/vr/ - Retro Games

>>4484910
When it came out it was amazing. It was a 3-d game that played well, had great level design, and was fun - all on a 16-bit system. Compared to the awful 3-d shit on 3DO and Jaguar at the time, this was great. It isn't all that special now, but 24 years ago it was incredible.

the music is great.
you can overclock it on a emulator if the lag annoys you

>>4484913
>Compared to the awful 3-d shit on 3DO and Jaguar at the time, this was great.
3D racing cars on Jaguar looked like colored shoeboxes racing around.

Star Fox actually looks, sound and plays very nicely even for a game that old.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnmnpWKoUS0

>>4484921
THIS - Look at games like Cyber Morph (that was a damn pack in game) - in 1993 no one knew how to do 3-D games even on more powerful systems yet Nintendo created their first 3-D game that was actually fun.

hey this thing came out 2 years before starfox, kinda neat in retrospect
https://youtu.be/Bntg_WEOS5w

Don't mean to be a fanboy but I DO think Space Harrier, Afterburner, G-Loc, Galaxy Force 2 were much better games. Barely anyone even knows about the sega super scaler or who the fuck Yu Suzuki is.

>>4484973
That's playing a pre-rendered video, though. Not real-time 3D. It's more closely related to SNES Winter Gold than Starfox.

>>4484978
>comparing 2 different things on 10x faster hardware
Sega fans are pathetic. And don't even get me started on how utterly pathetic the Genesis ports of Afterburner and Space Harrier were.
Nintendo had the right idea with Starfox, instead of making an overly long arcade game no one is gonna beat out of boredom they made 3 distinct routes with varying difficulty levels and let players choose between them, and even included secret levels to reward exploration.

>>4484910
In other words, you are underaged. MODS

>>4484990
Nah, I'm 37 and I never liked that game either. Starfox is far from a good railshooter, the series didn't become good until 64 and even that is overrated.

>>4484910
What are you, some kind of fucking faggot?

>>4485013
I do not think the game is very good, and while I can't criticize the graphics I can certainly criticize the sub 12 fps.

I'm sure it was pretty mind blowing in 1993, but when 64 came out it became obsolete and gauche.

>>4484910
Grow up and learn how to play real video games.

>>4485028
>real videogames
So not Starfox, then?

>>4485015
A real bonafide, lip-smacking faggot if I ever saw one. I bet your twink ass thinks Castlevania IV is the weakest entry in the series.

>>4485030
>I bet your twink ass thinks Castlevania IV is the weakest entry in the series.
Welll, as a matter of fact yeah I do? Is this some pretend to be retarded trolling?

>>4484978
Nobody gives a fuck about your Sega shit.

>>4484981
Genesis could do SuperFX-esque 3D without any addon chips.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9v-9lGNJQ4

>>4485038
Pretty good framerate too

Without it, we never would have had this hidden gem.

I think it's got a much better atmosphere than the cartoonish n64 reboot.

>>4485119
Surely the original talking antropomorphic fox was never cartoony

>>4485119
I can see what you mean, the old graphics looked simple but abstract enough that you could project anything into them.

>>4484910
When i was 6 it was cool turning sideways in between buildings

>>4484981
>>4485032
how does it feel to know that corneria's theme is just a bootleg version of after burner's theme

>>4485152
No it's not
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JyIIEBMh_2k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eclAC0JQJYk

>>4485152
Only a similar intro and that's it. I wonder who ripped off who.

>>4484910
Dude, the game is awesome. In some regards better than Starfox64

>>4485167
I find it garbage and so is 64.

>>4484973
It's not FMV, the vertices, transforms, etc are all pre calculated so the system streams them from the CD.

So the system doesn't have to do any calculation on the fly except for hiding ships when they get blown up and drawing the player's lazers.

>>4485152
>>4485162
>>4485163
They both have a similar vibe but Corneria isn't exactly the same or a rip-off of the AB theme. I should get that 3DS collection with Sega games sometime.

>>4485172
Don't do it, Sega games are trash.

>>4484973
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slLO51zUZYs

Here's another Mega Drive game that predates Starfox.

Again the transforms are precalculated.

But in the actual gameplay it's a wolfenstein-like raycasting engine with polygonal enemies.

>>4485175
Does your GF agree?

>>4485170
Interesting. I believe they used the same technique in Slipheed, same year as Starfox
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Crjgu2aE1QE

>>4485163
*whom

>>4485168
Hmm. Ok. Well you are entitled to your opinion.

Maybe give them more of a try? When I first played Starfox I knew it was good, but when I got to planets like Fortuna I knew it was awesome.

