/vr/ - Retro Games

>>7774773
>why does this exist?
hd textures? xashxt or whatever?

>>7774784
half-life: source, anon

>>7774797
oh ok. cos it cost like nothing i guess

>>7774773
Because they could put the OG code though google translate and the result was somewhat passable and they could sell it.

>>7774797
The Source Engine was just a huge deal when HL2 finally came out, so this was kind of inevitable (if not a wee-bit disappointing).

Source's flashlight is better than Goldsrc's and the bugs make the experience funnier.

>>7774773
why do you exist?

>>7775103
my parents loved each other but I'm not a cripple like this game

>>7774773
It's a demonstration to show how easy it is to port GoldSrc mods to Source.

...and then they charged for it.

Valve at one point decided to do a full source engine remake of HL1, but very very early on in development someone realized that you can just directly port Goldsrc maps directly into Source and it mostly works, so they just did that instead.

>>7774773
It's a good demonstration of the differences between engines, like RTX Quake now.

>>7774773
the idea of having your first encounter with an icthyosaur be centered a shark tank is cool but they didn't make the rest of the area design make sense. OpFor sort of does this better but without the same scare factor of being dropped in the water.

>>7775790
Did they fix the cubemaps? I thought it had the same reflection everywhere.

>>7775790
hl1 water didn't look this shit if you didn't use OpenYourAssGL

>>7777636
What did it look like

>>7777649
transparent and rippley
gif version (not my twitter):
https://twitter.com/i/status/1066947983730663424

>>7777667
is there any way to put these features back while also using GL or is it just strictly software mode?

I found my old 1998 retail intallation CD for Half-Life. What kind of hassle is there going to be if I try to install it on a modern OS? And if it works, does the software renderer work?

>>7777667
>transparent
That depends on the surface, not the renderer. That same one at the tentacles is also opaque in software mode.

>>7777797

>>7777782
It worked (mostly) fine when I used Windows 7, though it did crash on me once. https://youtu.be/RYfJC2aqZcQ
The Opposing Force patch helps a lot without changing too much, but you do lose that extra glock capacity gimmick.

>>7777841
I don't have the OpFor patch. I mysteriously managed to somehow lose my Blue Generations box and all 4 discs held within sometime in 2002-2004. All I have left is the manual which has the keycode that let me unlock everything in Steam.
I don't have anything left of the 1998 retail but the CD. Fortunately I have memorized the 13 digit code for some reason.

>>7777853
Just download v1.0.1.6

Anything afterwards fucks the game up in a couple of ways.

>>7777762
technically yes but you have to do some black magic with half life sdk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ga0V-UZEr0
>>7777782
yes, but you're better off downloading one of the pre cracked WON versions that are floating around
>>7777797
true, but a lot of the time the water in software mode has lower opacity

>no anon's won links post

>>7777667
I only saw that type of water in videos about the alpha. cool

>>7774773
Because at the time Valve was "committed" to porting/remastering games for Source, like Counter-Strike Source, Day of Defeat Source, and Half-Life Source although the latter sucks. On the other hand, the modding scene played around with the idea of doing sequels or ports for Source as well, like Natural Selection and Sven Coop but of course they went nowhere because the amount of work for Source grew exponentially compared to Goldsrc.

>>7777649

>>7777862
i can't find a crack for it.
It asks me to insert the cd.
Also any way to make the music play?

>>7778783
I don't know about you, but I think I'll just extract the CD iso and then use a virtual drive so the game can play the cd music from that drive.

>>7778556
Software mode is so based.
What games have a good software mode? I know HL, Thief, and Quake.

>>7779480
I don't know about "good" functionally, but I've been playing Dungeon Keeper recently in software mode and it looks nicest that way. The low resolution that can't be changed just makes things a bit cumbersome.

>>7779480
Unreal was practically built for software rendering, though you do lose out on detail textures.

>>7777896
I wonder if a similar effect is feasible on period-correct hardware without texture streaming. The NVIDIA hardware had some sophisticated multitexturing.

>>7779480
If it's so based then why it doesn't work in fullscreen for me.

>>7779708
Because Steam a shit.

>>7779764
Can't display properly in WON version too.

>>7779480
Not sure if software is based (it is), but rather id and Valve sucked at implementing hardware rendering, full of bugs and shit

>>7779778
Compatibility was more of a concern than anything back then. They didn't bother implementing fast driver routes, for instance.
Only when they ditched software altogether did Id take acceleration seriously, and it shows.

