/vr/ - Retro Games

>>5990852
I second Settlers 1. Also, for me - HoMM 1. Fight me, but HoMM 2 does everything better and more.
I don't agree on WC1 and System Shock, though.

Street Fighter
Not just OLD BAD but it's really gnarly as a game. You can just spam specials and destroy opponents, like Dragon Punch taking off 70% of the enemy's life. Other than that it's just wooden combat with all of 2 characters which is actually 1 character.

>>5990860
Daily reminder that pretty much the whole concept of fighters comes from a game that was mainly designed for vs CPU play, and they deliberately made special attacks OP and ass-backwards to perform. The whole genre was literally a mistake.

>>5990852
>settlers (same here - S2 is a classic while no one cares about the first one).
faggot
>postal (the second one is a classic while the first one was pure guano),
huge faggot
>warcraft (W1 is and was horrible)
biggest faggot in the universe

>>5990852
Jeff Vogel's exile. For fuck's sake, having to hit a key and then click, or double click to look at ANYTHING is maddening. Later games have a single right click to look at something, and it is the single biggest improvement the series has.

>>5990852
Dragon Quest, I played old JRPG just for the story but this is too much, the plot is barely there.

Civilization, I hate how the combat odds always lie about the actual outcome.

Dune II, you can only select one unit at a time, have to build concrete slab to expand, etc.

>>5990865
What do you mean? Karate Champ did what? See you next calendar day

>>5990870
This

>>5990852
Master of Orion 1 is dogshit compared to MoO 2.

>>5990859
HoMM 1 can't be a controversial choice, can it? HoMM 2 has better gameplay (like a hex grid), better art direction (especially music). HoMM 1 feels like an unfinished version of HoMM 2, there's no reason to play it, except for historical reasons.

>>5990923
I've seen people fight tooth and claw over this installment. I personally had decent enough time playing it, but I have no desire to come back to it, especially after playing HOMM 2 few years later.
Also, I really don't like the artstyle of that game. It just looks too cheesy.

>>5990923
The art (units and castles) in HoMM1 is sublime
Large units and less grid points produce different tactics than those in HoMM2
Being simpler doesn't mean it's lacking something

>>5990852
>S2 is a classic while no one cares about the first one
I still prefer the first one's music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SENZT62TVwk

>>5990949
The art really doesn't click with me, but fair enough about the different tactics, I guess.

>>5990852
I agree on Settlers and Warcraft. W1 is less enjoyable than Dune 2: Melee units with retarded pathfinding is a recipe for disaster. Oh, and once you unlock OP summons there is little reason for creating other type of units.

>>5990902
MOO1's streamlined planetary managment and less complex ship design make for quicker games. They're good games in their own right and different enough to warrant giving both a try.

Obvious contenders:
Street Fighter
Mechwarrior
Tekken
Any version Ys 1 not packaged with Ys 2
>>5990852
>I'd also say simcity and system shock but anons with taste will sperg out beyond imagination
Fyfy

>>5990876
>Dragon Quest,
It still has historical value plus it's still unique in that you only worry about 1 party member
>I played old JRPG just for the story but this is too much, the plot is barely there.
Please go back to /v/ and kys. Video games are not for story telling, and you're the reason why modern vidya is pure shit.

>>5990852

Quake.
fite me

I know it's far from being unusual, and I don't care what you faggots say: the original Metroid is effectively unplayable. Bad mechanics, extremely limited aiming making it awkward to hit enemies, very easy to get lost, not to mention restarting with a mere 30 HP when you die. Never understood why so low.
I already didn't like it very much the first time I played it, but now it's even worse, it has aged horribly.
However, I was pleasantly surprised to find that pretty much all subsequent entries in the series held up considerably better. Even Metroitd II, which ran on a weaker system, the Game Boy, aged more gracefully than the original.
I like all Metroid games to a certain degree, except, ironically, the very first one.

Not sure if this counts but the first adventure game made by Ken and Roberta Williams, before Quest for Glory or King's Quest or Conquest of the Longbow, was Mystery House.

