/vr/ - Retro Games

Saturn for 2D games, N64 for 3D games.
PS for music CDs and VCDs.

>>4630603
>3D controller for 2D games
I think your thinking of the regular Saturn pad, which is top tier for 2D. The 3D pad wasn't great for 2D games, D-pad isnt comfortable to use on a regular basis

OP here.

I was intending a discussion of the merits of the controllers themselves, primarily for 3D games I guess.

>>4630627
Isn't the N64 stick the most sensitive one?
I never had the chance to try the Saturn 3d pad (I just play games like Nights and Panzer Dragoon with a regular controller and is still good), and the dualshock sticks always felt stiff and clunky, same with the PS2 one, with PS3 they became more confortable to use, but still, dualshock sticks aren't very sensitive, same with Gamecube or Xbox sticks, it seems like the n64 stick is unmatched in terms of precision. This is easily noticeable if you try to play games like Star Fox or Goldeneye with a GC or Xbox controller.

Saturn's analog stick is the best, followed by N64's, and then PSX's at a distant third.

>>4630636
Not sure why you brought the Dual Shock into it as there isn't one in the image.

We had this thread hundred of times, nothing good will come out from this.

>>4630640
I thought the original PS1 analog pads were called dualshock, that's how I remember it.

>>4630643
Mr. Autismo was just waiting that answer, so he can correct you saying that is a Dual Analog controller.
It has concave analog sticks, longer grips and no rumble.

>>4630643
Nope.

Look again.

>>4630648
>>4630650
I see.
There's many different PS1 pads. I still have my OG japanese PS1 pad with the tinier size and handles, I think it's a bit on the rare side too.
I assume the sticks still work the same way?

>>4630648
I resent that label. You forgot the larger L2 and R2 buttons and the flightstick mode ;-)

>>4630659
The sticks are a little looser and longer travel, closer to the N64's.

>>4630636
>it seems like the n64 stick is unmatched in terms of precision. This is easily noticeable if you try to play games like Star Fox or Goldeneye with a GC or Xbox controller.

People exaggerate the hell out of this. I played Perfect Dark on N64 and 360 back-to-back and noticed very little difference.

>>4630695
I never played the 360 version of PD, maybe it was tweaked for the 360 stick?
My experience with the sticks not being as responsive as the originals are mostly through virtual console on Wii, which is said to be the best N64 emulation, but I still felt the Gamecube sticks weren't good enough in terms of precision.
And also regular n64 emulation on PC using 360 and DS3 controllers.
Sure, you could blame the emulation, but I think N64's stick really was more precise than the more modern ones. Maybe it's a precision that's not really needed, but in some games, it really did a difference for me.

>>4630627
For actual 3D games the merits of dual analog far far outweighs the subjective variations in rubber pad resistance and button shape.

To this day, I've not used a stick that had as satisfying a feel as the Saturn one. It had the right amount of resistance and springiness and felt solid and exact. How no other analog stick has ever matched it blows my mind.

>>4630706
The Gamecube controller has always been trash. There are so many people who claim to love it but I can only assume that's because the GC was their first system.

Anybody know why the Saturn 3D pad detaches at the cord? Were there plans for it to modular or something?

>>4631080
Well, I wouldn't call it trash, it works for the games that were developed for it, but yeah in terms of precision it isn't as good as the N64 ones, same with the other more modern controllers (Dreamcast included).
I really want to try out the Saturn 3D pad though.

>>4630821
For FPSs maybe. Prefab camera angels with limited options always works out better for third person 3D games. No need for a second stick in that case.

>>4631085
It's got the worst D-pad out of any official controller.
They INVENTED the D-Pad, yet they fucked it up worse than anyone else. Button layout was retarded too and was different just for the sake of it.

>>4631083
I think it says in the manual it's for storage. I don't know exactly how this makes sense, however.

>>4630595
The dual shock came later, playing catch-up to the N64.

Nice try.

>>4631076
Shame only ~20 games actually used the thing, though.

>>4631118
All the manual says is that it's called the "connector unit" but it doesn't explain why it even exists

i choose this, have you guys ever seen it? you can purchase it now, it's a great deal, and the best controller (literally flawless)

>>4631230
I haven't seen any threads about the Retro Fighters© Next Gen N64 Controller. Tell me more!

