/vr/ - Retro Games

>Perfect Dark
Bad example. Should've used Doom, Doom II, Quake, Quake II, Quake III, Half-Life, Duke 3D, etc. but not a console only shooter.

>>486580
b-but muh multiplayer

>>486676
All those games (excluding Quake III) have great singleplayer. I'm guessing you're that one Perfect Dark fanboy who is obsessed with it and dislikes competitive shooters since you suck at them?

Whatever generic war shooter that is is more than likely better than Perfect Dark anyway.
The only acceptable console FPS for then would be Timesplitters.

>>486647
What is that 1998 map from?

>>486736
I'm thinking maybe Half-Life since I recall seeing an image similar to that in a guide for it as a kid, but I may be wrong.

>>486710
Actually, OP is a completely different anon. I'm quite surprised to see this thread.

But happy. Perfect Dark is the best FPS ever made. The fact it's for the N64 in no way diminishes its brilliance.

Perfect Dark > Half Life

>>486571
Halo and Xbox happened.

The genre lost variety.

>>486781
Sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of 20fps 640x480. Oh wait, it ran at an even lower resolution.

>>486781
>The fact it's for the N64 in no way diminishes its brilliance
Except for the parts where it controls like ass and runs at 4 FPS, sure.

>>486782
What makes you say that?

>>486781
>Is Perfect Dark a good game
Yes
>Is it one of the best FPS ever made?
No
>Is it one of the best CONSOLE FPS ever made?
Yes

Here is your answer.

>>486802
Halo started the simplification of the genere, and the Xbox spreaded that simplification like a disease, CoD was just the end result.

>>486810
Simplification in what way? Are we talking about Mutliplayer or Singleplayer here?

>>486807
Now that I agree with. It's fun but still not one of the best FPS. Was a bit too slow paced and the framerate really got in the way.

>>486819
Kinda both. Halo didn't really require any amazing techniques in either MP or SP, seemed too simple. It's fun but kind of mindless fun, you just play with friends so you can crash into people with the warthogs, etc.

>>486819
Singleplayer.

It reduced the difficulty and added regenerating shields (a step to regenerating health) to make the game playable with a gamepad, i'm not trying to make console FPS look bad, but they always do that on the console versions of classic FPS (see PSX Doom for example), it also gave us a more linear level design, with cutscenes in the middle, all that was the basis for the bastardization of the genere.

But i have to admit, the multiplayer is kinda fun.

>>486782
I don't think Halo itself caused it, Halo was a pretty solid game with good single player and broken multiplayer. Most modern FPS games only focus on multiplayer with very uninspired action-movie like single player.

You might be able to say Halo 2 caused it though, as it had more emphasis on cutscenes and more linear levels and no health packs, and huge emphasis on the multiplayer.

>>486847
There is regenerating health in PSX version of Doom? Or is it only on a certain difficulty? I haven't seen my health regenerate, but the levels have been changed a bit.

>>486859
I didn't say that there was regenerating health on PSX Doom, but there was less monsters, and the projectiles are slower compared to the PC version, Doom 64 also had reduced difficulty, but it compensated it with some really neat level design.

>>486847
wait, what? since when did PSX Doom have health regen? sorry if i misread your post but...what?

>>486812
How is being slow paced a bad thing?

And people have no excuse to keep bringing up framerate and controls when the game has a polished Xbox 360 port on XBLA.

Perfect Dark has never been equaled as a FPS game when you take all the individual parts and regard them as a whole. People who think Quake is better as a singleplayer FPS in my opinion are using some sort of kooky John Carmack "B-B-But I want to shoot shit! Why do I have to wander around doing objectives?" logic.

I guess I'm alone here but in my opinion FPSes are perfect made for multiplayer.
I still play counter-strike 1.6, gives me the adrenaline rush in a tight situation.

>>486852
On another note, back in Halo's day World War 2 shooters were very popular, and many of them had heavy emphasis on cinematic scenes in the single player, one of those series was Call of Duty, but it wasn't completely dumbed down until Call of Duty 2 which came after Halo 2's release and popularity, and the first one came out 3 years after Halo.

Someone else here.

Conceptually, I can't think of any other game that did so many things right like PD.

>Fuckload of weapons
>Each weapon has an alternate mode
>Multiplayer is customizable as fuck
>Excellent single player
>Objectives and even your role in single player may change, depending on the difficulty
>Co-op and counter-op
>Dat music

Yeah, it had that FR issue, but I can say that while it does slow down, it has never gotten unplayable to me. I played it about a week ago.