>>7778783
>>7779708
https://www.moddb.com/downloads/half-life-won-resolution-fov-mp3-patch

>>7779969
doesn't work for older versions

>>7778556
SW render in GoldSrc is so soulful

>>7778556
Look how everything looks better in software mode, the textures, light etc. but you have this generation who played quake2 first, that broken disaster, and they think that games are *meant* to look like the left

>>7780897
Nobody ever mentions this so I don't know if it's ever noticed. But in software the HUD is crisp and sharp, but in hardware it looks noticeably softer, it's actually because there is a half pixel blur on the whole thing as the HUD sprites are positioned with decimals instead of integer (exactly like what happens in Photoshop)

>>7780918
Fuck I hit post too soon. You can confirm this sprite mis-placement by looking at the top of the HUD numbers. The very top row of pixels is cut off like the zero.

>>7780918
That blur might be a feature instead of a bug desu. Being slightly blurry looks good for a hud that's already glowing light, and it matches the rest of the textures.

>>7781096
Yeah, no.
The HUD already glows plenty in software, and a truncated zero is unambiguously a bug.

>>7774773
Half Life Source was created by Valve to show modders and developers how easy it would be to port their classic Half Life mods to Source.

That's the entire reason it exists.

"blows my mind" is too strong a sentence, but im always surprised theres people who will make long threads about something like water graphics in half life when they will barely talk about the actual content of half life

also ps2 version best version

>enable 32bpp
>fucking z-fighting
Guess I'll stick with 16bpp...

>>7782657
That's odd. If anything, 32bpp should fix z-fighting by increasing the depth buffer precision.
Is the issue with decals? This was a common problem that was supposed to be addressed with that decal offset cvar.

>>7782627
>also ps2 version best version

>>7782732
Yes it affects all the "Danger", "Hazardous Materials", "Keep Clear", etc. signs posted on walls throughout the game. Didn't know there was a way to correct it so I always just stuck with the default 16 bit color depth.

>>7782734
yes

>>7777782
https://mega.nz/folder/CldGAahb#yn_8LkRHraywPgKJMp5pqA

Win98 games > Half Life.7z

It's the last WON (pre-steam) version running on the Xash engine, imo the best way to play as it will work without hassle and has HD resolution support, mp3 soundtrack support etc

>>7782806
As neat as Xash3D is, it feels off in many ways.

I wish we could just get a true source port with no reverse engineering.

>>7782806
>1.1.1.0
Anon...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKkJPFmDW9Q

>>7783173
What's the best patch for Half-Life? I tried using 1.0.0.9 but certain scipted sequences were broken like the trash compactor.

>>7783229
Anything before 1.1.0.0
Upgrade to 1.0.1.6, you can install Opposing Force with it.

>>7783173
>This video again
The SMG speed is tied to the frame rate.
https://i.warosu.org/data/vr/img/0037/00/1482795326182.webm

>>7783236
Thanks. I'll give 1.0.1.6 a try.

>>7783173
Interesting
>>7783236
Was the camera tilt feature removed at 1.1.x.x or was it removed with the patch following 1.0.0.9?

>>7782627
so what are you some kind of storyfag? are you the guy in the fear thread who says "the combat is amazing, best ever but the wOrLd isn't interesting so i get bored of it after 5 minutes"?
go play your kojimashit or kingdom hearts or whatever

>>7783110
nobody thinks this pic or your other ~3 look as good as you seem to. get some better examples

>>7783348
1.1
There's virtually no difference between 1.0.0.9 and 1.0.1.6 that I am aware of.

>>7783398
Nobody? Who are you speaking for? The voices in your head?
>get some better examples
Such as? That's just a classic stock map. Here is a custom one to mix things up a bit.

>>7782772
The textures look like shit.

>>7783652
no

>>7778556
Is hardware even trying?

>>7783492
Thank you, sir. Much appreciated.

>>7777897
here you go
https://pastebin.com/4Hva72v7

>>7783236
Still getting the trash compactor bug with 1.0.1.6. It's weird because the collision for the compactor is moving and crushing the crates and stuff but the walls won't budge. Wish I knew what was causing this.

>>7777619
OF's water chapter was the high point of the game

>>7783396
why would you make a random guess and then springboard off of it to get mad at someone

>>7784306
Could be this?
https://youtube.com/watch?v=oGi6LDNHD74

>>7779480
ut2004 uses rad game tools pixomatic
it's good?, I don't know, it runs

>>7784316
internet

>>7783249
did he change computers between patches?