>>4631235
it deserves its own thread :)

>>4630595

Not a contest. Twin sticks gives much greater ability to control the camera than a single-stick setup. The better ergonomics of the Dualshock are just the icing on the cake.

Now, if we were talking a contest between original controllers for the three consoles, the Saturn's 6-buttoned pad would take the cake even without an analogue stick.

>>4631282
>Twin sticks gives much greater ability to control the camera
What PS1 games allow you to do that?
In fact, I can't think of many PS2 games that do that, free-camera movemenet with right stick became a standard on 7th gen.

>>4630595
I want to catch them all.

>>4631282
The PS1 has a better controller from a pure design perspective but in terms of real world application the controls are dogshit because most games were built around dpad-only controls of the original controller, and because Sony had no standards when it came to making sure their devs had proper control schemes. A perfect example would be something like Quake 2 which offers only a retarded choice of control schemes and no customization option on PS1, versus the N64 which allows you to fully customize the controls (which is the case with basically every single shooter on the console)).

>>4631085
the saturn 3D pad is extremely nice for what 3D games were on the Saturn. Plus it works in software as the official wheel as well (even for games that were released before the 3D pad launched). A little known fact about the 3D pad is that it's a hall-effect based analog system (using sensors to read magnetic values that change as you move the thumbpad around) so there's virtually no wear on the stick.

>>4631083
the idea was to add on stuff like rumble packs and to even be able to use it on a later Sega system by just swapping the cord, but obviously nothing came of it.

>>4631230
>literally flawless
How I know you're a paid shill, the manufacturing defect has already made rounds on the internet

>>4631501
Me thinks jokes aint yer forte.

>>4630595
There's a reason the general shape of practically every controller afterwards was based on the PS1's.

hahahahahahaha@saturn controller

holy shit does that thing look stupid

im fucking dying here

it looks like a fucking frisbee

how did that shit get past the concept stage?

>>4630595
Are you using PS4 sticks on the PS1 controller?

>>4632067
you could use google you fucking dumbass
https://kotaku.com/5816069/the-evolution-of-the-playstation-control-pad/

>>4632070
>linking kotrash
Kill yourself, retard.

>>4630689
>what's wrong Sony?
What did he mean by this? They found a solid controller design and stuck with it?

>>4630689
You can't change perfection

>saturn
Comfy, responsive, great
>ps1
Silly dpad BS, decent
>n64
WHAT THE LIVING FUCK NO FUCK YOU NINTENDO

As usual, Saturn wins. People who sided with N64 or PS1 in that generation were idiots. Saturn games were better, Saturn controllers were better, Saturn everything was better.

And I had all 3 consoles, so no bias. Just fact.

>>4632150

>>4632150
>worst graphics of the three
>worst controls of the three
>worst games of the three
>"Saturn wins"
Sega fanboyism should be classified as a mental disorder.

>>4632176
This.

>makes shit hardware
>fanboys still buy them
>release a bunch of absolute dogshit games
>fanboys still buy them
>shits on every decent franchise they have
>fanboys still buy and defend them

>>4631881
But it's better than the other 2.

>>4632176
>>worst graphics of the three
That would be PSX with its wobbly models and warping textures, or N64 with its vaseline smear and shit draw distance (dat fog).

>worst controls of the three
What does this even mean? The controller? Because its design is still being replicated today for fighting pads, pic related.

>worst games of the three
It had far greater third-party support than N64 and a higher quality-to-quantity ratio than the ShovelwareStation, try again.

>>4632434
>That would be PSX with its wobbly models and warping textures, or N64 with its vaseline smear and shit draw distance (dat fog).
No actually it would be the console with the insanely retarded architecture and the lack of almost any decent looking 3D games: the Sega Saturn.
>What does this even mean? The controller? Because its design is still being replicated today for fighting pads, pic related.
Hmm.. well, let's see, it means that the controls suck. The basic pad is only good for 2D games, and the 3D pad is undermined by not having a second analog stick (PS1) nor way to play with dpad + analog (N64). Not to mention the overall retarded circular design.
>It had far greater third-party support than N64 and a higher quality-to-quantity ratio than the ShovelwareStation, try again.
Lmao imagine being this fucking delusional. The N64 had all of the Nintendo, Rare and Midway classics which number into the dozens, and the PS1 had a library of over two fucking thousand games. Your shit-tier arcade port box with no support outside of Japan is a fucking joke. End of story.

