/vr/ - Retro Games

Obviously Ikaruga but some faggots will accuse me of trolling.
>but the chain system is pure route memorization!
So is the hidden bee chain system in Dodonpachi.
>but the 6th stage is too short and disappointing
Ketsui doesn't even have a 6th stage, the game ends at 5th.

Notice how even after coming up with good points you retards will still shrug my post off as trolling. You can't accept the truth.

>>4486934
>B-but Caveshit!

>>4486934
kys Treasurefag

>>4486934
Ikaruga is certainly unique, meaning having it as a favorite is quite valid, it means it suits your personal tastes more than any other shooter.

Complaints about how scoring systems are memorization-based are pretty bad and baseless since every single one of them is based on that (unless we get into some RNG heavy games I guess). Ikaruga is no different from the rest in the end, scoring systems are there for when you've mastered the game and want some challenge and fun after you've already memorized it.

>>4486748
instead of a thread where people learn about lesser known shmups, the autism in this board inevitable leads to predictable flame wars.

>>4486956
>developed by metal slug team
>lesser known

>>4486956
OP here. Sorry, buddy, that games is a run and gun and I am limiting this thread to pure shmups, read the OP carefully (GFII doesn't autoscroll and it has gravity/not 8-way movement). The game's still fun but please stick to the topic.

>>4486934
>>but the 6th stage is too short and disappointing
This is how I know you are baiting. Ikaruga only has 5 stages and its last stage is only 1 minute long, compared to any Cave shooter whose final level is 5+ mins.

Also DP and its sequels' scoring is lame, but Cave has done better than that. See: Dangun Feveron, Mushi Futari, Ibara, & Ketsui.

You Ikarugafags not only have shit taste, but don't even know what you are talking about. Go back to the IGN forums where your ilk belongs, thanks.

>>4486963
Yes it is. In The Hunt was developed by them too, is really good yet hardly gets mentioned. I doubt most Metal Slug fans are even aware of the existence of these games.

>>4486971
It's the anti-arcade shitposter, disregard him.

>>4486971
>Prove that he's not actually an ikarugafag
>Then bitch at him for being an ikarugafag
????

>>4486967
Enjoy your shitty thread then.

>>4486956
That game had a lot of potential but it's essentially an unfinished rushed game that doesn't even have original background music.

>>4486985
Thank you

>>4486973
Can confirm, I've known MS fans personally that didn't know about these.
In The Hunt just has too much slowdown... just like MS.

>>4486973
Now that I think about it, run and gun games that never got console ports are generally overlooked. OutZone is a real gem of a game, but is hardly brought up because it never got any ports unlike Truxton and Zero Wing. Even Mystic Warriors is ignored in favor of Sunset Riders, which isn't nearly as good.

>>4487002
>run and gun games that never got console ports are generally overlooked
Change run and gun for any genre and this works most of the time.

>>4487002
I like Sunset better than Mystic. Sunset is just pure run'n'gun, but Mystic has some cheap ass segments where you need to get lucky, like that minecart stage where you need to use your melee attack to neutralize bullets.

one thing I don't like about Sunset and Mystic is that when you slide, you automatically stand up. For example, slide and hold down, but you still stand up even though you're holding down. If I'm holding down, then I expect my character to be crouching when the slide ends.

Anyway, they're both very nice games. I haven't played them much, but a couple years back I barely one-coined Sunset and like 2/3-coined Mystic.

How would you rank the characters in Mystic Warriors? Homeboy seemed to be the best for me, and the girl seemed the weakest by far.

>OutZone
Yeah, that game really is a gem. Has a crapload of that Toaplan charm and goodness. I love that Yo-Yo weapon.

What you guys think about FixEight?

Maybe I'm just autistic, but I love how in OutZone the enemy explosions cause a lot of damage on the ground, but FixEight is missing that. Literally the only time you see the ground damage is in the first part of stage 1 in FixEight. It's as if Toaplan ran out of time to include the ground damage for the rest of the game.

Anyway, how would you rank the characters in FixEight?

Ninja and George Foreman seem to be the strongest by far. The lizardman is actually really strong too. The blue Dhalsim looking guy is actually really underrated. As long as you don't use his "S" weapon, he is solid as fuck. One of my easiest game clears was with him. The purple haired girl has ridiculous damage upclose but is royally fucked in the second half of the game if she doesn't have the proper weapon. The Ryu/Ken couple are solid but not spectacular. The robot though is a complete piece of shit.

Ninja = Foreman > Lizardman > Dhalsim >>>>> Ryu/Ken > Purple > Robot

Also, I heard the Japanese version is harder than the other versions. The Jap version is the only one I played, not because I'm a weeb autist but I just play the Jap version in all my MAME roms as a general rule.

>>4487009
I only use Brad because just looking at him makes me laugh, but I wouldn't recommend it. He's good for quick killing bosses but the delay between shots can be god awful. Spyros seems balanced from what I've played, though. It's a much harder game than Sunset Riders all around, requires more practice and strategy. That OST tho
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2lMFBCzMSU

>>4487014
I love those Toaplan run and guns but I'm saddened by the fact that I tried to make a thread for shmups like I described and we get run and gun discussion. Oh well. I know they're similar but I thought I made it clear.

>>4487020
Deal with it nerd, we're here to stay. OutZone is a hybrid anyway.

>>4487014
I didn't play FixEight very much. I heard people say it's worse than OutZone but they never go into specifics so it's hard to say. I love the visual style, though. Different but very nice to look at nonetheless.

>>4487014
both are great games. Toaplan is obvs reliable.

>>4487026
It doesn't autoscroll, it's all in the OP. But whatever, do as you like. At least this is a discussion about similar games and not some hate or shitposting.

>>4487020
"what's the best x" is usually not a good way to start a discussion about something

although I will commend this thread for proving that our resident treasurefag doesn't even play treasure games

>>4487034
I love going fast in this game. It's the reverse of the typical shmup with a regular and slow speed, here you have regular and fast as shit. I usually prefer shmups where you move relatively fast (hence Mars Matrix, but also Dangun Feveron)

>>4487014
How is the difficulty compared to the original btw?

>>4487037
It could be a good way, not my fault that people get so defensive about other's opinions though. At least I try to not incite flame shit.

>>4487020
I think it's because all of them are well known so people are thinking exotic.

"Anyone hurd of DoDonpachi?"

>>4487045
Even if mentioning popular games they could still try to argue why they think a particular game is the best. So far, nothing, though.

Speaking of VP1, haven't played that one much but I love the Raiden Fighters games.

>>4487051
I'm a big fan. Personal favorite is Raiden Fighters 1. The art style and fast paced music are neat.

