/vr/ - Retro Games

it's mario and it's on a console with no RPGs

>>4488532
basically

>>4488532
Fpbp

>>4488524
It's the first RPG I ever played and did a fantastic job introducing the genre. As soon as I was finished I wanted to find and play more games like it.

That, and like everyone else said there aren't many other RPGs on the system.

It's good, but Thousand Year Door is significantly better.

>>4488532
This and it's the first time they made one without Square's help.

>>4488551
Backtracking.
Combat system is better.

I still think super mario rpg was better

>>4488524
The game was comfy as fuck especially the snow area

It's well done.
>>4488532
I played lots of 5th gen RPGs on PS1 and Saturn, and Paper Mario is still on the top tier.

>>4488524
The writing is 100 times better than other JRPG's and the gameplay is great. It's paced well, the combat is interesting, it' doesn't take itself too seriously but yet manages to be a great game - It's just a fun and enjoyable experience.

>>4488524
I can't stand jrpgs, but I loved Paper Mario. Maybe it's because the combat is actually kinda fun and not tedious. Or maybe because it lacks all the shitty aspects of jrpgs like random battles, grinding, animesque visuals, melodramatic plots, teenage emo characters etc.

>>4488532
Exactly.

>>4488587
same

It's kind of like Chromo Trigger, aesthetically pleasing on its own merits enough for RPGs lovers to at least enjoy the experience, but, more geared towards casual players who really aren't into RPGs, offering them an easy comfortable experience. Wouldn't be a top game for most RPG lovers.

>>4489317
it would be a top game for nintendo lovers tho

Most JRPGs have a ton of fluff and tedium built into them, and Paper Mario shed most of that. I get why a really bloated world is appealing to JRPG fans because it keeps you occupied for so long, but for folks who are busy and have shitty attention spans the pacing in Paper Mario is perfect. Also it's very well designed as people have elaborated above.

>>4489317
The badge system lets you experiment and makes the game harder if you want. Don't use any extra HP badge and only use offensive badges.

>>4489565
>Don't use any extra HP badge and only use offensive badges.
This makes PM easier since you get to attack first lol

>>4489628
But you don't have much HP to tank bosses

>>4488524
>Why is this one so renowned?
Is it really?
Sure, it is popular amongst the Nintendo only crowd obviously. And it's a Mario game.
But when it got released people were playing Valkyrie Profile, Suikoden 2, Chrono Cross, Vagrant Story, Persona 2, Dragon Quest VII,..: on Playstation.
I'm pretty sure most JRPG players did not give a fuck about Paper Mario.

>>4489897
I like RPGs and was playing PS1 games at the time, but Paper Mario is really good.
Also, have in mind the developers for Paper Mario were Intelligent Systems from Fire Emblem (even though PM is not the same style of RPG).
Also, I don't think games like Persona 2 or Dragon Quest VII were popular with western people back in the 90s, it was all about final fantasy back then.

>>4489925
Well persona 2 wasn't a huge deal back then, and dq7 was overshadowed because it was released the same year as FFX.

That being said, I think paper Mario was a success because it had no genre competition for it's console, but the very few RPGs that were released on n64 (hybrid heaven, ogre battle, NOT quest) were generally good too. It was a game that was backed by Nintendo, which Nintendo can shill the hell out of their own games with ease, so it had a lot of hype going in. They saw the potential success with the RPG genre using their own franchise when smrpg was released years earlier, they've had previous success with Mario spinoffs on the n64, and they've had time to optimize getting the most out of the n64, so everything lined up and they delivered a clean hit with paper mario.

>>4488524
Timed hits
+10 points on reviews for being on a Nintendo
lol so randum humor

>>4489953
>lol so randum humor
This wasn't a big thing in the original. It got worse in the next two sequels though

Fun world, good music

>>4489951
DQ wasn't popular in the west outside of a reduced cult following, still kind of isn't although it has gained some more recognition lately.
PM's success may be partly due to Nintendo's marketing, but I think the game is really good on its own too. I consider it one of the best 5th gen RPGs, not my favorite, but top 5.

>>4488554
They still used a lot of Square’s system tho, giving the game a solid rpg foundation. The game is a spiritual successor to Mario RPG

>>4488532
>on a console with no RPGs
Holy Magic Century was top tier.

It's renowned for being one of the few "JRPGs" that isn't absolute dogshit. The combat is actually fun, the graphics and music are fantastic, and the interactivity with the game world adds much needed variety that most JRPGs lack entirely.

>>4490136
So it's a game for children who like QTE in their combat systems.
Got it.

>>4490167
You can choose not to use combos if you suck too much at getting the timing down.