>>4485181
*Whom ripped off whom. Thank you

>>4485179
She doesn't care about shit games, Segafags otoh have never even had a girlfriend.

>>4485176
See >>4485180

>>4484973
Just wondering, is that how they did cutscenes in Flashback / Out of this World or am I saying bullshit?

>>4485180
whoa, those visuals are intense.

>>4485193
Meant to quote >>4485170

>>4485195
Sarcasm?

>>4485197
No, I seriously think it looks cool.

Even if they stream the the data they still had to get the system to draw a lot of triangles. Plus the volumetric terrain in the later levels looks great for the time.

>>4485193
I assume so. Probably the same with the 3d triforce in ALttP.

>>4485201
Plus the framerate looks great. So why the fuck didn't Starfox did the same?

>>4485201
This poster >>4485176 is correct, the Sega CD couldn't do fullscreen FMV so there's no way those backgrounds can be videos.

>>4485203

Starfox is real time, it does a lot more caculation in each frame.

>>4485205
But Winter Gold is pre-calculated, so that rules out cartridge space and proves it's possible on the SNES.

>>4485206
Winter Gold uses a faster version of the SuperFX chip...the SuperFX2.

Honestly I find it more fascinating when Genesis / Sega CD are doing 3D since they don't have dedicated hardware for it.

That being said, out of all of those old console CPUs, the Motorola 68000 is definitely the most suitable for software 3D.

>>4485206
Sure it's possible, but Starfox had a smaller cartridge size, it's only 8 megabit (1 megabyte). This would not be enough space to store all the data.

Starfox also had a a terrain that was a lot more varied, whereas Winter Gold has repetative backgrounds like the luge.

Another point is, Starfox has collision detection in 3d, and, on top of that, the camera is not fixed in Starfox.

It does use some tricks to take advantage of being on rails, for example the buildings on level 1 don't have any polygons on the back because you can never turn around to see them.

>>4485204
Not true, Wirehead is fullscreen.

>>4484981
>She doesn't care about shit games
Then why does she play Starfox instead of better alternatives like Wing Commander or even Vanark instead.

>>4485593
>Wing Commander
meh
>Vanark
Bretty gud

>>4484913
Yeah before this my only concept of 3D games were Castle Master and some awful painter's algorithm flight sim that a mate had.

Compared to those, Starwing's 8fps was a dream come true.

>>4485707
>pathetic yuropoor
>behind on the latest technologies
Go figure.

>>4485032
Gamers do.

>>4484913
>It was a 3-d game that played well

But it didn't.

>>4484978

You're right, but do you seriously expect an RPG and nintendo centric board to appreciate gameplay orientated games?

>>4486210
I'd say this board is more arcade wannabe hipster kids centric.

>>4484978
>who the fuck Yu Suzuki is
Are you serious?

>>4486202

>>4486263
Who are you kidding?

>>4486202
Have you actually sit down to play Star Fox for more than the tutorial level?
Even with its crazy low fps and polycount, the gameplay is smooth. The game's controls were made with limitations in mind, and flying around, dodging enemy attacks with L or R and accelerating feels natural. It's not comparable to great but older Sega games with scaling effects. Those are great, Space Harrier is timeless and if I had to choose between playing SH and SF today, I'd choose SH. But SF still stands on its own right by being a more than decently playable game even with all the limitations. Sega did something similar with Virtua Racing on Mega Drive. Of course it can't compete with the arcade VR or the 32X one, but it's pretty damn impressive for the standard MD, and most of all, the gameplay works, it feels like the arcade, a lot choppier, but it's still there, you're playing VR. It's not some different game like the VF2 MD version.
SF64 is really when SF peaked, it's 10x better than the SNES original. But SNES SF still deserves its fame. It's a game I wouldn't mind playing again honestly, which is more of what I can say of majority of games. I'd still prefer SF64 obviously, but meh if it's between something like SF or other similar games of the time like Total Eclipse or those horrid Jaguar 3D shooter games, I'd choose Star Fox.

>>4484910
>absolutely zero redeeming qualities
Why must discussion be so bad here. I'm not even a fan of the game but c'mon guys.

>>4486210
>>4486220
Lately /vr/ seems like a board with these two sides fighting each other constantly lol It's like our bipartisan system.

>>4486682
>Lately /vr/ seems like a board with these two sides fighting each other constantly lol It's like our bipartisan system.
Except there's no "RPG" or "home system" side. Everyone who was alive back in /vr/ times played arcades, as well as home systems.
This whole faux arcade elitism surfacing lately is due to teenage internet subculture embracing this "old and ancient" video game culture called "arcade". They want to feel special because they use MAME and watch 1cc videos on Twitch.