>>486883
There is nothing wrong with various objective or one simple objective.

Not enough attention to detail and no willingness to do realistic gore. Also no difficulty anymore, literally linear map design and enemies you can just run past.

The most important thing in a FPS is that the guns feel awesome. Everything else is secondary but sadly nobody seems to be aware of that.

They also seem afraid of everyday scenarios because of all the mass shootings in America. It always has to be either sci-fi or war. That gets boring fast.

Probably been posted here: FPS games now are just shovelware to feed the kids and teens whose parents will buy them endlessly.

>>486913
We need more shooters like Postal 2 (Postal 3 sucked, so that doesn't count).

>>486883
Quake 2 had mission objectives though...

>>486937
Postal 2 was fucking awful. It's fucking infinitely worse than even the most generic "I want to be CoD4 too guys" FPS released today.

Half Life happened.

I miss when single player campaigns had a compelling plot.
I also really miss arena shooters - deathmatches in Quake II/III and Unreal were insane fun, the sheer twitchiness and rapid pace of arena shooters is something we're never gonna see again as far as people keep buying into the HURR DURR SO GRITTY SO REALISTIC IM A FUXIN COMMANDO TUHRORRIST SLAYER games.

>>486958
You just don't understand it...

>>486936
In Quake you didn't have to kill brown people.

Because everything was brown.

>>486958
Postal 2 is definitely fucking awful, I do not disagree but I would still rather play it than any generic contemporary war shooter. Postal 2 at least makes you laugh a few times and you can piss on people. That alone makes it more entertaining than most mainstream titles out there today.

But I'm probably the wrong guy for this comparison because I'd rather play some shitty flash game in my web browser than CoD. I tried playing that shit once because I wanted to know what all the fuss was about and it's fucking painful and frustratingly dull. It's so bad, I'd rather do nothing and stare at a wall than play that shit.

>>486958
From a gameplay standpoint Postal 2 was fucking good! Sure, the writers tried a bit hard on being edgy at times, but the game was fun, regardless.

>>486987
Doom 2 was also brown, all textures are brown, the new enemies are all brown, i prefer to call it Brown II, Brown on Earth.

>>486982
Except nothing about those games is realistic
That's like saying Rambo is realistic

>>486947
Haven't played Q2 in a while. Weren't its objectives just "go here, kill this"? There was no story to speak of. Even Half Life, based on Quake 2, has a paper thin story used as an excuse to move from A to B killing everything which moves.

Games like Goldeneye and Perfect Dark were designed from an entirely different mindset, by a team with little understanding of how an FPS game was "supposed" to be. They copied rail shooters and Mario 64, not Quake. They gave you objectives like "obtain disguise and infiltrate laboratory" instead of "KILL X, PRESS BUTTON."

And while Halo was a good game, it's sad how Xbox owners thought it was innovative. It didn't do all that much. And PC gamers had used dual weapons in Marathon. N64 gamers in Perfect Dark/Goldeneye.

>>486736
It's part of the map of Half-Life, stretching from around Blast Pit to Questionable Ethics.

I repeat, that's a small part of the map. The whole thing is ten times the size of the image.

>>486571

I get it if CoD isn't your thing but I think the hate is a bit misdirected. The Call of Duty games themselves are well made games by talented teams of developers. Yes, the gameplay is similar year after year but the games are still well made regardless.

Arma II and all the mods out for it are pretty damn awesome.

>>486997
You're an idiot.

I actually enjoy playing some newer FPS games just casually to unwind and have some mindless fun. I also play lots of Quake 2 and some Quake Live and enjoy them more "seriously."

I wish Call of Duty and similar games put more effort into making interesting, new gameplay rather than releasing the same thing every year, but I don't think they are actually terrible games.

>>486987
>>486997
Pic related is Quake's color palette. Blood (and by extension, Voxlap games like Ace of Spades) is even worse, with over half of the palette being shades of brown.

>>487108
Here's Doom's palette for comparison.

>>487121
How many browns do you really need? Brown is not that versatile a color.

>>487129
I understand what Doom's palette looks like and what it is, doesn't make you said any less stupid.

>>487141
The best part is that they only actually use 10 of those lines (at least one line is always set to fullbright IIRC). Literally every enemy in the game except those fucking slime things is textured using nothing but red and brown.