>>7784363
I don't think that's the issue. I also have a similar problem with the water in Power Up when you have to drain the generator room. Rather than draining down as it should, the water just disappears instantly. Seems like some kind of animation issue. It doesn't occur on 1.1.1.0.

>>7784546
>>7784306
I remember getting this too. I thought it was just a general problem with the WON version on modern PC's.

>>7784446
Maybe one version runs better? It's evident in the video that the frame rate isn't stable, so that's likely a factor.

>>7785059
>I thought it was just a general problem with the WON version on modern PC's.
Wouldn't surprise me. Thing is, I'm using hardware from ~2010 on a win XP system so I thought I'd be in the clear for the most part. It's a shame because that's the only real issue I've encountered on the pre-1.1.1.x patches.

>>7786064
where did you get your copy?
mine ask me to insert a cd even when i update it to 1.0.1.6

>>7786085
It's the original retail release. I also get the CD check issue but only on the base game. Any patch corrects that problem for me.

>>7786147
which patch?

>>7786171
I believe the very first patch to the game addressed something with the CD check.

>>7786171
This
>>7786185
Anything other than the base version of the game will fix it.

>>7785059
>I remember getting this too. I thought it was just a general problem with the WON version on modern PC's.
You wouldn't happen to have any more info on this issue would you? I'm trying to figure out if it's a problem with my graphics card (GTX 580) or with my OS (XP). I was able to find one post on reddit about the issue but there was no resolution unfortunately.

>>7787289
I'm surprised it happens on XP. I experienced it on Windows 7.
The GPU probably doesn't matter if it runs in software mode.

Maybe it's on some deep hardware level. I'd love to find out what exactly causes this.

>>7787373
>The GPU probably doesn't matter if it runs in software mode.
Good point. I'll test it out in Software to at least rule out the GPU. I also have a ATI x850xt I can try.

>>7787373
>>7787389
Same issue with the x850xt... I'm thinking it must be some sort of compatability issue with windows XP and later.

>>7782806
>Win98 games > Half Life.7z
I tried it. Worthless. Not only can you not play in software mode, but it has the fucking "HD pack" installed. The only reason to play this over the Steam version is no DRM.

>>7789005
You can uninstall that in 2 seconds by deleting the 'models' folder. What is it with people nowadays, wanting everything to be tailored exactly for their specific needs, or else it's 'worthless'. It comes with being born a zoomer?

>>7789005
Another 2 second fix you could easily have known, to get the software mode-ish textures (no filtering) open config.cfg and simply change gl_texture_nearest "0" to "1"

>>7789391
You have to be a zoomer to even consider the possibility that someone on a classic HL graphics thread is a zoomer. Deleting a resource folder so it uses the pak file instead is fine and all, but software mode still doesn't exist. What's the point of offering a WON version if it still includes the updates that ruined it?

>>7789407
If you were actually there back in the day, you were blown away by the blue shift hd models and wouldn't be saying hw rendering "ruined" the game. You're behaving like the epitome of a zoomer hipster who wasn't there, and totally misunderstands the mindset of those who were.

>>7789407
Pic in OP (and therefor the topic being debated in this thread) is the Half Life: Source port, apples and oranges. Wanting to use a deprecated software renderer from the DOS Quake era is fine, but don't be a religious zealot and attack everything that isn't your precious Software Mode. Heck, why not go back to 320x200?

>SEE YOU'RE USING SHITTY 1024x768 THIS IS WORTHLESS I WANT MY 320x200 TO GET THE FULL AUTHENTIC HALF LIFE EXPERIENCE

>>7789409
I did in fact find it annoying that the blue Generations box changed the 9mm SMG into an assault rifle, and the fact that the shotgun cocking sound is louder than its firing sound. I even tried to selectively replace the assets with the originals which looked inconsistent because the HEV hand models are different

>>7789441
I remember when Blue Shift was released (retail), you could opt out of the HD Pack during installation (for not overwriting the Half Life base game's assets). Perhaps they made it the default later in the Generations Box then.

>>7778556
Software mode also had a "blur" whenever you wake up / teleport

>>7789479
iirc, the HD is the default on the blue Generations installation but I had figured out previously how the file structure of Half-Life works so I knew where the model replacements would be installed.

>>7780897
I will never understand why anyone can prefer the muddy, blurry, garbage that is texture filtering. For me point filtering looks so much nicer and crisper, especially when the textures are low resolution.

