/vr/ - Retro Games

>>5746152
shmups aren't fun, acting like a special snowflake because you play them is the real fun.

shmups own faggots

>>5746152
when you put in another coin like a regular person

>>5746152
They don't. You can safely discard them with the sportsball, rhythm, racing, and fighting trash.

>>5746152
When you play for PBs instead of clears.

Shmups are very much like fighting games. The goal is the rush you get when you overcome a difficult challenge. Sometimes it can feel impossible, but if you keep at it you will get better little by little. They're lonelier than fighting games, though...

>>5746152
/r/ing the "egret II" badge being shopped into saying "regret" instead

>>5746152
when you experience absolutely no frustration upon failure by transcending the need to win and replacing it with the need to be greater than yourself.

When you stop being a try-hard binge gaming faggot and space out your runs and failures. I can't think of a single game with challenge that doesn't get frustrating after a long session, you just have to take it easy and enjoy the small improvements.

>>5746152

when you stay away from the games other people like, and find the games YOU like

>>5746152
If you don’t enjoy a shooter in the first 30 seconds beating your head against the wall isn’t going to make it more fun.

>>5746230
That doesn't make sense. A PB can involve going for a challenging 1cc.

>>5746302
A pb (at low levels) is a more immediate achievable goal, a 1cc can be far or close depending on game and your current skill level. It's a difference of mentality. But I would just say look at general improvements because after a certain point pb's become very rare.

>>5746183
>faggots own shmups
fixed that for you

>>5746152
I'm guessing it's when the first wave of enemies on the first stage stops killing you, you goddamn pansy. Stick to playing Animal Crossing, silky boy. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

>>5746302
Playing for PBs is far less frustrating, because whenever you beat yourself, you win.
If you just play for a clear or whatever, you will just lose the whole time.

>>5746230
A million times this. As long as you're improving consistently you're winning. Even if you plateau you're still winning because at least you're practicing what you've already learned.
This also applies to skills outside videogames such as learning Japanese.

>>5746152
Oh shit, tranny just blew this week's surgery savings

>>5746240
lol ok

Fagawa rank systems are simply artificial difficulty. The games would be nothing special if there was a max rank cap, but because the rank just keeps going and going the game becomes bullshit and impossible to clear unless you devote your life to it, and even then you have to pray you get lucky with shitty RNG.

Fuck Fagawa. I'm going back to Psikyo shumps, those are actually fun and not retarded bullshit.

>>5746913
>impossible to clear unless you devote your life to it
I cleared Garegga in a month or so. A clear is not really anything special in YGW games.

>>5746232
>Shmups are very much like fighting games. The goal is the rush you get when you overcome a difficult challenge. Sometimes it can feel impossible, but if you keep at it you will get better little by little. They're lonelier than fighting games, though...

This. Why the fucking hate all the time ?
I play for - you may want believe it - god damn F U N !

>>5746937
It's just /Shmupg/ falseflag

>>5746152
You just have to stop playing shitty shmups like what Cave, Raizing and Psikyo churned out and start playing the good ones, like Ikaruga.

>>5746942
see>>5746948

>>5746926
It is for me. I can't not get dicked over by either BH2 or Glow Squid. I try to keep rank low but they still go batshit on me.
Anyways, my point was the autistic rank system makes the game not fun, e.g. intentionally killing yourself, avoiding items, etc.
If the rank were more normal, like a Konami shmup, I wouldn't really have a problem with his games, but he made them such a chore.

>>5746978
I'm not a fan of the suiciding in his games myself, but they are still great games, despite their flaws.

>>5746152
he died on the final boss, that's rough.

>>5746152
They are arcade games, they aren't fun, just addictive enough at first to get a few bucks from you.

>>5746152
When you learn to play.

>>5747326
>he
watch out, the lgbt police will come get you now

>>5746152
When you develop autism

>>5746152
Pic related you handless turbo fag

>>5746152
lol is that a tranny?

>>5747471
yes
the world's best garegga player is a tranny freak

>>5746152
When you git gud.

>>5746152
In my experience, they're mainly for people who enjoy training and replaying the same area to improve their skills, or people who enjoy ultra-tense situations. I've had my heart rate double while fighting some final bosses in shmups. The feeling of triumph when you finally do get your shit together and hammer out a winning run is the main enjoyment I've gotten from them.

>>5747415
>>5747326
I called Kamui dude on twitter and he liked my reply.