>>4630595
>slippery Saturn 3D pad "stick" (more like a limited trackball with a crater for your thumb)

>hard edge of 64 stick diggin into my thumb, ok thanks that doesn't hurt at all

>porous rubber thumb stick on Sony's controller sweat sticky film after some use and no one has yet been able to explain to me why this is -- and it will happen on DS2, DS3 and sixaxis pads too

>>4632512
Lol if at any point the "hard edge of the 64 stick" physically hurt you, you are a complete faggot.

>>4632452
Imagine getting this buttblasted over someone not having a hateboner for a console like you do.

>>4632529
Imagine pretending that one of the worst consoles ever made was anything other than a complete piece of shit, and having to post memes of a 25 year old marketing persona to defend it.

>>4632512
>porous rubber thumb stick on Sony's controller sweat sticky film after some use and no one has yet been able to explain to me why this is -- and it will happen on DS2, DS3 and sixaxis pads too

The sticks on the Dual Analog are not porous nor rubbery. You people need to stop thinking the Dual Shock line is the only game in town for PlayStation controllers and give the original a go.

>>4632549
Before the trolls and autists dig in I just want to clarify I mean the original analog controller, as pictured in the OP, not the Analog Stick nor the digital pad.

>>4632452
>insanely retarded architecture
Only to westies. The Japs were more than competent with programming SuperH ASM. Sorry you're too stupid to program for more than one processor, though.

>and the lack of almost any decent looking 3D games: the Sega Saturn.
Good thing it made up for its lack of 3D games by having some of the best looking 2D games at the time. Also, in the '90s, 2D > 3D.

>Hmm.. well, let's see, it means that the controls suck.
"Controls" refers to how a game plays, you mean controller. Study up on your English, third-world-kun.

>The basic pad is only good for 2D games
So? It was and still is the best design for 2D games, that in itself is a massive accomplishment.

>and the 3D pad is undermined by not having a second analog stick (PS1) nor way to play with dpad + analog (N64).
More than one stick was hardly used during that gen anyway, and there are very few situations where using the D-pad and analog stick at the same time with the N64 pad were preferable due to only having access to 2 buttons without having to re-arrange your hands all the time.

>>4632452
>Not to mention the overall retarded circular design.
Confirmed for never using one. It is longer than it is wide and has grips in the back. It's a super comfy controller, much moreso than the PSX's angled grips or the N64's awkward tri-prong set-up. In fact, it was so good, Microsoft decided to copy it for their Xbox line of pads.

>The N64 had all of the Nintendo, Rare and Midway classics which number into the dozens
Rare and especially Midway were shit, so all you actually had was Nintendo.

>and the PS1 had a library of over two fucking thousand games.
And around 99% of those were actually worth playing.

>Your shit-tier arcade port box with no support outside of Japan is a fucking joke. End of story.
I'll take the arcade port box over the shit-tier JRPG box or the shit-tier collectathon box, thanks.

Also, you make it sound like only being supported by Japan (the best arcade/console game makers at the time) to be a bad thing. Amusing.

>>4632580

>Also, you make it sound like only being supported by Japan (the best arcade/console game makers at the time) to be a bad thing. Amusing.

Having to learn a language that typically takes at least 18 months of study to achieve basic competency to fully enjoy a software library is not an asset.

>t. owner of a Japanese Model 1 with entire collection in NTSC-J format

>>4632763
You really only need to know the language if you want to play JRPGs. People don't play fighting games and shmups for the deep lore.

>>4632452
>No actually it would be the console with the insanely retarded architecture and the lack of almost any decent looking 3D games: the Sega Saturn.

The funny thing is in 2018 if you go back and play that generation of consoles on a real deal CRT the Saturn has the 3D game that arguably holds up the best.

