/vr/ - Retro Games

People just love style over substance.

>>4191840
it's a complete package
>>4191857
Are you one of the types of people that claims DKC 2 is vastly superior to 1? Because newsflash, the difference in quality is not actually that steep

>>4191860
Not that anon, but he's right; they're bad games with 'pretty' (at the time) graphics.

Good controls, one of the best use of pre-rendered graphics at 60 fps, solid design and god-tier art direction (including music).

In some other thread anons were discussing about natural enviroment vs block enviroment, pointing out Mario and many other japanese games use block design, and westerners like to fuck around more with how the level looks and make them more "organic", such as in Earthworm Jim, but then the problem comes with the hitbox detection and how it's easy to misjudge actual ground from foreground or background textures.
In DKC's case, they pulled it off, although it still feels weird, and you will die falling to pits even though you touched a bit of ground texture, but once you get the rhythm in DKC, nothing can stop you and the problem with the hitboxes is very minimal. Also helps that Donkey can perform an air jump if you roll first.
DKC is one of those games, I guess. You gotta play for yourself and see what's all about. If you like platforming, there's a big chance you'll enjoy it.

>>4191863
Stop talking about Yoshi's Island

This game always puts me to sleep every time I try to play it. I don't know why; I really do want to like it but I can't bring myself to make it passed the first section.

>>4191840
Great graphics, animation and sound.

Of course, there's the most important factor: despite being developed by brits, it's designed like a japanese platformer instead of a western one.

>>4191967
I'm not, I've never played it.

>>4191971
Sounds like issues with your sleep schedule

Will Yoshi Island fans ever recover?

people that say this game has bad controls need to get gud and learn how to hold the run button. fucking plebs. it's amazingly fun for a snes platformer.

>>4192054
What do you mean?

>>4192054
>>4192136
both franchises are dead anon. I'm not sure why either of them would recover.

>>4191863
>>4191967
>>4192154
Why do people like to pretend that either of these franchises are bad or have any bad games?

Well, I cant defend New Island since I never played it, but the only kind of person that can hate on the new DKC's is a contrarian

>>4192173
>why do people pretend they're bad! they're mediocre!
because fuck you. We call things bad that you call mediocre. That just means we've got taste and you got an "everyone's a winner" mentality.

>>4192181
There isnt a single DKC that is even close to mediocre senpai

Keep thinking you have sophisticated taste because you can call good games bad.

>>4192190
read
>or have any bad games?

>>4192190
>There isnt a single DKC that is even close to mediocre senpai

Keep telling yourself that.

>>4192195
that's not a donkey kong COUNTRY game

>>4191840
I like the music sound and atmosphere more than anything

>>4192195
That isnt DKC matey. May as well include Jungle Beat

>>4192195
this is like bringing up sonic r if someone makes a generalization about the genesis sonic games

I like the DKC games a lot I actually just beat the first one again this week and started playing the second, and people saying they're popular just because of the graphics are dumb. Nobody is going to play and complete something that came out in the 90s today because of the graphics, especially if they're not good games. They have a good balance between being easy and fun and requiring some thought/precision to get past certain obstacles. There are lots of places where you can get through an easy way or there's a more difficult move that will be much faster or where you can collect a bonus item. These are foundational elements of good game design

>>4192195
If you like collectathons DK64 is fun, has cool boss fights, and has some fine platforming.

It just isnt Banjo Kazooie/Tooie

>>4192201
>>4192241
Tropical Freeze is an objectively bad game.

>>4191967
The descriptor applies to both Yoshi's Island and the DKC games.

Kirby Super Star was far better than those games.

>>4191840
Super smooth controls, you always feel 100 percent in control of your ape. Fun physics that entertain and just feel right. The level design has a vast learning curve, allowing you to groove through the levels in an ever more daring fashion, which makes this game a joy for speed runners as there is lots of room for creativity and a lot of fun in finding the fastest route trough levels. On top of the stellar gameplay you have an outstanding, highly atmospheric and catchy soundtrack that has no duds on it paired with truly beautiful graphics of a picturesque and timeless quality.

