/vr/ - Retro Games

Duke Nukem 3D >>>> above all

Too bad Randy owns the IP.

A pack of save files for "pistolstarting" PC-Powerslave/Exhumed (NOT PowerslaveEX).

https://pastebin.com/jJDwGaGF
(can't post the link directly because of the word filter)

One full life, zero ammo (the game gives you 24 revolver bullets, 51 machinegun bullets and/or 50 units of fuel for those of weapons which are in your possession by the time you start the level), zero mana and artifacts, each levels SHOULD have a correct set of starting weapons assigned to it.

In order to work, file SAVGAMEA.SAV should be backed-up/deleted, a save file from the pack, corresponding to a particular level (for example, 011SAVGAMEA.SAV) should be copied, that copy renamed into SAVGAMEA.SAV, then loaded from inside the game as usual. The game does not lock SAVGAMEA.SAV for modification, while working, so that substitution can take place more or less whenever you fancy.

If you complete the level, it naturally overwrites the current save as usual.

All the levels, barring levels 10 and 20 (which I haven't playtested that way) are playable and completeable when played that way (to be fair, I only tested a majority of them with the 3-lives saves, but I don't remember tanking through at the expense of lives anywhere). Level 17 however more or less requires you to find a certain secret in order to have enough resources to progress further in it.

powerslave isn't Build, is it? all the platforming wouldn't be possible on that engine I think

>>5628583
There is PC Powerslave and two versions of console Powerslave (Saturn and PS1). "PC Powerslave" and "console Powerslave" are essentially different games (they share some of the resources between them however, sprites, sounds, music, basic enemy behavior, etc.).

>>5628583
what? platforming is fine on build, then again people complain about turok and ive never had problems platforming in that game either. The saturn version of powerslave uses their own engine called Slavedriver which was also used for Duke3d and Quake on saturn, there was another build engine powerslave which came out before the console version different game by the same team. Platforming has nothing to do with being on build or not, all major build releases had some platforming.

I can't recommend Alien Armageddon enough, all the new content and features, etc

It did make me realise how kinda shit Duke it Out in DC and Caribbean Beach feel though even with all the new additions

Playing through THE AMC TC right now and it's very good. Only real con is that I'm not the biggest fan of the stamina system, I like the idea but in practice it's just nerfed my movement speed in return for rolls and slides I don't use. Unlike the slide in Alien Armageddon witch is great.

>>5628648
The episode is great, and I love bombshells rocket launcher

>>5628704
I thought I'd hate the giant underwater level, but it turned out to be pretty fun and atmospheric - the idea of a whole city being sunken was kino as hell

But I wonder if modders will ever figure out how to add hub worlds to Duke 3D like what was supposed to be in the 2001 Duke Forever Build

>>5628629
Did you play Turok on the N64? It was 20fps and like 50 fov so that your viewpoint was 5 feet ahead of your player model, it was awkward.
Also fps games with extended platforming segments and zero movement tech can fuck off.

>>5628648
Glad you're liking it - if it helps, stamina is affected by the weapon you're carrying (the bar changes colour reflecting this) so carrying a pistol will let you run a lot longer than an AR.

>>5628719
It is possible, just that it's a pain to pull off right. EP3 of AMC does have a big powerslave-style hub set on Egypt but even that only scratches the surface of what's really possible.

I also made that aquatic level, there's a few niggles with it but I think I did a good enough job of making navigation relatively easy.

>>5628704
>>5628756
woops top bit was meant for this post

>>5628756
What was your goal/inspiration for that giant water map? It felt like something out of Duke Nukem Zero Hour, a post Duke 3D style map in trying to capture something epic and grandeur about the Duke setting and doing something that wasn't done in the original game without also feeling ridiculous

>>5628723
yes I did, the only thing I found really tricky was the stupid bonus levels when you enter the portals

>>5628772
the music track basically - It's from LOTB, it's a great track and I basically built the level around it (the next 2 levels after this one are also by me and it's pretty much the same story - I chose PSX Duke tracks and kinda built the level to go with it)

Duke 3D is the one I have the most nostalgia for cause my dad had the full version, but I remember getting to play Shadow Warrior and Blood on a family friend's lounge room PC.
I recently emulated Powerslave and was surprised how fucking decent it controls for a PS1 FPS game.

>>5628756
The weapons affecting movement and stamina is a great idea. It's something not seen in retro shooters but it's great for giving weapons more personality and depth as well as help with weapon balance.

>>5628509
Does anyone know if the game "killing time" (pc version) is based on .WAD? And if there is any way to corrupt it?

>>5628602
Come to think of it, PC version of Powerslave, alongside original Quake, are two purest (known to me) examples of leveldesign for the sole purpose of leveldesign, as showcases at pushing individual styles places.

Started Duke3d with the following setup:

- high-end Android tab
- Magic Dosbox
- Duke3d Atomic cd 1.5
- XBox1 controller

Spent some time mapping controller to Alien Resurrection style (two sticks). It works quite well in the end. Set graphics to 800x600 - it looks grat after low-res Doom/Hexen.

Just finished E1M3 - toxic dump. Played it in 90s on 486DX - but don't remember anything beyond E1M2. Level design is just great, they really tried to not make it boring. Also a lot of minor details - leveld are super polished (I guess it will go down in the following episodes).

Also the game is not as easy as Doom E1 - LAPD pigs are deadly, can get 40% health from one shot.

Did not like e1m5 Abyss. That samey mountain caves. Got lost there and after half an hour finished on youtube.

First 4 levels in e1 are very good, Death Row is the best. And Abyss brings not the best parts from Hexen.

Played 3 maps of e2 after that. Setting there is nice - that techbase feel from doom. Levels are smaller and more corridor-like than in e1. Window views to space shuttle are good and the moving space-ferry in e3 is realy great.

Foes in e2 are worse though. These chaingunner pig replacements are shit. Who the hell thought that a hitscanner, that doesn't die from one shotgun and cannot be interrupted, - is a good idea? At this point on first playthroigh you either savescam (what i've done) or enter cheats. Self desttucting robots are okay.

I liked all 3 maps in e2 so far, especially the m3 - warp factor. But going to replay them couple of times to get better opinion.

>>5628580
Levels 1 and 5 contain stacked objects (looks like 1, is actually 2 same objects in the same place) placed where you are very likely not to notice the fact.
Level 5 has a hallway wuth two mummies, right behing the first keylocked door, I think, in that hallway there are seemingly 4 lifebloods. One of them (the one lodged in the left, in relation to entrance, division wall's niche) - if I remember correctly is actually doubled. This can be discovered if you hurt yourself with a flamethrower a bit, then heal - several times.
Level 1 contains a stacked ammo belt in the middle of dark "torch maze". It looks like a simple one (60 bullets), is actually two such ammo belts on top of each other. A bit prior to that, in the room right after the machinegun, near the pool of water, big ammo belt actually gives you 126 bullets instead of 120.
The last trope is different from two of those that precede it, this belt is lying in the plain sight, not obscured with anything. The trope of big ammo belt in plain sight giving you a non-standard amount of ammo is used, at least once, elsewhere, in Philae, level 7, the biggest byte-wise level in the game, but I'll get to it.
Level 3 also has the "stacked objects" trope, but it's used VERY differently from level 1 and 5 examples. The level starts with you looking at such a stacked belt, but there is also an enemy high on the ledge immediately behind you. It is very likely that just as you pick up the belt, you will get simultaneously shot by that enemy from behind, thus making you switch your attention on that enemy and missing the fact you picked more than one belt. Still, it is a far more bold and explicit usage of this situation than aforementioned levels 1 and 5 ones.

