/vr/ - Retro Games

>2020
>Not using Anri bikini suit

I love the world of shining force 1 and its story, even though it's barebone, and I don't know why.

One of the rare game that nails the LOTR feeling for me without even trying. I guess the music helps a lot

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyYom7ut4JA

>>6457893
where’s jogurt

I thought I could finish up 3 today. But now I'm stuck grinding all three forces to level 20 in the Hero's Test.
Send help.

>>6458007
I share that sentiment, for some reason it's the most enjoyable for the story and setting to me. It's barely there but it just feels right. Maybe because it's easy to fill the gaps yourself somewhat.
I'm looking forward to playing the GBA game soon to see how that goes.

>>6458224
Had good diversity in the characters, environments, and townfolk. Good use of steampunk elements without going overboard, neat use of magic and bots. Not to mention soundtrack was dope

Also promotion system was pretty satisfying, getting cool weps for characters

only thing is they made the game too easy, wish they just upped the difficulty like 2 notches

>>6458224
>>6458303
Travelling across the lands from your small kingdom to the other side of the world while battling an imperial army controlled by servants of the darkness also helped.
A lot of JRPGs have this "fight the empire" plot, but it's feels more like SW rather than LOTR. You truly feel that runefaust is ought to conquer the world in shining force... The dark dragon feels like Sauron, and Darksol, Saruman

Which is ironic, considering that SF alsp have elements borrowed from SW (Kane...)

Mishaela was mai waifu

>>6458334

>mfw bolt level 2

>>6458303
Maybe I am just a pleb but I do enjoy having the ability in SRPGs to just steamroll. So these games being on a somewhat easier scale is neat in that way at least.
>diversity in characters
Yeah, albeit I think it was also the force that felt the most cohesive and less rag tag than say most of what you get in 3, and to some degree 2.
There isn't a new random race introduced for half the characters for example.

Also come to think of it, what also helped is that 1 and 2 had sprites for the different races walk around town too sometimes. Thinking of the knights at the start of 1 or the mermaids now. Seems less of a thing in 3, where it's mostly humans for the civilians.

>>6458334
Yeah the plot, as simple as it is, just kinda clicked.
I like the politicking and all in 3 too, but there's just some charme to the very simple idea of pushing back an invasion like that.
>feel that Runefaust is ought to conquer the world
The fact that you come back to a ruined town after a relatively simple mission before, or rather the fact that you get out of that first mission and right into another battle just to get to the ruined town, really helped that.
>SW
That and the tech bits were fun, and what was more fun is that at the time it was just not explained either. Which was really cool, you just get them digging up some ancient lasers and stuff and using it as part of their normal forces.
>spoiler
Mae, and I am salty about Max just poofing after that ending. But I guess it's easy enough to imagine him showing up again. I assume it is something that comes up in the Gamegear games given that I heard those are bridging the gap between 1 and 2.

>>6458394
>spoiler
I'm exactly with you on that, but perhaps this bittersweetness is what also made it memorable. Good taste also, my crush was just me liking evil babes but Max x Mae is OTP (Tao and Anri are also good contenders)

Funfact: She appears in wreck-it-ralph and it's extremely funny considering how obscure she is compared to the other references

>>6458454
Perhaps, and again I think it depends on how you look at the post credit stuff where he is walking around town somewhere. Could look at it as him finally getting back to the group after some odyssey.
If anything it's not the ending of 2 at least, that one was just rubbing salt in a wound I didn't even know I had.
>Evil babes
I think I just like women in armor and cavalry.
>Tao and Anri
Yeah those would also work, I'd say.
>Wreck-it-ralph
If she was I must've missed it, you mean in the first one? Got a scene, roughly? Because now I'm curious.

>>6458394
Max is wandering around with Adam after the credits. It's really everyone else who went poof since he used his egress spell.

>>6458465
I think the game had sort of an affection system hidden inside of it and at the end of the game, Mae or Tao would say something that they're in love with Max if their points are high enough. Pure speculation though
Fun picture... 30 years later and we now have centaur doujins or pic related. I miss when games had anthropormorphic creatures like that.


As for Mishaela, it was this character https://wreckitralph.fandom.com/wiki/Sorceress
but apparently it's been disproven. It was a popular theory for a while.

>>6458485
It's been a while but I thought it said he was just wandering around after managing to find a way out and was now returning.
I must've forgotten about Adam staying with him on the thing though.

>>6458487
No clue on that system, I know 3 has one, that doesn't affect anything but boni, but that's the first time I've heard of it for 1. That said as far as I know from some play, the dialogue in the HQ on the GBA game seem to imply a Max x Mae thing. Might also just be confirmation bias tho.
>centaurs
I am not gonna lie and say I am not biased towards them quite a bit, because I am, but yeah.
The fact that the series moved away from having that large host of races that it used to have after camelot left is a shame to say the least. Doubly so because there seem to be very few games that do that kinda thing.
But if anything we got a bunch of fun games.
Also Centorea needs to get a chestpiece that isn't a pair of boob sleeves, it just still looks wrong
>Sorceress
I suppose that could've worked, shame it didn't tho.

I've loved Shining Force 1 since I was a kid and replayed it recently, still great. If i get back into the series, are there any games that aren't worth playing that I should skip, or are they all good? I saw a trailer for one of the recent games and it looked like it devolved into an extremely generic husk of its former self, so I'm skeptical.

>>6458562
Everything after the SF3 trilogy is just shameless cashgrabs by Sega farmed out to other developers. Camelot left Sega to make Mario sports games after they finished SF3.

>>6458562
The recent games are better not worth mentionning. It's shining force in name only.

>>6458562
>recent games
Just don't, maybe there are some good games in there, I don't know, but they don't look the part.
The Camelot games, as in the original devs' games, are:
>Shining in the Darkness
>Shining Force
>Shining Force II
>Shining Force III (Scenario 1 to 3)
>The gamegear games
>Shining Force CD (a remake of all game gear games except Final Conflict IIRC)
>Shining Wisdom

I think the one post-Camelot game I'd say could be fun is Shining Force Feather, as that still retains some of the charm of the series. But Feather is JP only, with no easily useable translation or any translation patch. So that's a bit of a pain to play if you can't into moon.
There are also Exa and Neo, both are PS2 games that are allegedly ok, but it's a very simple diabolo-ish top down action RPG. It didn't really grab me, you can only play as one character too so there's no real variety sadly.

In short, play through the Camelot ones.

>>6458596
You forgot Shining the Holy Ark.

>>6458614
I was sure I put that on there, but good catch

Also come to think of it FEDA: Emblem of Justice, it's a SNES game and JP only, but it's relatively close to being another 2d Shining Force game. There is a translation patch for it.
Although I haven't played it properly yet, so no clue on the story or anything. I know it's been described as a "dark" Shining Force so make of that what you will, battle mechanics seem good though.

>>6458635
I played FEDA. It's ok. I liked the furry girls.

>>6458647
Good enough.

>>6458667
There's nothing else to say really. Even today the only fanart you get are from japanese furries.
There's a neat alignment system and some characters can only be recruited if you're order or chaos

TL;DR If you liked Zylos or Alef in Shining Force you will like this game

>>6458693
Well it might be worth noting that there is a griffon centaur in that game.
But yeah I remember that it's the guy there and his bro doing rebel stuff and that there was a moral system in it.

bumping this awesome thread.

Throwing a bump in bc im down w the Force

>Fighting Bulzome
>no problem with the priests beforehand
>don't have any more healing items or MP long before his HP is even in the visible range
>his HP finally shows up when I'm struggling just to stay alive for a turn
>probably need at least ten or so more turns to get him down to 0 from there
I don't want to redo the three fights prior to this just to get some new items, is there any trick to this boss or am I just fucked?

>>6457979
based

>>6461231
At that point just sacrifice your party members until you take him down
Also, did you save Jane?

>>6462103
Yeah I managed to kill the guy after a second try
>Jane
Of course, after all she's done for us I couldn't just let her die.
Good that her AI didn't just suicide charge her into Bulzome.

Was that airship that showed up at the end of it the Holy Ark or what was that meant to be?

>>6462193
Yes, that was indeed the Holy Ark. The implication there is that it's carrying new spirits to replace the ones that were lost when Gracia and Bulzome neutralized each other.
There's also a secret ending. To watch it you have to wait a few seconds on the ending screen without pressing anything.

>>6462584
Alright, is that expanded on in The Holy Ark?
Any upload of that ending, because I don't think I have a save from right before killing him or the end of the credits.

>>6462643
If you're talking about the ending itself, no, because Shining the Holy Ark is a prequel to Shining Force 3. However, everything related to the Spirits is expanded on in StHA.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCuK7P-57OI
There's a translation on the description of the video.

>>6462792
Thanks. Not what I expected necessarily but that makes sense to add I suppose.

>>6458487
>think the game had sort of an affection system hidden inside of it and at the end of the game, Mae or Tao would say something that they're in love with Max if their points are high enough. Pure speculation though

that is not true, it is always Mae

>>6458693
>Even today the only fanart you get are from japanese furries.
Based

>>6464462
Max knows what's up

>>6464493
That's not based. Shining belongs to the monstergirl community.

>>6464656
It's got both.
That said FEDA is probably obscure enough that any kind of art is good.

>>6464656
Monstergirls are for cowards.
And considering how Japanese draw kobolds, furries are technically monstergirls.

>>6464656
Got some more pictures from that artbook, or a scan?

>>6464909
Fraid not senpai
The thread I pulled that from died without my request for sauce being filled.

>>6465038
It's a shame, I know there's some low res stuff for the SF3 artbook around, but no really good quality one either. And I don't think I've seen much of anything for 1 or 2.
Which is a shame because some of the art for those games is really cool in my opinion. Even if I forgot the artists' names again.

>>6465084
Someone scanned the SF3 artbook in good quality recently.
https://e-hentai.org/g/1497753/4d3c7407c1/

>>6465084
Lowe is getting cucked and he doesn't even notice it

>>6465782
Oh shit, thanks, Anon. I don't know how I missed that.
>pic
That one is still really comfy

>>6465782
Good stuff

>>6466047
She has the saddest butt.

>>6458635
FEDA's fun but it isn't quite on SF's level. Special attacks break the game pretty hard, and the plot is largely incomprehensible because they planned to explain everything in the sequels that never got made.

>>6469416
I assume you mean that means nothing is elaborated on all that much and things just happen? Or how bad does it get?

I'm playing the first game right now and the game over on MC death has me tearing my fucking hair out. I have failed the battle on the open fields after the caravan town 5 fucking times in a row because of pegasus knights 1-shotting my MC with a lucky crit/dual hit. Can't honestly remember the last time a game fucked me off this much, I had 10k going into this now i'm down to 900g.

>>6457893
I only played SF2 and I love it! How different it is compared to the 1 and the other games? I've been wanting to try SF1.

>>6470506
Keep them well protected, but also still have them kill stuff. The MCs in these games tend to become kill machines. Also it's not in 1, but I think in 2 there is a boss that will only take damage from the MC, so it's best to keep them levelled.
>900g
Just as a tip if you didn't know, you can egress from any battle as a way to grind. That way you can level your people and money on easy enemies so the oneshot thing doesn't happen too often.

>>6470581
SF2 is a lot more open in that you do have those two or three random battles you can just do repeatedly, and that you get a bigger world to just walk around in.
1 is slightly more limted in that and 3 just kinda dropped it alltogether in favour of a more linear overworld, mostly keeping only the town exploration and talking. Which I think is a shame, but it's understandable.
Beyond that 2 has some QoL changes compared to 1, most notably I think the fact that other people pick up items if Bowie has a full inventory. Also the cutscenes in 2 are a bit more wild than they are in 1. I think beyond that they're pretty much the same.

