on by the Saturn

Look at the fucking graph, they had extreme decline STARTING with the Dreamcast. 1998 fiscal year in Japan is 1998 Apr 1. to 1999 March 31, and they already stopped making the Saturn by 98 April.

>>8252089
That must've been someone else then. Also, your graph measures operating income, not net income. The bottom line is the net income. According to your graph, they should've been in the green in 1999 too, so the numbers there don't add up..

Can we have a Saturn thread without you retards shitting it up with endless debates on when Sega started losing money? Who gives a shit

>>8252126
>Also, your graph measures operating income, not net income. The bottom line is the net income.
are you unironically retarded?

>>8252089
>Consumer goes down in 95-96 thanks to disastrous US handling of the Saturn.
>Starts to improve a little from 96-97 thanks to Japanese Saturn sales.
>Goes down a little in 98 thanks to discontinuing the Saturn.
>Japanese Dreamcast launch in Japan has shortages, but is still profitable leading to profits in 1999 due to a sane price point and Sega of Japan was still selling and releasing Saturn software.
>Bernie Stolar cuts the Dreamcast price to $199 in the US creating a massive hemorrhage leading into 2000.

You can clearly see from your graph that the US Dreamcast launch does far more damage to Sega's console business than the Saturn ever did. Sure the Saturn years weren't a good position to be in, they were still recoverable. The Dreamcast is where things just go off a cliff though. Sega of America was so focused on moving consoles that they didn't realize that while they were selling a lot of Dreamcasts, they were losing tons of money on each one and needed extremely unrealistic software sales to make it up. It ended up with a goal that was unobtainable and constantly moving further out of reach.

>>8252148
Thats some great headcanon, I feel bad I have to interrupt it with reality.
>Consumer falls off a cliff from 95-98 after SoJ forces all focus be paid to the Saturn, despite the Genesis being the highest selling console everywhere but Japan, and continuting to sell 1+ millions copies of software all the way up until 97.
>The Saturn which is a titantic level flop everywhere but Japan, and whose manufacturing costs force the console to be sold at such a loss that even with a 9:1 attach rate software licensing fees can't make up the difference destroys the consumer side of the company. FF7 is released in 97, and combined with the release of VF2 being the last game of any note, effectively kills the console even in its one moderately successful market,
>98 sees a slight boost despite the Japanese Dreamcast launch being a complete failure, as the Genesis 3 release in America sells more consoles in one year than the Saturn had in its entire life.
>SoA breaks every entertainment industry record with the launch of the Dreamcast, selling more consoles, software, and add-ons than any company in history, and causes a big uptick.
>The announcement of the PS2 destroys any momentum the dreamcast had, and Sega resorts to massive price gauges all the way down to $50, or literally giving the consoles away for free with Seganet subscriptions, something they don't even have a chance to recoup on as the service is killed less than 2 years later. a completely unsustainable practice since the company was already hundreds of millions of dollars in debt before the console was even launched.
Now would you like to live in reality, or would you like to live in your weeb headcanon?

>>8252132
Operating income only factors in operating expenses. Net income factors in all expenses, taxes, debts, and so on. You can have positive operating income while still having a net loss.

>>8252148
That's not at all true. You forget that they also axed Genesis sales as much as possible (which had a 40 million user base and could've raked in cash from software sales), and that the Saturn lost them $100 for every console sold after they started dropping prices in 96. Remember that the US Saturn sales were ~1 million over the course of 4 years, while Japan had 5x that. In 1998 they already stopped manufacturing it except for the limited number skeleton units, so the loss was minimized there. But they also had to ramp up production of a new hardware, including all the R&D, devkits, shitload of advertising, Yu Suzuki going on a $80 million binge with Shenmue, etc.

>leading to profits in 1999
That's not how fiscal years work, if they get profits in 1998, it counts as the 1998 fiscal year, not to the profits of the next year. The 1999 upwards trend is likely due to the record breaking 1999 US DC launch. Except it still turned into a net loss because getting that extravaganza going required a substantial budget in marketing and logistics (which at that point they may have financed from loans, seeing that they were in the red).

>>8252194
You legit didn't even open the image and see what the graphs are actually measuring did you?

>>8252201
here's a hint: It's penis size.

>>8252192
>VF2 being the last game of any note

Sakura Taisen 1-2 combined sold nearly a million iirc.

>>8252208
damn man 2 games selling ALMOST a million copies, obviously i was completely off the mark saying the console was effectively dead.

>>8252201
I could say the same to you.

>>8252217
VF2 also sold ~1 million copies, which is what I was referring to. Saturn was selling fucking great in 97-98 in Japan incidentally, so much so that they had to slow down manufacturing because they couldn't afford to make so many consoles.

>>8252234
>VF2 also sold ~1 million copies, which is what I was referring to
because it was the sequel to the only reason anyone bought a Saturn in the first place. It is still 1 game and not the combined sales of two different ones. The sales numbers for anything Saturn related nosedive completely after the release of VF2 because all the Saturn was in Japan was a Virtua Fighter box. Sega consoles never sold in Japan otherwise because all japs want to play are jrpgs and mario and Sega never had either.

>too expensive
>poor logistics
>small library (combined with logistics? same 5 games in every store, yay)
>less variety in multiplayer games than ps1
>only does 2d fightin games well, which everyone was getting bored of
>fucking huge box of a system
>janky memory system compared to ps1
>shitty marketing and launch (you might not think it be like it is but it do)
>dated controller
>following after genesis' peripherals debacle
>notable games just worse versions of arcade games everyone already played
Doesn't even hit the nostalgia factor for most people because most people played the ps1 version of Saturn's games (no, nobody cares that Saturn had slightly better performance in a specific area). There's a reason nobody talks about this Sega CD 1.5 outside of nitpicky bickering.

>>8252148
>You can clearly see from your graph that the US Dreamcast launch does far more damage to Sega's console business than the Saturn ever did
The Dreamcast was officially killed in the third week of January 2001, all of Sega's losses that year had nothing to do with hardware of any kind. The chart reflects a loss of $53 million during the time the Dreamcast was on market, and over $100 million during the time the Saturn was.

>>8252260
>small library
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pyMz4-fPgk

>>8252292
Now post one for console exclusives and realize you can't go 10 deep without having to resort to shit like Bug or Sonic R

>>8252245
>The sales numbers for anything Saturn related nosedive completely after the release of VF2 because all the Saturn was in Japan was a Virtua Fighter box.
Nah:
https://web.archive.org/web/20081230005343/www.japan-gamecharts.com/sat.php

Some things to note:
- VF2 was on sale for practically the entire lifetime of the console, which is why its 1st week/total sales ratio is so low. The only games with lower ratio are fucking Puyo Puyo Tsuu and Sun. Incidentally, VF2 came out back in 1995.
- Most high selling software seems to be from 1996, a year after VF2. But that's not to say that 1997 titles are too much worse off. It makes sense given that that's when they released most of their games.
- 1998 seems to be the drop off point but they still got Sakura Taisen 2, plus a third party title (Super Robot Taisen F) both breaking 500k.

Software sales were fine. They only dropped in 1998, but that's because they axed the console in 1998, which also meant that they only released stuff that were still in the release pipeline, not focusing on making big hits (otherwise VF3 wouldn't have gotten cancelled).


>>8252272
No it does not. It shows a net income of 14085 + 5304 + 5572 million yen for the fiscal years of 1995-7 (which covers 1995 April to 1998 March). Then it shows -35635, -45881 and -42880 million yen for the fiscal years of 98-00 (covering 1998 April to 2001 March). Note that this excludes the first 4 months of the Saturn which was profitable enough that SOJ wanted to axe all of their consoles worldwide (I can only assume they lost less money on Saturn console sales at the beginning due to launch prices being extremely high). Also it excludes the final few months of the Saturn, but like I said they already almost completely stopped manufacturing the console by then, only releasing small quantity of limited edition units, so they would not have raked in 30 million yen losses from that alone.

>>8252327
>No it does not. It shows a net income of 14085 + 5304 + 5572 million yen for the fiscal years of 1995-7 (which covers 1995 April to 1998 March). Then it shows -35635, -45881 and -42880 million yen for the fiscal years of 98-00 (covering 1998 April to 2001 March).
open the fucking image and read what the fucking lines are you obnoxious failed abortion.

>>8252310
Nights
VF2
Fighters Megamix
Panzer Dragoon
Panzer Dragoon Zwei
Sega Rally
Burning Rangers
Digital Pinball
Digital Pinball Necronomicon
Sakura Taisen
Sakura Taisen 2
Virtua Cop
Virtua Cop 2
Virtual On
Dragon Force
Guardian Heroes

and Sonic R was fucking awesome.

>>8252292
The Saturn rivals the Playstation when it comes to shovelware. Just skimming through that video you will find hundreds of gambling and other nongames.

>>8252334
>console exclusives
>half the list is arcade ports
Thank you for proving my point.

>>8252334
sad

>>8252334
pretty great list, would play them all

>>8252330
>open the fucking image and read what the fucking lines are you obnoxious failed abortion.