>>5631298
I have already written on the subject of setup with rats-watching-you and underwater rats in level 2 in some other build thread before. In Philae, level 7, underwater rats are used twice, once below the secret ship (you get to by means of going upstream for the first time thus collecting yourself an extra life as well), once near the secret cave accessed from optional underwater cave in the area with 4 circular pools. Both areas are optional, ship gives you 2 still beating hearts, the cave gives you one.
Ship also contains aforementioned non-standard long ammo belt. In the ship's cargo hold, right below the staircase up, there are 3 long ammo belts. They should amount to 360 bullets total, but they only give you 300: the ammo belt the closest to the staircase is actually a simple ammo belt in the guise of a long one.
Right after you exit the ship area and return to main progression course, there is another opportunity to go upstream, which gives you another long ammo belt and the girls secret. However, having just topped off on ammo in the ship, that long ammo belt is very likely to be useless to you at the moment you discover it. The girls' secret might just be there to make explicit its - the whole room's optionality is intentional.
Shortly after the ship there is part of the water stream with two poison vials, illuminated with 4 flames situated in their respective wall niches. In one of those wall niches, there is a sitting rat, watching you, half covered with the flame sprite. It is extremely easy to miss.
The ending sequence with dodging poison vials is most easily completed if you actively go upstream on occasions (thus "'sequencebreaking"' of sort), and if you power through the poison vials on the chosen side of the stream by force of full beating heart. In the reservoir with three streams going through previously barricaded openings, the right opening, AS WELL AS the niche with the switch opening it - are entirely optional, moreover, useless.

>>5631365
Lastly, near the very end of the level, you have the last opportunity to go upstream. Thus, you get to a room with another extra life (there are two on the level, you got the first one when taking the first opportunity to go upstream, which also gave you access to ship, as mentioned before). In that room there are spiders placed in the anklet-deep water in such a way that they are plainly visible as spiders, but nearly impossible to be sniped in un-aggroed state. Those spiders are placed their backs to entrance, and it is perfectly possible to snag extra life without aggroing them. The room contains nothing else noteworthy.

Level 14 contain several places where you are seemingly baited to go out of your way as in doing something cool - with the level not acknowledging that in the slightest. I counted at least three such places but the most blatant one is situated near the end of the level in the big courtyard before the final door. There is a building there, a limestone cube of sorts, with an opening. Doing an extremely tight jump you can actually get into that opening If you miss the jump - which is likely to happen several times - you take fall damage - but there are enough blood vials around the courtyard. Anyway, after doing the jump and getting into the opening, you are treated to nothing whatsoever. Not even a speedloader. Just a dead-end. The floor kinda looks like that of an elevator though. So after actually acquiring the KEY to the final door, before exiting it (which is a point of no return), you do the jump again, again to nothing.

>>5629801
I hate how I have to wait for special ed creatures like that and the ghost to take 5 minutes of not spinning around in circles or running back and forth, to actually start attacking me. And then sometimes they confused and start doing it again for 5 minutes. Half the time I just decide to ignore them, let them have their special moments and walk past them.

>>5628802

Speaking of underwater maps, have you ever played a map called bobsp4? It's also entirely underwater but there's sea bases you can go inside through airlocks. It is like Subnautica in the duke engine

>>5631391
Two other such places in level 14, West Bank. The first one is near the beginning of the level, when you go up an elevator, a mummy attacks you from a niche you can't jump to either from an elevator in its top position OR from the floor next to it. You are actually meant to jump off MOVING elevator right before it stops in the highest position (you get mire height sue to addition of velocities, seemingly). The game DOES however acknowledge that jump, and gives you some ammo for your trouble. What it does NOT acknowledge is situated in the NEXT room. Each side of that room has three openings in it (low-high-low), with pictures of some sorts of trophies adorning them, looking kind of like podiums. The low openings each have some sort of ammo in them, the high ones seemingly do not. It is actally possible to get into those high openings doing extremely tight jumps from adjacent low openings, but you end up getting nothing, the far walls in either of those high openings are neither openable nor grenade-destructible.
The third example of level leaving you cold in the water is near the end of the level, after you kill the giant carapace thing but before you get the last key. In a building. Well basically, you can push one of the blocks in the "wrong" direction in order to reach a ledge seemingly inaccessible otherwise, but that way you get a glitch with the block simply disappearing altogether and that ledge being left un-reached. Or is it something wrong with my version of the game (I am using Exhumed exe, which, I think, I have DOS32A-patched) in that the block isn't meant to disappear, and that ledge leads to the switch activating that yellow cube elevator?

>>5631408
There is also a sickeningly tasteless multi-part joke, concerning everything jetpack-related, to boot.

>>5631365
>>5631391
On Philae, level 7. If I were to guess right now as to what everything written above on this level revolves around, I would say it to be something like "Why are you here? What exactly for?" (by means of making certain pickups, combat encounters, places VERY EXPLICITLY optional - if not downright not-worth-it - thus coercing you to question your own current motivations, while also conveying something like "there HAS to be some sort of a better way, when compared to just 100%ing the levels").

bump

jesus christ i should really find a way to patch eduke32 so it stops generating .log files in the working directory under linux

Could Duke's ponos satisfy Bombshell?

>>5628648
that chick looks like a truck stop hooker shes gross and defs not a bombshell

>>5630412
Replayed first 3 levels of e2, and they are all good. Liked 2 Incubator more than on first time.

Then played 4 and 5. And they are crap. Especially 4 - Fusion. Wannabe doom map (where is mine build-interactivity dammit) - zero logic behind the map, weird textures, overpowered foes, super dumb puzzles with oneshot obstacles. It definitely came from a different designer, than 1-3.

5 Occupied Territory is slightly better, but still crap - again zero logic behind the map planning, doom shaped rooms are overly large, and monsters are even more overpowered. Two bigger hitscanners in final room is total bullshit.

Level 6 stsrts better though, I hope earlier - "logical and interactive design" will return there.

>>5633134
Mine could but I usually nut after only a few minutes unless I have some heroin or cocaine.

murderer's thumb please you already shit up the thief threads with your blogs dont do it to build too

Will Allen Blum ever return to mapping? I want to see maps like Derelict or Golden Carnage from him. In a complete episode with no other co-authors, no shit extra graphics, no Randy involvement.

>>5633470
Fusion Station is a masterpiece. One of Duke's best levels.

>>5633804
And you say there is no logic in these two levels. You are wrong. Fusion is a very logical 3D level. It's an alien infested power station, with the reactor in the middle. You start at the bottom, and have to ramp your way up to destroy the reactor. Enemy placement is great too. Liztroops are shooting you from window, Enforcers (chaingunners) dominate the corridors, drones attack in the outside areas, and Octabrains are spawned by killed women. Fat commanders appear after the reactor blow up. One of the most perfect levels.

Occupied Territory is also great but it was originally planned as a boss level and it shows. It's much harder than the maps after it. It has great scale, and true sense of outer space, probably more than any other level in the game (Spaceport also has a good scale, but Occupied has better). It's also half infested, and the enemy placement is logical as well.

Great maps, if you don't like them, you're a newbie.

Is it me or did the recent update of Blood: Fresh Supply break the game? I used to get 144 fps easily, but now I hover around 90 and the audio is all fucked up and bassy.

