/vr/ - Retro Games

Hell yeah, Darkstalkers. How it was never more popular than Street Fighter I'll never understand. I mean, SF was just "national sterotypes beat each other up". But DS had "Vampire that turns dudes into chicks and then drains their blood!" "Demon with obnoxious laugh that fills you with blood!" "Half vampire dude with a sword that summons a giant monty python foot to crush you with!" "Frankenstein monster that attacks you with his ass!" "Kung fu Werewolf!"

>>475016
I think in the end it was just the huge amount of competition that was out there. This was right in the middle of the fighter boom, it had stuff like Mortal Kombat, KIller Instinct, King of Fighters, and even Capcom's own Marvel and later Street Fighter games to compete against. It managed to get a decent following in Japan during its heyday, but it fell off pretty quickly.

Darkstalkers just stagnated. It had the same look in every sequel and to every kid that had money that wasn't too appealing. Though I loved the hell out of the series.

A new artbook came out last month to go along with the PSN/XBL rerelease, and it's pretty good from what I've heard. Includes some interviews with artists who worked on the games and such. No confirmation yet as to whether it will be localized, but the last Darkstalkers artbook to come out was, so I think it's a possibility.

>>475103
Most of Capcom's series back then reused the same sprites, so that's not really a Darkstalkers only thing.

SF was quite a bit easier, had transitions like ST to Alpha and involvement in the "Vs." series, among other things.

Darkstalkers 3/Vampire Savior is certainly one of my favorite games and I still play it on PSN and GGPO with others.

>>475103
>It had the same look in every sequel

This didn't seem to negatively affect the Guilty Gear X series.

>>475353
Are you playing guilty gear right now? If anything GGX was a heavy metal version of DarkStalkers. Though not retro I dearly miss both games.

A couple small portraits for an older Anita still exist in Vampire Savior's finished ROM. Supposedly there were some plans for her to be playable, and the latest artbook includes some drawings for her. Donovan's Demitri headswap evil form that was included in the PS2 Collection is also an abandoned concept from Savior's development.

Darkstalkers is awesome! I'm really not bothered if they never make another one. It would likely have shitty graphics and I doubt their ability to create cool new characters.

>>475425
GGX didn't have the "monster" aspect of DS. You had a versions of a vampire, a succubus, a werewolf, a creature from the Black Lagoon, a Frankenstein's monster, a Chinese ghost, a skeleton (ironically a "heavy metal" skeleton), a pharoah/mummy, etc...

GGX was more "edgy anime" than a series based on classic monsters.

>>475750
I've heard that they spent 3 months just brainstorming character concepts for the first game. They really put a lot of effort into it, it was in development for around 2 years which is pretty long for an early 90's game.

>>475779
Potemkin is a frankenstein (if you mean science experiments gone wrong then so are Sol, Testament, Dizzy and most of the other characters) You got a possessed people (by demons and ghost). Slayer the vampire, Faust (mad scientist) I think guilty gear had monsters covered. But it's true that not in the same scope as DarkStalkers.

>>475779
here, this is for you

>>475785
As an example, here are some early drawings of what would eventually become Morrigan.

>>475779
>GGX was more "edgy anime"

>>475859
Fanwank will make any good show seem that way

>>475891
Champ draws such nice curvy, soft-looking girls. I know I've seen another Morrigan and Lilith by him (in PE uniforms), but I wonder if he's drawn any of the other DS girls.

>>475859
Are you going to argue with that or something?

>>475928
Note how, with such proportions and at 173cm, Morrigan still apaprently is only 58kg.

>>475930
Capcom's never been realistic with their measurements and weights. I can't remember what the exact numbers were, but Sagat's weight was impossibly light for the height and measurements given.

>>475934
I think he's just insulting the quoted poster's intelligence.

>>475891
I bet none of you faggots noticed this.

>>475964
It's fanart though, isn't it?

>>475968
Yes, although it's his intelligence that is inferior.

