/vr/ - Retro Games

>>7855360
>Oblivion
Based

Why, that's Skyrim, of course.

>>7855392
not /vr/ tho

>>7855393
Well for /vr/ I'd have to go with Morrowind.

>>7855360
>>7855409
Morrowind was nice but I liked Oblivion more in the long run

bump

>>7855393
Neither is Oblivion

>>7856178
>Retro gaming means platforms launched in 2001 and earlier
>homebrew will be permitted

Oblivion has a mod to run on a GeForce3, a card that came out in 2001. Together with a 2001 Pentium 4, it would run fine, even when uglier.
By /vr/'s own rules, Oblivion is retro.

>>7855360
Look, it's interesting. Oblivion is interesting. If interesting is enough, play the game. If interesting is NOT enough for you, don't play the game.

>>7856192
If you print out that post and put it in your car. You could park at every handicapped parking spot you'll like, and nobody would say anything.

>>7856645
Holy shit

>>7856645
That's the dumbest comeback I've ever seen, grats

>>7856656
>>7856664
Samefag

>>7856178
>>7856192
You don't need a mod.

>Retro gaming means platforms launched in 2001 and earlier, and official game titles for those platforms released no later than December 2007

>>7856664
I could run a ps3 emulator on an old pc. Not good but it would at least start. Don't make that games vr. Go back to v

>>7856673
I didn't post that

>I could run a ps3 emulator on an old pc.
only technically, there would be no use in it since it would be a 100th of real time

>Not good but it would at least start.
if you give it enough time, take a few hours to load a game

>Don't make that games vr
see >>7856672

>>7856673
Your analogy makes no sense though. Oblivion plays fine (30+ fps, just looks ugly on low end hardware) on a PC from 2001 and that's not even the point here, any platform launched in 2001 or earlier, PC is a platform way before that.
Your magical PS3 emulator, even if you had enough memory on a pre-2001 PC to make it execute PS3 code at any speed, would not even be close to "plays fine".

I just can't believe anyone actually likes Oblivion. It's so bad as an RPG and so bad as just a regular game you're supposed to play for fun. The combat sucks, the writing sucks, and the world is the generic fantasy land we've seen hundreds of times before. What's the appeal? I seriously don't understand.

>>7858128
>regular game you're supposed to play for fun.
and?

>>7858137
What do you mean "and?" It isn't fun to play. It's mindless. The combat is braindead, the level scaling and copy paste dungeons ruin exploration, and quests are just following markers.

>>7855360
>dumbed down Morrowind without artistic ambitions
Sure sounds like a game for you OP!

>>7858143
Stop judging a game by the saturated experience you have with the game.
Playing this game for the first time back then was a mind blowing experience.
A player can easily have dozens of hours of fun before the flaws of the game become evident. This is what matters.

>>7858417
The flaws in Oblivion are as apparent as they can be. One playthrough is all you need to notice pretty much all the major ones. Also what kind of logic even is this? A game shouldn't fall apart the more you play it, it should get better. Morrowind's world gets deeper and more interesting as you play the game for instance.

>>7858160
>without artistic ambitions
What does this even mean?

>>7858417
>a player can easily have dozens of hours of fun before they realize the flaws.
That's unironically one of the worst and most insidious things about Oblivion. When you start the game it's absolutely an enjoyable experience, not as good as the previous 2, but it has its own charm. That's when you start to notice though that your character doesn't seem to be progressing in terms of combat prowess with the enemies you fight. That's ok you think, I just need to get gud. But then you realize that you can't even afford to maintain the gear you need to even deal with random bandits. Then you feel like you can never actually complete the main quest because the only way you can ever hope to stay financially afloat is essentially doing pacifist runs through the oblivion gates. All because the leveling system and scaling are broken so fucking completely, and they are so fundamental to the experience, that it turns the game into a fucking chore that actively punishes you for continuing to play it. Yes these issues can be fixed with mods, but the game itself in it's vanilla form is so fucking poorly thought out that it's hard to just sit and listen to any fucking moron praise Oblivion. It was a slap in the face to anyone who bought it. Skyrim is a much more bland and less ambitious experience, but God damn at least that game is functional. Oblivion is not, and the worst part is that broken nature isn't like Atari ET where you realize it right away, it's as you said only apparent after you've invested a dozen hours into the world and gotten attached to it.

