/vr/ - Retro Games

>>7461104
Both remakes are better than the original

sorry guys op here, posted the wrong pic up there

>>7461108
Actual OP here, and I unironically agree with you and only wish the color pallette and controls were better for that version. It should not have been on the DS.

>>7461104

>>7461108

>>7461115
Given this >>7461112 reply, the goal of undermining the OP as a dumb shitposter succeeded

>>7461128
I'm not shitposting. That remake would actually be better than the original if it had full analog control and better graphics.

Pokémon Heart Gold/Soul Silver are to this day one of the greatest remakes of all time.

>>7461196
Improving upon perfection: The game.

>>7461104
There's a bunch.
AM2R completely obsoletes the original Metroid 2.
The various version of FF1 & 2 all make the NES originals not worth playing.
Majora's Mask (with fix patch applied and new textures) makes the original obsolete. Ditto with OOT.
Fire Red / Leaf Green obsolete the OG red / blue.

Heck I'd say it's more rare for a remake(remake, not port) to NOT obsolete the original .

The only things Seiken Densetsu 3 has over Trials of Mana are the pixel art and multiplayer.

>>7461104
Resident Evil HD
Crash Bandicoot N Sane Trilogy
Mario and Luigi Superstar Saga

>>7461215
>AM2R completely obsoletes the original Metroid 2.
For the most part, but then what about Samus Returns?
>The various version of FF1 & 2 all make the NES originals not worth playing.
Only the WonderSwan remakes, anything beyond the PlayStation ports of which are highly debatable.
>Majora's Mask (with fix patch applied and new textures) makes the original obsolete.
No amount of textures will fix the shrekified moon model.
>Ditto with OOT.
Only if you eat the censorship up.
>Fire Red / Leaf Green obsolete the OG red / blue.
I mean, you are probably right objectively since Generation I has more holes than an early Nasir-programmed Square game, but I dislike the Generation III engine/style. It never sat right with me that the remakes are just hacks of the new generation, making the series even more same-y and uniform that it already is.
>>7461282
And not mysteriously blowing up your PS4 Pro.
>>7461501
>Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga + Bowser's Minions
I don't like using the term "shit-taste" but...

Final Fantasy 7

>>7461535
>I don't like using the term "shit-taste" but...
Go swallow GBA's cum mate, I'll play the better game

>completely different game that follows the same plot
>in a game with almost no plot
>that manages to change the plot anyway

>remake

>>7461557
So how is it not a remake

>>7461557
Heartgold and Soulsilver also had huge upgrades to gameplay mechanics and had changes to the plot. Are they not remakes either?

>>7461582
There's no consistent terminology wrt remake/remaster/whatever so you can call it what you want, but something like ZM is totally different than OOT 3DS. ZM is no more an enhanced version Metroid 1 than Super Metroid is. It's like counting all the totally different Castlevania games where Simon fights Dracula as "remakes", or Star Fox 64.

>>7461132
>Remake would be better than the original if it wasn't worse than the original
A bold approach

>>7461550
Care to explain WHY it's better though? Minion Quest is literally the antithesis of Mario & Luigi.

>>7461115
Stfu newnigger

>>7461108
This one almost felt like a practical joke when they released it

>>7461616
The extra content and characters was cool.

>>7461610
Is AM2R not a remake of Metroid II then?

>>7461610
I'd consider Vampire Killer for MSX and that X68000 game (aka Castlevania Chronicles) to be remakes of the original Castlevania since most of the level design and enemies are the same - in the former, layouts are practically 1:1. Haunted Castle and Super Castlevania IV are definitely their own games though.

>>7461620
Refined gameplay, not like you spritefags would understand

>>7461709
>Refined gameplay
Literally explain yourself, as far as I know it's based on the (easier) Japanese version, which is a result of the rushed English release and not a real GBA/3DS difference.

