/vr/ - Retro Games

Welcome to /vr/ where every thread is bait and emulation doesn't matter.

Well I think the graphics are pretty keen. Comparing it to Space Invaders is a compliment.

>anon jr gives his views on games released before his time

okay cool

>>3964827
>Emulation
Doesn't relate
>Bait
I'm trying to start a discussion. Maybe, some games aren't good even though they're retro. We can't just say, "This is fine," and just cross our arms and sit back. We have to analyze these things, look at them critically. Otherwise, how can we continue to grow as people?

>>3964830
>Grandpa anon shit-talks younger anon for having an opinion about shitty games released in his time with rose-tinted nostalgia goggles
Yeah, okay, cool. We'll never see eye to eye like this.

jesus christ

Cool blog post, OP

>>3964863
What's wrong? Is what I said untrue in any way?

>>3964867
It's a post on 4chan, Idk what you're on about.

>>3964835

The game is a timeless classic, OP. Not our fault you can't see what people have seen in it for 30 years. If you don't know why people like this game by now then you're terribly new to discussing Zelda.

>>3964874
Timeless classic, ok
>Woooooooooah look at me, I'm the first Zelda, and you should like me because I'm a crusty fuck that started the open-world genre (although shittily), and like me despite my glaring flaws, like the awful balancing and not being clear with the player, woooooooooooow

>>3964882
Link to the past is a timeless fucking classic. Ocarina of Time (still not that good) is more of a timeless classic than the first one. The first one is bad. I will show it to my kids, but only because it was one of the first open world games, and to show him how the industry learned from it and how far it came. It does NOT have good gameplay.

>>3964882

You're clearly a youngster. This game was the shit at the time. All of your complaints were not valid in 1987, when I first played it. And I was late to the party.

>>3964897
>>3964892
C'mon guys don't be so mean to OP. He probably just needs some motivation to finish the game to "get" it.

>>3964897
>Not valid in 1987
They are valid now. It's not gonna be remembered as a gem forever, mark my words. Why the hell would I play the first one over Link to the Past?

>>3964892

>Ocarina of Time(Still not that good)

LttP is great, but OoT did more for gaming overall. This is why its cock gets ridden more and will until the end of video games. Stay mad.

Anyway, it really amuses me seeing people like you trying to argue that Zelda I is bad. It was great once, and now many games have surpassed it especially in its own series, but just like Pac-Man its more than playable and plenty of fun. To say its "bad" is subjective. To ignore the love it had and its influence is just plain ignorance. To not examine it from a mid-1980's perspective is to do yourself and the game a dis-service.

Why do you people play old games? To shit on them?

>>3964904
There is no getting it. Play the better game in Link to the Past. Understand why the first is an important piece of gaming history, leave it be.

>>3964915

Zelda I and II are casual filters. Ya'll suck.

ANOTHER fucking zelda thread?
you fags need to play more games

>>3964923
Yeah, like Golden Axe Warrior

>>3964835
Review the game in context then, compare and contrast it to other games released within a year prior to and after Japanese release. Also, for calibration, please name your favorite retro game.

>>3964926
Or metal slug. Maan metal slug 3 is such a fine ass game.

>>3964909

>mark my words

Yes, your words. Your words are overwhelmingly in the minority. This game, The Legend of Zelda, is in just about every book containing the history of the video games. Not every game gets a mention either.

I don't know what your problem is but it sounds to me like this is really personal for you. Stop trying to change what is done. The game is already in the history books. Let it go.

>>3964931
n-no anon, I'm making a joke. But yes, Metal slug 3 is my favorite.

>>3964913
Not ignoring its influence whatsoever. The love it had doesn't influence my opinion in any way, and I don't see why it matters. The appeal to emotion is not going to work.
>Why do you people play old games? To shit on them?
No, it's because I was interested in the history of the art form, imbecile. Heard it get praised to no end, thought I'd give it a shot. I don't just hate all old games, just bad ones. Symphony of the Night is one of my favorite games of all time. There is no reason, NONE, to play the first game other than for interest in the game that launched the franchise. That's like grinning and taking it in the ass from the first Street Fighter and saying it's better than 2 or 4. I don't understand the logic in these posts.

