/vr/ - Retro Games

>>8211214
tl;dr

Show me your A ranks first and maybe I'll take your spergout seriously

>>8211234
Based. Final Rush is easily the best stage in all of Adventure, and I'd argue that getting to the top of the area with vertical rails where you have to impulse yourself up in quick succession alone takes more mechanical skill than anything across all 2D Sonic games.

3D Sonic games have generally only gotten better, and they're still not that good. The Adventure games are bad, Heroes through to 06 is pretty bad too, but at least they don't force treasure hunting down your throat. Unleashed and onwards are actually kind of okay.
People's obsession with holding up the Adventure games as any kind of peak of quality is very strange. I mean, the soundtracks are pretty good, I guess. I kind of like how campy and stupidly earnest the writing is. But they're not good.

>>8211243
I just beat the level, and the last spring right before the end of the level is a fucking joke lol. This game seems like it’s ready to break at any moment. It’s gameplay is the choppiest shit ever. The Sonic level was better than Shadow’s

>>8211234
Only a speed would have A ranks in this 3/10 game

>>8211249
I think SA2 is only fun in the following
>City Escape and maybe two more stages of Sonic or Shadow
>Multiplayer races, although the bullshit attacks kinda leave a taste of piss in the mouth

>>8211254
SA2 is literally buttery smooth and responsive. Its one of the best spectacle platformers of that decade. It's pretty obvious that you're a retarded sperg because the only games breaking by the seams are Heroes and Shadow, some of the buggiest and least polished 3D Sonic games.

>>8211273
You’ve never played the GameCube versions. At least you can get through the game relatively swiftly in comparison. Buttery smooth and responsive? Yeah, it’s so responsive when the
>Camera switches randomly all the time
>The automatic boosts into rails sometimes sends you to death
>those green things Shadow spins on in Final Rush
I get that you’re a turbo sonic fanboy, but this game is just choppy and unpolished as fuck. Looking back, Heroes is too, but not nearly as much. Not to mention, shit like Mad Space is the most shitty level design I’ve ever encountered in years. One of the emerald pieces was found by my own eyes alone. The signal wasn’t even ringing whatsoever. Just saying I have no idea why people regard this as a top 3 sonic game, let alone quite possibly the best. It’s horribly designed.

>>8211289
Calm down sperg. I just think you're terminally retarded for trying to claim that the most polished 3D Sonic game is worse than some of the least polished games in the series.

I get it, it's your first playthrough and you're frustrated that you keep getting low ranks and you haven't mastered the movement tech yet. It's a style-based game, you're meant to replay it and gradually get better at it as you find shortcuts and better techniques. You don't become a master at it immediately. Settle down and don't take your frustration out on /vr/.

>>8211214
Final Rush is the second best Sonic level behind the beta version of Windy Valley

Ah, weekly Adventure threads.

It's fun how OP thinks Heroes and Shadow are better when they have the exact same amount of bullshit, just in different form.
Heroes wants you to deal with its wonky controls, railway levels, casino, and Chaotix missions, and Shadow is full of bad level design decisions.

I like all three games though, despite their flaws.

>>8211325
Shadow is more polished. Ever rail grind in that? You’re the retard here. Almost every level in SA2 is a pain in the ass whether it’s bad camera or janky as fuck controls or level design

>>8211289
I had more fucking issues with SADX in one hour of play than with 100 hours of SA2B where literally the only major bug I had was getting stuck on the fence right before the truck in City Escape. Literally git gud

>>8211351
Nah, Sonic Heroes is a straight forward platformer. SA2 has shit like Mad Space

Shadow is better because, although the Ark levels are aids. The rest of the game is not unintentionally difficult from shitty camera work, or throwing you into an unreasonable death every 2 minutes. This is a game where you need Stockholm syndrome to get it.

>>8211362
Rail grinding in Shadow is fucking horrible. It's not physics-based and you have to mash to go fast or you slow down immediately. Rail switching is more consistent, but only because the entire thing is scripted. You don't have to use the rail switch in SA2, just jump off and bounce bracelet onto the next rail to preserve full speed.

>>8211363
Dude, the last portion of the game is a mess

>Mad Space is the most random hope for the best bullshit ever
>Final Rush is good on the ground parts, but when he spins on those floating platforms, the game gets so choppy and unpredictable
>Sonic fight after that consists of a camera that keeps reversing as you mindlessly homing attack Sonic a hundred times.
The adventure games are sloppy as fuck. The game spazzes out constantly and shows that Sega really rushed this stuff. Compare this to the polish of Mario 64 and even Sunshine. Dear lord. Not only are these games horribly flawed, but short too.

Just gonna leave this. I want you to ponder the thought of the average person who plays video games, but never Sonic Adventure, try this out for a play through. They would notice the jank immediately and the only reason you defend it is because you warped your expectations of this game based off of nostalgia and hours dedicated to it. Come on now. You know I’m right with this take at the very least

>>8211375
>Mario 64
>fucking sunshine
>polished
Ok now you're just shitposting. Are we just going to pretend like early 3D mario didn't have collision issues and camera jank?

>>8211380
Yep, thread is a confirmed shitpost thread. Pack it up boys, 10/10 bait made me reply. Now go back to /v/

>>8211371
Bro, I pressed up while on the rail in SA2 and Shadow just flew right off. It’s way too delicate here. Shadow has the smoothest rail grinding. Idk what you’re talking about.

>>8211382
Nah, I’m not baiting. Did those games age? Yes. I’m saying compared to 3D Sonic, Mario is a fucking Swiss Army knife.

Defend this section if you recognize it. I Can’t move the camera at all to see where to go, and touching the green causes death.

>>8211418
Thanks for confirming you're a fucking retard. Thread promptly invalided.

>>8211367
> Sonic Heroes is a straight forward platformer
> find 10 hermit crabs
> collect 200 rings by random chance in casino
> collect 10 casino chips you can easily miss
> find Eggman's underpants
> find 100 torches
> solve 20 switch puzzles
> run past giant frogs stealthily
> fight stupidly overpowered enemies
> straight forward

>>8211423
>Soulnic Hersouls is a soulfully forward platformer
>find 10 hermit souls
>collect 200 souls by random chance in casoulno
>collect 10 casoulno chips you can easily miss if you're soulless
>find Soulman's undersoul
>find 100 torches to guide the soulless to the light
>solve 20 soul soulezz
>run past giant frogs soulfully
>soulfully soul soulful oversoul soul
>straight soul
This is all I gather from your post.

>>8211421
I made it past it. Doesn’t mean it isn’t terribly executed, faggot

>>8211423
Fair enough. I always forgot about Chaotix. However, it at least let’s you decide when to play that section, and isn’t too frustrating.

>>8211436
That's as much soul as you'll get in Adventure 2 and specifically Final Rush level.

Defend this part. I dare you. This is the tedious as fuck.

Holy fucking shit that Knuckles part where they want you to swim for switches just made me drown because they didn’t even allow access to any oxygen at one point. Maybe if the camera actually worked I could look around, but as it’s my first playthrough, how the hell would I know where to find it? Wasn’t in plain sight by any means. Well, that was my final life. What the fuck is wrong with this? I get it if you like feeling anxiety and buggy messes, but not me. I’m done for the night.

>>8211481
Hint: Knuckles can get an item upgrade which allows you to stay underwater as much as you want. It's hidden very well in one of his earlier levels.

>>8211481
You're making anti-Adventure fags look more embarassing than they already are. Keep up the good work.

>>8211486
Ah, well I should be able to still beat the game without it, right? Not even being a smartass, but actually concerned at this point lol

>>8211489
Bro you act all high and mighty, but pop this shit in for any average gamer and they realize that it takes hours to get a handle on this messy fucking game. This game is a disgrace to Sonic 1-3

>>8211498
Yes, you can beat the game without it (I think I did that on my first playthrough because I didn't even know the upgrade existed), but it's incredibly useful for this final level. Without it, the only thing you can do is actually git gud and master the swimming controls.

>>8211481
ive never drowned there

>>8211514
If only the swimming didn’t have drowning after 20 seconds of being underwater, and had actual swimming movements like Mario 64. Knuckles is so damn slow underwater

>>8211461
>Climb pillars to activate a switch
>Activate a grand total of 2 correctly timed time-stop switches to activate another switch
>Go back and activate the main switch
Switch switch switch switch aside, It takes little over a minute if you know what you're doing, it's not that bad. Knuckles's water section after that is worse, especially without the gear.

>>8211214
>Alright, Heroes and Shadow is better than this clusterfuck.

I don't see how lol.

Sonic Adventure 2's biggest issue is the nigh-incomprehensible, batshit story, but here's the thing- Heroes and Shadow just have horrible stories, so they don't come out better in this comparison.

On the gameplay and level design front Heroes/Shadow tend to be pretty dire. SA2 by comparison is still satisfying to play and the levels are frequently engaging.

Honestly even the shooting and treasure hunting stages are more fun and better designed than anything in Heroes or Shadow the Hedgehog.

>>8212648
Shadow and Heroes are closer to being a Sonic game. The mech stages are the most mindless shit ever where you literally spam b to win. Engaging my ass

>>8212797
Shadow and Heroes not having the treasure hunting and shooting stages do not actually make them closer in this case. Not when that core structure is constantly undermined with bullshit. I'd argue these games are a fundamental perversion of what a 3D Sonic should be.

also you wouldn't be complaining about the mech stages being mindless if you were going for good ranks

>>8212814
>Going for good ranks
I just naturally play through the game. Not into hunting that.

Also, Shadow and Heroes is closer in the sense that you're racing through levels from point A to B. Both games have collecting, but in Heroes case it's only 25% of the game, and in Shadow's case it allows you to have the choice of which ones you would like to do. You can still have the option to do neutral missions

Being a Sonic fan in the 2000s was so rough that you now have to pick which of the buggy, sloppy platformers (whose 'best moments' people seem to agree on just happen to be literal autopilot segments) are the ones responsible for the series' downfall, as if they aren't all following the same floaty zero-playtesting gameplay paradigm anyway. Condemn them all, stop being an inconsistent coward trying to make one or the other a "lost true way" in your head that it absolutely is not.

>>8211214
>>8211254
>>8211289
>>8211362
>>8211367
>>8211375
>>8211380
>>8211387
>>8211389
>>8211418
>>8211436
>>8211449
>>8211461
>>8211481
>>8211498
>>8211534
>>8212797
>>8212839
>>8213262
Who let the schizo out

>>8211214
i like adventure 1 and heroes, adventure 2 is meh, and shadow i will never take seriously

>>8212648
Gonna have to disagree with you. SA2 has child murder, terrorism, and Eggman pointing a realistic gun at Amy's head. The entire story of Heroes is "we have to stop Eggman" and then suddenly "we have to stop Metal Sonic". Aside from the "real superpower of teamwork" line being one of the most embarrassing things I've ever heard, Heroes doesn't do anything too absurd to drive it into "horrible" territory. Shadow, yeah, that game took SA2's edginess and ramped it up. But Heroes is so straightforward and inoffensive that there's nothing to really hate about it unless you hate how plain it is

>>8213494
this

>>8211489
>anti-Adventure fags
This is the mind of the Adventure fanboy. They have to invent some shadowy cabal of "dissenters" because they can't deal with the fact that these games aren't very good, and a lot of people who play them come to that conclusion.

