/vr/ - Retro Games

>>4499146
return to /v/

>>4499149
Return to the uterus.

Looks like cheese Pizza.

>>4499153

>>4499154
Your pizza has burnt cheese and neon yellow crust? You've got to stop going to those Latino-run places, man.

>>4499146

But it is true. N64 had a castrated texture memory and could either have a lower amount of textures with high resolution or more textures with lower resolution, but never the same amount with the same res as another port.

>>4499146

>>4499172
But it isn't true. N64 could use tiling to wonderful effect, when properly utilized the N64 hardware could produce much better textures than either PS1 or Saturn, just look at the OP photo (which is not an emulator, by the way).
>>4499173
Nice bullshot. Quake 64 is actually one of the few games where you can turn off anti-aliasing completely and it looks nothing like that. See pic related.

>>4499173
>OP posts picture of amazing graphics on N64
>b-but here's a shitty looking game, that means those amazing graphics don't exist

>>4499182
his post is of the xbox live arcade remake, nintenfriend. compare quake on the n64 to the saturn version

>>4499184
Uh what? There's no Quake 1 on XBLA, that's Quake 3. And okay, Quake 1 on Saturn looks like dogshit, what's your point here?

>>4499185
Nvm misread that, but to clarify that isn't the XBLA remake.

>>4499184
>some retard unironically thinks the Saturn version actually looks better than the N64

If anything, the muddy textures and the lighting gives quake 64 a more grim atmosphere, the ost also helps.

>>4499201
On a side note, I actually love this version of the game. The colored lighting and new soundtrack as you mentioned really adds to atmosphere immensely. Also runs butter smooth most of the time. Great game.

>>4499185
>not comparing screenshots at the same resolution
>not even using the same same level
kek
>>4499191
the saturn version has excellent dynamic lightening and is very faithful to the PC original

>>4499205
>the saturn version has excellent dynamic lightening and is very faithful to the PC original
Absolute bullshit. The N64 version is far more faithful, a few missing levels and addition of colored lighting aside. Much of the geometry in the Saturn version had to be severely stripped down to account for vastly weaker hardware. Dynamic lighting is about the only thing it had going for it, and even then, that's a small consolation for smaller, simpler levels and mudwater graphics. Stop being retarded, the Saturn version looks terrible.

>>4499214
It literally looks identical to the software original running at 320x260 resolution

>>4499205
>not comparing screenshots at the same resolution
>not even using the same same level
Doesn't really matter what resolution or level you compare the versions on when you can just take one look at any screenshot from the Saturn version and see how fucking horrible it is.

>>4499216
you're taking a compressed, artifact ridden pic and using it to judge the graphics as a whole. see >>4499184 and tell me that doesn't look like the PC version

>>4499215
>It literally looks identical to the software original running at 320x260 resolution
I sincerely hope you aren't actually retarded enough to believe this. Regardless, whichever one is more faithful to the fucking ancient 320x260 version, the fact of the matter is that the N64 version is superior to the Saturn version in almost every regard -- texture quality, animation, model detail, and most of all, frame rate. But hey, Saturn has dynamic lighting LOL.

>>4499146
You literally already made this thread today on /v/, please stop trying so hard for attention on an anonymous imageboard.

>>4499220
>S-Saturn version looks better than N64
>gets assblasted by facts
>W-well it's more faithful to the PC original
>literally who cares
The absolute state of delusional Saturn fans.

>>4499221
how does it not? why are you so hostile
>>4499225
it literally does look better, no one likes vasaline textures

>>4499214
nice emulator

>>4499220
I grant you the still picture looks slightly more shitty than the webm, but dude, let's be realistic, they both look like a hot mess. It's a shame, I can't even find many pictures of the N64 version with the filtering turned off, if I could it would be even more glaringly apparent how pathetic the Saturn version is.
>>4499227
Just pointing out that, yet again, you keep ignoring the fact that Quake 64 allows you to turn the "Vaseline filter" off completely. See >>4499179

Just stop.

>>4499146
But that looks great

>>4499146
another 5th gen console war thread, and graphics whoring as well. /vr/ is fucking dead

It never fails, every time Quake 64 gets brought up, a veritable hoard of Saturn autists come out of the woodwork and start yapping about Saturn Quake -- not because they actually believe it looks good, but because it's incredibly impressive that such terrible hardware could produce something even half as good looking as Quake 64, despite the fact Saturn Quake runs at a blistering 10 frames per second.