>>4487057
The older Raiden games (which are honestly Toaplan ripoffs, even if good ones) are a tad too slow moving to me, these are much more exciting.

I like Irem games.

>>4487136
I like how Konami did Irem better than Irem with Xexex.

>>4487140
Xexex is pure sex.

>>4487140
Except xexex is not as good as R-Type

Let's try this: Which of these companies that focused on arcade shmups is your favorite, and why?

Only consider retro entries (for instance, for Cave any game from Mushi onwards doesn't count). Feel free to add any company I might have missed.

Cave
G.rev
MileStone
Psikyo
Raizing
Seibu Kaihatsu
Takumi
Toaplan

Again, can't decide myself but want to see what others think and discuss it.

>>4482740

I know ya'll will call this bait, but still. Metal Black is a very, very close second though if that gives anyone some solace.

>>4487034
This is one my top 3 favorite shooters and I can't even beat it.

Love the bright graphics with large bullets and enemies, so you feel like you died from a bullshit shot. Love the amazing music, best in any Toaplan game. Love the art design, feels like the peak of classic Toaplan.

>>4487162
R-Type is utter trash, lad.

>>4487801
Nah, Espgaluda is, again, a game that stands on its own with its unique mechanics and thus very easy to see why it could be your personal favorite.

>>4487804
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wRairN1OAtk

>>4487817
One of the best damn games of all time. You can't just say that.

>>4487903
I guess he says that because the game has a simplistic scoring system compared to later games and is more memorization-based for survival runs.

>>4487475
It's tough to pic; All of them have a handful of great games.

>>4487918
It's about the experience man. Forget about autistic number pushing for a while and enjoy the journey.

>>4487921
I don't necessarily agree with the poster that trashed R-Type, I'm just trying to see his point.

You can enjoy the journey, sure, but I guess to some the lack of a deep scoring system makes a game less replayable to some.

what's the point of these threads besides calling each others names? I've already knew about all of these games for 20 years
>inb4 what's the point of thinking or some equally retarded strawman

>>4487934
To see what games others prefer and maybe even see games with a new perspective if they convince you with their reasons why it's their favorite. And more. People just prefer to shitpost.

>>4487930
Yeah I'm not accusing you specifically of anything.

From the replayability argument we again can get back to the autism angle. You see, not only do autists like numbers, they like repetition. Instead of moving on from one game to the next, they cry about muh replayability not being able to appreciate that a game can be entertaining for just one time only. I prefer to have many different experiences, revisiting old ones maybe years afterwards. Not that the autistic approach is necessarily wrong.

>>4487945
I myself value when a game is replayable, not necessarily again and again, just a game that you can enjoy coming back every one in a while. If you can only enjoy it absolutely once then I consider that a flaw.

>>4487475
Milestone is my fav overall, i fucking love everything about nearly all their games aside from chaos field. Radirgy,karous and illvelo are fantastic, amazing osts, easyish clears for casuals but hard to score well, love the cel shading to.

Cave gave me guwange blue version which is the ultimate underated gem of the genre for anyone who's willing to learn it.

Raizing for batrider.

Objectively though if possible it's hard to not see cave as the best due to the sheer quantity of great output they have.

>>4487945
you're a pleb though only experiencing mediocrity and muh aesthetics, this is honest to god the truth that all the real wonder only comes to those who invest fully into a game, the nuance and depth is off the charts. Playing for score is the ultimate experience available in this genre, all the frustration and work is worth it when you get that 1 run.

>>4488087
Batrider is probably the most fun I've had this year trying to clear a game

>Objectively though if possible it's hard to not see cave as the best due to the sheer quantity of great output they have.

They didn'd make as many games in /vr/ times, but they sure did outlast their competitors for quite a while.

>>4487945
Except replayability is about depth and not repetition, or avoiding different experiences like you describe. Some games have a high skill ceiling that leaves plenty of room for improvement as well as new techniques to explore after clearing it for the first time. Some people prefer discovering all of what a game has to offer during subsequent playthroughs, instead of a game that offers nothing after only one playthrough. Your "autism" claim would only make sense if you're playing games with little to no depth over and over again while experiencing no progression or learning nothing new.

>>4488096
>>4488138
Yeah, these guys make a good point; sorry, buddy. Though I can still see how sticking WAY too much to something, even if complex, can seem a bit autistic (see: speedrunning community)

>>4487475
>Cave
Dangun (needed a loop though, it's way too short of a game).

>G.rev
Shit dev, pass

>MileStone
Shit dev, pass

>Psikyo
Hard to choose, all their games are great. I'll go with Gunbird2.

>Raizing
Garegga. BatRider is more interesting but also far more bullshit.

>Seibu Kaihatsu
Raiden Fighters

>Takumi
Mars Matrix, wish the arcade version didn't have a counterstop.

>Toaplan
Fire Shark

>>4488190
This was not the point but interesting, though I'd appreciate your reasons as to why these are your favorites.

Dangun Feveron's scoring is crazy fun so no surprise here, though seeing it as your favorite Cave game makes it seem you aren't much of a fan of the company since that's the least Cave-y game they've done IIRC.
Why would you say the guys that did games for the Naomi are shit?
I swear there are parts in Batrider where you can't see well, the background blocks the view of the bullets.
Can you counterstop Mars Matrix? Impressive.

My favorite retro shooter dev is Toaplan because I like huge ships, huge bullets, and incredibly harsh synth soundtracks.

>>4488210
Toaplan is one of the most underrated companies outside of arcade/shmup enthusiasts, they basically established and refined the vertical auto-scrolling shmup formula.

>>4488213
I didn't know about them until I got into the Sega Genesis in more recent times. Back in the day I only knew about Raiden and various Capcom shooters like the 1943 series.

>>4488220
Yeah. and as I've mentioned before here, the non-Fighters Raiden games are very much inspired by some Toaplan earlier titles.
Capcom didn't focus exclusively on shmups and the way their games were made didn't have as much of an impact in the long run; by this I mean later vertical arcade shmups resemble Toaplan games much more (shops, healthbars, and other Capcom elements are a rarity).

Tyrian is GOTYOAT for me. I never owned an Amiga, but it feel so Amiga. I loved the tracker music, sounded like it was right from the demoscene. I would love to find a modern game with the same sort of mechanics and progression to Tyrian, even if it isn't retro, or is 3D.

>>4488232
Jets n Guns. It's the only game of this euroshmup style I've played, actually. I was about to give Tyrian a try since it's free on GoG but I never did.

>autism
This is the stupidest buzzword, especially when used in an argument for this genre which rewards repetition and practicing a 30 minute game for hours until you get a basic survival clear.

>>4488803
Another thing is that a lot of (if not most) dedicated players didn't just start off the way, they too played for mindless entertainment/novelty until that got boring after which they started putting more effort for bigger rewards.