>>8214050
You're either high IQ or you're low IQ. You're the latter.

>>8214050
and then you lump the people who didn't like them under one umbrella, welcome antifag

>>8214059
That was a very high IQ post.

>>8214064
What are you trying to say?

>>8214071
'touche antifag

>>8214074
You have schizophrenia.

>>8214067
Yes I know. Keep in mind that the bar for comprehending my post was purposefully low so that you can understand it. Considering the fact that you got filtered by Adventure 2... I'm going to have to adjust my speech patterns so that it's comprehendable by people with <125 IQ.

>>8214102
I didn't get "filtered". I played it when I was 10, and was actually stupid enough to like it back then. It's just not good.

>>8214114
It's OK to be low IQ. Keep in mind that 100 IQ is the population average, so a 90 IQ individual such as yourself isn't far off. You can still contribute to society if you try hard enough.

>>8214118
Repeatedly insisting that you have a high IQ because you can get A-ranks in Sonic Adventure 2. Is really sad. I don't know what to tell you.

>>8214123
Look, I know you're in the coping stages right now. I get it, it's hard to hear that your IQ is below the world average. But do not fret! All hope is not lost. It may sound corny, but hard work can get you through a lot. Genetically predispositioned intelligence is not the end-all-be-all.

>>8214130
Okay, I'll be playing Robo Blast 2 mods. You have fun with your Rouge A-ranks.

>>8214019
Heroes' story is plain but what makes me hate it is that it's careless. Shadow's return is glossed over (with a particularly baffling reaction from Sonic) and Knuckles is tagging along for no explained reason. Big teamed up with Amy and Cream because fuck it, they need a bulky power character, just throw him in, who cares

and yeah it's hard for me to get over those voices and cutscenes.

>>8215573
I guess that's a good point. I was too focused on the actual contents of the story, when you consider Heroes is a followup to SA2 yeah it's absolutely abysmal

>>8215573
I remember that at one point of game, Shadow says something like "Yo, that's cool!" and it always made me cringe, because it so out of his character. Although he says "I'm the coolest" in SA2 and it also sounds so fucking out of place.

>>8211214
Come on OP, Heroes and Shadows are held together by duct tape

>>8216440
>The buggy gameplay of the adventure games aren't

>>8216451
there's no buggy gameplay in adventure 1 or adventure 2

>This game is just bad overall and has only about 30% worth of enjoyable parts.
This describes the first Sonic Adventure as well. And the series was downhill from there.

>>8211214
>This game is just bad overall and has only about 30% worth of enjoyable parts.
This describes the first Sonic Adventure as well. And the series was downhill from there.

>>8211289
>Heroes is too, but not nearly as much.
This. Heroes is actually fluid compared to the twitchy anime shit of SA1/2. The problem is the gameplay in Heroes is fundamentally boring. It literally feels like autopilot the entire time. If it was actually nuanced like S3K it would have been the only good 3D Sonic game officially.

>>8211423
No one said Chaotix was good. But like >>8211449 Said it's optional unless you wanted to 100% the game. But you can just go online to see how dogshit the final boss is so it's not worth it

Seriously Egg Emperior is such a great final boss fight compared to Metal Madness I don't understand how they fucked it up.

>>8211481
Oh nice, another victum of the "missed the air necklace upgrade in the most out the way to find it area in Aquatic Mine" club

>>8211498
>Ah, well I should be able to still beat the game without it, right?
You can, but it's bullshit without it. Just go back to Aquatic Mine to get the upgrade and then redo the final act.

>>8211214
>Alright, Heroes and Shadow is better than this clusterfuck.
Hi DarksydePhil!

>>8216872
>Heroes is actually fluid
What alternative universe did you come from? Anything involving speed is slippery, and the gameplay is constantly interrupted by forced combat encounters. There's nothing fluid about Heroes at all. Don't even get me started on the shitty bosses and the entirety of Team Chaotix

>>8211289
>Shadow
>Final Rush
you mean Final CHASE

>>8211380
>the jank
play the Dreamcast conversion mod for SA1 you fucking retard

>>8211418
You’re not supposed to go to the bottom, retard
You’re supposed to hover onto a moving cube

>>8216930
Anon, you're talking to the same person who thinks Heroes and Shadow are the most polished games in the series, you're yelling at deaf ears at this point. Just abort the thread.

>>8211461
JUST CLIMB YOU ABSOLUTE MONG
this is literally the shortest segment

>>8216368
I don’t remember a line like that in Heroes

>>8216920
>What alternative universe did you come from?
The same one where Sora got into Smash Bros?
Heroes literally has no movement issues Sonic wise in a game about momentum. The problems with that game gameplay wise to most people are completely surface level, and not actually elements of "bad gameplay" but flawed execution in terms of representation.

For example, the "slipperiness" of the characters is all thanks to the running animation not looking convincing enough. See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxCcHOvSVJQ to get some insight on this
Second, the gameplay's lack of traditional features from the classic era games creates a dissonance of muscle memory being tangled with because you want to play it like the classics, but you can't because it changed the gameplay up, leaving old fans blueballed of its gamefeel. But outside of this, the game still has every flow into everything just fine, EXCEPT for one oversight, which is when Tails or any flight character loses flight power, which causes them to stop all momentum and fall without any horizontal control to speak of, and when you're about to run off a ledge, the game jerks you to a complete stop, just to end up falling off anyway because exiting out that animation is impossible as it locks your controls, making you promptly fall off the stage regardless. That and the fucking railswitching.

But just from the core gameplay itself that is Sonic's, it's the smoothest the series had ever been up to Unleashed/Gens since you actually get more control moving sideway than you do during boosting gameplay. The problem that makes Heroes this "black sheep" of the series is because it panders to no one properly. Adventurefags aside the game wants to be classic Sonic, but lacks any of the nuanced gameplay classic Sonic had to make the gamefeel of heroes worth playing though. It's like the Kirby of Sonic games. Too streamlined. Too straightforward. Too safe. Had it been S3K in all but in 3D, it would have been better.

>>8216597
Just stop. You're delusional.

>>8216915
Who?

>>8217013
Show me some clips and proof where the games are bugging out

>>8216930
SA1 on Dreamcast is okay. This thread criticizes SA2, you fucking mouthbreather.

>>8216934
Yeah, that's so easy when the camera can't move, and the blocks are quickly sending you to death. I beat it, but it's bullshit.

>>8216935
I've only played the 3D games up to Sonic 06. Shadow is by far the most polished of them. I said Heroes is more fluid than SA2. It's still flawed.

>>8216937
That's easy. The rest was fucked

>>8216947
That anon misremembered it from memory, the actual quote is "Yo, that's cool NIGGER"

>>8217071
>Shadow is by far the most polished of them.

>>8217052

>>8217052
Just play Final Chase and see Shadow spaz the fuck out on those rotating green platforms. It always happens as he's at the end of it. Especially horrible on the final one right before the goal ring.

>>8217086
That's not a bug. You just suck.

>>8217081
Based.

I once completely clipped through the ground in City Escape, falling through purgatory.

>>8217091
Oh piss off. He becomes an epileptic mess

>>8217101
Show some clips where the game becomes an epileptic mess instead of pulling shit out of your ass. You either suck (mostly likely) or you're just a disingenuous shitposter (probably both.)

>>8217071
>Yeah, that's so easy when the camera can't move, and the blocks are quickly sending you to death.
A rising block you lamebrain

>>8217107
I don't record myself playing lol. Go watch a youtube video of a non pro playing through the stage, spergboy

>>8217130
OK so you have no proof then? Glad we settled that.

>>8217043
https://youtube.com/watch?v=G7NBmFrwKvU

>>8217130
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mt0CxQI0MiU

so.... where's the epileptic mess?

>>8217148
>Posts a pro playing it
I'm talking about the average guy going through this game. When I played, Shadow was tweaking out from me pressing up or down (depending on the direction) on those rotating cylinders

>>8217142
Wow. Dante from Clerks is fucking dumb

>>8217161
He's not a pro, it's just an average no extra bullshit run of the stage. He gets a B rank.

I think you suck.

Never had the fall through the loop glitch. Maybe because I'm not a retard and do what the game wants you to do, push forward. Also Sonic Heroes and Shadow are some of the worst games in the franchise, both play like absolute ass and are far worse than 15 minutes in Mad Space. 2006 as a game is better than either of them. The real debate is Shadow v Heroes. Heroes plays worse, but has better aesthetics. 10 endings might actually be worse than playing all the Chaotix levels.

>>8217167
Nah, I can’t control Shadow spazzing out. I’m surprised it doesn’t show on that video. But when I say buggy, I’m not just talking visually. It feels buggy too.

>>8217220
>Nah, I can’t control Shadow spazzing out
Translation: "I suck"
>I’m surprised it doesn’t show on that video
Translation: "I'm surprised people with a normal functioning motor cortex exist"
>But when I say buggy, I’m not just talking visually. It feels buggy too.
This makes literally no sense, you said the game was an epileptic mess, now you're moving the goalpost over something intangible. What's next, are you going to say that Heroes and Shadow are "soulful"? Fuck off. Kill yourself.

>>8217238
It was buggy for me and all I pressed was up or down, you dribbling retard. Get it through your thick skull.

>>8217274
how are you even able to breathe, you're so retarded

>>8217281
The game is twitchy, buggy and an overall mess. Deal with it, Sonicfurfaggot

>>8217284
you must breathe manually or some shit, there's no way your brain has enough processing power to get through regular life

Good Sonic games:
1
2
3
S&K
CD
Bad Sonic games
the rest
You're welcome.

>>8217287
You’re the one that thinks Sonic Adventure 2 is defendable. What a little retarded window licker you are.

>>8213429
This was a hell of a schizo post to make, anon.

>>8217293
Bestselling 3rd party game on the GCN. Cope. Don't forget to exhale.

>>8217289
>CD
>good
bait and/or has never actually played a Sonic game

>>8217298
You don’t forget to exhale when you’re the one breathing in my farts in my thread, bitch.

>>8217298
NEWS FLASH: Nugamers love shit games on their baby consoles.

>>8217289
1 and CD are not good games. Adventure and Adventure 2 are.

>>8217305
I'm sorry you're an underaged sperg who likes trash like Sonic Adventure.

