/vr/ - Retro Games

>>7821080
I hate emulation so much. Phone emulation in particular.

>>7821080
fyi this is a Poco X3, running the latest RetroArch with run ahead ("cutting edge anti input lag technology") on a Poco X3, which has a relatively fast 120hz screen. It's connected to the 8bitdo SN30 pro, a relatively popular Bluetooth controller that's not exactly cheap.

>>7821080
fyi this is the latest RetroArch with run ahead ("cutting edge anti input lag technology") on a Poco X3, which has a relatively fast 120hz screen. It's connected to the 8bitdo SN30 pro, a popular Bluetooth controller that's not exactly cheap.
Yet even fucking Gameboy games struggle with insane input lag.

>>7821102
1.5 frames, could be way worse. I've seen worse in official emulation products. Not even going to comment on Bluetooth because wireless always introduces more lag.

I've never seen someone bold enough to take out their phone gamepad out in public. Do people only use them to play at home or what?

>>7821080
Turn-based games works quite well on phone since input lag doesn't affect anything.

>>7821080
Is this how you are justifying purchasing your retarded chink shit portable? Sorry sweatie but hacked switch/3DS/Vita/PSP is and will always be better

>>7821102
Question is, is run ahead actually enabled on this video? It' ass not on by default. Add 1 frame of run ahead and you get exact frame timing as real hardware. Plus—yes, bluetooth controller adds lag

>>7821206
Unofficially this
Also
>No need for complex inputs so can be played even on touchscreen
>If someone distracts you, can always leave the game and go back to it later

>>7821080
>Real Gameboy has 44ms input lag
but you guys told me REAL HARDWARE has no lag whatsoever?

>>7821269
>he believes 4chan webms

>>7821202
The DS4 is literally faster by 10ms wireless than wired but sure, whatever you say, fampai.

>>7821207
>projecting this hard

>>7821231
Yes, it's set to 1 frame

>>7821292
You don't know how to read, do you?

>>7821292
This. It only makes sense that inputs would get delayed by having to travel through wire when, otherwise, they can instantly travel through the air.

>>7821080
>bought a GB Boy Colour off AliExpress mostly for the novelty of it
>use it mostly to play Shanghai at work for a couple weeks
>just decides it doesn't want to work anymore after those couple of weeks

>>7821083
>man, fuck convenience

>>7821425
Yes.

>>7821425
This man buys his groceries from a 7-11 because it's convenient.

>>7821207
woah now hold on, that's a crime, you're not allowed to modify your consoles, it's against the eula, it's unethical and it supports terrorism, honestly i think you should be banned for advocating stuff like that on 4channel

>>7821331
>You don't know how to read, do you?

I read
>Not even going to comment on Bluetooth because wireless always introduces more lag.
>because wireless always introduces more lag
>wireless always more lag.
which I understand boils down to
>Bluetooth more lag than USB
which is evidently false

>>7821532
Sony fucking up their USB implementation doesn't prove anything. Also, not retro, fuckshit. KYS.

>>7821536
How come DS4 wireless is faster than any other USB controller then? Also how are controllers used for emulation not retro?

Also, on a scale of 1-10, how mad are you right now?

>>7821536
kek kek
nigga lost his mind

>>7821532
>Switch pro
>+11ms

Jesus fuck. Im a Using a Bluetooth adapter on my switch for emulators too. And joycons. I think the switch in general has 10+ms

>>7821336
Electrical signals travel at the speed of light, there's no such thing as a delay because of the wire lol

>>7821632
>what is polling rate
>what is signal processing

You can't tell when the button is actually pressed with a setup like this. Need specific hardware/mods for good measurements.

>>7821632
There's no light inside the cables dipshit

>>7821292
change the polling rate
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0wcJM4FtXQ

>>7821668
wired ds4

>>7821674
That reading is absolutely meaningless, in reality the difference is 2.5ms wired 1000hz vs 3.5ms wireless. 1ms difference, which is absolutely meaningless and proof that the input lag on Android has little to do with Bluetooth or wireless itself but rather with how Bluetooth is handled on Android, how external inputs are generally handled on Android or how shitty the 8bitdo Controller is.