>>7461735
AAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fmBzSEh-eBw

>>7461104
Pokemon FR/LG and HG/SS
Resident Evil REmake

>>7461108
Fuck no, the controls kill it for me. I don't even mind only having 8-way movement with the d-pad. The real issue is that you default to a slow walking speed and need to hold down a button to run. But it's fucking mario, and you normally play the game running 99% of the time, unless sneaking by the piranha plants. So that means you have to hold down the run button almost the entire fucking time, which also makes using the punch button a major pain in the ass since you can't really it it while holding the run button at the same time. I have no idea what they were thinking with that shit.

>>7461709
>Refined gameplay,
>even though Mush Badges still easily break the game,
>not like vr would understand

>>7461749
Completely agree and I was defending the port earlier. Contentwise it's fucking great but it shouldn't have been on the DS. The graphics are also soulless.

>>7461771
It just irritates me because the biggest problem I have with the game could've been so easily solved with some simple control customization. All they needed to do was allow you to choose whether it would default to run with a button you hold to walk, or vice versa, or set it to be a toggle. Or allow you to remap the run button to a shoulder button so that you can still make use of the other face buttons instead of holding down one button the entire time.

I still like the game for the added content, but god fucking damn

>>7461620
new animations are better.

MGS Twin Snakes

>>7461807
People will scream that TTS sucks, but I agree

>b-b-but it's too over the top and anime cheesy!
Yeah, this is the same series where the president grabs your cock to make sure you're a woman, and where the Eva does a flying backflip uppercut off of Ocelot's fae, but Snake doing some acrobatic shit in TTS is just over the line.

>>7461620
>all those reused assets amd poor sprite edits
>the fucking dry bones only matching with the new troopea in minion mode
>oh shit we're running out of time, which original sprites can we replace

>>7461820
So an entry in this series that is better about this godawful trash writing should just be worse to match? What the hell is this logic? You have the option to play a version of a Kojima product that contains less cringe, and voluntarily choose not to take it because you've accepted that things should be as bad as possible for some reason.

>>7461835
It's in line with the rest of the series. Its tone fits the metal gear series better than the original. Enjoy your cringe fake accents for Mei Ling and Naomi and Grey Fox just being the same voice as the DARPA chief nigga

>>7461820
I never cared for the "look what the series did LATER" argument so much as you can practically hear all the voice actors mentally groaning and being bored out of the wits for the fact that they were called in to voice the same game again with minor literal edits that don't mean much, not to mention the new direction completely ruined some deliveries like Ocelot's final lines.

>>7461820
You're an idiot.

>>7461785
See? A person who uses his brain in /vr/.

>>7461785
You're..not gonna see a lot of those idle battle animations unless you are literally slow. Some of the overworld animations are downright stiffer.

>>7461838
So it's worse like the other games, even though independently it could be better. Did you not understand the point I was making?

>>7461839
>I never cared for the "look what the series did LATER" argument.
Yeah that's a shitty argument for shitty people. Imagine if something like the Don Bluth classic "The Land Before Time" got remade to lose any semblance of harshness it had and be more in line with the toddlerfied sequels that break into Barney songs every few minutes?

>>7461501
>>7461550
>>7461709
>>7461745
>>7461785
...Look. It's okay to like different things. I'll even give a reluctant pass to liking remakes that NEARLY killed the series (looking at you, Fire Emblem). What I CANNOT do, in good conscience, is say that it's okay to like remakes that ACTUALLY killed the series AND the goddamn company. Really, you have these remakes to thank for leaving Paper Mario unopposed in its current form. You have these remakes to thank for skipping the only game in the series that could have actually used a remake (Partners in Time). You have these remakes to thank for the fact that you're not getting another Mario & Luigi game. And you're actually still defending them? No, fuck YOU, we were vindicated after AlphaDream died. You monsters.

>>7461942
I praised Superstar Saga remake you dummie, Bowser's Inside Story remake is literal garbage and didn't sell for a reason, I have no intention of defending that one.

>>7461948
What do you think directly led to it, genius?