>>487167
You're not even talking to the same person.

Also, it would not be hyperbole at all to say that many of the maps and models in Quake are textured entirely with shades of brown and gray.

Consoles made them slower and smaller.

>>486847
Tribes was the first fps with regeneration, not halo. Get your head outta your ass.

>>487191
Also the shaggoths

>>487064

> Yes, the gameplay is similar year after year but the games are still well made regardless.

It doesn't take much effort to reuse a lot of same assets the previous games had. And even with that, you can tell the games are running EXTREMELY thin on their recipe. Sad fact - CoD has practically become the staple in which other FPS games try to run themselves off of, and all for the fact that "It's what makes money." anyone who tries to push a different formula gets shitcanned awfully fast.

At least in Halo, you had big giant areas, and nifty enemy AI, cool vehicle segments, good music. Still doesn't touch Marathon though.

>>487224
And Halo was a ripoff of Tribes.

>>487226
I mean shamblers

>>487254
Did they have any real color though? I remember them being just brown and off-white with a bit of red.

>>487239

I agree that the formula is wearing thin. I'm just saying I think the hate is misdirected. I understand the argument that the "CoD machine" is hurting the industry as a whole but the games themselves are still made by talented teams. I would love to see what Treyarch could do with an original IP as they're my preferred CoD team.

>>487278
I think Treyarch really wants to do something different with CoD, but Activision forces them to do the same game every two years.

>>487317

>>487029
>>486736
Troll map. The actual map isn't nearly as fancy as that image leads you to believe. It plays more like the 2004 map and looks like this.

>>487317
And here is the actual map comparison image.

I think one of the problems with video games today is how expensive it is to make them. Companies don't wanna go bankrupt, and they know people will spend their money on the same shit as last year with a different name.

>>487296
They tried to experiment a little with Black Ops, but from what I can tell Activision forced them to tone it down so it'd be more accessible.

>>487278

> Talented teams

You should've just said Treyarch from the beginning. After what happened to Infinity Ward post CoD 4, Treyarch has brought a different feel to the CoD series. But still, I wish they'd put their efforts into something different altogether, like a new IP.

>>486647
Can anybody figure out what the 2004 map is?

From the first map I assume it's part of HL2, but I can't say for sure.

>>487223
>Implying consoles made FPS maps smaller.

Some of Perfect Dark's maps are huge. With no load breaks anywhere in sight. That's what you get when you build your own engine instead of using anything based on Quake.

It wasn't until CD-based systems became dominant that maps started shrinking, split up by load breaks, etc. Look at Quake and Half Life, though. The map design is nice, depending on map - but the loading is constant. The limitation was the Quake engine, not PCs or consoles.

>>487364
You act like they have a choice.
>>487382
You haven't played Bioshock Infinite.

>>487382
Final Fantasy 13 is. But that's an RPG.

>>487345
No map actually is like the right part anyway.

>>487345

I've always hated this image.

The map on the left is real. The map on the right is not. It would be fine if people on 4chan knew how to joke, but some people have passed off that image as gospel.

>>487382
Bullshit
>Modern Warfare 2
>Story mission on Estate
>turn a corner, get in house, defend, run out house, win map

>>487317
http://www.steam-france.fr/captures/autres/Black_Mesa_Research_Facility_HL_Map.jpg

Here's the map -- which I originally asked about.

Halo and Casuals happened.

Why is this confusing to you?

>>487382
Gears of War, Max Payne, Halo Reach...

>>487435
Halo Reach isn`t anywhere close, neither is Max Payne (except the cutscenes part). Haven`t played GoW, so I don`t know if it applies to that.

>>487382
Medal of Honor 2010 and Warfighter.

>>487451
>Haven`t played GoW, so I don`t know if it applies to that.
It does. But a little more like the 2004 map from
>>486647
Except no branches anywhere.

>>487401
>>487451
It's a troll for a reason. It compares a detailed map of a single stage to a simple map of an entire game. Which is why I said Half-life PLAYS like the 2004 map. Read the posts!

>>487389
> You haven't played Bioshock Infinite.

>Nooks and crannies everywhere, hidden items and voxophones, secrets galore, multi-level maps traversed by skylines, tons of places to take cover, multiple ways to traverse an area.

Apparently you haven't played Bioshock Infinite either.