>>7821674
and this is without changing it

>>7821532
Has anyone ever tested the WiiU gamepad? It uses WLAN not Bluetooth

>>7821532
I don't know, I used DS4 wired on PC and bluetooth on the phone, and it was more laggy on the phone.

>>7821083
>hasn't used an emulator on crtswitchres or a runahead RA/low-latency mode MAME on a VRR capable TV
If you only knew how great it could be.

>>7821102
The refresh rate doesn't matter as much as whether or not it has VRR, and if not, whether vsync/hard sync/frame delay is on. Also
>8bitdo bluetooth
>for your fucking lag test
Fuck off, your whole methodology blows.

>>7821102
Also
>insane
The stupid touch screen is giving you a frame and a half of lag. Not bad at all for a stupid phone, and your probably shitty settings otherwise. I promise you, you aren't good enough at games for that to matter.

>>7821080
You really think you can tell the difference in 20 milliseconds?

>>7821772
You can hear a difference of 20 ms, but only if 2 things are playing the exact same content in close proximity.

For playability, no, most people cannot tell.

In fact, most people are quite used to 5 frames of input lag, and I would argue play with at least that much regularly, without even knowing it, as terrible as that may be.

I would probably say even the hardcore here likely play with up to 2 frames of lag, every day.

>>7821080
Are you dumb? You can clearly see that the sprite on the Color display is moving faster.

I can't wait until PS3 emulation becomes a common thing and you faggots start debating about how having less than a full second and a half of input lag in Killzone 2 ruins the experience

>>7821759
It doesn't, there is no true VRR support on Android, as anyone familiar with RA would know. Vsync and hard sync is on, as is literally the default setting
>hurr durr using a popular gamepad that has little latency when used on Windows or Linux is bad
Yeah, right

>>7821759
>The refresh rate doesn't matter as much
Of course it doesn't but what matters is that this 120hz panel in particular has a faster g2g time as for example the Poco F1 and many other Chinese 60hz phones.

>>7821468
more like he eats everything with a spork

>>7821807
>sped up gameboy color demonstration
>timer started too soon on the onscreen button press
>bluetooth 8bitdo controller
he's not dumb, he's lying

>>7821885
>popular = good
at least use it over USB or get a 2.4g controller. Bluetooth blows, and you can very clearly see it tacks on another frame or two and that's inches away. It has packet loss issues out the ass any real world distance away.

>>7822098
>it tacks on another frame or two
the fact that you are still thinking in ingame frames is just beyond me.

these threads are so autistic
just play the fuckin games

>>7822035
>sped up gameboy color demonstration
It's not a Gameboy Color you dumb fucking mongoloid and the sprite starts moving at exactly the moment specified in the video. Even if you were right, it would hammer my point down even harder, as the lead of the original hardware would increase even further.
>timer started too soon on the onscreen button press
That's the touchscreen input delay you're seeing. The delay from the physical press to the in-emulator button being actuated is one of the issues why gaming on touchscreens is barely more responsive than on controllers.
>bluetooth 8bitdo controller
They are literally all the same you gigantic fagmeister. Google literally ANY android controller + "delay" or "latency" and you will find countless people complaining about the very same issue. On the other hand, the delay this controller has on Windows is significantly shorter, meaning this is in fact an Android issue. And yes, both Windows and Android are using Xinput, don't even get me started on direct input and its latency.

>>7822138
Who the fuck plays games?

>>7821298
so… are you retarded? set it to 2-3 frames then. could get slightly choppy, but then again, the game itself has near 3f of lag, i wouldn't expect this

>>7821080
I can't even see what the fuck is happening on the gameboy

>>7821206
Honestly i could never go back to playing a game like pokemon on a gameboy ever again lmao. I got a old galaxy.
I just got like all the DS pokemon games , GBA etc. Its so fucking slow. X2 speed just feels so much better. Takes like a fuckin hour to do anything in a pokemon game normal

>>7821080
I've done the same measurements and posted videos in chink handheld thread some weeks ago. Got the similar numbers to OP running Metroid Zero Mission in Retro Arch WITHOUT runahead. Runahead with Metroid games on SNES and GBA works fine for two frames, so it cuts 33 ms from phone lag bringing it quite close to real hardware. And allows to use all RA niceties. This makes 6"+ Android phone with a decent wireless controller - the ideal retrogaming handheld.

