/vr/ - Retro Games

The Playstation, obviously, though the N64 did more for FPS.

>>5131872
playstation and pc.
>>5131881
> though the N64 did more for FPS
zoomer faggotry, ladies and gentlemen.

Considering video games today are shit, this is a tricky question for console warriors.
Do YOU want your favorite childhood system to be the one that influenced today's bullshit?
Iono, console warriors. Pick carefuly.

>>5131872
These kinds of questions are sort of pointless, no offense meant, it's kind of like asking what's better, Chevy or Ford, at this point the industry is so thoroughly established asking where the lynch pin lies becomes an exercise in futility, no matter what I try to argue for in favor of one the other doubled down on, franchises, licenses, multiplayer, variety of genres, graphics, stories, it really comes down to, you guessed it, developers, developers, developers. I think that the joystick on N64 is a bigger step in the right direction then the 4 shoulder buttons on the PS1, then realize that the 64 has 6 buttons on the face, plus the 3 triggers, so both had expanded the input, and you could buy a PS1 controller with analog joysticks, 2 in fact, the only distinction is that the system wasn't built with that particularly in mind for the consumer, meaning games for the PS1 weren't developed with the joystick in mind whereas for the 64 it was a necessary component. It's really impossible to say which has had the larger impact, maybe just to say that Sony proved Nintendo wasn't the only company with staying power in the video game hardware industry, however both Sony and Microsoft were already huge hardware companies when they began producing consoles, then again Nintendo has been around since the 19th century, see? There's nothing to be said, the case for both is strong.

>>5131872
What kind of question is this? PSX... the N64 had very little to do to change the scope of the industry today outside of maybe the analog stick.

>>5131938
> tl;dr: nonsense about controllers
oh cmon m8. that has absolutely nothing to do with anything.

>>5131872
Eh, the Playstation didn't really do much beyond being the first dedicated CD based console to really take off with the public but if Sony didn't play the role then the Saturn would've done the job just fine, and neither of those consoles' libraries did anything that wasn't already well established territory from the previous gen.

As for the 64, the only thing it did was make Nintendo rely primarily on their own IPs instead of that of 3rd party developers', a philosophy which they never really shook off (largely due to the fandom they cultivated around said IPs). Sure, they relied on them with the 3rd and 4th gen as well but not for the sole sake of survival like they did in the 5th gen onwards.

Really, the 5th gen was more or less guided by general technological advancement while gaming stayed largely stagnant compared to it's evolution in the 4th gen as developers tried desperately to figure out designing games with a 3rd dimension. I suppose analogue sticks in controllers, Sony doing well to recognize the gaming audience was "maturing", and the 64 putting a greater consumer focus on local multiplayer with more than 2 players.
>>5131883
>PC
Could you go into detail on that? To the best of my knowledge PC gaming didn't cause much of a shift in the industry as a whole beyond FPSes and genres that weren't exactly hugely popular with the general public at the time.
>>5131905
Don't be a dense memer, the issues with modern gaming stem from a shift in focus towards mobile gaming which in turn led to the era of microtransactions, increasingly expensive development costs, and of course corporate consolidation which has led to the biggest 3rd party publishers churning out increasingly bland and poorly made shit that normies have been conditioned to eat.

>>5131959
>To the best of my knowledge PC gaming didn't cause much of a shift in the industry
online multiplayer

>>5131948
probably, the only thing that can be said for certain is that with the analog movement of the joystick for the N64 evolving into the motion tracking of the Wii it becomes obvious Nintendo was anticipating the VR market for a long time, of course the VirtuaBoy or what ever is evidence of that and VR has been a technological talking point for about the better part of a century, the real power of innovation may lie strictly in its ease of use, if a child can understand it, I think in that realm Nintendo has a much stronger grasp on design and accessibility.

