/vr/ - Retro Games

You forgot to call us EOPs

>>5981151
interesting, thanks for this.
>>5981160
reminder if you use a name on 4chan you're likely withering away to your death alone.

>>5981160
I don't have any scorn or condescension for people who don't know Japanese. This post is purely discussing the FF9 translation itself, not those who consume it. At most, I think it's kind of funny how people in the west still quote Vivi's translated line despite it being butchered to the point of meaninglessness (in my opinion anyway), but I can appreciate how those who only play a translation will find their own meaning in things through the fog of a bad TL.

>>5981165
He don't know me very well, do he

>>5981151
I already see lots of typos in the amateur's translation "Those alive must steal the lives others just to survive". Also the writing is very cliche to begin with no matter how you translate it. I'll stick with the official version that doesn't have typos, thanks. I don't see any important, more accurately translated things out of what you've shown here that I'm missing out on, just some cheesy generic drivel. This isn't the Japanese version of Shakespeare, it's closer to a young child's fan fiction.

>>5981179
Like I said, "I don't mean to propose my translations should have been in the game verbatim or anything like that". I threw this image together in less than an hour after finishing the game, you can hardly blame me for a couple of typos.

>>5981181
We really had a problem with these kind of threads pretty recently with /jp/ fuckwits ignorantly trying to get respect by informing us poor dumb idiots how the English translations of video games (not novels or even films, video games) were slightly different from their personal translations. Then we told that we don't really care and that it's pretty shitty that their behavior had cost fan translators patrons and discouraged amateur translation efforts in general. THEN they became downright offensive about translated Japanese video games in general and we told them to get the fuck out and eventually they did.

There, you're all caught up.

>>5981151
This is pretty much part & parcel of playing translated games.
Game translators are paid peanuts, and the only people who do the job either:
1) Have a ton of passion for the medium (the few good translations we get)
2) Are good at Japanese, and poor at english but a failure as a writer and see the job as a way of getting a writing job without the skill or craft (modern localizers)
3) Are poor at Japanese, and good at english, but can fake it well enough to get a job in one of the least demanding translation jobs you can get

If you're a good translator, you don't translate games. You translate things like patents, legal documents, production software, or technical documents. Those jobs pay much better, but the bar for entry is higher.

>>5981193
If you're talking about that shitty Fire Emblem translation where the Fan TLer rewrote entire conversations to suit his tastes, or the PC98 "translators" that literally machine TLed them to get patreon money by tricking people, then it's good that they get discouraged. They suck.

I think it's just a given that any JRPG from that era has an shaky translation.

>>5981209
To be honest, I only made this because I think FF9's writing is really impressive and it's a shame that some of the cool moments (like Necron) are memed as like "fighting Yoda" in the west. I would like those who only know English to at least respect the writing a bit more even if they can't read the JP themselves.

>>5981193
>we we we them we
Defining your social groups on an anonymous web forum is truly sad. Go ahead with your "ironic" witticism, I pity you.

>>5981494
By "we" I mean myself and others. I think the term you're trying to put in my mouth is "everyone". Keep practicing that English though.

I'm curious how bad FF7's translation is. i remember it being pretty incoherent

>>5981515
Tim Rogers, a man much wiser and more handsome than me, did a in-depth series discussing the FF7 translation. It gets increasingly artsy and dramatic as time goes on, but it'll be the best resource for this topic if you don't know Japanese yourself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZefYEaNUJ7w

(Answer: It's not great.)

>>5981505
What the fuck else is "we" supposed to mean, dumbass

>not playing exclusively fan translations
"Professional" translations are almost 100% of the time garbage.

>>5981553
Ikr

I'd stick to japanese not because of "superior writing" but because it's mentally stimulating and the characters are much more defined through text. The one exception is if the game is kana only, avoid that shit.

By the way the EOP guy is just a troll, "we" (hey babbage gramps) confronted him a couple times and he doesn't understand a lick of Japanaese.
Stop getting baited.

The translations got better with every game and the tools for allowing for that (like text box resizing) got better too. It’s not a big deal nor is it surprising. Acting shocked/exasperated being able to easily pick something apart in your leisure time is ちょっといたい.

>>5981535
Hey Tim.

>>5981151
I'd been thinking about playing FF9 in Japanese this time, and it looks like now I've got a good reason to do so. I don't look down on people who translated these old games, as they had less access to the powerful technology we do today, and probably pretty strict deadlines on trying to translate these massive scripts (FF6 was done in like a month or less IIRC) as well as the character limits imposed. And I do like the original script, I really do, it has plenty of flavor to it compared to a lot of the wooden dialogue of back then, but I think it's worth a look. That Star Wars quote replacement is genuinely a yikes from me though, Jesus. It's the last boss, show some fuckin restraint.

Cheers OP.

>>5981535
Great series. Unfortunately the more I followed him as a person it sort of ruined his whole shtick for me

>>5981179
>just some cheesy generic drivel. This isn't the Japanese version of Shakespeare
It actually just struck me to say this, but FF9 has a heavy "play" theme going on throughout it, with intentionally cheesy/ dramatic lines as throwbacks to play (even the least astute of players should be able to piece together the play at the beginning, the play at the end, and Kuja's dialogue). Necron's final speech (along with other bits of dialogue) being cheesy and such is indeed the point.

Also, I don't think Necron's final speech is "generic drivel". It's actually a very poignant observation on the inherent mortality of living things and the fear that brings. I think basically every human to ever exist has felt fear or anxiety about death at some point in their life and FF9 actually has an interesting approach to how we can live good lives despite this mortality, it's far from generic drivel. You shouldn't judge the depth of things based solely on a surface level assessment of dramatized prose.