>>8217310
CD is actual trash. Sega CD owners praised the game and called it an "underrated masterpiece" back when the game was completely inaccessible outside of original hardware. Once the ports came out and people realized how shit the game is, they become real silent afterwards.

>>8217309
This is how you know someone is a brainwashed nugamer who has never experienced a world where actual fun games are celebrated and trash games are not.
Overhyped, paid reviewer shit like Super Mario 64, MGS, Half-Life, and Halo sure fucked you kids up, didn't they?

>>8211214
git gud.

>>8217324
>Super Mario 64, MGS, Half-Life, and Halo
All good games. So is Sonic Adventure 1 & 2. CD is shit though, keep coping.

>>8217338
Sonic Adventure 2 has mindless mech levels where you spam b, speed levels where only half of them are actually fun, and the overly tedious miserable pieces of shit known as the jewel hunting stages. I get it if you’re a chaofag, but this game isn’t good. It’s 4/10 at the very best.

>>8217348
>Sonic Adventure 2 has mindless mech levels where you spam b
They're score attack levels. You can mindlessly spam in countless other games and get a shit score, but I guess it doesn't count when Sonic is doing it.
>speed levels where only half of them are actually fun
That's just your opinion man. Have you tried practicing them? Many of them are far more skill-dependent than most of the classic games.
>the overly tedious miserable pieces of shit known as the jewel hunting stages.
You can beat most of them in one minute. The only shit one is the pyramid one.
>I get it if you’re a chaofag
I've never actually used the chao garden outside of emblem collecting

>>8217360
You’ve never played Mad Space. And whether or not most of them might take a minute for you to beat because you’ve poured hours into this game, is it really fun? Ask yourself that.

>>8217373
>And whether or not most of them might take a minute for you to beat because you’ve poured hours into this game
Steam claims I have 26 hours in the game. Have you tried not being retarded? The radius for the radar is pretty generous. The treasure stages are the easiest to A rank due to how quick they are.

>>8217379
>26 hours into a 8 hour game at best
And you also said you don’t like the chao garden, so you can’t even use that as an excuse. What a fucking slow dipshit you are.

>>8217393
I didn't say I didn't like the chao garden, I just said I never got invested in it like other SA2 players.
>What a fucking slow dipshit you are.
The only slow dipshit here is you considering you get filtered by the fucking babymode treasure hunting stages. They even put hints for people like you.

>>8217408
Most people agree they’re a tedious slog aside from Pumpkin hill, you mindfucked fanboy.

>>8217324
Boomer, actually.

>>8217412
>Most people agree they’re a tedious slog aside from Pumpkin hill
Who are these "most people" that you frequently talk to? Fucking schizo.

>>8217412
Actually this has been debunked. I can confirm that most people either enjoy or are ambivalent towards the treasure hunting stages.

>>8217419
Go look at any review on the game maybe? Holy shit, you’re oblivious to the common perception on this game.

>>8217430
The game has a 89 on metacritic and an 8.5 user score.

>>8214118
>100 IQ is the population average
more white people really believe this eurocentric racist crap. IQ was standardized on european whites. 100 is not the global average, its far less than that. 90 IQ is still very smart from a global perspective.

>>8217362
Spinning endlessly around an enemy in SA2 is pure soul

>>8217481
yes, you're very smart tyrone.

>>8217481
>IQ was standardized on european whites. 1
And the irony is they were the only culture on the planet to not understand what basic hygiene was for over 400 years straight. Some high IQ they had.

>>8217437
So did Goldeneye, Donkey Kong 64, and the first Starfox game.

>>8217501
All good games. What's your point?

>>8217502
They’ve all been exposed as being dated and boring

>>8217508
Exposed by who?

I enjoy the jank

>>8217519
Go on youtube

>>8211249
>Unleashed and onwards are actually kind of okay.
Yeah I love boosting through 3 lanes on flat roads

>>8217527
What's on youtube? Did your favorite eceleb MasterChief117 make an exposé on why OLD GAME BAD for millions of views?

>>8217529
Those games always felt like roller coasters

>>8217527
how old are you?

>>8217541
Everyone talks shit about them. And no, I don’t just follow their opinions. But I’ve seen at least a few diss those games, and the comments didn’t disagree. I’ve played them all.

>>8217550
21. You?

>>8217556
You're too young to browse this board. You need to go back.

>>>/v/
>>>/y/outube

>>8217545
They suck
They are as auto-pilot as the haters accuse early 3d sonic of neing

>>8211214
Adventure 2 is an absolutely unfun chore for like 80% of the game. What's even worse is that the artistic direction feels nothing like Sonic, more like what if Sonic came to the real world.

>>8211214
Adventure 1>every other 3d sonic

>>8218527
Adventure 1 was actually trying to be a 3D Sonic game.

>>8211214
SA2 isnt perfect. its objectively better than SA1 in controls and glitches, but its still not perfect. that being said, heroes is an absolute fucking mess in design, controls, AND construction. i dont recall shadow being functionally bad, just a "bad game" conceptually, so i'll grant you that one. but heroes? heroes is fucking garbage. its like taking a step backwards towards SA1. SA2 has a handful of janky moments, some awkward camera angles, and dumb boss fights. but its never as straight up fucking BROKEN as heroes, and the design variety is so much more enjoyable than the snoozefest of heroes gameplay. in both game construction, design, AND functionality, heroes is significantly below SA2. is SA2 perfect? fuck no. but pretending that heroes is somehow better is just retarded. kill yourself sperg. also git gud, the game isnt that hard.

>>8211387
>bro i pressed a direction while on a rail, which tells my character to move/lean in that direction, and i fell off. wtf?
imagine being this retarded. theres literally balance/positioning on rails in this game. ignoring that and just doing what you feel like isnt the game's fault.

>>8211375
>mad space
mad space isnt hard. i dont know why people latch onto it like its some kind of cancer.
>when he spins on those floating platforms, the game gets so choppy and unpredictable
what the FUCK are you playing on? i've literally never had that issue or seen others have that issue in watching playthroughs.
>as you mindlessly homing attack Sonic a hundred times.
good job playing the fight wrong then, retard. its your own fault.

>>8218564
>SA2 isnt perfect. its objectively better than SA1 in controls and glitches
SA2 has much worse controls than the first.

>SA2 has a handful of janky moments
SA2 is massively fucked by the camera. I get they were trying to eliminate camera issues by forcing players into one they thought worked, but it only ended up backfiring spectacularly, shit was way worse than the glitchiness of the first you could still work your way around.

SA2 is a stiff and unfair piece of shit thanks to the godawful camera.

>>8216973
the "slipperiness" has nothing to do with animations, dipshit. you're fucking retarded if you think its actually responsive, smooth, locks on properly, and flows well without issue. you're just being willfully ignorant.

>>8217412
false. much like >>8217424 said, nobody really gives a shit. the only gripes i EVER fucking see are
>retarded complaining that you have to do emeralds in order, and the radar doesnt do all 3 at once.
>pyramid stage sucks (objectively true)
>mad space sucks (baddies being bad. traversing between the areas is quick and easy)
the only praise pumpkin hill gets is for the music.
again, they can all be done in like 1-2 minutes

>>8217545
>>8217574
honestly, i think that they should embrace that more. put more obstacles in the way so that skilled play makes it look like a fluid autoscroller. less tedious platforming, more precise jumps and direction choices during speed stuff. pepsiman.

>>8218586
>SA2 has much worse controls than the first.
this is objectively proven false, so you really dont have an excuse other than willful ignorance and hatred.
>camera
yes there are a number of bad camera moments, especially if you go slow, or try to explore. however, if you actually just go where you need to go, there really arent that many moments of it.
>stiff and unfair
no, you're just an objectively terrible player. the game really isnt that hard, and certainly not as broken as you're trying to make it out to be. rough, yes, but not worthy of your tantrum, and certainly not more deserving than heroes. you're fucking retarded for thinking heroes is smoother/better. git gud.

>>8218612
>this is objectively proven false
Nope. First game controls are far better for every single playstyle.
>yes there are a number of bad camera moments
The camera is garbage you aren't allowed to fix, period. You'll never play this game with a single part where the camera is where you want it to be for the 3D not to be awkward/unoptimal shit.
>you're just an objectively terrible player
The camera in SA2 is hot, hot garbage that always make it hard to see things properly.
>and certainly not more deserving than heroes
Heroes allows you to move the camera without reseting it to devs choice the second you move.
>you're fucking retarded for thinking heroes is smoother/better
Heroes has a far better grip at 3D than Adventure 2, and that's because SA2 is fucking awful with its camera.

>>8218621
>Nope.
congratulations. you're willfully ignorant. you've essentially stated "2+2=5" and think that you've stated something correct.
>You'll never play this game with a single part where the camera is where you want it to be
... you seriously expect people to take you seriously when you blow shit this far out of proportion? you're just being dishonest and throwing a tantrum dude. its pathetic. you're like an autistic kid SCREAMING and crying, covered in his own feces, naked, in the middle of a mall. its embarrassing to watch a human do this.
>Heroes allows you to move the camera without reseting it to devs choice the second you move.
and this doesnt actually redeem the mess that heroes is. at all.

you're just throwing a tantrum that is based on willful ignorance and personal failure because you're a shit player. just kill yourself already, dude.

Nigga, Sonic Adventure 2 is not worse than fucking Shadow the Hedgehog.

You are fucking 4 years old.

>broken/bad element of game
>"durr its soul xdddd"
All of you dilate
>>8217289
This

>>8218817
Who are you quoting?

>>8218589
>the "slipperiness" has nothing to do with animations, dipshit
Keee coping nigger. It clearly is since that's the definition of slipperiness. People said the same shit towards SRB2 and again, the animation contributes to people thinking that stupid shit.

>>8218612
>yes there are a number of bad camera moments, especially if you go slow, or try to explore. however, if you actually just go where you need to go, there really arent that many moments of it.
A shit game is a game that forces you to play in one way. The only good games in life are games that considers how players want to play them. That's why shit like Forces is dogshit but any other game like Mario Odyressy, Spyro, Rayman or even fucking non platformers like Minecraft or TF2 are far more loved compared to Sonic games. Stop defending SEGA's trash with "b-b-but if you just play it like the devs THINK you should play it!..." it makes you look like a sheeple weebcuck

>>8219246
Not that anon, but you really tried to spin a single sentence out of context huh.

There's plenty of freedom in both SA1's gameplay and SA2's gameplay. You're not confined within a script, you have multiple paths, multiple ways to use the physics to your advantage to find shortcuts and spindash skips. There are plenty of moments in the game where SA2 encourages you to jump off of a supposedly ""scripted"" loop-de-loop to reach a platform, such as the ones in Metal Harbor and Green Forest. The levels you're sperging about ITT, Final Rush and Final Chase, have even more freedom to reach different platforms just through skill and player freedom.