>>4192369
>Super smooth controls, you always feel 100 percent in control of your ape.
Really what I hated about the modern DKC games. They also look like shit because they're not like the original trilogy.

>>4192369
>Super smooth controls, you always feel 100 percent in control of your ape.
That's just blatantly untrue.

>>4192190
>There isnt a single DKC that is even close to mediocre senpai
Very true. 1&2 are great and 3 is total trash, absolutely abysmal. None of them is close to being mediocre.

>>4192285
This is a /vr/. Freeze doesn't exist here.

>>4192498
But it does mean both the Yoshi and DK franchises are dead.

>>4192376
Git gud. The game has pin point jump accuracy and you can cancel out of any movement at any time. It doesn't get any better than that. If you are unsatisfied, it is because you suck.

>>4192507
>both the Yoshi and DK franchises are dead

Everything is dead here, faggot, this is /vr/

>>4192558
>implying /vr/ doesn't play modern games

>>4192512
>Git gud. The game has pin point jump accuracy and you can cancel out of any movement at any time.
Those multiple frames of animation used for turning which makes the game feel slow as molasses and delayed, inputs being dropped, rolls conveniently ending right before I hit an enemy, and those garbage hitboxes must all have been my imagination then.

Oh wait, they weren't.

>>4192620
Stop talking about Tropical Freeze here, it's not retro.

>>4192620
They are, yeah. Game's polished as fuck.

>>4192620
>rolls conveniently ending right before I hit an enemy
so in other words you're terrible and can't time the move correctly

>>4192620
Those multiple frames of animation used for turning which makes the game feel slow as molasses and delayed,
I already told you in a thread months ago that this is false you irredeemable fucknut. As soon as you input, your character starts to move while turning. You can use this to moonwalk by tapping left and right rapidly but one side a few milliseconds longer than the other.

>inputs being dropped
more like your sausage fingers fumble and you blame the game for it.

>rolls conveniently ending right before I hit an enemy
This is an issue with your judgement of distance, not with the game itself. Always roll while running for a longer roll distance. Actually, never walk at all, always run. If there is one valid criticism of this game it would be that run should be the default because walking is useless and you should never do it.

>and those garbage hitboxes must all have been my imagination then.
The hitboxes are fine. What are you even talking about?

>>4192620
>Those multiple frames of animation used for turning which makes the game feel slow as molasses and delayed
I already told you in a thread months ago that this is false you irredeemable fucknut. As soon as you input, your character starts to move while turning. You can use this to moonwalk by tapping left and right rapidly but one side a few milliseconds longer than the other.

>inputs being dropped
more like your sausage fingers fumble and you blame the game for it.

>rolls conveniently ending right before I hit an enemy
This is an issue with your judgement of distance, not with the game itself. Always roll while running for a longer roll distance. Actually, never walk at all, always run. If there is one valid criticism of this game it would be that run should be the default because walking is useless and you should never do it.

>and those garbage hitboxes must all have been my imagination then.
The hitboxes are fine. What are you even talking about?

>tfw couldbeat it as kid
>cant beat it now
>that minecart level

the OST

>northern hemispheres
>aquatic ambiance

>>4192647
>Press roll right in front of an enemy
>It ends right before we make contact

>>4192675
>I already told you in a thread months ago that this is false you irredeemable fucknut. As soon as you input, your character starts to move while turning.
The camera moves, making it so the only thing I managed to move by changing direction was the camera position.

>>more like your sausage fingers fumble and you blame the game for it.
>Press B button to jump over a pit
>Game doesn't register input and I fall to my death

>This is an issue with your judgement of distance, not with the game itself. Always roll while running for a longer roll distance.
See above. You can start a roll right in front of an enemy and still get hit.

>>The hitboxes are fine. What are you even talking about?
>Clearly jump over an enemy
>Get hit anyway

The controls are shit and so are the games. I have no problems with the controls for things like Ninja Gaiden on the NES because the controls actually fucking work the way they should and the hitboxes are accurate. It's satisfying to play. I can't say the same about DKC.