>>5634154
they found a way to break it more than it was already?

Why the inferior Blood gets more hype recently on /vr/, when Duke is better in every aspect of gaming?

>>5628580
[shiteatingrin]Set, level 10, is abso-lutely "pistolstartable", by the way.[/shiteatingrin]

No, really.

Pretty interesting fight, too, quite interesting to figure out.

>>5633824
The main problem with Fusion, that it doesn't follow the pulpy-realistic setting of the best duke levels. It is believable (in 80-s action film meaning) when a switch inside the cinema-machine room opens the big screen curtains. It is not believable, when, to open the common door in presumably human tech area, you need to climb through some moving (and one-shotting) nuclear device and shoot the button through the specially prepared narrow tunnel. Weird alieny textures/doors/switches do not help. Flying antigrav bridge is even worse. Doom gets away with such things because you know - hell, demons and all that stuff. In Duke there is a harsh contrast after first 3 levels of e2.

I am not a newbie in FPSes by any means, but I never played duke beyond e1 before and can use a fresh look.

On Occupied Territory - it is funny, so it is not only feels unfinished and tackled on, but it is actually is some leftover added in the middle of e2 just in case.

Played 3 more levels today e2m6 - m8. They all have a descent doom-e1 techbase feeling.

e2m6 Tiberius is not bad, but a bit simplistic and small. And timed buttons are annoying.

m7 Lunar Reactor is good. Plays similar to m2/m3 , but is less polished. There is definitely a lack of ammo and especially the medkits (and I am playing it on Piece of Cake with a lot of saving). Destructible things there (to allow jumping to yellow card) feels on the same level as e1 maps.

m8 Dark Side is great, it plays like m3 Warp Factor. It also can have more medkits and less hitscanners, but generally it is not that annoying. Ending with black monolith is superb - I expected the big bad guy on the open area near the end, still was not disappointed blowing all babes and flying brains in final cave.

Going to replay these three maps in some days.

>>5636108
no one cares holy fuck

>>5635006
Numale SJWs - they can't like Duke for his "sexism" or Lo Wang for his "racism" - Blood is the safe choice for middleground cowards.

>>5636379
I like his posts

>>5636379
I care you shithole fuck.

>>5636885
>he doesn't duck around corners
it's like you want to die

>>5636885
Never played Blood, but the gameplay looks slick.
And the visuals are more aesthetically pleasing than Duke 3D

>>5636885
That's what they give you dynamite for, buddy.

>>5636885
Did you actually save the filename, or are you the same guy that's been posting that around?
People have already told you that Extra Crispy is the highest difficulty in the game, it's not even intended for solo play.

Anyway, I'd rank BLOOD slightly higher than Duke for the gameplay, but Duke is just so well done in other areas that I wouldn't fault someone for preferring it.

Blood is an overrated game which gets some hype recently because of the half assed ports. It will come and go, Duke is still the king of the Build Engine. The leveldesign is absolutely god tier.

>>5638043
this, like dont get me wrong blood is a great game but theres just so many fucking basedboys over hyping the fuck out of it, dukes levels are the best of the build engine

>>5628580
Blanksaved/"pistolstarted" level18. Died twice, once of my own grenade, once having stupidly fallen off a secret platform I DID reach (also there was a much better way of accessing it I now realize).

Still as much of a satanspawn of the level as I remember it being.

This time around, however, I did a pretty good job clearing it out. Also that sequencebreak of sort, allowing you to postpone activating trigger, cutting your access to the first part of the level for good, was nice. I think it was intentional too, there were other instances where it was possible to do things safe (if slow) way.

I think I more or less got its idea too, basically it seems to me to be "Scepsis, The Level: Reality Check Edition".

Anyway, these just are my current impressions, nothing more for the time being.

>>5636108
Replayed e2m6 Tiberius - on a seconc sight, it is basically a variation of doom2 e1m1 - similar shaped rooms, long corridors, final area with browny textures.

Mirrors in corritorr turns are nice, timed doors are dumb, foes are generally ok, small battlelord in final room is well placed, also liked the pool with brains.

There also a severe lack of medkits and ammo, especially with pistolstart. Game basically forces you to use cheesing guns - shrinker and freezer. And for big hitscanner - there are just not enough rpg rockets - finished him with grensdes and lsdt shotgun rounds.

Overall not a bad map, but too small and way unbalanced on ammo.

>>5638539
We want pictures/webms, Powerslave setting is great, always reminds me about Metroid's Chozo ruins, that are copied from ancient Egypt.

>>5638714
Now play e2m5 on comegetsome/pistolstart and then re-read this message of yours.

Also, fun fact, there is a beta of shareware version of Duke (ep1) which contains tougher versions of maps and even has some extra details here and there (some of the areas are underdeveloped though, when compared with the final game, and Toxic Dump in particular starts in the wrong place).

What I am saying, these versions of maps could be interesting for pistolstarting.

>>5638802
With pistolstart that woud be a save/load shitfest even on piece of cake. Occupied Territory is unreasonably hard. Don't remember about the ammo situation there though.

Movement on gamepad with two sticks is okay, but aiming is not even close to mouse (should be close to pure keyboard). Also vertical auto-aiming in DOS version works fine most of the time, but not always (when monster is higher than vertical auto-aim area or when minions are crawling on the floor in front of chaingunners). And while you can look up/down - you cannot aim up/down (cannot fix angle in half-up position). I don't consider playing this way above PoC.

Just got home from work, which episode should i play through in Duke 3D tonight?

>>5638904
Episode 4

>Download it today.
>Before congress does.

What did they mean by this?

>>5638850
You can absolutely aim up and down, meaning arbitrary angles (even though within a restricted range), using keyboard. Recheck how your controls are assigned.

>>5637874
extra crispy is doable with savescumming

>>5638850
You may have chosen "look" up/down instead of "aim" up/down. Look will reset the camera when you're done.

>>5639427
>>5639452
Indeed, aim up/down works differently and allows vertical aim. I am not sure I like it more though, now instead of "doom it like it is 1993" I am having "console_action_gaming.webm". Right stick is too sensitive, and it seems mouse speed config option does not affect it.

Replayed m7 Lunar Reactor, and impressions are the same as in first time - solid map, too many enemies, tunnel over the abyss is well done, also liked the Metroid-like "run until it blows up" finish.

>>5636885
You're the biggest nerd currently browsing /vr/.

>>5628704
If you are planning on playing the game on normal you don't have to worry about a the fatigue system, especially if you are playing from EP3 onwards, as you don't get any more
golden weaponsjust A golden bike

>>5638850
I think E2 would have been better if Fusion Station and Occupied Territory were pushed back to the end of the episode between Dark Side and Overlord. Then we would have 3 distinct segments: 1. space, 2. moon, 3. alien territory. These maps are much harder than TibStation for example.

Warp Factor could have been a much better level with less drones in it. The layout is great, but fighting them everywhere was annoying.

>>5628580
Okay, I think I got level 19.
It's a pretty retarded idea for the bossfight.
I mean yeah, technically it's a puzzle bossfight. Problem is, the puzzle itself is pretty, well, retarded and hinges almost entirely upon red herrings, obfuscating a very simple one step solution to all of your problems. And while I have some nitpicks with the implementation of level10's puzzle bossfight, it's incomparably more intricate and satisfying to figure out, than level19's.

>>5640795
Even more like that seemingly intended solution is so blatantly STUPID, it has quite a high chance of just not visiting your mind for quite some time.