I can definitely recommend SF1 and 3. They're both pretty damn good games.
1 also had a remake on the GBA, but I haven't played that yet.

>>6470802
How's the first one story compared to the second?

>>6470834
Similar enough in that it's fairly simple and all. I hear the GBA remake changes some stuff around or clarifies some stuff, for better or worse. Again, haven't played it yet, but plan to.
But basically you push back an invading force, Runefaust, and then defeat the big evil demon they summon. I think 2 made some reference to the defeat of Darksol and Dark Dragon, which is what happened in 1.
It's cool.

>>6470847
I remember those references. Is the ending better at least? Because the ending of the 2 sucked. Yeah. Bowie should have ended with the cutie martial artists priest elf, Sarah.

>>6470856
The ending of 2 was weird in how much it rubbed that in. I wouldn't even have minded the princess ending, had Sarah not been given as much attention during the ending. But instead they chose to just go out of their way to make her feel bad there.
Of course, ideally Bowie and Sarah would've hooked up.

As for 1, no, the ending doesn't do that. There is some bittersweet bit to it in the sense that Max and Mae are separated in the ending. Well Max and everyone really. It is a bit bullshit in some ways, but it's not really comparable to 2 in any way. I think it's discussed earlier in the thread too.

This series died when the main artist left. He's really underappreciated

>>6470894
Well that's good to know. A pity that no one modded the SF2 changing the ending.

>>6470979
The only big conversion I know of is one for SF1 that changes some things around. Like Mae dying at the start and you getting Varios instead. Among some other things. But I imagine most of that is a recolour so to speak, given that it swaps some characters around.
Then again it is probably just easier to imagine your ideal ending more than it is to try and mod one in for real.

>>6470925
Didn't SF change lead artists for just about all the games? As far as I know both 1 and 2 have different artists, as did 3. Unless I'm wrong of course.
If you mean the change after Camelot where the guy only kinda tried to stick to the old stuff with Neo and to some degree Exa and Feather, before just drawing scantily clad elves for the entire party, then yes tho.

>>6471013
Yes, I know. But from time to time better tools gets produced so one day it may happen.

>>6471027
I think the problem is more that this is a relatively obscure series of games, which I suspect won't have the biggest modding community out there.
Then again they autism'd a translation for 3 into existance so who knows.
Too bad they never got a proper one out for Feather, because frankly I am really interested in that one, both gameplaywise and from a dumb but comfy sounding story perspective.

>>6471046
There's a small and old community still active and doing hacks.

>>6471159
Fair enough. I assume on those forums that are still somewhat alive.
I wonder if that game a bunch of them are making is ever gonna come out. Also curious what engine they used for it, because it looks pretty proper at a glance, but no luck so far.

>>6471179
I played a new hack that came out recently that even made some crossovers. You can have Rune from Phantasy Star IV on your team. Whoever the skill set sucks. I edited it to be better.

>>6471205
But can I play as a not ded Alys?

>>6471223
...no. Don't mock the best PS girl, please.

>>6471227
I just cope with the bad feels with dumb jokes. I'm sorry.
What's the hack tho? That Battle Royale one for SF2?

>>6471239
This one: https://www.romhacking.net/hacks/4664/
Whoever, I used the editor and edited three unused skills, making it very OP with a large, kinda broken hitzone(5x5 if I'm not wrong) and at cost of 100 mana. I called them Fire Storm, Blizzard and Tandle. Then I used the save editor to apply to Rune and making him have 200 mana and other stuffs. Whenever it was Rune time, a lot of enemies suffered. It was glorious.

>>6471264
Oh, I thought I'd recognised that blue haired dude in the preview, but I didn't make the connection.
How's the hack otherwise? Comments on the forum were hit and miss on it.
>Editor
I assume the one that's also on romhack, how easy is that one to use?

>>6471271
Well...to be fair I don't recall where I found it. One of them was on this site and it was easy to use. Whoever, the save editor I found on another site. Allows you to edit save states.

>>6471290
Romhack has one for editing character stats and stuff, so I just assumed it was that one.
Truth be told I was a bit bummed out to find that it wasn't a map or scenario editor, then again that was probably expecting far too much from a random tool like that.

>>6471371
There is one that edit game stuff and other to edit save because some changes don't apply after you have started a new game.

>>6471389
Alright I'll keep that in mind should I dabble in that.
Although I think really first thing I should do is finally play that GBA remake, or the Gamegear games/CD.

>>6471410
Well, you do it then. Sounds fun.

>>6471264
The difficulty in that is fucking out of this world. I actually finished the fucker, but it was a pain in the ass. You got really dumb shit like the willard fight where these faggot rats wont stop spawning. And the boss fights are basically you getting smoked unless you get lucky. I dare you to enjoy the Camilla fight. But outrageous difficulty aside it's good.

>>6471575
Why are so many romhacks out there that just up the difficulty to stupid degrees?

>>6471575
I fucking cheated with my edited Rune anyway, kek

Someone had been datamining the Saturn Shining games recently, there's some interesting things in there.

https://tcrf.net/Shining_Force_III

>>6464656
kemono and monstergirls are both fine as long the japanese are drawing it

>>6473015
Based but cringe.

>>6474165
Kemono >=Monster girls > Kemonomimi >> shit > Western/sonic

>Krystal as Kemono
She was literally designed by american.

>>6474182
>Foxy Rena
Pinnacle of based.
Western fur can be good and better than kemono, the majority of it is just trash and that's all most people will ever know

>>6474165
>>6474182
>>6474187
Stop pushing your degeneracy here and get the fuck out to >>>/trash/

>>6474213

I still haven't played SF3 Scenario 1-3. I should. It's the only Camelot-era Shining game I've yet to play.

>>6474820
I suggest you do, they have their ups and downs but overall I did really enjoy my time playing them. The story was fun, if a bit much or quick at times, and the characters are all cool too.
I just finished the last scenario a few days ago.
If you ever feel like needing a guide, mostly for not missing characters, use Jumesyn, it's a good resource and it took me longer than it should have to find it.
Also remember to grind your units to level 20 promoted at the end of the first two scenarios, just to save yourself a some work by the end of Scenario 3.
Honesty best girl

I genuinely do think that Shining in the Darkness, despite being a very early, primitive & simple RPG, does a lot of things right for a console RPG of its era:
>reasonable difficulty curve
>some nice puzzles & mazes
>good presentation (aesthetics & music especially)
>actually decent survival-esque aspects
>the confuse/muddle spell through the use of Demon Staff

>>6476113
>does a lot of things right for a console RPG of its era
This is not true. It was outdated the moment it released considering Phantasy Star, a much better dungeon crawler and game overall, predates it by 3 years.

>>6476149
>BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWWW

>>6476149
>This is not true
Well come on now. You can't just say that and then not provide any elaboration; at least I listed down the aspects of SitD that I liked in my post >>6476113. To clarify my opinion, I think SitD is overall a somewhat average-ish RPG of its time, it's just that I thought that there were several aspects to that game that I think was done right.

I had to restart this absolute slog of a battle because the boss plants her arse in an area where I could only get one melee man in at a time and I wasn't able to deal enough damage to her to deal with her regen. All my ranged characters are hitting for precisely 1 damage except for my 2 mages. I came close to killing her, but my man missed two fucking turns in a row and then Tao ran out of MP.

Pure nonsense desu lads.

>>6476703
Ahhh yes, the infamous Mishaela fight. If the clown/circus battle is the initial casual filter, then Mishaela is the second one. Mishaela was the first in SF1 that actually gave me a lot of trouble, i.e. lost against her like 2 or 3 times. I think I only won in my fourth attempt.
>All my ranged characters are hitting for precisely 1 damage
Whew that's underlevelled. The Shining series has never been "hardcore" in terms of difficulty, but one thing you always have to pay attention to is making sure none of your characters are too under-levelled.

>>6476703
The health regen on some bosses was honestly unnecessary.

>>6476113
The graphics really help it a lot. It is just nice looking.

>>6458202
>leveling up jogurt expecting him to become uber.

>>6476995
Ok serious question, how do you get him to join in the first place? I remember seeing him, but talking to him didn't do anything.

>>6474213
no

>>6474182
Bayliss is European and her Assault apperance was by a japanese.

anything not designed by Tony Taka is shit

>>6477165
i actually took a look at how SEGA is treating the Shining series nowadays and just took a huge heaping vomit rn
the PS2 was a mistake

>>6474187
>that pic
How can Rena have such good taste...

>>6474187
>tfw you remember making that years ago on /kemono/
I miss 8ch*n

>>6477165
I understand that a fair chunk of Japanese Shining fans are fans of the Tony Taka-era of Shining (from what I can tell on twitter, at least) and there's only a ew Camelot-era Shining fans in Japan, but I wonder if SEGA can make a 2-in-1 series approach with Shining. Like, make 2 "styles" of games under the Shining game, one is the nu-Shining era of mmostly action-RPGs and have an old-Shining subseries that's for Force etc. A bit kinda like how Sonic has both the "Modern" and "Classic" approach thanks to Sonic Mania.

>>6477171
>PS2
Arguably Neo is still more or less within the spirit of things designwise. unfortunately the gameplay just kinda sucks.
No clue on Exa though, I heard mixed things.
The PSP games had potential, if only because they copied the Valkyria Chronicles combat system, which is great, but the designs were just boring frankly, and they're JP only too with stories that don't seem worth it either.
Feather seems fun enough, if hit and miss on character designs.
And then no idea what was after that with Radiance or whatever.

>>6477214
I am certain you could mix it up somewhat like that, yeah. Or you know, just call the Tony stuff something else given how little it seems to have to do with Shining to begin with.
Just give me that Shining Force/Valkyria Chronicles gameplay mix those PSP games teased at. I need it

>>6477197
That site deserved to die a crueler death, but /kemono/ was peak comfy and so were the Foxy Rena threads, really introduced me to a lot. I made some posts about old fur anime and western scene before the 90's, just to compare it to the modern Japanese doujin scene.

>>6477197
That site deserved to die a crueler death, but /kemono/ was peak comfy and so were the Foxy Rena threads, really introduced me to a lot, nice to see someone from it again even though I haven't kept up with the manga in three years by now.
I made some posts about old fur anime and western scene before the 90's, just to compare it to the modern Japanese doujin scene.

>>6477165
Unironcally disgusting

>>6477214
Honestly, if they make a new Shining game, Sega should just make a deal with Camelot somehow and have them develop it and still keep Tony Taka in charge of the character designs.
That way both Japanese fans and western fans would be pleased.

>>6478664
The onus is currently on SEGA. Hiroyuki Takahashi has already stated explicitly that he wants to make Shining Force 4. We'll see if SEGA is willing to cooperaate.

>>6478718
One can hope they won't fuck that up.

>>6478718
That won't happen because Nintendo is keeping them hostage making mario shovelware.

>>6478664
>keep Tony Taka in charge of the character designs

That sounds terrible, but it's not like they can get the original artist...

>>6479096
Rest in peace Kajiyama.

>he doesn't like Tony's art style
What are you, a faggot?

>>6479327
I like Tony's art style. I just don't like it if & when SEGA decides to make a Shining Force 4. Like I said in >>6477214, my dream is that the Shining series would be split into Modern and Classic sub-franchises, with Tony and non-Tony styles respectively.

>>6479327
It's fine on a technical level but it just looks generic as all hell. It would be better if he at least tried to keep some of the elements that made Shining what it was, but he doesnt. I don't know if that is his decision or someone else's but it sucks.
I enjoy anime tiddies as much as the next guy but Tony was not the guy to hire to draw them for Shining is what I am saying.