>>5990852
Agree with WC1. I still enjoy it but Warcraft 2 is superior in every way. The only thing I liked about it was the road system.

>>5991049
>Video games are not for storytelling
Phantasy Star II and IV, most Zelda games from LTTP onwards, FF2 (bad gameplay, sure), [Shin] Megami Tensei, Seiken Densetsu.
The Ys games generally have nice storytelling and really fun gameplay (And good music too).
5 minute video cutscenes, etc. did kill video games, don't get me wrong. But
that's because they tried to take a good thing too far in the wrong direction.
I still love some games with weak stories, like FF3 (JP), but storytelling isn't the issue.
Breath of Fire (the first one, and especially 2) have relatively standard RPG fare, but the dynamics of the characters really help make them memorable.

In the world of non-RPG's, this rule can break down a bit. But there are lots of games I've played (my cutoff is around 2005-2006 now, for GBA, and otherwise around 1998 probably) where I was more determined to keep going instead of ragequitting because I felt invested in the characters.

>>5992050
I agree. It was obsoleted right when games moved on.

>>5992050
It takes a lot more time to figure out how the game works, and even more to git gud, but it is playable eventually.
If you don't want to spend a few hours to get past the teething, I'd agree though. From a modern standpoint it's a hard game.

>>5991042
>Any version Ys 1 not packaged with Ys 2
Please explain. Maybe I just like Ys 1 too much, but I'm confused.

Fucking JAGGED ALLIANCE

>>5990852
Shit taste confirmed, portal 1 is a classic and 2 is dog shit. The amazing thing about portal is that you went into it thinking it was just an interesting, story-less puzzle/tech demo, and half way through it pulls the rug from under your feet.

>>5992184
r and s aren't the same letter anon

>>5992184
retard

>>5991463
How is it borderline unplayable? It literally set the standard for kb+m controls which didn't really chande since then.

As fot the thread, i'd say Leisure Suit Larry.There is no reason beyond historical to play that over VGA remake. Also, Test Drive series.

>>5991463
>autoexec file
>+mlook
there you go, now you can lookstrafe

>>5992175
This.
>>5991042
>Mechwarrior
Also this.
If we leave the storyline away, then Wing Commander I and II. It is nowhere near unplayable, but sprites just don't give you all the necessary information for space dogfights (proper distance and direction of the target, for example) and later 3D games made the gameplay feel obsolete.

>>5991049
Caveman paintings have historical value but you wouldn't put them in Louvre. Face it, DQ1 isn't fun and there's nothing to keep you engaged, either you're trying too hard to fit here or you're a sadomasochist.

>implying any game is truelly unplayable
Zoom zoom

>>5990852
Civilization, the first one. It's just... ugh. You can play it, if you really insist, but that's about it.

>>5992594
>I play games for anything else than enjoyment and entertainment
>I also use them to self-validate my life
t. actual zoomer

>>5990902
MoO1: its not that bad and actually pretty cozy. I did not like it at first but ended up playing it a lot. It has a unique flair to it.

Settlers1 is awesome, most ppl just dont understand how it works. It is slow. You place all the construction sites, but you connect them later, once the builder is back in the castle. And your soldiers only get good in castles and storehouses. Love it still and played through all the missions.

Civ1 and colonization are both still great but their combat system is utter shit. And it never got any better in the sequels.

Dune2 was ok, one had to be fast with the keyboard controls to master it. The midi soundtrack made up for the crappy controls.

Warcraft1 is shit indeed but so is the entire series.

For me the only case of a really shitty series starter is Metroid. The controls in the NES version are so clunky, you cannot kneel or jump and shoot downwards. I simply do not enjoy playing that. The later gameboy sequel was already way better.

>>5992678
>strawman

>>5992594
Get a load of this absolute shortbus take

>>5990852
>postal (the second one is a classic...)
Are you insane? Postal 2 is an okay sandbox but an awful shooter. All the ranged weapons take a hundred years to kill anyone.