Purposefully going slow and trying to treat SA2 like a point-and-click game is not player freedom, it's just player retardation. That's like playing Mario without jumping and complaining when the game doesn't function as intended. That's like playing Mega Man and complaining that the game doesn't function as intended when you refuse to shoot things. You are retarded, simple as. Just accept it and move on.

>>8218665
OP here. That isn’t even me lmao. That just shows you how other people find this game an unfair chore. It’s beatable, but it’s choppy as fuck and held together by duct tape

>>8219246
That’s actually a really good point. The game just forces you to adapt to it’s unnatural flow. Nothing about it feels comfortable. It’s always a fight with the controls, and also keeps you on edge for unnecessary death due to terrible game design. Anyone that adapts to this has Stockholm syndrome, and is wearing rose tinted goggles.

>>8219307
>There's plenty of freedom in both SA1's gameplay and SA2's gameplay.
Not with that dogshit camera killing you through loops and shit

Look at it like this, Utopia, GT, Spark 3, etc, doesn't yeet the player into the void just because I didn't hold up on a loop. Good programing would just treat any surface the same way control wise, if I'm 180 degrees upside on the loop, my controllers shouldn't magically invert. But that's what happens in SA1/2 in beta footage, hense why they automate it because the devs can't program for shit

And that's just part of the issues. The point is SA1/2 only "works" in a vacuum. All the fancy shit games like Mario 64 can do can't be done in a game as poorly made as SA1/2.

>>8219467
This is every fucking Adventure era game. SA1, SA2, Heroes, Shadow and fucking 06 are the worse examples of game feel I've ever dealt with. They are so blatantly "do as we say, not as you do" that it only could be explained with some kind of shake up with devs during this time because this mentality was not present during the classic era games. Hell I'd argue the least of these issues show up in Sonic 2 and S3K the most, making me believe it's thanks to SoA that kept out the limited dev only direction shit out of Sonic and gifted the idea that Sonic can be played however you want to they way it should be.

>>8219529
>The point is SA1/2 only "works" in a vacuum
There are plenty of examples of players using the freedom provided by SA1 and SA2 to get insane times. They don't work in a vacuum, they just work. Adventure games give you the player freedom to go along with the flow are use the mechanics provided to you. It literally isn't any different than SM64's philosophy, the only difference is nu-mario is a collectathon and nu-sonic is a spectacle platformer like its classic iterations. It's not the game's fault that you don't engage with its mechanics outside of holding forward, the point of player freedom is to trust that the player is able to come up with their own strategies.

>>8211418
I always cheesed this part by walking on the cube spawner edges.
that's honestly what made this game fun.

>>8211461
brainlet detected

OP:
>Adventure 2 is a scripted autopilot game with no player agency
Also OP:
>I can't beat Final Chase because demands too much from me mechanically

At least stay consistent with your narrative...

>>8218527
SA1 actually had platforming and exploration. SA2 cranked the automated sections and linear level design up by a large margin to eventually build up to the "rollercoaster with a hedgehog" games we have now.

>>8219452
if its actually 2 people, then its just some degenerate basement troll that thought shitposting would be fun. zero supporting evidence to all of the baseless claims.

>>8219590
i don't know what he's talking about anyway. iirc most segments in final chase still just involve holding forward and jumping despite the gravity. after mad space it felt like a breeze

>>8219590
I never said it's completely autopilot. The boosts are, and will fuck you over

>>8219597
You're the degenerate liking this furshit anime game

>>8219467
>forcing you to adapt to ITS unnatural flow
>going where you ACTUALLY NEED to go is smooth and fine
>complaints in this thread are about being bad and going places that are unnecessary.
oh yeah, you've got a rock solid point there. oh wait, the opposite.

>>8218596
>again, they can all be done in like 1-2 minutes
The fact that you make that argument kind of exposes the fact that the stages suck. It's like saying prostate exams are fun, because they're over quickly. If you liked the levels, you'd want them to go on forever.

>>8219592
>SA1 actually had platforming and exploration.
>exploration
this is always the absolute dumbest fucking argument. what exploration? what are you going to "find"? your "exploration" in SA1 gives you nothing, and you still have to funnel in to the final goal. that "open space" is populated by nothing and by meaningless shit. the "automatic sections" are about the same length as sections in the genesis games, with more options and things to do during them, like switching rails for rings/points, killing enemies for points, or even things to jump to/through for points. SA2 still has sections of levels with multiple routes. sonic has never been about "exploration" like mario games, because sonic is primarily about getting from A to B, not collecting shit like mario.

>>8219620
>If you liked the levels, you'd want them to go on forever.
Literally no one wants a level to go on forever. You do realize that games can wear out their welcome, right? Not everything is a zoomer grindathon that tries to infinitely capture your small attention span with service-based games. I love classic Mega Man, but imagine how dull the game would be if the stages were twice the length and it had twice the robot masters and two-three Wily castles. You're argument is retarded.

>>8219635
There's a whole community of people out there who make classic style Sonic stages, because they do enjoy that gameplay so much they want it to continue forever. How many people are making SA style treasure hunting stages?

>>8219620
when i first played, i had LOADS of fun exploring around the treasure hunting stages. and then you familiarize yourself with how to get around them and between points of interest. and then you go for score, which is directly tied to time, and you figure out where the emeralds can spawn and what the likely places to head towards when your radar goes off are. are you going to beat them in 1-2 minutes the first time? extremely doubtful. but it CAN reliably be done, and most CHILDREN dont have a problem learning that. if you're just a fucking retard, then you're just a fucking retard.

>>8219639
>There's a whole community of people out there who make classic style Sonic stages, because they do enjoy that gameplay so much they want it to continue forever.
Nice goalpost shift. Fangame/romhack =/= doubling the length of a stage because you think there isn't enough content in 1-2 minutes. Fuck off, it's so obvious you're just a shitposter.

>>8219639
how many people are making 3d sonic speed stages? your argument is garbage.

>>8219646
My point is it's revealing of the fact that the stages aren't fun that you would even say that. Have you ever heard anyone say "stage 1 of Metal Slug is okay, you can beat it in two minutes". Such a thought wouldn't even enter your mind until you've accepted you're actually bored.
>>8219650
A few people, actually. Spark the Electric Jester. Project Rascal. There are some original stages for Generations floating around.

Can we all agree A1's Sonic story is more fun than A2's entire single player mode?

>>8219667
man you just keep moving the goalposts, despite people's arguments already shutting you down. you're so disingenuous. all you have is blind hate and zero logic to actually back it up. you're just a shitposter and shitty human being, lol. get a life, or just kill yourself dude. you're doing nobody any favors with your pointless crusade.

>>8219639
making a whole ass 3d level takes exponentially more effort than a 2d one not to mention the engine itself

>>8219639
>>8219694
also sonic worlds is a 3d fangame with treasure hunting missions in it lol

>>8219670
a2 sonic in a1's levels though

>>8219620
Fucking this. Tired of bitch ass mothrfuckers saying this shit to defend Big the Fat in SA1, a shit game never had bad content and just because it's "over quickly" doesn't make it a good thing at all, it enhances it's a bad thing because good things are shit you always want to keep playing with. Why do you think people can enjoy playing TF2 and Minecraft for hours on end? If they were shit games no one would defend them with "oh at least it was over in 2 mins".

>>8219690
The treasure hunting stages aren't fun, and you're far more emotionally invested in this than I am.

>>8219670
I like SA1's story more in general, but that might just be because I played SA1 when I was younger, and only got around to SA2 as an adult.

>>8219694
Robo Blast 2 has an active modding community (and basically no one making Adventure style treasure hunting stages)

>>8219723
>Why do you think people can enjoy playing TF2 and Minecraft for hours on end?
Found the MC/TF2 autist. Imagine stockholming yourself into liking a game with no point and a game abandoned by its devs. There's no way you're older than 19-20 tops.

>>8219743
You're obsessed with a bad Sonic sequel from 20 years ago. You don't have the high-ground here, when it comes to calling people autistic.

>>8219743
>Imagine stockholming yourself into liking a game with no point and a game abandoned by its devs.
Oh so like Sonic? Did you forget SA3 killed your series 15 years ago? Or were you just pretended to be retarded?
>Hurr durr le underagde
I'm 30 years old. Keep crying Adventurechild as I keep enjoying TF2 and SRB2.

>>8219747
All I did was enter this thread to mock you. You're arguably more obsessed with SA2 considering the fact you had a sperg rage on /vr/ over not being able to beat the game.

>>8219754
I didn't make this thread. A lot of people think this game is bad, believe it or not.

>>8219761
>A lot of people = Me, myself, I, that one spammer from /v/
Oh boy, the horror. Good game actually BAD.

>>8219723
because its not "oh you can just ignore it, its a short little speedbump". saying it can be done in 1-2 minutes is proving that whiners about the treasure hunting are just brainlets that cant handle controls and 3d mapping in their head. its not hard. its not difficult. everyone saying "but EXPLORATION in sa1!!!" can fuck themselves because the treasure hunting stages exist for exploration type fun. if the treasure hunting isnt "fun", then neither is the "exploration" of sa1, and anyone using that argument can suck a shotgun. big the faggot in sa1 isnt good or fun either. its not even a good minigame. yes, it can be over quickly, and it absolutely SHOULD because its unfulfilling. treasure hunting is entirely different. you have reason to learn a map and its mechanics. its fun to explore. its fun to find the precise locations of the treasure. its fun to get better score by finding them quickly. the missions and ranks encourage replay.

the argument of "its trash and i was stuck on this tedious shit forever" is complete garbage because it just speaks to lack of player skill. "but i had to fight the camera!!!" you probably dont ever have to be in that corner then.

>>8219764
>I've constructed a safe little bubble reality where SA2 is a masterpiece, and only two bad people on the internet disagree
What can I say to this, honestly?
It's nothing personal. It's just not a very good game, man.

>>8219694
While on the subject, how long on average does it take to make, say, a boost Sonic stage like the ones in Unleashed? Designing those must be fucking insane in all the bad ways.

>>8219774
>I've constructed a safe little bubble reality where SA2 is a masterpiece, and only two bad people on the internet disagree
More like I'm just observing this thread and only see two people ITT raging over it, assuming OP isn't samefagging. They talk extremely similarly and constantly reply to eachother in a self-congratulatory manner, it's pretty suspicious.

>>8219771
I don't want to do it for any amount of time because it's not fun. I don't want to "get good" at it, because it's not fun. Exploration games aren't bad in concept, and I've played N64 collectahons and PC adventure games to know. This game just doesn't do it well. I don't know what to tell you.

>>8219779
actually never happens cause its a complete waste of effort designing all those assets just to blast through them. adventure-style 3d shit is actually pretty common

>>8219774
the funny thing that you cant seem to understand is that the people genuinely defending the game arent denying that its bad. and i'll take a second to say that again.

we arent denying that its bad

our point is that op is a colossal retard for claiming that its worse than heroes. heroes is objectively worse made and worse played. sa2 has issues, yes, but many of sperg/op's issues are entirely due to the player's fault of being an objectively shit player. a lot of sperg's issues arent real issues or valid criticisms. sa2 HAS problems, yes, but its not accurate to the pathetic TANTRUM the autist is throwing. thats all.