>>475981
It's fanart, but the measurements are official. Capcom has a tradition of giving their fighting game characters official heights, weights, and BWH measurements.

>>476038
*topless witch

>>475859
>names like "Sol Badguy"
>fem male characters abound
>speed metal "X Japan"-style music
>transgendered characters for fanservice
>Hey, look...a topless with
>pretentious phrases like "roman cancel", "aerial dust", and "HEAVEN OR HELL: DUEL 1 THE FIRST...LET'S ROCK"

It's screams of the typical nu-anime that has been the norm since the early 2000s, and it's become almost a parody of itself.

Don't EVEN get me started on Blazblue and it's "The Wheels of Fate Are Turning...Rebel 1...ACTION" shit. Can't you just say "round 1...fight"?

If a title like "Guilty Gear XX Λ Core Plus R" isn't pretentious fan pandering to sound "edgy", then the terms have lost all meaning.

>>476038

>I have no idea what I'm talking about
>I have no idea what the word pretentious means
>I'm taking a game series seriously that doesn't take itself seriously
>I have no idea what fanservice means

>>476038
Careful, Guilty Gear fans can be a bit touchy.

>>476057
I enjoy the Aksys game titles, but you can't deny this.

I like MK as well, but I'll be the first to point out how it's become a "try hard" series.

>>476067

I don't think MK is tryhard. It hasn't taken itself seriously since the first game.

>>476038
>If a title like "Guilty Gear XX Λ Core Plus R" isn't pretentious fan pandering to sound "edgy", then the terms have lost all meaning.
Only as pretentious and edgy as "Super Street Fighter II Turbo".

But let's keep this thread on topic, please.

>>476072
"Super" and "turbo" are on thing, but it's going a bit extreme with these other titles.

>>476078

New to 4chan, huh?

>>476050
You should stop using the quote markers. It makes you seem like you're trying to quote someone else when you're actually speaking your mind.

>>475856

I'm tired and out of it, so I read that as "Megaman" and not "Morrigan" and my mind was blown.

>>475856
Yeah, she's the daughter of the lord of Hell, after all.

>>476071
MK9 sure is, by both retconning via a "dimensional rift" and literally being made as a tourney style fighter instead of the silly homage to Big Trouble In Little China" it used to be.

>>476078

Quotation marks are "quote markers", faggot.

>this is GREEN TEXT
>Welcome to 4chan
>implying you've been on 4chan for a while

>>476038
It became pretentious and pandering though it did have monsters demons and ghost.

>>476086
Been here since the Crack era. Newfags are the ones that don't know how to greentext, btw

>>476096

But Mortal Kombat BEGAN as a tourney style fighter.

>>476106

>Newfags are the ones that don't know how to greentext

Cool, so no one in this thread.

>>476101
see
>>476106

I'm sorry that you can't interpret my message, even after literally spelling it out for you.

Sure didn't take long for the /v/tards to come spilling their shit over in here.

>>476103
It did...it just wasn't as much of the "classic monster" style that the DS was. I'm pretty sure DS was created to pit those classic creatures against each other, albeit using original characters and designs by Capcom.

>>476113
>colorblind as well

You should track the thread back to where I greetexted all over the place.

>>476038
You know virtually everything in guilty gear is named after rock/metal bands right? the game itself is a parody of 80's anime and rock. Hell, sol is freddie mercury.

>>476107
He meant gameplay-wise. MK9 aims at being a cybersport type game. The original was a retarded-ass "hyper-realistic" game where seemingly living people killed each other on screen WHOA SHIT HAVE YOU SEEN GORO HE'S NUTS

>>476115
>MK9 aims at being a cybersport type game.

I don't understand how this comes into play gameplay wise. It's still a one-on-one fighter.

>>476126
He prolly means the type of gameplay it has. It's much more complex than the simplicity of many of the older MK titles.

>>476107
Not in the same sense. MK was originally a cheap Midway attempt at stealing a bit of the popularity from SF2. They didn't even expect it to be a huge hit.