>>4499231
You do realize it was sarcasm, right?

>>4499229
it still doesn't have good lighting, the original soundtrack, and a fourth of the levels
>>4499235
>Saturn Quake runs at a blistering 10 frames per second
literally factually wrong

>>4499227
>how does it not? why are you so hostile
I'm not being hostile, I'm just trying to get you to understand how retarded you're being right now. You're literally trying to convince people that the objectively worst looking version of the game is somehow better than a version of the game which runs on a console with 3x more powerful 3D graphics and at a higher FPS and texture resolution to boot.

>>4499242
see
>>4499240

>>4499240
>it still doesn't have good lighting,
LOL that's a laugh. Good lighting? Take one look at the Saturn version dude. It looks like mud. Quake 64 has fucking great lighting, extremely colorful and vibrant.
>the original soundtrack
You're right, it has a better soundtrack.
>a fourth of the levels
The Saturn version is missing all of the secret levels like Ziggurat Vertigo and only has a few more levels than the N64 version does. Not to mention, it's missing about half of the original geometry, so I'd say it evens out lmao.
>literally factually wrong
No, actually it isn't. There are literally times it dips as low as like 5fps, meanwhile the N64 version runs between 30 and 60 99% of the time.

Just watch this video and look at how choppy, dark, jagged and pathetic the Saturn version looks. Meanwhile, N64 is zippy, clean and colorful.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHHzyvCW_Ls

I just tried the n64 version without the filter and it looks fine.

>>4499237
Here its called shitpostin pardner

>>4499240
>look mom it blipped up to 30fps ONCE!

>>4499240
>Saturn Quake runs at a blistering 10 frames per second
>literally factually wrong
I've seen a video that compares the two versions (not the one the other anon just posted), and it isn't even an exaggeration to say the game barely climbs above 15 frames most of the time. Let me see if I can find it.

>>4499248
if you call piss yellow colorful than maybe. the Saturn version also has a few exclusive levels and the last two chapters have tons of colorful levels... sorry most of those were cut from the N64 version. kek

>>4499257
>if you call piss yellow colorful than maybe
No, I mean like how every level is exploding with a myriad of colors.
> the Saturn version also has a few exclusive levels and the last two chapters have tons of colorful levels
LOL a ton of colorful levels? Please, let's see them. The only "colorful levels" I recall from the Saturn version are a few individual spots where you'd see "piss yellow" or blood red lighting in a few little hallways or something.
>sorry most of those were cut from the N64 version. kek
>shitting on N64 for having like 5 less levels
>meanwhile Saturn version doesn't even have the real levels because it can't handle the geometry
Literally laughing at you right now.

>>4499262
I would show them to you but there is literally no footage of anything past the first few levels on the internet and i overwrote my saturn save file

Lemme get this straight out there from somebody who doesn't feel like they have a horse in this race.

Saturn Quake is an absolutely amazing technical achievement. People were long saying on forums that a game with Quake's polygonal complexity could never run on the Saturn or even the PS1. Yet they were proved wrong.

The port was made by Ezra Dreisbach who is basically a Carmack-tier coder, but who has experienced horrible career luck his whole life. The attention to detail in Quake Saturn is phenomenal and he even added really sweet colored lighting. THAT BEING SAID: Quake Saturn is what it is - a miracle port. The resolution is really low and murky, and the framerate is such that makes your average N64 Rare game look silky smooth.

Quake N64 on the other hand is a bloody rushed port made by a developer who either didn't care or didn't have much time to refine it. It's sloppy. It feels sloppy. They didn't even bother to make the light switches work in the fucking first level. That being said, because the N64 is like 3x faster at 3D than the Saturn, it's still the more playable version simply through the N64's sheer brute force. Sure some of the textures look like trash, but the game doesn't have such a drab appearance and the framerate is literally 2-3x higher.

So there you have it: a miracle port on weak hardware vs a sloppy port on strong hardware. Pick your poison. Or just play PC?

>>4499264
No, you won't show me because they don't exist. Like I just said, there's a few small areas where there is some bright colored lighting, that's it.