>>4486805
There's been hate on the arcade threads lately and there are plenty of RPGs lovers here. I think it goes back and forth between these two camps (skill elitists vs guys who appreciate aesthetics and the like more).

>>4486805
Also, remember my pic. Zero (0) arcade games.

>>4486805
>Everyone who was alive back in /vr/ times played arcades
Wrong. My mom didn't let me go to arcades.

>>4486210
Spot the newfag. If you like Arcade games why the FUCK are you entering RPG threads. Use the hide function you stupid idiot.

>>4486228
He's corect. Yu Suzuki is more known as the guy who created Shenmue and Virtua Fighter than the guy who made Space Harrier these days.

>>4486882
Too bad, Shenmue introduced too much crap that was imitated by and assimilated later in modern games

>>4486901
Like QTEs. And that's it, that's the entirety of Sega's legacy. Fucking QTE

>>4486904
And the Sonic fanbase

>>4486879
I think he means that since the board is mainly that you can't discuss "gameplay oriented games". No amount of hiding would change that. I disagree though, there seems to be enough people here who enjoy them.

>>4486916
I've never seen an RPG fan derailing "gameplay oriented" threads, though. It's only you who is going into RPG threads to complain about them. I should start doing the same just to piss you faggots off.

>>4486920
I haven't done that and what you say has certainly happened. An Alien Soldier thread got murdered recently by haters.
I like both styles fine personally.

>>4486928
That wasn't an RPG fag, and you know what, you guys can take a little bit of hate. You deserve to get shat on because you're terrible.

>>4486940
You may be right, I don't know if he was an RPGfag. But at least it was someone opposed to these arcade-style games, so in that other camp.

I don't know why you insist on including me with these assholes when I said I enjoy both arcades and RPGs lol

>>4486928
The AS thread was derailed by the supposed "arcade elitists" (I think they're just bored kids trolling honestly), who always stir shit up on Treasure threads.

>>4487039
There's quite a big backlash against Treasure. From hipsterism to contrarianism

>>4485204
The Sega CD can do fullscreen FMV, and is doing that in Silpheed. I don't know why you think it can't but that it can render polygons at a quality that the 32x can't do.

This whole "RPG vs arcade" thing makes no sense.
The Shmup community on /vr/ has ALWAYS been shit, since day one. There were a couple good threads but I can count them with one hand. Every time it was always the same bullshit about 1cc's, emulators vs hardware fags, and just plain silly ad hominem nonsense.
RPG threads have their own shitposting, but they are contained there. Too busy shitposting about Final Fantasy VII or Chrono Trigger to care about what the arcade/shmup shitposting is about.

>>4487061
Why only shmups, belt scroller fans for instance have done the same.

>>4487071
Yeah I've read a lot of SOR2 shitposting lately, I guess shmup came to mind first because these threads have always been notoriously shit.

>>4487076
I get you, though. Even as a big fan of shmups I have to admit their challenge, format and complicated scoring systems sadly seem to attract some questionable individuals and too much elitism. This happens too with fighting games though it's different since it's direct competition.

>>4487058
I don't think it is, because Flashback, Out of this World, the intro to Red Zone and Winter Olympics have no FMV codec capability whatsoever but still manage to squeeze in some vector movies in cartridge format. I think it might be the same case with Slipheed.

Someone should open the CD and see if they can find any fmv movie files in the game and check if this is the case.

>>4485032
Well, that's not entirely true. There are some people who do care about Sega stuff. They're the sort of people that actually play video games, and could be considered video game hobbyists. This is in stark contrast to the sort of people who played a video game once and quickly discovered that they enjoyed going to places like /v/ to shitpost much more than they actually enjoyed playing the game.

>>4486871
Then she didn't let you have a home console either, champ.

>>4487097
Depending on the area arcades could be pretty shady places, not very kid friendly. Some become notorious for drug related stuff. "Winners don't do drugs".

>>4487123
It seems you've been reading too much internet stories, anon jr.
Most arcades were family friendly and there were many arcades everywhere, from shopping malls to small drugstores or hotels.

>>4487127
I'm from Spain and that shit definitely happened here.

>>4487128
I'm not saying it didn't happen, just it wasn't the majority of arcade centers and, in the case you lived in a really shitty isolated town with only one arcade center full of drug dealers, you'd probably be able to come across arcades at others places as I said.

>>4487127
hahaha damn gringo and your flower world!
Here in mexico, most arcades, back in the 90's where full of fuckers and toughs, that rob your money or kick your ass, if you are alone.
you have to go there with a friend to help you fight back or run away as fast as you can, also the places where always dark, with rock music, cigar smoke all over the place and a billiar
the bigger brands of arcade centers where the "chispas" "tentons" and "imaginate"
most places where so close to school centers, that in 1998 the goverment prohibited arcade centers around school areas.