>>5981917
how did following him as a person ruin his schtick for you?

>>5981151
The image of Vivi is just so much more kino with the text in vertical. It's something I love about the Japanese writing.

Other than that: yeah, playing the game in its original language is always the superior choice, but fuck if I'll be bothered to learn Japanese just to play videogames.

What bothers me is that Square could properly remaster this games and people would buy them, but they won't.

Hows the spanish translation?

FF7 and FF8 have notoriously bad translations
like entire sections that make no fucking sense
>GROSS NESS
>Lagunamov

I could go on all day

>>5981193
>stop talking about translation quality
>you should only praise "localizations" no matter how poor because anything that raises the bar is going to make my poor beloved modern localizers out of a job
>we / our /
>as a fellow /vr/ kid
Are you a "localizer" by chance?
Or that tripfag from before stanning hard for that machine translation scam?
Or both?

>it's pretty shitty that their behavior had cost fan translators patrons
That scammer who used machine translations, openly pirated the game, and lied through his teeth about what he's doing ("localization"), then is defended for "owning the weebs" only by *checks notes* a tripfag on /vr/, and resetera?

Stay mad, resetard.

>>5982367
7 is horrible in English, then Euro versions got horrible translations from that English version (basic reading comprehension issues) by Sony Europe.

8 and 9 are slightly better than 7 in English and done in collaboration with EA, but still with some issues. Localization team didn't expand character limits properly and cut corners, plus they changed characterization to be more "marketable" or whatever localizers fancied (asshole Squall, translation-induced plot holes/heacanons, missing text)

For their European debut, the Euro languages for 8/9 were retranslated from Japanese and while not perfect, they avoided some mistakes by the English translator while falling into others. German and French scripts are respected.

This ended with 10 when the burger team had Europe fall in line again with using the English text "for consistency" after some complaints blown out of proportion about audio and text differences (the English audio was so different from the accurate Euro translations it was noticeable)

>>5982367
>Hows the spanish translation?
Interesting question so I went and looked up a playthrough.

Necron is called Tiniebla Eterna (Eternal Darkness), which, if Google Translate is anything to go by, is a very accurate translation to 永遠の闇, Necron's Japanese name. With that said: the Spanish translation is pretty much as made up as the English translation for this particular scene, with the exception of the first line
>El miedo existe en el corazón de todo ser, sin excepción, desde el momento en que comienza a vivir.
>Fear exists in the heart of every being, with no exception, from the moment of their birth (my translation, which is pretty much the same as the one from the image, but the one from the image is MUCH better written)
The following two lines are also made up, while the last line
>Cuando la muerte se acerca, y os dais cuenta de que no podéis vencerla, se despierta el miedo en vuestro interior...
>When death comes near, and you realize you cannot defeat it, fear wakes up insde you.
Is similar to the original, but somewhat different.

The two lines in between are made up, plain as simple. They are as follows:
>La vida es un juego cruel... Os enfrentáis unos a otros, matáis para sobrevivir...
>Life is a cruel game... You confront one another, you fight to survive...
>Siempre bajo la sombra implacable de la muerte que llegará algún día.
>Always under the inevitable shadow of death that will arrive some day.

A shame, because I was just THIS close to saying "maybe I should play Spanish FFIX, "oye tío" and all..."

>>5982393
The french translation gets that dialog better, as well as Vivi's mojo even though it's not very well phrased IMO ("Vivre, c'est prouver qu'on vit?" roughly "Does 'living' means proving that we live?") or Brahne's death (very moving because we kind of understand that she wasn't that much manipulated by Kuja; he was honest when saying that he only "gave her a little push").

It is not so good in other places...

Also, Zidane's not such a playboy in french. I always wondered whether it was the english translation that exaggerated this aspect or the french version that lightened it (there is no such thing as a flirt with Lani in french, for instance).

>>5982371
>openly pirated the game
ah yes the worst crime of all, downloading a pc98 game

>>5982347
He is rather insecure and it’s kind of uncomfortable. This is mainly a product of the kind of environment Twitter is I think, but there’s a lot of self-aggrandizing and lashing out.

For example he raises hell whenever someone criticizes Kotaku, even to his benefit. In one of his videos he remarks with disdain that his parents once told him he’d be working at McDonald’s. Kotaku is owned by Gawker Media (BuzzFeed) which is the McDonald’s of journalism, so that actually isn’t too far off.

The title card he uses to show off his exploits is full of meaningless fluff. It’s played off as a joke, but to me it’s transparent “bragging” and in the digital age it may as well be résumé fraud. “Speaker of twelve(?) languages” doesn’t make any sense; you’re either fluent or you’re not, and you don’t just find out one day that oops, I speak Klingon and didn’t even realize. To me these things cast doubt on the real accomplishments and make me think that when he worked on No More Heroes he was probably the Ringo of the band.

He has a blog that is basically a circuitous “I have sex” boast but which has the disclaimer of “these might be true, they might not, who knows!” which is the same sort of behavior that masks his pseudointellectualism, which consists of humblebrags about studying Chinese at a young age, being vaguely cultured, and having hyperthymesia. Yet he couldn’t figure out how to pay his taxes nor at least get away with fraud.

I found this all out just following Twitter waiting for updates, which reminded me why I don’t use the service. It just ruins people’s images, though I believe it only exaggerates traits that were already there.

>>5982461
Sold on project EGG at the time.

>>5981151
>Go to PlayOnline for the answer.