>>5131959
>Could you go into detail on that?
errr..
>what is doom?
>what is duke nukem 3d?
>what is wolfenstein?
>what is unreal tournament?
>what is online multiplayer?
i could go on and on for hours.

>>5131963
the wiimote was a poorly executed gimmick that was so poor in terms of accuracy that nintendo and third parties developed fixes for it to improve it. their innovation is based on other people's ideas and usually stolen. don't forget that nintendo were sued and lost.
https://au.ign.com/articles/2017/09/01/jury-rules-against-nintendo-in-wii-remote-lawsuit

>>5131959
>PC gaming
PC gaming is all about showcasing hardware, graphics, sound, autonomous units, massive scales, and as >>5131960 pointed out online multiplayer, the personal computer is the benchmark of consumer technology, what the capabilities are and so on, strictly speaking of gaming there are the FPS and RTS developments that PC gamers have always been devoted to (Starcraft, anyone?) Computer hardware and software engineers have an infinite amount of potential projects to imagine that aren't limited to games, when those well-tailored games are presented however, the entire community takes notice, in essence they have consolidated their holdings, literally, gaming has effectively been removed from PC hardware and transplanted onto console platforms, there isn't much the PS4 isn't capable of, VG developers can concentrate their efforts exclusively to these machines, the dissemination is becoming ever more rapid, smartphones with their specialized applications, everything, and who's to say there isn't infinitely more artistic resonance in a well constructed computer program than in a Shakespeare sonnet or a Beethoven opera?

I think the PS1 influenced console design and thinking, the way consoles would be marketed and whom that marketing would be directed. Since the PS1, console form factors and controllers have become increasingly homogenous for Microsoft vs Sony, with some of Nintendos controllers (like the GC) becoming something in the middle.

I think the n64s influence is less tangible. I thinK it's LIBRARY was the influence, and I believe that the games that people experienced on the N64 influenced their purchasing decisions on future titles. I think the number of original titles created specifically for the N64 speaks to the fact that developers were trying to do something different and novel, and that this created a very positive influence and may be what kept Nintendo bringing third party games to their systems and intead of focusing more heavily on their own IPs, as well as investing time in creating new ones like Pikmin for the later consoles. I really do think the games on N64 were very inspiring to game developers and showed that a lot was possible, even with its limitations.

>>5131883
Give credit where it is due. Saying the N64 did less than the Playstation for FPS is the true sign of a deteriorating mind. And op never even asked about PC, ya lil' projecting prattler.

>>5131940
>outside of maybe the analog stick
that was the most important change that gen lol. It was essential for 3D games, especially platformers, to the extent that Sony had to reissue their controllers. N64 was the real system that pushed 3D games forward with shit like Mario 64 and Zelda OoT. PSX early "3D" games had shit like MGS and Crash Bandicoot and you can see the limitation in their vision and game design. They were essentially 2D games with 2D controls that just happened to be in 3D. Imagine if N64 wasn't there that gen, the entire generation would have been filled with shit like that, made for the original Saturn and Playstation classic controllers.

You are a gigantic fucking idiot my dude and you will literally never know how stupid you are. Have a good day though.

>>5132049
Also almost every single 3D third person action/adventure game today owes something to Mario 64 and Zelda OoT.

>>5132049
And of course the DPad is now entirely a thing of the past for everything that's not 2D/Fighter.

>>5131872
>Which system influenced more the evolution of gaming towards what it is today?

PSX

>What would be different if either had never existed?

If the greedy sony psychos would never have entered the console business, we would still have Arcades, SEGA would still be doing consoles, there would be no fucking XBOX, in short gaming would be pretty enjoyable still in the year 2018. And consoles would still be consoles.

>>5131872
PlayStation and PC.

How is this even a question?

>>5131959
>Don't be a dense memer
You say this, while replying to OP seriously. Come on.

>>5131872
Playstation is what made third party developers shine. Many multi-million dollar IPs today wouldn't exist without it.