>>5991463
I partially agree. While Q1 is a fucking awesome game, I never really liked the designs and the color palette. Q2 and Q3 look way better.

>>5990852
Parasite Eve 1
Chrono trigger

>>5992734
What the hell does that mean?

>>5990852
System Shock is far better than SS2 though. SS2 was a decent horror game but garbage in every other aspect.

>>5990852
>S1
>unplayable

Do humanity a favour and inject 10ml of bleach in your aorta

>>5990852
Pokemon of course.

>>5992881
You wouldn't get it, smoothbrain.

>>5992881
lol holy shit

>>5991267
Gotta disagree, hard. Arena is the only Elder Scrolls game that holds up in all regards. It's about one things and one thing only: dungeon crawling. And in that aspect it is better than every other Elder Scrolls game, including Daggerfall. It's also the only Elder Scrolls game that gives classes actually unique abilities that no other class has, like the knight's ability to repair armor, the monk's bonus reduction in enemy chance-to-hit and the ranger's bonus damage. Despite not having the class creator, it ironically has the most meaningful character creation in the series because of these unique abilities.

>>5992772
2 headshots with any weapon. Get good.

>>5990876
DQ1 is a very special experience well worth having. Playing old JRPGs "for the story" is very weird, but whatever: DQ1 has emergent story in spades and its events are never filler and are always meaningful, like when you defeat the dragon and travel back to the capital carrying the princess in your arms.

You don't HAVE to build concrete to expand in Dune II. Buildings are simply stronger that way. You build concrete when you have spare money and time. As for only being able to select one unit at a time, the game's balanced around that, so it's not really a problem. Dune II is not StarCraft.

>>5990859
HOMM 1 was far from unplayable. It worked aside from warlock being overpowered and random geenie lamps breaking whole multiplayer maps. Still almost nobody remembers HOMM1, it's usually homm 3 and some oldfags remember HOMM 2 and prefer this one if they like sprites instead of some weird art direction of homm 3.

>>5993148
I just played dune II and you need concrete to lay buildings on.

>>5993148
DQ1 is a fun game, rewarding even, IF it is your first JRPG where time investment doesn't matter to you and the basic formula is something you've never experienced before. DQ1 to JRPG is like The Great Train Robbery to Western. However, whereas the latter is one tenth of modern movie length, DQ1 takes the same amount of time to finish as any modern JRPGs. Making it especially exhausting for something with so little things to keep you interested.

Also for Dune II, your structures' health will dwindle if you don't build them on concrete. And no, the AI is capable of multitask several units at the same time. It's only balanced if you exploit their stupidity.

>>5992779
You know ID released colored lighting paks for quake and both mission packs. Game looks and plays way better than quake 2. I never liked the third one and 4 is an abomination.

>>5993230
Lightmaps + quakespasm sourceport makes quake look timeless. Quake 2 with its boring gameplay and orange walls looks nowhere near as good even when using a sourceport such as yamagi quake 2.

https://www.moddb.com/games/quake/addons/quake-colored-lightmaps

Drag n drop the pak files into the correct quake folders in quakespasm. Doesnt work correctly in darkplaces.

>>5990852
Define "unplayable". Does it mean that it's so bad it's impossible to play through it, or does it only mean it's bad?

Anyhow, Dragon Quest and Final Fantasy are my picks. Dragon Quest is grinding and nothing else. Final Fantasy is better, but it's filled with bugs, and even with those squashed (with the Final Fantasy Restored hack) the game still is way too inspired by Dragon Quest, meaning it is fetch quest after fetch quest and tedious dungeons.

>>5991049
>Please go back to /v/ and kys. Video games are not for story telling, and you're the reason why modern vidya is pure shit.
Retard. Double retard because it was Yuji Horii himself who admitted to wanting the player to create an emotional connection to the Hero thanks to the more "nuanced" story.

>>5993427
NEAT!

>>5990870
Agreed.