>>4499267
>It's sloppy. It feels sloppy. They didn't even bother to make the light switches work in the fucking first level.
>console port doesn't have a small feature that a PC game had, therefore it's a "rushed" and "sloppy" port
Quake 64 definitely could have used more TLC but it's not a sloppy port, it's actually quite impressive. A fully 3D game with a physics engine running at near-60fps with no texture warping is every bit as much of an achievement as the pathetic Saturn port. You would have needed a $1500 PC to display graphics like that found in Quake 64 at the time. Regardless of the Saturn version being an achievement, it doesn't change the fact that, taken on its own merits, it's a piece of shit. Quake 64 is actually playable, smooth, and fun.

>>4499269
I’m being baited but whatever. My action replay actually did have a backup of gloom keep, which is fairly colorful. The later episodes have some fantastic visuals.

>>4499272
It's sloppy because the N64 has almost as much power as a Pentium 75 with 3dfx Voodoo (more power in some departments), yet Quake 64 doesn't look or run as well as Quake on a PC with those specifications.

Yes, I know the N64 has like half the memory bandwidth of that configuration, so they couldn't get it running at 640x480. But it should have run at 640x240 at 30 FPS with same texture detail Literally no fucking excuse. And yes, I am aware that Quake on the Voodoo 1 had worse textures in some places than software mode due to some issue with OpenGL. N64's textures should have been that level at least.

>>4499281
That looks like a hot mess and outside from a few small blue and red accents there is almost no discernible color other than brown and grey.
>I’m being baited
No, you're just being retarded.

>>4499283
>It's pathetic that a $200 console port didn't look "quite" as good as a $1500 PC game

>>4499286
It would be asking too much if it looked as good, but it should have been the same thing at half the resolution. HALF

>>4499285
kek

>>4499272
Why is framerate so important all of the sudden? Doesn't OOT run at 15 fps?

>>4499293
>moving the goalposts

>>4499297
you really are from /v/ aren't you

>>4499293
OoT runs at 20 FPS (engine capped). And it's an action adventure game. Quake's a twitch arena shooter. I want more FPS from that. Goldeneye was fine since the game was about gadgets, sneaking and heatshotting.

>>4499298
That's kind of a stupid question anon.

>>4499291
Sorry for the potato quality, I don't have any kind of capture device, but even taking a picture of my shitty CRT with my shitty camera phone, it's easily apparent how much better this game looks than the Saturn version.

Quake, a game that looks like garbage on every single platform, including the PC original, is somehow being used as a benchmark for graphical fidelity ITT.

>>4499303
that look hideous

>>4499306
No, the Saturn version looks hideous.

>>4499307
maybe you just have shit taste

>>4499172
>N64 had a castrated texture memory
People really need to learn how this shit worked.

>>4499309
Maybe you're literally retarded because this looks vastly better than anything in the Saturn version by a mile.

>>4499293
Because playing a twitch shooter, with digital inputs, at 15 fps SUCKS. Quake is not fun on the Saturn and is really, really, really bad compared to a Pentium PC in software mode.

N64 was the console for FPS games for a reason. It is much more powerful than either competitor, because it is several years more advanced.

>>4499314
it look good on the saturn too

>>4499320
Except that looks like shit.

>>4499325
wrong

>>4499329
>shit textures
>warping and jitter
>Saturn can't even produce straight lines
>overly dark and muddy
Try again

>>4499331
quake is overly dark and muddy though, and this game emulates the original. if you want a vibrant saturn game play NiGHTS, the best fifth gen mascot game

>>4499331

>>4499335
>saturn can't produce straight lines

>>4499337
>Saturn now magically has a z-buffer

>>4499335
>>4499337
Both consoles will zigzag because they don't divide by z when they texture map. It's as simple as that. In my experience there's slightly less zigzag on Saturn though.

>>4499338
I have literally never seen affine texture warping on any saturn game ever. What I DO see on the other hand is quad distortion when verticies are off screen

>>4499341
>I have literally never seen affine texture warping on any saturn game ever.
Really gets the noggin' joggin'.

>>4499345
see
>>4499184

>>4499348
meant for >>4499345

>>4499312
I'm genuinely curious, can you explain how this works? Does this mean N64 actually had more texture memory than its competitors, or...?

>>4499348
are you still here /v/? the saturn LITERALLY does not have zigzagging because the system process and renders polygons as squares, or quads. there is no cobbling together two triangles like in >>4499341

>>4499360
Are you still retarded anon? Literally just showed you that there is zigzagging right here >>4499348.