>>5746152
All shmups require hard memorization. You basically practice them over and over until you learn a video game enough so you can /flex on those who'd rather spent their time learning a musical instrument, a language or a useful skill.

>>5748173
> You basically practice them over and over until you learn a video game enough so you can /flex
flexing happens more in fighting games and player vs player games, I don't see much of that in the shmup world. Most players are really chill

> on those who'd rather spent their time learning a musical instrument, a language or a useful skill.
useful to what end? How is learning the flute or Nigerian going to help me in shmups?

>>5746152
when you pwn everyone with your hi score

>>5746152
When you decide to try to git gud

>>5746152
>when the brain fog hits

>>5746152
When you make it to the next stage and see how fucking cool the boss/level design is and great the BGM is.

The art and music aspect of shmups are really underrated and no one really talks about that for some reason.

>>5748224
>How is learning the flute or Nigerian going to help me in shmups?

woah man don't knock the possibility of befriending nigerian friends with newfound linguistics, they're alright folk and you can get them into shmups too. granted, arcade games are pretty universal in entertainment

>>5748224
>Most players are really chill
Comes with the low population

>>5748173
Every skill is useful if you enjoy what you are doing. You are just another pretentious cunt who acts like his skills are "better".

I have no interest in learning an instrument, because I will never play in a band or become a singer anyway. Learning a video game is more useful to me.

>>5748583
based video game hermit.

ok retards what are some good entry tier shmups i played ikaruga and loved it and i want to really dip my toes into the genre

>>5748583
>Every skill is useful if you enjoy what you are doing.
The problem is that I enjoy playing shoot'em ups using "continues" whiling aiming for personal goals and your community of dangerous incels keeps yelling at me I'm having fun wrong or something ridiculous. I used to have respect for you before coming to /vr/, I really did, now you're nothing but a joke to me.

>>5748673
>oh no, Internet people are being mean to me!
Have you considered growing a pair you gutless bitch?

>>5748673
>The problem is that I enjoy playing shoot'em ups using "continues" whiling aiming for personal goals
Using continues means youre doing practice runs, everyone does practice. Eventually you won't have to once you are competent at surviving the game, which doesn't take too long in most cases.

>people make fun of me for playing wrong
They just want what's best for you. Playing with continues isn't a "style" or something to be proud of, it just means youre in practice mode due to incompetence.
Practicing is fun too.

>>5748324
>The art and music aspect of shmups are really underrated and no one really talks about that for some reason.


THIS.

Shmups look and sound dope as fuck, the bosses with all their transformations from a plane to a giant robot samurai are amongst the most creative designs I've seen in vidya.

Levels are full of details (in later shmups) and enemies are all a one big puzzle to solve.

I suck at shmups but I coin feeded a FBAlpha just because I wanted to see more of it.

>>5748656
Try Cave, they are great for beginners and excellent for experts too. Don't worry too much about difficulty, play what you like.

Low starting difficulty:

Touhou
Mushis
DoDonPachi Daifukkatsu
Deathsmiles
Espgaluda
Akai Katana
Battle Bakraid
Armed Police Batrider

Intermediate starting difficulty:

DoDonPachi
Battle Garegga
Sengoku Blade
Strikers 1999
Raiden Fighters Jet
Cyvern
Espgaluda II

Less forgiving starting difficulty:

Ketsui
Progear
DoDonPachi DaiOuJou
Dragon Blaze
Gunbird 2
Image Fight
Pink Sweets
Gradius III
Great Mahou Daisakusen

>>5748673
Have you tried 1cc's and decided it's not your thing or are you just dismissing it without trying? If it's the former fair enough since it's not for everybody but you're more of an exception in that case since most credit feeders play that way not out of genuine preference but because they're either ignorant of the concept and why it's fun, or intimidated by 1cc's, despite the fact that the difficulty ranges from doable first try blind to fucking retarded hard and everything in between. That's why people push the playstyle for most arcade games.

>>5748768
Not him, but I have never 1cc'd an arcade game besides Street Fighter games. Shmups are crazy hard if you didn't grow up playing them. It's hard for an old dog to learn new tricks l

>>5748776
Shmups are very rewarding because of the steep learning curve, and endless replayability.

Why is grinding in an RPG so much more fun than grinding runs in shmups?