But yeah, it's intended alright. Otherwise those mana goblets wouldn't be where they are.

>>5640290
Lunar Apocalypse is way too long and samey - they coud have dropped m4, m5 and m6 completely and the whole episode would only be better.

I also read about Warp Factor drones elsewhere, but for some reason (perhaps because of piece of cake) I didn't have much problems with them. They are rarely more than one and can be easily downed with shotgun.

Played final Overlord map - level itself is okay - small snd straightforward. But why the hell they did not provide enough rockets? I spent too much on Battlelord Sentry, and Overlord himself is a fucking sponge. I gave up and watched the final movie on youtube.

Played some levels of e3 Shrapnel City after that. And, damn, they are good!

Need to replay them for better overview, on first impressions:

m1 is the worst of them, didn't like the rooms planning, and enemy density per square meter is over the top.Also severe lack of medkits.

Bank level is great both outside and inside, puzzle with huge gear columns is nice, final room is atmospheric. Well balanced on ammo and medkits.

Water level is interesting, idea to have most doors underwater feels fresh.

Next level with skyscrapers has grest verticality. I just finished it too soon entering the opposite window on jetpack.

Film Studio level is very good - not too big and packed with details. Rooms inside studio look beleivable.

Unndeground station level is superb. I've got "wow" from both realistic station and the idea of train jumping.

All these levels, except the first are well balanced for ammo and medkits.

Did Megadeth's version of Grabbag ever make it into any of the variation releases of the game?

>>5641065
Replayed e3m1 Raw Meat, and it is not as bad as it seemed on a first glance. Rooms are too small, and there are too many enemies. But sushi restaurant details are nicely done, especially the kitchen and service areas. Found 3 more atomic healths and had enough health till the end. Connected pools with brains are not very interesting, but the waterway from the small kitchen bathtub to one of these pools was nice. Also was very glad to see LAPD pigs back - they are much better enemies than hitscanner reptiles.

Currently it seems that everithing in e3 is better than in e2 except the music. E3 music is kinda crap.

>>5628532
Everything else including Duke >>>>>>> Blood

>Ion Maiden might be killed by a litigious boomer group.

>>5642204
>he doesn't like the blade runner music homage

>>5641065
Episode 3 is overrated. I don't see any kind of effort in those maps. And Movie Set was hot garbage.

>>5642259
>caring about a game that is soley exploiting nostalgia
Thank god its doomed. Isnt even /vr/ related

>>5642398
keep telling yourself that faggot

got any links to alien armageddon for us?

>>5639445
Savescumming is not playing the game, it's torture. You're basically TASing the game at this point. I'd have more respect for you if you beat the game smoothly on lower diffculty.

>>5642398
Ion Maiden >>>> Dusk

>>5642328
Sorry, I like Blade Runner (both book and film), but haven't remembered anything about its music. Music in e2 is way better than e3.

>>5642394
Dunno, e3 maps are not that inventive as e1 maps - they all (except m1 and water level) follow the same scenario with the same set of actions and enemies (like battlelord sentry near after the final key card). But they do exactly what one expect from Build games (over Doom-engine games) - verticality, destructable environment, sub-water parts, moving puzzles and, the most important - real-life believable setting, that is well done on all e3 maps with a lot of details. Levels are packed with thematic content and always interconnected.

I mean, when this e3 came up half a year before Quake - all that was the first-time in FPSes and just on different level from Doom.

Finished e3, Farengeight map is okay, a bit weaker than others. Hotel map is one of the best. All the same stuff, as in bank/underground, just the hotel building id outstandingly well. Boss fight is dumb the same way as e1 and e2 bosses.

Overall a bit tired of Duke, going to switch to (one of) Descent or System Shock or Heretic or Hexen or Alien Resurrection for some time.

>>5642398
>Old game good
>New game bad

>>5636885
>Duke too sexist because a man trying to save women from aliens is wrong
>Lo Wang too racist because liberals think asian cultures are so stupid that any lighthearted depiction of them is just cruel mockery
Next, Caleb will be called Islamaphobic because the cultist enemies look and sound too much like Muslims

>>5643136
NOT
RETRO

Why do we split Build and Doom engine game threads? Can't we all have one continuous thread?

>>5643301
Despite Doom being the majority of the discussion in that thread, it actually is meant for retro FPS in general. In their OP they even have downloads for tons of different games, like all of the BUILD games, Lithtech, Serious Sam, etc.

>>5643301
doomfags are cancer and they only play one game

>>5643319
that thread has been containment for doom cancer since day one.

>>5643292
it's more retro than chinsey unity and kex shit at least

Holy shit that "lava poodle" secret at level16.

Anyway, in the recent few days I have replayed each level from Powerslave, barring level 20, several times from blank/pistolstart saves above.

What follows below is how I currently interprete the structure of its campaign.

There were 7 level designers (which is consistent with the endgame credits listing 6 (including Knutzen ALSO listed for "level design") as design team plus McNeely in "additional levels"). Maybe some of them level-designed by proxy of someone else, an implentor who actually did stuff at the editor (Knutzen and/or McNeely), but, regardless, at each given level it was entirely its corresponding designer calling the major shots, not implementor (of course, implementors themselves did design some levels of their own). The idea of "leveldesign by proxy" is lifted out of one of two McNeely's interviews who mentioned that SatQuake's secret levels originated from pretty much everyone on design team, while it was Knutzen and maybe someone else who actually got down and dirty with the editor in order to realize them in playable form.

Anyway, it seems like in contrast with Quake where level-designers were more or less not on the speaking terms, in Powerslave pretty much everyone influenced everyone, and trying to break down levels between the designers going from specific tropes and tells, will basically send you going round and round in circles. There are like basic repeating motives though. One guy, presumably, seemed adamand to make you overlook stuff by overwhelming and mialeading you. Another one seemed to be very interested in intentionally perverting and misusing tropes originated by others. Third one created levels that deliberately created an impression of being smarter than they really were in order to make you go in circles trying to "crack" them, when there was deliberately nothing to "crack" - thus devaluing and profanating work made by certain other designers.
(cont)

Playing picrelated, and it is pretty cool. Intro movie and the game itself has great music. Passed first two levels, and it feels like Hexen with better graphics and without retarded switches.

>>5643514
Intro: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HNu27Ytd8NU

>>5643503
(cont-d)
Anyway, what I currently see the breakdown to be is this:
level 00 ~ 09 ~ 15
level 01 ~ 04 ~ 11
level 02 ~ 10 ~ 14
level 03 ~ 08 ~ 13
level 05 ~ 17 ~ 19
level 06 ~ 07 ~ 18
level 12 ~ 16 ~ (presumably) 20

The 12~16~20 guy is presumably Brian McNeely (game director), the 06~07~18 guy is presumably Dominick Meissner (promoted from "Design Team" to "Stage Design" in console Powerslave, is also the originator and one of the actual implementors of the "dolls"), the 02~10~14 guy is the "profanator" mentioned above (02 is pretty much a caricature of presumably Meissner's levels, 14 - of presumably McNeely's), 00~09~15 is "trope subverter" mentioned above. Also, demo of 00 is played by presumably McNeely and not by its actual designer.

From this point onward, I concern myself further only with the last two strands of levels, 06~07~18 and 12~16~20 and their interrelations.

>>5642963
I think the only boss that was was obnoxious is the e1 boss, the other two while simplistic in how you fight them are at least engaging since you're constantly moving.