>>5981203
this

>>5982371
If you have a criticism, take it directly to Patreon. Take it to his home forum. Don't bring it to my /vr/. This is a board for the discussion of retro games and its SUPPOSED to have a comfortable nostalgic flavor to it. When retro games get translated, localized, "fan fictionalized" or whatever condescending thing you opt to call the process it brings a retro game to a new audience and that's a good thing. Period. Trying to destroy people's enjoyment if video games is a /v/ thing and acting like being able to read Japanese is some kind of superpower is a /jp/ thing. Take them there, not here.

It's nice that the thread about Tuned Heart went so well because it's an actual strategy game with game play mechanics to discuss instead of the story driven games before it. Night Slave is pretty fun but there's not that much to discuss about action game play.

>>5981565
Sup

>>5982586
>MY /vr/
No sweetie, I'm sure the board would do just fine without your backseat moderation. Dial 8.

>>5982636
Try to take it from me

>>5982651
Watch out anon getting hung up on semanttics is a symptom of low functional autism.
You know what's bullshit? Everyone names Fist and Pretty Fighter when talking about Saturn imports but nobody names the much superior Advanced Variable Geo 2 and Asuka 120.

>>5982356
A common thing in Japanese visual media is to frame vertical objects next to vertical text, and FF9 actually does this at least once from what I remember. Pic related. It's sad there's next to no way to reasonably reflect this in English.

>>5982998
I don't know how well versed in Japanese media you are, but I have a question. How common (and if common, why?) is it to use the written word on top of images, or over black backgrounds?

Battle Royale has a lot of this, and it looks great.

>>5983561
Extremely common. I'm not a cultural expert, I'm just well exposed to Japanese media, but my impression is that Japanese people are very fond of their writing system's aesthetics. They like to slap kanji everywhere they can. In TV comedy, subtitles are often an important part of a punchline/joke - kind of like how a laugh track might be important in the west. Stuff like your image is par for the course.

>>5981535
>linking shitaku
Fuck you

>>5983871
Don't be stupid, judge the content not the company backing it. Tim Rogers is a good dude even if he works for kotaku. You're only denying yourself the good content, though I imagine you're so monkey brained you wouldn't appreciate it anyway. Keep throwing shit around with thinking buddy, it'll get you far in life.

>>5983980
Go dilate Tim

>>5982586
So many new rules designed to stifle any hint of criticism or even discussion. The only thing passable is paid advertisments for the thing. How convenient.

And why exactly should I pay him for his pirated scam to earn the right to post a comment that will then be deleted? Are you trying a moral argument here? What kind of morality system is this?

Who died and made you king here, tripfag? /vr/ isn't your personal retraux hipster nostalgia safari park full of business opportunities for your beloved scams.

>When retro games get translated, localized, "fan fictionalized" or whatever condescending thing you opt to call the process it brings a retro game to a new audience and that's a good thing. Period.

Good to hear you're okay with Front Mission localizations that scrub faggotry then. Or Breath of Fire 2 protecting children from understanding what the hell is going on on the virtue of being an incomprehensible piece of shit. Did I earn my ticket to the /vr/ echochamber yet with my unconditional support that doesn't destroy enjoyment of internet strangers that hate opinions?

Oh wait. That's not /vr/. That would be ResetERA. Why don't you fuck off back there?

I think this thread needs some facts:

1. EOPs are subhuman.
2. /vr/ is full of shit-eating namefags that gobble up any fake "translation" as long as they can feel good about their inability to learn Japanese.

で、こんな下等生物を無視して、日本語で話さない?こうでもしない限り、議論が盛り上がらないと思う。

>>5983996
Yes, let me learn a language I will have no practical use for, will never use socially or professionally, and have no vested interest in. Sounds like a w̶a̶s̶t̶e̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶f̶u̶c̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶i̶m̶e̶ super cool idea

>>5984001
>Yes, let me learn a language I will have no practical use for, will never use socially or professionally, and have no vested interest in. Sounds like a w̶a̶s̶t̶e̶ ̶o̶f̶ ̶f̶u̶c̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶t̶i̶m̶e̶ super cool idea.

和ゲーやりたくないの?

>>5983996
ベースド

>>5984002
No, not really. English translations are fine. I don't care about the lost subtlety in entertainment. It only matters in...shit that actually matters.

>>5984007
参考までに
https://eigo-net-slang-jiten.blogspot.com/2016/05/based.html

>>5984009
>English translations are fine.
下等生物にとっちゃ、ね

>>5984013
Don't care. Good enough for me.

>>5984015
そんな諦観じゃどうにもならないよ

>>5984020
Have fun being almost comprehensible.

>>5984023
?
問題なく分かってもらっているけど。

>>5984034
Super epic samefagging

>>5984037
自演なんてしてないし、しようともしなかった。そりゃあんたが使ってるGoogle Translateの誤訳が生んだ誤解でしかない。

「分かってもらっている」って「他人が俺の言うことが分かる」って意味なんだ。

まあ、どうせこれも誤解されちゃう。

ching chong ling long desu ne

kya re kukurmutta, kora kaagaj da ne bhai?

OP: as a long-time fan of FFIX, thank you for making this post. I'm slogging through Tae Kim's guide to Japanese while looking forward to playing the Japanese version. I'm sorry this thread, and every fucking thread on 4chan, has to be bogged down by tryhard chuds.

Would you ever consider trying your hand at a fan translation? I thought the little exerpts you gave were plenty fine.

>>5984001
It's similar to my former roommate a decade ago who was like a weeb, but instead of japs, it was the lakota native american tribe. It was really a trip to see him larp as this 50-something pudgy white guy do all the morning chants, drive to south Dakota for a month-long raindance or something, and spending 2 hours a day learning the language, which is more or less dead.