I used to play Skyrim on an old xp gaming PC. It ran like shit, but it ran. So skyrim is retro now boys, whats your favorite builds?

>>7855360
One of the worst, only redeeming quality was Shattered Isles.

>>7855360
whichever one you played first in your adolescence

>>7856645
kek

>>7855360
Yes. In terms of quests, gameplay tweaks and gamedesign it's the peak TES. Sure Morrowind got the best story and Cashcowrim got Paarthurnax aka THE TOP DILF, but Oblivion the the absolute masterpiece aesthetically and gameplaywise, with a perfect balance of accessibility and complexity.

>>7859067
Nope easily one of the best. Daggerfall and its randomly generated crap isn't memorable at all. But you're always gonna remember glarthir in skingrad

>>7859771
This is bait.

>>7859782
No you.

>>7859775
Nope easily one of the worst.

>>7858128
It was baby's first open world RPG for a lot of children, and thus they have developed special attachments to it and are incapable of viewing it through a critical lens.

Morrowind > ESO > Skyrim >>>> Oblivion

>>7856664
It's pretty good, you're just assmad that you got destroyed by an ESL.

>>7859854
You think that boring trash eso is that high fuck your shit opinion retard

>>7858128
>I just can't believe anyone actually likes Oblivion. It's so bad as an RPG
most people who are into TES and nu-Fallout aren't into CRPGs, anon.

>>7858898
>bitching about oblivion being too hard
What the fuck am I reading

>>7860448
t. Never played Oblivion past level 5

>>7859854
Zoomed here. Skyrim was my first “rpg”. Oblivion is still fun.

Pro Morrowinder here. My first playthrough of Oblivion I was not impressed. I got a few Oblivion gates in and was sick of it. I gave it another go a few years later and found where it shined. It seemed every small town you came across had something going on. It started with that one town early on (that I some how missed my first play through) where every one is very off put by you. With exploration you find that they her captive slaves underground. I was bummed out it didn't go anywhere, but was curious if there was more like this. I was quick to find all the non essential towns had so much going on. I just excitedly wandered around the map until I found something new.

It seemed at that point that Oblivion didn't excel in the main game, but in all it's side quests. I loved the action oriented guild quests (although a huge departure from Morrowind's guilds) and MAN the shivering isles is one of my favorite DLCs ever. SO much soul and personality. More than the whole vanilla game itself. I was in awe when I pushed the man off the edge to fulfil his suicide request. The first time I hit Sherrogorath I was in tears of laughter from what followed.

It's a different game than previous TES installments, but I think it holds it's ground. Skyrim just didn't click the same for me.

>>7860448
He's right on all points.

The game features some really disgusting level scaling. If you're leveling up via non-combat abilities, which represent the vast majority of skills you'll be using, enemies quickly turn into absurd damage sponges. It doesn't take long to get to a point where every starving bandit in a cave or ruin is kitted out in glass and daedric armor worth more than an expensive home in any of the towns. This isn't an exaggeration.

Legendary items are also scaled to the level when you first find them, which means they're all functionally useless. You can sort of skirt around the damage sponge problem via a stacking weakness to magic + weakness to (element) + (element) damage enchant, but with a system that makes every single weapon that isn't that one highly specific enchant combination useless, I think most would agree it's rotten to the core.

>>7861451
I started the main quest line at level 30. When I got to the point where they strip you of all equipment for one dungeon it became a nightmare. Everything was one hitting me. This was my only bad experience with the scaling, but holy shit was it frustrating.

>>7859775
The Glarthir quest sucks. It's 3 fucking tailing quests in a row. People only like it because it's the only time Oblivion gives you a choice in something.

>>7858898
>>7860451
If you retards made a shit build and are getting rekt by timber wolves you can bump the difficulty slider down a notch and it solves all your problems. I've never had a problem with level scaling in Oblivion, although it is obviously flawed.