>>4192291
If you're bad at video games and couldn't get past the fourth world of DKC2 why didn't you just say so?

>>4192757
>The camera moves, making it so the only thing I managed to move by changing direction was the camera position.
I can do it, It's doable. You just seem to suck at inputs.

>Press B button to jump over a pit
>Game doesn't register input and I fall to my death
This has never happened to me and I've played this game a lot, for years. Are you playing a shitty emulator? Maybe check your controller, try a new one.

>You can start a roll right in front of an enemy and still get hit.
See above.

>Clearly jump over an enemy
>Get hit anyway
See above. I can't even imagine how that is supposed to happen.

>>4192757
>Press roll right in front of an enemy
>It ends right before we make contact

Are you walking? You're walking, aren't you? You have to run buddy, always keep that Y-button pressed.

>>4192865
yeah he's walking. what an asshat. and he's probably playing it on an emulator with his cuckbox one controller.

>>4192638
In Tropical Freeze they advertise pulling things out of the ground as a feature. Can you believe the state video games has gotten itself into?

>>4192873
I just tested it, he has to be standing actually. I tried to replicate what he described because it really never happened to me naturally. The roll extends really far and is super forgiving when you try to hit an enemy at the end of it. It difficult to actually do though because you have to start rolling as soon as the enemy enters the screen to even catch them at the end of it if they are moving towards you.

Also, the walking roll isn't nearly as gimped as I remembered, I haven't actually done one in forever, cause why the fuck would you ever. It's actually a standing roll that cuts your roll distance down to like a fourth, you actually kind of just do the move standing in place. So for what he's been describing to happen, you have to remove your thumb from the D-pad before pressing Y to roll so that you perform a standing roll.

That's the only way to consistently come up short but even then you would still have time to jump out of the way or just roll again before getting hit because the controls are so responsive.

>>4192291

>Kirby Super Star was far better than those games

oh yeah, the game with less challenge than Super Mario World. Right anon.

>>4192846
>I can do it, It's doable. You just seem to suck at inputs.
>This has never happened to me and I've played this game a lot, for years. Are you playing a shitty emulator? Maybe check your controller, try a new one.
>See above.
>See above. I can't even imagine how that is supposed to happen.
Yes, because the same problems occurring consistently over the course of the past 23 years on real hardware and on many emulators with many different controllers means that the game isn't at fault. Meanwhile, other games on the same real hardware and same many emulators with many different controllers don't have these problems.

All of this consistent empirical evidence gathered over decades, but no, it's me that's the problem, got it.

>>4192865
I always run in platformers, buddy.

>>4192918
It's just you complaining. I've never heard anybody else make those claims. You're the anomaly here, not me.

>>4192903
maybe he's playing with his feet

>>4192927
I think he's just trolling and lying through his teeth after reading >>4192918

>>4192918
>>4192865
>>4192757

Need to get some better reactions then, bud, the game is polished as fuck.

>>4192109
I have a good feeling the retro devs never found out the run button existed in earlier DKC

>>4192757

my god what an autistic shitlord you are

>>4193116
Why? Because running is default or that you can roll indefinitely when you have diddy?

>>4193331
mostly that the wii dkcs were designed to be played as if the run button doesnt exist, but that had more to do with the floaty physics and level design in those games. Still a big difference of game design

It's OK. Not a big fan that the mechanics are very simple. Then you have those Gimmick stages where you have to collect gas or wait for a fire to go out before jumping on the platform. Prefixed graphics or whatever you call them also make it a tad hard to know if you made your jump on an enemy correctly. It's still a fun game, and I still enjoy it a lot. But I can't call it a masterpiece with those flaws.

>>4191972
As this man says, good sound effects and music. I have yet to try this and dkc2 on a CRT but I imagine it would look great. Just need an sd2snes

>>4191967
>Yoshi's Island
>bad game

Bitch, you better explain yourself right now. You think you can get away with going around and talking shit about one of the SNES's greatest platformers without backing it up?