Do you have dyslexia?
>ANNUAL NET INCOME / LOSS
>1995: 14,085 MILLION JAPANESE YENS
>1996: 5,304 MILLION JAPANESE YENS
>1997: 5,572 MILLION JAPANESE YENS
>1998: -35,635 MILLION JAPANESE YENS
>1999: -42,881 MILLION JAPANESE YENS
>2000: -42,880 MILLION JAPANESE YENS

>>8252336
ok, name another console that could play those games in 1995-1998. Genesis Virtua Fighter 2 does not count.

>>8252348
You had to specify console because PC got half of them in the 90s.

>>8252348
>ok, name another console that could play those games in 1995-1998. Genesis Virtua Fighter 2 does not count.
Who gives a shit? No one buys a console to play shitty arcade ports. Its like buying a SNES to play Doom when everyone knows the true version is the PC game. The Saturn literally does not have a library of games worth owing the console for, and this goes double now when you can flawlessly emulate the actual arcade versions.

What is with Sony fanboys and sales numbers?
Every fucking vidya board they shitpost
Who gives a fucking shit

>>8252359
Snoy fag detected

>>8252357
>You had to specify console because PC got half of them in the 90s.

Yeah it's not like you don't have nearly all console exclusives being "exclusive (& on PC)" even today. It's not like they didn't have PC releases for Metal Gear Solid or Final Fantasy 7 either, right?
Oh wait.

>>8252359
>No one buys a console to play shitty arcade ports.
Back in 96, people absolutely were. Aside from the occasional JRPG, console games were largely arcade style titles, and the Saturn and PSX did that better than anything before. It wasn't until Sony started releaseing long-ass titles with buttload of content that this started to fundamentally change (FF7, MGS, Gran Turismo, and the like), and even then it was a slow process.

>Its like buying a SNES to play Doom
Doom on ANY console was a really fucking huge deal in 1994, it was considered the biggest name in the entire consumer video game market.

>The Saturn literally does not have a library of games worth owing the console for, and this goes double now when you can flawlessly emulate the actual arcade versions.
If you bring in emulation then this also stands true for every fucking console up to the Gamecube, because you can just emulate those machines flawlessly.

>>8252359
People absolutely bought consoles to play arcade ports. That’s why the Saturn was successful in Japan, because people bought it to play Virtua Fighter. Doom was fucking huge and you can absolutely bet people got a SNES just for it, as bizarre as it sounds to your feeble brain.

>>8252384
>Back in 96, people absolutely were.
No, they never did this at any time, and by parroting it you're proving you only know about consoles back then from youtube "historians" who also weren't even alive back then and have no idea what games people actually bought or played. In fact heres a count of how many arcade ports are in the top 10 selling for every notable console to that point.
>NES
0 arcade ports
>Genesis
4 arcade ports
>SNES
1 arcade port
>PS1
1 arcade port
>N64
0 arcade ports
Just for fun, if you removed any port of Mortal Kombat or Street Fighter 2 from these lists you're left with just one single game, Tekken 3.

>>8252415
Just because you and your friends didn’t buy MK on release day doesn’t mean people weren’t absolutely hyped as fuck for it coming out on consoles you snoy faggot

>>8252425
No one rushed out to buy a console to play MK because they already owned a console to play Sonic, or EA sports games, or Mario. No one has ever bought a console to play arcade ports, which is why the Saturn, the console that relied on them more than every other console to ever exist, was a catastrophic failure.

>>8252415
>>8252391
>>8252384
and hell why not do the Saturn's highest selling games outside Japan, since arcade ports were such console movers at the time and the Saturns high quality ones surely will top the list
>Madden NFL 97
>Nights Into Dreams
>Virtua Fighter 2
>Daytona USA
>Virtua Cop
>Tomb Raider
>Sega Rally Championship
>Sonic 3D Blast
>World Series Baseball
>Panzer Dragoon
A whopping 4 arcade ports, even on the system whose library is 90% arcade ports. All outsold by a yearly football game which sold a goliath 80k copies on the Saturn, which was only 920k less than it sold on the Genesis that same year.

>>8252479
Bro who the fuck cares. A game is a game, why are you so obsessed about it being a port?

>>8252483
I accept your concession.

>>8252483
its the n64 autist, mods won't do anything lol

>>8252484
Imagine getting this pressed over a port of Street Fighter Alpha

>>8252486
Oh shit, I should’ve known. Honestly i don’t know why I didn’t see it sooner, it’s so obvious in hindsight

I'm looking forward to trying all of those ports, myself. Space Harrier should be fun with the 3D pad

>>8252492
Controls like a dream Anon. Same with OutRun with that sweet arranged ost

>>8252486
I am the n64 autist and I only made two posts ITT (they should be pretty obvious).

>>8252503
I’m gonna guess it’s these two
>>8251620
>>8251885

So the other guy is just deranged then. Makes sense. Well it doesn’t matter, he just got filtered by arcade quality ports in the home on Sega’s 32bit 2D powerhouse, the greatest console ever made

>>8252334
>Fighters
>Shmups
>Pinball
>Sonic R
No wonder the Saturn bombed.

>>8252514
Nah it's these.
>>8252335
>>8252357

>>8252524
Very cheeky, very cheeky indeed

>>8252514
>post sales figures and financial reports to substantiate what I say all while you fail to name exclusives to the console, post objectively false things, and then randomly degenerate into calling me a fanboy of both Sony and Nintendo while frantically trying to move the goalposts from what you yourself posted
>I'm deranged
This is why you don't get into arguments about things you only pretend to like to appear contrarian.

>>8252531
Your sales figures flat out shows the hemorrhage starts with the US Dreamcast launch. We're not saying Saturn was a massive profitable success. We're saying Dreamcast was worse. If Dreamcast was making more money than Saturn then Sega wouldn't have dropped out of the console business.

>>8251702
I kneel
>>8252045
MNEMO ODE, it's for the 3DO

>>8251620
No good EOP

>>8252765
Name 1 Saturn game you can't enjoy without knowing japanese and has actually involving gameplay, not just reading text-boxes and moving cursors around in menus.

You can't.

>>8251563
Didn't have a new Sonic, transparency was shit, few notable 3D games, like dude, if shmups are your thing then the Saturn is great, but that's only one genre and one that 99% of people don't care for. The only shmup I like is Graze Counter and it ain't on Saturn

>>8252796
Even the N64 had a more diverse library and that's just depressing

>>8252798
>Even the N64 had a more diverse library
No it didn't. Stop lying to yourself. The only genre's where Saturn gets a little thin are 3D Platformers and first person shooters.. Even then what it has in those genre's isn't even bad for the most part. N64 on the other hand has massive gaping holes in it's library when it comes to things like RPGs, Shmups, Fighters, Light Gun Games, any kind of 2D Game, etc.

N64 is great if you just want Nintendo First party stuff, 3D Platformers, Racers, and FPS games. If you want anything else though you're completely fucked. Saturn may not have as many games as the PS1 but it's no library diversity isn't anywhere near as bad as the N64s.

>>8252798
>Even the N64 had a more diverse library
No it didn't. Stop lying to yourself. The only genre's where Saturn gets a little thin are 3D Platformers and first person shooters.. Even then what it has in those genre's isn't even bad for the most part. N64 on the other hand has massive gaping holes in it's library when it comes to things like RPGs, Shmups, Fighters, Light Gun Games, any kind of 2D Game, etc.

N64 is great if you just want Nintendo First party stuff, 3D Platformers, Racers, and FPS games. If you want anything else though you're completely fucked. Saturn may not have as many games as the PS1 but it's library diversity isn't anywhere near as bad as the N64s.

>>8252787
>name one game that requires reading that doesn't require reading
Not the sharpest tool in the shed are you

>>8252828
>RPG's
99.99% of people would rather play Paper Mario than some Saturn-exclusive eroge
>Shmups
Nobody cares
>Fighters
Smash Bros is better because there was never a Super Smash Brothers Turbo Championship Edition RMX coming out monthly at full price to invalidate your previous month's purchase
>Light gun games
Nobody cares
>Any kind of 2D game
Wouldn't go to the fuckin Saturn for that with worse transparency than the Super Nintendo. Like RPG's this is obviously better on PlayStation but nonetheless I hear many good things about mischief makers and mystical whatever the fuck and Kirby 64, whereas the only 2D Saturn game that wasn't the 9000000000th shmup was a compilation of Mega Drive Sonic games lol

>>8253352
99.99% of people would rather play star fox 64 over some Saturn exclusive shmup eroge

>>8253363
You literally have 2 directly comparable games to star fox 64 on the Saturn

>>8253375
Panzer dragoon do be good

>>8251563
The fact that they didn't have a Sonic game ready at launch killed this thing, even the 32x had a "Sonic" game to attract customers

>>8253423
If nights was a knuckles branded game game do you think it would’ve made a difference?

>>8253427
I think so, most people bought the 32x only to play Chaotix, they would have bought the Saturn to play a sonic branded Nights

>>8253363
>99.99% of people on /vr/ are furfags

>>8252479
>All outsold by a yearly football game which sold a goliath 80k copies on the Saturn, which was only 920k less than it sold on the Genesis that same year.

On a console that had 40x the install base at the time.