>>4499363
Man, the N64 is such a sexy machine. Still so sleek and inviting, even after all these years. Saturn and PS1 look like fucking geriatrics.

>>4499363
well, saturn literallycan't do true 3D. it's a 2D machine powerful enough to distort sprites into position and construct 3D environments

>>4499363
Going to interrupt this retarded conversation to comment on this "fake 3d" meme. 3d means there are 3 dimensions. It doesn't matter how it is rendered. Hard Drivin' is 3d. So is Virtua Racing on the same console, and a few other games, too. The only reason no one considers the Genesis a "3d console" is because none of the 3d games are good. Not being it isn't "real 3d". It is.

>>4499356
The N64's GPU can't draw textures straight out of the RAM, it has to copy them first to the 4 KB texture cache. Meaning each texture can't be bigger than 4 KB.

PS1 doesn't have that issue. It can texture either out of VRAM or out of 2 KB texture cache.

Why is it like that? Cause N64 has only one memory channel due to Nintendo being Scrooge McDucks. Cause of that every time RAM is accessed no other component can access it during that period (think of one-lane highway). If GPU textured straight from main RAM the whole system would then constantly grind to a halt, so Nintendo/SGI forced texturing from texture cache to prevent that. It's also due to the way texture filtering works, cause filtering requires 4x the RAM access of no-filter. So not filtering from cache is impractical.

>>4499369
You're right, the PS1 and Saturn are both 3D machines when nothing on the screen is moving.

>>4499373
why does everyone on /v/ suck nintendo's cock so much?

>>4499371
Interesting, so this means that the PS1 theoretically has 1MB of RAM since it can draw directly from VRAM then? But does the disc format limit this at all?

>>4499376
Probably because they're the only name in the business who's ever been worth sucking.

>>4499380
what about sega?

>>4499376
Because everyone on /v/ grew up with an N64 and still fall for the console war meme. Sony is the only company worth hating

>>4499383
I mean, they made some decent games here and there, but by and large they were a clusterfuck of a company. The Genesis was the only legitimately good console they ever made, and even then it was riddled with underdeveloped ideas and the like. Nintendo has always been the one company that creates consoles that are built like a rock and brimming with games of the highest quality. Granted, post-GameCube Nintendo has been pretty shit, but classic Nintendo is amazing.

>>4499379
In practice the N64 texture limit is about 64x64 at 8-bit color (you can go higher res if you have grey-scale textures, Goldeneye did this). I think the limit on PS1 for individual textures is 256x256 at 8-bit color (66 KB), so it's not like you could draw a texture as big as a whole 1 MB.

On N64 you can just refresh the 4 KB texture cache many times per frame. So if you wanted a 256x256 texture you would just divide up that texture into 64x64 chunks and load each piece into the texture cache for a total of 16 refreshes.

Now cause the N64 has that single memory channel, it's really hard to keep refreshing the texture cache for bigger textures without taking a big dump on system performance, so not many developers did it. Pretty much only Rare and a few others.

Disk format doesn't really limit PS1 so much, except that there's a massive access latency so you can't stream new data in so easily. That's why there's usually load times for every new area. Games like Soul Reaver got around that by having loading corridors.

>>4499386
You're looking at it wrong. You come across as someone who hasn't played one or two Sega games and still clings to the "they're not Nintendo" argument. Nintendo was consistently smart about how they managed their company, Sega wasn't. That's irreverent at the end of the day though, because that's ancient history. Their games have always been high quality.
>and even then it was riddled with underdeveloped ideas and the like
is this a throw away line or do you have literally anything to support it?

>>4499393
*has

>>4499267
saturn quake isn't even a real quake it's some doom-tier engine that pretends to be a quake game

>>4499397
you're trying

>>4499393
>Their games have always been high quality.
Except they haven't, just look at their pathetic answer to SM64, Sonic Adventure. Try playing that today and tell me how "high quality" it feels compared to a fucking N64 game.
>is this a throw away line or do you have literally anything to support it?
Oh, plenty. How about the countless, worthless Genesis addons? Or the Saturn with its cobbled-together clusterfuck of chips? Sega is literally "Underdeveloped Ideas: The Company". The bulk majority of their products were rushed to market and given very little thought. You can blame this on a billion different things, most angst-ridden Sega drones like to talk ad nauseum about "SEGA OF AMERICA AND SEGA OF JAPAN HAVING CONFLICTING IDEAS", but at the end of the day, the end result were poorly implemented ideas and products that slowly widdled away at Sega until they were a hollow husk. Look, I've owned every Sega console, and they had a few good games, but to assert that they were anything but retards is laughable.