>>7789608
To me, it's not really about whether or not textures look better or worse with filtering. The issue with Half-Life in particular is that when Valve patched in OpenGL, for some reason it messed up the way textures are loaded in the engine. There are a lot of prefabs in HL1 where an exact texel density and pixel aspect ratio was applied, so that the game world would have a consistent appearance regardless of what you're looking at. Sure, sometimes there are exceptions, for example background geometry at long range. The OpenGL update somehow stretched or contracted the UV maps, making the textures look slightly distorted compared to the original. It's not very noticeable in OpenGL, but if you turn off filtering it becomes noticeable. That's the reason I want to find a way to play the original unpatched retail version. To see the game in the format in which it was originally made.

Because a shitty linear game with crappy controls and bad gameplay exists. HL was terrible and just like Mario 64, the sooner modern "gamers" realize it was terrible, the sooner we can fix gaming to stop being style over substance trash.

>7789805
*Correction: Certain prefabs have UV maps that were aligned with the exact outlines of their textures, and those textures had arbitrary resolutions, not resolutions corresponding to power of 2 (not 16, 32, 64, 128 etc). The OpenGL update mandated all textures to be normalized to power of 2 resolutions. Valve programmed a conversion system that could automate that process for all textures and their corresponding UV maps, but it was imperfect, and most UV maps in the game became misaligned with their original textures due to the resolution change.

>>7782627
I started with the PS2 version and only recently (as in the last eight years) played the PC version of Half Life. I only discovered you could turn off the HD models last year. I actually like it more with the original look, I always hated how spent cartridges flew out the tip on the pistol and the magic 9mm M4.

>>7789836
Are you okay anon it sounds like you have a bad case of contrarianitis

>>7789836
Did you get lost on the way to /v/?

>>7789543
Bullshit. I have the blue Generations box, two versions in fact, and the HD stuff is all a part of the Blue Shift installation.
It does come with a patched Half-Life, so you get all the nasty bugs.

>>7789608
I will never understand why anyone can prefer the pixelated, aliased, garbage that is nearest neighbor. For me, bilinear filtering looks so much nicer and natural, especially when the textures are 24-bit.

>>7789945
Half-Life in particular has visual features that are specific to software rendering. The nearest neighbor filtering is just what you have to deal with.
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1933827927

>>7790014
I love how many of the listed reasons might as well be used against software mode.

Vertex snapping? Color depth reduction? Texel-dependent decals? I'd gladly do without them if I could.

Also
>If you had like an Intel HD Graphics and a Ryzen 9 3900X then you will have more FPS in Software renderer

At modern resolutions? Doubt.

>>7790037
Correct. It's not like hardware acceleration ruined the game or anything. It's a trade-off. Also, I don't think they meant that you actually get more FPS in software mode with that kind of hardware. They meant that you might get software to perform better than it normally would, but I also doubt that. A single core of a modern CPU should be able to handle Half-Life in a reasonable resolution.
But personally I would like to see the unmolested texels of the original textures and the seamless random tiling again. And the ripple water effect of course.

>>7789416
>REEEE
Anon just wants to play the old version, and he wasn't talking about making it look like OP pic.

>>7777667
Why on earth did they make the hardware version uglier than the software version? They just didn't know how to use openGL or what? Why even support it then, since people will automatically use the highest settings they can manage (meaning hardware at the time)

>>7790191
I would have been sold on software if it supported 24-bit color. It's so close to being perfect, but there is that major downside there.
Unreal supports 24-bit with its software renderer, and it looks so unbelievably up to snuff as a result.

>>7790542
I think it's a difficult programming dilemma to switch from 16-bit to 24-bit because of the way 16-bit color is coded. You have 5 bits for red, 5 bits for blue and 5+1 bits for green. In 24-bit color you have a neat distribution of 8 bits per color channel. So, if a renderer is programmed to use a system where one channel arbitrarily has a single bit more, it might not be that easy to produce a viable higher-bit alternative.
And as we can see from the fact that Valve neglected to reprogram the ripple water material and the randomized seamless tiling to OpenGL, they were obviously cutting corners. They didn't even try to add 24-bit color, because that would have been hard. Hell, would it have even been that difficult to make their OpenGL renderer support non-power-of-2 texture resolutions like their software renderer does?

>>7774773
I think I've heard that this port used to be actually okay back when it first launched, but as time when on and it got more updates, it ended up turning into the train wreck we all know nowadays.

>>7790387
Because OpenGL 1.1 is limited.