>>8219779
Probably takes a long time. The actual size of the stages and backdrops are massive since they have to compensate for Sonic's speed with an increased distance. Forces and Colors are pretty lazy in this regard and constantly slow the game down on purpose. But Unleashed and Generations have a lot of effort put into the actual locales. I'd say 2 minutes of stage time takes them like 2 cumulative months of development.

>>8219784
>i bought the wrong game for my tastes/interests, so it therefor is a bad game.
wow.

>>8219780
I know you're the same guy who posts in all of these threads. Your posting style is very recognizable.
You get irrationally angry.
You demand people "get good", and show you their A-ranks.
You make the "it's only two minutes" argument.
You'll probably bring up some e-celeb in a minute.

>>8219797
actual schizo, seek help

>>8219797
>You'll probably bring up some e-celeb in a minute.
Funnily enough, OP was the first one to do that. He told me to go watch negative eceleb reviews of SA2 on youtube as if that proves anything. Just a typical bonafide zoomer with no mental agency.

>>8219771
> its not hard. its not difficult.
That's not the point. its not hard. its not difficult. It's just UNFUN. Mad Shit is fucking cancer. Every level post the first 2 knuckles staqges are unfun trash. The very concept pisses on what a treasure hunting game shoudl be like in the first place

Before SA1, you had TWO fucking examples of how this should have been executed. Mario 64, Banjo-Kazooie. Before SA2, you now had SIX fucking examples of proper exploration based collectathon gameplay, Rayman 2, Spyro, Pacman World, Conker's Bad Fur, etc etc. The fact there's actually GOOD, FUN, non RNG based shit examples of doing this right, is proof enough no matter what shitposting cope you shit out as a excuse, treasure hunting just isn't good and enjoyable to play through to most people

Good gameplay warrants good praise. The fact people are mixed about this proves they failed to match the quality that was S3K Knuckles gameplay.

>>8219795
>you can't criticize anything ever because "you aren't the audience"
Well now we're into Kevin Smith tier retardation.
I like Sonic games, I like platforming in general, I even like games about collecting things when they aren't shit. How am I not the audience?

>>8219808
>mario 64
aquatic mine is just like wet dry world for better or for worse
>banjo kazooie
you collect multiple emeralds like the jiggies. are you saying knuckles levels would've been better with egg shitting minigames and context-sensitive stamps on the floor?
>rayman 2
not a collectathon
>spyro
like how knux and rouge fly around collecting gems
>pacman world
also not a collectathon
>Conker
sa2 isn't worse for missing cow shitting cutscenes and lag

>>8219808
its not like sega was flipping the table and going back to the drawing board every time a new collectathon platformer came out, especially considering it accounted for a 1/3 of the game. sa2's design was built off sa1, fuck whatever spyro and conker were up to

>>8219832
>aquatic mine is just like wet dry world for better or for worse
For worse, that's the problem. Wet Dry world at least have stars that always takes skill to reach, unlike RNG simulator
>you collect multiple emeralds like the jiggies
No, you collect jiggies via skill and exploration, you stumble upon shards because your radar is busted and the fact their positions are RNG. You also forgot there's more than Jiggies to collect for your benefit, you sonic schizoid.
>not a collectathon
Glad to know you've never played Rayman 2.
>like how knux and rouge fly around collecting gems
Expect with far better level design, skill, eneimies that are an actual threat, mcgiffins aren't fucking RNG in placement, but sure, they are the same.
>also not a collectathon
Glad to know you've never played Pacman World
>sa2 isn't worse for missing cow shitting cutscenes and lag
Literal defection of goals.

Cope harder next time.

>>8219836
>its not like sega was flipping the table and going back to the drawing board every time a new collectathon platformer came out
Considering they had examples to copy since it's not like them to be original or anything (see ShTH, 06, Unleashed, Lost World/Colors. etc), so that's not an excuse.

>>8219836
They should have flipped the table and gone back to the drawing board once they realized the levels fundamentally were not fun.

>>8219843
>For worse
that's just like your opinion fag
>rng
???? oh no emerald might be over here instead of ten feet over there i am so confuse
>No, you collect jiggies via skill and exploration
wow just like sa2 hunting stages or any collectathon really
>your radar is busted
works perfectly fine. if anything works too good imo
>. You also forgot there's more than Jiggies to collect
yes there are also rings, animals, drives, chao keys etc to find in sa2. you should remember this from the game you just played you n64 schizoid

glad to know you don't know what a collectathon is fucktard. if rayman 2 is a collectathon then half life 2 is a fucking collectathon. looking behind you and finding a goodie does not = collectathon. this retardation is hurting my brain

>>8219848
they arguably did copy examples, you just ignore the correlation because of your larger bitterness towards the game. my read of the situation is you're a butthurt n64 kid rationalizing why he never played a dreamcast as a kid or something

>>8219870
>that's just like your opinion fag
So is yours, but here we are, in a thread everyone being mixed about game that is overhyped by the fanbase as the best one in the series
>????
What the fuck do you mean ???? The fucking game randomly places all emeralds in different positinos every fucking time you play the game. This completely destroys skill in how to get the collectable unlike any other proper collectathon, instead just becames a game of chance for a good wild goose chase with no direction/focus
>wow just like sa2 hunting stages or any collectathon really
Except no real collectation uses RNG in place of skill and proper planning to get good at the game
>works perfectly fine.
Factually can't if SA1 did it better. Way to prove how much of a battlenintendrone you clearly are.
>yes there are also rings, animals, drives, chao keys etc to find in sa2.
Rings would be fine had any """hazard""" in these levels were actually a threat. And power ups also fall into this since they are based on previous gameplay styles, which only works best for the more Sonic styled gameplays. In the Knuckles stages they are completely superfluous and serves nothing towards the end goal, unlike other collectathons

>glad to know you don't know what a collectathon is fucktard.
I think I very much do while you clearly don't, retard.

>looking behind you and finding a goodie does not = collectathon
??? The fuck are you on about? The fucking game's literal plot is finding all 1000 lums throughout the entire game. And you do this by searching for them all throughout the levels. Not to mention the trapped creatures in cages you need to get as well.

>>8219878
>they arguably did copy examples
If they did then they clearly did them poorly. Which make sense since that's literally how they always do it like the Shithog in Unleashed, Mario in Lost World or Ratchet in ShTH.

>>8219903
Oh and I forgot to mention the fucking animals, drives and chao shit are all for the Chao which only women like that tomogachi trash. They are completely separate from the core element that is Sonic.

>>8219903
adurr i can't member where emerald is if its there instead of ten feet over here
takes skill just the same. you're just too stupid to even comprehend it so you blame the game for not holding your hand enough
wow so you don't think the collectables are valuable enough. i think the golden feathers and jinjos are dumb collectables so therefore banjo kazooie is badly designed. what's even your point here? you're seriously trying to throw nintendo fanboy buzzwords at me but you're implying sa2 needs to be more like n64 titles just for the sake of them existing as n64 titles. maybe they aren't the gold standard you misunderstand them as to begin with?
>>8219912
golden feathers have nothing to do with a bear punching carrots so banjo kazooie is bad hurr kill yourself

>>8219789
Nah, I can beat Mega Man on NES without exploiting the yellow devil glitch. So go fuck yourself.

>>8219907
shithog isn't a video game schizo

>>8219810
because you fail to provide valid criticisms for what makes the actual treasure hunting shit. protip: it isnt. its pretty much the same as anything else. pyramid levels designs are garbage though, and nobody is arguing that. i dont understand why some people get so hung up on mad space. its not hard to navigate at all. you complaints all boils down to you being a terrible player. any complaint about the camera in treasure hunting is just you being a terrible player and being where you dont need to be, and it doesnt affect the actual gameplay of the treasure hunting at all. theres nothing that makes it inherently bad.

there absolutely is the valid criticism of "i wanted a sonic game, so i only wanted speed type levels, not shooting and treasure hunting. why couldnt they just make that?". fuck, i agree with that. but that doesnt make the treasure hunting itself actually bad. you're crying and throwing a tantrum. you cant make a valid argument, because you dont have one to make.
>>8219843
>your radar is busted
confirmed retard. the radar is not busted, and it works quite well. if you HAPPEN to stumble upon an emerald and its not the one the radar is tracking, congrats! you found one early! collect it for max points while you're on top of it. where the fuck is the problem? it just wants you to do things in order. thats also how the hint system actually FUNCTIONS for you.
>rng
not an argument. its treasure HUNTING.

>>8219806
But I actually played the game and think Shadow is better. Which most e-celebs disagree with. Nice try.

>>8219925
>Blah blah blah Sonic Team can't do no wrong
The facts are, no one likes this shit other than nostalgia Battletards that grew up on this shit game as their first sanic game
>golden feathers have nothing to do with a bear punching carrots
Except you get invincibility for parts in the game you need it for? It's literally mandatory for the final boss.

Just stop posting, it's getting pathetic af.

>>8211214
City Escape alone is better than anything Heroes or Shadow have to offer.

>>8219931
1) i doubt it.
2) doesnt matter
3) you're still shit
4) your arguments are baseless shit
5) you're willfully ignorant.
kill yourself.

>>8219936
I defaulted into bashing the Hog of War trash, but the point still stands.

>>8219943
1) i doubt it
2) doesnt matter
3) now what happens
4) i will never
5) give up the fight

I unironically liked the Knuckles stages.
Except for Aquatic Mines that can go fuck itself.

>>8219943
Sounds like you’re the sperg here lmao

>>8219938
>confirmed retard. the radar is not busted
Yet SA1 isn't busted unlike SA2. Cope more
>confirmed retard. the radar is not busted
Here's your (You). No where does it say hunting = RNG. In the context of the sport, any animal in the wild will always be in different places. This is a video game, where the emeralds shouldn't be classified as sentient creatures. It's just a fucking gemstone shard.

>>8219940
>fact fact factity fact fact fact buzzword buzzword

getting shit for your chaos is mandatory to unlock green hill. you just don't care. i could just as easily not care about beating grunty. fact is you're a retard

>>8219870
Games like Banjo use the collection as an incentive to have you interact with the various stage challenges, which is where the actual fun comes in.
A level in Banjo goes like this: You need a jiggy, but a guy has it, so you have a footrace with the guy, and are rewarded with the jiggy when you win.
A treasure hunting level in SA goes like this: walk around the big box until you find the emerald, and then pick it up.