The holy trinity of Psikyo

>>4488803
Not a buzzword, it applies perfectly.

>>4488927
It is a buzzword unless you want to go further and say that everyone who enjoys developing any skill is autistic, in which case you might be some variety of retarded yourself

>>4488917
Looks about right. Dragon Blaze is GOAT material

>>4488945
Autistic is a buzzword but retarded is fine? You're a hypocrite (and autistic).

>>4488953
Yes, context matters, if you think that enjoying developing a skill = autism then there's something wrong with your brain

>>4488959
>implying vidya teaches skills

Fuck, you are dumb.

>>4488961
Ah, it's you. A shame the jannies didn't wipe you off this board when they were mopping up your shitposting.

>>4488964
That wasn't me though, now this is me: Fuck you're dumb,

>>4488917
Strikers is great

>>4488982
Why don't people like III though?

>>4488981
Not him but you clearly don't know what skills means you fucking plum cunt, what do you think skills only relates to employment or something? what a mong fuck, of course you need to acquire skills to get good at shmups and other skill based vidya, how could anyone even doubt that? you are what you eat, guess ape sperms on the menu.

>>4488959
this, autism is the latest buzzword used by those who are low skill and know they are shit so need to protect the ego by shaming others as having some kind of issue or abnormality to reduce the value of the achievement. Basically it's only said by lazy degenerate normie shits who will never get good at anything, ever.

>>4486934
>ikaruga
>6th stage
>i'm not trolling, though!

>>4488994
I can't believe a simple insult caused this much damage.

>>4488964
Who are you talking about?

>>4488102
>They didn'd make as many games in /vr/ times
true but most of their best work was 1st gen anyway, they peaked at pgm.

>>4488190
your taste is fucking atrocious, i doubt you've even played grev or milestone games.

>>4488196
>Why would you say the guys that did games for the Naomi are shit?
because they haven't played them and are to stuck in their ways, anything different is instantly bad to a lot of shmup players because they suck at adapting. It's why guwange isn't popular in the west, ther in genius new control method proves to much for pea brains who want the same dot dodge game every time.

>>4489004
Some reddit gen Z kid who's trying to kick veterans out of the board and in his own words turn this into hipster /v/

>>4489005
>ther in genius
Ah yes I did play Borderdown and Under Defeat.

>>4487475
>Cave
Mushihimesama and the DDP series. Great stuff.
>Psikyo
Strikers. Enough said.
>Raizing
Bakraid
>Seibu Kaihatsu
Pic related.
>Toaplan
Same! Same! Same!
>UPL
Strahl
>Tehkan
Star Force

>>4489006
As a result of being insulted for sucking at some game no less.

>>4489003
I can't believe you couldn't think of one actual argument against all that damage and had to memepost.

>>4489024
I just got here, btw, I'm not the guy you were replying.

>>4489027
Switched to your phone for the new IP? Good thinking.

>>4489028
Nah just open cmd type ipconfig -release ipconfig -renew. You noobs don't understand shit about computers.

>>4489029
This is some good bait.

>>4489030
I'm gonna be perfectly honest with you, these days I have more fun watching people 1cc arcades than playing them myself. I feel like this part of my life is done and put behind.

>>4487475
I have a tough time choosing between Raizing and Cave. Cave played purely for survival is really boring and their games don't really differentiate themselves, but if you care even the slightest bit about score they become entirely different and deep experiences. If we're considering everything before Mushi to be game for this board, then I'd easily say DOJ is my favorite shmup, perhaps even just one of my favorite games; there's just something so addicting about it. Normally I despise chaining systems, but hypers add just enough lenience that I find myself thinking of different ways to link chains even when playing other shmups.
Raizing, however, just make some fantastic fucking games even ignoring the score systems. Sorcer Striker is a treat, and I can easily lose an afternoon just plugging in credits. Garegga and Batrider may be some of the highest points of the genre, Garegga for intrinsically linking scoring and survival play, and Batrider for taking that system and adding a ridiculous amount of variation due to not only having a dozen ships, but having them all work together with the team system.

Fire Shark is my shit, tho. Not usually big on Toaplan, but something about that game is captivating.

I find it extremely hard to keep focused on 1cc attempts when it's just me sitting alone in a dark room. At least with streaming you've got people cheering you on, even the trolls help too as motivation because you really want to shove in their faces that you've made it despite their constant roasting.

>>4489052
Doesn't sound like you enjoy games, I just play an hour of runs each day to relax and it works out fine. Better than bashing my head against a wall for hours and watching my performance get worse with each run.

>>4489064
>Doesn't sound like you enjoy games
That's right, I can barely find enjoyment out of videogames anymore, the only way I can have fun is by trolling on 4chan.

>>4489070
What's your high score for (You)s?

>>4489072
Right now I have 14

>>4489076
That's pretty low, senpai. Come back when you can compete with the TORtanic post from /v/ that broke the board.

>>4489082
I actually made a couple of le epic reply screenshot myself I just never bothered saving them.

Muchi Muchi Pork is a nice game.

Anyway my point is fuck videogames and the losers who play them.

>>4489085
Not retro moeshit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-U6dCNJZ8Q

I found this game going randomly through Mega Drive ROMs. Ok, apparently it's a cult classic but I'm pretty unlearned when it comes the the Mega Drive library, anyway it's a pretty sweet shooter. I like shoot'em ups where you don't fly a plane.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEF6oyZI-bA

>>4489136
It's too easy. The cave shaft boss has a pattern that can be milked until counterstop and you gain a million lives just from playing normally.

>>4489085
nah, it gives you like 40 lives. It's annoying as fuck to play desu.

>>4489009
Yeah so you have shit taste and haven't played them much or you're a one trick pony pixel dodger. You haven't played milestone either so shut the fuck up.

>>4489003
Really? this is your strategy? you get proved wrong time and time again then instantly retreat to "kek le epic trul rite guise?", no really you're simply not a smart person.

>>4489157
I did play Radirgy, I thought it was pretty bad.

>>4489157
I thought Radirgy and Karous were fucking copy pastes of each other.

>>4489157
>reddit spacing
We can tell you are posts from a mile away, Cee.

I've been playing Harmful Park for the last few days and have been enjoying it greatly. Probably the best Cute Em Up next to Parodius. Stages are varied, four default weapons with three upgrades and difficulty settings for absolute beginners and veterans alike.

>>4489179
>shitty snes graphics
>no arcade release
>no second loop
It's trash. You only like it for the cute girls.

>>4489181
Go be a hipster that pretends to be a hardcore arcade player on /v/

>>4489182
It's ok if you only play games to masturbate at cute girls anon, remember you are a loser and no woman would ever touch you in real life.