>>486847
I remember the original Halo having really big, open levels in the single player mode. There were only a few that were really all that linear.

>>487482
Half-Life maps are mostly laid out like Doom maps though, with tons of backtracking and exploration. The area in the pic is actually the most linear part of the game.

>>487528
Why does everyone talk about just Half-Life? Opposing Force wasn't as memorable, but it has much better gameplay, weapons, etc. For some reason no one ever brings it up, though. I'm not sure if the maps were as large as HL1, but they were just as fun if not more so.

It goes deeper than map design. Game mechanics have regressed to Quake, but with cover. That said, maybe we were just spoilt by Perfect Dark and its sandbox-style FPS gameplay - and developers are just making the best game they know how.

It'd be interesting to study the map layouts of GE/PD, since some of them are quite remarkable. Facility is one of the coolest multiplayer maps ever made, but it breaks every law of "good" deathmatch map design.

Anyone remember this game? I swear, the plot may have been stupid crazy, but it was an awesome game! Maps were indeed pretty big and non-linear, as far as I can remember. Playing this shit co-op was some of the best times I've had as a kid.

>FPS's used to be awesome. What happened?

Timesplitters died.

>>487536
If you liked Opfor you might like this:
http://www.moddb.com/mods/opposing-life2life
Opfor's gameplay transplanted into HL's maps.

I'd say Metroid Prime was better than PD, although PD was quite good.

>>487548
Perfect Dark's areas were small and limited though. PD was a good game, but should NOT be held up as a shining example of FPS design.

System Shock 2 and Half Life are much better examples.

I think Quake 2 was the defining shooter for me growing up.

>Listening to NIN - The Downward Spiral, running and gunning
>Middle class, not angsty and never owned a trench coat

>>487551
It's got two sequels, multiple spinoffs and an HD remake. It's not exactly obscure.

>>487576
>>Perfect Dark was small and limited.
>>Half Life wasn't.

You do realise a map like "Crash site" dwarfs any single Half Life map, right? Since Half Life was limited by the engine?

The genius of PD's design is that the entire map is available to you. It doesn't unnecessarily block stuff off with fake doors. Yes, this resembles SS2, but are you suggesting SS2's mechanics beat PD's? There's more to an FPS than how large the average map was - and SS2's were pretty small.

>>487548
Quake with cover is a shallower game than Quake without cover. Cover reduces the value of movement skills and positional awareness.

>>486812
But the best console fps is Metroid Prime or TimeSplitters 2 if you don't count the former as a FPS

>>487592
The First and Second encounter are where it's at. The ones that follow are pretty mediocre, bad even.

>>487551
What game is this?

>>487614
I object to the idea FPS design should prioritise killing people. A good FPS should allow tactics beyond slaughter.

>>487623

>Mentioning Metroid Prime.

Wouldn't count it as a full fledged FPS because it lacks multiplayer.

>But muh prime 2

No.

Timesplitters 2 has more features than most FPS games released these days. Damn shame too. 60 bucks for garbage is hilarious.

Fps pretty much always sucked.

>>487637
If you think multiplayer is required for a fps to be good your opinion just doesn't matter.

>>487645
>FPS
>first person shooter
What else are you going to shoot?

>>487653
Counter-Strike is the greatest FPS and it's only multiplayer. Also neither of those are very good since they're on console, which is absolutely disgusting. The same goes for Perfect Dark.

>>487556
Shit was great, too bad none of my friends at the time were very good.

>>487670
He's clumsily trying to say games like Ghost Recon and Rainbow Six. The earlier entries, at least.

>>487624
I don't know. I agree first encounter and 2nd encounter are the best but I thought Serious Sam 3 was pretty good, although a little slow at first. Never really understood the massive hate for Serious Sam 2 either.

>>487682
Ah. I dislike those, don't really see them as FPS. Strategy games, really. Strategy with shooter elements.

I hate the idea of evaluating games based entirely on their multiplayer. A game can have no multiplayer and be a brilliant FPS. Let's not forget Goldeneye didn't have multiplayer originally - it was added in at the last minute by one team member in 6 weeks. Sure, Perfect Dark is fondly remembered for its cooperative, counter-operative, bots, and various multiplayer options - but it would have been just as good without them. Halo, too.

>>487697
Please stop samefagging this. We know you really like Perfect Dark, but you're the only one who loves it this much. It's not bad, but it can't touch the PC FPS of the mid to late 90s and early 2000s.

