/vr/ - Retro Games

I don't think any fuck up was as great as Daikatana.

>>6070529
By the way the scam backing niggas on your pic should have just played Elemental Gimmick Gear.

>>6070536
Or Napple Tale. Fuck why did they back this shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nzOwy2nu70o

>>6070529
Why would he expect Zelda from a 2D RPG being promised? Zelda isn't anything like a RPG.

>>6070529

>Narcistiic Perosnality Disorder

The guy is a pure sociopath who sees others only as tools to be exploited. Learn up the dark triad and cluster b personality disorders. A lot of scam artists are these. Basically all the worst people in the world.

He's really only 25? Man he looks older, I'm 34 and I don't look as old as him. I know the hair has a lot to do with it, but he should probably lay off the weed, cigars, alcohol or whatever else he's doing that could be causing that (some of those in the pictures), maybe stop having full sperge episodes as well like these posts and chill the fuck out.

>>6070529
>The Next Generation of the 2D RPG
>Looks worse than a RPG Maker game
Did he ever actually release a game, or did he run off with the money?

>>6070529
I know a lot about pinball development history.
The Thunderbirds pinball machine... the CEO's wife, who was a key employee of the company, died. And another key employee also died and they couldn't get into his accounts. Not really a story, just really sad.

Game Plan, a second-tier pinball company, went out of business, and a bunch of prototypes and designs became the property of the bankruptcy court. But some employees stole them and hid them in a barn. But then winter came and the snow collapsed the roof of the barn. Sad stuff.

>>6070595

A rich guy came across the design documents for an unproduced Capcom pinball machine called Big Bang Bar. And he took preorders for 110 units. And he ended up taking a loss on the project, but he kept his word and delivered anyway. What a nice guy! Thank you Gene Cunnigham.

I guess none of these stories really qualify as development hell. Forget it!

>>6070593
>I know a lot about pinball development history
that's oddly specific
>Not really a story, just really sad.
did it affect development of the machine in anyway? did his wife design the aesthetics?
>>6070595
how does this sort of thing even get found out; seems like a story to take to one's grave

>>6070598
A lot of people nowadays kneejerk assume that cancelling games was a mistake. But you look at this and Sonic Xtreme and you realize you need to reconsider that automatic position.

>>6070619
Since it hasn't come up in this thread yet, might as well mention that one of Sonic X-Treme's devs almost died from pneumonia after not being able to take time off due to the crunch of nearly everyone else being laid off, and having like three people left trying to finish the Saturn's killer app by Christmas.

This was after Yuji Naka had them nearly start over because he found out some baka gaijin were using his beloved NiGHTS engine, since NiGHTS seemed like more of a passion project for him. IIRC, shortly after that some other Japanese suit came to inspect their progress, which was fucked since they were just forced to practically restart from scratch, resulting in all the layoffs that resulted in one of the few devs left nearly being worked to death.

>>6070619
I like Sonic Xtreme. Going off the existing material on it, I'd probably have caved in and begged my parent for a Saturn had it ever been released.

>>6070529
Your pic, countless kickstarters, and 99% of the steam library prove that not only did something get made but a buttload of it got made. Not much of it is any good. There has always been people making shit but it's far worse now. Any talentless hack can download a game maker and shit out a turd.
Having your shit game rightfully called shit isn't development hell. Having the hardware change in the middle of development, or even worse once it's finished, is hell. That happened to me three times. Having to cut levels or features because some bean counter wants to save a buck on the cost of a cart is also hell. That's happened more times than I care to count.

>>6070529
It's unfortunately extremely common for hackjob indie devs to release their game on an older platform not out of passion for it or because they wanna test their skills by working in a more restrictive environment but rather only to stir up publicity from the homebrew community who will eat up whatever anyone shits out cause hurr gotta support duh community.

>>6070531
duke nukem forever?

and i say this as someone who liked DNF

Whatever happened to the game VR was making?

>>6070583
>Looks worse than a RPG Maker game
Wasn't it actually an RPG Maker game?

>>6070529
The sega16 thread for Paprium is currently 660+ pages long and starts from excitement then goes to anger, depression, acceptance, and finally everyone ripping on Fonzie for being horribly incompetent.

>>6070762
>might as well mention that one of Sonic X-Treme's devs almost died from pneumonia

might as well mentioned that the same person also got a sex change operation so he wasn't exactly the paragon of mental sanity to begin with.