>>7861520
The difficulty slider is a flat +% outgoing, -% incoming. This does not fix the broken level scaling.

>>7855409
>>7856626
it’s unreal that there were only four years between oblivion and morrowind when from daggerfall to morrowind was six and we’re going on ten with skyrim

>>7861520
If you level up non combat skills it fucks you bad, and there's a lot of non combat skills. If you want to level up your speechcraft, acrobatics, alteration, etc and it's a major skill you will end up getting out paced by the level scaling. Honestly it's why I personally don't consider Oblivion to even be an RPG. It wasn't made for anything but combat.

>>7858898
The truth right here. Even if you do perfect efficient leveling eventually you cap out your damage and enemy health always goes up. Once you have 100 strength and 100 blade (blunt is objectively worse) you are doing the most damage you can without abusing infinite alchemy power. The worst part is most people will have no idea how to do efficient leveling and will play the game as the devs intended, which is the worst possible thing for you to do. Not only that, they rebalanced the game to make efficient leveling even harder with less skills than Morrowind and harsh limits on trainers so you can't spend a bunch of gold to get what you want. Back when the game came out I hung out on the gamefaqs forums and every single day there were several new posts from people asking why the hell everything started one shotting them and why they couldn't hurt enemies anymore. The game punishes you for leveling up and robs the player of any sense of progression

>>7861520
It's just one retard, me, the same retard, in both posts. I'm pretty smug about the other people in here blowing you the fuck out because you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to Oblivion. I lived it as a kid and I know what that game did. Zoomers like you belong on a cross

>>7858898
>you can't even afford to maintain the gear you need to even deal with random bandits
Just to add onto this, if you were using the Blade of Woe at its highest level scaled version, it would take either 32,640 gold or 21 grand soul gems to recharge it fully. It's such a poorly thought out system it's unreal at times. And it's not like the Blade of Woe is some god item that kills enemies in 1 hit either, half a dungeon of fighting ogres with it and it'll be out of charge.

Morrowind and Skyrim are the best
Oblivion's mechanics are surprisingly terrible, Skyrim legitimately has better RPG and character building and gear systems that give you more freedom to play as well as break the game.

>>7861652
It can be fairly enjoyable if you take the FF8 approach and min-max to the point of essentially removing combat from the equation.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=873311868
This guide, specifically in the 'Levels 12-16' part 3 and 4 detail how the weakness stacking system works, which can be used in spell form or enchanted on weapons (at a much lesser magnitude to make recharging as painless as possible) shreds anything and everything, no matter how ridiculous the level scaling gets.

>>7861680
>It's still good, you just have to not interact with combat in an action RPG and build your character in an incredibly specific way
The absolute state of vanilla Oblivion defenders.

>>7861680
At this point why the hell don't people just stop playing the game or just go play another game in the series that doesn't have this issue? Or just get a mod if you really care? I can't understand the stockholm syndrome people have for this game.

>>7855360
>tfw we will never have a 64bit Oblivion Special Edition made to run on modern PCs with better stability and optimization

>>7861685
I don't know about good. Decent maybe, but that's otherwise an accurate assessment. I think the game is at its best when you're exploring the world, avoiding the main quest, and doing whatever neat non-radiant side quests you encounter. I've never said anything about vanilla either, I'd never play bethshit without unofficial patches at bare minimum, but the combat isn't salvageable so a compelling option is to simply circumvent it.

>>7861692
>or just go play another game in the series
If you've already played through Morrowind and Skyrim several times, Oblivion can be worth a single playthrough.
>Or just get a mod
Mods don't really fix the scaling. Even OOO which is always recommended doesn't actually de-level the world Gothic style.

>>7861729
Well the original point I was on was discussing the original Oblivion release unmodded and some idiot tried to tell me I was wrong. I actually will say to the other guy you're responding to, OOO does make it an actually enjoyable game, but yes it absolutely needs mods to even be playable in my opinion, something I can't even say about Skyrim for as generic as that is.