This whole thread might be the most autistic thing on this board right now

>>8219968
but banjo doesn't have a 1/3 where you run fast and another 1/3 where you pilot a mech

>>8219961
>getting shit for your chaos is mandatory to unlock green hill
Oh WOW I get to play a shit recreation of a timeless classic stage over 10 years ago prior to the release of SA2! How novel! All I had to do was wasted 20 irl hours on fucking baby sitting just to unlock this KINO of a stage!

You sound like a complete troglodyte. Go die in a acid pit.

>>8219984
Yes, which is another reason why it's a far better game, focused and well fucking polished and planned out.

>>8219984
There absolutely are "run fast" levels in Banjo. That's what the running shoes are for.
The mech levels basically amount to slow clunky shooting, which Banjo also has with it's egg shooting.

>>8219986
oh WOW i get to fight one more phase of a boss and watch a cutscene? how novel! all i had to do is waste 20 irl hours collecting fucking babies sitting there just to unlock this KINO of a credits screen

>>8219986
>Oh WOW I get to play a shit recreation of a timeless classic stage over 10 years ago prior to the release of SA2! How novel! All I had to do was wasted 20 irl hours on fucking baby sitting just to unlock this KINO of a stage!
Green Hill in SA2 is not just a fun bonus.
It's a statement by the developers about the design philosophy of the game.
Green Hill's inclusion just demonstrates why the level design of classic Sonic wouldn't work well in the 3D games.
Its inclusion increases the appreciation players have for the level design choices used in the final game.
It also BTFO's the "this game would be soooo much better if they made levels like in the genesis games" crowd.
Also, I find it strange that you would complain about a fun little easter egg/developer statement that 99% of players will never see.

>>8220002
ewww don't compare kazooie autorun jank to sa2. you're such a pitifully transparent fanboy. go bang your face into the sidewalk and hallucinate this timeline you want so bad where sonic is exactly like banjo

>>8220014
I didn't say that. Banjo is a good game.

>>8220015
so is sa2

>>8220017
It's not, and I grew up with it.

>>8220024
but its good you just don't appreciate it. because its not like banjo, i guess

>>8220005
Oh no, he has no arguments left so now he's desperate to "win" this comment section! Here's your upvote, fellow redditor!
>>8220009
>Green Hill in SA2 is not just a fun bonus.
It's actually just not fun, no bonuses here. A good bonus for a stage like this, that is after you collected everything in the game, should be as good as something like Grand Master Galaxy, you know, a stage that actually TESTS your skills. Not some shallow demake of Sonic 1's starting level that completely highlights the lack of classic physics the Adventure titles keep getting credited for apparently having thanks to zoomer retards growing up on these trash games.

>>8220030
>Yeah! I want the most fun level in the game to be something 99% of players will never see!

>>8220030
how is what you get for all the jinjos more valuable than what you get for all the emblems? that you just project more value onto the former but not the latter? why should anyone care? what could sa2 have learned by having jinjos in it? why are you so stupid?

>>8220036
Yes? It's called challege you stupid underaged zoomer. Games reward the player with more content if you are good enough to get through it. And only good fun games get that praise for that, compared to today's games where there's no challenge what so fucking ever and just gifts shit players everything because otherwise it's now "bad" that games don't let me have everything at the start of the game.

>>8220046
>Yes? It's called challege you stupid underaged zoomer. Games reward the player with more content if you are good enough to get through it.
hey that reminds me of this game called sonic adventure 2 where you're rewarded with more content if you're skilled enough to get all the emblems

>>8220040
>how is what you get for all the jinjos more valuable than what you get for all the emblems?
See >>8219968
It's fun actually tried to find them and collect them. It takes SKILL and mastery of your gameplay to do this, and most of them by the 2/5th point of the game tests the player into getting to them. SA1/2 hunting stages are just "fly around randomly until you find it, gg no re.

In fact I'm now just realizing just how shit these fucking stages are with how no badnik, no power up, none of the level design actually complements collecting these Emeralds. The only level that kinda does test you is that one Rouge level in a prison. everything else is just hurr durr I go vroom in random directions.

>>8220028
I don't appreciate it because it's a game that doesn't really achieve anything it's attempting to do. It tries to sell itself on "variety" except the "variety" just amounts to filler stages that you play in order to get back to playing as Sonic, and some virtual pet game that kids liked, but is actually just a lame skinner box in retrospect.
And the Sonic stages are only okay at the end of all of that. A fangame made in the Doom engine wipes the floor with them, and that's saying something.

>>8220053
We were talking about the hunting stages you goalshifting retard, but even then the entire thread already pointed out how bad the rest of the game is in their own ways, namely the fucking mech levels.

Am I a contrarian for never liking sonic? The classics are fine but I've never had massive fun playing them.

>>8220046
1. I'm 27, not a zoomer or underage, but I understand that you spend most of your time with children so I won't hold this against you.
2. What dev in their right mind would put in active effort to design and implement the best level in a game in a spot where 99% of players won't EVER see it?
3. There are plenty of difficult games coming out today, and most of the difficulty in the classic games you love comes from shitty programing, artificial lengthening of the gameplay experience to justify the cost of a cartridge, and design flaws.

>>8220065
the hunting stages take skill. i'm not even really saying this to the game's credit even. taking a shit takes skill. point is this idea that the hunting stages are devoid of skill just because you don't like the mechanics is silly

>>8220067
something clicked for me when i started playing classic sonic more like a skateboarding game and less like a mario-esque platformer

>>8219960
>SA1 lets you track all of the emeralds at once
>that means that SA2 is BUSTED
no, it just means its different. it wants you to do it one at a time. thats all. the scoring system is also set up for one at a time. im sorry that you would prefer it the other way, but that doesnt make it "busted". your argument is invalid.

also i dont think you've ever gone actual hunting. "No where does it say hunting = RNG". nowhere does it say that hunting means that you always reliably find something in the same place every time, lol. you're just mad for the sake of being mad. "its a GAME and its a ROCK so it should be STATIC placement" is the pettiest shit i've seen yet. kill yourself.

>>8220060
>that's saying something
srb2 which has been polished for 20+ years was shallow as fuck until like last year. sa2 was worked on for like a year and a half and released in 2001

>>8220091
So they probably should have put more work into SA2. That doesn't make it a good game. The opposite, in fact.

>>8220069
It’s obvious that Sega has half assed Sonic ever since the genesis. It’s just rushed cash grabs. These games aren’t only either an unpolished mess, or a boring autopilot roller coaster. They’re also short as fuck, and rely on A ranking the levels. It’s artificial game length. Even for Genesis, compare the length of Sonic 1-3 in comparison to Super Mario World. It’s outrageous.

>>8220093
>So they probably should have put more work into SA2.
hell yes they should have but you could say that for any game
>That doesn't make it a good game. The opposite, in fact.
nope. a rock can still be nice even if its not polished to perfection

>>8220104
A good game is polished at least to the point that you aren't left noticing how unpolished it is.
There was more they wanted to do with Ocarina of Time, but it doesn't stand out. In Wind Waker, it kind of stands out. Sonic Adventure is Wind Waker (if you can even call it that).

>>8220069
>2. What dev in their right mind would put in active effort to design and implement the best level in a game in a spot where 99% of players won't EVER see it?
Every dev before the mobile gachi era? Games always had great final game content because they expected the player to get gud and earn it. Despite being one year younger than me, you act an entire generation apart mentally speaking
> There are plenty of difficult games coming out today
To you, maybe. I literally had no modern game actively challege me in difficulty. Maybe except AHiT's Death Wishes which can sometimes feel less like focused and planned out challenges at times and thus bs , but most of them actual do feel like it challenges your skill from mastering the gameplay pre DLC.
Too bad 99% of modern games don't do this and instead is now removing lives as a cope for making games even more braindead.

>>8220070
>the hunting stages take skill
Sorry, but you're just bad at video games. Literally nothing is SA2 is hard. Most if not all Sonic games aren't even hard, but the 3D ones were never hard, just boring at best or cheap and broken at worse like in most of the pre Unleashed era games.

>>8220110
>A good game is polished at least to the point that you aren't left noticing how unpolished it is.
i don't agree at all. any five year old can clip up the stairs and skip like a 1/4 of mario 64 but that doesn't make the game bad despite being unpolished
>There was more they wanted to do with Ocarina of Time, but it doesn't stand out. In Wind Waker, it kind of stands out. Sonic Adventure is Wind Waker (if you can even call it that).
what the fuck are you talking about? wind waker is 1/2 filler and no one even brought it up but woof speaking of lack of polish. this is just blind idolization of nintendo products and cursing others for not being enough like nintendo products

>>8220126
it doesn't take much skill to just get through it. of course i agree sa2 is generally easy, i beat it when i was 5. point is there's still skill to be sharpened in the mechanics. its kind of the whole point of sonic. you failing to understand this explains a lot

>>8220089
>it just means its different.
Different /= good. SA1 was done better. Just cope over that fact already.
> it wants you to do it one at a time.
Aka, pad out the game? Yeah, that's totally good game design

>nowhere does it say that hunting means that you always reliably find something in the same place every time,
Oh, so fishing spots, deer spots or other spots people find to get a "control group" are just magical buzzwords devoided from reality? Guess I was living life all wrong then.

>>8220091
>srb2 which has been polished for 20+ years was shallow as fuck until like last year.
There was nothing wrong with SRB2 prior to 2.2, people were just filtered as fuck over PC controls. It's fucking doom, if you sucked at doom you sucked at gaming period.

>>8220127
The fact that you dislike Nintendo to the point that you feel the need to overate anything Sega does above anything Nintendo does doesn't give you the high ground. It makes you look petty.
You want to talk good Sega games, we can do that. I love Streets of Rage, Super Monkey Ball, Crazy Taxi, Sonic 3. I don't love SA2 because it's not up to par, and I'm not such a fanboy that I can't admit that.

>>8220129
>it doesn't take much skill to just get through it. of course i agree sa2 is generally easy, i beat it when i was 5. point is there's still skill to be sharpened in the mechanics. i
If baby shit is "skill sharpening", you might as well be playing Kirby or something.

>>8220132
being a shitposting contrarian doesnt make it better or make you right. :)

>>8220140
>kirby BAD
Seek help, you keep getting more and more contrarian.

>>8220184
I didn't say Kirby was bad, I said Sonic isn't Kirby tier in difficulty. At least comparing to the classic era.

>>8220179
Why are you talking to yourself?

>>8219634
you're shit at sa1 if you really have to ask that.

I think OP secretly loves SA2, he's been letting this thread go on for 3 days straight.