>>6070976
god if they could've just gotten the 2001 demo to be released as an actual game, they would've owned the FPS scene for years. (yes, I know that that demo was all pre-programmed, but it looked so fucking good)

>>6071058
Man I can literally see the edited sprites in this.

>>6071073
>>>/tv/

>>6070529
I wouldn't exactly call this /vr/

>>6070583
Sneed

>>6070615
>that's oddly specific
Weirdly there is a pinball fan community

>>6071098
I welcome any border-cases who want to post here. Don't make them go back to /v/

>>6070529

>>6070541
Why is this song so beautiful what the fuck

>>6071702
Oh god its too beautiful i'm crying I'm worse than guy in the OP

I think its ASMRing my heart

>>6070529
I feel for the guy, and anyone who donated for an "2D RPG like Zelda" is kind of a dope. I'm an incompetent failure myself, so the only thing keeping me out of that kind of hot water is not even trying.

>>6071643
I mean, why would there not be

>>6070615
Both stories were told on a pinball podcast. Or maybe the game plan story was on a pinball forum. His wife (Thunderbirds) was in charge of interacting with the company that owns the Thunderbirds IP and keeping them happy. It made the machine take a lot longer to come out.

>>6070619
Big Bang Bar is great. Better than you might be able to tell from that one picture.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTBBmjnkc2E

It's got an alien go-go dancer that dances around, and three alien choir singers that lock balls in their mouth for multiball.

>>6071775
I guess it's just two alien choir singers.
Also some of the alien go-go dancers have nipples and some don't. Not sure why. Not going to post a picture of both versions so people can compare, I don't think it matters that much.

The original prey? The original tf2? Praxis wars by rebel boat rocker?

>>6070554
iirc the majority of the kickstarter money was spent on a massive party for him and the other devs who promptly bailed when they met him in real life. The rest of the money was spent on amphetamines save for $10k which went towards a hair transplant that transformed him from an ordinary bald guy into an bald guy who thinks he's Elvis.

>>6071058
Pier Solar HD was 3 years behind and complete radio silence for most of that time, but he did deliver in the end. Other people involved were openly saying the ball was in his court and they had no idea what the fuck he was doing all that time.

I don't think he's malicious or incompetent like the bald guy, just massively autistic.

Is pinball discussed on another board or something? I always thought it fell under /vr/'s scope but I've never seen a thread about it. Don't see anything on /tg/, /asp/ or /toy/ and I don't know where else to look.

>>6071951
There's a general every now and then. It's in the same weird place arcade machines are, in which the community of either really isn't large enough to require splitting, but most of which qualify as retro.

>>6071951
It's discussed once in awhile. Big reason you don't see it much is lack of accessibility, pinball sims don't really cut it and pinball tables are a lot harder to find than they used to be let alone in good condition.

>>6072000
They're not hard to find at all, unless you live in the middle of nowhere. See the pinball maps provided in the OP.

>>6072458
Oh, wait, I thought I was in the pinball thread, which is currently active. Here are some ways to play pinball:
There's a twitch channel where anyone can play on a physical pinball machine over the internet. Free, no lines because no one knows about it. I'm not affiliated with them. I think the lag's not too bad if your ping is good, but see for yourself.
https://www.twitch.tv/surrogategames

Also:

How to find pinball and pinball tournaments in your area:
US, Canada, Australia, Japan, Finland, London
https://pinballmap.com/
Worldwide:
https://pinside.com/pinball/map
Europe:
https://findapinball.com/en/

Tournaments:
Depending on where you live, there may be a facebook group for pinball players in your area.
You can also find tournaments near you here:
https://www.ifpapinball.com/calendar/

Pinball Simulators that will give you a free virtual pin or two as a sample:
Pinball Fx 3 (Sorcerer's Lair, Fish Tales)
Zaccaria (Time Machine)
Pinball Arcade (Mary Shelley's Frankenstein)
Stern Pinball Arcade (Also Frankenstein)
There's also Visual Pinball, which is a freeware pinball simulator.

>>6071058
The leather daddy party featuring supposedly "100% working betas" he held at some discotheque is the best part.

>>6070529
I can't really hate the guy. It must be really tough to make a video game. I have no idea how to make games at all and I've been playing them my whole life.