The new game was specifically tailored to be a competition-level fighter, not just a cash-in.

>>476038

Thanks for the entertaining read, but I think you need to go back to /v/.

>>476131

So they actually tried to make a game that wasn't shit? I...don't see the issue here.

>>476135

To be fair, UMK3 is not very simple on higher levels.

>It's like he's wearing nothin' at all!
>Nothin' at all!
>NOTHIN' AT ALL!
Stupid curiously attractive fishman!

>>476114
>It did...it just wasn't as much of the "classic monster" style that the DS was. I'm pretty sure DS was created to pit those classic creatures against each other, albeit using original characters and designs by Capcom.
Gametrailers had a short interview about it just recently, actually.

The game got pitched by Capcom US employee as a licensed Universal monster fighting game. Then CoJ said "we'rr just stear zem" and started developing. CoA guy tells (in the interview) how he pitched Morrigan - they wanted a vampire lady, he said you already got one try succubus, "well, what's a succubus?", "it's a demon that kills men by screwing them", and CoJ designers were apparently all like "holy shit amazing wow it's going to be the main character holy fuck lol".

>>476126
>I don't understand how this comes into play gameplay wise. It's still a one-on-one fighter.
It's immensely important from gamedesign standpoint. Balance is more important than visual design or variety, etc.

>>476121
>80's anime and rock

You had me until that point. It's current era anime and rock. There's no glam rock or HNK-style fighters to be found. It look more like Bleach or X with that Nomura style "belts and zippers" all over the place.

>>476149

But Demitri is the closest thing the series has to a main character.

He's also boring as sin to play as.

>>476147
character-wise, it is. Every single character is only different in their special attacks and hit boxes. They still share identical basic attacks.

>>476162
No, Morrigan is the main character. The story is about how she's about to inherit her father's immense power. Lilith is a part of the seal that keeps Morrigan's power away from her so that she wouldn't destroy the world until the time is right, etc..

>>476162
People seem to think Morrigan's the main character because she's the one that's always in crossovers and stuff. But Demitri was the main character. Although if you go by the game's Japanese titles, each game in the series seems to refer to a different character ("Vampire" - Demitri, "Vampire Hunter" - Donovan, "Vampire Savior" - Jedah).

>>476183
She IS the main character.

>>476183
>("Vampire" - Demitri, "Vampire Hunter" - Donovan, "Vampire Savior" - Jedah).

I...I never ever noticed this. I just thought Capcom was trying to sound cool.

>>476121
Part of the reason I love the game the other part being monsters ghost and demons.

>>476206
Well, we almost had the thread back on track.

>>476150
you're compeltly wrong, so here's some links. various music references, and then the anime short. brush up on guilty gear before you argue about it.
http://www.angelfire.com/electronic/myPlace/ggfaqs/ggname.html#ino
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R54VZUJNr18

I'm hoping the re-release does well. There were statements saying Capcom was using this as a litmus test to gauge popularity to see if there was enough to warrant a new game in the series.

It may sound blashemous, but I would really like to see them use the SF4 engine for a new Darkstalkers. They'd keep the gameplay rooted very much in the 2D tradition, but use the new engine and see what kind of crazy visuals they could muster.

Almost every single frame of animation in Darkstalkers showed that exaggerated wacky style, with loads of hidden expressions, and I'd love to see them try this with the new engine.

>>476193
Part of it was trying to sound cool. They wanted to avoid just using numbers or "Super"s or whatever because they thought that was boring. Of course they did end up releasing two "2" titles eventually, but they died instantly.

>>476187
>>476175
>>476162
Wrong answers every where, lol.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wHq_O5FFTec

>>476218

Well I'm convinced.

>>476235
Are you convinced that Guile is the main character in the Street Fighter series?

So is darkstalkers 4 going to happen? capcom has played it safe when it came to fighters this gen, so it doesn't seem like they have a shot.