>>4499398
He's not wrong. It's powered using the Slave Driver engine, developed by Lobotomy Software, who also did PowerSlave on Saturn. It pretty much is a Doom engine, and it shows.

>>4499404
Where exactly are these countless, worthless Genesis addons? Are you talking about the Power Base Converter, which gives you access to the entire Master System Library? Or the Sega CD, which gives you access to CD based games runner on more powerful hardware?

Or are you talking about the 32x? One useless addon. But at least the graphics aren't LED-Red wireframes.

>>4499406
Slaver Driver is more advanced than Build engine you know.

>>4499404
>Sonic Adventure
okay maybe not all the time
>worthless Genesis addons
the games are scattered across their platforms. The Sega CD has Sonic CD, Ecco the Dolphin, Snatcher, the Lunar games, Terminator, etc. The Sega 32X is a piece of shit though. The Saturn is totally a clusterfuck, but it still had tons of great games too. The Dreamcast is arguably when Sega was at their best since the Genesis.

One way or the other, those are all hardware problems, I thought we were talking about games?

>>4499407
>at least the graphics aren't LED-Red wireframes
virtual boy even has good games, wario, teleroboxer, tons of unreleased games, and a great homebrew movement

>>4499404
>I've owned every Sega console
No you haven't, kek.

>>4499407
>implying Sega CD isn't a worthless addon
Now that's a laugh. Oh yeah, all those FMV games were fucking great. The Genesis looked like a heaping hunk of diarrhea with all of those things poking out, each with their own power supply no less. What a fucking terrible design. That's not even counting stuff like the Mega-CD. Then on top of that, you've got all the model variants, even that retarded Pioneer system that played Genesis games. Sega was constantly dumping money into all of this bullshit just to stay "new" and "relevant", meanwhile the SNES was absolutely blowing it the fuck out of the water -- and this is coming from someone who actually preferred the Genesis.

>>4499412
>someone random retard doesn't believe me
Oh well.

>>4499409
Dreamcast at least was Sega's most competent hardware ever. That PowerVR 2 chip was god-tier.

Genesis was pretty good hardware but it was flawed too. Sega made add-on support less than optimal, fucked up the sound chip's PCM timer (which is why so many Genesis games have crackly voices) and traded having more colors for MS support. Still, overall it was a fine effort, and gave the 2 years newer SNES a run for its money on several occasions.

>>4499409
That's just it. The games were scattered. Even with consoles like N64 and Gamecube, which many (though not myself) would argue had comparatively few good games, every Nintendo console has always had a slew of defining classics. Sega almost never had that. The Genesis did to an extent, but that's about it. Even the Dreamcast had a pretty pathetic library all said and done. You shouldn't have to purchase a bunch of bizarre addons and 4 different consoles just to get a few dozen decent games.

>>4499413
the irony is that you're the one who seems to be angst ridden. is everyone from /v/ like this? the Sega CD actually is a great addon with tons of great games, the FMV games are just a meme. but you wouldn't know that because:
>>4499414
kek didn't you just spend the entire thread talking nothing but shit about the saturn, and Sega as a whole? why would you buy all of their hardware other than it would look convenient in your argument

>>4499380
because???

>>4499416
but what does that matter after the fact? are you poor or something? even then don't you know what emulators are? that scratches out the saturn, but not all of their other consoles.

>>4499418
>kek didn't you just spend the entire thread talking nothing but shit about the saturn, and Sega as a whole? why would you buy all of their hardware other than it would look convenient in your argument
Typical autistic logic. I never said Sega never had good games, just that they often didn't know what they were doing and that their good games paled in number to Nintendo's offerings. The very fact I've owned everything from the Master System to the Dreamcast is why I'm appropriately prepared to speak on how shitty their respective libraries are.
>>4499420
>poor
>de facto non-argument
No, I'm just not enough of a retard to either A) waste money on a heap of decaying plastic consoles that I don't care too much about, or B) emulate and get an inferior experience. I'd rather devote my time and money to actually playing good games on fewer, better consoles.