>>5984043
Nah, I think YOU misunderstood and erroneously think I've misunderstood. Maybe if you spoke the same language everyone else is using there wouldn't be any misunderstandings.

Name ONE retro JRPG with good translation.

>>5984187
またイミフなこと言ってるね。

このスレで俺の投稿は
>>5983996
>>5984002
>>5984013
>>5984020
>>5984034
>>5984043
だけ

>>5983983
>>5983989
>>5983996
There you are, took you long enough.

Everybody take a look at this piece of shit. Does this seem like someone anyone would ever want to engage in conversation with let alone give any consideration to his "opinions"?

No this guy is a miserable spiteful loveless asshole who's only joy is desperately trying to delude himself into some illusion of worth based on his "opinions" that other anonymous (and pseudonymous) posters are beneath him. He contributes nothing while doing the maximum damage he possibly can.

Literally no forum benefits from trolls like this and /vr/ in particular suffers appreciably from them.

Shun or ignore them.

>>5984187
>>5984023
>>5984037
Based /jp/anon

>>5984187
>Maybe if you spoke the same language everyone else is using there wouldn't be any misunderstandings.
Context is always king.

wtf is it about Japanese and basically no other language that produces elitists

>>5984334
エセまんこを広げる時間じゃないっすか?

And just so you can understand me... you're such a little bitch, crying about retarded forum shit like contributing etc. This isn't GameFAQs, faggot. Noone cares about you, your posts and your defense of fake translations.

>>5981151
Because none of that shit means anything. Replacing three lines of pseudo-intellectual gobbledegook with three words of the same is not a crime.

Also, who the fuck fears death for their entire life? I've been looking forward to that shit since I was 20-something.

>>5984334
Jesus christ lmfao
>its fuckin ILLEGAL to criticize things!
idk what its like to have such low standards that you're completely fine w a dude on patreon posing as a translator and taking ppls money in exchange for "i ran this script thru google translate and cleaned it up a bit" but it sounds epic sad, dude, or maybe you just literally are the dude who was doing that and you're still mad you got called out? Lmao because that would def explain why you think you're important enough to go around namefagging in every thread you're in
You a big working designs fan? Lmao

>>5984351
Wait for that tranny and his lackies to think we're the same person.

Tbh you're way too nice. I just tell them they're subhuman.

>>5984351
Yes, I am a big Working Designs fan. If Vic Ireland hasn't brought those games to us back in the day we probably wouldn't have created the exact nerd scene in which shit eating weebs like you grew up to once again give needs a bad name with this ridiculous elitist attitude.

>>5984346
It's hard to learn, unless you speak Korean or Chinese, and it opens you up to the country's pop culture.

>>5984346
Exotocism, and thier media has been gatekept until the digital age.

>>5984371
Get a family and stop caring about games, boomer.

>>5984346
1. it's the hardest language for english speakers to learn so learning it is an achievement
2. it's extremely funny to lord it over eops because theyre the saltiest motherfuckers on earth. every time you tell them to learn the language they say its a waste of time or that the writing is never good enough to care, but theyre still gonna beg for translations constantly and want it so bad that they dont even care if the end result came straight from google translate, theyll even pay for it which is crazy but true

>>5984371
i actually didnt play a single game from wd until way after the fact, grew up on ff dq and smt. regardless of how u feel about their work, no lmao they were very inconsequential to creating and contributing to the weeb scene. All they did was give a precedent for guesslations and inserting unfunny jokes that eops will bend over backwards to defend even to this day

>>5984395
>they say its a waste of time or that the writing is never good enough to care
True.
>but theyre still gonna beg for translations constantly and want it so bad that they dont even care if the end result came straight from google translate,
This is an imaginary thing that happens in your head to make you feel good about yourself.

>>5984413
The Makyouden debacle is well documented.

>>5984413
>>5984420
Of course you trannies will say that not knowing Japanese, making up shit and removing half of the text all together is okay.

>>5984387
>swing and a miss

>>5984406
>I grew up on SMT
That says it all right there. In the 90s the only English SMT was Atlus's Persona 1 with black Masao and Revelations for Game Boy. If you think those were more influential than the WD library at creating the Wapanese scene, well...

>>5984427
A decent translation is all you need. Japanese writing is nowhere near clever enough to require being read in the original language. If the translation gets the same point across, it's fine. These are video games, not art.

>>5984436
It wasn't a translation at all, tranny.

>>5984440
What a pathetic attempt at an argument

>>5984446
That's a fact anyone can see, shit-eater.

What surprises me the most is how you claim you care about games, but then are happy to get something that isn't the games in question. It's made up shit by some scammer. And you eat it up.

That's why I know beyond doubt that you're not human. You don't possess the mental capabilities of humans. You don't know what things are. That's how simple it is. That's why EOPs are subhuman.

>>5984430
idk why you latched specifically on to smt but big fucking lmao at the idea that wd was 1/100th as influential as ff is just... christ lmao

>>5984413
>that never happened
you're either a. a newshit b. willfully ignorant or c. trying to speak on a topic you dont know about take your pick pr check all 3 boxes if you like

>>5984413
>This is an imaginary thing that happens in your head to make you feel good about yourself.
This.

Those who are so desperate as to "beg" for translations are the ones who got meme'd into learning Japanese to begin with. Meanwhile, what is actually happening when they mean people are "beginning" for translations:
>hey bro, translate this game for me
>no, learn Japanese
>uh, ok, I'll play something else then

>>5984348
じさつ して ください。

>>5984454
>EOPs
Didn't know this term. Thanks. I'm gonna exploit this at work as I call all the spics SOPs and no one will get it.