>>5132526
If it wasn't on PS, they would have made them for other systems.

>>5131883
You are just going to completely ignore that Goldeneye helped popularize FPS games?
I think you're the fag.

>>5132662
With respects as to what set the standard for console FPS games to come Medal of Honor is vastly more influential.

>>5132049
Can’t really argue with that, but I’d argue PSX also really influenced pop culture more, as it really rocketed games into the mainstream and was the first co sole that added that “cinematic” experience that games today focus more on.

Not necessarily good things, but influential all the same.

>>5131881
>the N64 did more for FPS.
did literally nothing for FPS

The PS saw the invention of modern gamepad FPS controls, while N64 had derp controls but a cool mission select in Goldeneye, the one thing that could influense future FPS's but sadly didn't

>>5132692
Holy shit, imagine being this delusional. Nobody gave a fuck about Medal of Honor dude, it didn't influence shit -- infact, the devs even said they were influenced by Goldeneye when making the game. For better or worse, Goldeneye basically set the bar for shooters on consoles, and introduced a number of mechanics never seen before that have since become industry staples. Please stop being an absolute fucking retard.

>>5132049
>>5132058
>>5132067
Whew, that was some of the best rage directed towards me that I have ever seen on this board in awhile. You forgot to mention the part where Sony made it easy for third parties to work with them on their system unlike your favorite video company who were notorious for fucking with third party companys, popularized some genres that were failing in the US with the help of some of those companies like Square/FFVII, pushed an image that caught on with bigger crowds that helped make video games more mainstream while this was the first gen where Nintendo began to decline.

I know the truth hurts my fellow Marioboy, and I see you have been upset about this for quite some time. Let me go get your diapers and your Switch, and I come on over and let you cry on my shoulder as you are quite troubled over Sony's fifth gen win almost 20 years later.

>>5131872
>it's another Sony ponies dogpile N64 out of penis envy episode
Fact: the N64, despite selling 1/3 as many units and being on the market for much less time, was vastly more influential than the PS1 in every way except making multimedia features standard on home consoles. Super Mario 64 was the frist game to get open world 3D right, Ocarina of Time introduced mechanics like refined z-targeting that are still in use by games, goldeneye influenced every shooter made after it, the console made splitscreen and local multiplayer popular, popularized the use of analog, and gave birth to series like Smash and Mario Party which have become cultural phenomenons.

You know what the PS1 had? 3D games that were still stuck in the same 80s and early 90s 2D design mindset. Crash was basically just a 2D platformer, FF7 did absolutely nothing the 2D FF games didnt do minus better graphics, MGS only had an impact on the stealth genre which is currently dead, and that's about as far as the influences go. It was a popular console because it was cheap, had lots of games and good brand visibility, but that's all. It just didn't leave the same kind of footprint that the N64 did

>>5134078
I also prefer the N64, but MGS had impact on a lot more than just the stealth genre. It was the first well known cinematic game.

>>5131872
Playstation.
The N64 is a joke and embarrassing overall outside of Super Mario 64.

>>5134636
You don't like stuff like Sin and Punishment or Goemon?

>>5134637
He's a contrarian who never touched a N64 controller other than the demo station at Best Buy when he was 9.

>>5134643
No one who didn't grow up with an N64 gets any enjoyment out of it. I really envy you guys who has that sweet stockholm syndrome tucking you in at night.

>>5134668
I grew up with 3rd and 4th gen mostly and am grateful for it.
But during 5th gen, I had 3DO (at first), PS, N64, Saturn and PC.
If anything, being a single-system peasants is what's not letting you appreciate anything outside of the Shovelware Station.

>>5134668
zoomer cancer: 100% ignored

The N64 controller, weird as it was, set the foundation for modern controls with the rumble pack, the analog stick and the C buttons which could be used as a right-hand D-pad for camera/movement. It took Sony a couple years to update their knock-off SNES controllers with the DualShock, which basically just streamlined Nintendo's initial design.