A lot of the games that at the time were considered graphically superior due to pushing the effects to the max now look like absolute dogshit. All of those fancy effects are now a low resolution mess running at god awful frame rates.

But then you have fucking Virtua Fighter 2. Yeah you look at some stills of it on the internet and you go "meh" but then you actually play the fucking game.

Rock solid 60fps at fucking 704x480 resolution. Art design kept everything within the limits of the console so the polygons and textures all look crisp even if more simplistic that what came in later games of that console generation and there are no over abundance of shitty effects.

This leaves the game clean and fluid as fuck looking even in 2018 as opposed to the dogshit low resolution low frame rate crammed with shitty textures and effects games that were considered "better graphics" 20 years ago.

>>4630595
The one with 2 analogue sticks 10 times outta 10

>>4632580
>Rare and Midway were shit
OH I AM LAUGHING
You wish Gran Turismo was this good

>>4632990
Midway themselves didn't develop that though. Plus Stunt Racer 64 was better.

>>4632986
In which games do you use the right one?

I'd go with the PS1 controller. Saturn's 3D controller was less comfortable than I remember it being last time I used one and it's an 8-way nub for the 3D-ness, not true analog. N64 would be my top but the analog stick is very flimsy, hard on the thumbs, and once it's worn down becomes quite a pain to use. This is not a new thing, back in the day when the console was new I'd have to constantly get new controllers because the analog sticks would grow insensitive and start grinding themselves down after a lot of use (the dust would accumulate in the socket for the analog stick, which is how even 12 year old me knew).
PS1, on the other hand, felt cheap as hell especially compared to later revisions. But it feels much more comfortable since Sony hasn't changed their core controller setup in 4 generations.

Now if you went PS2/Dreamcast/Gamecube/Xbox I'd do PS2>DC=Xbox>GCN. GCN controllers are great but I just can't use them for anything that isn't Smash/native GCN game, while PS2/DC controllers are the highly improved versions of the previous generation's controllers and Xbox controllers, at least the later revisions, are almost as comfortable as the 360 controllers.

>>4630595
*blocks your path*

>>4632576
>Only to westies. The Japs were more than competent with programming SuperH ASM. Sorry you're too stupid to program for more than one processor, though.
Lmao, what kind of argument is this? I'm not the one developing shit you dumb fuck. Fucking John Carmack himself said the architecture was retarded, and that guy has more intelligence in the tip of his dick than in the slice of meatloaf you call a brain.
>Good thing it made up for its lack of 3D games by having some of the best looking 2D games at the time. Also, in the '90s, 2D > 3D.
This is how you know you're dealing with a mentally ill Sega fan right here. Nobody gave a fuck about 2D in the 90s, it was all about 3D. If you're speaking purely from a retroactive standpoint, there are still more well-remembered, influential 3D games than 2D games.
>"Controls" refers to how a game plays, you mean controller. Study up on your English, third-world-kun.
It can be interpreted to mean both, and the fact that you're making a misbegotten attempt to attack grammar rather than attacking the argument is proof that you don't have one yourself.
>So? It was and still is the best design for 2D games, that in itself is a massive accomplishment.
Wow, awesome, a pad that was great for the least popular type of games.
> there are very few situations where using the D-pad and analog stick at the same time with the N64 pad were preferable due to only having access to 2 buttons without having to re-arrange your hands all the time.
Lol what? Almost every shooter on the N64 is best played with either the dpad + analog or c buttons + analog depending on if you are right or left handed. You can still access both the A/B button and two shoulder buttons with either method, how small are your hands?

>>4630595
Sega Saturn is the only good one. Just like every other gen with Sega competing.

>>4634249
Imagine being this deluded

>>4634915
Genesis D-pad is better than SNES.

Hey /vr/ is 8bitdo sf30(not pro) a good first controller? I have never played games with controller it has always been keyboard but now when I go to meets or friends I can't do anything with controller.
I really want to learn to play games with controller and snes pad looks sweet as fuck, please give me tips on getting good with pad, one situation I came across that really made me not enjoy pads was not being able to charge shot jump and dash together in some mega man.
Also please tell me some videos I can watch with snes pad hand cams, only one I know is trihex. Please /retro vee/

>>4630595
I used this for FFVII & Chrono Cross.