>>5992267
Too hard to fit in? Fucking more people love DQ1 than dislike it had that’s an undeniable fact, you fat cunt. I can’t believe you squeezed a (you) of me

>>5990852
Tales of Phantasia SFC. Skills that were limited to either short range or long range, being able to only control one character, lots of dumb shit like paralyze and stone being the same ailment, and the slow ass animations for spells, life bottles having long ass animations for some reason and really just difficult overall when you're low level, and not in an enjoyable way.

Impressive game on a technical level but a complete mess. I heard the PS1 version was better but I never played it. And Tales of Destiny PS1 only really made things more tolerable by basically making it piss easy.

Honestly you could argue that the first "real" Tales game was Tales of Eternia since that's the one that basically has the layout to how most Tales games play up to this day.

>>5990852
>>5990859
>Settlers 1
Actually enjoyable but the latter maps are too tough and take a HUUUUGE amt of time to beat. it's like german devs think we have too much free time!
>WC1
It's decent for that era, but C&C 1 totally blew it away.
>HOMM1
I'll kick your ass. Campaigns were too hard, but the custom maps were great. Also the "prequel" King's Bounty , Genesis version, was brilliant fun. Just enough randomness for great replay value.

>>5994254
>Tales of
Just Play Star Oceans if you want easier battles And cuter anime wamen.

>>5992050
>I already didn't like it very much the first time I played it, but now it's even worse, it has aged horribly.
I actually had the opposite experience. As a kid I found Metroid to be hard, confusing, and obtuse. Then I went back and played it as an adult and found that I actually really enjoy it and it's a very good game that holds up surprisingly well.

>>5990852
Dune 2. You can't select multiple units, that alone makes the game a Sisyphusian nightmare.

>>5990923
Yeah, the gameplay in HOMM1 was really expanded in every direction in its two sequels, making it kind of obsolete - however, it still has some nice music tracks.

>>5990902
It's arguably better and more unique than Master of Orion 2 "Let's go full civilization" Electric Boogaloo.

>>5993210
I'm pretty sure you can build buildings on regular gray rock with the drawback that the buildings gradually lose health until they're at 50%. Haven't played in a long time though.
Did you play PC or console?

>>5991024
Yeah all the tactics in W1 was creating wizards/warlocks and spamming water elementals and demons.

I'm playing System Shock 1 for the first time right now. It's definitely playable, although there was an adjustment period. Enhanced edition of course.

>>5994679
my strat was always pick humans and ambush them green piggies with superior archers' range, and a few catapults.

>>5993759
Nostalgia speaking, it was baby's first RPG back in the 80s so of course people will look fondly on it.

>>5994587
Yes, you're right. The other anon is just larping as a Padishah.

>>5992163
While you're correct, even people are /tg/ are insisting that role-playing games were never meant to have stories, because too many people are addicted to twitch play bang-n-shooties.

>>5990852
>I'd also say simcity and system shock but oldfags will sperg out beyond imagination
As a hardcore Simcity fan who started on the first game, it's fucking primitive compared to later entries. You have barely any options for building, there isn't much to do other than build a city and unleash hell on it. 2000 was far more of a game. 3000 is as good as 2000. If you have played either 2000 or 3000, it's almost impossible to go back to the original and enjoy it. Even with nostalgia working in it's favor, I still wanted to play 4 or SimTower instead.

>>5992050
Good thing there's a romhack that adds in Super Metroid style saving, automap, and Ice+Wave beam. I agree, it aged very roughly. Worst offender is the parts where you need to destroy blocks that respawn in order to climb up shafts, the game is enjoyable beyond those parts.

>>5994706
Agreed. I have no nostalgia for it, but it is playable and enjoyable, just slightly clunky.

The first Breath of Fire is insufferable. I'd rather watch paint dry than playing that shit again.

ufo enemy unknown

>>5990852
Ignore the contrarians, warcraft 1's interface is hot garbage. Warcraft 2 is miles ahead, especially the battle net edition.