True Kong here.
All other versions non-canonical.

>>4193909
AKSHUALY
Donkey Kong: just DK
Donkey Kong JR: DK Kidnapped, rescued by DKJR
DKC: Original DK is now cranky, DKjr has now taken the mantle (Further evidenced by cranky still not wearing clothing, as the original donkey kong never wore a tie or nothin, but DK JR was no stranger to wearing a wifebeater, which he carries on by wearing a tie, deepest lore etc etc)
Mario kart sorta confirms this by having DKJR in SMK become standard DK in MK64

>>4193918
And the Game and Watch versions?

>>4191840
It's not though.

>>4192190
Correct, they're all insipid, ugly trash games that would have turned out even worse without Nintendo EAD holding Rare's clammy, limey hand throughout development.

>>4191967
>Yoshi's Island
>bad
Wew lad

Because of poor collision detection, iffy momentum mechanics, lame bosses, randomly-placed save locations that require you to beat some number of levels in a row in each world before you can save at will again, and mostly-uninspired level design.

>>4195510
stomping on poles to find red coins every level? Dunno how anyone can defend it if I'm being honest

>>4191840
Because everyone loves black people

>>4195620
Shit man, couldn't have said it better myself. I can get why people like it but I always thought these issues were obvious and stood in the way of me enjoying it.

>>4195620
>randomly-placed save locations that require you to beat some number of levels in a row in each world before you can save at will again
git gud

>>4195620
>poor collision detection
Much better than most other western-designed platformers though. This anon already covered that: >>4191883
>iffy momentum mechanics
I completely disagree, the momentum on DKC is great. What makes it "iffy" to you?
>lame bosses
The bosses are just okay, I like the big bee, and the final boss fight is really good. But yeah bosses could have been more exciting, still I wouldn't call them lame except maybe for the first one (his ice world incarnation is a lot more vicious).
>randomly-placed save locations that require you to beat some number of levels in a row in each world before you can save at will again
How long can it take to beat a couple levels in a row? Anyway yeah I remember struggling with the ice world when I was a kid. However, we should be grateful the game has a save system at all, many games in /vr/ times didn't. People are just spoiled now with save states and what not.
>and mostly-uninspired level design.
Disagree, then again, probably different people have different appreciation for level design.
The only seemingly flaw I could think about DKC's level design is that some of the secret bonus rooms are really randomly hidden, often in places that would require a leap of faith, or just plain using a guide to find them all (especially in levels like Orang-utan Gang, that one has a lot of secrets that are hard to find on your own), But then again secrets are just extra stuff, you don't need them to finish the game, and DKC1 isn't even like the sequels where you need to find stuff to unlock secret levels, in DKC1 it's just about getting extra lives and completing the file %.

>>4195620
git gud

>>4191967
Yoshi's island is the best platformer ever you dumb /v/fag.

>>4196698
read >>>4195785
As much as I liked it though

Yoshi's Island must be the only platformer you've ever played.

>>4193918
how do you explain this?

>>4192285

It honestly isn't bad. Different yes, but not bad. I mean, nothing compares to the original trilogy, but as a standalone game Tropical Freeze is pretty alright.

>>4197702
Who gives a shit about head-canon either way? Video games aren't meant for that kinda shit with few exceptions. Some flavor text written by someone else is as non-canon as it gets.

>>4197709
>it's not bad because you can finish it from start to end
It's an absolute disgrace. Unfun and shits all over the DKC franchise.

>>4197714

That's not what I implied at all. Stop putting words in my mouth.

>>4197730
That's word for word what you said. Stop glorifying mediocrity.

>>4197731

No, it's not. Is English not your first language?

>>4197734
Not an argument

>>4197738

There are no arguments here, not on this board. Just a metric fuckton of people having pissing contests and shitting all over the floor.

>>4197741
>no you
Stopped reading there

>>4197619
>>4195785
Finding red coins is optional. When I played Yoshi's Island as a kid I didn't care about getting a perfect score.

>>4198353
>it is optional
So is playing the game. If you want to beat the game 100%. Doing this is necessary.