>>6479637
>it just looks generic as all hell
To be fair to Tony, dude's one of the old guard of erotic art in the 90s and early 2000s. His art was a standout during those days; very few people draw or design girls the way he did. Part of the reason his art feels "generic" these days (which I disagree, I can spot a Tony art from a mile away) is because he was one of those artists that helped influence eroticism in 2D porn. Dude's influence was far-reaching in Japanese otakudom.

>>6479679
Alright fair enough, but you see my point when I say that just about none of it looks like camelot Shining at this point. Which is my main gripe with it.
If the guy starts drawing the old melting pot of races while also nailing that feeling of a fairy tale mixed with some sci-fi then it'll feel right again. At least in terms of art style and designs.

>>6479721
>If the guy starts drawing the old melting pot of races while also nailing that feeling of a fairy tale mixed with some sci-fi then it'll feel right again
Oh yeah, this I agree 100%. Even if his art is far removed from the old Shining style, at least he could've made it have the same "flavour" in terms of races and variation of design. I have a feeling that the producer of the Shining series during Tony's reign felt the need to utilise Tony's "titillating" allure as much as possible, which led to the females all being elf or human with similar aesthetics, i.e. the easiest to lure otakus. I do suspect the fault is moreso on the producer than it is on Tony.

Then again I've never seen Tony draw a centaur/wolfman/other species so maybe he just sucks at it.

>>6479734
Hence why I said earlier that I didn't know if that was even his decision or not. But it's unfortunate either way because it really did remove a lot that made the series what it was.
>sucks at it
Perhaps he does, I don't know. Hire Z-Ton or something.
Jokes aside, I hope that no matter who gets the art if there ever is a Shining Force 4 that they look towards the old games for inspiration again.

>>6479096
Yoshitaka Tamaki is still alive and ready to go.

>>6457979
anri doesnt have a bikini. only business woman. tao has the bikini.

>>6480678
Imagine if they gave everyone alternate costumes to find

sf1 had character scaling and pacing issues.

hans is useful at the start because ranged, but when he levels up he just increases speed AND THATS FUCKING IT. he rarely gains attack (or even hp/def) unless you save scum for it, and even then its rare. he doesnt get a new weapon until the circus, and even then its not really enough to keep him competent. diane is basically the same.

the game shoves 3/4 healers at you in the first chapter. you dont need that many healers. also their mana pools grow so slowly that you can barely use them as is. i guess that makes buying items more appealing/useful?

new weapons are so staggered. sf2 has you buying upgrades basically every new town. in sf1 if a character's stat growth is too slow, they become obsolete before they can be relevant enough to GET that new weapon, and even after getting it, they're only hitting for 2-4 instead of 1.

bird people can fly!... except they cant hit for beans. i've never had the patience to spoon feed the birds through their 1 damage attacks to level them up to see if they eventually grow up into decent fighters. its just not worth it.

the only characters that start off weak that remotely pay off are bleu and adam. bleu turns into a competent beast, and adam takes more babying early but similar grows into his own.

too many characters join at a point where they do shit for damage and require too much babying to become relevant. additionally, a bunch of characters are clearly just outclassed in stat growth. why choose somebody that hits for 15-20, when there is another character (even in the same class) that can one shot shit for like 40? why put a new character in the party when somebody else of the same class is already doing their job better?

>tier list
i'll admit that i havent gone through the effort of babying everyone just to see if they grow into reasonable/competent characters, but heres my tier list. order in the rows doesnt matter, just placed people in the right categories. (cont)

>>6480774
(cont)
S: heaviest hitters in the game. magic is a given, and once you have aura, you dont need any other healer ever.

A: gort could probably be considered S, but his speed is often an issue. same for guntz, and he has the movement problem. alef doesnt share the S-tier magic slot because she joins so late and has to catch up, and enemies are rarely grouped enough for big bolt spells (which anri can learn anyway...) hanzou is cool, but he doesnt actually hit as hard as others. mae's attack is a little lacking, but her hp and def help her stay relevant.

B: domingo is just a freeze bot, which anri already is. he has to catch up in order to perform, and also isnt a waifu. whats the point? ken, pelle, and earnest suffer from being outclassed in stats. kokichi is neat, but still mediocre. lowe gets you through the game as a healer until torasu.

C: honestly never really used khris, but she might be a replacement for lowe if you want. either way, torasu wins she's useless in the end.

D: shit scaling, garbage characters, or at least in the case of vankar join too late when other people do the job better already.

one thing i didnt get to mention in my previous post was the map layouts were AWFUL. so many overworld maps are just FULL of trees and mountains. most characters have a movement penalty. it just creates such a SLOW SLOG for no reason. while the elliot fight was long/wide and took a couple of turns to engage, it at least felt like a charge of two armies meeting on the field of battle, and you got to use your characters more tactfully with positioning rather than "everyone moves 2 spaces at a time (except the few that move 3!), melee lead the way."

>>6480774
>>6480792
oh and another thing: enemies at the end having magical attacks. not spells, but magic attacks. spells and mage class enemies are fine, but chunky front liners having heavy hitting, defense piercing, magical attacks that can not only crit, but often hit TWICE. why? why not just make them more threatening so the high defense characters can do their job and tank? just so hp sponges like ken can seem relevant? not really worth it. just feels bad to face and irritating.

the game is still pretty easy, but some of the design elements are super flawed.

>>6480774
Seeing the birbs that low doesn't sit well with me.
They can cast shit with Chaos Breaker and use the Sword of Darkness, all from safe distance...it doesn't seem fair.

>>6480823
I think the issue is that generally you can make just about any character work pretty damn well if you just put some effort into them. Which in SF usually translates to just using them normally

>>6480774
>>6480792
>>6480812
now sf2 had a great many QoL improvements. items get passed to the next available character, experience rolls over after it fills, shops are more streamlined and you can equip right from there, and easy stat checking from menus.

personally, the first battle felt way harder with only 3 people, and the second battle felt much easier with the enemy spacing and having 4 people. the first game gives you a fully rounded party right from the start, but sf2 trickles in the characters. also you only get one healer at the start, and its shitty faggot sarah. at least in this one, she can heal herself even when full and still gain experience so she doesnt fall quite as behind as lowe and others did, but she still fails to serve as reasonable choice. this sucks extra hard because you dont get a replacement healer until karna at the earliest or frayja if you skipped her.

like i mentioned earlier, new weapons come by at almost every new town. it feels good to get upgrades. if you push for 40, its really hard because the game expects you to promote at 20ish, and short after the 20ish mark the post-promo weapons start showing up and enemy scaling reflects this. however, if you CAN push for 40, pretty much every character than do so will outshine the ones given to you already promoted.

some maps can be a slog (like the desert) but they're much fewer and farther between. terrain and land effect are more tactical and meaningful rather than "the entire map is 30%".

while some things still have magical attacks, they arent nearly as common or commonly used. spells are a more consistent threat (that enemies actually USE) and require more planning for positioning than sf1 ever did.

i always felt like 2 was just more enjoyable and FUN than 1. it was a direct improvement in basically every aspect, including difficulty. the only way it wasnt was that the optional characters werent as cool or potent.

(tier list next)

>>6480823
so you have to wait for that late in the game for them to become useful, and then only really as a caster abusing an item? sounds pretty shitty to me, and thats my point.

>>6480774
>>6480792
>>6480812
>>6480861
tier list:

S+: infinite scaling. boost and aura can always grant a set amount of experience, which allows them to scale higher than anyone (at reasonable pace, not autistic 1exp pace or slow 10exp pace). karna could be here too, but i never take her at creed's, so she's always too far behind. even though sarah could climb with 10s, but fuck her. more on that later.

S: heaviest hitters, magic is always nice (kazin for sorc since tyrin learns other strong spells and sorc spells are basically just as good or better than blaze 4). rick always shined for me, especially after pegasus promo. i think i tried eric once and he did well, and i've heard he's competent so i'll put him up there as an alternative to tyrin.

A: solid fighters that never let me down. could they be S? maybe? sf2 has people more similar in stats than sf1 did, so A-C is a lot of opinion or minor factors

B: just nothing really all that special. when choosing an archer for a run, i would usually choose elric or janet, even though may is cutest. centaur penalties sucked, and brass gunners were cool. the 3 melees were competent but never really stood out for me.

C: this is mostly outclassed, too late, or some kind of crucial flaw. kiwi gets obliterated by magic, but functions well as a fighter IF he doesnt get nuked by a spell, especially after promo for semi flight and taking advantage of land effects. why take chaz when you already have 2 great mages to choose from? the only reason i can think of is if you didnt take tyrin and dont want to make tyrin play catch-up. also chaz is a faggy name and looks like a faggy frenchman. claude comes in too late and suffers from movement (i know theres peppers and stuff, but still). i think i tried using him once, but i might have gotten bored and unimpressed that run. he really ought to be a stellar character considering his uniqueness. gyan comes in too late, randolf pales in comparison as a choice (cont)

>>6480905
(tier list continued)
comparison as a choice to the others at creed's. taya MIGHT be a decent pickup if you didnt take tyrin for 2 mages, but then you're either running 2 sorcs, or relying on blaze 4 for big nukes until you get atlas 2. she still feels late and unimpressive. rhode is simply outclassed by the other archers because they can go past 20 for extra stats.

shit tier: higins comes in already promoted (automatically outclassed) and too late and meaningless to replace somebody else. and wtf is his character? "im sick!" and looks like a green nigel thornberry, but more of a pedo. luke suffers from the same problems as the birdmen in the first game: too weak to contend. considering he's pre-promo and screech is post-promo, he should theoretically be able to outclass him, but it would just take SO. MUCH. WORK. and with a start like that, is he really going to reach slade or even jaha levels of attack? new weapons help him deal more than 1 damage sometimes, but those run out and he still isnt scaling well to try and push 40. even after promo, weapons barely help him from drowning. also gay eugene levy eyebrows.

and then theres sarah. sweet useless sarah. dumb cunt sarah. apparently she's damn near everybody's waifu here, but christ does she piss me off. struggles to cast enough healing to keep up in levels, shit for speed, ugly portrait, ANNOYING character, doesnt even get her own promo sprite despite being a STARTER (vicar is made for frayja, and master monk is made for sheela). she's the slowest and weakest healer. i could keep sarah, not pick karna, go back and grab karna, and karna would surpass her because of aura. she is out classed in every aspect as a healer. if you want to promote her to master monk and try to make a fighter out of her, regular fighters still out class her until experience gain drops, and then she's just using dinky little heal for 10exp to cheese her way up the stats. meanwhile, boost and aura users are trucking along (cont)

>>6480945
trucking along at 48exp AND providing useful spells. sarah is garbage, and i would literally rather run with 2 healing seeds/drops on every fighter than suffer her being in the party. at least then the AMOUNT healed will be more too. luke with 4 healing items literally makes a better healer than sarah. fuck sarah. fuck everyone's waifu obsession with her. fuck everyone thinking she deserves anything out of the ending. yes, the princess ending is forced, yes her speaking up is awkward as fuck. but there isnt really any character growth, interaction, or development throughout the game other than "classmates", "i maybe have a crush on somebody", and "awkward outburst at the end". all we have is a trash character that is outclassed and acts like a fucking bitch.

>>6480945
You know, I knew from the first post that this was you again. But good job on taking this long to get to the Sarah rant.

>>6464462
It's one of the many things that got changed in the GBA remake. There, it's whoever you've had in your party since you got them and haven't gotten killed once.

>>6477015
You talk to him in Chapter 1 which sets his recruit flag. You then get to chapter 4, the wagons leave and he's in the area they've left behind. Talk to him there and you recruit him.