>>8253352
Hope you enjoy Quest 64 you big gay retard

>>8251563
VDP1 is slow.
If you wanted to bring straight ports off of the PS1 to the Saturn, you basically had to halve texture resolution to keep rendering speed up. This also ignores the fact that the Saturn doesn't provide purpose-made hardware for accelerating transform/lighting calculations, you have to either run that code on the other SH-2 or attempt to wrangle with the DSP chip.
These points still apply when writing software specifically for Saturn, too. Drawing high-resolution textures is slow, and you have to handle lighting and transform calculations yourself, both of which can majorly bottleneck performance.
There are other issues like the available tooling for the Saturn being ass (barely updated since late 95), quad rendering (your modelling software uses triangles and UV mapping), transparency (although if I'm honest 50% mesh mode looks fine on composite), etc.

>>8253642
ps2 had an installbase 150x the ps4 and a bit less than 2x the ps3's
so we should expect the ps2 version of fifa 14 to have sold the best?

>>8251563
Quads instead of triangles. 8 Processors across 5 different architectures to program for.

Mind you I like the system, it's just overly complex, and bet on the wrong horse from a graphics point of view.

>>8252862
I mean, when you put it like that, maybe they're in highschool and are taking the first babysteps into logic, and thought a tautology was cute?

>>8253912
Fifa 14 came out two generations after the PS2 died, not two years after a badly selling successor console was introduced.
It's more like how the Wii outsold Wii U releases for a while.

>>8252415
>No, they never did this at any time
Fucking famicom launched with nothing but direct arcade ports (Popeye, Donkey Kong). People bought it.
Pacman was considered a killer app in early game consoles.
Playstation launched with Ridge Racer, and Tekken, both arcade ports. People bought it.
Best selling video game of all time (Tetris) also played like an arcade game.
But if we count games that play like an arcade title, then we should also include Sonic, Super Mario Bros, Duck Hunt, Dr. Mario (and I should point out that a lot of those did get arcade releases), in fact nearly everything that isn't an RPG or a sports game or simulator.

I don't understand the talking point about arcade ports. I don't own a single arcade port. My favorite Saturn games are platformers, shooters, strategy, and adventure games. I own a few multi-plat games, some people don't consider them "Saturn games", but I don't have the other console they were released on so they're Saturn games to me, besides, if multi-plats don't count on the Saturn they don't count on any other system, which is a retarded way of viewing things.

Anyway, here's my list of Saturn favorites:
>Magic Knight Rayearth
>Astal
>Clockwork Knight 1/2
>Bomberman Wars
>Bomberman Fight
>Gex
>Rayman
>Solar Eclipse
>Heirs of Zendor
>Grid Runner
>Robotica
>Powerslave
>Duke Nukem 3D
>NiGHTs
>Burning Rangers
>Albert Odyssey
>Dragon Force
>Pandemonium
>Necromonicon
>GT24
>Willy Wombat

And the list quite literally goes on for another hundred games or so but these are games which speak to me the most

>>8253352
It's painfully obvious you know nothing about the Sega Saturn's library.

>>8254571
>know nothing about the Sega Saturn's library
Sure we do, because we already played most the games in the arcade, on the playstation, and on PCs.

What people didn't understand was dropping $400 for a machine that mostly had $60-70 gimped versions of games we were already tired of playing.

>>8254618
You can’t play Death Crimson on PS1 and N64 can you though

No mainline Sonic game.
It's cool to look back on it now as an "alternative" console but if this was your main system from 1995-2000 while the PSX and N64 were booming, you were hurting bad. That's the experience my cousin had with his. He got a Saturn near launch but ended up buying a PSX around '98 once he realized his grave mistake. Tekken 2 and 3 > Virtua Fighter 1 and 2.

>>8254632
Can't post on /vr/ in 1996 either. Not that we would want to, everyone was busy playing ps1 and n64 games.

>>8254657
And missing out on Death Crimson by the looks of it

>>8254618
And what you don't get is that for quite a few of those games the Saturn versions are still worth playing. For example a lot of the CPS2 ports have additional characters, game play modes, etc. that aren't in the Arcade versions or recent compilations.

Then there's games like Grandia where the Saturn version is still preferred due to the PS1 versions being botched ports and recent Remasters being terrible. Some multiplatform games like Megaman 8 and Megaman X4 the Saturn versions are still the better versions to play. Then you have some that while inferior ports like Castlevania, Suikoden, and Vandal Hearts have enough bonus unique content to make them worth a playthrough.

And then there's still no other way to play the likes of Panzer Dragoon II, Panzer Dragoon Saga, Shining Force III, Shining the Holy Ark, Fighter's Megamix, Deep Fear, Albert Odyssey, Magic Knight Rayearth, Legend of Oasis, Dark Savior, etc. which are all solid titles.

>But it was $400 on release!
And by the time the PS1 launched a few months later it was $300. But really who cares at this point? It's 2021, you can get a Saturn easily enough and enjoy its library either through an ODE, or by burning CD-Rs with a modchip. The system is pretty accessible these days if you don't care about collecting original discs.

>>8254661
>step over dollar
>on way to golden goose
I'm fine with that.

>>8251563
The biggest flaw that the Saturn had was that the majority of its games were only released in Japan. We're slowly seeing more and more fan translations being released, which is nice, but there are a lot of excellent games that will never be playable in English.

>>8251703
If you're playing on a CRT using composite video (like 99% of gamers were doing in the mid to late 90s) this was a non-issue because the TV would blend the mesh together to make it look transparent.

>>8252376
Van Gogh lived in abject poverty for most of his life and died penniless. One of his most valuable paintings today is one he painted on the end of a barrel because he could not afford a piece of canvas at the time.

>>8254727
>It's 2021, you can get a Saturn easily enough and enjoy its library either through an ODE, or by burning CD-Rs with a modchip. The system is pretty accessible these days if you don't care about collecting original discs.

Exactly. I paid $99 shipped for pic related earlier this year. I bought a MODE, but you can get a PSK cart for like $40 that will let you play burned games, and CDRs are cheap as shit.

Basically for a $150 investment you can have more games than you will ever have time to play. If you can't afford $150 than mow some lawns or get a fucking mcjob.

You don't have to mention all those great titles in Saturn's library, it's a console worth having just for Sakura Taisen alone.

>>8254785
Sakura Wars didn't get good until the third game on the Sega Chadcast, though.

>>8254618
>What people didn't understand was dropping $400 for a machine that mostly had $60-70 gimped versions of games we were already tired of playing.

Not everyone was living near arcades, and not every arcade had all the games the Saturn had.

>>8254727
That's a lot of words to add nothing new,or even relevant, to the linked conversation.
>>8254750
>investment
anon, no, that's not how that works.
Here's an actual money tip: stop buying so much obsolete vidya hardware and you'll easily be able to afford a PC that can play all the retro games for free.

>>8254618
>we already played most the games in the arcade, on the playstation, and on PCs.
Very few arcade games came out on the PC, and the ones that came out on PS1 usually had shittier versions than the Saturn.

>games we were already tired of playing.
In the arcade you could play a game for 5-10 minutes depending on how much change you had to waste. Not enough time to learn and enjoy the game unless you wasted 5-10$ on a single title on a regular basis.
With the Saturn versions you could play them nonstop every afternoon and all weekend. If anything, we didn't play them again in the arcade once we got the home versions. Not that this was true because home versions usually came out 1-2 years later. By the time Saturn got Virtua Fighter 2 and Mortal Kombat Trilogy, arcades started getting Virtua Fighter 3 and MK 4.

>>8254871
or, get this, you could get a superior system like a PS1 for less money and be happy. I like Sega in general but you tryhard widows really sour the pot.

>>8254871
>Not everyone was living near arcades
For $700 you could have traveled out of bumfuck nowhere to a place with an arcade, dropped a couple hundred in an arcade of Saturn "exclusives", then gone back home and bought a Playstation.

>>8254882
>That's a lot of words to add nothing new,or even relevant, to the linked conversation.
Not really, it pointed out that even the games that aren't exclusive to the Saturn are still worth playing to this day due to having things like more content or still being the superior version. So those multiplats on top of the good exclusives it has make it worth having.

Honestly if you're going to start dismissing Saturn games for being arcade ports or having newer versions available on other consoles then we could probably dismiss most of the good games on consoles like the N64, SNES, NES, Genesis, etc. It would be like saying most of the first party offerings on the NES, SNES, N64, Genesis, etc. don't count for those systems because they're available on other systems like the Gamecube, Wii, Wii U, Switch, PC, etc. You could even stretch that to third party offerings from companies like Square, Enix, Capcom, Konami, etc. with all the times those games have been re-released/ported over the years.

It's a silly argument to make on a board dedicated to discussing retro video games and retro gaming hardware.

>>8254915
>NUH UH

>>8254920
Ok, the following games no longer count for the N64 since they're available on other systems:

Mario 64
Ocarina of Time
Majora's Mask
Mario Kart 64
Diddy Kong Racing
Banjo Kazooie
Banjo Tooie
Perfect Dark
Goldeneye
Star Fox 64
F-Zero X
Paper Mario
Mario Golf
Sin and Punishment
Kirby 64
Mario Tennis
Wave Race 64
Yoshi's Story
Super Smash Bros.
Pokemon Snap
1080 Snowboarding
Cruis'n USA
Cruis'n World
Cruis'n Exotica
Mortal Kombat Trilogy
Resident Evil 2
Megaman 64
Tony Hawk 1-3
Quake
Quake 2
Duke Nukem 3D
Doom 64
Turok 1 and 2
San Francisco Rush
Rush 2049
Star Wars Episode 1: Racer
Star Wars Rogue Squadron
Star Wars Shadows of the Empire
Star Wars Battle for Naboo
Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine
Rayman 2
Conker's Bad Fur Day
Jet Force Gemini

There's probably more than that too. So if we say those games don't count for the N64, then what's left to play on the thing?