>>7861760
>something I can't even say about Skyrim

Eh, Microsoft will break it soon enough.

>>7861695
I wish we had this so much. Fallout 3 could use it too

>>7858561
The game has a generic Tolkien-lite fantasy world as opposed to Morrowind which has its own characteristics unique to its world.

>>7861963
I'd honestly pay out the nose for remasters of Morrowind/Oblivion/Fallout3/NewVegas.

>>7862006
Cyrodil is a generic fantasy province cry some more about it. Morrowind is my favorite but oblivion haters are just retarded.

>>7862849
Yeah hating a game that is broken in it's core mechanics is retarded.

>>7861524
>>7861529
If your issue is getting demolished in combat from bandits and other enemies you feel should be low level relative to you the difficulty slider can be accessed at any time and you can set it so you're not chugging 30 health pots to clear a bandit camp. This doesn't fix gear like Fin Gleam being shit if you get it at a low level but it's an easy fix for people who choose to whine about noncombat builds.

>>7862862
Stop touching the difficulty slider retard its not perfect but it plays just fine unless you go and turn up the enemy health. Sorry you keep getting raped by daedra in kvatch retard

>>7862882
Its a fucking single player game you minmaxing autist. Sorry you can't run the perfect meta build you read in a guide cause you got some gear too early. Game ruined 0/10

>>7862882
>>7863260
How do you get through the day lacking self awareness to this degree? You stupid fucks literally are only defending Oblivion because it has the words Elders Scrolls slapped on it. You should both consider using a shotgun for your next haircut.

>>7863291
Im defending it because its fun you fun hating retard.

>>7863301
>having to play one specific build and completely broken level ups and level scaling is fun
Morrowind is fun. Daggerfall is fun. Modded Oblivion is fun. Fucking generic ass Skyrim can be fun. You have to be a cock sucking fanboy to consider vanilla Oblivion fun.

>>7863319
Why isn't it fun?

>>7863363
Oblivionfags can't even read

>>7863407
You say its broken but never state how. As if morrowind and every other bethesda game isn't broken either though so that is such a shitty non complaint.

>>7863513
I'm not writing >>7858898 again, go fuck yourself. It's well documented the level scaling issues in original Oblivion as well and I'm not paid to do simple Google searches for you.

>>7863525
I cant tell which posts are yours shit for brains but anyway you just suck dick and don't understand how to level your character properly my Breton crusader is a fucking beast and I can crush anything. If youre not getting +5s or 4s on your stats when you level you're doing it wrong and leveling up too many other skills. The only time you should have trouble with combat is if you touch the retard slider which does honestly make the game unfun. You are actually fucking terrible at the game. Youre not keeping up with anything because you don't even know how to raise your stats properly. Ive read your shitty rant in threads before it seems familiar you have Mike matei levels of video game retardation. Of course your warrior is getting blown the fuck out because youre only getting +2 strength per level and you took alchemy as a main skill and made a ton of potions causing you to level up and get a choice of +5 INT to go with your new 2 strength of course your character is going to suck fucking dick and get his ass kicked.

>>7855360
It's always going to be Morrowind. At least uuntil 6 comes out and has a chance to knock it off it's throne.

>>7859771
>aesthetically and gameplaywise

>>7855360
Daggerfall, hands-down. When Daggerfall Unity is released, we'll actually see some mods for it, which will be awesome.

>>7855360
Oblivion was the best so far. Yes, they made the map much smaller than it should have been, and yes, the final boss looked stupid, but overall the game looked and played great and was well fleshed out. Definitely the most complete Elder Scrolls game as well. Very few, if any plot holes, great story lines, lots of great and lengthy side quests (which is rare in any game). Loved it.

>>7855392
Only a few short years and Skyrim will officially be retro.

>>7855360
Hardcore RPG gamers can't stand this one, unless you are a plebian casual I would avoid it or never give it another try. None of the Elder Scrolls games are any good but if I had to choose one it would be Morrowind.