>>6070529
hebrew spotted

>>6072832
>hebrew:hebrew+homebrew

>>6072460
>new layout!
Looks suspiciously similar to their last batman table layout
Bravo Stern

>>6072938
The new one's much better though. And it's not so terribly similar. For one, the two ramps are different. That alone makes a huge difference.

I know a guy who was a designer at Silicon Knights from 99 to 07, and while he didn't ship anything /vr/ he worked on the PS1 version of Too Human and switched over to the Eternal Darkness team shortly before they moved from the N64 to GameCube. So the development tidbits I know aren't /vr/-related, but I do know that SK had Saturn development kits and the coders hated working on the system, so its possible a Saturn version of Blood Omen was considered because its a largely sprite-based game.

>>6070529
What's bizarre is that the guy is still trying to make this game. He's gotten new crew and shit, but recently pretty much everyone but him has some kind of IRL issue fucking them. Or they're lying and want out.

>>6071781
Oh it matters

>>6070583
Sneed

Sonic 3
>The development began in late January of 1993, and up to June, we were doing tons of programming for the SVP. The SVP chip itself was still, at that time, being developed in parallel with Virtua Racing, so our team got to go to technical meetings in Chicago, which was really fun. Unfortunately, in June we realized that development of the SVP chip probably wouldn’t be finished by the end of the year. So we abandoned all the programming and work we’d done up to then. In the remaining 6 months we had for Sonic 3, we had to start entirely from zero and re-do everything. So while it might seem like it took us a long time between Sonic 2 and Sonic 3, the reality is that we really had no time at all to spare.
>The thing was, we had planned a big promotional tie-in campaign with McDonald’s the following year in February—and we had spent 2 billion yen (approx 20 million USD) on it!—so we absolutely had to meet that release deadline for Sonic 3 in February. Unfortunately, having to restart everything in June, we only had time to create about half the stages we’d envisioned.

>>6073576
Secret of Mana
>Secret of Mana was originally planned to be a launch title for the SNES-CD add-on. After the contract between Nintendo and Sony to produce the add-on failed, and Sony repurposed its work on the SNES-CD into the competing PlayStation console, Square adapted the game for the SNES cartridge format. The game had to be altered to fit the storage space of a SNES game cartridge, which is much smaller than that of a CD-ROM. The developers initially resisted continuing the project without the CD add-on, believing that too much of the game would have to be cut, but they were overruled by company management. As a result of the hardware change, several features had to be cut from the game, and some completed work needed to be redone. One of the most significant changes was the removal of the option to take multiple routes through the game that led to several possible endings, in contrast to the linear journey in the final product. The plot that remained was different than the original conception, and Tanaka has said that the original story had a much darker tone. Ishii has estimated that up to forty percent of the planned game was dropped to meet the space limitations, and critics have suggested that the hardware change led to technical problems when too much happens at once in the game. In 2006, Level magazine claimed that Secret of Mana's rocky development was Square's main inspiration to move their games, such as the Final Fantasy series, from Nintendo consoles to Sony consoles in 1996.

>>6073578
Ultima 9
>There have been at least four distinct versions of Ultima IX in development, which have differed in both storyline elements and technological implementation

Deus Ex.
>I put together two groups of people with differing philosophies -- a traditional RPG group and an immersive sim group. We were making a game designed to bust through genre boundaries, and I thought a little competition and argumentation would lead to an interesting synthesis of ideas. I thought I could manage the tension between the groups and that the groups and the game would be stronger for it. My plan didn't work.
>We had to name one of the groups "Design Team 1" and the other "Design Team A." (Neither group would settle for "2" or "B.") It became apparent -- later than it should have -- that I was going to have to merge the two groups and have a single lead designer. When I finally made that change I disappointed some folks, but the game was the better for it, and that's what's important in the end.

>For one, there's no way, in a first-person RPG, to stage a raid on a POW camp to free 2,000 captives. Also, there's no way to re-create all of downtown Austin, Texas, with any degree of accuracy. Third, blinded by the power of UnrealScript, many of our original mission concepts depended upon special-case scripting and lots of it. We discovered the need for general solutions rather than special-case solutions later in the project than we should have (this despite much harping on the subject by some team members).

>Unfortunately, what that meant was that the AI was, to a great extent, designed in a vacuum, and as is often the case, we didn't really know what the game required with respect to AI until relatively late in development. And that meant implementing AI features early on that ended up being unnecessary later, once our design had evolved into its final form. In addition, building on the base of Unreal Tournament's pure shooter AI meant that, instead of designing a system specifically for our needs, we ended up adding stuff and tweaking until the bitter end, causing NPC behavior to change constantly, right up to the last day of development.