>>5984454
>>5984468
Just look at you. Look at the kind of person you are.

>>5984574
I always like when a new translation comes out because it's very similar to the feeling of a new retro game being released. I'm also aware of some translations that are under way in a similar way to how I was aware of Japanese games back in the day that were.

>>5984468
Oh and to be clear, I "latched onto" smt because it proves you only became a weeb relatively recently. You don't know how influential wd was but guess what - in the early to mid 90s it WAS more influential than ff on western interest in Japanese culture. You do know that half of the Final Fantasy games prior to 7 didn't even get official translations right?

>>5984454
>EOPs
Didn't know this term. Thanks. I'm gonna exploit this at work as I call all the spics SOPs and no one will get it. >>5984813
>I always like when a new translation comes out because it's very similar to the feeling of a new retro game being released.
Agreed. I literally called out of work when Policenauts was finally translated.

>>5981151
Ohhhhhh Necron is our fear of death personified.

Fuck shitty localizations man.

I completed FFIX my first time about four, five years ago. Enjoyed it more than I thought I would, more than I did when I was just riding the PS1 Squaresoft wave when it first came out. Excellent game, as flawed or less so than many of the outspoken fan stand-outs yet so unfairly judged by contrast. I enjoyed it mostly for the progression and customization (some people actually do play JRPGs for the gameplay), but that's not to say I don't enjoy storytelling. I probably would've held better focus on the narrative if the translation had retained the original underlying themes all throughout. Maybe the translators thought a simplified and earnest script would better fit the "return to roots" premise, to put it in line with the original SNES translations? That too much ennui and existentialism would categorize it too closely with the other PS1 games instead of being a fun fantasy romp?

>>5984872
Wait shit that just means he's like an Eidolon if not literally one. The fear of death being our strongest idea.

>>5981216
>>5981209
This is something they should've fixed for the remaster.

But I would never expect it out of Square. Then again Chrono Trigger DS did it.

What do you guys think Ozma was? Does the Japanese version give us more of an idea to what it was?

>>5982110
>poignant
banal

>>5984896
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/197338-final-fantasy-ix/69601415

Necron = Hades = Ozma = an ancient summon of the Mole people

>>5984581
Back to DJT.

>>5984813
Have you looked at yourself? You're a subhuman happy to be lied to and scammed. You probably excuse Muslim rapists because you can get nice kebab. That's how fucked up your reasoning is. Subhuman to the core.

>>5985286
You're a very sad, angry person. I feel bad for you.

>>5984581
自殺しなさいねぇ *

>>5984581
>>5985305
Come to think of it, if you want to meme this, get it right. It's 逝ってよし or 氏ね etc.

>>5985293
Nah, I'm very happy in my position. That's why I can see how subhuman you are.

Its funny as fuck how on the internet, 4chan, reddit, wherever, everyone who learns/is learning Japanese is so protective of the language. Like "Noooo, someone else is twying to speak my super special anime video game language, time to gatekeep!" and then you meet actual Japanese people finally and they're always super helpful and excited that you're showing interest

>>5985318
You're a very sad, angry person. I feel bad for you.

>>5985319
Personally I always tell people to stop being subhuman and learn Japanese themselves. You know, to avoid fake "translations", rewrites and shit like that. This is the very opposite of gatekeeping.

>>5985321
Is this your cope?

>>5985327
>This is the very opposite of gatekeeping.

frankly it strikes me as more of a vague middleground

>>5985327
You continue to be a very sad, angry person. I continue to feel bad for you.

>>5981151
Am I the only person who compares FF9 to Lupin the Third?

From the monkey faced protagonist thief to the strong chinned man of the law trying to turn him in.

>>5985293
>>5985321
>>5985329
>no more tripfagging
You're learning, ResetEratard. Good.
Even if you were earlier tagging three different anons as the same evil bilingual oppressing scatophile hipsters.

Why are you thread-whining, backseat moderation, and inflammatory drive-by posting the hell of this thread if those are bannable offenses in your motherbase? Aren't you being hypocritical?

More on topic, I used to hear that
>memes
>NAMBLA "jokes" in SNK arcade games
>plot holes
>reading comprehension mistakes
>"humor injections"
>localizers in interviews clearly voicing contempt for the audience and the original work
were all "NEEDED" for "localizations" because the original text is "dry" or something and needs that "human touch" (more like "bad touch", this isn't anal sex that needs lube to feel good) -> localization is better, and actual translations are actually bad translations because "they lack that human touch"

In that case, pray tell, what "human touch" does Bing Translator brings to nip games?
Aren't you confirming that this defense of "localizations" is just a defense of any objectively bad translation, just to "own the weebs" in your own words in that patreon thread?

In that case and for the sake of entertaining the argument:
You're well aware you're defending shit
You said you revel in the sight of people you hate (a lot of people) being subjected to that shit.

The patreon scammer admits and brags about the use of machine translations - which are universally hated by pro-translation and pro-"lolcalization" camps alike, who accuse each other of it.
He openly pirates the games as well instead of distributing patches.
Those are objective facts.
People on /vr/ who gave it the benefit of the doubt and actually played it found out it mistranslated crucial plot points (which they care about and need to play let alone enjoy, this being a visual novel)

You want only people who like shit to stay on /vr/.
That's a pretty small sample.

tl;dr >>>resetera.com

>>5985407
Just for your reference none of the people telling you how crazy you sound for the last 8 hours have been me. You just sound crazy - and not a fun kind of crazy, an awful pathetic kind of crazy.