>>4485167
In only one regard and thats the coneria theme. Even then all of SF64 ost is good while the original has some questionable songs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JXJlj_0dkg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l5KGCViaE_4

>>4487294
Just "questionable"? Really? Those songs are awesome. I love me some 80s synth pop.
Plus, at least those songs give the game a more unique vibe. Not saying that the OST for N64 is bad but it sounds too much like a John Williams movie score and I personally prefer OSTs with some more variation.

>>4487128
>I'm from Spain.
Please stop this, chaval.

Nintendo shit. Gets a pass from the nintoddlers for being "innovative" (I've heard it: invented 3D graphics, invented 3D shooters) despite being obviously unplayable garbage. Meanwhile superior Sega games might as well not exist to them. What's Space Harrier? Some sorta Starfox clone? Kys.

>>4487328
Lol keep crying at the grave of fucking sega and their shitty neo sonic games. Fag. Some people conquer the imagination of the world much better than others. Grow Up.

Amazing how people in this thread argue over old games as if it's the end of the world (SEGA vs Nintendo!! reeeeeee)

Star Fox was a class game with great atmosphere and a great narrative - as well as fantastic gameplay. The framerate is a bit iffy but play the overclocked version if you want to remove that. The 3D graphics have a charm that just can't be replicated today, I wish there was a PC fan version of Star Fox with the same type of graphics because personally I love the abstractism of the polygons. Maybe I'm biased because yes, I played it as a kid and loved it - and it is pretty much my favourite game of all time.

SEGA games like Galaxy Force II are awesome too (the rotation and scaling!) but something about Star Fox is special - the N64 game is technically superior but the SNES one has more charm.

Also, post arcade footage of Starblade rather than the Sega CD please https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M7vTjEebrnQ - another game I love due to that abstract 3d design. 1991!!

>>4487339
People reply and give more attention to confrontational posts, there's nothing you can do about it.

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE NONTONDIO IS THE BEBST. DONT TOLK BAD ABOWT NONTONDO. REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. FEEEL MEY RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH. NOW GOE AND SIN KNOW MORE. YOU FILY PAGINS

>>4487360
good post

/vr/ is turning into /v/ with all these bullshit arguments. Starfox is, was and always will be a classic. The game was incredible considering the platform it was released on.

>>4487403
>The game is shit but it runs on garbage hardware (plus an extra chip) so you must excuse its shittiness and enjoy it
Always the same argument from Starfucks fans.

>>4487326
Please stop what

Will this game ever get a source port of some kind?

>>4487408
Oh bore off man. I was 12 when it was released, it was a technical marvel and it is still fun.

Still the best Star Fox game so take that as you wish OP.

>>4487734
Yeah, too bad 64 got remade and not this one

>>4487328
I hope this is falseflag bait by some nintendo fanboy. I don't want to think Sega fans are this much salty.

>>4484910
Fox is broken in SSBM.

>>4488528
Get good also not retro

>>4487304
I'll leave macbeths theme up to personal taste but I dont think fortunas theme has any place in a rail shooter like star fox.

I prefer Novastorm but it's very difficult.

>>4489519
Novastorm looks amazing, thanks anon I will check this on out for sure!

>>4487734
>>4487740
Wow, for a second I thought I was on /v/ seeing opinions this contrarian.

>>4490006
Even if you prefer 64 you've got to admit the game that could benefit more from a remake is the original and not 64. Just imagine SNES Starfox with better frame rate and textures.

>>4490016
I can agree with that. I got SF64 3D for free and even though I enjoyed the better framerate and being able to play it on the go, I'd still rather play it on my CRT on the original console.
Also, I don't want to be one of these "muh atmosphere" faggots, but I'll be one. The lighting on the N64 game is better. Some levels are too obscure (the aquatic one for example), but that was kinda the idea, you're going through some deep sea ruins lots of weird creatures and your only source of light is the submarine and shooting missiles. The 3D version lets you see a lot more and it kind of misses its atmosphere.
And yeah Nintendo went full jew or retard or both. Having "3D Classic" versions for all their games like Mario, Metroid, Starfox was a no-brainer, yet the only games they did were Kid Icarus, Kirby's Adventure and some other early Famicom titles.

>>4490006
>>4490016
>>4490026
The thing with 64 is it is basically a remake of the first game. It does everything the original did and more plus its plot is very similar.

>>4491438
Sure, but not exactly

>>4491438
eh it's pretty damn different

>>4489657
There were four different versions of Novastorm: A PC one, Sega CD one, a 3DO one and a PS1 one. They all have some differences between them.