>>3964928
>Favorite Retro Game?
I'd say it's between Mario 3 and Symphony of the Night, just can't pick one.

>>3964938

I'm clearly talking to someone more than 15 years younger than I am.

Sorry kid, but you don't know jack shit.

>I don't understand the logic in these posts

Again, I'll reiterate. Not a single complaint you have is even valid given what else was available at the time. Sure, the game has been surpassed. No one says its the best, but its still a completely playable game that offers some freedom not seen in much of its competition.

I could go on further about how you're wrong and just a snotnosed shithead, but I'll stop because history's already been made. I don't really need to do anything.

>>3964954
>What was available at the time
Okay, goon. Mario 1, DK for arcade, hell, Pac-Man. I'd play those over Zelda any day.

>>3964963

>goon

Good lord

Anyway, then by all means go play them. As I've said, your opinion really isn't worth much against the weight of history.

>>3964824
Alright, you goobers are kind of frustrating. I'm not saying this game isn't important to the history of the industry. Its influence can still be seen today. What I am saying is that despite that, it's a bad game. Argue the flaws. Present the argument for why it's good, so we can all consider these points in a discussion. You guys need something more than, "I loved it," or, "you're not considering the fact that it's important to gaming," because I am, and these are puny arguments.

>>3964971
>History
Yes, you are a goon. I have said and reiterated time and again that I UNDERSTAND that it's an important to history. It is, yet it's still a bad game.

>>3964973
You're confusing "It's a bad game because of design reasons that wouldn't be considered for another generation" and "I don't like it."

>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).

This is not even true you stupid baka.

/v/, you can't just play the contrarian for something old and expect personal nitpicks to sustain your position.

>>3964981
How else are the devs supposed to patch broken games?

>>3964973

What you've asked for has already been discussed in the thread, OP.

what you're bitching about is that its basically the foundation for a whole bunch of shit and by itself looks like and plays like and is bad when compared to everything that came after it.

No one is saying its GOAT. It's simply a good game. You can have almost no issues completing it as long as you're not a retard, and if you like retro games, overall its a good experience.

You come off as someone that got frustrated, used a guide, and then had attention span issues regarding the soundtrack when they didn't have the space for the complete OST you think the game needs.

Stop being a fag OP

>>3964978
Play it again dumbo. Spear-throw-boys, rocks, tektites, peahats which move to the edges constantly so they can't be hit.

>>3964985
You just like the game. I don't hate retro games. It's just that there are better ones.

>>3964975

And again, you're overvaluing your opinion. Tell me some of your favorite modern games that you think are timeless. By all means. Going by your logic, they're bad in 30 years by default.

Everything that made this game fun in the 80's is still there anon. It's just that since its been outdone you can't get your head out of your ass to see it for what it is.

>>3964986
That's not what's being said at all moron.

>>3964991

>You just like the game

Because its a good game and none of your complaints are valid, especially when you take into consideration what limitations they were working with.

>Its just that there are better ones

Agreed. That still doesn't make Zelda I bad. It does however mean that OP is a faggot.

>>3964992
You don't even need to go to modern gaming to see timeless classics. Doom is timeless. Metal Gear Solid, more recent, timeless. Mario 3, Super Mario World, timeless, Symphony of the Night, timeless. Call of Duty 4, timeless
>inb4 "wooooow look at you, COD goomba
You want to talk timeless? Super Meat Boy is a gift to man.

>>3964997
>Limitations
Not a good reason, especially since Castlevania exists.

>>3965006

>You don't even need to go to modern gaming to see timeless classics.

What are you talking about? No shit you underage fool. That isn't what I was asking you and you bringing up other games that are held in high regard just as The Legend of Zelda is shows you can't read or comprehend things properly.