>>8254661
Nobody cares about lightgun games
There is not one soul who would play Death Crimson over Pro Skater 2

>>8254727
>Saturn version of mega man X4 is better
NONONONONO

>>8254742
Dithered transparency can only create the illusion of 50% transparency. You would never see a fade like on PlayStation

>>8254942
Spoken like someone who has never played death crimson

>>8254940
>this is how things were in 97
i look forward to your next wall of irrelevant text

>>8254959
>someone who has never played death crimson
That could be almost anyone.

>>8254964
And you’re one of them. How sad

>>8253352
NNOO YUO CAN’T HAVE A CONSOLE FULL OF ARCADE PERFECT PORTS1! WHERE’S THE HECKING PLATFORMARINOS??

>>8255002
>arcade perfect
this is what delusional saturnfags actually believe

>>8255007
Post a PS1 arcade port that isn’t neutered in any way

>>8255019
why settle for ports? it's current year, you can emulate the arcade original perfectly. fuck being a coping consolecuck and playing inaccurate and inferior ports of arcade games.

>>8255021
Not what I asked. Post port.

>>8255007

>>8255021
>emulation
no thanks, I'm straight.

>>8255021
Mame is for fags

>>8255043
>I'm straight
as a rainbow

>>8255019
Street fighter alpha

>>8255002
After ff7 came out nobody was interested in the arcade experience

>>8254946
The better background effects and controls make up for it. Plus if you're playing over composite that part looks just fine.
>>8254961
So then why are we dismissing Saturn games that were either exclusive or the best versions available in 1997?
>>8255056
Yeah about that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDWnXOfCQFA

>>8255056
Sound effects were changed for the PSX version. So it’s not arcade perfect

>>8255073
>Better controls
How
>>8255074
You said "neutered" not "different". Maybe a nigga thinks the PS1 sounds are better

>>8255073
>If you're playing over composite that part looks just fine
Nope, the overlapping lights don't get to overlap because composite blending can only simulate 50% opacity, and last but not least your afterimage looks like shit on the Saturn, I would rather have it disabled altogether

>>8255074
The backgrounds are also screwed up. When they scroll vertically you can see the edge of the image and the black background color behind it. The Resolution is also off far worse than the Saturn's 352x224. Everything looks smaller and messed up as a result. You also have the comical intro where it's a clone match as there's not enough memory to store 2 different characters for a demo fight. And then there's the longer and more frequent load times.

>>8255076
>How
Because of pic related.

>>8255087
I like the buttons aligned in a cross better, also the Saturn controller is too petite. Never thought I would be complimenting a PlayStation controller for its endowment

>>8255076
Sorry maybe I should’ve been more specific
https://youtu.be/ufd2Ne2UCt8

>>8255073
>So then why are we dismissing Saturn games
Because this is a thread about Saturn's flaws, which is only a relevant discussion if it's framed through the lens of its active period. This isn't about modern emulation.

You want it to be about modern emulation? Every retro game is available for free and you can play as you like. There, done, moving on...

To reiterate: resources, for most people, are limited, especially concerning entertainment. Spending resources on the Saturn during its retail release was less beneficial because there were TWO better options, both more easily available and for less money.

god fucking damnit i'm so done with running every conversation through an autism translation

>>8251960
Holy newfag

>>8255095
Oh this one is even worse
https://youtu.be/2vWQXcAzhJQ

>>8255079
>Nope, the overlapping lights don't get to overlap because composite blending can only simulate 50% opacity
So what? You only have that going on for one level.
>and last but not least your afterimage looks like shit on the Saturn
It looks fine. Sure the PS1 has transparency but Saturn's doesn't look bad, just different. Again I think the better background effects, controls, and faster load times on Saturn make up for it.

>>8255093
So reconfigure the button assignments. The Saturn's D-Pad and shoulder buttons beat the pants off the PS1's awful Dpad and mushy triggers.

>>8255097
>Because this is a thread about Saturn's flaws, which is only a relevant discussion if it's framed through the lens of its active period.

By that logic then it's superior Arcade ports, better versions of Games like Grandia (which was exclusive in 1997), etc. should definitely count and not be dismissed.

>But it was more expensive!
For 3 months. By the time PS1 released Saturn matched it in price and actually beat it to hitting the $200 mark. Then in 1996 you had things like the three free games deal and the price was down to $150 by 1997. Also import Saturn games were actually pretty accessible with stores like Electronics Boutique selling them in the US along with ways to play them on your US Saturn.

>>8255104
Nothing makes up for those shitty dash trails you have to endure for the whole game. It's part of the game's identity

>>8255114
And people still didn't buy the Saturn cause it didn't have the games

>>8255114
>By that logic then...
No. None of what you said makes it more desirable than its competition.
>the price was down to $150 by 1997
because it was shit and it wasn't selling
>import Saturn games were actually pretty accessible
No, they weren't. They weren't that desirable either. For every one game Saturn had in the store PS1 had ten more. Most people weren't going to chase imports if that locals weren't even that good or easy to find. Big box stores were king, most smaller gaming stores were on the verge of collapse, it took GameStop taking over all of them for the model to even stay in business.

>>8251563
No good sonic game, half assed ports, sega didn't gave a shit. It was an unborn child.

>>8255156
It did in Japan.

>>8255284
>only approximately 6 million units sold
>worse software attach rate than the N64
Barely.

>>8255194
>No. None of what you said makes it more desirable than its competition.
Again, I'm pointing out that in relation to the present, it's a silly argument to dismiss games due to them being available on other systems. If we did that for the N64 you'd lose just about every game worth playing on it.
>But Saturn failed in the US in the 90s!
Again who cares about how it did in the US in the 90s? It's not 1997, it's 2021. It's easily available now, and Japanese imports are easily obtainable. If the games are too expensive there's tons of options to avoid having to shell out big bucks. Why can't we appreciate the Saturn for what it is and what good games are available on it?

Seriously, why does it bother you so much that more and more people are realizing the Saturn isn't a bad system when it's entire library is made available?

>>8255284
Hate this meme. Yeah the west didn't get the eroge visual novels, so what?

>>8255321
There's more to the Japanese Saturn library than eroge visual novels. A lot more actually.

>>8255324
Yeah, can't forget those Snezz-tier jarpigs, bad arcade ports, and the list goes on.

>>8255341
Snes tier down to the graphics even, many times worse
Do any Saturn JRPG's have transparent gradients on UI elements?

>>8255294
>Again who cares about how it did in the US in the 90s? It's not 1997, it's 2021
If you're assessing the Saturn today its in an even worse point than it was when it was actually on market. All its arcade ports can be played on MAME, all its fighting games can be played on fightcade, and its list of actual exclusive titles worth a shit doesn't even hit 10.
No one cares about the console, No one ever has cared about the console. Its as irrelevant to video games as something like the 3DO or Jaguar and was even when it was on market, it has no notable games, it didn't set any new standards, it flopped everywhere in the entire world except Japan, where it barely finished 2nd in sales to a console with no jrpgs, while still being outsold almost 4:1 by the Playstation. The only place I ever see anyone even talk about the damn console is here because this board is filled with weebs and contrarians, and the only actual relevance the console gets outside here is people gouging autistic collectors because the games and console sold such microscopic amounts that they're impossible to find.

>>8251636
>Most of it's good games are better played in the actual arcade version these days. Same issue with the Dreamcast.
You get extra features with console arcade games and I would bet you couldn't even tell the difference between most dreamcast arcade ports.

>>8255523
this
though panzer dragoon saga is meant to be good

>>8251563
What flaw? It's a perfect system.

>>8253939
Pretty sure it's just a little faggot trying to fit in by pretending he's hard core

>>8255294
Once again, YOU are the only person talking about Saturn games as they exist today.

Fine, you REALLY want to talk about Saturn games as they exist today?
Everybody already played most of its games on different platforms. Fucking around with Saturn games that have already been played elsewhere just to see minute, irrelevant differences is a waste of time. There are THOUSANDS of unique non-Saturn retro games to be played. Literally every fucking time someone recommends a Saturn game they list one of the same 5 games or a game that was more popular on another platform.

And that's why the Saturn is garbage, because the only way to determine its value is to weigh it against similar products. It is worse than every single piece of competition it had. It got its ass whooped by the fucking Game Boy Color, people were more excited to play pokemon in two muted colors than seek out Saturn gameplay.

People don't want to generate false nostalgia for a console they didn't play.
People don't want to slog through import moon runes.
People don't even want to waste time of /vr/ pretending they liked the Saturn.

There's nothing to appreciate other than the lessons the industry learned via Saturn's failure.
The discussion in this thread is more notable than anything the Saturn ever produced.

>>8255827
damn bro...

>>8255827
Imagine being this booty blasted that you were born too late to get an old toy before hipsters drive the price up

>>8255993
>IMAGINE
found the zoomer

>>8256014
Those damn zoomers implementing feudalism and shit!

