/vr/ - Retro Games

>>4983470
the shape of the pixels is ultimately determined by the combination of console with TV. asking if a console outputs square pixels is meaningless.

>>4983476
Came to post something like this.
/thread

>>4983476
But each system puts out a series of lines (in NTSC, it's typically about 480 active / visible non-interlaced ones), each containing a certain number of dots (what would today be thought of as pixels).

My question is whether any of them put out a complete picture that, on its own, yielded an X/Y ratio equal to 4:3.

>>4983491
And just in case you require even more pedantry, a 4:3 was the widely standard display aspect ratio for consumer television sets between 1950 and 1999.

>>4983491
and my answer is it depends on your TV settings. if you don't like that answer, then the genesis is an example of a system that outputs 240 lines with 320 pixels each, whatever that means to you

>>4983504
Assume that I own a mainstream consumer television that was made after the year 2006. What then?

>>4983507
check your horizontal and vertical size adjustments, break out a ruler, and you tell me. if you don't have those on your TV, then you are at the mercy of whatever was calibrated at the factory and the drift since then.

>>4983509
I ran all the standard tests and confirmed I have a precisely uniform grid of square pixels on-screen. What /vr/ consoles can I use that would fit evenly into that grid?

I think only the NES and SNES outputted rectangular pixels.

>>4983517
In addition, I modified the television firmware to disable any internal upscaling, resizing, or other forms of picture manipulation beyond the initial analog-to-digital conversion.

It's a dumb "zoomer" question since aspect ratio isn't fixed on analog displays but its answer is still yes. Both PS1 and Saturn render in 320x240 on most games and there are additional earlier cases like Master System outputting PAL

>>4983526
>Both PS1 and Saturn render in 320x240 on most games

Are you sure it's not just 360x240 squeezed to 4:3 by the CRT?

>>4983539
320x240 was pretty much the standard, though some PS1 games also use 320x224 and 320x220. There's also a widescreen resolution, as well as a "high def" mode, which is used by a handful of games (Chrono Cross uses it for the menu screen).

>>4983723
For fixed square-pixel (aka digital) displays, BT.601 recommends a resolution of 720x480 for typical 525-line NTSC signals with 858 samples per line at 13.5 MHz. That picture is then squeezed to a 4:3 aspect via 8:9 PAR. If you instead prefer the SIF standard of 704x480, it's a 10:11 PAR.

Regardless of which it is, PS1 and Saturn both adhere to a standard of non-square pixels.

It always annoys me when I see CPS2 games with the fat aspect ratio. I understand that it maps a bit better to widescreen displays with square pixels, but the games were meant to be in 4:3

>>4983768
It's acceptable if using a screen with a low resolution. If playing on say, a 3DS, then you either go 16:9 or skip pixels which looks horrible.

>>4983723
>320x240 was pretty much the standard, though some PS1 games also use 320x224 and 320x220

You have a lot of confusion.

>>4983470
Yes. They all did. You just needed to adjust the h/v size knobs on your TV until it displayed they that way.
kids. lol

>>4983723
PS1 and Saturn games use all kinds of wacky horizontal resolutions. Somewhere around 352 is quite common, the crash bandicoots and others (tekken i think) use 512, SOTN is only 256 etc.

>>4983496
Still butthurt about that widescreen bomberman game Hudson made in 1993 and only showcased on conventions because few TVs used that aspect ratio at all.

>>4985267
I'd give my left nut to be able to play Hi-Ten on an HDM-3830.