>>4499413
Model variants are common. You only notice it because Sega changed the exterior shell more than is usual.

Also you are aware that the Mega-CD IS the Sega-CD, right?

The rest of your post is retarded. The SNES, at no point when Sega was selling the Genesis as its premier console, was "blowing it the fuck out". You know Sega released their next gen console 2 years before Nintendo, so that Nintendo was effectively no longer competing with the Genesis after 1995, right?

>>4499416
Wii U

>>4499425
>paled in number to Nintendo's offerings
they were about equal. Every big SNES game had a Genesis game to counter it, usually from the same company too. post a picture of your sega hardware by the way

>>4499234
It had potential, if it wasn't for the retards that take random screenshots from Google without knowing anything.

>>4499429
everything I've posted is OC running on real hardware

>>4499426
>Also you are aware that the Mega-CD IS the Sega-CD, right?
Yes, which is why I just brought it up...
>The rest of your post is retarded.
Pot and the kettle.
> The SNES, at no point when Sega was selling the Genesis as its premier console, was "blowing it the fuck out". You know Sega released their next gen console 2 years before Nintendo, so that Nintendo was effectively no longer competing with the Genesis after 1995, right?
Lmao, imagine being this delusional. The SNES was literally still outselling the fucking Saturn despite it being a next gen console, how's that for competition? The Sega Genesis sold roughly 30m units total, the SNES sold almost double that. Sorry, it got blown the fuck out.

>>4499431
> The SNES was literally still outselling the fucking Saturn
didn't it take Nintendo two years longer than the competition to enter the fifth-gen?
>The Sega Genesis sold roughly 30m units total, the SNES sold almost double that. Sorry, it got blown the fuck out
???????????
there's still debate TODAY over which console actually sold more

Sega has one of the most rabidly autistic fanbases I've ever seen, holy shit. They just can't get over the fact they were cucked by the big N. Shame.

>>4499431
>The Sega Genesis sold roughly 30m units total
It actually sold around 40m. Nobody knows the exact figure, since the only official number ever provided by Sega was 30m in November 1994 or some shit. They outsold Nintendo in Christmas 1994 btw, so you can bet that number grew by a lot before the Genesis was discontinued.

So there was about a 9 million difference between Genesis and SNES. SNES outsold the Genesis (Mega Drive) by something like 13 million in Japan. I'm sure it doesn't take a genius to do the maths and work out what that means. it outsold SNES globally if you exclude glorious nippon.

>>4499435
>didn't it take Nintendo two years longer than the competition to enter the fifth-gen?
Uh yeah, because their last-gen console was still selling better than Sega's next-gen console, lmao.
>there's still debate TODAY over which console actually sold more
There's really not, but it's cute that you think that.

>>4499436
Segafriends like every console though? I could be having a pro-nintendo discussion except that's not what I'm talking about ITT

>>4499438
>It actually sold around 40m. Nobody knows the exact figure, since the only official number ever provided by Sega was 30m in November 1994 or some shit. They outsold Nintendo in Christmas 1994 btw
>citation needed

>>4499442
the burden of proof rests on you /v/friend

>>4499440
You don't really have a choice. Your company of choice is a corpse and if you didn't "like every console" you'd still be playing nothing but Dreamcast games 18 years later.

Feels so good being a Nintenbro and knowing that Sega was literally so raped that they became Nintendo's buttslave and practically own Sonic.

>>4499442
http://segatastic.blogspot.com.au/2009/12/mega-drive-sales-figures-update.html

As I said, it's all speculation. We know it has to be at least 30m. But in reality it's gotta be a lot more than that, unless you literally believe Genesis stopped dead selling in November 1994? (even though they outsold Nintendo that Christmas)

>>4499445
look I get that you're "trolling" us, but can you please stop posting like a clearly underage /v/kid?

>>4499443
>the burden of proof rests on you /v/friend
Not sure why you need me to spoon feed you. Google "Sega Genesis", then "Super Nintendo", look at each Wikipedia article, roughly 50m for Nintendo and 30m for Sega. Now show me where they outsold Nintendo in 1994 and sold 40m units.