The port of strider on the pc engine took almost five years, making its way through every possible format before hitting the arcade card. It has a ton of problems from missing songs to massive flicker, crap colors and poorly optimized hitboxes. It did get an extra stage but data suggests there were supposed to be two

The head of NEC Avenue also shaved his head on camera (for a bet) after the game reached its final delay

>>6072467
That fucking party was over a year ago and it was meant to be a launch party yet the game still isn't even out yet.

>>6073471

Too Human is arguably a worse game than Daikatana. At least Daikatana is interesting in several regards (fucked-up design, memey Romero) Too Human, like Advent Rising, is just...sad.

>>6074401
Yeah, this guy worked on the PS1 version and briefly the GC version but was working on The Box instead of TH on 360 and was let go shortly before the release. The employees knew it was bad and the studio was rapidly expanding while firing old talent and Dennis Dyack was "surrounding himself with yes-men". This employee I know described TH on PS1 as similar to Syphon Filter. Another funny tidbit he gave was that SK was aiming for no load times with the game, but as a result empty hallways kept getting longer and longer as they populated environments.

>>6073586
What would you even expect in an immersive sim RPG guys would take issue with

>>6075146
RPG
>skill test determines if you manage to hide yourself
Immersive sim
>No, you actually have to search for a spot.

>>6070529
Im so happy he said sonic adventure and not a nintendo game

>>6077061
>Nintendo nationalists.

>>6070529
Still can't wait for the ouya version! I'm so excited!

>>6070529
I find this guy extremely based.

>>6070529
>all his monumental problems would be solved by just getting a real job and creating for the sake of creation rather than reward

>>6070554
Even guys who go bald at 19 don't look as bad as he does. He's probably a smoker and alcoholic in addition to all the hard drugs he consumes.

Anecdote time: I quit smoking earlier this year and after 9 months it looks like my face aged backwards five years. It's insane how badly it fucks you up.

>>6077431
Sure, more job security is awesome and artists in general should create rather for the art than to be rewarded for it whether by money or just fame. However I can kind of understand that some people still want to go for it and hope they'll be the new toby fox or whoever did Cave Story (I'm too lazy to google it right now). The fact it's so unlikely to be succesful with it makes it all the more attractive to try it out and hope to score, kinda like gambling for the lottery. I wouldn't recommend it to anybody but if it does create a gem once in a while then I don't mind.

>>6077432
Im 24 and i look like a fifthteen year old will smoking kill my babyface?

>>6078136
Not necessarily but there's a high likelihood it will. Smoking constricts the small blood vessels in your face which makes you look at crusty and haggard over time.

God, I should have learned to code when I was still young and capable of learning new things. I could be fleecing people on kickstarter right now.

>>6078175
You don't need to learn code to scam people on kickstarter you know. Just pretend you do

>>6078146
Oh then ill just look like a little boy with bad skin fml

are there any video game kickstarters that didn’t turn out shitty? seems like they’re always a disaster to some extent, or is that just the ones that get shared?

>>6078397
Undertale.

>>6078397

FTL, shovel knight, hyper light drifter from the top of my head

Radio the Universe is looking good too, it only has to actually come out

>>6078397
Blasphemous is a good example of how incompetent most kickstarters are.
the guys behind it have experience in the industry, they set out to do something and kickstarted it with a roadmap in mind.
and even then it got delayed and they had all sorts of problems.
but then you have complete fucks like Girgis who think "having a dream" is enough. yeah, no shit it's gonna be a nightmare. you have 0 experience.

>>6070531
-Duke Nukem Forever (14 years in hell, end result's mediocre, mostly thanks to George Broussard)
-Malice (Some platformer that was on the PS1, then originally had Gwen Stefani voicing the protagonist, and evidently killed Argonaut Games)
-Paprium (That Genesis game which ended up being a disaster & canned before launch)
-Star Citizen (eventually...)

>>6071075
>god if they could've just gotten the 2001 demo to be released as an actual game, they would've owned the FPS scene for years.
Some guys actually recreated that version of DNF as a DN3D mod. And it's pretty fun.
https://www.moddb.com/mods/duke-nukem-forever

>>6078580
Does a shitty fanbase count?