>>487686
In no way do I hate 2, it was fine, just not as good as 1st and 2nd. 3 was a little too meh, but not exactly bad either.

Saw this picture on /v/ some time ago.

No one cares about old FPS anymore.

>>487716
Believe what you will, but I'm not the OP. This may come as a shock to you, but there are a lot of people who like Perfect Dark. Are all the Quake fanbois a samefag?

>>487740
Obvious troll image nigger.

>>487751
You keep referring to not being the OP so you've just hinted you've already posted a few times here. You also keep on posting the same things, it's really obvious. I've seen you do the same thing in other threads as well.

>>487740
>not being able to identify a blatant troll
>on /v/

>>487758
>>487764
There is a truth behind every lie, you know.

The question no one dares to ask - since the 2005 Perfect Dark Zero is regarded as fail for the unforgivable crime of not being like Perfect Dark, how does it stack up against other shooters? After all, it was a more important Xbox 360 title than Halo 3, as far as Microsoft were concerned.

Honestly, I'm getting a little sick of my fellow PC Master Racers who refuse to consider that any console game could be better than a game for PC. It's bigoted.

>>486781
aw, come on man. I love perfect dark to death and argue for it's brilliance all the damn time, but it is the best fps ever? no damn way man. Come on, you just make people who like that game look like idiots.

>>487806
What people didn't like about it is that it went the generic shooter route. It played off the brand and seemed more like an older Halo game than the older Perfect Dark. While that sounds like "it's not the old game," it's because it lost the free roam style PD and Goldeneye were known for.

>>487823
Best FPS ever is a subjective thing. It's like saying Mario 64 is the best platforming game ever made. It's impossible to prove it objectively, since various games since have improved various aspects. However, you could make an objective argument that Mario 64 is the best based on how the game mechanics combine as a whole. Perfect Dark is often called "best FPS ever" by fans.

It's very much like the "Ocarina of Time best game ever" argument. Yes, Metacritic has OoT and PD as two of the highest ranked games. But not everyone's tastes are the same.

Trying to disqualify a game for not being on PC is pretty immature, though.

>>487897

No console FPS is the best FPS ever and that's something you can't argue with.

>>487897
How many fucking times are you clowns going to keep misusing the words sub/objective? Christopher Poole!

I'm not even going to explain it again. This time, I want YOU to do the talking.

>Best FPS ever is a subjective thing.
Define.
>It's impossible to prove it objectively
Define, then explain why
>you could make an objective argument
Define
>that Mario 64 is the best based on how the game mechanics combine as a whole
Explain
>But not everyone's tastes are the same.
I thought most people old enough to use this site were capable of tying their own shoes.
>Trying to disqualify a game for not being on PC is pretty immature, though.
Explain

Has anyone played SiN?

got completely overshadowed by Half-Life when they were simultaneously released, but it was a fuck awesome game in its own right.

>>487949
screenshot

>>487949

I like that this game is an FPS because I hate how the player character looks.

>>486571
Way to use a console FPS as a Then example.

>>487942
>>Trying to disqualify a game for not being on PC is pretty immature, though.
How the fuck does that even NEED explained?

>>487953
Haha yeah, he looked that particularly 90's kind of douchey.

He voice and vocal quips were awesome/hilarious though. Not DOUK-tier, but still entertaining.

>>487930
As a long-time PC master racer, I disagree. The game is more important than the platform.

Game > Platform.

"But console" is not a valid argument.

>>487949
No. No it wasn't. Shitty writing, generic gameplay and it was so bugged at release they sent out CDs with patches, because they were too big to reliably download at the time.

>>487965

"Console" IS a valid argument because console gamepads are unfit for the FPS genre.

>>487949
Sure, I fapped to Alexis.

Good game too.

>>487949
no but i played it sequel

>>487930
Games like Metroid Prime has an amzing level design and atmosphere tied with th best on PC, but if we talk about controls or multiplayer, I agree with you that nothing on a console can compare to PC

>>487949

Yeah, I bought SiN Episodes and got SiN with it. I beat SiN episode 1 and then played SiN while waiting for the other episodes to get released.

Jokes on me I guess.

Though I barely remember anything about SiN and don't think I thought it was that great.

>>488020

What about Metroid Prime played on Dolphin with mouse support?