I like your impressions. Personally enjoyed ep3 more than 2 just due to the earlier missions and introducing those drones which are my least favorite enemy type, but 1 still remains the best episode overall to me.

bump

>>5643532
Overall mood in Witchaven is similar too Hexen, but levels are different. Dungeons are more like classic dungeons similar to Might and Magic 6 ones, maybe more dense and less sprawling. In Hexen dungeons are more varied and inventive. Here the first too levels are just a set of caves with almost no moving platforms or lifts. It is quite colorful at the same time - textures of water, lava and moss are bright. It looks more "fantasy-realistic" (less weird than Hexen, which is cool in its own way) and plays quite well.

>>5643851
E1 is the best hands down. But I was expecting the quality of levels to go down and was blown away by e3. For some reason e3 (the final ep of original duke) is more polished by e2. And e2 has the best music and some cool level ideas.

>>5644683
*is more polished than e2

>>5643503
All the credits list 3 level designers. You're making shit up and you're insane.

>>5644683
E3 is much worse than E2. Levels are shorter, they have almost zero novelty, maps don't even look like cities, except maybe LA rumble or Freeway. The whole episode was a rushed, unpolished afterthought, many maps were, according to people who own the betas, just multiplayer maps modified for single play use. Raw meat, Movie set, Tier drops, Rabid transit, Fahrenheit and Stadium were the worst offenders.

>>5644827
>many maps were, according to people who own the betas, just multiplayer maps modified for single play use

and that's a good thing

>>5644872
No. Multiplayer sucks.

>>5644883
The multiplayer orientation of maps, the fact that every single map in the game(s) should be playable in co-op and deathmatch, also defines how the maps play in single player.

For instance that's why the maps loop, are interconnected.

So, YOU suck.

>>5644824
Credits at the end of the actual game (see youtube):
Level Design - Paul Knutzen
Additional Levels - Brian McNeely
Additional Design - Paul Knutzen, Paul Lange, John van Deusen, Kurt Pfeifer, Dominick Meissner, Dane Emerson.
7 persons total.

Credits from ingame manual (replacementdocs) / mobygames:
Stage Design - Brian McNeely, Dominick Meissner, Paul Knutzen
Design Teak - Brian McNeely, Dominick Meissner, Ezra Dreisbach, Paul Knutzen, Paul Lange, Mark Coates, Jason Wiggin.

7 persons again - but these credits don't match the first ones.
First credits list as designers John van Deusen, Kurt Pfeifer, Dane Emerson, the second credits don't. At the same time second credits list as designers Ezra Dreisbach, Mark Coates and Jason Wiggin the first credits don't.
Ezta Dreisbach, however, in addition to being the author of Slavedriver engine for Saturn Powerslave/Quake/DukeNukem3D, in addition to having been quite vocal in interviews, made a bonus level for Saturn Duke, called Urea 51. There aren't any levels alike this in PC Powerslave. Which makes the second set of credits, the ones from the manual, suspicious.

There is another detail. The first set of credits, the actual in-game ones, list a person, who wrote said manual, Ted Somethingsomething if I am not mistaken. That person is not anyone mentioned above, and I don't think he appears anywhere else of note in said credits. What I think could happen is that that person could unwittingly slap Saturn version credits onto the PC version manual, and somehow nobody caught in that.

>>5644893
"Design" can be anything. There is a reason why it's another category.

Lo Wang is shit
>no memorable quotes
>it makes no sense for a zipperhead to make a hiroshima joke, it's as if an american protagonist said ''just like 9/11'' after blowing something up altough all ping pongs are self hating so maybe he just desperately wants to ged ''good shitskin'' points
>annoying voice
>his pervert persona is done in a way that makes him look disgusting, Duke had a Johnny Bravo charm going on, too bad he is circumcised like all retarded americans who want to be more like their israeli masters
>he is bald

>>5644896
I have already stated a possible reason behind it being another category: leveldesign by proxy. One person plans the level, extensively playtests it and provides feedback, another one actually implements whatever he's being told in editor.
Right now I am searching for the McNeely's and Dreisbach's interview where the former suggested that setup might have been the thing, in order to provide an exact quote.
Moreover, I have reasons to believe this sort of setup has also happened elsewhere. Willits' levels from Quake 1 bear more than a passing similarity to those of his sister from raven.wad, for example.

Also, the name of the person who made Powerslave manuals is Tom Kristensen.

>>5644921
YOU WA TINY DICK

>>5644896
Had interviews a bit mixed up. This is from Ezra Dreisbach, this interview:
www.gareth.uk/2010/08/07/interview-with-ezra-dreisbach-of-lobotomy-software/
>The exclusive secret levels were designed by the whole Quake team. They were actually built by the Quake Saturn level designer, Paul Knutzen

One definitely need to play Witchaven to fully understand, how cool is Hexen - how deep and polished it is comparing to similar games.

And also to understand how cool and advanced was the Build engine at the time (even the early incomplete version used in Witchaven). 640x480, free look, jump/duck/fly - all this released a month before Hexen and run on 486sx.

>>5644921
You are tiny grasshopper.

>>5644992
Except that's for another game. Made several years after. And just for a couple of levels. And even then it's obvious from what is said that "designed by everyone" mean most of them just threw in ideas. Most of DN3D's levels are probably designed by everyone the same way.

>leveldesign by proxy
Then why aren't they in "additional level design"? Several people are already listed several times in the credits.

You're just making stuff up to support your phantasy and back it up with interview "proof" which are you hearing what you mean to hear.

>>5645274
I feel completely at right to believe whatever the fuck I happen to fancy as long as it is not contradicted by facts currently known to me. Whether anyone else chooses to share my current convictions or not, is not of any concern whatsoever to me. They have their own heads, might as well use them to think for themselves for once. But I absolutely do not cosider my obligation to agree with anyone's, yours included, groundless convictions and beliefs ("obvious, uh-huh"), however strong one might _feeeeeeel_ about them.

I am trying to make what sense I can from a particular artistic work, called Powerslave (BUILD) and that includes throwing away nonsensical garbage. Which I currently believe I did as stated a bit earlier.

And Saturn Quake absolutely has "Additional Level Re-Design", with four people listed there, in its credits.

>>5645362
>facts

credits

>And Saturn Quake absolutely has "Additional Level Re-Design", with four people listed there, in its credits.

because it's from the interview they didn't all actually make the map and it was just everyone throwing ideas

so their "level design credits" consist in standing in front of the coffee and saying "hey wouldnt it be cool if this level had this thing"

>>5645371
Because you were obviously there, witnessing the whole thing. Or maybe it is rather a fantasy from your head. Which one is more likely, hmmmm.

Also
>The Saturn port has four exclusive levels named "Purgatorium", "Hell's Aerie", "The Coliseum" and "Watery Grave" replacing original secret levels.
kek.

>>5645371
And if the quote from the interview makes anything perfectly clear, it is that "designing" and "actually building" the levels could, in some contexts, be fairly distinct things in Lobotomy.

>>5644886
this, the maps being playable both on singleplayer and multiplayer is a sign of good level design because it means the experience won't be as linear

>>5642328
What track has a Blade Runner homage?

SEEKRET LEHVEL

>>5645942
Raw Meat's song is literally the Blade Runner ending theme.

>>5645659
Yet, they are ugly, short and uninspired. There is no sense of city in most of those maps. Levelord’s maps suck in general. Pigsty and XXX Stacy from E4 are also bad.

>>5646094
Or Shop n Bag. Boy, that outside looks so terrible.