>>5990865
>Street Fighter invented fightan games
Leave you brainlet

>>5992886
cringe

>>5992050
Cringe

>>5992267

I played DQ1 last year for the first time and had a blast

Only Exile 2 and (i think it was Rygar?) pal version are the only truelly unplayable games

>>5995693
All about perspective, scooter. Enemy unknown is consistently more playable than the pure masochism that is TFTD

>>5996654
>pure masochism that is TFTD
this is true and it was originally almost unbeatable because of that research bug.

>>5990852
Civilization unironically.
Civ1 is way too buggy and not as streamlined as Civ2, I still really like the aesthetic of Civ 1 though

Dune II technically (it's the first game in the RTS Doom games) because of the fact it has a lot of rough edges due to being one of the earliest RTS games made at the time and the AI is fucking unbalanced as fuck and worse than Empire Earth at times. Also can't select multiple units. It's still playable though, unlike say Civ1 which has way too many flaws to be fully enjoyable for me.

System Shock 1 is alright but a lot of areas just feel too repetitive and navigation is a nightmare, I'd still rather play System Shock 2 over it.

>>5990882
[SARCASTIC CLAPPING]

>>5996016
>b-but yie ar kung-fu
dude whatever

>>5991463
Quakeworld still holds up, especially because of the netcode updates over the years

>>5991463

>>5994575
Not to mention the awful spying system in MoO2. MoO1 had you decide what research category you can steal from, make you blow up missile defenses on target planets or incite revolutions. Using civilian population as invading armies is also a revolutionary concept that unfortunately was never picked up by later 4X games.

>>5999926
Ha really? I bought MOO2 but never got about playing it.

I played MOO1 countless time. Only problem I have with MOO is beating the Guardian at Orion. Only ever able to do it with a race with high production, and build 1000++ small ships with massdrivers, on easier difficulties. By the time I can do that, I can already wipe out my opponents with my massdriver fleet.

That and a poor starting point usually means defeat at any difficulty. If you start too close to an AI, you're doomed to be defeated in early war. If you start with poor planets near you OR planets are too far away from you, your opponents will totally overwhelm you later on.

>>5993026

Third opinion here, I half agree, half disagree. Arena sucks ass, BUT even though it sucks hard I prefer it over Daggerfall. Daggerfall promises A LOT, but when it comes down to it Daggerfall is just about spending hours and hours traversing three-dimensional copy pasted labyrinths.

>>5991463
very wrong opinion

>>6000692
>I bought MOO2 but never got about playing it.
You will certainly not regret trying it out this weekend. Battles are a million times more interesting. Planet development and research are less fun imo, but it is overall still outstanding and addictive.

In MoO1 I ignore the guardian until I hace auto blasters and high energy focus. It is just important that enemy does not get to it first, because death ray. I prefer playing Darloks on impossible in a crowded galaxy. Steal from everyone, focus on computer tech research and feed the opponents some useless tech to keep them from hating you all at once. Check out who forms pacts and alliances with whom and frame accordingly to make them break up their treaties. Kill off your immediate neighbours. It might need a little bit of save and reload to really get into it. Sometimes getting caught spying means game over and the only way to save the game is to reload and hide the spies for a while.

>>5990859
HoMM1 however is a fully functional game that can be easily played at any time by anyone.
Have you tried it's precedessor, King's Bounty? It's fucking unplayable and was made obsolete the moment HoMM1 came out.

>>5992908
You must be 18 to post here

>Ctrl+F
>King's Quest not mentioned
Niggas, are you alright?

>>5990852
Settlers 2 is indeed great, i still play it to this day.

>>6001710
>King's Bounty?
Genesis version was good.

>>5990852
>and system shock
yike!

>>6002063
i would say it is unfair to call the first one crap, but i'll admit there's no reason to play it when 2 just does everything better

>>5993026
>Despite not having the class creator, it ironically has the most meaningful character creation in the series because of these unique abilities.
There's also a class mod now, bringing the total number of classes to 36.