Btw, amazonrelated costs 100 bucks, has a 6.5" bright screen and is fast enough to run Snes9x and mGBA cores with runahead:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Alcatel-6025H-2AALGB12-1S/dp/B091377TT8/

I've know for experiencie that the lag is pretty noticeable with a bluetooth gamepad.

>>7822803
It is, but 2 frames runahead in RA cuts 1/3 of this input lag, bringing it close to original hardware lag.

>>7821532
What's the explanation for this? Custom drivers? What is it be doing differently?

>>7821336
What about coding and de-coding the signal?

>>7822924
Put one of those decoder rings you could get from cereal boxes in front of the console, eliminates all delay.

>>7822952

>>7821341
buy chink get chinked

>>7822760
>that hand

I was looking into alternatives and I found this, anyone has some experience with wired gamepads on phones?

>>7821269
>b-b-but cope
Stay retarded zoom zoom

>>7822760
For anything that doesn't require analog input

>>7822760
Post it here

>>7822896
Bluetooth has a higher default polling rate. Forcing the gamepad to 1000hz on USB makes wired ~1ms faster again but at that point it's impossible to notice the difference.

>>7823303
Xbox360 wired works fine with Android phones, you need big USB to small USB connector for it.

>>7822956
>Gubarashi...
>pls

>>7823964
Will record the new one tomorrow.

>>7821205
I used dualshock 4 + phone setup in my car before but I'd never take it further than that. Public places are too loud for gaming.

>>7821231
Yeah no you don't. Android is laggy garbage.

>>7821269
Looks like it's shot at 240fps, so 44ms is less than 1 frame. Which is Impossible since we know real GBs take exactly 1 frame to display the image. Which means OP's test is wrong and the GB would have 64ms of lag.

>>7822820
Runahead will not work past 1 frame if the game has only 1 frame of internal lag. You start getting rollback glitches and no actual reduction in latency.

>>7821543
> Usain Bolt standing still
> I walk past him
> I must be faster than Usain Bolt!

It says more about how Sony implemented their USB connection than Bluetooth actually being faster than USB.

>>7821543
faggot
>>7821080
don't bother with any emulators or plastic chinkshit, hack a 2ds you can get on ebay for like 90 bucks

I had a bad experience with bluetooth, maybe it varies between gamepads and phones, but for me it didn't work well.

>>7826417
>don't bother with any emulators or plastic chinkshit, hack a 2ds you can get on ebay for like 90 bucks
I have a 3DS, Vita, PSP Go, Dingoo A320, OpenPandora, GPD Win, a hacked Switch and various other chink handhelds, plus the phone in the video and the 3DS is by far the worst device I've ever used for emulation because of the atrocious display. The 2DS looks so goofy that I would never use something like that, honestly. I would literally use anything else, though the GPD Windows devices are probably the best if you want good portable gaming. Also, stop being a poorfag.

3DS has great original games and ports though, video related.

>>7827558
The major problem of emulation on 3DS is that the weird resolution means you would have to use filtering for most systems, which makes them look like shit. Plus, the device is too weak for anything N64 and above, something even cheap chink handhelds can do these days.

(Again, I'm not hating on the 3DS as a console but using it for emulation is a meme and only people who never tried anything else would propagate this.)

>>7827558
>>7827561
Personally I'd go with either a hacked Vita or Switch in terms of hacked mainstream handhelds. Like you said, the 3DS is a pretty solid platform in its own right but as an emulator system it's hardly ideal, even if it can technically run a lot of platforms.

what the fuck kinda systems are you trying to play that 1. are too resource intensive and 2. they don't fit on the display? are you guys not content with nes-snes anymore???

>>7827910
>1. are too resource intensive
PSX, N64, Dreamcast, Gamecube, PSP. These are systems most ARM-based Chink handhelds can play and the 3DS can only play to an extent (PSX performance is now better on n3DS but still far from perfect, all other systems don't run at all).
>2. they don't fit on the display?
Anything that is not 400×240, which is basically anything. It's a stupid resolution to emulate on and your only solution to avoid black bars is to use non-integer scaling, which makes it look worse than most chink handhelds.

>>7827949
why are you expecting good performance from 5th games

>>7827558
>spends money on all kinds of dogshit-tier emulation machines because he can't stop consooming plastic trash
>s-stop being poor *orders a 9999 in 1 brick game*
A fool and his money I suppose.