>>7461948
Mario & Luigi: Bowser's Inside Story + Bowser Jr.'s Journey isn't as awful as the previous remake and wouldn't have undersold if that one wasn't awful.

>>7462002
>The Godfather Part 2 spawned Part 3 so Part 2 is shit
Retard take there
>>7462015
Swallow that contrarian cum
>9gag
(YOU)

>>7462002
>"Sir, our remake was the only game in the series to sell under a million, what do we do?"
>MAKE ANOTHER REMAKE!
To the retards trying to shift the blame on one of them, no, both products are at fault, one mistake doesn't tank a company overnight let alone one that's been handling the money-maker that is MARIO of all things, you're bad and you should feel bad.

>>7462002
PiT is so fucking underrated. I really loved that game. Never played Dream Team or Paper Jam though.

>>7462065
PiT is the closest to the enjoyment I had with Superstar.
Dream Team needed cutting 10 hours worth of worthless padding and Paper Jam needed more passion.

>>7462002
>Dream Team is the second-highest game in the series.
Why? All the 3DS games were underwheming!

>>7462082
My guess is just how much 3DS sold helped.

>>7462002
>Those last two are merely a year apart.
You can just FEEL the desperation.
>>7462024
>The Godfather Part 2 spawned Part 3 so Part 2 is shit
Bad analogy, first off making a film from scratch is entirely different from a video game remake that basically edited existing assets into the current engine, secondly the example used was dimished returns leading to bankrupcy.

>>7462118
Superstar 3DS is better than the original in almost every way, Bowser 3DS is worse than the original in almost every way, it's not a difficult concept to grasp.
Let me guess you're one of these soultards who think old RE was soulful and comfy for having shitty graphics.

>>7462141
>old RE was soulful and comfy for having shitty graphics.
But it was though? It was mostly the gameplay and cheesy story/voice acting I loved though.

>>7462002
It's really a series of poor decisions that led to no one buying M&L anymore (outside of BM/BJJ-anon apparently). I'd say things really started to go downhill when Starlow replaced Fawful as the trademark "face" of M&L.

>>7461104

>>7462171

>>7462184
what about this one smart guy.

>>7462184
Actually play it and see it in motion, instead of coping by posting bloom memes.

>>7462191

>>7461604
And yet it doesn't fix any of the problems that Gold, Silver, and Crystal had, namely the bad level curve, poor Pokemon distribution, and barren Kanto.

>changes to the plot
What changes? You mean the dancers who force you to get the box legend before the E4 instead of letting you discover it for yourself?

>>7462192
Literally why would you when you can mod your Wii U to play the originals anyway? This art style wasn't meant for that. It's telling that they had to modify nearly all the promotional artwork to trick your brain. The only reason it isn't remembered as the weakest remaster is because of the Swift Sail.

>>7461104
To answer your question, OP, not a lot of remakes can hold a candle to Metroid's surpassing the original in every way, and you're delusional if you think otherwise.

Book 1 (the remake portion) might be slightly shorter, but I prefer to think of it as trimming the fat. There's a reason this is still very much beloved in Japan.

>>7462194
The left one honestly looks like shit.

>>7462259
Oh god, she looks like granny Michael Jackson with The Mask on

>>7461535
Samus Returns is adequate but I had the sense that the developers really wanted to make an original game instead of a remake of the Game Boy game, whereas AM2R felt fully committed to reimagining Metroid II while simultaneously paying tribute to the series. It's better for normies who can't grasp black & white visuals but not an utter homerun like Zero Mission or arguably AM2R. I'd also say SA easily had the worst endgame of the three versions, Proteus Ridley a shit. Nintendo had better resist every urge to remake Super next, I guarantee there is no improvement to be had there, or at least include the original like you did with ZM.

>>7462194

>>7462192
>[literally any action or thought in literally any sort of capacity]
>COPE

>>7462192

>>7461105
Both?

>>7462351
Not that anon, but one thing my mind just cannot grasp/accept about Samus Returns is that they fucked up how space jump looks.