>>8220126
>Every dev before the mobile gachi era? Games always had great final game content because they expected the player to get gud and earn it.
This is blatantly untrue. In the ~40 SNES games I've been playing since childhood this isn't the case except in like 2 games. You're wearing rose colored glasses.
>Despite being one year younger than me, you act an entire generation apart mentally speaking
Maybe you're just stuck in your ways and incapable of evolving with the times, gramps.
> I literally had no modern game actively challege me in difficulty.
100% Hollow Knight without getting hit. Go ahead. It's not a particularly hard game but it certainly doesn't hold your hand if you actually try to do everything. I'll admit that about half of the bosses don't pose much challenge but the same can be said of Castlevania, Ninja Gaiden, and a slew of the hardest games from "your day".
>Too bad 99% of modern games don't do this and instead is now removing lives as a cope for making games even more braindead.
This is unironically a good thing. Do you honestly enjoy playing through every level of a game over and over just because you're trying to figure out how to get past one difficult obstacle? How the hell do you have the time to do that? Even Super Mario Bros had an easy way to start back at the beginning of the world you lost in if you lost all your lives.
I simply refuse to believe that you find doing the exact same thing over again for 45 minutes thrilling when you get stuck on an obstacle in a game. If you say that you do, I will absolutely accuse you of lying.

>>8220630
If anything, I think a lot of retro games tended to front load their good content. Green Hill Zone syndrome.
SA2 does this too. City Escape is everyone's favourite level.

>>8220662
i like pyramid cave and final rush better

>>8220630
>This is unironically a good thing. Do you honestly enjoy playing through every level of a game over and over just because you're trying to figure out how to get past one difficult obstacle?
I'm oldschool, so it doesn't ass ravage me like zoomers struggle with today. It forced me to get good and I enjoyed games more

Imagine playing TF2 only to have everything control your movements for you without your input? That's how modern games feel to me most of the time, everything wrong I could do gets handholded for me, anything I could do on my own is just stopped in favor of linear progression.

>>8220786
>I'm oldschool, so it doesn't ass ravage me like zoomers struggle with today. It forced me to get good and I enjoyed games more
I'm old enough to have a job and a family, and I can't spend 12 hours a day playing videogames anymore. Having to play through an entire game over and over to just practice one thing in a later level is not reasonable for an adult with a family and responsibilities. I guess that's the difference between us.
Having to start the game over does not make the obstacle more difficult and it doesn't make the game more challenging. It doesn't require extra skill. It doesn't make you a super hardcore le epic gamer. It just wastes time. If I want to play a game over again, I'll play it over again, but being forced to do it over and over again when there's just one part I'm having trouble with. It's simply foolish to believe that being able to play a game from just prior to the part you want to practice makes the game easy.

>>8220862
You don't have a family or responsibilities, stop larping

>>8220886
It speaks leagues about you that you, at 28, believe that someone having a family and responsibilities is larping. Is this what "oldschool gamers" are like?

>>8220903
I'm not the same person in the reply chain, just calling you out as a larper

>>8220941
Believe what you want. No skin off my bones.

>>8220954
Anybody who says this shit is always fucking larping, if your entire life is consumed by your career then you picked the wrong field. You can very comfortably play retro vidya and hold a full time job.

>>8220963
I work in clinical psychology and enjoy my job, though because of the nature of crisis situations I'm sometimes required to work a bit more than intended. If you're not willing to allow your career to consume your life, you obviously don't enjoy it, and thus you have picked the wrong field.

>>8221000
hey im not involved in any of this i just saw this while scrolling past but you're literally bringing up your job and trying to defend your job while you're in a fucking Sonic Adventure thread.
get some perspective man. i hope to god this is a larp and you're not a full grown man

>>8217362
Man, even the "walk on water like it's ooze for some reason" concept of that Chaos fight was incompetent. It could be 100% fully functional and look and feel bad. The design idea for it would still have been something that someone didn't think hard enough for, you can't even excuse it.

>>8221046
It makes me wonder if Sonic is meant to be moving really fast through that entire fight. They don't convey it very well, if so.

>>8217362
0:30 That happened to me right before making this thread

>>8211249
Wow, you said the literal opposite of the truth

>>8221647
I really didn't. Anyone who's able to divorce their emotional attachment to the Adventure era can see this.

>>8221067
Yeah, that's most likely the idea. I think a scene design that would have worked would be to have Sonic in a constant running circle around the arena from side-view, and being able to jump, dodge and start a chain of homing attacks on vulnerabilities or projectiles Chaos could produce. Sonic on water that acts like honey doesn't work as a speed simulation - someone had a cool "look how fast Sonic is" concept in their head that made no practical sense and wasn't delivered in implemented gameplay here.

>>8217362
what kind of jank ass version of sa2 are you clowns playing where shit just doesnt load like that?pvtvv

>>8217362
I can tell how like 50% of this is done on purpose. Why the fuck you need to go sideways in Lost World level. That shit in White Jungle also don't happen if you don't go slow intentionally.
When you do a Light Dash in pyramid cave, you jump off the hook after auto-grabbing it, instead of just going up. Pathetic human.

>>8217362
the solution is to not play the game like an egoraptor autist stumbling around going sideways for no reason like this

>>8222895
>Egoraptor mention
There we go. Now this thread has a full house of Adventurefag copes.

>>8222931
>immediate mask-off moment
So it is you. I should've known you were the one that started this entire thread, but you were pretty subtle this time, I'll give you that.

>>8222953
I'm not. It's just funny how predictable and delusional you people are, and how you have deified Egoraptor as some kind of Satanic figure, going out of his way to destroy the reputation of good games.

>>8222982
Why don't you stick to Sonic threads on /v/? Your attempts to "troll Adventurefags" doesn't really work out on a slow board.

>>8222994
Yes, "they" are out to get you and tarnish the good name of these flawless masterpieces. That's what's happening here.

>>8223008
OK if you claim you aren't OP, then honest question now that you've been exposed, do you have an IRC bot set up for whenever Arin is mentioned, or do you just lurk these threads for a very long time?

>>8223031
I don't know what to tell you, friend. You unironically believe the Sonic Adventure games are flawless and anyone who says otherwise is part of this evil cabal centered on an irrelevant has-been Newgrounds animator. If you can't see that this is borderline schizo shit, I don't think I can help you.

>>8223049
>anyone who says otherwise is part of this evil cabal centered on an irrelevant has-been Newgrounds animator.
>evil cabal
I wish, the reality is even sadder than that, it's just one person with too much free time. At least an evil cabal would be more interesting.

>>8223054
Oh no, a file got posted... Six times... It's the Freemasons out to ruin Sonic Adventure.

>>8223058
See you next adventure thread

>>8223062
I'm not even him.

>>8223008
again, nobody is actually saying they're flawless masterpieces. they ARE bad games. they HAVE jank. but they also have a lot of jank that you basically have to go out of your way to find, or you have to be doing some really stupid shit in order for it to affect you (ie: being a bad player). SA1 is pretty bad. SA2 is rough, but significantly better. heroes is a fucking mess. its been a long time since i touched shadow, but i dont remember much jank, just irritating level/mission design and laughable "plot". OP saying heroes is better than SA2 is objectively false. OP being a terrible player and blaming the game is disingenuous.

thats it. thats the main issue of the thread. saying heroes is better is just disingenuous. blaming the game on his own incompetence isnt a fair claim. SA2 is basically just the shiniest turd in the pile, and nobody here is really denying that. thats it. stop pretending like its more than that.

>>8223154
I don't even think the "jank" is the worst thing about them. It's the filler. The fact that the Sonic stages are kind of broken once you get through all of the other shit is just the cherry on top.

>>8223165
sure, it should have been a game with 20 more speed stages and no treasure hunting or mech shit. however, that doesnt make the treasure hunting itself "bad". the treasure hunting, on its own, is probably the least problematic of the 3 in terms of execution. it just shouldnt exist in the first place. the mech stages are tedious. the boss fights/designs are pretty bad. but be that as it may, they ARE in the game. take that fact with a grain of salt. they still perform pretty decently. like i said, there is some jank, but its not the sort that really merits this spergged out tantrum of the OP. its definitely not great, but its not THAT bad. its not heroes bad. and OP is a bad player.

>>8222642
>Why the fuck you need to go sideways in Lost World level.
Why the fuck isn't there collision detection at all in the first place? This isn't a "on purpose" shit, that's purely unacceptable. No one in any other fanbase defends shit like that.

>>8223154
>his
Woah woah now. It could be a woman playing.

I used to like sonic but, the internet has made me just disgusted by the mention of him.

the ARPANET was a mistake.

>>8223471
>Why the fuck isn't there collision detection at all in the first place?

Probably because it's a wall that serves no other purpose than being a decoration and no one should be autistic enough to intentionally run into it instead of running forward.

I agree it's an undeniable flaw but I'd never even learn about it without glitch compilations.

>>8211262
I agree with this

>>8223743
>Probably because it's a wall that serves no other purpose than being a decoration
I'm glad you're that desperpate to defend this trashfire of a game because of nostalgia.
>The mountain in Bombomb Battlefield is meant to be decoration, it's ok if I clip the entire thing just because I was suppose to only be on the path leading up to it

The irony is if Nintendo made Adventure this wouldn't even be a discussion right now. They'd never let any game have shit detection in it (after what happened to Sunshine)

>>8223883
>desperpate

>>8223883
Even Sunshine is better than any 3D Sonic game.

>>8222931
bruh he literally played sadx and did so exactly like your shitty webm. acting like there isn't this general e-celeb/journo hateboner towards the adventure games that ego is a part of is just disingenuous. if you're not just trolling, i'd bet you were influenced by their takes. no one who just played sonic adventure at some point with no external influences would not be reacting like you

>>8222931
bruh he literally played sadx and did so exactly like your shitty webm. acting like there isn't this general e-celeb/journo hateboner towards the adventure games that ego is a part of is just disingenuous. if you're not just trolling, i'd bet you were influenced by their takes. no one who just played sonic adventure at some point with no external influences would be reacting like you

>>8224409
It's a reaction to this bizarre reverence for these games I'm suddenly expected to have. At best, they're "charming". They're not actually very good. It's like if one day I woke up and everyone was being weirdly defensive about Megaman X7.
And no, I haven't seen Game Grumps since Jon was on it.

look at this disgusting clipping that just RUINS the game entirely. it's not like i could just ignore it and play the game like someone who doesn't have every mental disorder known to man or anything. this one teeny tiny hyperspecific issues is an indictment on the entire game

>>8224416
oh good then so you were there for all the crying ego did in sonic 06 about how the adventure games were just as bad. my fucking point exactly. you aren't free of external influence. you thinking sa2 is bad is not a result of jesus himself beaming the objective wisdom of the universe into your brain. its just everyone else who's influenced, sorry to say.

>>8224429
*it's not just

>>8224429
I don't have to agree with anything Egoraptor says. I don't even like him. I like Jon.
I know what these games are because I played them when I was just old enough to see that they were kind of bad.