>>7827623
What makes the 3DS not ideal? No malice, just curious. I don't run emulators much on handhelds, but I do have some basics (gb, nes, snes) on there and they run fine. I haven't heard anything about problems before.

Since you mention vita, does that have native emulators at all, or is it all PSP stuff? I was hoping for good emulation of dreamcast and n64/saturn, but I've only ever heard of running PSP emulators on Vita, and that it didn't run as well anyway.

>>7827949
320x240 does fine on 3DS, but it sounds like you want 480 stuff.

I'm surprised that there are devices that can run GameCube at full speed on a portable. They must be expensive though, as I've not yet seen one that was perfect, but I'm also a cheapskate who doesn't keep up with new hardware.

>>7827969
at least the 9999 in 1 brick game can provide me warmth and confort in knowing the 500 tetris and racing game variations will always be there for me, chink shit cannot even do that. dont diss my boy 9999 in one brick game

>>7827983
Well from a straight screen resolution standpoint the Vita gives you much more flexibility with scaling. Anything running at a weird line count on 3DS kind of leaves you out of luck. And like you said, no real way to do anything taller or the like. Performance is hit and miss too, even on N3DS.
As for systems well obviously you essentially get PSP and PS1 'for free' on Vita, both running essentially natively. You can even use some Vita-specific patches for PSP games that don't work on emulators to add dual analog support in a few titles. The option of native ports of a couple PS2 games are nice to have too. And for emulators you've got native ports of basically everything these days. A lot standalone and a bunch more through retroarch. You really don't need to do stuff through the PSP emu layer anymore and anyone still talking about it as the only legit option is either out of the loop or deliberately downplaying the system. N64 emulation is also coming along, through a project that shares advances with the emulator on 3DS. Honestly not sure how performances compares there, haven't fired it up on my N3DS yet to check. But it's a viable option and a bunch of titles are already playable, it's past the proof-of-concept phase.

>>7827993
Interesting. Is there a site that hosts vita homebrew? I don't know shit about it, seems like

>>7828000
VitaDB is a bit of an eyesore to navigate but it has a lot of stuff. Wololo also covers the scene a lot.

>>7828026
Vita has a pretty extensive homebrew scene and lots of great ports (TheFlow almost rivaling ptitseb here), but regarding emulation, it performs worse than the much cheaper ODROID-GO Super on N64 and Dreamcast. Even mGBA does not run all games at fullspeed on Vita, which is kind of infuriating, given that gpSP and VBANext are pretty shit in comparison, the cheaper ODROID-GO runs it perfectly and the 3DS can play these games basically natively.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdP4gqRNEw8

>>7827954
Because similarly priced chink handhelds can emulate them. Plus, they are able to run much recent versions of emulators for older consoles, which results in better accuracy. Seeth all you want but we all know that these devices have much better internal hardware than Nintendo's 6 year old New 3DS and therefore perform better, for a lower price.

>>7828140
I'm not pushing the Vita as the device to get for handheld emulation, just so we're clear. In terms of performance for your money a major system is never going to compare to a chink emulator handheld. The reason to use one is generally to expand utility of a system you already have, in my view at least. Ergonomics and build quality are also generally better. I'm mainly just talking in response to people that insist the 3DS is the better system for this kind of thing, which I don't really agree with. If you don't want a 3DS or Vita AS a 3DS or Vita, then I wouldn't recommend them for these purposes in the first place.
And yeah, I wish some of these cores got more love.

>>7821632
Not entirely correct. Electricity travels at 2/3 the speed of light over copper wire, on average.

>>7828156
>Ergonomics and build quality are also generally better.
While chink handhelds have improved in recent months (especially with regards to ergonomics and the % of shitty batteries), it's obvious that both the n3DS and the Vita have a much better feel to them and I'd chose them over something like the RS97 any day. It's also easier to simply use a device you already have for emulation, which is why phones are so popular to begin with. But the mentality of
>dude lmao just get a hacked a 2DS/3DS/Vita/PSP
if your main goal is emulation and not playing these handheld's native libraries is nothing but a shitty meme.