Are there any high quality versions of the card art from the GBA game or is this as good as it gets?

>>6481285
i think you can get him before the wagons leave (or even HAVE to). in the church tent/building, you can walk around the left side (inside) and when you reach the back left corner you can see him in a remote place behind the building. he wakes up from a nap or something and suddenly he's in your party. but yeah, you do have to talk to him first at gong's place after the first battle.

>>6480905
Poor Kiwi. I understand Camelot wanting to make him a tanky boi with his high DEF but his HP is way too low to even resist most magic attacks. So he almost always falls off in the midgame/lategame when more and more magic enemies start to appear.
>>6480774
>>6480792
>hans is useful at the start because ranged
Yeah, I don't get why he and Diane's stat growth are so low. Their benefit in being range does not do enough to balance out their mediocre damage. Both those archers feel like nood-traps. I remember babying Diane to try and make her strong but her damage falls off towards lategame.
>too many characters join at a point where they do shit for damage and require too much babying
Yeah, this is pretty much the SF1 experience. I think some of the joy in SF1 is in trying to make your party work; figuring out who's strong and who isn't. But one thing I can say is that because SF1 isn't particularly difficult, you *can* kinda make any party composition work since you can get away with having somewhat mediocre characters because it's not like SF1 is ultra-hardcore in terms of difficulty.
>bird people can fly!... except they cant hit for beans
Yeah their damage at the start is kinda weak and you have to baby them a lot. But I did one time baby and level up one of those birdies (I forget which one) but they do actually end up with decent damage in lategame. I'd put them in tier B or C.
>domingo is just a freeze bot, which anri already is
Okay, this bit I disagree 100%. By endgame his DEF goes way above Anri's and he can fly which can be such a blessing in certain maps like the fight against Mishaela. Even though Magic kinda falls off at the end of the game Domingo still gets to cast BOOST so he remains relevant til the very last fight. I personally would put him into A or S. Absolutely not B or lower.

>>6480945
>>6480969
Holy shit, ahahaha. Goddamn anon, are you okay? Did Sarah steal your wallet or something in the past?
>>6480971
Is this Sarah-hating anon a regular of Shining threads? I'll admit I'm not often on /vr/, more like a once in a while crossboarder.

>>6481576
Well, he was around a while back. I dont think these threads are frequent enough to really qualify as having regulars but there you go.

Tier lists are useless because if your characters end up good or bad is all dependent on RNG

>>6481605
objectively incorrect. even by save scumming, certain characters simply outclass others. i've had arthur level up and gain 7-10 in a single stat, as well other big stat gains in that level for a total of like 15-20 points. no other centaur comes close to that kind of growth. archers simply do not dish out the same sort of damage as zylo or peter.
>>6481576
i talked about it in one other thread a few months ago. sarah is objectively trash and outclassed. also if she's your waifu, you have absolutely SHIT taste.

>>6481928
> also if she's your waifu, you have absolutely SHIT taste.
Good thing it isn't, then. My Shining Force II waifu is Karna. I don't have a waifu in SF1 but I will ship Max & Mae until the end of time. Those two deserve to be together in holy matrimony.

>>6481928
>gain 7-10 in a single stat
This can happen to any character literally, like I said it's all RNG
In the last run I did Pelle ended up being my strongest centaur by far

>>6482026
He is kinda right. Characters have different growth curves from eachother apparently. I say apparently because frankly it is barely noticable if at all on a regular run without a lot of grinding.
Arthur should generally overtake the other knights for example because he gets higher stats later on. But it is also very RNG heavy and to get him to that point takes an eternity and a half. So usually it simply does not matter.

>>6481954
Good man

>>6458562
Avoid EXA, they are just cash grab garbage. Shining tears is a "spiritual successor" or at least it was advertised as such. It's an action rpg but it's fun with 2 players.

CD is basically the first two gaiden games, gaiden final conflict has been translated. 2 is great, 3 is a bit different but also damn fine, english patches obviously. But yeah, avoid EXA, imagine my dissapointment when I thought it was a srpg but turned out an action rpg with nothing really relating to the originals. I bought it new and returned it to gamestop for like $10 a month later.

>>6482273
>I bought it new and returned it to gamestop for like $10 a month later.
Ouch.

A couple years ago I was like "I'll give the nu-Shining games a chance" and imported all 3 of those PSP Shining games. They're still wrapped and unplayed to this day. I'll play them someday.

I love how all the games are connected, lore-wise.

>>6482281
Oh. I have never seen that combinedmap before. That is really cool. Where is it from?
But it also makes you wonder about who the ninjas in 3 are talking about when mentioning the east then, because Rune sure wasn't the ninja town.

>>6482273
I hear Exa had some fun in there but yeah it definitely departs from it, same as Neo, but Neo was at least still kinda sorta looking SF, even if it was a mediocre arpg.
>Shining Tears
That also kinda sorta looks the part and I completely forgot about it.

I think that Feather and Blade never got translated is a bit of a shame. At least those are SRPGs even if both lack a decently sized character roster.

Is there a fan translation for Shining Force II? Wikipedia suggests there is one but I can't find it. Is the original translation even that bad?

>>6482313
>Where is it from?
I forget, since I saved that pic a long time ago. But it's probably from shiningforcecentral.com. Not anything official, I'd wager though.

>>6482351
Probably. Still cool tho

>>6482381
I would probably trust a lot from the folks over at that site though, especially if it's from Moogie (SFC.com's founder & moderator). She once wrote a lengthy article explaining the lore and connection between the different Shining games, and it was actually published on Camelot's official site, see
>shiningforcecentral.com/?p=studies&c=chronology

>>6481928
>Not waifuing or even liking Sarah
Abyssal terrible, excrement taste

>>6482486
Does it even surprise you anymore? There are people out there who hate Mae, for gods sake.

>>6482516
>hate Mae
Unacceptable. Mae is bae. Also can you give me sauce for that pic? Artist pixiv/twitter?

>>6482516
I'm honestly not sure why anyone would hate any SF character, most don't have a ton to go on in the first place and none stand out as being particularly annoying or anything either.

>>6482570
That is correct.

>>6482026
your characters were not of equal level or you got absolutely ass blasted by rng. pelle is pretty average. and like >>6482257 said, different characters have different growth curves. ken gets more hp than others (at least early). mae gets more defense. arthur gets more attack. guntz gets more defense. zylo gets more attack. other characters simply dont compare. and no, most other characters NEVER have a stat boom like that.

>>6482479
I'll have to read through that sometime, sounds like some good autism.

>>6482805
Bless her for still maintaining shiningforcecentral.com even after losing interest in nu-Shining. I think she stopped updating the list of Shining games after Shining Heart came out.

>>6482815
Yeah it's good to see those forums up. I recall finding at least a translation script for Feather on there, which might be useful in the future.
Still a shame nobody ever made that patch.

>>6480774
>Domingo
>B Tier
You absolutely stupid motherfucker. Did you ignore the part where Domingo:
>is literally the only tank mage in the game
>ignores terrain and has high movement
>has absurdly high HP, DEF and AGI
>will lure in enemies towards him instead of your fragile mages or weaker units
>can be used as a frontline tank OR assassin to pick off any troublesome enemy
>can buff others with Attack if magic won't be enough to one-shot
>is gotten fairly early in the game
Literally his only flaw is his shit ATK (which hardly matters for a mage) to prevent him from being outright gamebreaking. Even when he runs out of MP, he still makes for a reliable wall.

>>6483279
>just beat the game yesterday for the first time
>missed domingo even though I got his egg

>>6483279
You forgot to mention that he is cute.

>>6483332
My man.

>>6483279
i honestly forgot he can even learn attack/boost. i suppose he could be a viable substitute for anri or tao if you put in the extra training for him, but thats a LOT of catch up. like 10 levels worth of catch up, more or less depending on playstyle. sure, alef might be similar, and adam has even more catch up. wouldnt be entirely opposed to putting domingo in A. hell even dropping adam down to B. domingo still isnt a waifu and intelligent tactics shouldnt really be getting tao/anri killed anyway.

I'm playing SF3 and there's an evil mage called abdark, they say he's a Vandal. I thought he was a devil but the translations were different but they don't seem to be the same acording to the wikis.

>>6474880
Different anon, what emulator would you recommend I use?

>>6484764
SSF
There is no option to scale the internal resolution but it works without any issues. I hear mednafen or retroarch also work, but no clue.
I think I had to set it up to emulate the memory cart of the Saturn rather than using an infinite memory folder, which is an option. But you can make lile 20 saves on the cart, so more than enough to have a couple for all three scenarios.

Check the translation patch website. They suggest version R12 of it. But I later ones seem to be fine too. As of the latest one, R16 I think, you dont need an external virtual CD drive anymore either.
If you want one tho I suggest virtual clone drive, 3 comes in ISOs and it mounts those just fine while being relatively low profile.

Lastly, do not trust save states to substitute for saves proper. I only had them be corrupted once and not work anymore, but it can happen.

I thinnk that is about it.

>>6484305
Are they? I thought they just changed their mind about terminology.

>>6484784
>I hear mednafen or retroarch also work, but no clue.
Mednafen user here, works fine on my end.
>Lastly, do not trust save states to substitute for saves proper
I second this. Strongly. Use proper saves, every time.

>>6484813
Yeah. Especially for something like three 40-50h games that would be a pain.
But you need proper saves anyway just for transferring data between scenarios.

Perhaps to add what the problems with another emulator were. Yabasanshiro and whatever forks it has works, kind of, but there are graphical issues.
The spell animations are broken, one some versions it is the fire spell and sometimes the Elbesem Orb effect (you wont have that until later in Scenario 1).
Also the Selection circle for looking at your units disappears in some chapters and so do the textbox backgrounds.
Waterfall textures or water proper is just missing or replaced by the equivalent of a pink/black square texture.
Lastly every 30 minutes or so, sometimes more or less, the sound would just hang on a note forcing a restart.

At that point I just switched to SSF, which was maybe 3 chapters into Scenario 1. It is a shame to only get really pixelated models, but they are good enough and it is better than dealing with any of the above. Allegedly there are also crashes in Scenario 2 and 3 with it.

>>6484843
How faithful is SSF to the original Saturn when it comes to SF3?

>>6484896
No clue I dont have a Saturn, but it runs properly, the save transfer works and there were no general issues for me. So I assume it is at least decently accurate and definitely compatible.

>>6484784
>terminology
they might've done, the wikis can be under developed.

>>6485539
That's what I thought at least. Frankly Innovator was a bit of a weird word to use like that.

>>6484784
Thanks bro, going to replay 1 then 2 (despite being a huge fan of 1 I never actually finished 2) and move on to 3.

>>6485752
Have fun!
That's more or less what I did too, just played those three in order. Technically CD/Final Conflict are between 1 and 2 if you want to play chronologically, I think, but I just wanted to knock the big three out.
>2
It's good too, some QoL stuff compared to 1, mostly in terms of things like the XP carrying over on level ups and the inventory being a bit less of a chore.
There are also some points where you can grind certain battles by walking into them on the overworld.

I think overall I ended up preferring 1 for the feel of it, but 2 had those improvements.

>>6485770
Right I completely forgot about CD I believe you find out what happened to Max right? Got into the series because of my uncle and it was one of the earlier games I used to play as a kid LOVE LOVE LOVE it.

>>6485886
I can't say, I haven't played CD yet. It might be, as far as I know it bridges the gap between 1 and 2.

>>6485886
The Max/Mischaella plot is only in Final Conflict.

>>6485886
This >>6486330. Shining Force CD is basically a remake (Takahashi actually used the word "remake" in the design documents for CD iirc) of Gaiden 1 & 2 and has nothing to do with Max. The Max & Mishaela plot is only in Final Conflict and bridges not only 1 and 2 but also with Shining in the Darkness which takes place *after* 1 & 2.