>>7859854
people say this, and its a tempting explanation, but I played multiple open world RPGs before this, including Morrowind, yet I still like Oblivion. I can't deny any of it's flaws, hell it's an RPG where you are better off staying at level 1 the entire game. Still love the game.

>>7855360
morrowind. I really like Daggerfall but the smaller handcrafted world is better than the gigantic entirely random one, I think.

>>7858128
>The combat sucks
soo....just like every game in the franchise?

>>7861695
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zkXR_FYnvM

Morrowind feels just more alive to me. I liked Oblivion too but it felt less serious, something you play for the sake of having fun. Morrowind felt like it had a morale to teach. Also I liked it's magic more.

>>7862006
Oblivion is a throwback to pre-Morrowind games, so it's fine being more generic fantasy.
>but muh PGE1 endless jungle
TES has been retconning itself since Daggerfall, who cares if it happens again. You fags are the prime example of
>it's fine when [X] does it
BTW, the real issue with the Oblivion landscape is not being generic, but being boring and empty because Bethesda was still working like they did in MW but this time didn't have fog to hide the lack of LOD and emptiness.

>>7864529
>the real issue with the Oblivion landscape is not being generic
No, it really is generic speedtree garbage while Morrowind was lovingly hand-crafted.

I haven't properly played Oblivion in 9 years because Skyrim ruined me. But I'll still boot up Oblivion to create a new character to explore the world with, trying to find all the map markers. Even after so many years Oblivions environment and atmosphere will never get old to me

>>7858561
Morrowinds world is completely unique in the general high fantasy setting of other tes games. But, thats because of kirkbride not tod howard. Oblivion is a fine game with a few worthy questlines and the aeylid ruins are legit good dungeons diving

>>7859775
>Daggerfall and its randomly generated crap isn't memorable at all.
Bruh, you never did the fucking lich king quest in daggerfall, kek. Just another shit for brains regurgitation machine. Theres plenty of non random quests in daggerfall, the main quest is legit the best main quest in any tes game.

I thought Morrowind was boring but loved Oblivion, at least a for a week or so.

>>7864780
>bruh
>kek
>Just another shit for brains regurgitation machine
The lack of self-awareness is stunning.

>>7861524
It does. I remember helping/watching someone play oblivion and i kept on saying, ohh youre gonna get wrecked here, but she didn't get wrecked. She adjusted the slider and combat was not as tedious. I did it on my last playthrough and it was not bad, though, i didn't slide it that far down.

>>7861528
From daggerfall to morrowind, bethesda was split into two groups. One worked on tes adventures: redguard, while the other worked on battlespire. Its kind of amazing they pushed out Morrowind, because after the debacles of redguard and battlespire, major changes happened to bethesdas corporate structure and who was working on what. This is when todd Howard was given more control than kirkbride, who at that point was not technically on the team working on Morrowind.

>>7864831
It literally does not remove leveled lists.

>>7864818
Yes, attack my character instead of my position. very intellect, much reddit.

>>7864852
It makes combat easier for non combat builds. Makes no sense for a level 30 character, who has been in a myriad of fights and dungeons to get 2 shotted by a fucking bandit. Technically the leveled lists are there, but its not as hard if you use the slider and by hard, i mean tedious

>>7864859
You aren't exactly inviting intellectual discourse when your position, and instant refutation of it one line later, is indistinguishable from parody.

You're free to try again without the zoomer brain rot.

>>7855360
morrowind had a cooler map. much cooler architecture. best tes soundtrack. better final boss.

Oblivion has radiant AI and horse armor, the game is a joke. That's why it became a meme.
>>7864780
Heil Weltraum Hitler!

>>7855360
I enjoyed it, but I hope whoever decided on that level scaling system got fired.

It makes rpgcodex seethe.

>>7855360
Skyrim. Oblivion is a meme.

>>7855360
>kill enemy with sword
>he floats away from the weapon's impact like a deflated rubber doll

Skyrim > Morrowind > Oblivion

>>7865539
Nope, Skyrim is more of a meme. I know Oblivion has its issues like with some of the faces outside of custences, and certain things about the radiant AI. Oblivion still has Mysticism and other stats that have been staples of the series. Skyrim FUCKING Removed Mysticism. Bethesda didn't sit on Oblivion for a decade, but they did with Skyrim. due to incompetence and narcissism seeping into the game dev team since after Fallout 3.

