/vr/ - Retro Games

Not really

Shinra = Western military industrial complex (CEO is evil white man)
Mako = energy dense resources created from dead living beings (oil and gas)
Sephiroth - Pyscho White man with crazy agenda who goes on killing sprees (like mass shooters)
Cloud = Reluctant blondie hero (White man's burden to save the world)
Aerith = prostitute roastie with heart of goad (Women who sleeps with many men are good waifus)
Tifa = strong independent womyn who can kick ass (feminist ideal)

>>5571328
>Tifa
>independent
Easiest way to spot someone who never played the game.

Not really but at the same time yes.
Mako was their stand in for none renewable energy.
Before Mako it seams they used coal(lol)Barrets home town was coal mining town. After in AC Barret calls Cloud and says he struck oil.
Going in to to the overall message about "killing the planet". It does fall flat, When the coal and oil run out they will go back to using Mako. Cloud and crew are not going to live forever and someone else will revive Shinras plans and reactors.

Red XIII = Native Americans/Aboriginals/Noble Savage
Barret = Ghetto Black male caricature
Vincent = Emo culture
Cait Sith = Military drones

>>5571329
I played it from start to finish.

>>5571280
Not even close.

>>5571280
You destroy the planet by removing it instead of by using it in a way that pollutes the planet, so no.

There are simularities, but I'd say Shinra's first president is about as far as the ExxonMobil similarities go, being similar to a president of that. When Rufus comes in it's someone like Saif al-Islam Gaddafi.

>>5571329
I wouldn't be surprised if they made Aerith more towards that way in the remake, but not Tifa.

>>5571280
No, oil is oil in FF7. Barret literally strikes oil in AC and they use it as a replacement for Mako. Barret also used to be coal miner and his hometown went to shit when they changed to mako.


I don't think it had a deliberate environmentalist stance, but since the game is Japanese nuclear energy would be the closest thing they're demonizing.


Shinra is a fascist military industrial regime, not just a corp.

>>5571334
>Going in to to the overall message about "killing the planet". It does fall flat, When the coal and oil run out they will go back to using Mako. Cloud and crew are not going to live forever and someone else will revive Shinras plans and reactors.
It makes sense that this would happen but we see Midgar and Red XIII 500 years later and it didn't happen.

One of the big differences between Mako in FFVII's fictional world and gas/oil in our world is that Mako is literally using the planets spirit/life energy. Both oil & Mako harm the planet but one is obviously worse for life on the planet than the other.

>>5571328
>>5571337
You're really looking for something to be mad about, aren't you?

>>5571343
Because Square has such a big track record of doing that. Give criticism where it's due; stop being cynical and snarky about everything/

Half the Final Fantasy games are about how they can't use magic anymore at the end of the game....the final fantasy.

Gaia theory was in vogue in the 90s

>>5571359
I don't think the use of Materia is hurting the planet, unless I missed something.

>>5571365
That seems to be the case as of AC, and why only the bad guys use Materia. In the Reunion book they say Yuffie just collects Materia for fun.

>>5571357
>You're really looking for something to be mad about, aren't you?
I'm just interpreting the game with a contemporary viewpoint.

It’s nuclear power, idiots. Japan is full of retards that oppose it.

>>5571340
ive never heard someone say this before when saying that they actually played the game so no one believes you bro. better like next time 2/10 bait

>>5571617
>Anon hadn't played the game because he said he played the game.

You're a funny guy.

>>5571475
Considering what happened in Fukushima around 8 years ago I can't really blame them. Same with Ukrainians and Chernobyl. As convenient as nuclear energy is and how little chance there is things might go wrong there's still that small possibility. I don't think you'd want that to happen where you live.

>>5571659
Fukushima came after FF7.

>>5571659
>literally nuked them twice
>It WAs tHe pOwER pLanTs

>>5571357
>500 years later
The implacation being that the planet wiped out humans.
We see Midgar covered in vegitation and abandoned. Edge was bult next to it yet even in AC that is gone as well. My bet, someone else used Mako and the planet took mesures in to its own hands this time. WEAPON i bet.

>>5571659
This is the "school shootings gun control" argument. Isolated tragedies do not beat statistics. They're retarded.