LIf this is what it does to the western mind to consume a steady diet of VNs then that is going to do a lot more to dissuade /vr/ from reading them than your actual complaints about their translations. You should maybe try working THAT angle.

Like I said before I'm pleased with how well the Tuned Heart thread went. It's a good one for anons to reference in the archive how crazy you get when people just enjoy a game for the sad sake which is something people do on /vr/

its well known that final fantasy 9 is a boring piece of jarpig shit

>>5985478
Honestly I prefer your perspective to theirs, jarpiganon.

>>5984082
Yeah, this thread sure turned to shit, huh? I'm glad the image is being informative for some people since that was my goal.

I'm actually a professional translator with a couple of books published / games released, I just didn't mention it to avoid distracting from the topic (and also because the TLs in the image aren't super great due to focusing on literal accuracy.)

It'd be fun to do a retro game project but it feels like the selection of actually good games left unTL'd is pretty low at this point, and I'm pretty busy with paid work. Not to mention that retro game character limits are truly hell. Nothing is worse for translators than character limits in my experience.
>>5984874
I would honestly be really surprised if the translator had ideas that lofty. The vast majority of translators, especially pros just trying to meet a quota, look at the line in front of them and not much else. The FF9 translation looks to me like the TLer was translating before playing the game, didn't have a grasp on the theme of the game when encountering lines related to it, and thus translated them like normal lines without thinking too much about it.

For example, Queen Brahne's line in the image sounds kinda strange when TL'd literally, so I imagine the translator just rewrote it to sound smooth without thinking about the thematic importance of Brahne telling Garnet to live life according to her own ideals and such. It's actually often a good idea in translation to rewrite awkward sounding lines when they aren't important, so my first thought is he was employing that principle on lines he didn't realize the importance of, which added up dramatically over the course of the game.

The Yoda quote is pretty mistifying to me. Ideas:
1) He thought the lines were dumb/cheesy and memed instead of TLing them properly
2) He didn't realize it was the final boss speech and didn't take them seriously
3) The lines are actually hard to TL, maybe he just got lazy and wanted to save time

>>5984349
Necron's speech is not meant to be universal truths, it's the personification of the fear of death stating its ideals, so to speak. Zidane puts his foot down and tells it to fuck off just like you might.

>>5985509
You get to tell the literal manifestation of the fear of death that he's a huge retard? Sounds awesome.

>>5985516
Yeah, FF9 is pretty based. It's a shame so many people thought Necron was just a rando.

>>5985526
Isn't he a rando, though? I mean, the explanation for him being there does exist... but he appears completely out of the blue anyhow, because that explanation relies on taking elements we have seen throughout the game but dialing up to eleven to make a big bad boss appear. It's so ridiculous.

>>5984349
Plenty of people fear death.
I kind of welcome it myself, but most of religion (for those inclined to be gullible) is based on removing the "unknown" part of dying.

>>5985531
Your mistake is thinking of Necron as an actual entity instead of as symbolic for something that has been present throughout the game. Playing in Japanese, I couldn't imagine a better final boss, and it was the perfect culmination of the game's themes. A generic fight with a villain like the one with Kuja prior could never reach the same heights.

>>5981151
Thanks OP, I'd always suspected that vivi line and those other things on the left of your image were badly translated/made up.
I'm a proofreader in a scanlation group FWIW but I can't really speak Moon. It just sort of nagged at me.

>>5985541
It's also sort of a callback to the old FF "thematic" bosses, like the dark cloud in FF3, Chaos in FF1.
But much more thematically fitting and less rando than anything in FF1.

>>5981151
I dunno. It's irrelevant to me because I don't speak Japanese nor do I ever care to. And the translation doesn't ruin anything if you aren't a pedantic on the spectrum. Kuja still the bad guy? Zidane still have a tail? Can you point out anything that goes against the elements in the Japanese version? Because as long as everything plays out the same I'm never going to care if they picked the wrong word from a thesaurus.

And as an aside, being so anal you could fart a quarter into two dimes and a nickel isn't going to do you many favors in life.

>>5985581
It's a less coherent and focused narrative, if you actually like to be a little cerebral. Or have a cerebrum.

>>5985584
Not OP, BTW

>>5985581
I think the deleterious effects of a poor translation can be fairly significant to ones enjoyment of a game and how much it impacts them, but if all you care about is the basic plot and descriptions of the characters' appearances, you probably don't think on a high enough level to appreciate that.

Where’s the autistic NEET to retranslated FF8&9 like 7 got?

>>5981151
I don't care.

>>5985774
Thanks for the (you)

>>5981151
For I, Garland, will knock you all down!

>>5985541
I know what you mean about Necron being symbolic, except there's nothing symbolic about a physical enemy appearing out of nowhere.

Take Final Fantasy VII's final fight, Cloud vs Sephiroth. That IS symbolic. Cloud defeats the Sephiroth in his head, and I'd say it's fairly well done: even the graphics (of higher quality than the rest of the game) and its scripted nature (unlosable fight) is a great example of its symbolism.

Necron on the other hand... "hey, there's this huge dude in front of us", lose the fight and everyone dies. It's hardly symbolic, and if you want me to say "it is symbolic alright", I'll say it's shitty symbolism compared to FFVII.

>>5986210
Apparently it's just because you don't understand the poignant nuance because Vivi said "exist" and "not exist" instead of "alive" and "dead". See how much us dumb EOPs miss out on?

>>5984175
I know a guy like that except he claims he's actually a native.

>>5982654
May I ask what the title of this game is from? It looks like it's on PC Engine and I could be wrong.

>>5981160
Sort of like a tripcode?