Not retro.

>>7865550
Which version did you play when this happened.

>>7865558
Every new Bethesda Fallout/ES is going to get more and more dumbed down, the new ES will probably resemble DOOM more than Morrowind.

>>7855360
all TES games are bad>>7855376

>>7862849
>>7864529
Lol I praised Oblivion for other qualities in this thread, so I'm far from a hater. There's nothing wrong with generic fantasy setting, but this also makes it fair to say there is little creative direction in the environment. They just made up for everything with BLOOOOOM.

>>7865747
>the new ES will probably resemble DOOM more than Morrowind.
honestly doesn't sound that bad if they really committed to it. i'd take that over "Skyrim 2"

Greetings /vr/

I wanted to revisit Oblivion again, the last time I played it was on PS3 years ago, and I just realized I have it on Steam. I remember the game's atmosphere being really peaceful and relaxing, but also remember Oblivion gates being a complete mess, and dungeons being pretty groan inducing after a while.

Are these mods good:
https://gamerant.com/elder-scrolls-oblivion-best-mods-ranked/

Will the game run decently, modded, and on high settings on my dated hardware? Cheers to anyone who replies.

>>7866348
Can't speak for that specific setup, but I remember playing the game on my A8-3870K APU rig ten years ago. It couldn't maintain 60 fps at high-maxed settings at 1080p, so I wouldn't expect any miracles from yours either. You may have to stick to gameplay mods and leave the graphics ones out if you want the game to run smoothly.

Holy shit vr keeps sliding into full v levels of pathetic. People are actually in here saying they are having Bethesda (tm) approved Fun (tm) by keeping track that they level up the Bethesda (tm) approved skills so they can level up properly. Remember if you aren't using the Bethesda (tm) approved character build, you aren't having proper FUN (tm).
Fuck skyrim has more build variety then oblivion

>>7866713
Yeah opening up past the year 2000 was a fucking mistake

>>7858417
>Playing this game for the first time back then was a mind blowing experience.
No it wasn't. The game was a big step down from Morrowind in almost every aspect.

>>7855360
>>7864230
nono you see these standards only apply to oblivion because muh.

it doesn't matter that skyrim is just a more blobified version of oblivion made 5 years after it was impressive.
it doesn't matter that morrowind has a tiny world that's artificially inflated by fog and hills, funneling the player through the same routes over and over.
it doesn't matter that morrowind's amazing dialogue consists of wiki-style word spam where 90% of the people in an area all "say" the same shit and you're just playing spot the difference.
it doesn't matter that morrowind is more broken in every way.
it doesn't matter that morrowind is ugly and generic fantasy beats the shit out of mud and mushroom aesthetic any day.

such criticisms ONLY apply to oblivion. this has been your morrowindbag training 101 course. how did you do? are you ready to have a correct "opinion" on the elder scrolls franchise yet? there are no refunds by the way.

>>7866772
Oblivion is fundamentally flawed trash in it's vanilla state and there is a reason it has less interest for it than Skyrim, Morrowind, or Daggerfall. COPE

>>7866841
We have already proven youre just terrible at games mike

>>7866896
Fuck off retard

>>7855360
I genuinely never understood why Obivion gets more hate than Skyim. Oblivion at the very least had decent guild quests. Skyrim was shit all the way through.

>>7866841
>derp derp derp game is shit derp derp derp

cope with the fact that you're a faggot.

>>7855360
Who cares?

>>7868719
Gothic 1 and 2 are top-tier, but they're in a completely different genre from TES.

>>7855360
with a soulfull UI like this is safe to say that oblivion is the best elder scrolls game.
super comfy game in general btw

>>7855413

Oblivion might be a broken mess, but Skyrim is fucking dull.

>>7869329
That's really bad gui design.