>>5644921
does Lo Wang sound fucking japanese to you?

>>5646130
i thought lo wang was a title

>>5646094
>>5646095
>Pigsty
Mostly good.

>XXX Stacy
Below average/user level tier.

>Shop n Bag
Quite alright, but not the best.

If you want a really bad level from E4 it's Babeland.

>>5646181
I just beat ep4 and babeland was really one of the worst maps in duke overall, it took me alot longer than I'd like to admit to figure out I had to hit 2 specific targets to open the prize cabinet.

Alien Queen sucked too I legit thought I was doing the same part again getting the red key card since its almost an identical mirror of the blue side. The boss itself was annoying but probably one of the more mechanically engaging as a result of having to worry about air while fighting.

All in all ep4 is certainly the weakest, but I'm still glad it exists it was hilarious to see Duke shove a pipe bomb up her alien snatch and say time to abort your whole species. Going postal is probably my favorite level just for the section where you mow everyone down after getting the last keycard.

>>5644921
WHO WANT SOME WANG

>>5644993
One of the problems with Witchaven is weird "like on ice" movement (that one get used to after some time) and the jumping thaf is outright buggy - jumping when moving just doesn't work most of the times. It is not a big problem, because there are nof too much platfotming to begin with.

>>5646591
I think Dukeburger, Going Postal and Derelict are the only relevant maps in e4. Derelict got a lot of hate, but IMHO that was the only map in the episode that reminded me of the first two episodes, and their dukish atmosphere.

>>5646993
Passed 4 or 5 levels and the maps are more or less the same, mostly with "dark castle dungeon" textures. Going to play couple of mord maps to see if there some more diverse locations.

>>5644921
>no memorable quotes
OO I THINK MY DINGY HANGING OUT

bump

How do you do fellow cultists, there are 3 Blood source ports now, right? Is there a best one? I played Blood on DOSBox but I wanna switch to a port for Death Wish.

>>5644921
"JUST LIKE THE GOOD DAYS AFTER 9/11!"

>>5646171
Its an Chinese name

>>5628580
Anyone here tried to "pistolstart" level 20 (or its Sep'96 beta version)? What even the fuck IS this? Dude what?

>>5642398
>Pretending to hate ion maiden even though he's never played it
Go back to doomworld forums with the other try hard zoomers faggot you fool no one.

>>5650124
Addition: at least in case of beta version of level 20, loading is as a level other than 20 (that is renaming the un-GRP-ed map file from LVL20.MAP into, say, LVL19.MAP and loading it off a corresponding save file) seems to cancel the time limit.
Which means said time limit seems to be part of the game rather than part of the code, therefore this should work for the final version of level 20 as well.

>>5650478
>part of the game rather than part of the level itself

>>5650478
>(that is renaming the un-GRP/STUFF.DAT-ed map file from LVL20.MAP into, say, LVL19.MAP, placing said renamed file into the ingame folder (it overrules the corresponding map from STUFF.DAT), and loading it off a corresponding save file)

>>5628532
If we're REALLY lucky, he might actually get ousted from Gearbox (his employees fucking hate him), so we'll just have to see.

>>5645942
E3L1. It's like, completely spot on.

>>5643324
I play more games than you, fag.

Are there any "themes" you'd have liked to have seen for a Build game?

I'd like a western one, I know there's Outlaws (non Build) but it's not really got that feel.

>>5651014
Outlaws is so fucking goddamn ugly to look at.
I woulda loved something like Duke Nukem 3D filtered through spaghetti westerns.

>>5651014
Megastructure consisting of all the shittiest Duke userlevels mashed together and all riven, warped and bleeding into each other to the point of critical levels of rampant chtonic cosmic existential dread ensuing. And stuff.

>>5644921
Unlike Duke who is a power fantasy roid monster Lo Wang is actually relatable, so he has that going on for him.

Playing Out in DC, and quite liking it. Huge realistic maps, mostly pigs around, plenty of ammo. Three-door timed buttons on level 2 were absolute crap though (as most timed puzzles). Currently exploring FBI building.

>>5651014
I always tought the engine would be perfect for a cyberpunk RPG like Shadowrun. In first person.

>>5651403
It's not on Build, but please do play Cybermage (hard difficulty, keyboard-only, coming up with convenient key layout might require some tinkering, but is absolutely possible). It can honestly give any Build game a run for its money in terms of its level-design, even though the engine places visibly more restrictions upon said level-design, than Build does.

>>5651403
Also, 1) reading the manual is very much advised since the game has some quirks that may lead to you fucking it up (to name a few, 1) you are leveling up by collecting enemy souls, which disappear quickly, if you don't consistently do that you will be severely underleveled by midgame; 2) always patch up ammo pieces with good armor capacity before they fully break down, since they disappear for good in that case; 3) you learn new spells not in the least by subjecting yourself to what enemy casts at you, there are literally some spells only a handful of enemies cast, if you kill them having evaded that spell, you can miss out on the spell entirely (I don't remember whether all the spells have respective icons/spellbooks placed in the game, anyway, zapping yourself with enemy cast typically gives you access to the spell significantly earlier than finding the icon)). 2) Tutorial level is crap, and 1st level proper is so-so. Just jump into the game and get to level 2 asap, there it starts getting good. 3) Game director and main mapper was D.W.Bradley of Wizardry 6/7 fame, and Cybermage is by far his most polished, least janky, most accessible game, as has by far the most intricate level layouts of his. There are occasional crappy level parts though (including tutorial), Harvey Smith (yes, that one, of Deus Ex 1-2 and Dishonored 1-2), you see. 4) Don't use melee. Ever.

>>5652326
Actually, my harping on Harvey might be unwarranted, as per mobygames, there were 4 level-designers on the game. Regardless, some episodes, namely, in midgame, are fairly obnoxious.
I really oughtta give this game a second look, tell you what.

>>5652335
Last one, sorry, somewhat scatterbrained currently.
>4 level-designers
4 JUST designers, which I ASSUME includes level layouting, since there is no distinct "level design" category in credits (as per mobygames).

>>5629872
>xbox1 controller
wtf is wrong with you man?

Beta version of Level 20. Can't be completed blindly, at least from blankstart. Requires you to find everything you can, in order to have enough resources to proceed further, but on a strict time limit, which makes you likelier to miss stuff due to haste. By replaying you optimize your routes and actions, while also finding stuff you overlooked previously.

Seems to be a part of a sort of an exchange that goes something like that.

Beta of Level 20 (presumably, McNeely, game director) - "As a principal author of this game, I have a better idea of what this game is all about - if anything - than anyone else ever will".
Level 7 (presumably, Meissner) - "Don't remember asking you jack in regard to that particular question. I am here pursuing my own interests, and that does not NECESSARILY include indulging your AMA sessions"
Final version of Level 20 (presumably, McNeely) - "Oh yeah? Sweetie, I outrank you. Maybe you should start asking that question riiiight about now." (adds reactors).

That having been said, the last move is ungraceful and is, whatchamacallit, bad form?

>>5653543
Also, that is the core idea of PC Powerslave as a whole, that the author of the game has better understanding of the idea behind his game, than the player ever will.

Would Duke E3 be better regarded if they had just joined some consecutive levels into bigger levels? Imagine E3L1 joined to E3L2 into one level, for example. Remember, the justifiably well-regarded E1 has only 6 levels, but some of them are huge. That helps give a sense of epic adventure. Maybe if E3 was reworked to join some consecutive levels into a smaller number of larger levels, it would be more satisfying.