>>476245

I will be when someone posts a link to the SF cartoon intro.

In which T Hawk was literally flying.

>>476246
see>>476207

We'll see. They obviously want to do it.

>>476254
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NuaJgxUOUlo

I'm such a sucker.

>>476150
>It look more like Bleach or X with that Nomura style "belts and zippers" all over the place.

Name one character that is based off one of those series' characters. Guilty Gear is closest to JoJo's Bizarre Adventure more than anything, but I bet you think that's edgy too.

>>476261

0:53

Top left corner

T HAWK

IS

FLYING

>>476273
Can't ignore Deejay's shrinking powers.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4nWu7N3hLM

>>476270
You don't have to be "based on" a specific character when you're just following trends.

Also
>>476210

>>476256
>They obviously want to do it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qJolbPmD7U
Here's a recent interview with a few people who worked on the series. It ends with them saying they've always wanted to make a new installment in the series and are hoping that someday they'll be able to.

>>476286

Capcom should rerelease these cartoons to promote their games.

I'd buy a Darkstalkers DVD! Err, Blu-Ray I guess. Crazy kids and your ever-changing media.

>>476256
Ok, you convinced to want the same thing though I do miss beautiful 2-d sprites.

>>476305
*fingers crossed

BUY THE HD REMAKE TO SHOW SUPPORT

My only gripe is the fact the games don't have their original intros (unless there's a way to access them...I just don't know the method)

>>476310
I think you can unlock the original intros in the vault along with the concept art and such.

>>476307
If they'd go absolutely NUTS like they did with SF3 (only using hi-res), it could work. Otherwise, their best bet is to use the already-made SF4 engine.

>>476310
Do this, NOW!!

>>476339
I'll have to check. I absolutely SUCK at the tutorial missions.

>>476308
I guess that would depend on who holds the license to the show.

It was kind of a mess when the classic Transformers and GI Joe eps got released. Rhino lost the license before they finished GI Joe, and the title switch hands to Shout Factory, who released both series complete.

I'm not even sure the SF series got an official DVD release, let alone a BD...I'm fairly certain DS never did outside of random VHS episodes.

>>476296

Yeah, and the only trend GG is following is JJBA's habit of naming characters or straight up basing them off of famous musicians. Also, if you wanted the thread to stay on topic, then you shouldn't have derailed yourself it by making shit up about a game that's barely related. You don't know what edgy means.

>>476373
pot, meet kettle

Get back on topic, or GTFO

>>476367
Be nice if they could get it. The PS2 version of Mega Man Anniversary had 2 episodes of the cartoon.

Which, while it is very cool, pales in comparison to the developer interview that the GCN version got. I'd be down for both regarding DS

>>476379
I guess that was the tradeoff for the terrible, un-alterable control scheme for the GCN version :P

A to fire, and B to jump...wtf?

>>476345
SF3 took a HUGE amount of time and money on Capcom's part, and it didn't start to pay back until many years later. And that was with a flagship franchise, not a cult one like Darkstalkers. And of course the market has changed in the decade since, eveytone thinks 2D is old and crappy. As much as I'd love to see them go all out on a super high-quality 2D-animated Darkstalkers, it just isn't going to happen. It'll be 3D, if it happens at all. So then the question becomes to what extent can the emulate the original animation style in 3D? Supposedly Dhalsim was the most difficult character to animate in Street Fighter 4, and what he does is pretty tame by Darkstalkers standards.

Anybody want to play this on PSN? I'm not good by any means and have very fond memories of the game, but get thrashed all day by online randoms :/

OK...we need to make a petition to have the DS, SF, and MK Animated series all released on BD.

I'd include the Megaman series, but it was actually pretty good. I'm only using the previous examples so a company can release them under the "So Bad It's FUCKING AWESOME" line

And before you say "we can't have MK AND SF in the same line", remember. Both SF and MK were in GI Joe (well, MK wasn't really...but they were GI Joe style action figures by Hasbro) :P

>>476407
It's also much more cost-effective to 3D model a character and then manipulate them, as opposed to drawing every single frame.