>pop cown

>>4489185
You're projecting and I'm not even the anon who posted the game. I'm just advicing you to go be a hipster that pretends to be a hardcore arcade player on /v/, also /vg/. Go circlejerk and practice pseudo-elitism there.

>>4489187
Nah, I fit right in here. We're all pieces of shit.

>>4489181
>>4489185
You're the cancer that killed this genre

>>4489187
>I'm just advicing you to go be a hipster that pretends to be a hardcore arcade player on /v/, also /vg/
Fuck you. This is exactly why the /vg/ threads went to shit.

>>4489194
*I* killed the genre? Not the technological and graphical advancement in home consoles pushing mainstream audiences away from Arcades and the fact that the genre hadn't seen a true innovation in over a decade?

>>4489186
>High-Brow Gag & Pure Shooting

>>4489164
>I thought Radirgy and Karous were fucking copy pastes of each other.
fuck me that goes to show how unbelievably shit you are as a player. Radirgy scoring is based around keeping the multiplier at 16x as much as poss whilst karous is about deligating kills between your 3 tools sword shot and shield to get your level ups for each as high as possible to multiplier enemy kills, the only thing they have even remotely in common is the item juggling techniques.

>>4489174
Why do you think i'm trying to be stealth? i'm not you flaccid dick.

>>4489161
ok? i'll bank you gave up within a couple hrs and didn't really get to grips with it at all.

>>4489179
harmful park is really good especially on higher difficulties.

>>4489049
DOJ original or black label? Anyway it's a highly polished game.

>intrinsically linking scoring and survival play
I value this a lot and this is why I've enjoyed Batrider and Bakraid so much this year. If only this genre had focused more on that less assholes would be calling score players autists.

>>4489064
Do the same though maybe a bit less time and not every day religiously, just most of them.

>>4489181
Please don't be that ridiculously elitist, read the OP.

>>4489213
>>4489350
USE. A. TRIPCODE.

>>4489426
We're different guys this time, sorry. I don't like that other guy's edgy attitude anywyay.

>>4488986
Whatcha smoking it's regarded as one of the best, way better than the first strikers

>>4489526
It's Strikers Plus that people don't like very much.

>first 2 minutes is the entire game
>can't explore, no world building whatsoever
>cryptic score systems nobody fully understands
>shitty difficulty curve, one moment you're on top of the world the next you're pummeled to death
>boring characters, boring music, boring graphics design would feel right at home on a super nintendo
Fuck shmups.

>>4489001
>saves png as jpg

you're a special kind of retard

>>4489648
I know this is trolling, but still:
>first 2 minutes is the entire game
Almost universally the first 2 minutes are much easier than what's to come, you don't even encounter some types of enemy formations until later. Some have different terrain and stuff.
>can't explore, no world building whatsoever
As if this was the only linear genre in existence, not every game has to be about exploring, you can also build a tight linear experience.
>cryptic score systems nobody fully understands
This is a better point though people do understand them, just that it took time and nowadays you usually refer to guides made by others to increase the learning rate. Even then these systems are not essential if you don't like them. And most older games have simplistic ones.
>shitty difficulty curve, one moment you're on top of the world the next you're pummeled to death
It's the classic arcade format, they give you a few minutes to ease into the general movement and mechanics and then ramp up the challenge so you don't get bored (particularly if you replay the game)
>boring characters, boring music, boring graphics design would feel right at home on a super nintendo
This is aesthetic stuff so not important and subjective, though I find it funny that you mention the SNES seeing as how that console had problems running these games without slowdown. In any case, you seem to be wrong since even if I dislike them there's a huge fanbase for stuff like Touhou only for the characters and music, so...

Tyrian is the best. There's not debate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w025kQRMZwA

>>4489660
The gameplay is lousy as hell, they even fucked up movement by adding friction. Quantity over quality game design in general with 0 balance.

>>4489660
Tyrian has its bright points but due to being a "euroshmup" style game it's hard to compare the game with the arcade ones (even if I allowed the discussion of these here) since their appeal is different.

The problem with euroshmups is that they usually aren't as tightly designed. Since you have shields and stuff and don't die in one hit the devs didn't build the games so you could avoid every hazard, thus starting a slippery slope of cheap level design.
Ultimately you get games that are much more forgiving (saves between stages, the aforementioned shields...) and easier but ironically more cheap than arcade games (and arcade games are usually criticized of being cheap). They focused much more on aesthetic stuff like text logs and have more "sim" elements that don't add much like heat systems.

>>4489665
>they even fucked up movement by adding friction
What's wrong, can't git gud?

>>4489676
"gitting gud" at Tyrian is just getting an op weapon combo and avoiding crashing into enemies since that's the only real threat because they chain damage and fling you all over the place since the devs didn't know what they were doing

>>4489683
I think they knew exactly what they were doing, it's just got a different style from your weebtrash games.

>>4489684
They were trying to make a shitty, poorly thought out, unfun game? In that case they were successful.

>>4489694
>thought out, unfun game
Wrong, you're just terrible at videogames blaming the game design for your shortcomings
>but muh inertia
Never had a problem with it, man up, kiddo.

>>4489694
Go back to your underage pantsu simulator.

>>4489674
Wouldn't even be that bad if shooting shit was satisfying. But it never is. Enemies are all bullet sponges, player weapons are often poorly balanced, levels aren't even always designed in ways where you can destroy all the enemies. Nothing worse than having to watch enemies float down the screen simply because you had the misfortune of picking a weapon the developers didn't bother playtesting.

>>4489697
Says the guy that has to retreat to euroshit because he gets dicked by japanese games. Sad!

I said there's NO debate! Jesus fuck!

ESP r.a.d.e forever!

I hate when trolls call others weebs for liking Japanese games in cases where they are of higher overall quality. This is even more egregious considering most retro shmups are just spaceships, tanks, etc. wow so weeb. As I said, Tyrian is hardly comparable, but you can't argue it's a more unpolished experience.

>>4489714
I like the secondary fire shenanigans in that game, too bad about the milking.

>>4489708
>Tyrian gets hated by the army of 35 year old Arcade retards who still live at mom's basement
That's when I immediately knew I would love Tyrian.

>>4489724
We're all shit human beings here, get off your high horse. Look at yourself, you're an embarassment.

>>4489724
>too bad about the milking.
This excuse is over peddled desu, you can get 30 mill without any milking at all and the western record is 29 so the milking is no reason to not play unless you're going for 30-40 mill basically wr level.

>>4489560
players do though, pegboys 2-alled all but the first and stated plus as one of his favs, most just shit on it because of aesthetic short comings but don't really play them.

>>4489526
i wouldn't say this either, they are very different beasts, the first is my fav in the series even if the loop is dildos.