>>8255827
What a pleb, Saturn has the best version of PTOII you know

>>8256023
idk what PTOII is
Guess I needn't play Saturn, thank you for finalising my thoughts

>>8255827
lol fag

>>8255827
>I don't care about video games, I only care about the company and how much they sold
seriously?

>>8255827
But wait anon. Don't you know that the Saturn can play arcade perfect ports with the help of the 4mb rom cart? PS1/N64 can't do that.

>>8254887
I was plenty happy enough with my Saturn, didn't need a Playstation next to it.

>>8254904
>For $700 you could have traveled out of bumfuck nowhere to a place with an arcade, dropped a couple hundred in an arcade of Saturn "exclusives",

Yeah, once.
Or I could get a Saturn and some games for 1/3rd of that, and play them any time I liked for the next 25 years.

>>8255019
>Post a PS1 arcade port that isn’t neutered in any way

Cotton Fantastic Night Dreams (a jap only budget release of a 1991 arcade game).

>>8255194
In the UK you had stores that specifically offered region modding services and 50/60 switches so you could play import games on the Saturn. They were even advertised in magazines.

>>8255359
>Snes tier down to the graphics even, many times worse
There were some Saturn JRPGs which targeted the SNES but switched platforms halfway through. Albert Odyssey was one I think.

>>8255019
I like the PS1 port of DoDonPachi more than the original version. Both the Saturn and PS1 ports are very accurate, but the PS1 version includes the option to bind slowdown to its own button instead of slowing down automatically whenever you hold the fire button

>>8255523
Japan is the only market that matters and Saturn did well there.

Needed more jrpgs if I'm honest

>>8256465
You mean in English?
Shit had plenty of jrpgs

>>8256475
Not him, but can you recommend me some? The only one I've got plans to play so far is Tengai Makyou IV

>>8256304

>>8256478
>Albert Odyssey
>Panzer Dragoon Saga
>Shining the Holy Ark
>Dragon Force 1 and 2
>Shining Force 3 (all three scenarios!)
>Grandia
>Linkle Liver Story
>Ogre Tactics: Let Us Cling Together
>Mystaria: The Realms of Lore
>Sakura Wars

>>8256478
Madou Monogatari

>>8256551
Shining Force 3 was an SRPG and Dragon Force was more like a strategy game.
Same for Ogre Tactics and Sakura Taisen (and that was like half srpg, half visual novel).

>>8256586
Eh oh well. Not a big Jarpig fan so those were what immediately came to mind. Anon still needs to absolutely play Panzer Dragoon Saga though

>>8253438
Never even heard of that game before, probably because I don't have a 32x, just a megadrive. Damn. That looks fun.

>>8256615
Wait until you play it, oh boy

>>8256615
The music is fucking outstanding and it’s a very pretty and colourful game (if a bit cluttered and garish in places) but the actual core gameplay with the ring system is really really mixed. There’s a lot of stopping and starting to get over simple ramps, levels are massive and vertical and can be sometimes difficult to navigate and it’s pathetically easy. I’d say give it a try but don’t be surprised if you end up hating it

>>8256551
>>8256586
Thanks bros. I'm already a huge Puyo fan so I'd probably enjoy Madou Monogatari a lot. Not sure how I managed to forget about Panzer Dragoon Saga; I'll check it out. Already picked up a copy of Sakura Taisen, but I'll have to check out Shining Force 3, too.

>>8256627
If you like golden sun, play shining in the holy ark

>>8256625
Oh and also some of the characters just flat out break the game. Charmy can fly infinitely and bring his partner up in the air with them so you can just absolutely power through stages and fly over any and all obstacles.

>>8251563
found one.

>>8251563
no Ridge Racer? No, gracias!

>>8256909
I preferred Daytona USA to Ridge Racer. Having 40 cars on the track at the same time blew my mind. Daytona USA also has a significantly better designed drifting mechanic. Daytona USA also has the better soundtrack (I will fistfight anyone who thinks otherwise).

Ridge Racer has a much better framerate though, I'll give it that. Having goraud shaded cars with decals instead of actual textures probably helped a lot.

>>8251563
It's fatal flaw was this superior masterpiece that existed concurrently.

>299

>>8257696
>can't do 2D sprite-based games as well as the Saturn could

Into the trash it goes.

I just got mine in the mail and I think they forgot to pack the flaws... because I'm not finding any!

>>8255523
>>8255827
>Some of it's games are available on other platforms!
Again, using this same logic we can dismiss large chunks of any consoles library. It's a silly argument to make on a retro gaming board.

>But it failed outside of Japan!
Again, so what? So did plenty of other systems. They all still have fans and games worth playing. Do you go and rage this much in threads discussing the PC-Engine/TurboGrafx16? What about the Master System? The Dreamcast? The Gamecube? The Virtual Boy?

Seriously, why does it upset you so much that some people like the Sega Saturn?

>>8257814
>every single launch title for the Famicom was an arcade port
funny isn’t it

>>8257814
>Again, using this same logic we can dismiss large chunks of any consoles library.
No you can't because you're missing the key point here, which is that theres no point in playing the Saturn version of any of the games on it, except to be a contrarian. All the arcade ports are better played on MAME, or have been ported on other more powerful hardware arcade perfectly. All of its fighting games are available on fightcade, in their 1:1 arcade form, with the addition of online multiplayer. All of its multiplats don't give any real benefit to being played on the Saturn, the floor tiles in the opening town of Grandia, and the sprites being mirrored instead of having two distinct sides isn't some massive improvement, no one is dropping the game because Sue's purse flips sides depending on how you're standing. No one cares that Vandal Hearts has little glows underneath the torches in the Saturn version, these are extremely minor improvements that have 0 affect on the actual game, its not like adding M&K controls to Goldeneye or something. Then for things like Symphony of the Night or Resident Evil the Saturn additions don't offset the downgrades either version has, and theres nothing worth going out of your way to play when 99.9% of people have nostalgia for the PS1 versions anyway. This is without even accounting for the fact the games are in moon runes and you need extra add-ons to even play them.
>Do you go and rage this much in threads discussing the PC-Engine/TurboGrafx16? What about the Master System? The Dreamcast? The Gamecube? The Virtual Boy?
All of those consoles except the Gamecube and Dreamcast are seen as objective failures, with bad libraries no one cares about. No one rages about them for the same reason no one rages about the Saturn, no one cares about them at all. They just don't have some extremely small subset of retarded weeb hipsters constantly making threads about them just like vegans desperate to tell everyone they're not eating meat.

>>8258137

>>8255993
>>8256052
>>8256198
>>8256198
Facts. The way saturnfags talk about the system you would think it's the second coming of the SNES.

>>8258171
The SNES is shit and full of games no one cares about anyway. So really the Saturn is the first coming. The virgin birth. Our lord and saviour.

>>8258137
> All the arcade ports are better played on MAME and newer systems!
What about the ones that have additional content not in the Arcade like Street Fighter Alpha 3 and Vampire Savior?
>Grandia isn't that much better!
But it is better and cheaper than both the PS1 version and HD Remaster. With the English patch it's now the definitive version of the game.
>These other games aren't the best versions!
So what? They all still have bonus content that's not in other versions making them worth playing.

Again, we can use these same arguments to dismiss most of the N64's library these days. We can do it for the NES, SNES, Genesis, as well as the PS1. But we don't because it's an idiotic argument to make on board dedicated to retro games and retro gaming hardware.
>Those other systems suck and don't have fans!
Tell that to the PC-Engine community. It has a pretty strong following that's right up there with the Saturn. Same with the Master System.

Seriously, why does it upset you so much that someone likes the Saturn?

>>8258174
Too bad the Saturn is Sega's worst system.

The Master System had better platformers.
The Genesis had better shmups.
The Dreamcast had better racing games.

>but... muh jarpigs... m-muh eroge VNs......

>>8258171
Forgot pic.

>>8258174
>The SNES is shit
I'm sorry that your parents didn't love you.

>>8258182
Name one (1) good SNES game. I’ll wait

>>8258174
The original sin.

>fatal flaw
the fact its so much more expensive than other retro consoles

I'm not gonna read the whole thread and a schizo arguing with himself, so give me a quick rundown, why are you shitposting about Super Nintendo on a Saturn thread?

>>8258191
The Neo Geo says hi.

>>8258180
>What about the ones that have additional content not in the Arcade like Street Fighter Alpha 3 and Vampire Savior?
Irrelevant, the point of playing fighting games is against other people, and no one ever has or will be playing the Saturn version. Adding more characters, or combining games rosters just breaks them and makes them non viable for play.
>But it is better and cheaper than both the PS1 version and HD Remaster. With the English patch it's now the definitive version of the game.
If you're playing the english patch then you're already emulating it, meaning you can just pirate the HD version and play it at 1080p, with no loading times at all, and with any gamepad you wish to use. Its not the definite version unless the floor tiles in a single town you spend 40 minutes in are gamebreaking to you.
>So what?
Adding worthless shit no one cares about doesn't make something worth playing. Being able to shoot Wesker in a shitty battle mode you'll play 2 times and get bored of or some reskinned hunters aren't worth lego characters and longer loading times, or universally worse looking sprites in other games. Again, the only real reason to play the Saturn version of these games is to just be a unique special snowflake who needs to tell everyone he is, no one has genuine nostalgia for them, or was constantly wishing they had a Saturn version instead of their PS1 copy. Hell, at least the Dreamcast had objectively better in every way PS1 ports, and still most people don't give a shit.
>Tell that to the PC-Engine community. It has a pretty strong following that's right up there with the Saturn. Same with the Master System.
Yeah, that was kinda my point there. Don't know what delusional world you live in but theres not a single person who gives a shit about any of those 3. No one is mad about the Saturn, people are sick of hipsters pretending anyone knew or cared about it, now or even when it was actually available as a product.