>>4499448
The truth hurts, buddy. You can write me off as a 17 year old /v/irgin but it won't change the fact that everything I've said is the truth and there's nothing you can do about it.

>>4499450

>>4499446
>using a Sega fan blog from 2009 as a source
You can't make this shit up.

>>4499456
Uh huh.... as I just said, roughly 50m for Nintendo and 30m for Sega. Your point is...?

>>4499459
these are confirmed sales, but again, sega never disclosed the final numbers

>>4499146
>/v/ brings decade old console wars to /vr/

>>4499461
I'm sure they never disclosed final numbers because they didn't want to make poor Nintendo feel bad about having sold so many more units, right?

>>4499463
Nobody is denying SNES outsold Genesis globally my friend. Sega knew that, and that's probably why they didn't confirm the final figures. But we know where the 30m number comes from. November 1994.

Again, unless you think they didn't make a single fucking sale from the very moment the figure was presented at that time, then it sold a lot more than 30m.

>>4499467
I've yet to see any proof of Sega outselling Nintendo in 1994.

>>4499469
not to move the goalposts but what does that even matter?

>>4499472
I mean, you're the one talking about how 1994 was this special year for Sega and how it must have contributed to undisclosed sales beyond 30m, so I'm kind of wondering where you get this idea from? I guess it doesn't matter, it's 5:21am on the east coast and we're both pretty autistic for even arguing about this. Good night anon.

>>4499469
Sega's US revenue in 1994/1995 was $1,812.
Nintendo's was $1,471. This is NPD data.

>>4499476
Revenue is completely different from stating that their consoles were outselling Nintendo's products. That revenue doesn't necessarily come from the sale of consoles.

>>4499476
should mention, if it isn't obvious, this is in units of millions of dollars

>>4499479
This is hardware revenue only. To be fair, it includes both Genesis and Sega CD, but since the latter sold like shit it shouldn't matter, right?

Revenue is a pretty good indicator actually, since it's pure sales (doesn't factor actual profit or anything). Both consoles had a similar price on the market.

>>4499482
oops I'm wrong it does actually include software. Do you have a good reason why Sega players would be more likely to buy more software per console than Nintendo players in 1994/1995?

If not, then your objection is moot.

Graphics fags were a mistake.

>>4499179
>Menstation watermark

Nice bender source you poofta

It isn't really fair to use Rare as an example, most of the library of the N64 had very muddy/blurry textures

>>4499754
>most of the library of the N64 had very muddy/blurry textures
same could be said of PS1 except with muddy/blocky

>>4499759
PS1 had pixelated textures

>>4499761
exactly
muddy and blocky

>>4499765
no, pixelated is sharp and clear.

>>4499772
sharp but not necessarily clear

>>4499376
Saturn one should have lower resolution, significantly lower colour count, and lower framerate.

>>4499363
>it's not real 3d because there's occasional glitches

>>4500649
>occasional glitches
That's a funny way of saying "hardware that can't produce real 3D"

>>4499464
And it's always the latest one you can discuss here, 5th gen. Makes you wonder.

sega was always off-brand, cheap stuff
thats why used sega hardware and games still go for so little compared to nintendo

>>4500723
These days it seems in PAL land Mega Drive games are more expensive than SNES games

Explain that hmm

>>4500723
Nintendo is the Apple of games. That's why everything is (over)valued

>>4499312
>implying that the majority of /vg/ are able to parse your diagram and understand the implications

>>4499240
>Screenshot of staring at a small room, you can see the FPS climb on the way in from the few seconds before
Not helping your case there, chiefie. Find a screenshot with open space and/or enemies and compare.

>>4499404
>>4499386

As people are now rediscovering, Sega has consistently put out games that were the best in the business for gameplay.

Also you've never played many Sega games or games in general.

>>4499404
Why wouldn't it feel high quality? It has a vastly higher level of production and better graphics.

>>4499425
Except Sega had way more good games. Very little of anybody's stuff holds a candle to their Arcade games. Something Nintendo was so bad in they had to drop out of the industry.

>>4499457

With sources you illiterate fuck.

>>4500723
A lot of Arcade PCBs go for less than some Nintendo meme game nowadays. What's your point?

>>4499573
It says Meristation you mongoloid

>>4502163
What does that even mean?