>>7462351
How about a Fusion remake (or at least an update that feels more like a SNES game than a GBA one)?

>>7462204
Not relevant and I agree

Yes, it's also more railroading and plot focused in general

>>7461104
>>7461114

>>7462725
So why is the orginal Gameboy version better?

>>7462445

He's probably talking about Samus Returns

>>7461104
Zero Mission isn't even close to as good as the original. It's a casualized shadow of a masterpiece

>>7461215

>The various version of FF1 & 2 all make the NES originals not worth playing.

They're technically better and I completely understand why people prefer them, but something about the original versions hold a special place in my heart, even if the original version of II is terrible. Also, I don't like that they changed the Flying Fortress from a space station into a floating castle for some reason in the PSX version and up. And fighting a Beholder is cool.

>>7462065

Yeah I really don't understand why PiT is so hated. I got into this series late and only played SSS, PiT, and BiS within the last several years and while I think SSS is the best one, PiT is still pretty good too. I liked the Bowser parts of BiS, but exploring his insides got old quick and there was too many times I had to repeat the same minigames. I tried Dream Team but stopped shortly after Luigi's Subconscious because I was so damn bored.

>>7461215
There's a lot of bad taste in that post
>Heck
It even extends to your word choice

>>7463484

This is the first time I've ever seen someone try to make fun of another person over the word "Heck". Kids didn't even do that in elementary when they were swearing to be edgy.

>>7461132
>That remake would actually be better than the original if

Then it's not better

>>7463459
Zero Mission HAS the original, so there really isn't anything to complain about if you found the map guidance a bit much.

>>7462729
It's impossible to answer that question without first acknowledging that AM2R is a completely different game. Neither Nintendo with Samus Returns nor the "fans" behind AM2R properly remade Metroid II: Return of Samus. A faithful remake would have to recognize that certain design choices in the original game were made as a result of the Game Boy's weaknesses, while others were made to take advantage of those limitations and turn them into strengths. Neither remake sought to honor the things that made Metroid II unique among Metroid games, rather, they sought to vaguely replicate the game's map while overhauling the gameplay style to mirror Super Metroid and Zero Mission's. Not even the music emerged unscathed, and if you say "what music?", then you, too, are unqualified to remake Metroid II.

Pro tip to end all protips: If you're going to remake a game, first thing to do is ask yourself if you really love the entire game or only one or two elements while the rest you'd describe as "outdated" and "rough around the edges". If there exist such players who do love the total package and would like to amplify it and modernize it in a way that's respectful to those qualities they love about it, then those are the people who should be remaking the title, not you.

>>7463647
>Zero Mission HAS the original
No it doesn't. The original is 240p output to a CRT, not emulation on a handheld

>>7463703

Some of the purists here amaze me.

>>7463753
>Some of the autists here amaze me.

>>7463753
Not everybody can have bottom of the barrel standards

>>7463817

>Absolutely *has* to play the original NES version on a CRT or it doesn't count

And you call me the autist?

>>7463938

I just like games, man. I'm old enough to have played these games on actual hardware and shitty CRT TVs, and I don't care to do that for the rest of my life. For the last nearly 20 years I've just played a lot of them on emulators because it's more convenient. I care about the games, I don't care to forever chase a childhood experience I'll never have again because it's no longer 1989 and I'm no longer 6 years old.

>>7463703
Not to mention that in order to have the screen fit on that handheld they had cut two rows of pixels. It's literally not even the same graphics as the original.

>>7461104
They should have made a Fusion sequel right away

>on master system
chop lifter
safari hunt
california games

donkey kong 94 gb

>>7461108
at the risk of causing some Reee, all sega 3ds remakes but especially outrun

Still its a little unfair it the better game comes out on newer hardware

>>7463689
Faggot.

>>7461104
Only thing I dislike about Zero Mission is the handholdy camera that shows where to go. Game is pretty good a part from that. For remakes like that, try the SNES Dragon Quests.