>>4634918
what does a genesis or snes pad have to do with the 3 that are pictured?
OH THATS RIGHT: NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

>>4634249
what a surprise, the tripfag picks the lamest pad.

>>4635000
Just pointing out Sega won there as well.
>>4635004
>Too stupid to realize I'm not a tripfag.

>>4636095
why did you delete your thread?

>>4630595
Most fun is top right, and most useable is top left. bottom center is trash

>>4636129
You can't delete threads that have been up for that long. Only mods can.
Seems like australia was banned finally, let's see if he comes back using a phone.

>>4636142
uh that's not cool.
i thought pic was just creepypasta, but if mods deleted the thread doesn't that kinda make it seem like it's true, thus the reason to delete?

>>4636143
Maybe, who cares. The good news is that australia was banned, hopefully.

>>4636142
they didn't delete his other thread >>4634279 so he wasn't banned.. they specifically wanted to wipe out that thread's contents

>>4636146
I guess they're preparing to launch Australia's dox info in some way.
Honestly, he deserves it.

>>4636148
lmao that's so fucked.
but sorry can you fill me in on why he deserves it? he seems annoyingas fuck but he's not off topic or anything?

>>4636148
and what if he's using a vpn or someone else's network/identity for safety, then they're attacking some innocent dude lol

>>4636151
>>4636154
are you scared now? :)

>>4636129
>>4636142
Can't delete threads that old.
I just got a global warning so odds are I'm getting banned any second for that thread.
It was an honor to post with you.

>>4636159
Told ya, you posted too many flamebait and avatarfagged in 24 hours.
You should have slowed it down man. You're addicted to shitposting. Spend some time off 4chan, go play some Sega Saturn or something.
Bye, you won't be missed.

>>4636156
i mean what could be spookier than a retro gaming forum moderator?

>>4636165
a retro gaming forum shitposter, of course!
:)

>>4636159
are you worried people are doxxing you and talking about you in IRC? (probably not true, would be an epic site privacy fail, and something tells me they're not exactly geniuses who would know how to do this anyways)

>>4636167
wow so intimidating when you use that covered smiley face! you mods sure are scary, not gonna mess with you!

>>4636168
>would be an epic site privacy fail
Which is why you won't see his personal info posted here. But still his personal data is already being passed down on IRC.
tripfags/namefag doxxing isn't a new thing anyway, it's happened a lot of times before.

>>4636172

yeah no. this is all just drama to scare people out of shitposting. shitposters would use neighbor's wifi or a VPN anyways. again, mods of this site aren't going to be able to enumerate someone's ID lmao

> hey guys check it out, i haxxored the shitposter's id. here it is! now what do we do with it... hm... darn shitposters!

>>4636181
Whatever helps you sleep, man.

Stop fucking with australia, he's probably schizo. Paranoia won't help him. Sure, he's a shitposter and deserves to be banne, but stop fucking with him about IP doxxing. Or at least don't mention here where he can read it.

>>4636185
can't sleep after >>4636167
>>4636156
smileys. definitely not a sad, overweight moderator trying to seem intimidating. probably the CIA or similar!

>>4636195
You seem to be a bit nervous tho.

>>4636193
i doubt he's worried and can see this is an attempt to scare him into not posting.
if people want to ban him fine, but larping about him being doxxed/haxxed is middle-school tier retardation, so it's funny to discuss and imagine the fedora wearers trying so hard to give off this impression

>>4636207
I don't even think they're trying to scare me into not posting, I'm just getting banned any minute like I said, that thread was used as my rule violation.

>>4636143
>>4636146
Just checked some other threads and a lot of my other posts were deleted like my anti-Mother ones and MK defending. Oh well, you'll be fine.

>>4636217
>>4636210
you seem self aware, so you know that most members here seem to despise you. why not just hold back on the type of posts you know pisses people off, and stop using a silly name? or are you trying to annoy people on purpose? i feel bad if its just that you're too socially awkward to know what angers people, but you're probably trolling...

>>4635004
>trip
nah man