Again, its not the game: it is you.

>>3965006
woops, sorry, cod 4 is moder, haha, should've put it with meat boy

>>3965009

Castlevania is a completely different style of game and Simon's Quest sucks. What's your fucking point?

>>3965006
Doom? A single plane experience where aiming doesn't matter and you just fetch the same three keys over and over, blindly looking for secrets in walls that have no other indication there's anything there?

>>3965017
Nice AVGNpinion newfag

>>3965026

>newfag

I've always hated simon's quest. Got another baseless accusation to throw my way you dipshit?

>>3965021

DOOM is a timeless classic. God you people need to get over yourselves.

>>3965014
They're better than Zelda. I disregarded your modern gaming since I can ignore it because there are better games from even around its time. I'll give you some modern gaming reccomendations, though.
Call of Duty 4
Doom (the one that just came out)
Monster Hunter (really any one you prefer)
Devil May Cry
DK Country for Wii, 3ds
Could go for Pokemon Sun or Moon
Super Meat Boy
Binding of Isaac
Hyper Light Drifter
Super Mario Galaxy (that and 2 are pure gold)
Zelda Breath of the Wild
Dark Souls series
Ultra Street Fighter 4

>>3965029
Why is Doom a timeless classic (Wolfenstein was the real groundbreaker with an actual plot that's not lol demons) but Zelda isn't?

>>3965029
No you havent you gay little nerd

>>3965037

nice. that sure proves me wrong.

>>3965036

You're confusing people. LoZ is a timeless classic. So is DOOM.

>>3965032

>they're better than zelda so zelda is bad

Well, it was fun. Enjoy your shit thread OP, you're cancer.

>>3965021
Doom has fun in it though. It's action packed, with exciting music (though there are few tracks), and you don't have to look for secrets.

>>3964824
>Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen
No they don't. Some do and they never spawn near an edge you're close to and if there's only one edge they will only spawn when you're far enough away from it.

>>3965048

OP is mad about a game from 1986 having only a couple music tracks. He's too far gone anon. He can't understand anything.

>>3965043
Zelda is bad for the reasons I stated in OP, and they're even more glaring when you compare it to games from its period.

>>3965057
Castlevania is from 1986 and had a new track for each level. Lack of effort from devs, I guess.

>>3965045
Fun is a subjective quality. What if I gain more personal enjoyment from solving mazes and puzzles instead of W+M1 through the same wall textures for 2 hours?

>>3965043
I might have confused you for OP and was using his arguments against Zelda on a title he holds dear to show that his criticisms don't hold weight. Doom's ok.

>>3965071
>Implying Zelda doesn't look the same in every dungeon and cave
maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan c'mon now

>>3965060

Why are you bringing up Castlevania again? Casltevania was a much smaller game. You know nothing of the history of the games you're trying to critique.

>>3965059

>Zelda is bad for the reasons stated in OP even though others have mentioned why I'm wrong.

Mmmm. Great thread OP.

>>3965079
He fucking said:
>OP is mad about a game from 1986 having only a couple music tracks.
Castlevania is 1986. Varied soundtrack. It's the fucking time period of Zelda. Why not bring it up?

>>3965078
You're comparing a console game from 1986 to a PC game from 1993.

>>3965090
Then I'll compare it to a game from its time period, Castlevania. Varied music, varied levels, enemies, beautiful game.

>>3965101
So by that logic, Doom, compared to say, Rise of the Triad, is a flawed and bad game.

>>3965086

The first time he brought it up he tried to say Zelda 1 is bad because Castlevania is better.

They're different genres, with Castlevania being the smaller game. Comparing them is exceptionally stupid.

>>3965103
Yeah, you're right, Zelda is just bad, you don't even have to compare it to others to see it.

>>3965105

You sure think you're exceptional at this.

>>3965026

It never gets old. James totally blew your game out of the water years ago and you still can't handle it.