The best option by far is of course to become a /g/entooman and build your own RBPi cm4 based handheld device on something like the Circuit Sword, with a classic Gameboy casing. It's the true testament to autism but it can run everything up to PSP and Gamecube (albeit not very well) and even play x86 PC indie games via box86.

Pic semi related.

The chink handhelds work better, I'm sure. I just have no reason to put faith in them. Every random china miracle I've tried has been a low-quality piece of shit. Sure, better specs than 5-10 year old hardware, but build quality and even basic behavior were poor. Always felt like you were gonna lose it working the next day. GPD sticks out particularly well in this regard; I've owned a few of their pocket computers, and they were so touchy about whether or not random things that were in-spec or held to given standards would actually work in-spec or follow the standard. Maybe they're just a bad company, but I can't say I've used or seen anything else that has changed my mind.

>>7821080
Most people can't notice input lag above 200 ms

>>7828219
Aside from your meaning "below" rather than above, I struggle to fathom this as reality. 200ms is 12 frames of lag, 6 if it's 30fps. Surely such a massive delay is noticeable to the average player. Where's your source for that number?

>>7821269
seething emutranny

>>7821772
The first time I realized something fishy existed was during the double jump you have to do in this screen in mario 1, I was playing at the office with a friend and it was extremely hard, then I tried at home in the console and it really wasn't difficult...of course since then I continue playing on emulators all the time while my nes serves mostly as a decoration, but you can fell the difference for sure

>>7821772
yes, easily

>>7828185
>china miracle
Performance you never encounter!!

Lol you all are so passionate in hating chink devices. Anbernic and the newest GPD Win are of much higher quality than previous chink emu gadgets.

this is such a zoom zoom thread it hurts, when you faggots are older then 20 your brains are going to be so slow you won't even notice thw difference between anything lower then 100ms delay

>emulation bad
Notice how this shit only started popping up after normalfags bought heavily into retro-collecting and drove the market up from $35 for moderately rare carts into paying $200 for mass produced earthbound carts and $1500-$5000+ for non-arcade exclusive versions of Cave PCBs.
It's so incredibly transparent. Just like the shilling of studio monitor CRTs after shysters started flipping them.

>>7828851
I'm 31 and if you can't tell the difference between 40 and 80ms, go have your brain checked.

>>7828894
No, Android emulation bad. We've been able to emulate game with little input delay on PC for years and all of this only started when normalfags started using phones and tablets as substitutes for actual PCs.

>>7828851
You understand you're outing yourself as a zoom zoom when you pretend to know about what happens when someone's older than you are, right?

>>7829264
I'm in my mid 50's and can easily tell the difference between even much smaller intervals. It's the difference between landing a hit or getting hit in nearly any fighting game. I fucking love how emufags cope saying they can't notice 100ms when even smashfags cry about moves taking that long with 0 lag. No point zoom zoom getting his brain checked. There's nothing there. Just an empty echo chamber that youtube shouted some cope into.

>>7829264
Random japanese muh aesthetic so vaporwave

>>7831112
http://classic.jisho.org/words?jap=%E3%83%90%E3%83%8A%E3%83%8A&eng=&dict=edict

>>7829264
Hey, I'm just passing the Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine right now!

Another good variant for retro handheld.

>>7821080
>Use bluetooth
>Get lag
WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWWWW

>>7823303
I use a razor kishi

>>7821497
>Based 4channel poster.
Sneed.

>>7821772
Lag is cumulative. You want to lower it in as many places as you can and the controller is one of the easier ways.

>>7821080
I didn't care about this shit when I was 10 on real hardware, I don't care about it now.

>>7834051
What a dumb retort because if the system you were playing on was laggy as shit you would have cared when you were 10 and if you wanted to play it now you would care now.

>>7832498
Read the thread, moron. On PC, DS4 has less lag via Bluetooth than USB.

40 ms = 3 frames
80 ms = 6 frames
It's not that bad. Some Saturn games like Guardian Force have built in 7 frames and it's still acceptable.

>play fighting game online
>70 ms lag average on top of TV screen lag
>playable
>b-b-but muh bing wahoo, you have to buy the real thing from my coomlection
Yeah ok retard

>>7821749
>MAME for GB

MAMEs GB core is horrible second only to GB on VBA.

>>7821832
We shouldn't have even let the 6th gen faggots onto this board.

Love gaming on my cell phone