>>7464670
>donkey kong 94 gb
Can you really call it a remake though if it's approx. 99.9% new?

>>7461820
>Yeah, this is the same series where the president grabs your cock to make sure you're a woman, and where the Eva does a flying backflip uppercut off of Ocelot's fae, but Snake doing some acrobatic shit in TTS is just over the line.
this argument is bullshit. even as the series got more outlandish, the large majority of the normie human choreography in cutscenes was based on real military techniques, and in the instance where they did push the bounds farther it was something you might see in a James bond flick, not crouching tiger. A specific example of the difference:
>in 2 or 3 snake needs to move to other side of a door, does a mocapped swat turn.
>in ts snake needs to move to the other side of a door, does a side flip 8 feet into the air.
snake might as well be a cyborg ninja in ts.

>>7461104
Resident Evil 2004 but I still like and play RE1

>>7464038
>shitty CRT TVs
Then get a good one
>I've just played them on emulators because it's more convenient
>I care about the games
Not much

>>7464540
Metroid 1 NES >>> Zero Mission > Metroid 1 GBA

>>7465036
This Anon gets it.

>>7461104

>>7465036
Based.

>>7461215
>The various version of FF1 make the NES original not worth playing
I disagree

>>7465036
What about Metroid 1 FDS?

There are still things in the original Super Star I prefer but this is still probably one of my favorite remakes.

>>7466359
100% agree. The original is slightly more difficult (but only because you take more damage), the music has more reverb and I like it that way, and the sprite based cutscenes are super charming, but overall Ultra is a far better version with better graphics and way more content. The cgi cutscenes are also charming in their own way.

>>7465994
It's excellent and I own a copy. Sound/music is somewhat different, enemy behavior is slightly better, loading time, less durable format

I'd rank the NES cart and the FDS disk on par with each other

>>7465994
>No playable suitless Samus.
I only play Metroid in a leotard, no sale.

Taxman's Sonic ports are pretty fucking great, plenty of fanservice, althought IIRC CD fucks up one of the mechanics of time travel.

Also, pic related isn't better, but a pretty damn interesting port of its' own.

>>7463481
PiT is the best game after SSS.
It's easy to get bored of Dream Team since the pacing if horrendously bad.

>>7466803
This. Am I the only one upset that they pussified Samus outside the Power Suit in Zero Mission? You even unlock NES Metroid, not FDS Metroid, even in Japan. I mean if you want to retcon her to have lower defense or be unable to use Morph Ball that makes sense, but she should still be able to kick ass. The fucking prequel manga even had a scene where armorless Samus still materializes her Arm Cannon, just like the NES version.

>>7467964
In fairness the game makes it pretty clear that the Power Suit was rendered unusable in the crash, so Samus would be a sitting duck unable to access any of the modules. The restored Power Suit is sillier in my opinion, we didn't really need an explanation for a design shift. Also things like making Kraid gigantic like he was in Super misses the point, because in that game you were initially supposed to think the small Sclayd is the real Kraid at first until the real one shows up and got beefed up like Ridley. Anyway, I'd maybe put the blame of Sakurai for perpetuating the "armorless Samus can't selectively access parts of her suit" myth, except in Subspace Emissary it's shown in the story that Zero Suit Samus was separated from her Power Suit, and Samus' Final Smash has it destroyed.

>>7467992
>Also things like making Kraid gigantic like he was in Super misses the point, because in that game you were initially supposed to think the small Sclayd is the real Kraid at first until the real one shows up and got beefed up like Ridley
Even though in the NES Metroid, finding the Fake Kraid was actually harder than reaching the real one.

>>7467964
I'm more upset that they made the Zero Suit Samus's standard deaign outside the suit. It's so boring. I liked that each game had their own version of Samus up until then, it gave each one an identity. I damn well cheered when Samus Returns reused the one of the pre-Zero Mission designs, even though it peretuates the mistake that Samus had green hair when it's just the Varia.