>>5986210
Keep in mind that all throughout FF9, the world gets wrecked by giant unfathomable beings summoned by emotions and the like. Necron is just another in a line of those. It's not as clear as two dudes brawling, though, so I can sympathize with it being harder to understand.

>>5986330
To be honest I haven't played Final Fantasy IX in like 13 years. I do know people always complain about Necron being a random boss, but if this is true (and assuming you are not talking about Eidolons)
>the world gets wrecked by giant unfathomable beings summoned by emotions and the like
then I can see Necron making sense.

>>5986353
The plot of FFIX for most of the game is centered around summons with a bunch of meaningful conversations about how the emotions of the summoner impact the summon and all that, so yeah. It's not a huge leap from that to Necron, and it was confirmed by a developer at some point or another that Necron was summoned by Kuja's intense fear of death in particular. That could have been made a bit more clear in-game but it wasn't too hard for me to put together. I think Necron's speech being turned into star wars memes contributes to people not understanding his place in the story.

Also, sorry for being smug for a second there. In FF7, Sephiroth is around pulling shit for most of the game, so he's a clear main villain. He's the guy that Cloud has to beat. But in FF9 there isn't really one. There's a lot of different people and locales given attention. The post final boss sequence should make it clear to anyone that Kuja is no ultimate final boss. You have to look into the subtext of the various events in the game and see Necron (I.e. fear of death) lurking as the "true final boss" that Zidane and co need to fight. Just like FF7 builds up Cloud vs Sepiroth, FF9 builds up "living a good life" vs "fear of death". This degree of abstraction makes it a lot harder to get and I was being smug about it.

If only Necron appeared at the end of Disc 2 to sinisterly stab Garnet through the heart instead of her just falling silent as a symbolic representation for those so imprisoned by fear that they dont let themselves live the life they want, e.g. black mages.

>>5986371
It becomes really obvious this is what happened when you read >>5981151

Are there any retranslations for 8 and 9? 7 got one

>>5984349
You're full of shit. You'd have killed yourself by now

>>5981193
>it's pretty shitty that their behavior had cost fan translators patrons and discouraged amateur translation efforts
But that's not shitty, that's fair. Don't 'we' on this shitty opinion of yours

>>5982393
matáis should be 'you kill' not 'you fight'

implacable is not 'inevitable' but 'relentless'

>>5988135
This.
Parasites who not only 'fantranslate' and encourage piracy, but have the nerve to beg for money, and profit off of other people with real jobs and who put in real labor and at the same time have NO CREDENTIALS AND OFTEN DON'T EVEN HAVE AN INTERMEDIATE LEVEL OF JAPANESE don't deserve any fucking money, they deserve lawsuits and jailtime.

>>5988161
Jail time for a fan translation? Look, I get that they're often shitty, but that's too much hyperbole even if you're joking.

>>5988161
How do they encourage piracy if essentially they are selling a patch/mod, which they produced themselves? Translators should get paid for their work if they want to; they aren't breaking any justifiable laws.

>>5981193
Just a heads up. I'll be here when the next scammer comes. He'll be exposed.

>>5988370
Based

>>5988370
Based

>>5984334
Dude just retire your tripcode already, we can tell you're a fag solely by your desire to be known in /vr/ as some kind of recurrent sitcom character. Literally everyone else here is capable of posting anonymously and letting whatever "credit" that comes from significant contributions to the board be left for the wind to carry away, why can't you? Do you want your own applause track whenever you show up in a thread?

The only problem I can think of regarding FF9 localization was that just over half the series was officially localized (1, 4, 6, 7, and 8) and of those 8 is really the only one with a actually worthwhile localization (6 is fine for what it is but there's a lot of liberties with it plus Nintendo censorship caused a lot of changes that would be retcon later). And since FF9 is a throwback game that reference all the other Final Fantasy games they couldn't really just take names and lines from previous games like you could with the Japanese version. So you get a throwback game that feels off throughout the whole game.

Don't get me wrong FF9 is fine overall but since now all but FF7 localization has be properly done I would wish they took all of those and redo FF9 localization with all the new localizations in mind.

>>5982586
>>5981505
>>5981193
>>5981160
>>5984334
>>5984831
>>5984813
>>5985473

Threadly reminder this namefag defended a translator of PC98 games using machine translations on projects while taking Patreon money for it.

I sure do love having schizophrenia and posting on /vr/. EOP subhumans BTFO! Dilate trannies!

>>5988831
Square did a somewhat good job catching up on localizations then (1, 2, 4, 5), my problem is that Bandai sold the US rights to Mattel right as Bernie Stolar was heading it, who ensured it never saw the light of day, the localizations were held back for the inferior (dumbed down) GBA ports of Final Fantasy, and the port of FF3 was never finished.

>>5988169
>Jail time for a fan translation?
You have a point. While the Bern convention affords the content creators the right to decide how their work is translated, should they object to this, they didn't act on this. Fair Use would protect the translator a tiny little bit, were this translation separate from the game... WHICH IT ISN'T.
That he is a scammer, while technically true, should earn him a Patreon ban, not jail.

However, the real reason why he deserves a taste of the law hammer is that once he is profiteering off putting the copyright-infringing WHOLE GAME, not just his translation, competing with the actual developers who sell it on Project EGG for money to this day, he's being a bootlegger. That's the line most console publishers draw whether they should go after "passionate fan-translators". Most rom sites aren't even as shameless when monetizing their website, nor do they act with the same self-righteousness of this shitstain.

>>5986309
Off topic, but might be one of the Shining Force series on the Genesis/Sega-CD.

>>5989101
Is this how you cope?