Gamewise, OoT set the foundation for adventure/exploration games that went on to influencing sandbox games from GTA to Minecraft. GoldenEye, clunky as it was, showed devs the enormous demand for quickboot, party-style FPS games in a way PC FPSes never could.

PS1's biggest games are arguably less relevant than N64's now. MGS and RE are really the only two that I think have some lasting mainstream influence, since classic JRPGs are more or less niche again.

>>5134668
I didn't grow up with one and at best I'm disinterested in most of the library. Despite that I can still enjoy a lot of games for it.

It feels like half of this board only experienced 5 games on a single console as a child and somehow thinks their experience encompasses the entirety of retro gaming. If you think any major consoles "has no good games" you're willfully ignorant and should shut up.

>>5134732

>>5134732

>this is unironically what nintentoddlers believe

I bet you have a Switch too.

>>5134732
> terrible crash and burn controller
> "it lead the way"
sure it did buddy

>>5134732
>The N64 controller, weird as it was, set the foundation for modern controls with the rumble pack, the analog stick and the C buttons which could be used as a right-hand D-pad for camera/movement. It took Sony a couple years to update their knock-off SNES controllers with the DualShock, which basically just streamlined Nintendo's initial design.
The design of the Dualshock was totally different, it just happened to also have analog controls.
>Gamewise, OoT set the foundation for adventure/exploration games that went on to influencing sandbox games from GTA to Minecraft
That's fucking insane.
>GoldenEye, clunky as it was, showed devs the enormous demand for quickboot, party-style FPS games in a way PC FPSes never could.
What? Goldeneye certainly was innovative/influential, but deathmatch was already a thing since Doom and was already "quickboot" and "party style".

>>5131881
Medal of Honor on N64 was good game

>>5131872
>Which system influenced more the evolution of gaming towards what it is today?
Each was unique, and in a way they were for different markets.

PSX offered RPGs like never before seen and many great single player games that were more serious in nature.

N64 offered many multiplayer "party" games. Very few "serious" games in the big picture, but it certainly made an impact with its market as well.

I think that a better way to look at it, is that Nintendo is more or less its own invention. PSX was interested in selling a video game console, while nintendo was more about selling video games it made, and 3rd party signed up because it was nintendo and was a guaranteed stable market.

I think looking at how later systems were directly influenced by their predecessor. I don't think that PS2 drew too much from N64, just like the Gamecube did not get too much from the PSX.

My opinion: Nintendo makes its own products, which just happen to plug into a monitor. Sony wanted as much of the market as possible, and seemed to be driven by hatred of Nintendo, and it worked out for them. They were both "video game systems" but were so different that comparing them is almost impossible.

>>5131938
>it's kind of like asking what's better, Chevy or Ford
This is the simple truth of the matter.

>>5131883
>GoldenEye
>Perfect Dark
>Doom64
>Hexen
Opinion discarded.
Before N64, FPS only really existed on PC, which was the exclusive domain of neckbeard PC fags.

>>5135307
>just like the Gamecube did not get too much from the PSX.
Except ya know, Sony changing console gaming forever with the dual analog sticks.

Every system since the PS1 has just tried to be the new PS1, so PS1. Even though I’d rather play Mario 64 or OOT than any PS1 game today.

>>5135343
No need to hate pc fags. I was primarily a PC fag and played wolf3d, doom and clones, duke3d, descent (which gets mentioned too infrequently among classic fps's) and quake. Despite this, i had so much fun with goldeneye and perfect dark back in the day, it was clear they were novel and a step forward in fps gameplay. They weren't 'better' than eg quake, they were just a different genre being created.

>>5131938
>These kinds of questions are sort of pointless, no offense meant, it's kind of like asking what's better, Chevy or Ford
Or you could just look at facts and see that one sold 3 times the units, had 7 times the games, created the modern gamepad standard and the idea of a games console as a multimedia machine. But you like Zelda, I get it.