>>6470925
>>6477165
More like the series died when Tony Taka took over. Even if his art is good on a technical level, the series has legitimately just been a huge ad for people to buy his figures for years now and you can't even kiss the girls or anything despite how much they apparently want the dating sim audience crowd; whats the point?
>>6477214
>>6478664
I'd honestly rather ditch Tony but if this was the only way to get back to the feel of the original games then I'd put up with it. He needs to start learning how to draw more than just same face elf girls for the series though; I'm not a furry but as said earlier in thread, Shining's different races was one of it's charm points.
>>6479734
I always think about how different Pako's (Shining Force Exa/Feather) and Noizi Ito's (Shining Force Feather, though she's better known for Haruhi Suzumiya) artstyles are for Shining but yet compared to Tony, they got pretty close to the original series vibe.
>>6479096
>tfw he had just begun his own manga
>tfw went to check it out after he died and liked what he ad so far of it a lot
rip ;_;

>>6457979
I too like to coom to pixels.

>>6486869
I don't know about Exa but Feather was alright, at least kinda. The character designs still felt a bit more overdone than the other SF games, even 3, but it was something.
And the combat was kinda fun.

>>6486869
>you can't even kiss the girls or anything despite how much they apparently want the dating sim audience crowd
Oh my god, this annoys me so much. So many Japanese games suffer from this. Just a lack of committal; of not wanting to go all in. They make RPGs where you can romance the girls, with affection meters etc. But you can't even fucking kiss them! I know a lot of devs want to keep the character's relationships "open" so that fans can ship him with her and whatnot but it gets frustrating seeing game writers doing hint-hint nudge-nudge romance with nothing concrete.

Kinda off-topic but there was this PS Vita game "Demon Gaze" which pleasantly surprised me; not only do you get to romance and kiss the girl, but halfway through the game you even have canonical fade-to-black sex. And the game ends with you having a child with her.

>>6484784
>SSF
Didn't it now requires Vulkan?

>>6487256
It might, I don't know frankly because I just use my desktop.

>>6470979
>A pity that no one modded the SF2 changing the ending.

As much as I hate the ending of SF2, I think I'd hate it more if someone changed it just to suit our fanfic needs. Not that I still don't think a Sarah ending would be better if they ever made a remake but the idea of just changing someone else's work really always rubs me the wrong way.

>>6487268
If it were to happen, I think the easiest way, writing-wise, would be to just not have her have an outburst. Which keeps true to the original, without the unnecessary heartbreak.
But then, as said earlier, one can always just imagine their fanfiction anyway.

>>6487256
What's a Vulkan?

I honestly don't remember Sarah's outburst. At all. It's been fucking YEARS since I last played SF2. I should replay it.

>>6487283
It really does kind of come out of nowhere. Sir OldFuckFace tells you to wake up the princess with a kiss and then Sarah runs out crying. If I had known she were in to me I really wouldn't want to get with Nancy Narcolepsy. Not really a fan of blonds anyways.

>>6487241
I agree with them being more overdone but if I had to choose between keeping Tony or bringing back one of these designers, I'd still pick them. It just hurts seeing how unrecognizable the series is these days in his style.
>>6487254
It's super annoying. It'd be a whole new set of issues with the new games if they were full on dating sims that really committed themselves to that but part of me wishes that they at least actually did that instead of all this nudge nudge teasing that ultimately amounts to nothing in the end as you said. It's why I said they all basically work as ads for Tony's figures instead, since they're super watered down dating sims at the very best.
>>6487268
>tfw in Shining Wisdom it's canon that Sarah and Kazin travel around together fighting off stray bad guys with Kazin still having feelings for Sarah but Sarah still hung up over Bowie
>>6487283
Basically everyone asked Sarah if she agreed that Bowie and Elis were perfect for each other which causes her to run out with Kazin running after her, iirc. I wouldn't have a problem with this if as said, it didn't come out of nowhere but also if Elis had legit said at least 1 meaningful thing out of the 2 likes she does get in the game in comparison to how much you hear from Sarah.

>>6487293
>>6487254

Frankly Im just sick and tired of the dating sim trend making it so every girl has to be there for the MC to not pick. She can't have a relationship with any other character because the MC needs to be the one to solve all their issues so they fall in love with him despite having no real chemistry. It fucking ruined Trails of Cold Steel. Can you imagine how bad it would be if they did this to Lunar? Sorry Kyle and Jess, sorry Mia and Nash, sorry Ronfar and Mauri. You don't get to have meaningful character growth and chemistry with other people and have meaningful relationships because I need to be a self insert faggot. I love a good secondary romance. Why can't people just let a story be a story anymore.

>>6487283
It's just the very ending, as in after the final battle.

>>6487290
It's also weird how much they play up humans to humans and elves to elves etc. in that one. I think Jaha gets rejected too and so on.
Grans is a bit of a mess in that regard it seems.

>>6487293
Oh absolutely, well again that or forcing the guy to actually draw somewhat in the series' tone and style. Not that I expect the old cartoony stuff to be back, but you know.
That said I'd like to see the knights armored a bit more like 1 had them again, or Arthur in 3. something about the simplicity was just nice.
>Wisdom
I didn't know that. As side characters I assume?
>still hung up
Well that just adds more salt.
>Elis
I mean, I get it in the sense that you kiss the princess at the end to wake her up and it's a fairy tale ending. Even if she didn't do anything before that kinda makes sense. It's just that with the outburst out of the blue it gets this sour tone that didn't even need to be there.

>>6487309
You know the fairy tale ending would often at least have the hero pine for the princess from afar in some capacity so at least some attraction isn't out of the blue.

>>6487305
>ToCS
Well that might be annoying once I get to it.
That said if you absolutely have to have relationships in an SRPG, I think you have a cast big enough usually to play matchup with a lot of groups, in a story or as a mechanic. Wasn't that one FE game just a eugenics simulator because of it?
Feels like that would make a ton more sense and not a waste of a system or cast.

Not that I even think it should be there necessarily. A story can be told without romance of course.

>>6487315
True, but I'm just saying, given that Bowie is mostly mute, and that it's what they were clearly going for, that it would be ok in my book.

>>6487317
>Wasn't that one FE game just a eugenics simulator because of it?

Pretty much all the Fire Emblem games are basically match maker. And to be blunt even in the non eugenics one the relationships are always very brief and frankly forced. Just imagine,

>Character A: Oh hello, Character B! I didn't see you because I was doing THING!
>Character B: Oh, Character A? I didn't realize you liked THING. Let us bond over THING 3 to 4 times with increasing levels of intimacy that has no bearing on our actual personalities or narrative!

>>6487319
True, but I think if you wanted a gameplay mechanic, that is preferrable to the whole protag thing talked about above I would say.
Though ideally matching up certain groups should give you bonus missions that could unlock certain things for those characters. Not strictly romance mind you, but that's what Valkyria Chronicles did with their later entries.
That way you'd get something fun out of it too. Beyond just a stronger unit. Albeit it's also much more limited as you don't really get to pick anything, given that the matchups and friendships are predetermined, but it means you can also pack just a little more side story into them.

>>6487305
Unfortunately thats the market these days it seems. Even though FE was literally saved by its dating sim elements, at least even then the girls you don't pick can still develop/have relationships with others outside of the self insert protag. I surprisingly found Excella in Shining Resonance a bit interesting, but the fact that she's quite literally locked out from interacting with anyone who isn't the self insert protag is absolutely irritating. That is to say though, I agree it's a trend that I also wish would stop. Back when they localized Shining Resonance they mentioned wanting to appear to western fans more which made me curious as to if they were going to try and go back to the series roots in some way or form, but it was extremely vague and I'm a hopeless full who still clings on to even the tiniest bit of hope that maybe one day the series I love won't be a ghost of it's former self anymore.
>>6487309
>>6487315
Bowie does speak a handful of times, but I don't recall him ever saying to Elis outside of something like "oof" and that wasn't even directed at her, it was in response to him falling after trying to save her or something. I think that was the only time Elis even said something about him as well, which also wasn't directly to him. Bowie never shows any sort of attraction to Sarah either honestly but because the player is super familiar with her along with her being an easy unit to keep throughout your whole playthrough (not to mention that Sarah kickstarted your adventure by pushing you to go to the castle with her), its understandable why Bowie and Elis just doesn't make any sense in the end to many who played.

And also about Wisdom, they were side characters yes. Working designs screwed up the NA translation by retranslating their names and making it seem like they were both romantically involved but the original JP and more accurately translated EU games made clear that it was very one sided on Kazin's side.

>>6487305
I can agree with that.
>It fucking ruined Trails of Cold Steel
Rean was a mistake.

>>6487309
More on Kazin/Sarah in Shining Wisdom, its so one sided that Sarah only took interest in Kazin after she at first thought he defeated the games bad guy since she's attracted to Heroic qualities, and while he lets her believe that at first to have her affection, he quickly admits that he didn't which she loses interest in him just as quickly too. I still need to play through it all myself but I remember searching up the clips on yt forever ago.

That said, I do like Kazin and Sarah together a lot though; even if they aren't a canon thing I still find the relationship they do have interesting.

>>6487337
>>6487336
I feel like I really want to like the trails series but in addition to be mind numbingly long and repetitive, Cold Steel pulls that bullshit persona crap. And under normal circumstances I think I might be more forgiving or willing to put up with it but it KILLS the narrative. It straight up murders it. The whole point of your team is that you're meant to be a melting plot of different classes and social statuses which is GREAT for narrative potential. Oh but look nobody can say shit to anyone outside the occasional designated pairs. One dude HATES all the nobles but he only ever briefly squabbles with the one completely ignoring the other who is actually a really good example of what a noble should be a perfect antithesis to his hate because if she can't even so much as talk to another boy. Like there is so much potential here and it's all murdered for Rean.

>>6487336
>>6487341
That cosplayer, is that Aizawa Memi? (twitter.com/memiest)

>>6487336
>oof
Unrelated somewhat, but the damn cutscenes in 2 were so much fun. Chucking Bowie up after Elis, or most of Astral running around and doing whatever.
>Wisdom
>>6487341
That is just rough still.

>>6487341
>Sarah only took interest in Kazin after she at first thought he defeated the games bad guy since she's attracted to Heroic qualities,

Girl got standards.

>>6487357
It is indeed Memi, bless her soul. I wonder if she'll ever mae a Shining Force fanbook with staff interviews like she did for Phantasy Star though.
>>6487358
Both 1 and 2 had lots of fun scenes and I'm still very appreciative of that. I still enjoy the one scene where the NPC painted Bowie as your typical bishounen, sparkles and all.
>>6487360
She really does, but it's hard to beat Bowie who's not only a childhood friend but also the guy who saved the world. Rip Kazin.

>>6487379
I don't really remember Kazin being especially UNheroic. I mean he was there from before you left the first kingdom. Im sure if he applied himself he could be very heroic.

>>6487379
I forgot about that scene, that was fun too.
I think the less serious nature of some of them with some slapstick stuff was fun for 2. In part also the fact that every character that was lying on the floor was just a rotated standing sprite.

>>6487389
So I did have it saved, nice. It's nice seeing how much fun Camelot had making the games.
>>6487385
He wasn't a wimp/weakling for sure and even seems to be remembered as a hero if he's off riding the remnants of Zeon with Sarah in Wisdom, but it just wasn't enough for her it seems.

>>6487282
Newish graphical API.
Not every toaster has a video card supporting it.

>>6487394
>It's nice seeing how much fun Camelot had making the games.