10+ years of BTFO

Even when growing up, I thought the game sucked too. I didn't even play III because of how much it sucked, as games weren't exactly given to me all the time.

>>3965108
>Oh woooooooooow I'm sooo trolled, Im gonna knucklespost

>>3964824
lol I love it when the 12yr olds have an opinion and share it with people that laugh at dumb child opinions like ops

>>3965187
I'm not 12, grandpa

>>3965191
>Being this triggered when called out for being a newfag

>>3965171

>woooooooooow

You're on the wrong board.

>>3964824
>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders.
Maybe. But the graphics are still miles better than the bloody diarrhea that was Zelda II.

>>3965193
I'm not even triggered. You're just wrong about my age

>>3965217
I'm not even that guy.

>>3965224
Wow, look at you

>>3964824
I agree with 2b and 1

but the visuals are dope, old school

I mean, it's really a game where you memorize where the fucking hidden shit is and then play it over and over

one thing that great games have is replay value as opposed to just earning coins or whatever and buying the newest crap available in the "store"

over and out

>>3965217

>You're just wrong about my age

Then stop acting like a 12 year old. Believe it or not, the way you present yourself matters even when you're anonymous.

>>3965227
>Play the same game over and over just to find more rupees in hidden caves
Coooooooooooooome on

>>3965234
>>3965225
>>3965108
>>3965105
>>3965071
>>3965074
>>3965026
>>3965032
>>3964992
>>3964926
>>3964928
>>3964897
>>3964824
zelda is the worst anyweays its all just dungeon this dungeon that heres the items wow look at me im throwingf boomberangs everywhere


>zelda doesnt even have that much to do with the lose
>the lose is literally based off creator's childhood so automatic shit

series in general is not that impressive imo, had to copy skyrim and mass effect to amke a decent selling game and keep the series afloat in 2016 lol.

>at least they have a fanbase of retarded edgy teens who claim OoT is the bread and butter of modern gameing formulas

no it isn't. grow up. get a good game on like morrowind.

>>3965261
i meant to write lore instead of lose sorry anons

>>3965261
The 13 year old is starting to crack. It's a shame he can't even appreciate quality games for the right reasons.

>>3965269
It was a different anon, you can see by his terrible spelling (and also the number of posters went up)

>>3965269
>>>965269
>>>>65269
>>>>>5269
>>>>>>269
>>>>>>>69

oh yeah because morrowind is a shitty game lol.

Elder Scrolls series is what zelda always aspired to be. prove me wronge

>>3965286
>The Elder Scrolls games can safely be categorized as role-playing games (RPG), although they do include elements taken from action and adventure games. In Arena, as in many RPGs, players advance by killing monsters (and thereby gaining experience points) until a preset value is met, whereupon they level-up
Zelda did this once and everyone hates it. Leveling makes no sense other than to gate players with an invisible barrier.

>>3965290
haha oh yeah sure buddy prove it

>>3964830
Honestly, this is a really silly argument. It actually proves his point. You're essentially saying you need nostalgia goggles for it to be enjoyable. Good job.

>>3965294
>muh open world
>can't go anywhere because a level 2 rat will kill me
Bravo, whoever makes that shit.

>>3964938
You are so clearly a kid! Look, nothing in this world is "invented". everything, EVERYTHING, is an innovation inspired by what came before. SotN, more than perhaps any other game, is an example of this. it is a culmination of decades of gameplay and innovation. Especially because it is a mixing of two genre-defining games.

Nothing in art, and very little in science, can stand on its own as a paragon that will never be eclipsed by later works. By definition, art evolves, and that means it grows from what came before it. That you can scoff at OG Zelda means that the gaming art form has drawn inspiration from it, and gone on to create better things. Newer games are better than Zelda, BECAUSE OF ZELDA.

can it stand on its own, against games today? no. and it should not be expected to. the gaming landscape of the early NES was vastly different from today. People had different expectations, and the art form was still developing, let alone discovering the best ways to optimize its strengths.

seriously, saying that Zelda is a lame game is like bitching that Romeo and Juliet has needlessly complicated dialog and uses worn out tropes. such an argument says more about the person making it, than the work they are directing it at

>>3965306
He said nothing about open world, just that Elder Scrolls are better. Open world means nothing when the game is shit, like in Zelda's case.