>>476428
I would, but I'm a 360fag...sorry

>>476407
Well, a lot of SF3's initial issues were regarding character roster. They beefed it up, and by the time 3rd Strike rolled around, it hit paydirt.

>>476218
>American Darkstalkers cartoon
I see you have no idea what Darkstalkers is actually about.

>>476462
Follow the thread from there, and maybe you'll get it.

>>476367
Back when they were still around, ADV did the dvd releases for the american adaptations of both Street Fighter and Darkstalkers.

>yfw seeing this stage for the first time

>>476207
>I'm hoping the re-release does well.
Capcom said it didn't sell at all and they're canning the whole fighting game update initiative because of it.

Obviously, no Darkstalkers on the SFIV engine for us either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjTZ_IcQ4Lg
Here's an old trailer for the second game in the series. It features some beta elements that didn't make it to the finished game, most notably Victor's ability to shoot lightning bolts while his powerup super is active, and a strange variant of Huitzil's cannon super where he summons another robot.

>>476270
>Guilty Gear is closest to JoJo's Bizarre Adventure more than anything,
Please do not say stupid things like this.

I swear, Guilty Gear fans are literally THE worst.

>>476548
The stages in Darkstalkers are great. Vampire Savior had the most out there and jaw-dropping ones, like the Fetus of God, the skyscraper wall, and the demon train, but the ones in the first 2 games were also cool in a "monster movie set" sort of way.

>>476438
>It's also much more cost-effective to 3D model a character and then manipulate them, as opposed to drawing every single frame.
SFIV type animations aren't easy at all. Characters deform a lot. It's not Tekken or Soul Calibur where everyone's interchangeable, SFIV animations are completely unrealistic and entirely custom, just like old Capcom 2D animations.

>>476548
BTW, here's the artist who drew that stage, as well as many others.

>>476617
I bet she hates games and has left the industry long since. They all have.

>>476621
Most of Capcom's old artists left the company long ago (a few are still around though, like the guy who animated Anakaris), but I don't know if they're still in the game industry or not.

>>476582
The newer fans are trash and have moved on to BlazBlue please don't generalize. The real unfortunate thing with GG is a lot of fan made fighting games came after it like Melty Blood, Zero fighter and many more to bring in those kinds of fans. Anime is a double edged sword for fighting games.

>>476582
>literally THE worst.
>literally

Kingdom Hearts, Sonic, Pokemon, Call of Duty, League of Legends

>>476676

All fanbases are horrible. Quit trying to put yourself on a pedestal. Having an argument of "whose shit smells the least stinky" is retarded.

>>476685
I don't even play Guilty Gear.

>>476596
They aren't easy, but they don't require redrawing the model for every frame.

>>476689

I didn't imply you did. I'm getting tired of people shitting on fanbases like any of them are better than the other.

>>476596
>It's not Tekken or Soul Calibur where everyone's interchangeable

Tekken's Jack is very hand-manipulated, as well as many of the weapons in Soul Calibur (especially Ivy's). Still, it's a base model they can manipulate, as opposed to having to hand-draw every single animation frame.

>>476702
>I didn't imply you did.

So how is calling you out on using "literally" incorrectly putting myself on a pedestal?

>>476690
They do require animating every bone on every frame. Manually. SFIV doesn't seem to use mocap at all.

>>476709

1. I'm not him.
2. You put yourself on a pedestal by making everyone else seem below you, whatever fanbase you belong to

>>476706
Drawing a frame of a sprite and hand-animating a frame of a 3D model are about the same amount of work.

>>476743
Uh huh

Nice damage control, you literal idiot.

>>476745
I guess it just doesn't seem to be as difficult once you get the base model done. You can warp the bone structure an manipulate it like a pose.