>>8224434
fuck off. you made this entire thread just to see the reactions of people who like it and now you're acting like this victim of all these people ~forcing~ their praises of this game you don't like onto you. lets say i believe your larp that you're just some zen master free from all externalities, you're still just disliking the games for contrarian attention just like ego. there's no difference other than you can't influence children who will grow up to make 4chan threads about how sonic adventure pissed in their coffee

>>8224437
I didn't make this thread.
>you're still just disliking the games for contrarian attention
No, see that's the thing. It's not even a contrarian opinion to call Sonic Adventure bad, or it wasn't a year ago. I don't know what happened.

>>8224443
keep calling attention to how you're only doing this to be contrarian. its actually the other way around in that people generally liked these games growing up then e-celebs had to go and tell them that their memories are lying to them and the games are actually bad. was an especially prominent attitude in like 2012-16. people are only sort of warming up to the adventure era now because they are no longer easily influenced children and see the adventure titles as something valuable modern sonic design just ignores in its entirety which only makes it more of an issue

>>8224453
I very distinctly remember being pissed off whenever the games made me do treasure hunting, and even then on some level knowing the Sonic gameplay was kind of weird and broken. I "liked" it, or I forced myself to think I did because I put money down on the game, but I kind of knew it wasn't good.
I like them less now. I actually used to like the shooting, and the Chao gardens, but none of that really holds up.

>>8223727
i used to cry about the sonic fanbase but then i just googled any other fanbase and saw the exact same behavior. we're just conditioned by memes and balding snes fanboy e-celebs to project all this cringe culture onto sonic specifically. the pokemon community makes the sonic community look level-headed but you don't hear about that cause muh perfect nintendo products are above cringe

>>8224482
I don't know what world you live in where people don't know that certain kinds of people are very into Pokemon. We're all aware of Chris-Chan.

>>8223883
Yeah, I'm glad too, because I'm playing DX and adventure 2 for 15 damn years now and wall clipping happened to me like twice during countless replays of both games. So I kinda have right to NOT hate it because it didn't give me many reasons to. I even launched the game now to check that Lost World level glitch, you clip through the wall, but you don't fall. So uh, I don't know how people break their game.

But that only applies to PC port, I've never played Gamecube or original Dreamcast Adventure 1, so I probably should check that out. Even its fans say it's a bugfest galore, so I'll probably get everything shown in that webm above plus extra content.

>>8224394
Yes, it is. Despite the jank, it's still far more focused and planned out gameplay wise. And I know this is the case since I played Sunshine for the first time 15 years after I played SA2.

>>8221046
>>8221067
>>8221895
i think the idea is just what it is. you're not supposed to trudge through the water, you're supposed to stay on the lilypads so you don't have to. i imagine originally you were supposed to sink down and die in the water like everywhere else but that was considered too hard or something so they made up the honey water gimmick

>>8217362
i imagine the seething nincel who made this sinking 400 hours into sonic adventure just so he can record like 10 seconds worth of clipping bugs. cause early 3d games never have those its only muh ebil sonic

>>8224568
Stop trying to force Nintendo vs Sega onto this. It's cringe. The biggest critics of shitty Sonic are fans of good Sonic, funnily enough.

>>8224584
everyone in this thread is comparing it to mario. fuck entirely off. the only thing forced here is this patronizing. the biggest critic of sonic fans are mario fanboys who see sonic as undeserved competition. notice how no one's making webms for mario 64 despite its myriad of similar clipping issues. why is that? why is sonic held to this higher level of scrutiny. if its not fanboyism its just a baseless double standard

>>8224592
It's like Mario is a good standard to compare any 3D platformer to or something
>NOOOOO! IT'S NINTENDO! THAT'S NOT ALLOWED!
Fine, use Jack and Daxter then, you crying bitch.

>>8224603
and why is that? it clearly has the exact same issues that apparently make sonic adventure bad so why isn't it held to the same scrutiny? why is it just considered the default good game? the fanboyism is so dogmatic you can't even see it for what it is
>jak and daxter
did you think just saying the name of another game is some kind of trump card or something

>>8224614
What? Because you can find one example of Mario clipping though a door?
And again, the bugs aren't even the biggest problem with Sonic adventure. The problem is it's full of bad gameplay.
>did you think just saying the name of another game is some kind of trump card or something
The point is there's any number of good games we could compare Sonic Adventure to.

>>8224620
what? because you can find one example of sonic clipping through a rock? https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=mario+64+glitches here, go crazy having a look you non-fanboy you. i assure you there's much more than just that mips door clip.

and i could positively compare the lack of clipping issues in sa2 the myriad in 64 but that doesn't make 64 a bad game of course or necessarily imply that sa2 is better overall. and yet sonic falling through a platform once is supposed to be some kind of argument for why the whole game is bad or why the entire SERIES is bad

>>8224630
People went out of their way to find glitches in Mario. This stuff just happens to people in Sonic. That's the difference.
And again. Sonic Adventure could have no bugs at all, and that wouldn't fix the treasure hunting stages being boring.

>>8224637
>This stuff just happens to people in Sonic
i can assure you nothing in that webm is naturally induced. you'd only think this all le just happens if you discovered sa through game grumps or some shit. i've played through the dreamcast version multiple times and none of this shit has ever happened to me. and i go out of my way to sequence break whenever possible. its all just forced bullshit. anything to stave off the switch buyers' remorse, i guess

>hat wouldn't fix the treasure hunting stages being boring.
and no one here including you has made a convincing argument as to why they're bad besides 'i don't like them'. also epic backpedal since you only started whining at me for saying that webm was dumb shit for emphasizing glitches that never happen to anyone

>>8224649
I can definitely remember the game spazzing out and throwing me off the stage, or doing that thing where you endlessly circle an enemy with the homing attack.
>and no one here including you has made a convincing argument as to why they're bad
Literally go and read the thread back. We did exactly that.

>>8224658
>i remember the game just lyke...spazzing out lmao
you remember it and yet can't even describe it
>endlessly circle an enemy with the homing attack.
its not endless nor even dangerous if you're not like op and are constantly trying to move off the ledge

"We" the fuck lol is this some kind of discord cabal you're running? why don't you read the thread and notice how the argumentation boils down to "its not fun" which is a nothing statement. i could just say mario 64 isn't fun and even make personal arguments why but that doesn't mean every mario 64 fan has to reconsider

>>8224667
>you remember it and yet can't even describe it
I just did. The game spazzes out.
>is this some kind of discord cabal you're running?
No, Schizo. It was me and another person talking about why the levels are bad earlier in the thread.

>>8224673
i played mario 64 once and it umm like spazzed out and stuff...so its bad. what do you have to say to that
>it was me and another person
KEK HOW WOULD YOU KNOW ITS JUST ONE OTHER PERSON i was just kidding but you're starting to convince me

>>8224592
There are numerous 3D platformers roughly contemporary to the Adventure games I would call better. There are aspects of Adventure 1 in particular I like, but the Adventure games are both messes.

>>8224679
You want me to remember the exact details of every gltich in a game I played 20 years ago? The game's full of moments where you go to do something and it just behaves weirdly or doesn't work. I remember that. You go to do the ring dash thing and suddenly it just decides "no" and throws you down a pit.

>>8224692
>You want me to remember the exact details of every glitch in a game I played 20 years ago?
no its just a stupid non-argument. i could vaguely claim any game is bad because it "spazzed out" on me. but i mean yeah if you remember it happening you'd think you'd actually remember what happened
>The game's full of moments where you go to do something and it just behaves weirdly or doesn't work
i thought you hadn't played it in 20 years. why are you so sure? you can't even give a single personal example. imo you're just mandala effect-style projecting the webm onto your own experience with the game that you obviously don't remember well itself

>>8224695
I remember the game feeling loose and cheap.

>>8224701
wow two adjectives i finally get it now. hold on i have to go burn my dreamcast and build a shrine to miyamoto-sama and beg for forgiveness

>>8224704
I don't give a shit about your imaginary console wars.

>>8224706
>retro console wars are irrelevant to the retro board
wut

especially odd to say since the average poster here (hopefully) was actually there to experience it. i'm not just gonna stop paying attention to people (in this very thread) using mario as the default to compare to sonic. its like yeah the console wars are over and yet totally-not-nintendo-fanboys always act like sonic has something he needs to prove to mario. i'm sorry but i'm going to continue to rub two brain cells together and call this what it is

>>8211214
I'm really sorry you kept getting a really tame game over, and on the best stage in the game of all places, oh anon,

>>8224720
"retro" doesn't mean "arrested development". You should have gotten over having weird emotional attachments to corporations, as if they're your friends at least by the time you're 16.
Most SA fanboys played it on the GC anyway, so I don't know what weird angle this is.

>>8224731
wow fuck off i never said corporations were my friend. i'm sorry you couldn't convince me sonic adventure was bad but now you're just grasping

>>8224735
You're saying it implicitly.

Way better. Suck my saggy white balls

>>8224737
you're assuming it just like you assumed sonic adventure is bad because you saw a webm of a game you haven't played in 20 years

Fuck this shitty game.

>>8224735
let's go through the characters
>sonic
half of his levels are just watching him automatically hit boosters and springs. homing attack is a shit mechanic that trivializes almost all enemies, basically a QTE
>tails
sonic levels but with superman 64 rings, so even more automatic boost shit
>knuckles
hot and cold in a 3d platformer. no one would ever choose to play a game like this, people just accept it because it comes with sonic
>amy
her stages are like a minute long and she controls like ass. why give her a giant hammer when the objective is always to run away
>gamma
third person shooter where move and aim are the same controls. would be frustrating except that you simply lock on and wipe out everything at once, making it boring instead
>big
LMAO
>super sonic
just a sonic level but the floor is a water texture

nothing really works. if you remove the brand and call this Mikey the Monkey and Friends it would be a mediocre, forgotten nothing game

>>8226791
Hey I don't know if you got the memo but we all moved to this thread

>>8226508

>>8226791
>muh boosters and springs
you being too stupid to sequence break isn't the game's problem. stop playing it like mario and expecting the level designers to hand you the path through the level on a silver platter
>hot and cold = bad
so is minesweeper a badly designed game now? its perfectly fine as a fundemental mechanic. your mere insinuation that its bad isn't meaningful
>she controls like ass
>>retard continues to blame his incompetence on a game i beat when i was 4
>muh boring
wow another adjective
>just a sonic level but the floor is a water texture
not even accurate. most of the time in that chapter is spent in the hub and the perfect chaos fight feels more like boost than any former sonic level

stop wasting your time with this unconvincing nonsense and let your shitty thread die

>>8227671
That isn’t me, you silly dipshit

>>8224637
>And again. Sonic Adventure could have no bugs at all, and that wouldn't fix the treasure hunting stages being boring.
This. The game is fucking fundamentally anti Sonic. Everything great about Classic Sonic is dead and buried from SA1 onward. It's like a completely false version of the series IP from another dimension come to Berenstain Bears the Sonic everyone actually liked in the 90s. No one but non fans, zoomers, or Gametendrones would prefer SA1/2 over the rest or prerest of the series.