>>8258252
Man shit I just like the games, is that so wrong?

mods only let this kind of shitposting go on in saturn threads lol

>>8258260
It is clinically wrong and scientifically debunkable

>>8258252
Please, tell us more about how the Sega Saturn has personally slighted you.

>>8258260
So play them? Do you actually think anyone gives a shit what games you play? Only genuine autists are sitting there seething over almost 30 year old videogames. For the most part people are probaly just like me and sick of some 20 year old hipster faggot pretending anyone ever has or will give a shit about the console. The thread was abouit the Saturns flaws and all anyone who likes it can do just like every other thread is desperately try to pretend the console wasn't a complete failure. Its like 5ish people here have some psychotic obsession with trying to get people to believe the Saturn was an actual competitor to any other console of the time, when during its highest year of sales ever it sold 70k more units than the fucking 3DO.

>>8258137
>why would you play this on this system when you could on another system
Because I don't have that other system? This mentality is so mind-numbingly stupid. You own a Saturn because of the games you like, which are most likely going to be exclusives. The reason you'd then play multiplats on the Saturn is because you want more games to play on the system you own. If a game I want to play is on two or three systems, I pick the Saturn version because I own a Saturn,
not to be contrarian. You're coming at this from such a decontextualized emulation perspective. You think there's no reason to play a multi-plat because I could just put my Saturn in the closet and go to my computer and emulate it instead.

>>8258286
Well it killed my favorite game company, and made the Dreamcast that I got on launch day die in under 2 years because they had lost so much money on it they were hundreds of millions of dollars in debt even before its release.

>>8258295
Boo hoo, its 2021 get over it and play Burning Rangers

>>8258295
Unironically the most wholesome reason to have a grudge against the saturn. Unexpected

>>8258292
>Because I don't have that other system? This mentality is so mind-numbingly stupid. You own a Saturn because of the games you like
No one owned a Saturn, it took 4 years to break 1m sold, it was outsold by the fucking rehash genesis they released in goddamn 1998. No one has nostalgia for the fucking thing, no one owned one, no one owned any Saturn games. If you were actually alive during the time you wouldn't even make a post this fucking stupid.

>>8258184

>>8258308
>No one has nostalgia for the fucking thing, no one owned one, no one owned any Saturn games

>>8258295
The Saturn wasn't entirely responsible for that. The 32X, bad decisions by Sega of America, and selling the Dreamcast at a massive loss all contributed to that. Stop being a fanboy.
>>8258308
>Released in 1994
>By 1998 sold 8.8 Million
I think you need to have your head examined. You might be retarded.

>>8251563
Sega would have succeeded if they let Americans run the brand. SoJ execs were too retarded and proud to let this succeed. That's literally it. >>8251702 is right.

>>8258320
Doesn't count. It's available on Steam, Switch, PS4, and Xbox One now. Didn't you know?

>>8258395
The original game has way more responsive aiming.

>>8258308
I've owned my Saturn since 2006. I wasn't an original owner, no, but I didn't hop on any recent bandwagon as the Saturn following was still small back then. It has been my favorite console for a long time though, and I have nostalgia for the sense of curiosity I always had around the Saturn. I was intrigued by the references to NiGHTs in the Sonic Adventure games and the inclusion of Sonic R in the gems collection.

>>8258401
Doesn't matter. It's now a multiplat and doesn't count.

>>8258405
Kind of a similar boat here, though I've had mine since 1996 and am the original owner of it. It's been one of my favorites for a long time now as well, especially after I was able to start getting more games for it as I got older and had more disposable income (around 2006-present).

>>8258184
Mega Man X
Idk how one can think the SNES has no good games especially if it had the full backing of developers one loves on other platforms. Are you really console warring 30 years later? Get a job, go to the gym, find a wife

>>8258526
it's bait! oh my god anon! ah!!

>>8258594
>opinions I disagree with are BAIT and NOT REAL, nobody could ever possibly dislike my precious Nintendo box

>>8258345
>The Saturn wasn't entirely responsible for that. The 32X, bad decisions by Sega of America, and selling the Dreamcast at a massive loss all contributed to that. Stop being a fanboy.
Oh you're that retard, this explains everything. Why is it that every single thread about something Sega related theres always like the same 3 dipshits making the exact same posts ad nausem no matter how many times you point out how stupid and wrong they are? Its like you think repeating bullshit enough times will make it true.

>>8258774
I'm sorry that you have such a childish mind that you can't understand series of bad decisions led to Sega dropping out of the console business, and not just one console.

Take the Saturn out of the equation and Sega still goes out of the console business. They were their own worst enemy and were constantly making bad decisions. And that goes for both the US and Japanese branches.

That said, none of that has anything to do with whether or not people like the Saturn and it's library of games. If you don't like it fine. But don't sit here and throw a childish temper tantrum just because others do like the system.

>>8258796
>But don't sit here and throw a childish temper tantrum just because others do like the system.
The only person throwing a temper tantrum is you anytime someone points out all of the Saturns flaws, which is the point of this thread. You make the same exact posts every single fucking thread until someone proves you wrong, and then you just wait for the next thread to do it all over again like a fucking bot. The only part of the script you haven't fulfilled yet is going on some autistic rant about the N54.

>>8258807
You've literally been writing barely coherent walls of text about how people are not allowed to like the Saturn.

Seriously, why does the fact that some people like the Sega Saturn irritate you so much?

>>8258835
Another day another thread of Saturnfags crying about other systems instead of talking about the good games on Saturn

>>8258835
Ok retard. Just ignore I said the exact opposite here >>8258287 while you continue to shit your diaper someone said something bad about a 30 year old piece of plastic
Done wasting my time with you, can't wait for you to repeat the same "SoA mishandled the Saturn, Bernie Stolar killed Sega by pricing the DC at $199, the Saturn was very successful," bullshit you spam every thread until you get called a retard by someone and then do it all over again.

>>8258854
>I said the exact opposite here!
>links to post raging about people liking the Saturn.
Seriously are you retarded?

>Saturnfags discussing its flaws

>>8259039
Nah, Saturn fans know it's flaws well enough. We just don't care because the good games are still good regardless.

>>8259051
Why don't you ever talk about the fucking games then, it's always some flamewar trying to prove the Saturn was good in the same way Zelda lore faggots don't actually talk about the Zelda story

>>8258851
>crying about other systems
When the other systems were actively KILLING FUCKING GAMING, you tend to cry about it. N64 and PS1 had a ton of shitware style over substance trash while Sega tried to continue ACTUAL FUCKING GAMES on the Saturn. Gee, I wonder why the Saturn failed? Because you fucking idiot children fell hook, line, and sinker for the viral marketing and fake reviews of the shit games Nintendo and Sony shit out.
I'll cry all I want to about how your generation killed gaming, kid. Deal with it.

>>8258252
>the point of playing fighting games is against other people,
Wrong zoomie.

>>8259079
>Gee, I wonder why the Saturn failed?
Because Sega's model of offering bare bones downgraded arcade ports was never an attractive option.

>>8259075
they don't have any notable games, just ORIGINAL PORT DO NOT STEAL

most of the saturnfags here have already admitted they bought the trash heap 10+ years after release and/or can't figure out how to use emulators

>>8259075
We do, but then you get console warring fanboys going into rage because they were told the system sucks and isn't supposed to have any good games. They then destroy the conversation with mental gymnastics as they try to say every good game being discussed for the system isn't good and doesn't count as a good game on the system for asinine reasons. This thread is a prime example of that.

>>8259103
>still not talking about its games
>still ignoring flaws
this thread is a prime example of reactionary fanboys wishing saturn don't be like it do

>>8259102
>they don't have any notable games
Shining Force III Trilogy
Panzer Dragoon Trilogy
GunGriffon 1 and 2
DragonForce 1 and 2
Legend of Oasis
Shining the Holy Ark
Bulk Slash
Burning Rangers
NiGHTS
Astal
Clockwork Knight 1 and 2
Magic Knight Rayearth
Albert Odyssey
Iron Storm
Fighter's Megamix
Grandia
Saturn Bomberman
Saturn Bomberman Fight
Solar Eclipse
Guardian Heroes
Silhouette Mirage
Dark Savior
Mass Destruction

I'd say those are all good notable games. And they're not Arcade ports either.
>most of the saturnfags here have already admitted they bought the trash heap 10+ years after release
I've had my Saturn since 1996.

>>8259103
don't argue with the sony fanboy m8, his sole purpose is you's
just ignore
he shitposts in every single thread

>>8259115
These threads literally play out like this:
>SATURN SUCKS!
>No it doesn't, it has plenty of good games going for it like these.
> THOSE DON'T COUNT BECAUSE THE SATURN WAS A FINANCIAL FAILURE!
> That's silly logic.
> OMG WHY DO YOU SATURN FANS KEEP TRYING TO SAY IT WASN'T A FAILURE?! WHY WONT YOU TALK ABOUT THE GAEMS?!
>Are you retarded?