>>4489350
Stop crying over my supposed edgy attitude which isn't edgy anyway on focus on what you're saying, batrider intrinsically linked to survival through score? fuck no, just one stage chained fully will get you 4/5 1ups in the next and so on, it's the most out there avant garde scoring system of all time, go watch a superplay.

>>4489730
I'm not saying I'm not shit, just not a weeb.

>>4489728
But I don't hate it, I included these games in the OP for a reason, I like them all. It's fun, just not as polished as the best arcade ones. Sadly, arcade elitists give this genre a bad image.

>>4489747
I can't think of any arcade shmup that's less polished than Tyrian desu. Even the most garbage ones are more cohesive. It works ok as a mindless phone game though I guess.

>>4489746
I play ESPRADE, I'm just saying it'd surely have a bigger hardcore following if it weren't for the milking parts.

And yes, the fact that you can get so many extra lives is linking scoring to survival. There's games like Dangun Feveron where scoring is counter productive to surviving, this is what I meant.

>>4487045

Viper Phase 1 is so good.

About 10 years ago I went on an autistic buying spree and bought arcade pcbs of raiden1, 2,and DX (the good pcb version, not the bad sound one), Viper Phase 1, Raiden Fighters 1, 2 and Raiden Fighters Jet. I should get the modern ones but they were STUPID expensive. I play them on an astro city sit down candy cab.

I'd say my favorite is DX followed by Viper Phase 1.

>>4489752
Exactly, it has a different appeal. It's not a bad arcade-style shmup, it's a more casual approach. And when a game is more casual polish isn't as important.

>>4489758
>not the bad sound one
what the fuck was seibu thinking with those

>>4489763
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrYnZ7ZxRe4

>>4489754
I disagree, bakraid gives you those lives because you need to suicide most of them away for the scoring system to work, do you actually know how bakraid scoring works? even the medals are worthless.

>>4489754
>I play ESPRADE, I'm just saying it'd surely have a bigger hardcore following if it weren't for the milking parts.

why would it?no one in the west can break 30 mill and most can't even beat my 24 mill, it's just an excuse ppl like to wheel out for why they won't bother as if they were ever going to get anywhere near good scores in the first place.

>>4489758
I really hope you are really good at some of those, pcb collectors are notoriously garbage players.

>>4489763

Pretty much to make money. The "bad" one is playable, but once you hear the proper one, you just can't go back.

>>4489793
Weren't we talking about Batrider specifically? Yeah, Bakraid is another beast, but even then, even if you suicide you get so many extra lives by scoring (and lowering the rank) you're still improving your chances of surviving.

About ESPRADE, the thing is it feels demotivating so people try less to get to WR levels. There's a reason other Cave games have a bigger scoring following. I'm not defending this, just trying to say why I think it's less popular with the fans.

Oh and btw I don't collect them but I know a guy IRL who does and can 1cc stuff like Sexy Parodius and Truxton II.

>>4489194
>Fuck you. This is exactly why the /vg/ threads went to shit.
Pretty sure the endless shitposting duels between KBR and Cee is what did them in, actually.

>>4489879
They seem to be destroying /vr/'s shmups and/or arcade threads as well.

>>4489879
clp and kbr are the heart and lungs of shmupg, we make it great.

>>4489889
well that's fucking funny because every single one i post in ends up busier and lasting longer as a result, my style as unorthodox as maybe is top notch at inspiring activity and interaction.

>>4489905
Yeah, busy with off-topic shitposting and making /vr/ in general think we suck.

>>4489972
This.

Perma-rangeban Cee fucking when?

So, after all, the whole arcade shitposting spree of the last few weeks was by some /vg/ crossposters.
Sometimes we are too harsh on /v/, when we forget /vg/, /v/'s retarded cousin, exists.

>>4490008
And people that came from forums after they were banned from them

>>4490002
>>4489972
Look at you leftist anti freedom fucks, you advocate facism at the drop of a hat because "muh feelings, muh he doesn't say what we want to hear", you people are fucking disgusting, go get an echo chamber somewhere else.

>>4490008
Nope, it wasn't. It may have been caused by Cee but the anti-arcade autist is exclusive to /vr/.

>>4489972
>making /vr/ in general think we suck.
Implying this isn't a badge of honour, who cares what a bunch of sad stick armed emos who can't even play any fucking games past the same level they were at age 12 and just endlessly wank on about "muhhh collection" and "muh nostalgia, hurr wot u bought?" etcetc, the time has come to make some room for actual players.

>>4490018
>fascism
>leftist

Jesus christ, go read a book and spend less time grinding numbers in videogames you silly buffoon.

>>4490021
>been caused by Cee
I love how someone elses bullshit is somehow my fault, no wonder the west is in such a mess. Make people take responsibility for themselves, that penis is nothing to do with me just because i told him the truth and he didn't like it. You're the type of person that tells raped women "you made him do it", disturbing.

>>4490023
Enjoy your circlejerk. Not everyone here is like that. If you think like that then why waste your time, do you really think people like that will listen to you?

>>4490023
So, make room then. You don't play video games, and you have no reason to be on /vr/. When you were 12, you were playing web-browser games on Cartoon Netwrok's site, and now you pretend to be an elitist dick because you've watched a few Touhou 1ccs on youtube.
/vr/ has room for many more people, but not for the likes of you specifically.

>>4490025
It was an example based on relative tone not an absolute statement you melon fuck, both oppress through force or did that evade you? they are much closer related than you think, why don't YOU go and read a book namely history. I don't spend much time playing as it happens, i do spend a long time on history and politics though as it happens.

This is beginning to seem /pol/ crossposting now lol

Dude, it's not about censorship. The fact is, if you fuck up every shmup discussion (we were discussing the games, we're not those collectors you mention) you're not letting others have fun discussing these games, and even more seeing how often some elitists and anti-arcade guys fight each other and derail the threads.

>>4490030
They already are.

>>4490032
Wat? i have a ton of clears for many arcade genres, some are on youtube to you stupid penis as for the rest... wat? just nonsense that doesn't apply, look how emotional i make you.

>>4490032
>but not for the likes of you specifically.
And there it is, advocating the echo chamber and banishing anyone who dare not walk your line, you're a fucking disgrace son, you need your arse kicking.

>>4490018
Protip: Freedom of speech doesn't exist on private forums. Keep crying you get kicked out of every community you participate in because of your insufferably shitty personality.

>>4490038
Anti-arcade guys are a boogeymen, they're too busy shitposting in their own threads. The shitposting on arcade threads come from the same 1 or 2 guys samefagging a lot, and sometimes getting some (You)s.