>>3964963
those are all vastly different games from Zelda. they are pretty different from each other, too. its like trying to say that Basketball is a better game than Baseball

>>3965323

>>3965324
you know what fuck you zelda is better than skyrim and you're a fucking moron

I get the feeling the same kid keeps making these "zelda sucks" threads
first OOT, then MM and now the first game

>>3965323
>Nothing in art can stand on its own as a paragon that will never be eclipsed by later works.
I disagree. I think Michealangelo's Sistine Chapel ceiling is a masterwork that no one will come close to matching.

>>3965340
these are the kind of people defending zelda origional series.

enough said

>>3965340
Fuck you too. Oblivion is better than Zelda.

>>3965323
I think we are still waiting on the best game of all time. It will come (not necessarily in our lifetime,) and it will 100% be a paragon that will not be eclipsed.

so we all; agree elder scrolls series is strictly better than zelda series or are we still ciurcle jerking a 31 year old game

>>3965360
>agree elder scrolls series is strictly better than zelda series
Of course it is

>>3965362
based

>>3965364
>>3965362
ok good i think we are on the same page now, thanks for the thread op

>>3965370
Don't get me wrong. They're better than Zelda, but still shit rpgs.

>>3965108
You know, with the length I'm able to keep this discussion going, I'm going to say I'm pretty dang good.

>>3965227
1 is objectively false. I have played this game many times and that literally doesn't happen.

>>3965448
He agrees with 1. It's not just me. Even if you don't get hit when you leave the screen, there's so many guys, you'll take damage so you'll have to kill em to get some health. Combat is just boring.

>>3964824
Your actual complaints are pretty much all false.

>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).

No it doesn't. It really doesn't do that, it never does that. Especially in the dungeons, where if you stay where you spawn you literally CANNOT BE HIT.

>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders

See image. It's leagues ahead, entire video game generations ahead. Hell, it's practically as far better looking than early Famicom games as Link to the Past is to it.

>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.

Which means you actually have to fucking explore. Handholding is shit.

>3) One overworld soundtrack

A flaw. Always been bummed it had so few musical tracks. Kind of a Famicom weakness in general, though.

None of the reasons you gave are either true or significant. Sure, you don't like it... but just because you don't like something doesn't mean it's good, have you ever considered that?

Even the best video game in the world will have people who didn't enjoy playing it. Same with the best book, or the best movie. That's what fucking personal taste actually is!

>>3965462
He can agree all he wants. It's still not true.

>>3964945
Sotn. Underage for sure

>>3965464
>Which means you actually have to fucking explore. Handholding is shit.
Exploring is NOT busywork like this. it's the world giving the player incentive to keep looking, which the game doesn't do for me.
And yes, the music bums me out.

>>3965478
Call me underage all you want, it's the best retro game.

>>3965496
No, Castlevania 3 is far superior to "50 names for the same piece of equipment of the Night."

>>3965504
>"50 names for the same piece of equipment of the Night."
First time I've heard that one. Yeah, you use a sword the whole game (or shield rod, but that's just broken lol) just like in Zelda. I don't get what your problem is here.

>>3965531
>First time I've heard that one
Because I just made it up you fucking cumstain. SOTN is easier than any other game in the Castlevania series up to that point (haven't played anything past it). I've probably played it beyond 200% completion twice and never died.

>>3964854
>>3965295
If you care to re-read my post, I never said anything negative about OP, unless you consider being born after Zelda was released a negative.

Looks like it's past babby's bedtime.

>>3965541
Alright, I'll agree that it's easy. Your other argument sucks ass.