Ever play the PS2 game "Stretch Panic? It takes this "warp" concept and puts it directly in the player's hand. This same concept is prolly how they animated Dhalsim in SF4. They took a model that could be warped, started from point A, then mapped it at point B, and let it automate the in-between animations, doing touch ups on overly-distorted bits.

Of course, I know jack shit about this, but it seems like a concept that would work on a developmental level.

Here's an unused concept for what older Anita could have looked like, from the latest artbook.

>>476759

Damage control on what? I don't know if you're still trying to imply I'm him, but whatever. Calling for samefag when you can't even see IP addresses is stupid.

Much like yourself.

>>476814

Wasn't she playable in the Saturn version?

>>476814
And from the same artbook, here are some ending art concepts involving Anita, Jedah, and Dee.

>>476038
>GG
>Edgy anime

You know that edgy animes don't have complex plot nor well written characters and, edgy games don't have polished and elitist gameplay right?

Yeah,you just suck at this game

>>476830
No, she wasn't. The only game Anita has ever been playable in was Marvel Super Heroes, and just reused her young sprites from Night Warriors where she follows Donovan around. Her older form is shown in Dee's ending in the PS2 Collection.

>>476038
>mfw someone doesn't know the origins of Sol's name.

>>476837
>>476948
mfw people continuing to derail a thread by shitflinging

This isn't /v/, retards.

>>476837
>You know that edgy animes don't have complex plot nor well written characters
>Evangelion
>Berserk

You seriously went there

>>476837
>doesn't know the difference between "edgy" and "trying to be edgy"

Even heard the term "wannabe"? I hope you learned something today.

>>477167
>animes

I bet you call them womans as well

>>477186

>play jojo
>learn about push blocking
>suddenly I love pushblocking
>all I do is pupsh block

name some game with push block

>>477176

wtf you sick mother fucker

>>477176

omg grossssssssssssssssssss

>>477176
That is disgusting.

>>477176

>mfw

>>476038
roman is short for romantic, and "aerial dust" is just hitting the dust button in the air, no different than saying "aerial fierce" or something

Demi x Morri OTP

>>477336
wtf is a fucking "dust" button?

>>478760
Are you stupid? It's the button Dust Man presses to make dust. Fuckin' duh.

>tfw you will never eat Sasquatch Creme D'Anjou

>>479425

>tfw you are never going to have Sasquatch plushies

>>479628
I would seriously buy Sasquatch plushies. The guy's design is practically begging for them.

>>477154
>Refuting your statements about Guilty Gear being an "edgy anime" game
>Shit flinging

You sure are upset about being wrong.

>>480246
Why do you care so much?
Can't accept the rough truth?

Let's stay on topic please.

What would you like to see in a new Darkstalkers game, /vr/? How would you set a new Darkstalkers apart with different mechanics? After all, one could make the accusation that it's just Street Fighter with a Halloween theme on top - how would you differentiate a new Darkstalker's title in terms of mechanics?

>>482221
I think the mechanics are fine as is. Street Fighter doesn't have chain combos, pursuit attacks, dashes that you can actually attack from, and there are lots of moves with unique properties seen nowhere in Street Fighter.. And lots of the mechanics later Street Fighter games share with Darkstalkers were actually taken from Darkstalkers rather than the other way around (people seem to forget that the first 2 Darkstalkers games came before Street Fighter Alpha and Street Fighter 3).

>>482221
Keep downs, chains, pursuits, guard cancels, hard as fuck tech hits and no super flash and i think it'll be significantly different. oh and of course turbo 3.

also, does anyone play on GGPO? we should do some /vr/ tournys maybe?

>>483647
>>482221
oh new mechanics? Uh, that's really hard to say. they're already so different and use way different mechanics to begin with.

The second Darkstalkers game was where world-famous fighting game player Daigo Umehara launched his competitive career. He once went on a winning streak that broke the game's wins counter. To this day Pyron's standing hard kick is still called the "Umehara Kick".

Top tier in every game.

Bengus's art was so awesome back then.