Seriously are you retarded?

>>8259101
>never an attractive option
...to fucking nugamers attracted to style over substance SHIT.
To ACTUAL FUCKING GAMERS WHO CARED ABOUT GOOD GAMES? FUCK YES IT WAS.
Your generation killed actual gaming. The least you can do is go back to /v/ with your colleagues and circlejerk about the latest Call of fucking Duty or whatever other trash you love.

>>8259142
Never as in never ever. Look at the top selling games for consoles and PC since the dawn of time.

>>8259134
>Sony fanboy
I don't think actual PS1 fans are the demographic who are stuck in their childhood trying to still have console wars on the school playground.

>>8259138
>still not talking about games
>still ignoring flaws

>>8259157
>still not talking about games
Mentioned some of my favorites here >>8259131. I even went out of my way to avoid Arcade ports for you.
>still ignoring flaws
How many times must we discuss VDP1's issues with Transparencies? It's been discussed to death and doesn't really have any impact on what good games on the system are worth playing.

>>8259147
Just because a game isn't in the fucking top ten doesn't mean it's not popular, dumb kid.
Jesus fuck, you'll use any goddamn half-brained excuse to slam what you don't understand, won't you? I honestly think every single "gamer" these days should be forced to play only old games for a very long period of time and maybe see how fucking screwed up the N64 and PS1 was when it came out and changed gaming for the worse and how people who actually cared about GAMES were Saturn owners.

>>8259157
Any game mentioned is going to be shot down as shit by trolls like you, so why fucking bother?

>>8259168
>Just because a game isn't in the fucking top ten doesn't mean it's not popular, dumb kid.
The Saturn was literally such a flop it killed Sega's console business.

>>8259131
>I've had my Saturn since 1996
i notice you ignored the part about not knowing how to emulate

that's basically the same list of games posted multiple other times, i'd think such a small library of games would be able to generate more discussion about the games themselves than the same simple list over and over

maybe you should make a thread discussing saturn's 20 good games instead of fanboying in a thread that's asking for its flaws

>>8259165
>VDP1's issues with Transparencies
nobody gives a shit about this but autists

>>8259178
So you're going to continue to ignore the fucking reason I stated Saturn wasn't successful, you troll?
Your fucking shitty style over substance shill companies paying magazines to rate their shit games 10/10 was literally so fucking attractive to nugamers like you that you caused real games to die off. Fuck you and your entire generation.
>>>/v/

>>8259184
>style over substance
The Saturn flopped because of a lack of substance. Daytona USA has three tracks and one car.

>>8259179
>i notice you ignored the part about not knowing how to emulate
Because it wasn't worth discussing? I know full and well how to use an emulator. I use it as a tool all the time with homebrew and romhacking.
>that's basically the same list of games posted multiple other times
Just like the same list of N64 games that gets posted multiple times? It doesn't help when you write off half much of the library as not counting. We all know that if I mentioned anything like Thunder Force V, Street Fighter Alpha 3, Virtual On, Sega Rally, Radiant Silvergun, etc. you'd dismiss the entire list due to it having shmups and arcade ports in it.
>maybe you should make a thread discussing saturn's 20 good games instead of fanboying in a thread that's asking for its flaws
The only person fanboying is you. As for starting another thread why bother? You'll just go shit it up again like you always do because you can't stand people liking the Sega Saturn.

>>8259193
>Daytona USA has three tracks and one car.
The Saturn version actually has quite a few different cars that all handle very differently. You can also race as a Horse.

>>8259207
They're all just recolors of the same car with slightly different stats.

>>8259212
It's almost like it's an arcade game

>>8259184
>magazines to rate their shit games 10/10
if you ever cared about magazine ratings there was something wrong with your brain

ps1 and n64 both, individually, outshone saturn in every possible way
>people who actually cared about GAMES were Saturn owners
they sure as shit spent a lot of time caring about the possibility of more games being released for the saturn
n64 having no games is a meme, saturn had so few games it's not even funny in a troll debate

>>8259212
>Game themed after NASCAR has cars that are just different colors but have different stats!
It's almost like they're trying to imitate their source material or something...

>>8259216
Sold at full price on a console competing with other platforms that have games in the same genre with way more content.

>>8259205
You should really break that up, way too much imagination and defeatism for one post.
Maybe you've developed a tolerance in your time with the Saturn.

>>8259223
>it all comes back to how much it costs
jesus, be at least a little more subtle fanboy

>>8259228
The value just isn't there.

>>8259223
I wouldn't really say Ridge Racer had way more content. There you had 1 track and a handful of cars.

>>8259226
You really should seek some professional help to figure out why people on the internet liking the Sega Saturn causes you so much pain and anger.

>>8259237
>people who make fun of saturn's flaws must be hurt and angry
Oh, wow, you sure hit home with that one, Dr. Drew.
anyway...
You gonna talk about Saturn's flaws, discuss Saturn's games in depth, or keep deflecting?

I refuse to believe human hands typed the majority of these posts

>>8259247
>pointing out flaws
>I think it’s shit
Good job

>>8259235
Ridge Racer is the only other console racing game at the time as anemic when it comes to content.

>>8259249
>looking at two posts
>ignoring rest of thread
great job

>>8259259
Correct

>>8256014
>looked in the mirror

>>8259247
>You gonna talk about Saturn's flaws
It's flaws have been discussed to death. Which one in particular do you want to discuss again?
>discuss Saturn's games in depth
I already gave you a list of some of my favorites. Which one do you want to discuss in depth?
>>8259256
>Ridge Racer is the only other console racing game at the time as anemic when it comes to content.
It's literally the only racing game on the PS1 to directly compare to Daytona USA at the time.

>>8251563
It literally lacks 98% of the best games that era. It's a waste of money if you enjoy any genres other than shmups.
What good games it does have are either shallow, repetitive arcade style games, or inferior ports.
So... yeah

>>8261767
It has a pretty good selection of FPSes, RPGs, Fighting Games, Platformers, and strategy games.

>>8261779
Now how many of those games are either exclusive or better on the saturn?

>>8261823
For FPSes Powerslave is probably the only one definitvely best on Saturn. That said ones like Duke 3D aren't bad ports by any means.

For RPGs there's quite a few exclusives or definitive ones:
Albert Odyssey
Panzer Dragoon Saga
Shining the Holy Ark
Dark Savior
Grandia
Lunar Silver Star Story Complete
Magical School Lunar

For fighting games most are going to be arcade ports as that's where most of your fighting games come from. That said you still have some good exclusives like Fighter's Megamix and Guardian Heroes. Also a lot of those arcade ports end up having additional content that make them worth playing over the arcade versions. This is especially true for games like Street Fighter Alpha 3, Vampire Savior, etc. You also have some that are just still good ports worth playing like Dead or Alive, Virtua Fighter 2, and Virtual On.

For platformers, action, and adventure games you have exclusives like Astal, Clockwork Knight, Burning Rangers, NiGHTS, Shinobie Legions, Beyond Oasis, Magic Knight Rayearth, Linkle Liver Story, Princess Crown, etc. Then for definitive versions you have Megaman 8, Sonic 3D Blast, etc.

For Strategy games you have the Shining Force III Trilogy, Dragon Force 1 and 2, Wachenroder, Sakura Wars 1 and 2, Iron Storm, etc.

Honestly there's definitely enough games to justify having the system or emulating it.

>>8261857
>no Bulk Slash
cmon man

>>8261863
I'm tired and forgot? I listed it here >>8259131.

Sonic R was enough to make me get a Saturn, unironically. It looked so cool.

>>8261857
>fighting games
Asuka 120%

>>8251969
the eyes being buttons is fucking rad

>>8262180
Its inability to tell the difference between switches and buttons is fucking rad

>>8251563
sound.

unless you were some genious like Koshiro.

My top 10 Saturn games
1. Panzer Dragoon Saga
2. NiGHTS Into Dreams...
3. Shining Force III
4. Panzer Dragoon II Zwei
5. Guardian Heroes
6. Sega Ages: Outrun
7. Legend of Oasis
8. Burning Rangers
9. DragonForce
10. Saturn Bomberman

>>8255073
>Plus if you're playing over composite that part looks just fine
The Saturn has very clean composite so that doesn’t happen, you still get the checkerboard

>>8262180
They're switches for the shoulder buttons actually, but yeah this shit is sick.

>>8262419
Rude!

>>8262696
Saturn's composite is clean but not that clean. It dithering will still blend and look like a transparency.

This video is a composite capture:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovGomKnJSfE

Notice how the spotlights in the intro stage look transparent.

>>8264502
>Saturn's composite is clean but not that clean. It dithering will still blend and look like a transparency
I'm literally using one right now on composite
trust me it is extremely clean and there is no transparency

>>8264746
And I played my Saturn for years over composite with the official cables. Dithered transparencies blended just fine. Now S-Video and RGB didn't blend, but that's to be expected. Now some Saturns I've seen have severe rainbow banding with dithered transparencies, but I've never seen one have perfect looking meshes when using composite.

Again, you can see direct composite captures in this video showing proper blending going on at the 19 minute mark:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_OchOV_WDg&t=1150s

>>8264746
I can attest to one game where the dithering produces transparency on composite but a checkerboard on s-video: Gex. It's tail time mothertucker! The clouds in the cemetery appear transparent in composite but checkered on any other output.