>>3965624
What, that it has a needlessly convoluted equipment system? You disagree with that?

>>3965627
>all those goddamn swords
>only difference is small numbers
>never worth it to bother with unique weapons either
>fuck, you level up anyway, so sword strength isn't even very important

>>3965636
Just equip the one with a higher number, it's really not a problem

>>3965645
The point is it's an overly complicated system that doesn't really change anything. A 7 year old could clear the game with Red Rust and never once intentionally activating a magic spell.

>>3964824
GREAT OPINION 5/5

>>3965651
>Overly complicated
No. Get an item, equip it. That's what a normal person instinctively does. A 7 year old's gonna find a weapon, or a cape, and equip it just to see what it does. I figured it all out. Granted, magic was a little complicated, but I got a spell, and looked in the menus to see how to use it. You don't really need to use them, though.

myfoot.jpg

>>3965673
What the hell does your foot have to do with anything in this thread?

>>3965675
differentperspective.jpg

>come into possible bait thread
>it is
>anons ontop of anons baiting over and over, not even creative or interesting trolles

4chan: 2017

>>3965678
Woooooooooooooooooooooooooow

>>3965670
I didn't say it was complicated, I said it was convoluted and barely effects gameplay.

>>3965678
>>3965673
Haha xD, so randumb!

>>3965682
con·vo·lut·ed
ˈkänvəˌlo͞odəd/
adjective
adjective: convoluted
1.
(especially of an argument, story, or sentence) extremely complex and difficult to follow.
"its convoluted narrative encompasses all manner of digressions"
synonyms: complicated, complex, involved, elaborate, serpentine, labyrinthine, tortuous, tangled, Byzantine; More
antonyms: straightforward
2.
technical
intricately folded, twisted, or coiled.
"walnuts come in hard and convoluted shells"

con·vo·lute
ˈkänvəˌlo͞ot/Submit
verb
past tense: convoluted; past participle: convoluted
make (an argument, story, etc.) complex and difficult to follow.

Surely you see how I came to the conclusion that you were calling it complex?

>>3965687
Check out 2 then get back to me.

>>3965694
What the fuck? That's the wrong context for our argument, fool

>>3965686
mypubes.jpg

>>3965694
wow i bet you are a genious liking a shit game nobody plays and claiming its decent zelda two was worse than one by far but thaty doesnt mean the origional zelda game was good hhaha check out your brain then get back to me

>>3965706
modes ban him

>>3965706

Those are some respectable pubes.

>>3965704
>Talking about a technical aspect of gameplay, not the story

How to make Zelda 1 a little more approachable for casuals without ruining what made the game good:
>Put cracks or some telltale signs of bombable structures outside, in dungeons, make striking walls with the sword sound different if it's bombable.
>make burnable trees slightly different
>make burnable trees immediately vanish when a flame touches them, rather than after the flame vanishes

Everything else about Zelda 1 is fine

>>3965721
In other words, just tell the children to play A Link to the Past?

>>3965727
There's a few unique aspects about the original LoZ that're still great though, I actually love the items you find in the first game, and the simplistic arcadey combat is satisfying and punishing as all hell if you fuck up. I also like how there's no magic meter in the original LoZ, which meant you could experiment and play around with your items pretty often, with the exception of bombs, I'm always really miserly with those.

>>3965714
A gameplay aspect can be "intricately folded, twisted, or coiled"? Because that's not how gameplay aspects behave. Do you understand English?

>>3965741
You know what? You got me. Symphony of the Night is now the greatest retro game of all time.

>>3965750
>Woooooooow look at me, I got wrecked, and don't have a counter argument, so I'm gonna sarcastically say you got me, even though you didn't, haha
Get real, dude

>>3965764
It's so true. I'll send you the deed to my trailer tomorrow.