Camelot and Sega really needed each other. Every game they've made without each other has been dreadful.

>>6487403
Camelot is literally begging Sega to let them make SF4. Sega has the power to finally free them from being doomed to only make Mario sports games but we just don't know if they will ever do so.

>>6487394
Yeah the games, and I think Golden Sun too, are full with little fun stuff that just feels right. Albeit it's been ages since I've seen stuff about Golden Sun so I couldn't quote anything.
Just makes it even more of a shame that they just stopped.

>>6487410
Sega better let them. If they let VC4 happen after that series was pretty damn ded, and it was a beautiful return to form. They could let SF4 happen too.
Maybe they need to make a PC port of SF3 and have that be a surprise hit too for good measure, to fuel SF4.
One can dream.

>>6487423
>and it was a beautiful return to form.

It was horrid.

>>6487424
It was good tho. All the gameplay was there, the story was fun enough, you had cool bosses and some cool missions and setpieces. It was just about anything I wanted out of a VC game.
Missed some QoL from the PSP games, but I feared for a V:R 2.0 disaster.

>>6487429
>the story was fun enough

The story was the worst part and had wholes so big you can drive a barge through. The main character was phenomenally annoying and the only thing I liked was Minerva's massive hate boner for him.

>Waaaaaaaah My name is Claude, I sulked so hard it actually gave me the power to read the weather for no reason and it works on different climates thousands of miles from the shitty village I grew up in.

It tried to shoe horn in the magic loli's entire story and her endearment to the crew in a single rapid fire chapter, and everything involving Kai was infuriating. Raz's death was also pointless and anyone with any amount of thought could have thought up a plan that would have prevented that. Like using your massive guns to shoot the fucking fence.

>>6487434
I get your points, but it honestly didn't bother me all that much while playing. I enjoyed the game a lot to say the least. It felt right for an entry in the series.
But I can enjoy the not!school from 2 and most of the dumb shit from 3, so maybe I am a pleb.
No clue, it's just a fun game overall to me. Which isn't to say that it's flawless, but it definitely felt like it belonged to the series.
>spoiler
It was, I don't know why they didn't just shoot the balloons. But at least they just let you rez him and whoever you send off for NG+ so you can pretend it didn't happen.

Either way. The point was, that I was just dreaming about SF making a return in a similar fashion.

>>6487450
Oh I defiantly would be happy to see it come back. Maybe use a similar graphics engine even, I think that sketchy story book look would work really way for the old style

>>6487459
The thing is, if they'd crossover those two games, as in use the Blitz engine to make an SF game, I'd be about as happy as one can be. But it's not necessarily the gameplay of 1-3 either so it might be hit and miss for people.

I think Shining Blade and Hearts tried that, with the PSP engine, but both of those are JP only and suffer from terribly small character rosters as I recall. Ontop of being Shining in name only as far as I know.

>sketchy look
Yeah if anything that could work. All the VC games are bright and colourful too and stylised well enough so that I could see it working for a 3d SF game.

Please properly spoiler any plot-relevant info from Valkyria Chronicles 4. I haven't played it yet. Though I have actually bought it. It's sitting on my shelf, still sealed.

Which SF4 would you prefer?
>traditional square grid-based battlefield
>hex-based
>VC style freedom of movement

>>6487590
Personally, VC, because I like the combat system there a lot.
Alternatively they just refine the formula they used for the other SF games. Maybe give you abilities like 3 kinda tried, but instead of them being random you have some control over them to make it a bit more involved. Maybe work on how the turn order works.
I don't think I'd change to hex based.

>>6487586
Have fun once you do. It's cool.

>>6487590
Traditional square since that's Shining Force's thing and not VC.
I don't want or need them to reinvent the wheel, I just literally want Shining Force 1, 2 or CD, but with QoL improvements like a turn order list, not a thorn in my ass to manage equipment, and a more competent A.I. without having to resort to a difficulty slider.

>>6488308
A turn oder list would go a long way already.

>>6488440
>>6488308
The GBA version of Shining Force has a turn order list.

Just started SF2. How the fuck do I keep Kiwi alive long enough to gain xp? His attack power is shit and mages always beeline for him and one-shot him.

>>6488452
It had a number of QoL improvements from what I've played, such as a unified inventory that you could equip people from.
Although I've not seen the turn order, where was that at?

>>6488474
I think I just droped him after a while. Short of just grinding I don't think there's much to do.

>>6488548
Turn order was buried in a menu. It's been a long time so I don't remember exactly how to pull it up.

>>6488582
Alright, I'm sure I'll find it

>>6487590
grid based.
Sonic Mania would be a good example of how to make a new edition. similar feel and gameplay with fixes, better graphics and small editions.

>>6488474
Kiwi is tough to manage. You either grind him as early as possible or he falls behind and never recovers. If you're already struggling to level him up then it's already not worth it.
>>6488548
>unified inventory that you could equip people from
I actually really like the separate inventories of the earlier Shining games. Reminds me of another series I'm really fond of, Wizardry. I think for SF4 they should retain the separate inventories and retain SF2's automatic item transfer when picking up items.

>>6488931
it might be too easy if you could use an unified invetory during battle.
I would like a an option to view all the items the members have in one grid, then you could drag and drop items from one character to another or the inventory.

also having a special inventory for key items would be good.
I've started playing 3 recently and I do appreciate that they give the characters two extra slots just for accessories and weapons.

>>6488972
>I would like a an option to view all the items the members have in one grid, then you could drag and drop items from one character to another or the inventory.
Very good idea. I like the separate inventories since it gives some tactical depth (who do I put on Healing Seed duty in battle?) but the added convenience of easy item management outside of combat would be welcome.

>>6488972
>it might be too easy if you could use an unified invetory during battle.

It would make healers pointless out the gate if you could just hoard healing items anyone could use.

what game should I start with? if its 1, should I go with the megadrive or gba?

>>6487423
I like Shining Force a lot better than Golden Sun (mainly bc Golden Sun had a bit more of a messy development that shows at times) but I agree it had lots of fun and charming n it too. From the first time I saw how VC played I've always wished for Sega to make a new Shining game in that style, even though I understand wanting the original overhead tiles back too since I still love that style too. It could play like the new FE game that allows you to to do both (no pixels though) but I'm not sure if I'm ready to endure more SF vs FE arguments. Everyone and their moms hopes for a completed (and translated) SF3 port and it's still a dream to be honest but dangit, I still want it bad too, along with SF4 of course.
>>6487424
Hey, I liked VC4 though it could count as my first VC since I haven't played much of 1.
>>6487590
VC style with traditional square grid, aka FE3H style. It'd probably be pushing it to have it go between 2d and 3d though and like I said before, I'm not sure I'm ready for more SF vs FE arguments. One thing I'd want them to keep though is turns determined by speed as opposed to you picking who moves when you want. Sure it was irritating at times but playing FE3H after replaying SF1 really made me realize how fond of it I was.
>>6489432
If you just want the SRPGS start with 1. If you're interested in the series as a whole start with Shining in the Darkness which is the very first game in the series but is a dungeon crawler.

>>6489432
I forgot to mention the versions for 1, sorry. Genesis one is my personal fav but if you're interested in the story then I'd recommend the gba remake for a more accurate translation. You can still get the gist of the story for the genesis game alright enough but they completely screw up on some very important plot points that does leave you confused. While fans have translated the JP text from the game, I don't believe anyones made a patch with it oddly enough.

Holy shit, anons. Literally just announced like 2 hours ago: Game Gear Micro. The Yellow version has all 3 of the Shining Force Gaiden games. I'm kinda tempted to buy honestly.

>>6488931
>>6488972
Note that you cant use the inventory during battle It is still separate then. Bur for purchases your items go straight to the storage. Then you pick from there when you want someone to have something

>>6489590
Same anon, unfortunately. Making a ant-sized game gear is a new low for Sega but the fact that they put all the Shining gg games on it entices me more than I'd like to admit.

>>6489749
I just wished it was a little bit bigger. Right now it's 8 cm wide, 4.3 cm tall and 2 cm thick. Might be a tad uncomfortable for long gaming sessions, but the novelty of it all makes me wanna buy it. If the battery lasts long then maybe it'll be worth it.

>>6489541
I'm not sure I'd necessarily mix the two styles, mostly because I can't quite picture how that'd work, given a lot of VC is about moving your unit freely while a grid system is inherently more restrictive on movement.
>SF3
Imagine a release that is just all three games, and the premium disk, in one, with some QoL stuff like being able to go to sync points after or NG+ and all that stuff.
I think that recent release of Langrisser I and II kinda did that for its branching paths.
>spoiler
I suggest you do, all four of them are pretty fun.

>>6489590
Those things look really tiny, damn.
I get making it a little smaller but that's a bit much.
But it could be cool for those games. The originals weren't released in the west were they? I mean outside of the CD remake.
Was there a translation patch for them?

>>6489756
It looks like it'd make a cute charm for car keys or something but I wouldn't want to subject it to that if it's 50 bucks. Also knowing myself, I'd probably accidently beak it after one button press. It's nice seeing Shining basically own most of the console to itself though.
>>6489760
I wish I could better explain it, but I can understand why you think it'd be something hard to mesh together too. I forgot Langrisser I and II got ported; it's still a shame the mobile game still looks miles better than it but I'd still like to play one day. Maybe after I get around to finally playing more of VC1.

>>6489760
>Was there a translation patch for them?
Only Gaiden 1 was localised iirc. Final Conflict has a translation patch. Gaiden 2, despite not being localised, is still playable in English through SF CD.

>>6489784
If anything it'd be cool for someone to grab the translated roms off one of those then. Assuming they release them in the west anyway.

>>6489782
I think I just wouldn't mess with either formula too much. As said a while back Shining Blade was an attempt at doing the VC kinda combat with a Shining game and that worked. I mean aside from the usual complaints of later Shining games.
>Langrisser
Yeah I would've picked it up just to try the series out with a bit more convenience like that, but it honestly just looks cheap with the sprites like that.
So maybe I'll just play the originals if I do. 40 bucks is also a bit much as is.

>>6489590
I honestly like the look of those two green buttons on a yellow body. Looks funky.

>>6489541
>>6489550
Thanks for the info.
>If you're interested in the series as a whole start with Shining in the Darkness which is the very first game in the series but is a dungeon crawler
I do really like dungeon crawlers so Ill give it a try I guess. Didnt know shinning series had these games.

>>6489879
The old Camelot games that aren't SRPGs are:
>Shining in the Darkness (Crawler)
>Shining The Holy Ark (Crawler)
>Shining Wisdom (ARPG)
And then most of the current releases are either ARPGs or just JRPGs, but Shining in name only mostly.

>>6489879
Np. The Shining series has lots of other games besides srpgs as the previous anon said but those are just the most popular ones.

>>6489879
>>6489895
>>6489901
I honestly really like those two Shining first person gridders/dungeon crawlers.

>>6489970
I haven't played them properly yet, but Shining in the Darkness just looks really comfy stylistically, and Ark seems fun enough too. Cool combat music.

That said, I wish ark also let you recruit from the entire pool of races available, but they didn't do that for either of the crawlers.

>>6489432
You should NEVER go with the GBA version of anything.

>>6489981
Neither Darkness or Ark are the kind of dungeon crawlers were you make your own party. They have defined characters and stories.

>>6489993
It's not bad tho, potentially bad story changes and the lack of outlines around battle sprites aside.

>>6490001
I'm aware, I'm just saying that they fail to make use of what would be available for a cast.
Not that it matters much for what they are really.

>>6490010
Different anon, but I played like the first couple hours of SF GBA and despite the changes that I *did* like, the aesthetics really, really didn't work out for me. I won't say it's a bad game since a lot of people say it's good, but I doubt I'll ever play it again. I really don't like the art, sorry. More of a personal thing.