>>5748817
RPG fans of all people should know fun is subjective

>>5748817
because you get good characters and stories to go with the grinding in jarpigs

Why take the arcadepill when you could take the jarpigpill?

>no anxiety/pressure induced while having a good run, max comfiness
>no feelings of turmoil after a failed run, which happens far more frequently than a new pb
>can discuss more things about the game than just strategies, such as story, character development, lore, etc.
>isn't completely dead like shmups and other arcade genres, new games from both indie and AAA devs still made
>you don't have to git gud in order to enjoy the jarpigs, but if you do, there is always jarpig speedrunning

>>5748776
There's tons of super easy shmups, try Batsugun Special, Nemesis (Gradius 1 US release), Twinkle Star Sprites and Deathsmiles. Most console shmups are also extremely doable with minimal practice.

>>5748853
>implying dodonpachi doesn't have good lore

>>5746152
Shmups are only fun for literal sufferers of autism. Your brain basically has to be a computer to git gud at these things. Source: I have the tism myself.

Shumps are too much work and not enough payoff. Might as well just get into speedrunning instead if you're gonna go full autism.

>>5749048
>Shumps are too much work and not enough payoff
It only feels like work if you play too much. If you just play an hour a day in a game of your choice, it's not that bad.

Einhander
G-Darius
Gradius Gaiden
R-Type Delta
Mars Matrix

If you can't have fun with any of those then you're a total fag.

I like shmups, but the main thing that I dislike about them is that they can force you into a perfectionist mindset and sap the fun out of them. I recently picked up Psyvariar Delta, and I want to kill myself every time I play it. It made me realize that every shmup that I've 1cc'd was just a straight up memorizer with no real skill involved.

>>5748728
thank you, gonna check em all out

>>5748853
I dunno man i just like zipzooming in space

>>5748903
What are some good autismvania games?
Things like Tetris Grand Master, Shmups, etc.

Hellsinker comes out on Steam soon.
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1067720/Hellsinker/

>>5749296
Psyvariar has some real pixel dodging nonsense in it. Not a big of that stuff.

>>5748817
In RPG you could grind for a couple of hours and go into that ruins that fucked up your shit and finally see whats inside and survive.

In Shmup you could grind for couple of hours but since your performance will rely on your actual skill more than attributes your could level up by merely wasting time killing low tier mobs, you will still end up stuck, advancing a level or two at best.

Especially how high the learning curve is in most shmups.

/v/-tier thread

>>5747635
she is a girl you derp

>>5749394
Pretty much. Jarpigs reward time spent equally. Skill-based games reward time spent but the period of time that you spent scales with how much it takes you to memorize and execute.

>>5749669
t. Softdrink

>>5750608
lol

>>5749315
Rhythm games are peak autism. 100% memorization.

>>5748817
>Why is grinding in an RPG so much more fun than grinding runs in shmups?
It's not more fun, it's just easier, and takes less mental and physical energy.
"Grinding" shouldn't be used if you're referring to practicing a difficult game, it's completely different from grinding in a RPG.

>>5750424
yeah, how could we possibly obtain the objective measurement of a man if not by the scores he gets by outwitting and out-reflexing people in a videogame.

>>5746852
Thanks mate, and now my end of the bargain

>>5748324
>implying nigerian is a language

lol

>>5749394
cuz you're comparing casual play to a challenge run.
try doing a low-level playthrough or a speedrun of an rpg, it'll be just as unfun as grindmonkeying for a 1cc or good score in an stg.

>>5748817
cuz you're comparing casual play to a challenge run.
try doing a low-level playthrough or a speedrun of an rpg, it'll be just as unfun as grindmonkeying for a 1cc or good score in an stg.

>>5751543
But shmups are actually fun for score. They are short enough to not get too frustrating. And they are well designed.
RPGs however are way too long to play competitively and often have stupid RNG shit hours into the game.

It's not comparable, except for multilooping shmups like Gradius perhaps.

>>5751546
I actually enjoy RPG challenge runs. I've beaten FF1 with four white mages and FFT once with solo Ramza, once with a party of straight archers (no other job abilities) and once I put the entire party on AI the entire game.