>>7870009
The more beautiful they get the duller they get.

>>7869329
>consoleshit UI
>soulful
Ask me how i know the 360 was your first console.

I'm old. I've been playing RPGs since 8-bit Bard's Tale loaded from cassette. To me, Morrowind is "next gen". So don't mistake me for a "zoomer" when I say, advisedly, that Morrowind is a boring and badly designed game. Some of the mechanics baffle me, like why even have the entire concept of "levelling up" like in D&D if you are also going to have a system where skills increase through simple practice? Why is almost half the population of Morrowind able to provide training services with no attempt at environmental context? Why is almost everyone's dialogue drawn from a common pool of stock phrases? You can break into the Queen's bedroom late at night and she'll say exactly the same thing that a lizardman peasant in the street would. The in-game books are fantastic, couldn't the guy that wrote them also have written the NPC dialogue? Whose idea was it for respawning Daedra to always drop incredibly valuable daedric weapons that trivialise the game?
>you don't have to do X, just roleplay it
Cool so in order to enjoy the game i have to deliberately NOT do comkon RPG activities like optimise my characters levelling or harvest valuable items, right

>>7870025
why? Because it doesn't take up all the space? There's a mod that fixes that.

>>7872658
It's just bait.

>>7864770
>Morrowinds world is completely unique in the general high fantasy setting of other tes games.
Skyrim is just as unique compared to other TES games, so I guess it also has artistic ambitions.

>>7858898
>that it turns the game into a fucking chore that actively punishes you for continuing to play it.
You described playing Morrowind to me honestly.
The game is probably supposed to have less tedium once you start leveling, but i just can't make it past the early phase of the game to get there because it's just fucking grueling.
I couldn't get into back around it's time of release and i still can't now.
The dice roll thing is just not fun in a game like this, i don't have issues with it in CRPGs either.

>>7874048
youre supposed to charge up your fucking attacks instead of rapidly swinging..

jfc, PLEASE tell me this is bait

>>7874774
Not my clip, just giving an example.
Fights can go on very long in early game and you're just standing there for ages clicking your left mouse button.
It's boring, there's no strategy to it.
It's the most mind numbing shit ever.

>>7874774
>>7874048
Youre still not going to fucking hit Nels llendo or whatever the fuck his name is at level 1 look what he's fucking wearing. Just pay him the gold and become homies.

>>7855360
Objectively the worst.
It, as a game by itself, is absolutely crippled by its leveling system to the point that the game becomes unreasonably punishing. Simply not leveling, which is the most common solution to the scaling in the base game, has the issue of locking out many creature types - causing entire species to go extinct and ruining the diversity of the world.
Ignoring playability concerns on modern systems heavily modded Oblivion is better then vanilla Skyrim, although that is hardly a accomplishment. Any TES game modded is better then any unmodded game in the series.

>>7867015
The leveling system being the worst leveling system in any video game ever, the milktoast LOTR enviroment, appealing to console players with the unmodded UI.
Skyrim is an extremely polished Oblivion that removes a lot of Oblivions faults. Oblivion is trying to be what Skyrim is, but fails at that.

>>7874048
This wasn't really a criticism back then when the game was released, its anachronistic to criticize Morrowind for this.

This is something that modern FPS players coming into Morrowind feel, since they are thinking of it like a shooter instead of a RPG. Like your sword is just a point-blank shotgun instead of a reflection of your character's attributes in battle with your opponents.
If Morrowind was a isometric game like Fallout 1 or 2 nobody playing it today would have any issue with the dice roll combat.

>>7855360
Eh, not really. It could have been the best though if some of their promises panned out right and it lifted more elements from Morrowind. It also has another dogshit character editor.

It does do a lot of things right though.