>>4198812
But you can see the ending of the game (i.e. beat the game) without doing that.
Also, this fucker says "ho-hohoho"

>"platformers" where the player takes up 1/9 of the screen
There needs to be a different name for garbagr like dkc

>>4198812
man that's so dumb
>100% the game is too tedious guys
As opposed to jumping into every hole in any given DKC2 level to find a bonus room?

You people are fucking casuals.

>>4199195
>but you can see the ending by performing a glitch that skips to the end credits

>>4199726
I never said anything about tedium. I just said it isn't really defensible

>>4191967
autism, autism,
and memes

>>4200113
To add to your post, the DKC games and Yoshi's Island were both responsible for the collectathons that came to dominate the platformer genre in the late 90s. Collecting things wasn't required to progress in them, but they sure as fuck heavily encouraged the idea of collecting trinkets via DKC's percentage counter and YI's grading system.

>>4200113
>>but you can see the ending by performing a glitch that skips to the end credits

It's not a glitch, it's just sequence breaking, you casual.

>>4200189
And here's how I know you're very young and never played anything pre-4th gen.

>>4191840
playing it for the first time rn, loving the level design, music, artstyle, and atmosphere overall, bad bosses though

>>4200521
This. There were several games on the NES alone where the game encouraged you to collect stuff, not in the least some of Rare's games (not that he would know that Rare developed games before Donkey Kong Country got released).

>>4200521
>>4201707
He never said anything about them being the first you dipshits. Why am I surrounded by a bunch of ESL?

>>4201902
Why do you speak in 3rd person anon?

>>4201902
>collecting things wasn't required to progress in them, but they sure as fuck heavily encouraged the idea of collecting trinkets via DKC's percentage counter and YI's grading system.

By that logic you could just as well say that games from the 80s were "preparing" people for collectathons. Hell you might as well say almost every game in existence is a collectible. The fact you see it as "heavily encouraging" that the developers put in some extra stuff players could bother with for replay value only says something about yourself. Do you consider Zelda or Metroid games to be collectathons as well then? Or almost any RPG in existence?

>>4204013
You don't really understand the distinction. DKC and YI prominently display your ability at hunting down collectibles. DKC shows your percentage on the file select screen every time you save or load. Yoshi's Island grades you after every single level.

Compare that to something like Super Metroid, where you only see your percentage after you have beaten the game. Both ways "grade" you, but DKC and YI are far more in your face about it. Also, Zelda never says to you "hey, you didn't pick up this collectible." The distinction means everything.

>>4204362
The "distinction" you're trying to make is still extremely subjective and most likely wrong.
I get what you mean though, that because YI and DKC have collectibles that influence your % completion, that means they are the reason games like Banjo-Kazooie and Spyro existed.
And I don't know, I don't think so, dude.
DKC and YI are both classic 2D platformers, where the extra collectibles you can take are just part of the whole obstacle course, or alternate path secrets.
You don't really need to get a set amount of these items to be able to hit the goal of the level, though, and that's where the main distinction lies, the one you can't observe.

You were wrong from the start by comparing 2D platformers to 3D ones.
And even within 3D platformers, people use the word "collectathon" a lot, and a lot of times it doesn't really apply much.

>>4204402
The focus on grading the player for their completion percentage is what lead to the "collect X amount of trinket to beat the game" design that became prominent in platformers during the second half of the 90s. I fail to see how this is a hard concept to grasp. You're hung up on the idea that 2D platformers and 3D platformers can't be compared simply because one of them has an additional axis to move around in. That third axis doesn't magically change the idea of jumping around obstacles and on to platforms.

Compare DKC and YI to Super Mario World. SMW never grades you for the number of dragon coins you collect, you simply gain a 1-Up for collecting five. DKC games berate you at the end for not finding every bonus room and trinket. YI plays a fanfare and animates the results screen if you manage to finish a level with 30 seconds, 20 red coins, and 5 flowers. The games are at their core designed around the idea that you should go out of your way to collect things unrelated to beating the level, and that idea turned into designing games solely around needing to collect things to beat levels.