>>4499146
one thing i don't understand is so many people give the N64 shit for "bad graphics" and "early 3d" but give the original playstation a pass

>>4502198
What I can't understand is that /v/ mentality of people giving a shit about a company's financial situation 30 years ago instead of discussing the games.

>>4499573
>poofta

>>4502169
Was a Spanish cyber-café. It end up being a gaming magazine.

It's a shitty way to write Mary's Station.

>>4502198
Because there are 3x as many people bought a PS1 as an N64 and Sony in general has one of the most rabidly autistic fanbases on earth. Anybody who isn't literally retarded can take one look at some of the better N64 games and tell you they look vastly superior to even the best PS1 games. Somehow Sony ponies have deluded themselves into believing that eye-bleeding graphics riddled with jaggies, diarrhea textures and jittering polygons are actually better looking than the likes of SM64 and Ocarina of Time. It's a mental disorder, really.

>>4502216
>chips
Those are crisps you nonce

>>4499456
Tectoy hue hue

>>4499452
>>4499445
Why are you acting like Nintendo is good now-a-days? It's all easy-to-play rehashed garbage for kids now. I mean, even back then that's pretty much what it was but not nearly as bad as now.

>>4499202
It actually looks impressive

>>4504041
Oh I don't know, maybe it's because they're obviously doing something right considering it still sells?

Why the fuck would you want to run Quake on a console? You get a free potato computer that will run it with ease, and then you can use a mouse like a normal person.

>>4505207
The levels in both Quake 2 ports are unironically better than the originals.

>>4505219
Doesn't make up for the fact that they look like a pile of shit, and play worse. Maybe I'm old school, but I can't stand FPS games on any console. Using a controller to play an FPS feels like trying eat soup with a fork.

>>4505228
You're exaggerating you big drama queen, of course mouse controls are better but this isn't a competition.

>>4505228
Find a way to port the levels from Quake 2 console to PC then we'll talk.

>>4505219
Glad someone else agrees. I always thought Quake 2 N64 was way more fun than the shit PC version, not to mention it actually added muzzle flash which was a bizarre omission in the PC version. The level design was tighter and more interesting, and the weapon balancing was way better too.

>>4505189
Well yeah, there's still tons of kids out there.

>>4499341
Very instructional image, thanks

>>4499391
And best post, thanks anon

>>4499240

how is called this specific application?

(not the game, the fps counter)

>>4505907
Don't worry, all the mature sonic games are coming to Nintendo anyway

>>4506808
I think only Digital Foundry have this technology

>>4499146
>Read entire thread
>It's just another "LOL DAH N SICKTFO' ESS SHEIT" thread

Fuck you faggots, I love the N64.

>>4499146
Now post the original version

>>4506969

faggots

>>4507309
It is the original version

>>4506919
My point is that Sega didn't rehash the same games and they weren't overly easy.

>>4499407
unlike nintendo who had the ripoff e reader for gba, the dd64 which was useless, the gamecube modem

>>4499431
old consoles use to sell more than the new ones for the first couple of years, the ps1 didn't really take off until early 97

>>4508376
I wonder how many people actually played the GameCube online? Presumably at least enough for PSO ep 3 to have online play like 1&2 before it.

>>4499179
I don't know who's trolling who but I don't think you know what these are
>anti-aliasing
>bilinear filtering

>>4508394
N64 anti aliasing IS just shitty bilinear filter anyway. And yes I do know what that is.

>>4500546
Shut
the
fuck
up
you
stupid
ass
mother
fucking
/v/ermin
before
I
take
this
fist
and
ram
it
into
your
stomach
and
rip
out
your
god
damned
spine
!

>>4508403
>N64 anti aliasing IS just shitty bilinear filter anyway
Anti-aliasing =/= bilinear filter on N64 (though technically texture filtering is a type of anti-aliasing, that is not what it means in the context of N64). N64 uses an edge AA algorithm which is not bilinear filtering.

Also bilinear filtering is not "shitty", it's still the standard form of filtering even on modern cards/games. Anisotropic filtering is just an extension on bilinear filtering that takes into account the texture's angle in respect of the game camera.

>>4505219
So fucking what, there's bound to be copies of the console levels on some quake mod site you twat.

>>4508423
Wait, so the cpu actually WASTED cycles on that smear filter? Fuck Nintendo.

>>4508412
Nice Running Man paraphrase

>>4499240
Is the lowest of this port