>>6002137
Did any of the later Settler games include non-Euclidean maps?
I find that more interesting than having a fixed border.

>>6002137
2 is rather hectic and combat oriented. It is simply a totally different game than Settlers 1.

Settlers 1 is more logistics oriented and more of a sim or Tamagotchi game. Its target audience were unemployed Germans who like to tend to a medieval village and look at funny little virtual servants carrying stuff from A to B and back. You can literally read a book or work an office job while playing Settlers 1.

>>6003018
>Settlers 2
>Hectic
>Combat oriented
Have we been playing different games? Or did you accidently press "2" instead of "3"?

I find the early quest games by Sierra.
KQ1 - 3, PQ1, etc.
To be pretty shit compared to the later graphics, especially KQ the first two games are barely playable.
Stand out series in the Sierra line up always was Quest For Glory.

>>5990852
Caesar.
The first one is barely a game
The second one doesn't really know what it is doing.
The third is barely playable and waay too short.
The real "fix" comes with Pharaoh.

Gran Turismo and SSX, not really unplayable, but part 2 has mostly the same content and much more making the first game redundant

/v/-tier thread

>>6004035
I disagree on SSX for two reasons --

1) Uber tricks are a lot of fun but the game ends up being centered around them a bit much (similar thing tends to happen with special moves in THPS games). Not having them makes for a different enough experience.

2) A lot of the tracks in SSX Tricky are updated versions of the first one so it's nice to notice the difference. The environments in SSX Tricky also threw out the few pretenses toward realism that SSX had, so it's a nice contrast with the first game.

I thought SSX 3 was actually the weakest of the three but I love all three. Something about launching off a 3000 foot ramp and doing a 180*99 degree spin or whatever scratches a very particular itch. I suppose if you're not as in love with them as I am, Tricky is probably the best one to play of the three.

Polite stage for not retro.

>>6004037
>N-no, all games ar-are great!
>D-don't bully shitty games!
>S-sacred cows!

>>6003812
PLEBS ARE NEEDED

>>5992950
First gen is unironically my favorite. It gave me this feel of going on an adventure that none of the next gens did. Never played it as a kid, either.

>>6004996

>>6005126
>/v-v/ be gone!
>M-muh sacred cows
Happy, now?

>>5990852
Every JRPG that had a NES game as its first entry

>>6005079
Kanto =/= Gen I

Diablo 1.

>>5990852
Worms. The original is a waste of time at this point. 2 is great but the series really hit its stride with Armageddon. Damn fun game with friends or even solo. Better yet the campaign in Armageddon was surprisingly fun. I actually liked 3D but ultimately W:A is the real deal.

>>5991463
I think it's overrated, but I'm only partially in agreement. The enemies were spongy as fuck but the level design saves it. MP was probably the shit on release but once UT and Q3 hit the scene...yeah...Q1 became obsolete.

>>6008126
>The enemies were spongy as fuck
They really aren't, even on Hard Mode you're given plenty of Quad Damage and explosive ammo, and it's pretty easy to get your value's worth out of shells.
You're probably thinking them damage sponges because A; the Shambler takes half damage from explosives (thus you save the nails or thunderbolt for them as much as you can), and B; the base shotgun isn't as powerful as in Doom, when it's not supposed to be the game's shotgun tier weapon, but rather is a pistol tier weapon, and its speed and tight spread actually makes it better than average compared to most game's pistols of that era.

>>5990852
>have to build roads
Fine, until theres no vectoring and no queuing commands

>>5993026
My biggest problem with Arena is that I can't change the controls. Is there a mod to fix that?

>>5990852
Postal 1 was videospiel though.

>>6008535
>Postal one text at the back
>Check these nice handdrawn graphics mixed with cutting edge 3D!!!

It's the uggliest game I ever played back then.

>>6008295
The road system was originally introduced solely due to technological limitations of Amiga to keep the pathfinding working. And it was less about "make as efficient system as possible" and more "make it work at all". Hence why AI was so damn terrible when not pre-scripted in both Settlers 1 and 2.