>>7463689
Agree. To me the only thing they needed to do for a remake was to add a map and have a color option everything else is useless.

>>7461501

Kill yourself.

>>7461108
hey retard this is the same fucking game but without analog sticks

>>7461620
what? they remade that game??

>>7470665
That wouldn't even be a remake, that would be a port.

>>7470725
No

>remakes
>surpassing the original

>>7470729
>The same exact game but with a map screen and color
Literally just a port with some features. Just like how Kirby's Adventure on the 3ds is compatible with the 3d slider and removes slowdown but everything else is exactly the same as before, making it an enhanced port and not a remake.

>>7470738
And? Better than a remake.

>>7470749
But that's not a remake. Making the exact same game was not the goal of AM2R, it was going to be a remake. Your opinion doesn't matter.

>>7461104
I played samus returns

>First time I'm interested in the combat system of a metroid
>Cinematographic camera, ends the illusion of non-linearity of the game
>Visuals that despite being a little self-conscious for my taste, have the advantage of coming from the hands of professionals, and end up having a more consistent style and theme than any fangame


I liked the game.

The Game received a negative reception thanks to the fans not recognizing their place and of course the cancellation of AM2R

>>7470804
AM2R never got canceled or even fully C&Ded. All Nintendo did was tell them to remove download links from their site. So instead, the site just has a news post letting you know you can still torrent it.

>>7470738
>Just like how Kirby's Adventure on the 3ds is compatible with the 3d slider and removes slowdown but everything else is exactly the same as before, making it an enhanced port and not a remake.
Just because it's a recreation of the original with minor physics differences? Sorry, not quite. As far as I know, the 3D Classics line uses entirely brand new code, making them RE-MADE by definiton. Just like the Taxman versions of the classic Sonic games are considered remakes.

>>7461114
This, RE1, katamari reroll, and destroy all humans come to mind.

>>7461114
you mean samus returns

>>7461196
>HGSS better than Crystal
no

>>7463464
I can't stand the enhanced versions.... It's like playing a polished turd, I want to see the original dinosaur turd in all its glory

>>7463459
ZM is the second remake of Metroid, because Super Metroid is already a remake disguised as a sequel.

>>7470847
Hell, they even waited until the game was complete to do that.

>>7462490
>who is metaquarius

The SNES/SFC version of Prince of Persia developed by Arsys is a great game. It's more like an overhaul than a remake, adding new stages and enemies, beautiful stage art, new music and overall elevates the PoP experience.
The Prince of Persia 2 port for the SNES is shit, though. It's like they dumped the floppy disk on a cartridge and didn't test it before release.

>>7471221
That's just being a contrarian for the sake of it. The Gen IV battle mechanics alone improve the game by miles.

>>7462490
>how about a downgrade?

>>7461104
Super Zero Mission + Justin Bailey rom hack

>>7461112
man, all i want is a Mario 64 remake that looks as good as the official character renders from the original

>>7461215
only way to make an older version truly obsolete if it is the exact same game but with additional content that does not alter the original experience. Updated graphics does not make older graphics obsolete and certain mechanics will not always make the transition to new versions. Only by releasing the original, but more of it, can you render the older version un-needed.

>>7462159
Fawful was on par as being one of the greatest new additions to the Mario franchise and I was so psyched when BiS was first coming out and it was revealed he was the baddie. After that release, the series definitely felt like it was going down the Paper Mario route of less unique, bizarre elements and becoming more generic.

>>7463464
i also fucking hate how wind temple or whatever the fuck it was was no longer a space station, especially considering that is exactly the kind of insane genre mix-mash the series would fully delve into later on. Makes perfect sense WarMech would be in such a place that way

>>7466636
i always wondered if the Japanese GBA versions of the NES/Famicom mini series are based off of the Disk system versions or the cart versions. Like I know they release disk system only games, but would the japanese version of Metroid and Zelda 2 have all the original quirks as the disk version?