>>5751520
>IMPLYING MILLION UNITED STATED DOLLARS ALL CAPS PIDGIN ENGLISH ISNT THE NIGERIAN LANGUAGE

If they aren't fun after trying them, they will never be fun. Go back to Chrono Trigger or whatever RPG you enjoy if that's the case instead of sticking to shmup communities just to remind them 24/7 of why you don't enjoy them. Move on.
Really telling that this board can only really have an active thread on shmups if it's hating on them. You don't have to enjoy these games, nor be good at them. You're not better otherwise. If you feel insecure due to having games as the only thing in your life, seek meaning through other means too.

anyone else watching slowbeef's first time playing battle garegga?

>be failed e-celeb
>have to savescum battle garegga on super easy and on the arrange mode that draws medals into you and only lowers them 1 grade if you break your chain
sad...

Honestly I had fun the first time I played. I love the non-stop action and adrenaline. I how you can just jump in and start.playing the game without any boring cutscenes, tutorials, or wandering around. I love how the game requires total focus, so when I play it I don't have deal with anxiety depression or intrusive negative thoughts like in real life. There's no mental space left to worry about how I'll never get a girl, or have any friends, it's just all about the game. I find it very therapeutic and meditative. It's almost zen, achieving a perfect ego loss, just existing in the present moment, and not in the past and future.

If you don't like shmups, that's ok. There are plenty of games of different genres. But I love them, and highly recommend them, especially if you are dealing with mental health issues like anxiety or depression.

>>5746913
Rank management using tactics like purposefully avoiding powerful and intentional deaths is a core gameplay skill you need to use to play the game.

/v/-tier thread

>>5748173
Hot take: learning an instrument without going pro is no more valuable than getting good at games. They're both hobbies you use to pass your time when you're not at work. The main value is the enjoyment they provide, not any practical benefit in the real world.

>>5748656
Batsugan special

>>5748853
Any game where you improve your character instead of improving yourself is a waste of time.

>>5752553
>Any game is a waste of time.
ftfy

also arguably the game where you improve the character will waste less of your time than how much time you'll spend replaying the same 30 minute game until you stop sucking ass at it.

>>5752573
I can take my shmup skills and apply them in any other game in the genre. Good luck transferring your final fantasy character to dragon quest.

>>5752578
>shmup skills
what, muscle memory and reaction time? lol

>>5752589
Playing shmups really requires more than just this. It also requires very good hand-eye coordination, dexterity, endurance, and strategical thinking

>>5752578

Your "shmup skills" will still take months to learn a new shmup and get the 1cc in them. In that time one could have enjoyed and beaten several JRPG's.

>shmups
>reaction times
Jarpigs were a mistake

>>5752593
You would be surprised how quickly skilled players can learn new shmups.
What would take a month for you, can take 2 days for a veteran.

>>5752593
Right, so go do that, noone cares. What's the point of never shutting up about how you don't like shmups. Does sucking at them makes you insecure or something?

>>5752596
The topic was which type of game is less of a waste of time. You're the one getting fanny flustered over the discussion and someone preferring to play JRPG's instead of shumps, lol.

>>5752603
Except for the fact that shmup fans get bombarded by seething jarpigs over and over. It's fucking pathetic
What are you even doing here?

>>5752595
Show me any player who picked up a shmup and got a 1cc it in a matter of a few days.

Bonus points if it's not some casual babby shit like 2hu or a Compile shmup.

>>5752608

>>5752608
>Show me any player who picked up a shmup and got a 1cc it in a matter of a few days.
Lmao players do this all the time. A 1cc is really not that hard for a good player mostly. The real challenge is playing for score.

Jaimers for example 2-ALLed R-Type in 2 days, 1cced Garegga in 1 day, etc
They have enough experience to be able to do this.

>>5752593
Why do you see video games as something to beat and rush on to the next one? Like you're just trying to get it over with quickly.

/vr/ shmup threads in a nutshell

>>5752391
>what's "fun" never changes throughout your entire life. ill pretend to be old and wise now.
>really telling that im so insecure i have to shitpost about what people are insecure about
cool cringe bro

>>5746232
In fighting games you are just trying to rank up online. Which is completely in line with >>5746230 "ranking up" your personal best high score on subsequent plays.

>>5752727
It's shooting games not something deep you gain appreciation over time. It's not that hard to figure out if you're cool with moving, shooting and memorizing short games to survive or get a high score. You either like this or you don't.
Maybe later in life you will, but not by playing them over and over to see if they grow on you but rather due to you changing over time.
What reason is there to go on about how you don't like this genre over months other than sheer insecurity?