>>6490021
I think I've grown used to them a bit, but I've played maybe the first three battles so far. It's a shame, given that something as simple as adding outlines to the sprites would make it so much better, especially because on the overworld, they had the outlines.

>>6489590
jfc sega

>>6488474
in my experience, you get him early enough that low damage numbers dont mean much if you just feed him a little bit before leaving grans island. since other characters get weapons, i usually equip him with the power ring in parmecia. if you havent fed him enough and he's only hitting for 1s, its probably too late. regardless, magic is a generally consistent thing in sf2, and the spells only get stronger late game. he's pretty decent in all regards EXCEPT hp pool, so that weakness of getting blasted by magic might not be ideal.

Oh, by the way, that Game Gear Micro? The four-set of that is already sold out on AmazonJP and Ebten.
>>6490692
>if you havent fed him enough and he's only hitting for 1s, its probably too late
This, absolutely this. He's a case of "grind him now and give him your booster items or forever fall behind". He really cannot recover at all from lagging behind in levels.

Oh fuck, I double-checked. Yep, even the Yellow version that has the 3 Shining Force Gaiden games are already out of stock unless you're willing to buy at 3 times the inflated price from scalpers. See pic related. Maaaaan, fuck scalpers. It's only been 10 hours since the announcement, what the fuck.

>>6490752
>>6490769
I mean those are the jap versions anyway aren't they?
But yeah, I imagine as usual the scalping is hard.

>>6490752
you dont necessarily have to give him booster items, but his defense generally stays high enough to only take 1 damage. if he falls behind, he starts taking real damage and then cant compete in any aspect. power ring should be enough to at least "clean up" low hp guys and stay up in level to contribute real damage in short order.

>>6490001
kek, naked Galm.

>>6490850
>I mean those are the jap versions anyway aren't they?
I was planning on buying the Japanese versions, because no way in hell are we getting the unlocalised Gaiden games for the western release. No company is willing to accept the idea of patch-translating roms. Yet.

>>6489782
These niggas really thought Nick looked like Max.
Either they are really stupid or Nick really is a master ruseman.

>>6492335
Woah, older Tao looking very fine.

>>6492354
I feel like this artist hard at least one more picture of her but I might be imaging it since I'm sure I've saved majority of their work.

>>6492359
I got a couple.

>>6492363
Second one. His art is very lovely.

>>6492369
He also drew one of my favourite Holy Ark fanart ever. Pic related.

>>6492363
>>6492369
>>6492370
Thanks, I'm surprised I missed these. It'd be nice to see all 3 of them together in a game, if there's any chances of that at all. I'm glad that despite how dead the old games are, I'm grateful to all the artists that still draw fanart for them; DA fetish artists need not apply.

>>6492335
>>6492359
>>6492363
>>6492369
>>6492370
>>6492373
Oh, nice I'd never seen those before. I assume going by filenames that the artist is @Pict?
>fanart
Yeah it's nice to see.
I still have a drawing or two I wanted to do, but time's hard to come by as is. Perhaps one of these threads.

>>6492397
@Pict_A_Piyond actually, and kamiomutsu on DA where I first found them. They're more active on twitter though anyway.
I actually have a picture I'd like to draw too ever since finishing my replay of 1 but I'm also not sure when I'll have time or if I have the skill to pull it off as I imagine it either.

>>6492402
Neat, I like their colouring and lines tbqh. It's nice.
Maybe I'll pretty up one I did when I finished up 1 a while back, not quite happy with it as is for posting, if the thread is still around by tomorrow or the weekend anyway.
But I wanted to draw some stuff after I did get through 3, that would take up a bit more time.

SEGA have acknowledged the Game Gear Micro being out of stock:
>https://twitter.com/SEGA_OFFICIAL/status/1268431272256266241
due to pre-orders exceeding expectations. They've said they're reopening pre-orders, likely meaning additional units will be manufactured to compensate the demand. If you're one of those weirdoes like me that want to buy this uncomfortable ergonomic nightmare, now's the chance!

>>6492435
Do you know if Amazon ships this internationally too? I'm so tempted anon, I really am.

>>6492435
Godspeed, Anon

>>6492528
It should, it might just cost a good chunk. Or nothing at all if you're lucky.

>>6492528
>Do you know if Amazon ships this internationally too?
I just checked, apparently it has restricted shipping. So not every country can it be shipped to. Not too sure why. If that fails you might have to use a forwarder or proxy.

>>6492528
Source for that image? Artist twitter link, please?

>SEGA FINALLY re-releases the GG Shining Force games
>but it's Japan only
>but it's on the shittiest possible device imaginable
>but it's also $50 just for FOUR (4) Game Gear games
>but it's also being sold EXCLUSIVELY in Japan
>but the other 2 games are STILL untranslated
God I fucking hate monkey paws.

>>6492639
Do we have confirmation that it's JP only or is that just what we all think?

Anyone here played Shining Force 3 in Japanese? I've been thinking about doing a playthrough in Japanese but my Japanese is pretty much just N3/N2-tier (JLPT). Like, I can understand most shounen manga fine but that's about it. Is the language in SF3 difficult?

>>6492640
[Different anon] Right now those machines are only for Japan so firstly, we don't even know if the rest of the world is getting those. Secondly, even if it releases for the West, chances are SEGA will change the games included. None of these companies rereleasing retro games through retro consoles (Nintendo, Konami, etc.) have done a "retro-translation" of their rereleases. I doubt SEGA will change that. Though if they do, it'll set a wonderful precedent.

>>6492650
Well, yeah, that's why I said "what we all think". I imagine it'll be there, but so long as there's no official stance on it there's at least a tiny bit of hope left.

Question time! If SEGA+Camelot ever made Shining Force 4, where would you like them to place it in the Shining timeline?
1. After SF3, basically with the whole Vandal + Innovator plotline.
2. Before even SF1, maybe the origins of Dark Dragon and the other two Demon Kings.
3. Somewhere between Shining in the Darkness and Shining the Holy Ark, since supposedly there's a huge timeskip between these two.

Rememer to properly hide any game spoilers in case there are anons here who haven't played the relevant games.

>>6492776
Good question. That I don't think I have a real answer to.
I think all the games are self contained enough that none really need much expanding on so I imagine you could, or should, make another story like that. Perhaps set it in that big timeskip on some other continent or one of the unexplored regions and then just do your usual story. That also means you can work from a clean slate again. Which could be good for newcomers too.

What I do know though, is that I'd want for the more simple aesthetics for characters of SF1 and 2 to be back. 3 wasn't bad but it had a lot of very different looking characters, where the other two felt like you were commanding a much more standard and uniform force even if you picked them up as you travelled. If you get what i mean.
But that's just personal taste.

>>6492839
>the other two felt like you were commanding a much more standard and uniform force even if you picked them up as you travelled
Yeah I can see that.
>Perhaps set it in that big timeskip on some other continent or one of the unexplored regions
>unexplored regions
Holy shit. Bro. I just had an idea. You know how the previous Shining games' continents/countries had names like Granseal, Rune, Enrich, Thornwood, etc. right? For Shining Force 4, set it in a new continent. The name of that continent is.... Camelot.
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>6492941
I think it's probably just because the sprites were more uniform. And the designs more down to earth for most.
>spoiler
kek
But only if you up the arthurian fairytale memery further.

Should a newcomer to the series play SF1 on the Genesis or GBA?

>>6492961
Already answered here, mate: >>6489432
I prefer the Mega Drive/Genesis version, ESPECIALLY for newcomers. Even though that version has that annoying inventory management.

>>6492961
Depends, but I started with the Genesis one, you can always play the GBA one later. And it's perhaps easier to then look at what they changed for the update.

>>6492435
>ps classic has to be sold at a loss (probably) to get rid of the stock
>sega has to make another batch of micro-gamegear-shits
LOL, weird timeline.

>>6493129
Never really looked into it, but beyond the usual trappings of these emulators, what was wrong with the PS Classic anyway?

>>6492776
for timeline, i would want something very before (like with prevalent ancients presence, and/or the 3 demon kings), or something very afterwards.

either way, i would want it to be a sweeping big adventure across as much land as possible, with as many references to the past/future as possible. my only qualm about something like that is the pacing. too many battles might get kind of boring. not spending enough time in/on continents might seem too sporadic. more battles means more levels, which means higher numbers, and numbers can already get out of hand by the ends of the games as they are (from 1 and 2 experience at least)

>>6492776
I would like a back to basics storyline, so maybe something set after SF2 and have it feature Lucifer as the big bad. (the greater devil lost in translation).
perhaps something also involving the ancients.

I say after SF2 but it could be after SF3 as well, it doesn't matter I'm just a bit unsure on how that would effect things.

>>6492941
>The name of that continent is.... Camelot.

No. It is a silly place.

>>6493291
Yeah, I agree. If it tries to do some sort of continent-traversing grand adventure and try to maintain pacing, the game might end up being too long and drawn out with inflated battle numbers.
>>6493397
>perhaps something also involving the ancients.
Yeah, that might be cool.

>>6494508
Cute elf. Want to ear touch.

>>6492535
>>6492546
Thanks, I at least know a site/someone I could probably proxy it from but I also know that sometimes Amazon JP ships certain items internationally too and wasn't sure if this was one of them. if it's still open in around 2 weeks time I might cave.
>>6492547
https://twitter.com/heikahp Here you go
>>6492643
I'm barely even N5 so I'm not a good source but I'd assume if you can understand most shounen manga then SF shouldn't be too much an issue. I don't think it uses furigana in it much though; maybe google some people playing through the first batte or something to see if you can handle it. GL anon.
>>6492776
I also never thought about this surprisingly but I think I'd like it probably after SF3, or at least somewhere where it wouldn't interfere much with what was already established in previous games, basically as >>6493291 said. As much as I love the old games, they tended to always focus on a new area/continent and it wouldn't feel like a SF4 if they did that to me. The only way I'd accept it was if they made it about the ancients and/or Dark Dragon's/Zeon's first summons which I think would be pretty cool and interesting since we've never seen the ancients up close before. But then again, I'm also afraid it might be a bit more sci-fi than it needs to be (though Camelot is super dedicated to their medieval fantasy aesthetics at least) along with how many liking how they left it up to your imagination on how the Ancients were like, myself included to an extent. It'd also be cool if the new continent was called Camelot too as >>6492956 said, and even better if Arthur or at least one of his descendants were there as well.

>>6492359
>>6492363
>>6492369
Get me the full pic of this header, I literally searched even in several jap sites and I found nothing, and yeah I don't mean only Pixiv

>>6494601
This one too
I asked around and apparently this artist is one of those super butthurt japs who scrub their galleries clean every now and then

>>6494601
>>6494603
Thanks for making me aware of them so now I can also lament the fact that I don't know where these came from. The style of bother aren't ones that I recall seeing before (the second one might be
this artist >>6492335 but I'll check again to see) either which makes me afraid that they might be imagines from old SF fansites which may or may not exist anymore. I'm always saving SF art and dumping it here or /v/ whenever I get the chance though so if I come across the full arts of either I will certainly post them.

>>6494619
Both of them are Kamiomutsu's, but they were just twitter headers
I checked in every one of their sites and I found nothing, I also checked a lot of jap keywords but I still had no luck
Let's just keep looking and maybe post them here if we ever find them

>>6494593
>https://twitter.com/heikahp
Thanks matey. I follow a ton of SEGA-centric Jap twitter users, followed this one immediately.
>I don't think it uses furigana
I did check and yeah, it doesn't. My big concern is when the dialogue is about the political intrigue and uses "big" words. Even royal language is confusing to me. We'll see.