>>487942
Subjective, AFAIK, refers to personal experiences. A multiplayer FPS is highly subjective because it relies on you to have good co-players.

Objective refers to evaluating the thing on what it is, not how you experienced it. Just because you felt game X had better camera than game Y wouldn't make game X better, since this is merely a subjective experience. An objective approach would be to analyse how the camera alterations affect gameplay, the connected game mechanics, etc.

At least, that's how I see it. They're over-used words.

>>487986
>"Console" IS a valid argument because console gamepads are unfit for the FPS genre.
I can agree with this to an extent, but it's the responsibility of the dev team to balance the game so that it can work well on the equipment it's being played on.

Regardless of that, a PS2 or XBox controller is a step below mice, and the DS can't do FPS for shit.

>>488049
>but it's the responsibility of the dev team to balance the game so that it can work well on the equipment it's being played on.

That's exactly why console FPS will always be inferior. Adapting an FPS game to a console butchers the gameplay.

>>488035
>An objective approach would be to analyse how the camera alterations affect gameplay, the connected game mechanics, etc.

Affecting gameplay would be subjective. The only objective things one can analyze regarding a game is, basically, its software, i.e. if there's poor coding, glitches, etc.; and, I suppose, story if it's not logically-consistent. Aside from those things, it's subjective.

>>487986
>Console gamepads unfit for FPS genre.

If you're playing something like Quake or Tribes, sure. But I spent years hating the Xbox before I realised a skilled Xbox Halo player was pretty damn good compared to me with my mouse and keyboard. No, controllers aren't as good for twitch shooting - which isn't an issue if you design your FPS to be less reliant on twitch shooting.

And multiplayer FPS skill levels aren't a real argument. It's about a comfortable game experience, not raw kill counts.

There have been some utterly brilliant console FPS games. I'm grateful that some got PC ports, even if modern console FPS games are often retarded.

>>488115
>There have been some utterly brilliant console FPS games

Which? All I can think of is watered down gameplay ones.

I'm surprised this hasn't been mentioned yet.

Granted, it didn't focus as much on the shooting as other FPS games of its time but look at this level.

What happened?

>>488143
Nothing happened, they just unrolled all the corridors.

>>488143
Back when graphics and engines were simple, levels were very easy to design. Now, the complexity of a single street on a code level could exceed that several times over. That, and the bigger and more complex a level is, the more time you wind up running about in circles after a red herring. Some very large levels with a billion paths can often fall squarely into bad design territory.

The only way levels of large size can not turn into a slog is if there are multiple ways to complete them and various paths conform to various playstyles. If you have a massive level with one route, then a bad design idea on your part could lead to players getting frustrated. If a door isn't very visible or a key is too well-hidden, you aren't making a challenging game, you're making something that's a pain in the ass to play through.

Of course I know that map is System Shock which is hardly Doom or Wolfenstein, but you get my point. Some older FPS maps were fucking mental.

>>488134
Define "watered down gameplay". And Halo and COD and Battlefield 3 aren't examples I'd consider good console FPS games.

Maybe...

Goldeneye/Perfect Dark
Turok trilogy.
Timesplitters Trilogy.
Deus Ex 2/Human Revolution. (Deus Ex 1 also got a PS2 port with pretty much everything intact.)
Bioshock 1.

Off the top of my head. I don't play all that many FPS games.

Does Skyrim count as an FPS? Or Thief 3?

>>488134
Goldeneye was awesome, so was Perfect Dark, and XIII was a pretty fun game too.

>>488143
What is this?

>>488231
Boku no System Shock.

>>488219
Ah, yes, XIII. There's an interesting game which didn't get enough attention.

Then there was BLACK. That was an interesting console FPS.

And King Kong was quite innovative. Another console FPS. Even if the FOV was horrible.

>>488209
Oblivion and Skyrim are pretty much FPSes with swords

>>488153
But that's not fun at all.

Are there any FPS games that are being created specifically for PC rather than console? Like a game built from the ground up for PC so it actually takes advantage of the large amount of keys and the more precise aiming capability of the mouse?

To me it seems like even old franchises grown for the PC like Deus Ex have migrated to the console. So we get a console port of that rather than something designed specifically to take advantage of the PC's ability. I know this is due to the shift in audience that companies want to appeal to to make the "required sales", but I just wondered if anyone is taking the initiative to appeal to the PC crowd.

>>487382
Here.