>>5135372
Not him but, the ps had 7 times the games but arguably none were singularly as popular as n64's best. Mario64 is notable as massivly pushing forward modern 3d platforming and goldeneye was a massive phenomenon basically defining console fps. I don't like zelda so can't really comment on it.

As to the OP's question re which was more influential on today, it's impossible to say since they were both huge influences.

>>5134072
lol, imagine someone thinking Medal of Honor games were influential. They were also all on PC, there's no reason to play them now.

>>5134072
lol, imagine someone thinking Medal of Honor games were influential. They were also all on PC, there's no reason to play them on PS now unless you like shitty graphics.

>>5135343
>Before N64, FPS only really existed on PC
Before the N64 the FPS genre was essentially just Doom, and it was ported to every console known to man.

Heck, before the N64 was released, Descent was already ported to the PS1 with essentially modern FPS controls, just using the face buttons in lieu of sticks.

>>5135456
>Descent was already ported to the PS1
i didn't realize this but i can't believe the controls were any good. even mouse&keyboard kind of suffer, a sidewinder joystick or dual-stick controls make it so much better

Anon, i'm not sure you remember correctly. goldeneye was a 1997 release, by which time there was a huge amount of FPS games on PC in many flavors not just 'doom clones'.

>>5135353
>Sony changing console gaming forever with the dual analog sticks.
I can't argue that, but by the same token, they were put in the dumbest place. Xbox got it right...I just don't like the thumb-stick layout. I think that sort of design was coming one way or another. N64 had the c buttons that were moving toward that idea in the some of the 3d games.

However, Goldeneye did make use of dual analog sticks (2 controllers), and to get technical, you could have enjoyed dual analog gameplay on the N64 before it was an option on the PSX.

>>5131872
This is though because this generation of gaming hasn't age very well.

Console wise, the N64 gave us four controller ports, making it the king of local multiplayer, the PSX had the CD format, making games like Final Fantasy 7 possible, and taking Nintendo's 3rd Party support as well. PSX also gave us memory cards to save our games. N64 has the expansion pak which helped make some games playable, but that's it.

Controller wise, I think the N64 controller had a bigger impact, even if it is an abomination. Even if PSX came before, the Dual Shock probably wouldn't have happened without the N64 controller and the games associated with it. And before people bitch, the Dual Shock came out in 1997. Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time helped showcase what the controller could do, and camera control as well. Something people forget, the N64 controller introduced the Rumble Pak and the feature of rumble when it was bundled with Star Fox 64, making rumble a mainstay in gaming. So I say the N64 controller was more impactful, with Mario 64 and camera controls, OOT and Z targeting, and Star Fox 64 and rumble.

In terms of game library, PSX takes it hands down, N64 is limited with no 3rd party games, just mainly Nintendo and Rareware games. The Playstation consoles have the most diverse libraries of games, so it helped the PSX by having all types of games for anybody.

Going back to both systems, both N64 and PSX have games that have aged terribly, it was the fact that it was the generation that went from 2D to 3D. At the end of the day, I say the N64 did more for the industry, the PSX brought a lot to the table with the Dual Shock, CD format and memory cards, but the N64 had camera control, Z targeting, four player multiplayer, and rumble. It's obvious that because of Nintendo and the N64, Sony was able to say fuck you to the company that screwed them and influenced them to create the Playstation.

>>5135970
One last point: PSX had Final Fantasy 7, N64 had Super Mario 64. One game changed a series, the other changed the landscape of the gaming industry.

>>5132662
>Goldeneye helped popularize FPS games
ahahahahahahahHAHAHAHhahahahAHa

>>5136139
Are you alright anon?