>>8261767
>repetitive arcade games
Back to /v/ with you.

>>8251563
>coaxial only
>shitty 3D rendering
>too many processors
>everything available in its final run was in Japanese only
>its AAA titles were nothing compared to PS1's

>>8264818
>>8264836
playing powerslave right now on composite

>>8264854
isn't that just your crt's scanlines in the photo?

>>8264924
I'm going to assume you don't know what scanlines are

>>8264953
And I'm going to assume you don't know what a shadow mask is.

>>8265107
it is the arrangement of the phosphors on a VGA CRT monitor
now you

>>8265114
It's also used on CRT TVs. Your picture is so close to your TV that you can see it making it impossible to tell if you're seeing a dithered transparency or the shadow mask of your TV. Take a few steps back and try again. Or better yet, get a capture card.

>>8265139
My CRT uses a slot mask
stepping back does not change how the image is displayed
the saturn has cleaner composite than sega previous consoles and even the N64 and to get the blending you are talking about would need RF connection and fuck using that

>>8265149
You're confusing the shadow mask of your TV with dithering. Here's a direct capture of my Saturn over Composite. Notice that it blends properly.

>>8265254
>You're confusing the shadow mask of your TV with dithering
no I am not, whatever capture device you are using is terrible enough to make the image even more blurred than the actual output, in fact I'm willing to bet that it can't even capture 240p
it is also not a shadow mask, it is a slot mask and that has nothing to do with what is happening there

>>8265270
It's an Elgato Game Capture HD which the updates to support 240p over composite. On my CRT it looks mostly the same just with a little rainbow banding as you can see in the attached picture.

Why don't you try sitting at a more viewing distance to your TV and take a picture?

>>8265270
It's an Elgato Game Capture HD with the update to support 240p. On my CRT TV it looks mostly the same just with a little rainbow banding as you can see in the attached picture.

Why don't you try sitting at a more reasonable viewing distance before taking your next picture?

Is it possible to hate the console Liru has?

>>8265297
>try sitting at a more reasonable viewing
Mate, you’ve gotta stop with this meme

>>8265254
>lights can't overlap

>>8264502
that looks fantastic

>>8251563
Terrible hardware.
Underwhelming software.

Played Panzer Dragoon.

What a fucking boring ugly ass game. Literally one of the most overrated piles of shit I've ever played. What a joke

>see a cool interesting looking Saturn game
>Its Japanese only
>Repeat forever

Played Panzer Dragoon.

What a fucking beautiful game. Literally one of the most perfectly rated gems I've ever played. What a pleasure

>>8265683
I'm not the retard sitting so close to his TV that he can't tell the difference between phosphors and dithering.
>>8265707
Yeah, that's what happens with dithering.

>>8265838
Zwei is even better. Same amount of levels and stuff but the lore is more developed, the graphics are better and there’s branching paths and a level up system to encourage replaying. Fantastic game

>>8265838
Janky graphics and it's too hard

>>8266554
>I'm not the retard sitting so close to his TV that he can't tell the difference between phosphors and dithering
Clearly you are

>>8265835
I don't see a problem there.

>>8265835
I've found that if this happens enough times you eventually get bullied by the universe into studying Japanese

>>8251563
https://youtu.be/g3Fmi1P00lc

>>8267839
lol thanks anon

>>8252765
Even jap games suck ass, I don't wanna "play" a fucking VN

>>8267959
what a profoundly bitchmade response from anonymous

>>8267962
Saturn has no games beyond... uhh... panzer dragoon? and that fireman game? everything else is either a shitty port of a psx game or was ported to a better system

>>8268003
What about Shining Force III?

>>8268003
it's got plenty for me, the Sega retard. Sega Ages, the Virtua games, Sega Rally. I really love the Vampire Savior port too

>8268457
why

>>8265254
just embarassing

Never played Saturn ever as I couldn't emulate very well.

Literally discovering the library now. Fuck this system has some cool shit in it. Currently playing Psychic Ninja it's nuts. Have easily 20+ games I have downloaded I'm gonna check out. Most are 2D. Saturn was basically a superchsrged mega drive really. Pretty cool.

>>8268873
great game, my fingers were killing me by the end though

>>8268873
>Psychic Ninja
The backgrounds have that early 3D ugliness but the sprites aren't amazing either. And supposedly the visuals were the main appeal.

There are already a lot of Shinobi games to 1cc.

>>8256615
It's the only sonic game where the best gameplay is the Special Stage

>>8269327
this is sadly very true.

>>8254997
It was better on Dreamcast, though it's still a shitty game regardless. The only way to play light gun games is at the arcade and even then only the ones with haptic feedback. Playing at home with no recoil is gay

>>8269365
I was on the fence since I understand the appeal of arcade ports and genres, but someone claiming a lightgun game without a lightgun is better than THPS, just shows how contrarian these Saturnfags can be. THPS was good enough to be a real arcade game itself.

>>8251563
1. Expensive as fuck to buy.
2. Games are expensive as fuck to buy.
3. Because of these two factors, the only Saturn we have at my shop won't sell.

It hurts bros. It wasn't a bad system but its out of price range of so many.

>>8269935
I spent three days opening it up, cleaning the damn thing, replacing that battery, and making it look as fine as daisies, and for three months it has sat on my shelf.

>>8251563
It was a bitch to program for, and its double GPU chip system, although unique, was not exactly well suited for 3D thanks to a rushed implementation.

>>8269935
Where's your shop? I've been interested in picking one up to modify into a development console, since Saturn homebrew is something I want to tackle eventually.

>>8269971
Damn man. What did you actually end up playing?

>>8268873
>Saturn was basically a superchsrged mega drive really
Yes. The 32x was a slower Sega Saturn that lacked SH2 coprocessors.

Hypothetically, if Sega would return to the console market, what would they call their next console?

The Sega Neptune, since it went unused?
The Sega Dreamcast II, since that was their last console?
The Sega Earth, the long speculated name for many consoles?

I want some sort of wealthy mad scientist with too much free time on their hands to make a 16X so that I can play Genesis and Sega CD games on my Saturn. That would be cool.

>>8269242
But the shit that's happening is so weird and wonderful. Your fighting a giant bone spider, 30 seconds later you're fighting a giant skeleton burning down a village, a minute later your floating down the river fighting a gigantic frog and a minute later you're inside it's stomach fighting is stomach worms. Its crazy. Its hard. It rules.

>>8270007
Neptune or, hear me out: Jupiter.

DITHERING

TWO CPUs!

>>8270092
I would try it out but for some reason I can't find a dump at the usual places.

>>8270149

>>8270275
It’s on Archive

>>8270001
The 32X has the same dual SH2's as the Saturn, they're just clocked slower. What it lacks is all the other dedicated hardware and RAM. So no VDP1 or VDP2, no SCSP, no SCU DSP, etc. Everything you see and hear on the 32X is done through software.

>>8270615
I think it was inverse(a VDP chip and no SH2s.) Shows how much of a nut I am about the 32x.

>>8270709
But it's not the inverse. You can open up your own 32X and see the same dual SH-2s that are in your Saturn. The only thing the 32X VDP can do is draw 32000 colors to the screen. There's no support for polygons, sprites, backgrounds, etc. You have to do all of that in software on the SH-2s.

Why can't the Saturn play Sega-CD games? Why can't the Dreamcast play Saturn and SCD games?

>>8270768
Because it's completely different hardware that's completely incompatible.

>>8270780
But why did they make that decision

>>8270805
No one gave a shit about the Sega CD in Japan and considering how Sega of Japan stuck their fingers in their ears when it came to concerns from the western branch, they likely didn’t care. Plus it would’ve required either basing the hardware off the Sega CD which would make the console comically underpowered or spending more time and money on the system to make it compatible which Sega wasn’t prepared to do

>>8270805
For Saturn, they did it because the Megadrive was their fifth console in a row with backwards compatibility built into the chipset, this carried a lot of baggage, and they had a shitload of problems expanding it (the Sega CD and 32x sucked so much because they forced the Megadrive to be expanded in ways it could not do). Also the Megadrive was selling extremely poorly in Japan while selling 10x more units abroad, so it hurt their pride a lot.
So they went for a clean break, axing the old thing entirely and creating a new architecture, that is also infinitely expandable (the Saturn cart slot has digital video and analog audio input, interrupts to every chip, almost every system clock exposed, etc).

For the Dreamcast, same reason really... Saturn was a bad decision on several levels, they wanted to axe it and bring out the new thing.

And backwards compatibility wasn't a big deal at that point.

How do you Homebrew a Saturn? It seems harder to do than the Dreamcast...

>>8270989
Read the documentation, try out some of the different libraries and tools:

https://antime.kapsi.fi/sega/docs.html
https://segaxtreme.net/
https://www.jo-engine.org/

>>8270727
I typo'd and meant to say "thought", my bad.
I don't own a 32x, that whole "32x nut" thing was just sarcasm.

>>8270805
Backwards compatibility is always a terrible idea. You only have a certain amount of silicon budget, supporting a previous console will make your current console less capable. Look at what backwards compat did to the genesis, had they not had to waste huge amounts of die space supporting the master system vdp, the genesis could have had 128 colors like it should have had.