>>7876449
>This is something that modern FPS players coming into Morrowind feel
Did you miss the part of where i said I've played CRPGs and i don't find this to be an issue in them? generally because there is more strategy involved and management of your party.
This simply does not work in the 3d space, it doesn't mesh well with that sort of gameplay.
And i will state this simply is far more simplified than playing a video game that is based around being a table top RPG.
Therefore it loses it's appeal in that area as well.
This is the point of where Bethesda Softworks should have just committed to what they were doing like they did on Oblivion.
I haven't played Daggerfall so i can't comment on the combat on that game.
It's not to do with me being a modern FPS player, i picked this game up in a bargain section when it was at 10 dollars.
I don't think it was that far from release.
pic related

>>7855360
Its good and I enjoyed it more than morrowind - for combat.

>>7858128
>>7858143
>>7858898
I often see later TES games being criticised as having shallow shitty combat when it's really just a lack of imagination on the player's part.
My last playthrough of Oblivion, probably like my tenth, was my most enjoyable one yet and all I used was magic and my fists. You can use command spells plus conjuration as your main way of killing enemies. Anything else, you just stack weakness spells on it and kill it with a lightning touch or two.
Then when you get the staff of worms, you can really drown your enemies in mobs. You get in situations where you're fighting conjurers and they're fighting their summon which you've command creatured, their reanimated comrade's summon and your summon. Necromancy actually becomes somewhat viable when you realise that you can arm your thrall with a really powerful weapon before reanimating themthis can be game breaking in skyrim.
Magic really opens up the game, of course your first time you'll just hack your way through it and then say it was shit but there's no need whatsoever to play like that.

>>7855360
Yes

>>7858128
>>7858143

I often see later TES games being criticised as having shallow shitty combat when it's really just a lack of imagination on the player's part.
My last playthrough of Oblivion, probably like my tenth, was my most enjoyable one yet and all I used was magic and my fists. You can use command spells plus conjuration as your main way of killing enemies. Anything else, you just stack weakness spells on it and kill it with a lightning touch or two.
Then when you get the staff of worms, you can really drown your enemies in mobs. You get in situations where you're fighting conjurers and they're fighting their summon which you've command creatured, their reanimated comrade's summon and your summon. Necromancy actually becomes somewhat viable when you realise that you can arm your thrall with a really powerful weapon before reanimating themthis can be game breaking in skyrim.
Magic really opens up the game, of course your first time you'll just hack your way through and then say it was shit but there's no need whatsoever to play like that.

>>7858128
>>7858143

I often see later TES games being criticised as having shallow shitty combat when it's really just a lack of imagination on the player's part.
My last playthrough of Oblivion, probably like my tenth, was my most enjoyable one yet and all I used was magic and my fists. You can use command spells plus conjuration as your main way of killing enemies. Anything else, you just stack weakness spells on it and kill it with a lightning touch or two.
Then when you get the staff of worms, you can really drown your enemies in mobs. You get in situations where you're fighting conjurers and they're fighting their summon which you've command creatured, their reanimated comrade's summon and your summon. Necromancy actually becomes somewhat viable when you realise that you can arm your thrall with a really powerful weapon before reanimating themthis can be game breaking in skyrim.
Magic really opens up the game, of course your first time you'll just hack your way through and then say it was shit but there's no need whatsoever to play like that.

>>7858128
>>7858143

I often see later TES games being criticised as having shallow shitty combat when it's really just a lack of imagination on the player's part.
My last playthrough of Oblivion, probably like my tenth, was my most enjoyable one yet and all I used was magic and my fists. You can use command spells plus conjuration as your main way of killing enemies. Anything else, you just stack weakness spells on it and kill it with a lightning touch or two.
Then when you get the staff of worms, you can really drown your enemies in mobs. You get in situations where you're fighting conjurers and they're fighting their summon which you've command creatured, their reanimated comrade's summon and your summon. Necromancy actually becomes somewhat viable when you realise that you can arm your thrall with a really powerful weapon before reanimating themthis can be game breaking in skyrim.
Magic really opens up the game, of course your first time you'll just hack your way through and then say it was shit but there's no need whatsoever to play like that.

>>7876823
I just tried 5 fucking times to spoiler the line about Skyrim fucking fuck it if someone wants to let me know what the fuck they did to spoilers then thanks

>>7874048
Go play Gothic and Gothi 2 instead if you want good gameplay.