>>4490042
>i have a ton of clears for many arcade genres, some are on youtube
Post them.
>look how emotional i make you.
Not emotional, I was accusing you of being a kid who believes he's "hardcore" because he watches 1cc runs and then practices using save states, and doesn't get paid for it. That's you, right?

>>4490048
True, there is only one real anti-arcade faggot who has an easily recognizable posting style and shitposts in other threads as well, such as the Umihara Kawase thread, where his garbage was picked up by the jannies.

>>4490042
I'm OP and play mostly arcade games, I don't see how you're talking to "collectorfags who don't play games" here.

>>4490043
>Freedom of speech doesn't exist on private forums
Indeed

>>4489793
>I really hope you are really good at some of those, pcb collectors are notoriously garbage players.

I'll be honest, I fucking suck. I wasn't a pro by any means but I was working on VP1 and DX at one point. I love the game but just haven't tried to get gud. It's an excuse I know, but I moved and didn't play as much as I did before the move. I'm finally getting the "arcade" back up and running after a couple years down time. The boards are stored correctly but I really need to put some use on them.

You definitely got my number anon. Got any tips on getting gud?

>>4490156
Not him and even if it's just a cliché it's true: just practice it. Even if it's just a couple of tries every day, if you are constant about it you'll see improvement eventually. Also, not playing for too long helps with the burnout aspect.

One other thing I can tell you is try to consciously recognize why you fail; take some mental notes and think of an strategy for any particular trouble you may be having. Sometimes you just need to memorize a part, as well, particularly with these older shmups.

>>4489350
>DOJ original or black label? Anyway it's a highly polished game.
White label. It's harder, sure, but I can cheese the rank lower by throwing all my lives under Hachi before the loop starts. I'll move onto black label if/when I want to focus more on score.

>>4490008
The shitposting spree is someone else. Cee is a cunt and kraut has a persecution complex, but they've been here for years.
Besides, since the /vg/ shmup threads were restarted relatively recently (around the time of Mushi's Steam port), it would be more accurate to say the /vg/ threads were ruined by /vr/ crossposters. That kind of shitflinging is stupid and useless though, just like this post.

Friendly reminder that "freedom of speech" means the gubmint won't come and arrest you for voicing your political opinions so long as you do not disrupt the peace. Being kicked out of communities for being an insufferable faggot has nothing to do with the government.

>>4490278
What was Cave thinking with the 1 life at the start of the second loop anyway

>>4489650
>noticing
The autism is THROUGH DA EFFIN ROOF TONIGHT!

PARTY AUTISTS IN THE HOUSE TOOOOONNIIIIIIGHT

EVERYPONY JUST HAVE A GOOD TIME

>>4490291
>EVERYPONY
You guys surely are coming up with creative ways to shit up the shmup threads lol

>>4490290
Likely a byproduct of appeasing the players that were still going to arcades for shmups, i.e. people that were looking for challenge. It's an interesting way to add challenge, but combined with having to no-miss OR no-bomb a stage to regain a life it's ridiculously aggravating. I'm glad they did away with it for black label and never brought it back for other games.

>>4490296
The fact that they even made Black Label just to fix this and a bunch of other rank/scoring related shenanigans without really mixing up the game like later Black Labels seems like even the high level players didn't like this feature.

>>4490296
Also no continues in the second loop. I can only imagine how obnoxious it was to learn the hibachi fight back then.

>>4490317
Shh, you'll summon that guy that claims to credit feed every game and that to be the superior experience.

>>4490308
I'll always stand by my opinion that it's an interesting way to add challenge, but it's one of the few times I feel justified saying a challenge is "unfair". Losing power levels is a punishment for a mistake, raising rank is player controlled, and even the janky slowdown in SH3 can be mitigated, however slightly, through player action, but removing lives for no reason other than "it mayk gam hurr durr" is a terrible design choice. Between that and the lack of continues in the loop, it just feels like Ikeda was getting greedy.
>just to fix this
Black label also added some slowdown and >>4490317, which makes me believe that Cave was dissatisfied with the difficulty of white label all around. Black label is definitely the superior version, but I guess I'm just a masochist/dumb. There's something satisfying about plugging credits away at the "less fair" version, though if I decide to play more seriously i.e. for score I'll switch over.

>>4490328
Interesting to see a guy getting greedy by not letting players credit feed lol

>>4490334
Something along the lines of "if they can't credit feed in the loop, they'll have to put in more credits because they'll be pushing further while blind." I didn't say it was smart, I just don't think "this has to be THE HARDEST" was the decision behind it, especially since Ketsui came not too long after and has its own weird bullshit for getting high-level players to pump in more money to make attempts at the second loop. That is, if I'm remembering my Ketsui trivia correctly; didn't Cave have to tell players that Ura existed? I know it forces the player to restart 2-5 if they game over at Doom and the player puts in another credit.

>>4490346
Ura loop requirements are pretty cryptic and stupid to begin with. And with games like these getting so much praise (they deserve it, though) no wonder some people that don't play these may think of us as autists.

>>4490346
You can restart 2-5? I remember playing around in the ura loop (with savestates, of course) and losing to Doom was a full game over.

>>4488917
How does Strikers 2 compare to 1 and 3? Didn't really find 1 all that fun aside from the boss fights which were fantastic however I adore 3. 1 just felt really lacking when it came to presentation especially the music.

>>4490432
2 is quite better than 1 imo, between 2 and 3 I guess it's all preference as both are polished, although 3 added a few more mechanics like technical bonus and medal chain.

>>4490346
>I just don't think "this has to be THE HARDEST" was the decision behind it
This is most likely part of it desu, even if not the entire story. CAVE has a history of not only loving to pander to hardcore players but even just making insane, over-the-top shit like DOJ Death Label when there is 0 financial incentive involved.

Any good shooters for the neogeo on the switch? Kinda new to shooters and was looking at maybe picking up Aero Fighters 2

>>4491034
Twinkle Star Sprites is amazing if you've got friends to play with. Otherwise Blazing Star and Shock Troopers.

>>4489650
The hilarious part is that it really is a jpg.

>>4487140
My vote.

>>4491034
I suggest trying them with emulators before buying just to see what game you prefer.

Dr. Toppel's Adventure / Dr. Toppel's Tankentai, a cute-em-up with interesting shooting mechanics. Not a hard or demanding game by any means, but still interesting due to the fact that you have to change your shooting pattern pretty often to get high score.

>>4493226
Yo Sega, let us borrow the color palette from Fantasy Zone right quick.

One of the most intense experiences I've ever had playing these games is getting a full cube chain in Stage 5 of Mars Matrix.