Two 2008 releases. Two real maps.

>>488112
>glitches
Cancelling moves in fighting games were a glitch LOL SUBJECTIVE

>>488502
Stuff like ARMA III, maybe?

>>488502
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7iX_gPh6II

I can never pay much mind to games with only monster enemies.


I like it when it's mixed like in System Shock or Bioshock or more real like in Half Life 2

>>488708
That looks really good. Why did developers stop making FPS games where you can explore a lot?
Why is exploration considered a bad thing nowadays? Is it because they think players can't handle it? Or are developers simply lazy enough to not design levels and stick with set-pieces?

>>488861
Takes too long to make maps.

If the player isn't railroaded straight to every single piece of artwork, it's considered wasted effort.

>>488861
Rising development costs. It costs so much less to just make a railroad map. Anything else is just a waste of money

>>488861
There's actually another reason other than "laziness" or "players are dumb"

When your map is a huge-ass maze, it can get really frustrating and boring to wander around for 20 minutes just trying to find the exit, especially when you're backtracking and all enemies are dead. This is a turn-off for players, and will make it less likely they'll desire to finish the game.

If you want your players to buy DLC and sequels, you can't have them dislike the game. Hell, they'll feel more inclined to buy DLC or a sequel if they beat the game quickly.

It's not like you can't wander around in FPS's today and find cool shit anyways, it's just that the developers don't encourage wandering off and you aren't getting lost, so you aren't feeling a very big sense of exploration.

Besides, when you were younger and if you were like me, you always just ran into random areas to find cool things. As we age we don't stop and think "Hey what's in that room" but "Game tells me to go there. I go there"

TL;DR it's not laziness or "dumb audience"

>>489062
I'm pretty sure Valve have openly admitted to removing everything which confused their play testers - such as they ability to take wrong turns.

This was getting especially bad by HL2: Episode 2.

Halo happened. I mean, halflife started the railroad trend of stupid games for stupid people, but halflife had killer mods for multiplayer like CS and Day of Defeat. Halo is where shit FPS games really got started.

>>488526
Isn't Second Sun one of those really short maps that ends in a cutscene?

Not exactly a fair comparison.

>that feel when Halo was originally supposed to be a free-roaming action game across a 10 000km ring where there are no missions and you organise your own war against the Covenant

>You win the game when you push the Covenant out of Halo through gradual military victories

>Then Xbox happened

>>490078
Halo had switched to standard FPS well before being bought by microsoft.

>>490078
>>that feel when Halo was originally supposed to be a free-roaming action game across a 10 000km ring where there are no missions and you organise your own war against the Covenant
>>You win the game when you push the Covenant out of Halo through gradual military victories
>>Then Xbox happened
Actually, Halo was originally going to be a PS2\Xbox cross-platform game, possible with a PC port.

We did get PC ports of Halo 1 and Halo 2, then Microsoft screwed us over for the rest.

>>490119
>Actually, Halo was originally going to be a PS2\Xbox cross-platform game, possible with a PC port.

This is total rubbish. Halo was originally a Mac exclusive.

>>490134
>This is total rubbish. Halo was originally a Mac exclusive.
Halo was a PS2\Xbox game at one stage. It may have originally been Mac exclusive early on, but it wasn't going to be an Xbox exclusive until Microsoft took control of Bungie.

>>490134
A sci-fi shooter that takes place on a mysterious alien ring world, Halo: Combat Evolved is an action-packed experience that allows players to battle their enemies on foot and in vehicles with alien and human weaponry. The production of Halo has a long and tumultuous history. The title was originally designed as a breakthrough game for Apple's Mac systems, and console versions of the game also became a high-priority project for the development team when it signed with Take-Two. As all PlayStation 2 owners are aware, however, production on Halo was shifted immediately to an Xbox version in 2000 when Take-Two Interactive sold its 20% share of developer Bungie to Microsoft. Thereby solidifying Halo's position as an Xbox and PC exclusive (with a Mac port much, much later on) forever.

http://au.ign.com/games/action-double-pack/ps2-14552

The status of Halo for the PS2 remains a little foggy, since no formal declaration regarding its debut outside of the PC has been made. For those that read IGN on a regular basis, however, it has been known for quite some time that our sources inside Bungie have disclosed that console versions (for both the PlayStation 2 and Dreamcast) have been in production for quite some time now and that an announcement revealing the set-top Halos is just days away. Publisher Rockstar Games has also gone on record by stating that the PS2 is the most likely console that Halo will appear on and that 2001 would be the year that it does.
http://au.ign.com/articles/2000/05/12/halo-5

>>487761
I loved Pd. Shit was popular as hell too, is this a troll or just a person with amnesia?