>>5752391
a wild tardo

>>5752391
>>5752738

>If they aren't fun after trying them, they will never be fun.
I had lots of false starts with shmups. They were an acquired taste for me. The learning curve is steep. I didn't even know "where to look" when I first started so I was dying every 10 seconds.
Now I get them, they are pretty fun.

BOMBER

>bumping shmup threads on /jarpig/

>>5748853
Jarpigs are legit peak anxiety. I cant do them.

>Level scaling so more kills = harder game.
>Missable items
>Complex autistic fusion systems with a limited amount of resources in the entire game.

>tranny janny be mad

>>5752534
Puzzle games do this for me. Columns is my go-to game when I'm depressed.

>>5755447
Most JRPGs don't have level scaling, but missable items are complete bullshit I agree. It's even worse when the item needed to advance the fucking game is hidden and you only have some cryptic riddle

What are the best shmups on steam?

>>5748853
>You can only do one or the other
Imagine not taking the bothpill

>>5756557
Raiden IV

>>5755612
>Most JRPGs don't have level scaling

Is this true?

>>5756832
Yes, that's why grinding makes things much easier.

>>5752543
But anon, if I tell a girl I play an instrument, she'll be interested, but if I tell a girl I play video games, her pussy will dry and she will ditch me

>>5746152
Always fun you pleb.

>>5756557
Any of the cave ports:
- dodonpachi daifukkatsu (dodonpachi resurrection)
- mushihimesama
- deathsmiles

excellent non-cave games on steam:
- ikaruga
- eschatos
- zeroranger
- crimzon clover world ignition

All are good, but they have different gameplay styles, so you should check them out and see what you like. I'm a big cave fan, so I would probably recommend dodonpachi daifukkatsu or mushihimesama highest, but again you can't go wrong with any of these.

>>5756557
>>5757097
Don't forget Judgement Silversword along with Eschatos. Graze Counter is also great, although a little easy. I've cleared normal and expert, and am trying unlimited. Better players may want to start on unlimited.

>>5757097
>playing Cave games on Steam
Enjoy your inaccurate slowdown timing. X360 is the only way to play late Cave shumps, besides the PCB.

>recommending zeroranger
lel

Play one on an emulator with infinite credits. Just go to fucking town on it. If you enjoy your playthrough, replay it sometime and try to use less credits than your first run. Keep setting personal records like that and you'll start improving. Don't worry about 1ccing or "playing legit" the first time. A game isn't worth taking so seriously unless you already like it.

>>5758119
Yes but you can't actually enjoy a game unless you take it seriously to some extent, try to overcome its challenges and learn its systems and mechanics. Infinite credits are like godmode, it would make literally any game an unengaging homogenous mess. You need to at the very least have the mentality of trying to do better and learning, if you are not aiming for a 1cc and scoring.

>>5758098
How are they inaccurate?

>>5759004
They aren't he's just trolling

>>5759127
Except he's right. The degica ports are borked, especially deathsmiles.

>>5759137
How though?

>>5759142
watch youtube videos of steam version vs the pcb version

>>5759147
>No evidence
You must be a /shmupg/ poster

>>5758134
>Infinite credits are like godmode
This. Cheats in vidya are only worth it if they're some zany shit like GTA San Andreas where all the cheats are great tools to fuck around in the huge sandbox that is the game.
The boring factor gets exponentially bigger the more mundane a cheatcode is. Godmode is basically the tail end of that scale and absolutely no one can play a game with invincibility turned on (and ONLY invincibility turned on) from start to finish and say with a straight face that it was "fun", much less a scrolling shooter where the fun is basically not getting hit by shit while the levels scroll forward.

>>5759142
He probably means they have some differences in slow-down, where it happens and to what degree.

There is an argument against slow-down, some people don't like it as a game feature at all.
But on the other hand playing without slow down is much harder so it depends what you're after. A more accurate port or a more challenging port and fast paced port. The Steam port of Deathsmiles MBL doesn't have enough slowdown so it closely resembles the NA release of Xbox 360 version before it was patched.

/v/ and /vr/ are not too different

>>5760190
I can see why modern games love trying to be cinematic experiences, if this is the “people” they cater to.

shoot em ups=onions shit
beat em ups= for CHADS

>>5760243

beat em ups = pest control simulator

Play fighting games.

>>5749394
Don't talk shit about RPGs

>>5760295
based

>>5760163
This is outdated info, all the device ports have had slowdown fixing updates released through steam years ago.