>>4490167
>game for children
>coming from the guy defending the most autistic genre known to man
No, it's just a good game, which almost every JRPG ever made is not. Funny that you say the game is for "children" because it has active combat, given that it would be a lot easier for a child to play a traditional JRPg with brain dead turn based combat and no reflexes. Regardless, that isn't what I meant by interactive. I mean how interactive the world itself is, such as being able to use various moves to uncover secrets in the environment, taking items that grow on trees, etc. The level of interactivity in most JRGs is laughable, running into invisible monsters and maybe stumbling upon a treasure chest once in a blue moon, wow, fun.

I get it, it's on the N64 so you automatically hate it because you're a faggot, but it's a legitimately amazing game, sorry.

>>4490196
I'm only egging you on because you sound like an idiot. If you think a game is better because you push a bunch of buttons during combat you're fucking retarded.
And of course it's for children. It's Mario.

>>4490206
Not him but your favorite video game is also for children.

>>4490208
Nah, my favorite games are not for children but I wouldn't mind.
I only wanted to get him mad.

>>4490206
I didn't really interpret anything you said as "egging me on", just typical misinformed stupidity, which is what you continue to exhibit. Retard, we're talking about video games, pretty much all of them are made for children. That's the kind of piss poor argument that a butthurt faggot comes up with when he can't defend an actual point. You're one to shit on Mario for being childish anyway given that you are defending an autistic genre filled with cringey anime characters made for young japanese kids. Sorry for your shit taste in games I guess, paper mario is fucking awesome.

>>4490212
>I only wanted to get him mad.
How mature of you.
Anyway I think he might have been baiting by saying that "almost every JRPG sucks". So you might be the one made fun of.

>>4490212
>i wanted to make him mad
>YOU'RE CHILDISH FOR PLAYING MARIO GAMES
Lmao is this retard for real or what?

>>4490217
>Anyway I think he might have been baiting by saying that "almost every JRPG sucks". So you might be the one made fun of.
No, I'm pretty sure he's serious. He seriously thinks pressing buttons at a nice timing is better than boring strategical turn-based combat. He's just that kind of dumbass and he his sorry argumentation doesn't desesrve any respect anyway.
It also amazes me how much some people hate admitting Mario is for children. As if someone is going to take your toys because you're old now. Everyone loves Mario.

>>4490237
His argument is dumb but you're equally dumb for engaging in it and pulling the "it's for kids" card.
Nobody hates "admitting" it, although technically Mario appeals to a wider audience and not just kids. Actual games strictly made for kids are edutainment stuff (which mario had, on PC)

>>4490237
You're right, I am serious, but my argument for why PM is such a great game has literally nothing to do with timed attacks during combat. First off, that's a ridiculous oversimplification of the combat, which is augmented by the dozens of badges you can use, various partners assisting you in battle, items, equipment, etc. Frankly it sounds like you haven't even played the game so you don't really have any idea what you're talking about, but compared to the snore inducing copy-pasted combat in most JRPGs, PM is a godsend.

Moreover, to repeat once again, what makes PM so much better is interactivity. Being able to turn items you find in the environment into various recipes, the integration of platforming elements, exploration, interactive objects in the environment, etc. For example, going into your house, doing a jump attack on a loose floor board and finding a secret area where Luigi keeps a diary about how jealous he is of you. Little touches like that make the world feel much more alive and most JRPGs just don't have them.

At this point in our conversation, you've yet to provide one shred of evidence for why PM isn't a great game, so my advice is to stop being a retard and actually play it because you'll enjoy it.

>>4488532
That's true but it would have been a good game even if all the PS1 RPGs were released on the N64 instead or if Paper Mario had been released on the PS1.

On its own it doesn't innovate amazingly but it has a very unique art style, the turn-based battles had some action-based elements to make it interesting, the humor was good, etc. All good elements for an RPG that set it aside from Generic Top-Down Turn Based Fantasy-RPG #37.

The game is great, but I thought the music was a mixed bag, not bad but compared to SMRPG or even mainline Mario titles, the compositions and sound production doesn't seem as high quality, however, it has some really good tracks like this one
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFbjaE3eUDU
Reminds me of SMT music.

>>4488524
I feel one of my favourite things was how the battles weren't full of 20 second animations of meteors exploding and doing 12098153 damage, instead you bonked a dude and he bonked you back and it's legitimately exciting/worrying if either attack does more than 3 damage,

>>4490265
>First off, that's a ridiculous oversimplification of the combat, which is augmented by the dozens of badges you can use, various partners assisting you in battle, items, equipment, etc

Partners are just party members but dumbed down.

Equipment and items already in other RPGS but dumbed down in mario.

The badge thing is just Mario's version of a skill point system that every fucking rpg has past the 16 bit era. You have some points you use them to buy passives and active skills. And even than it's dumbed down compared to other systems.