>>5989409
Yeah fucking sucks. But honestly that's Square localization in a nutshell it feels. They will only really consider new localization when a new game is coming out. And as with FF4 and 6 they love keeping some bits and cramming them in the new localization whether or not they work. FF6 GBA localization is nice but the sudden SNES lines popping in really feels out of place since it doesn't flow at all. FF4 "Spoony bard" is fine I guess since there's not really much else in FF4 that's kept but still something that Square really need to get over.

>>5988810
btfo thanks for saying it

>>5988810
>Do you want your own applause track whenever you show up in a thread?
I would love that thanks

Good translation shouldn't necessarily be literal, it should translate the equivalent meaning in the target language/culture

But that only works if the original meaning is retained, you can fuck up the interpretation too

>>5988831
Have you checked out the Beacause retranslation? It's good stuff.

>>5992872
I have it but haven't touched it. FF7 is both the game I most want to revisit but something that is hard for me to want to start. Haven't really heard anyone talk about it outside of it is a thing so I don't know if it's actually worth checking out or sloppy. That being said it doesn't really fix what I was saying. Square really only does retranslations when it's a new game. And FF9 was made at the time when half the games were brought over and couple of them was mishandled. So FF9 translations is just a mess to begin with. Whether or not Square team was great at their job they had nothing to really look past to that would be usable.

>>5989435
Y'know what? This is pretty fair, and he should definitely be banned from Patreon.

>>5992878
I played through the entire Beacause retranslation, and while I'm just one guy, I can definitely say that the story beats are much more impactful, and the dialogue flows much more naturally and with much more context since the scenes were translated in context and not from a disorganized excel sheet. They spent almost 10 years autistically making sure everything was perfect, and it doesn't have any of the literal Japanese faggotry like honorifics or stilted langauge that feels natural in Japanese but awkward in English.

If you're playing the PS1 version there's no option to revert items and Limits to the localized version, but if you have the PC version, there is an option.

I honestly believe that it is a much more definitive way to play Final Fantasy VII in English. Are details still lost? Of course. There's a lot of things that are untranslatable like specific speaking styles or personal pronoun choices. Is it the best you're gonna get if you're an idiot EOP? Absolutely.

>>5981151

>Fear exists wihin ...
"All life bears fear from birth"
would be perfectly acceptabe, concise, no need to write a thesis on something that requires only a sentence. Its just a single mistake, the word "death" instead of "fear"

>To live is to commit
This one I agree with. They are two different things. One is the position of you before anyone else, the other is a more general statement about life. But still, thematically, it is fine.

>To live is to be cease...
"Anxiety becomes fear." There is literally NOTHING wrong here. A perfect summary.

>When one...
This one I also agree with. I have no idea why the fuck they put in star wars trash here. honestly

>>5982586
K : I : L L
Y : O U R S: EL F

>>5989954
>And as with FF4 and 6 they love keeping some bits and cramming them in the new localization whether or not they work.

That's how Square Enix works in general.
Reminder the script of Star Ocean The First Departure in either Japanese or English is a direct copy paste off the SNES original rather than a competent edit that accounts for the extra content.
Secret of Mana for Android is a direct copy of the old truncated English SNES script, and the PC version is a slight edit of that that adds SOME of the missing content (but still is too inherently flawed as a base) and new content. Other languages (which have scripts owned by Nintendo) had to be retranslated from Japanese, and the result is much better.

Localization department had at one point people who loved bringing as much Japanese titles as possible, and insisted that Chrono Trigger, Final Fantasy 5 and 6 deserved retranslations. Woolsey meme fans and game journalists slammed that, people didn't buy the games, in the case of the European branch some burger gamejornos made a stink that the translations aren't "accurate" because their localization doesn't follow the same changes as the burger localization, so Square Enix then started to run everything through focus groups.
It's bad enough that the Wada era has a dearth of original releases, but now near-complete localizations for Hanjaku Hero DS, Nanashi no Game, Fullmetal Alchemist 3 among other things got filtered out in the process.

>>5993014
How the fuck does a crappy localizer get fans? Honest question. I love tomato for bringing over Mother 3 but I always hated how he changed character's names.

>>5992901
Keep in mind my translations aren't meant to be superior replacements, they are just meant to be literal so people who don't know Japanese can see the changes.

That said, while I do think that "Anxiety becomes fear" is elegant in its brevity, I don't actually think it's the better TL. First, the sentence prior to it said "Life fears death", not "Life is anxious about death", so it's a non-sequitur. Second, the difference between anxiety and fear is very nuanced, so a statement like "anxiety becomes fear" on its own doesn't have much weight or depth. Third, this speech is brief and doesn't have much time to convey its ideas, so the more direct and thorough the lines are the better. "Anxiety becomes fear" is very far from a perfect summary and smacks of the TLer being lazy rather than bothering to translate properly. (Also, I feel like the first line being TL'd as "bears death from birth" is painting your perception, but in the original this is supposed to be the first line where fear of death is explicitly mentioned, so it should have been threaten with a lot of care rather than summarized poorly).

Also, regarding "but lives only to die" vs "steal the lives of others just to survive", I learn towards the more literal translation due to the fact it's supposed to be tying into prior scenes in the game where the preciousness of life is contrasted with how we as humans have to kill to survive. I think this is also a very deep and meaningful subject relevant to basically everyone, so it being scrubbed out of the final speech that's supposed to start tying the themes of the games together for the finale isn't great in my opinion.

I feel like it might tie into Quina's hedonism too but to be honest I skipped the fuck out of all of Quina's bullshit so who knows.

>>5981565
Lol, will you kys when I take down another fake translation? You and your tranny namefag pal?