>>490164
> The title was originally designed as a breakthrough game for Apple's Mac systems

So it basically backs up what I said. Good.

>>490193
>I loved Pd. Shit was popular as hell too, is this a troll or just a person with amnesia?
Look, I understand people getting a little bit annoyed. After all, lots of PD fans tend to use the same tone and arguments when they defend PD, so it can seem as if they're just dealing with one samefag popping up on a bunch of different threads.

The game did sell about 4 million copies if you add together the 64 and XBLA versions. Since that's 4 times the amount Deus Ex sold, is it any wonder it keeps popping up on FPS threads?

So long as people don't drag game X into EVERY thread, no matter how irrelevant, I see no problem with pimping it. After all, good games deserve to be shared. I've discovered some amazing games on /vr/ and /v/ these past few weeks thanks to anons enthusiastically suggesting, or doing their best to break the preconceptions I'd held.

>>490229
>So it basically backs up what I said. Good.
That's fine, dude. I simply meant that it was a PS2\Xbox game during the time it was a straight FPS. Then around 2000-2001ish, Microsoft killed the PS2 version, allegedly.

>>487789
Doom is a third-person platformer.


Identify the truth please.

>>490238
It was a straight FPS when it was a mac game. I know this for a fact, I was at the macworld where they revealed it for the first time.

>>487716
I'm someone else who posted about PD too. I'm not taking away from PC FPS's, but it was a lot harder to get 4 guys with shitty computers together t play a game than it was to get 4 guys with n64 controllers. Goldeneye and PD started the couch-bro shooter movement.

>>490256
>Doom is a third-person platformer.
Sonic Robo Blast 2 is indeed a third-person platformer. It is the logical evolution of Doom. Just a Raichu is the logical evolution of Pikachu.

>>490264
>It was a straight FPS when it was a mac game. I know this for a fact, I was at the macworld where they revealed it for the first time.
Ah, okay. I was always under the impression the Mac build was more open world, more strategy-focused.

this thread is retarded and is just a bunch of idiotic strawman arguments... god... this board has gone to shit in such a short amount of time

>>486647
If I remember correctly the map on the right was from Duke Nukem in totalbiscut's WTF video about it.

>>489979
>Isn't Second Sun one of those really short maps that ends in a cutscene?

Isn't that every map in modern Call of Duty games?

>>490283
Be a part of the solution, not the problem. Comments like that just continue the mentality, and there are still a lot of terrific threads.

>>490283
>this thread is retarded and is just a bunch of idiotic strawman arguments... god... this board has gone to shit in such a short amount of time
Look, there are some logical arguments to be made here.

DOORS. Modern FPS games don't have working doors. I dunno about you, but as someone who played Perfect Dark and Deus Ex, the inability to open doors makes the game world unreal. Modern multiplayer FPS games like Call of Duty don't even HAVE doors in multiplayer. You exist in this strange door-free world.

>>487482
it's not even a map, it's just a line that says "cutscene" on it over and over

>>490314
Perfect Dark had doors... Pressing B opened them

>>489657
2 hours going down the same turn...
how can people that stupid figure out how to walk, much less drive or eat!

>>490330
>Perfect Dark had doors... Pressing B opened them
That's what I mean, dude. Those FPS games had working doors. Modern games have doors only team-mates can open, or which can't be opened at all. It's bizarre.

>>490301
I don't see how my comment continues the mentality of this thread at all? I can't say I'm disapointed? also every thread other than the gauntlet threads devolve into idiotic troll arguments, click on a random thread, I dare you

►playing halo for singleplayer
Nope

>>487526
That's what makes it so good. While trying to tell a more focused narrative, the game never forgot its Shock roots. Ken Levine wouldn't be so stupid as to completely excise it out.

Whereas Bioshock was about exploring Rapture, trying to find out what happened, Infinite is about finding the girl and getting the hell out of a falling Columbia.

>>486571
Maybe you developed good taste.

>>490267
SRB2 kicks ass. Glad to see it still exists.

Retro FPS we rent actually FPS, they were an extremely violent version of rollerskating.