>>4486934
>ikaruga
>obviously

kys. that's like saying gradius 3 because it was widely available and popular. ikaruga was unique and graphically cool but get over it. there's gameplay out there that's more interesting, technical, and fun. Raiden Fighters Jet has a million more hours of varied gameplay, for example

>>4493574
Not that you can't like Ikaruga but that poster has been proven to be a troll, don't feed him

I've always really liked Raptor: Call of the Shadows, but I'm nto entirely sure why. I think maybe because I liked the mechanic of earning money with kills and then buying upgrades between levels instead of the usual "fly here to grab powerup X". And certain (but not all) powerups could be stacked, giving you a very customized plane at the end of it.

Also, the levels were just well balanced around your steadily increasing power, or I thought so anyway.

>>4493673
You might like the other euroshmups mentioned here such as Tyrian and Jets n Guns. Also maybe Stargunner (1996).

Still, as I said here: >>4489674

>Also, the levels were just well balanced around your steadily increasing power, or I thought so anyway.
When you begin to dig deeper into some of the finest arcade ones yo begin to appreciate their more polished level design.

>>4490278
the loop starts at a fixed so dying vs. Hachi doesn't help. you can still do some basic rank control once in the loop by bombing while in hyper. doing this against bosses won't affect your score too much (even fufufu does it in his WR run, mostly to deal with 2-2 boss random madness) and will significantly lower the rank, but less than dying though.

>>4493725
*fixed rank

>>4493725
>>4493735
Oh, I didn't realize this. Thank you! I was using information from this ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HW7qt67h3Y ) video, though I suppose it shows my complacency that I took the claim as fact without researching on my own. Well, a new PB shouldn't be too hard to get now, even without better chain routes.

>>4486934
Everybody responding to this is utterly assmad at how right you are

>>4494591
I'm not saying he's not right, he's just trolling (notice how his facts about stages are wrong). A broken clock is right twice a day.

>>4494584
The comments on this video are mostly good and accurate except for few stuff. Here fufufu suicides in order to carry an hyper to the loop and have a level 4 hyper for the boss fight in order to speedkill him. This replay is crazy btw, hypest shmup performance ever.

>>4494584
What's your PB btw? This game is super hard to play for score.

>>4495194
>What's your PB btw?
I'm only at 150m. Most of my practice has been for survival, so I can only chain stage 1, the back half of stage 2 after the large turret/building, the start of stage 3, the very beginning of stage 4 and the portion directly before the midboss (though I cannot keep the chain during the midboss itself). I've only cleared up through 2-1, as well. The PB will mostly be from the lives bonus since I'll stop dying to lower rank.

>>4496042
I also mostly use hypers in place of bombs, meaning I keep to 1-2 for most of the game except for segments I know I can chain well.

>>4487475
Cave. Mostly because of the tap/hold dynamic most of their shmups have. Legit feel that is the most intuitive speed/power control conceived for shmups. Not saying every shmup should have it, but it's a really flexible standard to build a variety of games around.

Psikyo is my second choice. Love the fast bullets, strong charge attacks and multi phase robots. Plus, Zero Gunner 2 is basically one of the best games of all time.

>>4487475
I know Konami, Taito, Irem and Treasure didn't entirely focus on arcade shmups, but each of them are prominent in the scene, so I don't get why you'd exclude them from comparison.

>>4496801
The hold to move slower is quite good, however it's too bad it's attached to the laser. When scoring you need to laser a lot and thus end up moving slowly almost all the time. I like the way ESPRADE did this though, holding and tapping is the same shot but changes the speed.

>>4496806
I know, it just didn't feel right putting them with the others. If you want to include their shmup libraries and rank it with the others then go ahead, though! I like their games as well, though I haven't touched the Treasure ones much myself. Still, Treasure did about as many as Takumi and I included them there.

>>4488917
>No Zero Gunner 2
okay

>>4489085
Not retro, but yes

>>4496813
Part of why I like it is because it connects weapons to movement speed. The method of ESP Ra De is less interesting to me, because I like having to work around these kinds of limitations. I cannot laser and move fast at the same time, so I need to either release the laser or optimize movement.

>>4496854
I see your point, there's definitely pros and cons. These are all very good anyway.

>>4497845
Fuck, I forgot to remove the Sage name lol

>>4496816
What's so good about ZG2? I felt it didn't do its rotation mechanic justice with the level design. Has too many enemies that can't turn around and only shoot forward, and not enough variation in spawn locations. Game felt a bit cheesy. Maybe it's better in the second loop though.

>>4497904
ZG2 just has the benefit of there being nothing else that controls like it, and it controls like bliss. The rotation and lock-on offset work so well that it baffles me that there's no game out there just flat out stealing it (that I know of at least).

How far in have you played by the way? I've reached to the boss of stage 5, and I got the impression enemies do try to surround you, and some of the bosses like to move across the entire screen, but I could also just be predisposed towards remembering those moments over everything else.

>>4498057
Got a 1CC of the first loop and stopped. I only felt that the enemies tried to surround me in the ascending part of level 6 and a few moments of level 7, the rest of the game has lengthy delays between waves and not enough ambushes. The bosses are a highlight as usual for Psikyo, though. Also agreed about the rotation mechanic, I'd take it as a standard for top down shooters over twin stick any day.

>CTRL+F
>RADIANT SILVERGUN
>NO RESULTS FOUND

wtf

>>4498612
saturn emulation is shit, that's why

>>4498937
Is it? I got my first 1cc in RSG 8 years ago using SSF.

>>4498612
Because, like Ikaruga, it isn't very good.

>tfw you close your eyes and keep seeing bullets after playing a shmup

Rayforce/Layer Section/Galactic Attack.

It nailed design. Each level clearly had a lot of though put into them - enemy patterns, sound cues, and the constantly transforming environment. Love how you progress through the entire game without a single loading screen, you’re taken on this constant ride through space, plummeting through the atmosphere and deeper into the robot caves. This is a timeless game. Great for beginners and experts.

espgaluda ii. played the hell out of it on my iphone

>>4498996
>1cc'd it and shit on it
the madman

>>4499019
Even the music fits perfectly to what's currently going on. All cheerful and adventurous during the first few levels, becoming more melancholy as the game goes on.

>>4491039
>>4491527
I picked up Aero Fighters 2. I have to say this is a damn fine package they put together on the switch. If each of the neo geo games on the switch has half of the effort put into the options and emulator then these might be some of the best ports I've seen of neo geo games.

>>4496816
>Zero Gunner 2
>not Cannon Spike

>>4495193
>hypest shmup performance ever.
it was good but hypest has to be sps 2-all ketsui live at stunfest with a no miss doom.

>>4490156
>Got any tips on getting gud?
yes, stop game jumping and buying new pcbs as a substitute for putting effort into one.