>>4192173
>style over substance
I'd say it's the opposite with a lot of "classics" people love, but especially on Nintendo. They're sound games, but the style is utter shit and many of us won't touch them. Take DK out and you have a game of monkey families and bananas that I would give to my 3 year old cousin.

What is it about DKC that inspires every other series' fanboys to crawl out of the woodwork to proclaim their favorite's superiority over DKC whenever it's mentioned? Is it because the fake Miyamoto quote just set the precedent or what?

Seriously, you don't go into Kirby threads and see 500 posts that go like "PFF, KIRBY IS SO OVERRATED, ACTUALLY ROCKET KNIGHT ADVENTURES IS WHERE IT'S AT!" every single time.

>>4204623
Because they're all weebs who are extremely butthurt that a western studio took a Japanese IP and made it incredible/what it is today

>>4204013
I don't really 100% metroid or zelda games because the more you collect the easier they become. And with jrpgs it's just implausible to define what is 100%ing it. I think it's different from a game like Yoshi that has individual level grading

>>4204623
Because Kirby has always been a more cultish, low-key series in comparison to the original Donkey Kong Country.

Also you'd be hard-pressed to find people saying Kirby has some of the greatest platformers of all time. Meanwhile there are people like OP that praise DKC from the mountaintops.

I honestly think DKC is INCREDIBLY overrated. It's a decent game but there are many superior platforms. DKC2 and even 3 are leagues better anyway.

>great graphics
>great music
>great level design
>levels are fresh and different enough from each other that they don't get stale
>lots of secrets to find

it's just really high quality in all areas

>>4204553
Yeah but the fact remains: You can hit the goalpost without having to collect everything.
>>4204623
>Is it because the fake Miyamoto quote just set the precedent or what?
Yes.

>>4191840
It just is

>>4200189
Mario was the one to do that shit first. Or have you forgotten a lot of the Mario series depended on having micro rewards like coins, 1 ups, and power ups to keep the player interested? Aka collectathons. Call out the actual perpetrator.

>>4204847
>I honestly think DKC is INCREDIBLY overrated. It's a decent game but there are many superior platforms.
Suggest a better platformer that is fast and not Sonic.


>and even 3 are leagues better anyway.
>leagues better
>3
Oh, so you're just fucking retarded, don't know what makes a good game and have terrible taste. Forget I asked and just proceed to kill yourself.

I'm playing them for the first time. I beat 1 last week. about 10 stages into 2.

the graphics always turned me off. they still do except for the backgrounds on the underwater stages. the music is awesome.

the gameplay is simple, not gimmicky. the difficulty is perfect with the exception of very minor parts.the secrets are there but not too obscure. it's just a really balanced game. bosses a bit easy. although I'm an old fart and skipped DK country when it was new, I can now see why it's popular.

>>4191840

I think that looking at the game now, it can feel really barebones, there's no extra content at all. I think the game is still liked so much because even if it feels lackluster now, it still has a big advantage over the tremendous glut of platformers that popped up in the early 90s because it was at the very least a competent game. The controls are extremely tight and even something as simple as jumping in mid-air long after rolling off a cliff is satisfying. Sure didn't get that with any of the bullshit Acclaim, Ocean, or Sunsoft made.

Also, the differences between DK and Diddy's gameplay is infinitesimal. There's that stretch in Jungle Hijinx where you can run for a while if you kill all the enemies first. Despite being "faster", Diddy makes that run in a smoking ten seconds, while DK takes a whopping eleven seconds. And Diddy only jumps higher after bouncing off an enemy, and even then it's practically unnoticeable.

>>4193918
I just replayed through the DKC games. In 2 or 3 (I forget), Cranky refered to Donkey as his grandson. Donkey Kong Jr. was DKC Donkey's dad.

>>4207929
Right. DK is shit and not worth using. No need to dote over why.

>>4208124
>Donkey Kong Jr. was DKC Donkey's dad.

So that would make him "Donkey Kong III"?