>>5134072
no normie even played a fps until halo, get over it
also medal of honor for psx was fine, fuck off

>>5136139
It did for console kiddies who never played games on a PC, even today most people play their FPS on Xbone or PS4

>>5136260
Doom was the normie introduction to FPS. If you were an adult not into kiddie games the 486 at work had doom on it.

>>5136381
doom sold way less then the halo
I've never meet a doom fan irl but plenty of halo babbies, even girls
halo is the normie shooter and the one who popularized the genre, nobody played doom unless they were onto fps, gamers knew it existed but refer to it more as a tech demo than a game

>>5136459
>thinking people actually payed for Doom
my sweet zoomer child

>>5136523
>thinking people actually played doom
I found it pre-installed on my first pc but after 5 minutes I quitted and never reopened it again as a kid not really into fps
also halo 1 had a pc release and torrents were already a thing, so the pirating argument is stupid af
no saying halo is better than doom, but it's probably more normie-friendly

>>5131872
Playstation.
>Proper FMV use
>Controller standardizing
>Library with tons of pioneers and series starts
>The beginning of games shifting away from Nintendo, less censorship.
>Depth of field settings (Spyro)
>Bringing Roguelikes to normies (Azure Dreams, Chocobo's Dungeon), resulting in the current roguelike/lite boom.
>JRPG evolution

If it was gone, I really don't know if the Saturn would claim some of this fame or not. But the N64 would most likely have been the more popoular console of the era, resulting in less FMVs. Controllers would probably take more cues from the Saturn's setup.

>>5135972
>PSX had Final Fantasy 7, N64 had Super Mario 64. One game changed a series, the other changed the landscape of the gaming industry.
I wouldn't call FF7 THAT influential but okay

>>5134074
everything you've said is crap and not really an argument lol
>marioboy
I haven't owned a nintendo console since the N64 and I also owned a PSX. you're the fanboy here my dude

>>5136883
That Anon was talking about Mario 64 being the influential one

>>5131872
Umm... Playstation.

There's nothing on the current market like the N64.

>>5136883
Well as someone who didn't have a PSX at the time, it was the game associated with Sony and Playstation, so I found it to be a key reason as to why the PSX was so successful.

>>5136893
I think that both FF7 and SM64 are pretty influential, I just think that Super Mario 64 was more influential.

>>5134732
somebody post that pic

>>5131872
Honestly, N64 imo. One of the biggest selling points was multiplayer and people saw that there was money to be had. There are games being released now with no single player whatsoever for the same reason. LAN parties were a bigger influence and massive improvements in internet speed and availability played a bigger role in that development but that's not what you asked. N64 had much wider accesability compared to dragging your custom built 100lb pc tower and tube monitor around.

>>5135385
Medal of Honor and Medal of Honor Underground are Playstation exclusive to this day.

>>5135970
>N64 is limited with no 3rd party games
Turok did pretty well, and some cult classics did pop up. Granted there was a total library of 400 games. Ogre battle 64 was outstanding, and certainly was on par with Final Fantasy Tactics. Rogue Squadron was good. It also had the best port of NBA Hangtime on any system.

>>5138143
what's /vr/ opinion on those?
I remember the former being the first fps I enjoyed (I tried doom before but never liked the gameplay and the sci-fi/horror theme) and the latter a lot of fun with splitscreen multiplayer

>>5135970
I agree mostly, but Ocarina didn't invent the targeting system. Other games like Mega Man Legends had it earlier, and that probably wasn't the first. Yoshiaki Koizumi putting it in OoT just popularized it (and probably improved it too).

>>5140249
Legend's "lock on" doesn't really work like OOT's Z-target, at all.
OOT was really the first to include a visible lock on that lets you move around your enemy and is not just an auto-aim feature (which is what Legend's lock-on really is, same with Tomb Raider, something that Doom already had).
OOT's target system went on to influence games like Devil May Cry and Demon's Souls, where you can target an enemy and move around it, as if you had a rope atached to the enemy.

>>5140417
lock-on is for peasants though