>>7790632
If anything, that makes it easier. You can do the same math on all three components and exploit parallel processing.
On the other hand, you can fit more vectors into MMX if they are small.

>>7790647
This is partially true. Don't listen to Gmanlives.
It was never what I would call "ok" though

>>7791005
>exploit parallel processing.
But 1998 commercial CPUs were single core. You couldn't have all that many threads back then, especially considering that "doing the same math" locks up those calculation resources for every instruction, and some resources are required for multiple parts of the pipeline at the same time, causing even more non-operation cycles. For example if you calculate R G and B threaded, G has to wait a cycle for R to write its result because the architecture that fetches the G instruction is the same as the one that writes the R result. 60 frames per second is quite a demand for that kind of limitation.
Then again I don't actually know what kind of architecture or instructions single-core 1998 x86 CPUs had. They might have something for calculating multiple simple instructions of similar bits at the same time.

Give me a crack for 1.0.1.6

>>7791073
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIMD

>>7791215
Oh. That makes perfect sense, thanks. It's not really computing three different values for the three color channels in parallel processing, but considering all channels as a single binary number and performing different calculations on parts of it if I understood it correctly.

Ok but how i can make software mode to display properly in fullscreen.

>>7777777
Czeching

>>7791304
newfag

>>7790387
Wait till you see quake 2 -devs at that time were willing to trash everything about their game's graphics/look to get that hardware 'performance' (frame rate i guess)

>>7791271
throw your lcd in the garbage where it belongs

>>7774773
why does this exist?

>>7791254
Huh? Single binary number?

It's pretty much by definition considered parallel. How it processes different values is arbitrary and flexible.
More specifically, CPU's at the time supported MMX, which theoretically allows for up to eight integer calculations at the cost of one. The numbers don't have to be same, just the operations and data types.

https://software.intel.com/sites/landingpage/IntrinsicsGuide/#techs=MMX

>>7793001
Okay, but if their renderer was programmed to do 5-bit calculations for R and B and 6-bit calculations for G, wouldn't they basically need to rewrite everything to make it support 8-bit calculations for all three channels? The 24-bit color is neatly segmented to 8-bit parts and fit well in the processing of an x86 CPU. But the 5- and 6-bit parts of the 16-bit color seem to require some extra work. Just because the 24-bit is simpler doesn't sound to me like the conversion to it would be simple because of the weird inconsistency of the 16-bit.

>>7793056
It's always easier to remove than to add.

I have no idea how the framebuffer blitting works, but I can imagine that it works internally with high-precision variables and then packs it into 16-bit pixels during the last step. Nothing but that last step would have to be changed, then.

It's already in a whole different territory than that of palette lookups.

>>7782627
>>7783676

Cope.

>>7793245
Why are the BSP geometries completely different between those screenshots?

>>7793339
Ask Randy Pitchford.

>>7789608
Would you really look at this and think it ought to have filtering disabled?

>>7793416
Well, some of those horrible texture seams would disappear because aliased pixel edges would hide them in all instances where edges align with U and V.

>>7793245
right is crisper, but left has better colors/lighting

>>7793469
Speaking of edges, filtering can do a good job of hiding boundaries and creating convincing transitions.
See the shade between his skin and right glove.

>>7793976
Here the illusion is kind of ruined. What looked like shading now looks like a part of the painted surface.

>>7793976
Bilinear filtering has always been best used for smooth gradient transitions. I don't think anyone wants to imply that it has zero value in graphics.
Also, lol at the 90° tiles on the left and the abrupt 100% drop in texel density on the right.

>>7794095
>They included this sloppy piece of work for 1.6 and made it into one of the most popular maps today, while this work of art is completely forgotten

Why.

>>7774773
Reflections and physics, dazzled with enough bullshit for people to briefly ignore all the things it didn't port over right.

>>7794109
Are there any currently active maps that actually have environmental hazards? I can't think of any. Survivor has the ice through which you can fall.

>>7793987
I like how you care about this but not about the fact that there's only one set of hands in the game and the model doesn't match almost any of the actual characters.

>>7794118
Not a unique hazard, but Vertigo has that famous fall scream.
You can also blow up the satellite dish in Assault and take some damage.

>>7794146
>the fact that there's only one set of hands in the game

That was infamously NOT the case before they updated all models in 1.6. The arms were not even consistent between different weapons.
Veiny arm when using the AWP.

>>7794186
Does Prodigy have an invisible wall preventing you from running off the cliff side? I can't remember.