>>5571328
>>5571280
Except the civilization in the game had gas and oil before Mako came. It isn't an allegory or anything, it literally the planet's life blood as explicitly laid out in the game.

Somebody should cast Holy

It's no wonder you people think FFVII is overrated.

>>5572108
No, you're wrong, my silly 50-hour anime adventure has to have some deeper meaning, otherwise I wasted my time :(

>>5571280
no, shinra is supposed to represent America/the white devil. characters like hojo represent eastern collaborators. There are some undertones in the story that suggest sympathy/admiration for the axis powers. Wutai being oppressed by shinra corp is a clue. Lots of small details mirror the developer's thoughts about the 20th century

>>5571280
Whatever political context the game had is totally lost once they leave Midgar anyway.

The Midgar areas are a pretty clear metaphor for pollution and peak oil but it falls apart afterward.

It's a shame environmentalism has become a partisan thing. It's made media terrified of environmentalist messages, whereas in the 90s TV shows and movies pushed the message to the point of being preachy.

>>5571328
based brainlet /pol/tard

>>5572305
The deeper meaning is finding acceptance in death.

>>5572656
No you fucking dumbass it's about how capitalism destroys the environment, stupid fucking westerners ruin everything

>>5572736
As opposed to communism and everything else every tried?

>>5572256
/thread

>>5571337
Was there mainstream emo culture in 1997?

>>5572740
Communism has never been tried. Can you name somewhere where the workers have ever owned the means of production? Protip: you can't.

>>5571337
Barret is Mr. T.

>>5572736
That wouldn't be true. Industrialization and technology with a mass population is a detriment to other life and themselves no matter the economic model.

>>5572868
probably not what we call emo today.
But 1997 was right at the turning point for the actual "emo" culture.
My friends in college were all heavily into the emo rock movement and this was 1998-1999

>>5572873
No true Scotsman is a fallacy. Also, every single independent nation that has called itself "communist" isn't communist? /x/ is the board you're looking for, bro

>>5572736
You're retarded. No matter how angry you get, you'll still be dumber than a sack of empty sacks.

>>5572873
Jonestown was a nice commune. For a while.

>>5571328
This is kind of a dumb surface-level analysis because FFVII ultimately is a conservative narrative against globalism, big government/business, and the abandonment of tradition.

>>5572873
Lol you’re acting like the industrial hellscape of Soviet Russia was positive for the environment lmao

>>5571328

Why can /pol/fags only think in the context of their own narrow retard political gripes.

>Zoah = Sega
>Priesthood = arrogant execs
>Empire = Sony
>Paet = The game's creator who lost faith in the priesthood and left before collapse.
>Edge = Sega's hope that Azel Saga would save the Saturn, doomed from the start.

>>5572926
Ma nigga

>>5571280
Just a reminder that Barret is based on Mr T you dumb fucking Zoomers.

>>5572102
>Meteors hitting Earth are isolated incidents. They statistically don't cause mass extinctions!

>>5572873

>>5572438
>Wutai being oppressed by shinra corp
They aren't being oppressed though. They were presumably at war because Wutai was in the way of Reactor construction. There's literally zero Shinra presence in Wutai for them to be 'oppressed'.

>>5573212
I think it's a narrative against humanity in general. In the ending, it's implied the humans all died out. The only survivor from the party was Red XIII. Even destroying the meteor and Shinra wasn't enough to stop humanity from destroying itself. Destroying Shinra "restored tradition" but it wasn't any better than Shinra in essence. They probably returned to using coal, which would've caused global warming. That would explain why the temperate Midgard turned into a tropical jungle.

It's a common theme in other story-heavy FF games as well. If anything, it's their narrative that's simplistic. They imply that certain groups of people are 100% evil, irredeemable, and must be killed off. In FF7, everyone suffered collective punishment for Shinra ass-raping the planet for Mako.

>>5572873
that's the point... it's impossible, or at least implausible, to try. Communism is the equivalent of your career-plan being winning the lottery.

>>5573897
jej but true

>>5573897
The people who support communism are the same people who would never help other people or do any form of charity. Their common excuse is that their individual contribution has no impact. Multiply this by a hundred million and it's easy to see why this shit would never ever work.