>>5651393
Duke out in DC is not as cool as it could be.

Levels have very nice maps, but the gameplay design on these maps is lacking. In vanilla e1 there is a strong feeling of progression on each level. DC levels are pretty anemic - they are just huge (and with great planning) maps, that are empty except some monsters here and there. Some killed civilians, or st least some notes on level could have created much better atmosphere.

Finished Smithsonian, very good map, but besides being mostly empty, it has super-retarded puzzle with switches hidden inside the pools.

>>5656874
Smithsonian is, on its surface, basically an enhanced remake of the very first Travis' usermap, Beta One, with bits of Aztec and Beta Two spliced there as well. It lacks the twist from Beta One though, so it's not a straight up remake, and rather a deliberately created similarity. Oceanarium area is seemingly lifted/enhanced from Beta One, but in that map it was completely optional and braindead, while here the twist is exactly the puzzle you mentioned, which catches you offguard where, if you are acquainted with the source material, you would least expect it.

>>5651279
>AWW CHING CHONG PING WING MY EGGRORR FARR OUT HAHA
>relatable
We don't cotton to strange Chinaman with no sense of self who stand secretly by for indeterminate amounts of time. Gonna put you in a world of hurt.

>>5651014
80s-90s urban anime, City Hunter, Riding Bean / Gunsmith Cats, that kind of thing

On the subject of Mystery of Colored Dots.
LVL0 has tile 70 (deep red) and tile 71 (lightest blue).
LVL1, LVL2 and LVL4 have tile 67 (light orange).
LVL3 has tile 68 (orange proper) and tile 75 (penultimate blue).
LVL5 has tile 71.

>>5658609
That concerns Powerslave.
The list is not exhaustive.
In LVL0 the second kind of dots appears underwater.
LVL1 has dots near two torches shortly before you drop down a wide square shaft.
LVL2 has dots in the optional hallway with poison vials.
LVL3 has one kind of dots on the spitting faces in main courtyard, another kind of dots immediately before magmatis appears.
LVL4 has dots in the lava maze.
LVL5 has dots on the spitting faces in the middle part of the level (the block/switches maze).

>>5658621
I'll also add, that, yes, I am pushing my narrative here, but if Knutzen is the guy who designed LVL14 and/or LVL2 and/or LVL10, then the whole issue with Inconsistency of Color Dot Appearance could simply be pretty much deliberate mindfuckery on his part.

>>5658646
Meaning, I'll NEEDLESSLY elaborate, three aforementioned levels are basically trololo levels, build just so that to fuck up players, trying to complete them in a certain specific ways.
LVL14 is built to fuck up players which try visiting everywhere and finding every secret by interpreting the clues scattered around the level correctly.
LVL2 is built to fuck up players which try to determine optimal developer-intended route through the level.
LVL10 is built to fuck up players which try to devise an ABSOLUTELY PERFECT solution to the puzzle it presents (the puzzle itself is quite good, but it is made to appear smarter than it actually is).

All three cosplay adding up, coherently, to some semblance of sense, but fall apart quite spectacularly on a really close inspection.

The bottom line I currently think is something along the lines of "Oh, you imagined it all along, silly", gaslighting of sorts.

Anyway, point is, these dots (and other related "effector" sprites or whatever those things are called), at least, in some levels, could just be that kind of thing.

>>5656874
>In vanilla e1 there is a strong feeling of progression on each level.
LA Meltdown is such a magic episode. Despite having limited assets, the maps are incredibly relatable, polished, and the whole episode felt like an adventure. It has that typical Duke feel unmistakable with any other games.

It's so sad they never made any other episodes with the same atmosphere. All other episodes have their flaws. There are some levels with LA Meltdown vibes (Lunar Reactor, Dark Side, Freeway, Derelict, Golden Carnage), but they are few and far between.

The episodic progression never returned in Duke, and in fact in other Build games. The closest thing was No Rest for the Living in Doom, which was a very well built adventurous mapset, but it didn't have the variety of the Build Engine/Duke.

>2 weeks left of Q2 and still not a word on the release

>>5658434
>casually pointing his gun at his own head
wtf is this dude doing

>>5660801
Agreed. LA Meltdown was by far the best episode of Duke. The level to level consistency is so strong, like you say, there's an actual adventure and story being told through the level designs themselves, it feels like something is actually being accomplished.
That was entirely lost in Duke after Episode 2, Episode 3 and 4 are totally disjointed. Kind of a shame that a lot of work seemed to have gone into Episode 2, but the annoying enemies and less relatable setting made for a poor fit with Duke.

Also, I've never played Freeway I played this game back in 1999 for the first time, never beat it, went back and replayed episode 1 a bunch of times. Did a playthrough of all 5 episodes this year, but missed it. I should probably play it.

>>5661594
>2 days prior to the Jewish Maiden lawsuit the launch trailer was being worked on
the game was probably going to be shown at the PC e3 show and everything went to shit and now we're likely looking at a delay.

>>5629043
It has its own engin. Also, it is for 3DO.

>>5628583
it is definitely building platforming does work in It is definitely building platforming does work in buildings in games. It is definitely build engine. platforming does work in build eningn games. Even in Duke3d there are maps with plenty of spelunking. E1m5

>>5628719
If hexen can have a hub world I don't see why a build engine game can't

>>5629872
>Also the game is not as easy as Doom E1
The first three Doom episodes are very easy with modern controls (keep in mind it was meant to be played on cursor arrows).
Duke is more difficult but not too much. But there is almost no tactics in Duke, just shoot and run. You can't avoid most projectiles.
I find Build games quite sloppy overall. They're fun, hilarious, interactive, but sloppy and often frustrating. Doom reigns supreme IMO.

>>5661661
>Jewish Maiden lawsuit
It's a bunch of greedy boomer rockers. They used to be really REALLY good in the 80s but it's long gone.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9qbRHY1l0vc

>>5661657
E2 did suffer from dragging, and some annoying levels, but it was the closest thing to E1's aesthetics and atmosphere. Spaceport, Lunar Reactor and Dark Side are amazing, and worthy sequels to E1, I'm in the minority, but I like Fusion Station as well, and even Occupied Territory a bit, although that is quite annoying and hard for a mid-episode level. I think all Levelord levels in E2 sucked, also Tiberius Station and the pathetic Overlord.

E3 felt like "OK, we have 1 month left until the deadline, let's make another episode, city might be a good theme". There were some good parts there, I loved LA Rumble for example, but many levels like Movie Set felt like something that were made in 2 days. Also, the episode is very short, most levels play shorter than 6-7 minutes, and they don't have any novelties, no new enemies (other than the weak shark), no new effects, etc. Also the episode terribly missed a level like Death Row, Abyss or Dark Side. A long epical journey to satisfy and challenge the player.

E4 is absolutely terrible and aged very poorly. The aesthetics is totally different, and it felt disjointed from start to finish, with most maps being just glued from previous, unfinished works. I'm in the minority, but I love Derelict, the only genuine Duke style level there which reminded me the second half of LA Meltdown. It had flaws, like the annoying door sound or the mandatory lightning damage, but the good overweighs the bad here.

Alien World Order... the less said is the better. It had zero soul, zero effort. Levelord showed again he is not a good leveldesigner, in fact, never was. Blum was much better, the famous Mirage Barrage and Golden Carnage levels rocked, but he also put zero effort to the other 2, High Times for example could have been much better given the Amsterdam theme.