>>4490053
>Post them.
K, https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCp2e9X5tR9BLdSlIGjzftDA/search?query=clp

Now what? you worthless gape.

>>4490053
>because he watches 1cc runs and then practices using save states
Funny you think a single player exists who doesn't do this, more demonstrations of how low level you are. Nobody gets paid for it? wtf does that even mean, is that really your argument? jesus.

>>4499126
As arbitrary as it is, I see Cannon Spike as a different genre. There is no autoscrolling and each level is an enclosed arena of some sort.

Also haven't played it much. It seems good, but I recall emulation being less than satisfactory.

Soldier Blade,is one of those games i often go back to.Einhander,Battle Garegga,Rayforce are also fantastic.

Sup. I've tried to play 1944: The Loop Master more lately (only tried it a bit previously) and for some reason this game still kicks my ass very early on, from stage 2's boss onward.
I'm no expert on these games but I've cleared a few, even other Raizing games like Batrider and Bakraid which are no slouch. Has anyone here played this game? What do you think about this? If you have some tips, you're welcome.

>>4490053
>practices using save states
Are you saying you don't? What are you, fucking stupid or something? If you're actually wasting the time to "practice" on a PCB like it's 1987 in 2018 you might want to reevaluate how much your time is worth.
>>4490053
>and doesn't get paid for it
Wat? Who gets paid to do this?

>>4500891
>Not being a professional shmup player
>Not making billions of dollars in esports money
wew lad

>>4486748
HOT DOG STORM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aPuqESX2mtE
this game is severely lacking hotdogs. false advertising.

>>4501164
This board would hate these games even more if it was popular in this regard lol

>>4486934
Off topic but does Treasure even own any IP or did everything they make belong to the publisher

>>4502534
They own every non-licensed IP except Gunstar, Mischief Makers, and Sin & Punishment.

>>4502557
I caem https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=louFuSUK5bw

>>4502557
What about Rakugaki Showtime? Does that also belong to Enix or was Marina just a cameo?

Has noone on /vr/ really played 1944: The Loop Master? Okay, then.
What do you prefer, macro dodging or micro dodging? I prefer the former and being able to move fast as shit, but adding the latter from time to time to spice things up is absolutely fine.

>>4503789
bullet cancelling

dodging is for tryhards

>>4504123
I like Mars Matrix though afaik you can't rely on bullet cancelling exclusively on any game (haven't played many non-retro ones, though). In any case if you have to choose between those two styles of dodging which one do you prefer?

>>4504442
Macro dodging is fun as fuck and works best with the complete movement freedom these games have. Especially nice during levels where you will be moving around a lot either way, so why not make it more exciting. Games with a lot of macro dodging tend to be more focused on routing than pixel precision which is another point in its favor. Choosing one is a bit shit though, I like that most games are dynamic combinations of both.

>>4489186
That's pretty much how anglos pronounce pop corn.

>>4504470
I get a bit anxious while pixel dodging in later shooters since it's harder to judge your hitbox and enemy bullet's hurtboxes (they are all smaller than the sprite). I also get tired of it quickly. I still find it fun in small doses and as a variety in games with mostly macro dodging, too bad the genre focused much more on micro dodging later.

>>4504762
I hate it more in early ones because later games tend to show the player hitbox. Late 90's and early 00's CAVE was the fucking worst about micrododging. No visual indication for the player's hitbox yet they expect you to know it like the back of your hand for some of the dodges.

>>4504778
By "later ones" I was referring to those late 90's and early 00's CAVE games, those are late by this board standards.

>>4504818
My bad, thought you meant in the context of danmaku

>>4504820
I probably have more fun playing Dangun Feveron for score, though it's hard to deny how polished feel DDP, DOJ and Ketsui feel for instance other than this unfair hitbox thing.
Not retro but the time I tried Mushihimesama I got so mad because some bullet patterns have no graphical indication of being avoidable, you just have to roll with it and squeeze between the bullets.

>>4487014
1cc'er here

Black guy with weapon 1
Robot with weapon 2
Lucy with special weapon

The rest of the characters don't matter

>>4505318
Fuc, I need to give FixEight more of a try. Game's fun but I just focused on other ones.

>>4486748
Thunderforce IV

>>4505380
Could you elaborate? I like it as well, but I think it would be more interesting if you told us why you think it's the best, at least to you.

Early bullet hell, where the hitbox is not actually shown, can be a bit anxiety-inducing at first, but I feel that by the time you're "ready" to 1cc/1-all, you'll have a feel for what's possible or not.

>>4506193
Yes, they just made it harder than it needed to be in this aspect. It adds a weird extra learning curve.

>>4506204
You still gotta learn the bullet hitboxes anyway. Most modern shmups only bother to make the player's hitbox visible.

>>4506210
This shit is what made it so hard for me to get into "danmaku" shoot'em ups coming from a background of earlier ones. It's not that they were harder but the graphical sprite-hurtbox inconsistency just pissed me off. I still don't like it but I can appreciate the design of the games.

can someone recomend me a shmup to put on snes mini? I'm new to snes library in general

>>4506457
Axelay or Pocky & Rocky

>>4506475
thanks. what about more traditional games like super aleste or r-type series?

>>4506518
You need some Biometal.

Also R-type 3 is shite.

>>4506193
Generally speaking that's true, however I still tense up at times when I have to make tight dodges even after being able to 1-all. The loop 1 last boss of Daioujou has some scary patterns, the last one in particular makes me sweat bullets despite not being that hard.

>>4506457
Probably the Macross shmup if you can. Sadly SNES doesn't have very many nor notable games of this genre due to the slow processor.

>>4506994
>I still tense up at times when I have to make tight dodges even after being able to 1-all.
I know AND hate this feeling, man.

>>4507204
The tension is what makes it all worth it.
Even if it makes you go careening into a cloud of bullets.

>>4507778
I prefer the type of tension you have while macrododging moving as fast shit like in Dogyuun but yeah, I'm not bashing danmakus, I still play them as well.

I like having to work out a way through a "maze" of bullets, like the last phasesof the stage 2 bosses of DDP and DOJ, or the stage 3 boss of Mushi on maniac. Haven't really seen many stages give this effect though, at least not in /vr/ shmups.

>>4506457
Super EDF
UN Squadron

>>4509134
For some reason if I have to do that stuff for more than a short period of time I get really tired of it even if I enjoy it in short burts. Then again I haven't touched non-retro shmups (almost).

>>4509651
Understandable, even in short bursts it's very intense but that's what I find so exhilarating. In contrast, I get exhausted and deflated doing recoveries in the classic, checkpoint shmups.

>>4487136
agreed. whats that one though

>>4512301
X Multiply

>>4511308
For sure, there's a reason checkpoints got phased out, it feels even more demotivating.