>>5572615
Well not to get to off topic about it. But that is mostly 27/7 news fault.
Because you have black science man running on the news every few years a going
>WE ALL GONNA DIE UNLESS YOU STOP USING PLASTIC BAGS
People have been hearing variations of that line for 15 years now. People tune it all out, so it provides an opening for partizan politcs. None of them have the balls to stand up to the real problem. China.
Even so called environmentalists wont give up their Iphones and all the cheap plastic we get from chinas smoke stack factorys.
The way things are looking the issue has become so emotnal for the whole world that nothing will ever be done about it. All thanks to black science man and the rest of the shitters looking to shill books.

>>5572873
wouldn't that be like everyone has a factory in every home, but what would the prices and competition be like then in that case scenario, that would be a case for bartering i believe than? no? or am i thinking too much.

>>5573906
Modern commies are just students. Starbucks cup in one hand IPhone in the other.
They are sold a lie mostly by their teachers in class. They all think they will be the top dog if communism ever comes. That what it boils down to if you speak to any of them. They all want to be the Pol Pot or the Mao. You know so they can go around and have shit for free by stealing from people under the moral pretext of "it is the peoples money".

>>5573604
Dumb japs, Mr. T was long irrelevant by the time the game came out.

>>5572656
Yeah, it is about "everything is going to end someday".
It also is about "being yourself" , you can see it in the final battle in cloud mind when he win against the naked sephirot(his dream about being a soldier).

>>5572108
>It isn't an allegory or anything, it literally the planet's life blood as explicitly laid out in the game.
I mean, ok, I don't like a=x b=y interpretations either, but that's a very suggestive concept and is delved upon a lot in the game.

>>5573921
I don't think that's the idea, and in fact would be some kinda ultra libertarian (american sense) utopia.

>>5572102
If anything, the fact that this kinda argument worked for what is really the cleanest/cost effective resource for energy currently available is pretty sad (willing to be it's also about oil capital holding it down but that would need a bit of research wouldn't it)

>>5572954
Emo was late 80s to mid 90s. Wtf are you talking about?

>>5571358
Thing is though that in all Square's history, they haven't done a remake at this size before yet. We really don't know what they're capable of, because changing character's personalities is all in the translator's hands. Most new dialog was either a situation when TOSE tacked-on some stuff to a port or Slattery fluffed out the script.

The only thing we can really compare it to is FFIII DS because it gave the characters a personality at all. Even IV used most of the original dialog, and the switch in format to a more action based game may mean that there are more script rewrites than you'd think.

>>5574303
The context is the word MAINSTREAM

>>5574016
Well yeah that's the idea. If you're just stealing ideas for your own story it doesn't need to be a current reference. In fact it's probably better if it isn't.

>>5574016
I pity the fool who thinks Mr. T will ever stop being a household name.

Wait wait... エリス was a prostitute?

>>5574140
Well least it was subtle with its arguments. Unlike games made today.

>>5574598
Dunno if this is a cultural misunderstanding or what. Does 花売 have a similar connotation to 花魁 or something?

>>5572736
People may not like your post but you are the most based poster in this thread. The shitty living conditions for those who live in midgar are really the result of absolute open free market Capitalism, which it in of itself doesn't have any incentive for business owners and corporations(like Shinra) to ever seek a more eco-friendly source of energy and fuel, not only that but the game even shows the strong divide of the upper and lower class and wage slavery. Everyone who disagrees is a capitalist cuck.

>>5576006
Marx was never an environmentalist.

>>5576006
Being eco-friendly is an aspect of free market economics, mongoloid

>>5576437
>tfw the fascists were the only ones to ever care about Nature

>>5572736
>it's not the jews of midgar
nice try shlomo

>>5574786
Is the subtlety mostly in translation though? Even post-SNES translations would often tone down some themes.

>>5576437
Being "eco-friendly" is not an exclusive to free market economics or really to any sort of system. There are eco-capitalist as well as eco-socialist that believe that expanding of the present capitalist system actually is responsible for environmental degradation (which in the context of FF7 is actually true). Some alternative renewable sources of energy are simply voided being used because they're not profitable in the first place. The priority within a free market is not to be eco-friendly unless it actually becomes profitable and upholds the current system of affairs.