Okay, I just double-checked today and apparently now they can ship those Game Gear Micro overseas. Weird. Yesterday, it was stated EXPLICITLY that "This item does not ship to your location" but that's changed now:

https://www.amazon.co.jp/セガ-セガ企画-イエロー/dp/B089DR8DLS

>>6494593
>liking how they left it up to your imagination on how the Ancients were like
Yeah, Camelot's always been really good with that. They explain just enough for the Shining world to make sense and for you to grasp an understanding of it, but leave out just enough to allow for speculation and theories. This is actually the fault of a great many modern JRPGs I feel, the tendency of wanting to over-explain everything.

>>6494593
>liking how they left it up to your imagination on how the Ancients were like
Yeah, Camelot's always been really good with that. They explain just enough for the Shining world to make sense and for you to grasp an understanding of it, but leave out just enough to allow for speculation and theories. I feel like a fair number of modern JRPGs (not all, obviously) suffer from the tendency of wanting to over-explain certain details in their story/world.

>>6494789
I really do think games were better when they had less to say. It feels like that as soon as everyone got the space to add voice acting and longer cut scenes they just would waffle on and on about things that either don't matter or just constantly have characters repeat themselves. It's even worse when this overblown crap is treated as good writing or world building instead of letting actions and subtleties speak for themselves.

>>6494796
Yeah, pretty much what you said.
>got the space to add voice acting and longer cut scenes
Funny thing is that Panzer Dragoon Saga, despite following the trend of adding voice-acting and having longer cutscenes, somehow did not suffer from this fate. I guess having a good writer who knows what he's doing does wonders.
{ I deleted >>6494789 and reworded it as >>6494795 to make it clearer still, but my point is still the same. }

>>6494807
Well look at something like Legacy of Kain. That game series borders on grandiloquent but it's theatrics make the game stand out and even when it has a lot to say, it feels like it's saying a lot. The big problem is when you got a group of characters standing in a circle all chiming in the same "ME TOO" dialogue. So many games feel like they need to have every single character talk in every single scene like we're gonna forget they're there or something.

>>6494814
>Legacy of Kain
Fuck, still haven't played that game. It's high priority in my "List of games to play" but I never got around to it.

>>6494751
Oh I see it now, thanks. Hopefully it'll still be up to preorder by the time I decide.
>>6494651
>tfw follow Sega centric jp twitters but can barely understand much of what they say
I'm just glad to find them at least. Also I once heard from someone that the words and terms they use in jrpgs are so far removed/maded up from actual JP that it's not too much a problem as you'd think it'd be, but I honestly can't tell you if it's true or not.
>>6494795
It's a lost art for sure. A lot of modern jrpgs do over explain but I've also run into a handful that also under explains. Playing SF1 again was a really nice refresher since it was just right in those regards, even if the localization messed up on translating some of the big plot twists near the end.

>plots and schemes between TWO stories
What even was his endgame?

>>6494892
cute girl

>>6494892
All he wanted was some pants. A DECENT PAIR OF PANTS!

>>6493160
$99 as launch-price, for starters.
then the news about its poor emulator and weird game-choice (pal-version tekken? rainbow six!?) sealed its fate.

Kino
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QALEoNuV4g8

>>6495376
What the hell, I've never seen this before.

>>6494892
I wish we'd gotten more story and lore regarding the new kingdoms introduced in the Gaiden games.

>>6495376
I'm using noon in SF3, although that one gets memed most of the characters have awkward lines.

>>6495376
This is honestly the type of rare content for this series that keeps me going.

Is it just me or did Shining Force become more popular recently at least in these parts? There seems to be a thread going at all times, it didn't use to be like that.

>>6497750
Yeah, it think it did in the past year or so. Not that I'm complaining, it's absolutely my favourite series from old-SEGA. As for the reason why it increased in popularity, I honestly do not know. Only thing I can think of is that the release of the Mega Drive/Genesis Mini with its included Shining Force game has rekindled interest in the series.

>>6497819
Is there a full set of that manga somewhere? Not even translated necessarily, just curious.
I found something ages ago, but it wasn't this one.

>>6497556
>there's a few photos of some guy that made a garage kit of Max, Mae, Kris, Anri and Yoghurt
>not stylised, just based on their art from the manual or whatnot
>there's no further info or even better pictures
I didn't expect those things to be in circulation, but I'd pick one of those up instantly. I'll post one after this.

>>6497837
And here we go.

>>6497750
Could be, I honestly only discovered the series around last year, but it seems there were at least a few Shining threads in the archives before even that.

>>6497837
>Is there a full set of that manga somewhere?
I wouldn't know. I just save these manga whenever I find them. Some on 4chan, some on twitter. Long time ago though, I don't remember which account posted these.
>>6497838
Dayum, those are very nice for independently made. Also, Mae x Max best OTP forever. A bit miffed that Final Conflict didn't provide any finality or conclusion to their relationship.
>it seems there were at least a few Shining threads in the archives before even that
I'm not a regular on /vr/ (I usually check /vr/ like once every 2 weeks or so), but I think before this we used to have a Shining thread like once a month. So it's not *that* rare back then. The increase in these threads' popularity thankfully hasn't ruined its quality of discussion.

>>6497852
That's a shame, I'd really like to see more of it because it looks neat enough stylisatically in that it captures the look of the games for the characters pretty well.
>OTP
And of course they are, just a bit of a shame about that ending, or what you mentioned. Though I've not played that yet. I thought it was also a bit of a missed opportunity that she didn't even show up as captain of the guard or something for any of the Gaiden stuff, given that some of the others do.
>nice
Yeah they're pretty cool, This Anri is the only higher res picture I got. But beyond that there's no trace of them left on the internet.
Or at least not with what I could look for.
>threads
Fair enough. And perhaps it's because it's probably mostly the same people that post in these anyway. Or at least that's what I would say if I had to guess.

>>6497750
Sometimes for a series to get momentum all someone needs to do is bring it up. Some fags mentions it, it makes another fag want to play it and they want to talk about it and so on so forth..

>>6497871
>it's probably mostly the same people that post in these anyway
Heheh, guilty as charged. I've probably posted in almost every single Shining thread here on /vr/. I reckon in this thread alone I've probably made like 30 posts.

>>6497871
You know what kills me? Merchandise and figures only got GOOD long after the stuff I care about stopped being popular

>>6497882
F
Yeah, at least there's a few series I care about that have got some decent stuff, mostly because vehicle models are easy to make I suppose.
But getting figures for SF like the above would be really cool.

>>6497878
Same at least for this one and some prior ones.

Oh right that happened

>>6497891
Don't question whatever the wizards are doing.

>>6497837
Google says it's from Shining Force - The Inside Story, a doujinshi. You can probably find the whole thing on Share.
If you're interested in SF manga, japanese SEGA magazines (MarukatuMD, DengekiMD, etc) used to run some SF oneshots . There's some scans of said magazines on segaretro.org

>>6497896

I hate to use this expression, but SEGA franchises always have the most "soulful" fanart out there.
Seeing them pop up on Twitter is always a delight.

>>6497910
I always loved Sega's official art, but tragically for reason I will never understand, they get a pathetic amount of fan art unless it's sonic porn.

>>6497897
Share?
And thanks for the tips, I'll check those out then.

>>6497910
Speaking of which, here's that picture I was gonna go over earlier to post. Honestly It'd need a million more fixes because this was pretty much the first time I tried to draw a horse or armor at all, but still.
The Laser Eye battle for me ended with pretty much just Mae and Max left and her getting the kill on it, so I drew this after.

>>6497913
Might just be the lack of popularity on some of these, then again no clue how well known these were in their prime vs now.

>>6497956
They were pretty well known back in their heyday.

>>6497964
In that case, no clue

>>6497956
>Share

A japanese P2P network that's been around since 2004. You can find the most obscure shit in there. Just search the JP name of the content you're trying to find and away you go.

>>6497886
>>6497871
>>6497838

where can i find such figurines?

>>6497956
thats a really cool picture anon, keep it up

>>6497852
is there more of this set of art?

>>6498067
You can't, that's the problem. Presumably some guy made them and then sold them, as garage kits go. I've found no trace of them beyond those pictures.
But my google might be weak too since those things were probably made and sold in Japan.

>>6498069
Thanks

>>6497993
Fair enough then, might give it a try later.

>>6497750
i wonder if fire emblem's increased popularity has reminded people of shining force, and thats why its remembered more and discussed more.

>>6497819
>>6497837
>>6497897
>tfw when remember when this came out and have been still wanting to find and buy til this day
I hope it's on the site you mentioned but maybe I'll own it one day.
>>6497838
>>6497871
>>6497886
These are so nice, I haven't seen them before. At the last few wonfes's though someone has been showing off their Zylo garage kit and I'm just glad that there's any figures for the series in general.
>>6497878
I don't check this board than often but I'm glad I caught this thread since I always tend don't often catch the threads with actual discussion. But if you ever see a Shining thread on /v/ though and someone spamming lots of art, there's a good chance it's me.
>>6497956
Very cool art anon! I'd say you did pretty well with all the armor and other details.

There's also this other one of Darksol's generals too. There might be a better chance of finding the kits for these since they're recent but I'm unsure how you get them if you didn't buy them at the event in person. Here's more pics though: http://chemrea.blog21.fc2.com/blog-entry-93.html
>>6497882
Companies lately have been going back to make new merch for old things and I can only dream that Sega makes at the very least a pack of rubber straps of old IPs like they did with their Sega Girls keychains or something. I find a lot of Tony's Shining swimsuit figs really boring, but even if they got him to just draw Tao in her swimsuit just so they could sell it as a fig would be a lot better than nothing.
>>6497910
I get what you mean. Sega ignores a lot of the old IPs that really made them what they are so coming across people who still draw fanart for them consistently enough without them ever being relevant really shows you how passionate they for the series along with being charming regardless of skill level, at least to me.

>>6498441
I really wish they were available somewhere. That's a pretty good Zylo too. Looks like he did a Mae as well, albeit the face and pose are a bit wonky on this one.
>Very cool
Thanks.

>>6498456
>Generals
That's pretty neat, I have to admit I'm a fan of the dragon's design still, he was pretty cool.
>Tao
Mae in a swimsuit when?
But yeah even something like that. Albeit the on-model stuff above would be preferrable just because they look like they'd be really neat to stand up as a force.

>this figure talk

Have you guys considered 3D printing?
Some of my friends who are into anime and figurines completely gave up on the official stuff when they discovered 3D printing could be used to make literally every figure they dream of for very cheap.
I don't know how it works, but it might be something worth looking into?

>>6498797
Never thought of that. Then again short of using one of those "we print shit for you" sites I don't have anyone that has a 3D printer. And those sites aren't exactly cheap as far as I remember, neither is buying a printer.
Other issue is of course actually making a proper 3D model, which can be learned easily enough but still.
Could be an option.

>>6498456
eww, actually taking the time to make general ballsack.

>>6499007

>>6499293

I'd wager Domingo's figure would be really easy to make since he's really just a jellyfish.

>>6499312
Cute!

bump

saged to death...

Did the janny tranny autosage the thread?

>>6499605
>>6499595
isn't it after 300 something

>>6499595
>>6499605
>page 10 now
I guess so. Not really sure why. It's not like we've had off-topic discussion, everything here's been /vr/ proper.
>>6499680
Huh? I thought bump limit was 500? Have I been wrong this whole time? I'm very sure the bump limit is 500.

Once this gets archived we can just make another thread, I guess.

I enjoyed talking to you fellow anons. I hope to discuss this series and share pics with one another sometime again.

>>6499846
See you later, friend.