>Being able to turn items you find in the environment into various recipes, the integration of platforming elements, exploration, interactive objects in the environment, etc
Every RPG has item finding/exploring and there are a lot deeper crafting systems out there. The only interesting thing is the jumping, which was basically a gimmick. It's not like the platforming was very challenging. It's just there because a mario game where you couldn't jump would be weird.

You havn't told us anything it does better than other RPGs other than the jumping gimmick, which really isn't all that great.

It's a game carried entirly by it's IP and a unique aestetic.

>>4491268
Badges are nothing like a skill point system. Many badges not only have an effect on combat but even change how you can interact with the game world. There's a certain badge you can get which even lets you essentially turn the game into a classic platformer by allowing you to kill most weaker enemies without ever entering a battle sequence. Moreover, the unique ways in which you can acquire and mix and match badges is much different from your standard RPG and the skills you gain from them are much more tangible than your typical "ice blast that does 1000 damage or fire blast that does 2000 damage" stuff.

Another misnomer is saying that partners are just "dumbed down party members", which couldn't be further from the truth. The partners in PM are more unique and useful than any generic characters in most RPGs who largely function the same and only have different attacks. The partners in PM have unique abilities that are needed for accessing certain areas and items, not to mention wildly different combat abilities. This also ties into the interactivity, as you'll often have to experiment with different partners' abilities to uncover hidden things or interact with various environmental objects, like using Parakarry to reach a high place or Kooper to hit something far away. These are simple example but nonetheless, the game is far, far more richly interactive than almost any other game of this type.

Yet again, by saying that "jumping" is the only distinguishing feature of the game, you've distilled an entire experience into an autistic and oversimplified definition. In addition to what i've already stated above, incorporating platforming IS a distinguishing feature of the game and goes a long way in making it more engaging. You say "b-but every RPG has exploration and treasure", yeah, like wandering around a world map with no interactive objects except things you just walk up to a press a button.

Again, it doesn't seem like you've even played this game.

>>4489079
>animesque visuals
implying that's a bad thing. do you know where you are faggot?

>>4491292
Not him, but contrary to what you might believe, not everyone on this site has shit taste. Although, I will admit you are in the vast majority. Why anyone would subject themselves to autistic weebshit beyond the few good animes that exist is beyond me.

>>4491297
>beyond the few good animes that exist is beyond me.

I feel I have similar (maybe called plebeian by true weebs) taste as you. What anime did you enjoy?

Personally the only ones I care for are Dragonball (&Z), Cowboy Bebop, Samurai Champloo, Akira, and Food Wars

To keep it on topic, I've not beat Paper Mario, but I did enjoy it for a month or so of casual play. The visual's were a really cool gimmick back in the day. I don't know why but I really enjoyed how they did that, reminded me of Parappa.

>>4491428
Sounds like we have similar tastes indeed. Trigun is my absolute favorite, followed by Cowboy Bebop, Neon Genesis Evangelion, The Big O, Fullmetal Alchemist, a few others. By and large anime is pure shit, but definitely check those out. Trigun and Cowboy Bebop are a must, if anything. Trigun has more of that cringey anime shit that comes with the territory, and is very slow to start, but halfway through it becomes one of the best animes ever.

Samurai Champloo was great also, glad you enjoyed it. I generally like animes with a lot of atmosphere and western themes which seems right up your ally, so I think you'll enjoy some of these too.

>>4491431

Cool, thanks anon, I'll definitely check them out.

>>4491437
No problem. If this thread is still alive after you've had a chance to watch some of those, i'd love to know what you think of them.

It was an RPG on a system that had exceedingly few, especially compared to the PS1.

>>4488551
The only thing better is the combat system, everything else is worse in TTYD

I played Paper Mario as a kid, and really hated it. I thought it was inferior in every way to not only the games of its time on the PSX, but even to its spiritual predecessor.

My memory could be playing tricks on me, but essentially what I remember is that it was a really dumbed down rpg for braindead kids, even simpler and less interesting the Final Fantasy Mystic Quest. I've always just assumed it gets a lot of love because of nostalgia and the fact that the last time most people played it was when they were 5 years old and didn't really know any better.

I'm prepared to be wrong though, so if I'm missing something please feel free to call me a giant faggot.

Comfy music and overworld design.

>>4491650
It's on the easy side, but I wouldn't call it dumbed down for braindead kids. In fact, with all the options between partners and badges, and because the game forbids you from grinding, I think it's better designed then many other RPGs, which in their majority aren't hard anyway.
I played it for the first time a few years ago so I don't have nostalgia for it.

>>4491665
There was also Superguarding in the sequel, which was 3/60th of a second (3 frames) before contact compared to a Guard's requiring a press of A Button 8/60th of a second (8 frames) before contact.

>>4491690
It's almost like the red parry and blue parry system in Third Strike (IIRC they were 3 frames and 7 respectively)

>>4491701

Red parries are frame perfect in third strike. Ground parries are 11 frames and air parries are a little less.