Compare all these to Doom and episodes like No Rest for the Living or Sigil. They were made with passion and care, expanding the original limits with keeping the style.

>ctrl+f
>strife
>0 matches

This board is shit.

>>5661813
>strife
>Build engine

>>5648476
Following levels are not really diverse, but a fun to play except the one-shot spike pits. Also there is a great idea, that if you don't want to backtrack the whole level for the key to the final room - you can jusf use "open door" spell that always work.

>>5661809
I don't hate E4, but it's pretty uneven in style and quality for sure.
I think the last three levels are pretty good, as they feel a bit more like a cohesive adventure, with Derelict being the best part by far (and I think it's actually one of the best official Duke maps).
It's like a long and oppressive dungeon crawl, but on board a cargo freighter infested with alien horrors.

Babeland is my least favorite of them, I kinda hate that level actually.

>>5628841
The ps1 version is really different from the pc version

>>5633470
Polaris is good and you will love Dark Side

>>5661809
Hate Derelict, but I like Shop-N-Bag. I don't hate E4, but it is the weakest of the classics, there's nothing holding it together and nothing that really stands out.
Totally with you on LA Rumble, definitely one of my favorite levels in the entire game, and definitely the best one in E3.

>>5636108
If you are playing episode 2 of duke3d for the first time in 2019 you are absolutely a newb to fps.

>>5636108
>I am playing it on Piece of Cake with a lot of saving
>I am not a newbie in FPSes by any means
Pick one and only one.

>>5636885
The unfortunate truth is the following:
1: most people havent already played or seen a shareware of blood so they are naturally drawn to something "new" in their mind
2: blood is generally better from a spectator perspective, weapon and enemy animations are more exaggerated and visually attractive to the kind of people who watch youtubers play through old dos FPS games, or are getting their info about the game from webms, say.
3: since the game came out later, after duke3d, the engine was improved a bit by then, and people's computers were better, so there were less map limitations. The game no longer had to run on a 486. Minimum requirements were higher. So this allowed more detail in the official levels. Believe me, the movie theater in e1m1 of duke would have more than 3 rows of seats if the game was allowed to run on more than a toaster. For levels that push sector limits and wall limits look up ROCH maps for duke3d. All city maps that are so overfilled with shit it runs awful on my pentium 3 550 dos machine and I had to play it on my phenom II under eduke. But the level of detail is incredible, in a "I didn't know the engine could do this" sort of way. my point being that the original my point being that the original developers level designers made sacrifices so that all maps in the game would run smoothly on common hardware of the time

>>5639130
It's right there at the top of the image you illiterate tranny tripfag attention whore. Congress had just passed the communications decency act. Games like Duke were the main targets.

>>5639857
Holy shit you dumb fucking zoomer stop playing it on your fucking phone and if you really want this shit to matter to you then you need to fucking play it on a pc. I don't care if Its fucking eduke i dont care id its fucking jduke or whatever fucking source port you use but you are still too far gone with some input lag filled emulation fest on your android device.

>>5641438
No.
it's not that good anyway

>>5642394
Honestly if you don't think flood zone is one of the best achievements of humanity in 1990s you're retarded

What's the best way to play Duke3d these days? I'd like it as close as possible to the original experience, but I wouldn't sneer at better mouse look support

>playing Blood for the first time
>hitscan enemies that have the drop on you instantly
>have to pie corners like it's friggen Rainbow Six
>lotsa backpedalling, trying to rambo your way without a powerup is suicide

Game's cool and all, but this is not the high speed low drag power fantasy I was expecting.

>>5663597
>have to pie corners like it's friggen Rainbow Six

This is why I like it, I like that decisive tactical feel.

>>5663597
Try playing from third-person.

>>5662036
Ok, just it is hard to call fps-noob someone, who played Doom2 and Unreal Tournament on release.

>>5662039
I am playing without the mouse and Duke is not an easy game to be played that way.

I first played half life in 2011, are you going to call me a fps newbie too?

>>5662087
How it would be different, if I setup Dosbox and xbox1 controllef on my necro-laptop? Why bluetooth in windows will have different input lag than in android?

I don't need sourceports for original campaign - it runs in 800x600 and controls are remappable in dosbox. And dosbox (and other emulators) are way more polished on Android than on windows.

Got to Top Secret level in DC and quite like it - big enough warehouse and a time machine device that teleported me to some pyramid.

>>5663597
Caleb can carry a golfbag of powerful weapons and lots of ammo for each, and he's really agile and fast, but yeah, he doesn't take a lot of punishment.
You need to use speed and quick thinking to avoid being killed.

>>5663761
Kinda agree. I do like the idea of realistic elements juxtaposed with very fantastical and exaggerated fictional ones.
Makes me wish there was more games which took after the deliberate tactical play of games like SWAT and Rainbow Six, but in a setting where you fight all kinds of horrible supernatural monsters.

>>5664521
sounds like you'd like hideous destructor

>>5664540
I've been interested in it, but frankly I'm kind of intimidated by all the numerous binds.

>>5628532
>https://www.gamescenes.org/2009/11/interview-tobias-bernstrup-and-palle-torsson-museum-meltdown-1996.html

Download here:
>http://www.bernstrup.com/meltdown/old/download.html

Duke is pure art. Never heard of this before, gonna give it a shot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xh4m8KD5wsI

Is there any way to improve performance in BuildGDX, in particular the framerate?

>>5663597
blood is a pleb filter for people who aren't actually good at video games and have an iq below 100. Anyone with experience playing games will know how to manage their resources and be cautious while exploring levels. The game isn't even challenging unless you pitchfork start well done.

>>5664469
I've never played it any other way. Got it when it came out, I've tried with a mouse and it's a steaming pile with a mouse. The angles of the looking up make me sick as it skews everything. My first FPS with a mouse was Quake 1. This was after starting on the original Wolf3d as my first fps.

>>5665095
Maybe if you're coming into it some 20 years after it's release. When it came out, it was quite fun. At the time we had Duke3d and Shadow Warrior. Shadow Warrior was a parody of itself and the gameplay and level design was super repetitive and boring. Duke3d, by that time we had all beaten 2-3x and were looking for something new. It had great sound, graphics were pretty awesome, and being a horror film geek, it had all that fun referencing and nostalgia that people find appealing in things like Futurama. Every single poster, spoken line, etc. was reference to some horror film or action film. Just like Duke3d was for Action films referencing pop culture of the time galore.

Blood 2...that's another story. That was a steaming pile for sure, but we're here to talk about build engine, so Blood 2 is right-out. Blood you have to play in the time period it came out. Much like many of these games, you lose the "holy shit" that you had at that time. We weren't jaded by better graphics, tighter game play, or anything like that people have now. Seeing streams of blood shoot out of a character or their head come flying off was new and exciting. It was gorey, the guns felt more real than previous Build games, and it required a bit more caution. The later levels got tedious and generally boring, and you can tell they got bored stretching it out due to repeating themes and generally a lack of anything interesting later on, but overall in it's time, it was a GREAT game. Still have the Blood and Bloodless versions on CD-rom somewhere around here. Being in modern times, and not having lived in that time, I could see your point. It's a pretty shite game if you have played games since then. It's far better than Shadow Warrior, and equal to Duke3d imo.

>>5663597

Blood wasn't even particularly hard for a 90s shooter. I had more trouble with Doom 2.

Blood is just Spook Nukem

>>5665609
Isn't it great?

Blood is just a mediocre Duke Nukem TC.

>>5665990
yes as is gook nukem