>>5576676
>having an ideology is the same as practicing it
Start by naming 1 communist country that has ever been eco-friendly.

>>5576676
If something is not profitable it is de facto not eco friendly.

Take US ethanol requirements. A ton of our corn crop is converted into ethanol to supplement gasoline. This makes the gasoline less efficient and increases wear on cars and required a new generation of seals and fuel lines.

The adoption of this led directly to the Arab spring and food riots in several countries because it spiked the price of food so high.

People died.

It was also literally a loss for the economy. If you spent one barrel of Petro energy growing corn in this way, you only got .8 of a barrel out. It only functioned at all through government subsidies. We were in a long recession forever because of the inflation this caused. We were burning trillions of dollars a year trying to get ethanol gas to work. We finally got it up to 1.2 barrels last I checked, which still isnt great but at least it's not automatically a loss.

Other stupid shit: plastic bag bans, plastic straw bans.

It's illegal to give away a disposable plastic bag that costs approximately nothing to make. Instead you need to reuse a bag that clutters up your house or car and gets nasty and needs to be replaced and costs like $5-15.

The plastic bags disintegrated in a few weeks of uv light because they are so thin. And most people bagged them up and took them to be recycled anyway with the rest of their thin plastic recycling.

Now I cant find anywhere to do thin plastic recycling for all the thin plastics I still get from shipping. I got all the nasty reusable bags that are moldy and made of durable material and very thick plastic and linings bonded to it and shit. Now I need to throw those away, and they cant be recycled because the plastic liner doesnt separate and it's a ton more waste from all this fabric and shit.

But if you ask a san Francisco eco faggot he will tell you they are saving the planet.

>>5576736
>US ethanol requirements
-weren't done purely for environmentalist reasons.
Related to that: look at tetraethyl lead and just how long it took for the harm it was doing to become accepted as fact.

>>5576609
From what i have seen. No it was not even in your face in jap. The eco themes were there, but nothing i have seen from snippets of dialog go full
>STOP KILLIN THE REAL EARTH BUY A PRIUS AL GORE IS GOD
Even when i expected it the most like in Cosmo Canyon.

>>5576784
Certainly. If anything it was just a fig leaf to put on the money they were forking over to the corn lobby.

>>5573894
I feel like that’s a rather black-and-white interpretation. Ultimately humanity’s connection with nature possibly saves them from utter annihilation through the Lifeforce.
I wouldn’t say they survived the catastrophe but I wouldn’t say it’s set in stone they didn’t either.

>>5576736
>Other stupid shit: plastic bag bans, plastic straw bans.

Nothing about that is stupid. Proliferation of one use plastics is one of the main things causing massive environmental destruction and for no really good reason.

>>5576676
Yeah, I didn't think you could do even this >>5576693 dumbfuck.

>>5578353
No. We are not fucking China dumping all of our bags into the ocean.

They go in the landfill or in the recycling. Either way is fine. They are SO CHEAP that it is better for the environment than the cost to produce any other container.

You think that reusable bag grows on trees? Look at how much it costs. Look at the cost of a barrel of oil. Its called the Petro dollar for a reason. Convert the cost and cost to a percentage of the barrel of oil. Convert that to carbon dioxide. Sell that on the carbon market. This is a good approximation of environmental damage done considering the most factors, for example production cost, transportation costs.

Okay now take a plastic bag. Oh wait it costs approximately nothing.

>>5571340
Before or after you learned of the item trick? I don't how many days I spent playing leveling up. I still haven't beat that faggot Ruby Weapon

You forgot the part where AVALANCHE is an eco-terrorist group and killed thousands when they bombed the reactor at the beginning of the game. And Cloud did it all for 150 gil.

Although the game actually calls Barrett out on it.

It would be cool if everytime someone drilled for oil the planet would retaliate by creating giant mutated bioweapons
Kinda funny that you kill the gods in every game but you're supposed to feel pathos with the planet as it actively tries to stifle and kill you at every turn

>>5571329
Ironic post. Canon Tifa is nowhere near the meek bimbo fanon makes her out to be.