▲
▲ ▲

>>3965779
whoops there we go lol xD

▲
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>>3965781
>>3965779


crap one more try

▲
▲▲

>>3965784
Why are you doing 3 Triforces, there's only two

hold on let me try once again
▲
▲▲

>>3965792
Good god, he did it 4 TIMES

>>3965464
/thread

>>3964936
It's historically significant, not too good tho

the original metroid is the same deal. They're both flawed games, but they were innovative. THe medium was very young, and they did things that no games before them did.

It's like looking at an early attempt at the internal combustion engine and going "wow look at how poorly engineered this is, so unoptimized." Does not appreciate the context.

Dude why are you bitching about a 31 year old game which you clearly suck at

>>3965846
>Metroid
Same deal as Zelda, and pretty much all my critique applies, except the music. I appreciate the context. They were innovative, not good games though. Love what they brought to the industry, but I don't love them. Even in the context of the time period, there were better games. They were innovative, but made bad mistakes. Hell, Mario 1 had backgrounds. Metroid 1 doesn't even have that going for it.

>>3965858
>Doesn't like to see critiques of retro games, on fucking /vr/...
You have got to be fucking with me.

>>3965846
A more apt comparison would be the steam engine. Started it, but is absolute shit.

>>3964926
Golden Axe Warrior is great but real men play Neutopia.

>>3964824
Still better than Ocarina of Time.

>>3965930
Funny. Say that IRL with a straight face, bet you held back tears of laughter as you were typing out that ingenious bait. Bet you feel proud of yourself.

>>3965936
I legit think it's a better game than OoT, the combat is more challenging and there's no stupid tutorial fairy holding your hand every step of the way.

>>3965941
Alright, navi sucks, the fucking owl sucks, the game isn't that good. But, the combat in Zelda 1 is pathetic. Dinky. He just sticks his sword out. Wow, engaging combat that is.

>>3965928
Final Fantasy is good too

>>3965846

difference is is that you can go back and play LoZ just like it was 1986 and have fun. Hell, you can have fun with it even if you're using a guide.

Metroid 1 you constantly get frustrated over how long it takes to get anywhere and you can only shoot in 4 directions, up down left right. This sucks because its difficult to kill shit this way, especially after playing sequels in the series.

Zelda still works just fine, even if its sequels improved on it x10000.I just don't see how you people have the balls to make a claim like Metroid=LoZ. I completed LoZ first time on the Gamecube Master Disc. I was VERY late. Meanwhile I still can't fucking beat the first metroid game, gave up and played Zero Mission.

>>3965865

Metroid 1 is again, not very comparable to Zelda 1. If you think this, you're awful at games and need to stop playing them.

>>3965945

it was 1986

you people are literally retarded

>>3965840

>not too good

If it wasn't a good game, it wouldn't be historically significant.

You people are so full of fucking dogshit. If it was fun once, its still fun. Just because its been outdone doesn't make it a bad game.

I swear to all flying fuck you people are completely braindead.

>>3965721

What the fuck is the point of even having secrets then? Might as well just have them as open caves otherwise bombs and the candle become just another version of keys

>>3964824
The reasons you give are complete bullshit.


I don't like the first Zelda game, but for different reasons. It's not a bad game, it's one of the greatest games on the NES, but not if you're a newcomer to that system.

I played this game for the first time on the Gamecube with the Windwaker/Ocarina of Time/NES Zelda edition. I liked the big, non-linear open world that you could explore. I liked the enemies, the combat, the fact that you had to find dungeons. I especially liked that you had a wide variety of items to use. It's a great game. Now for why I don't like it.

It's too fucking cryptic. If you pick up this game, don't read any guides on the internet, don't have an entire school bus to debate the game with, no Nintendo Power magazine, the chances of you seeing the end of the game are slim. I couldn't find the second dungeon because there weren't enough hints that led me to the raft. I knew that I had to go to the "easternmost peninsula", but I couldn't cross over the floats that were there. I didn't know which bushes to burn, which items to get, where to bomb shit to progress, and that just made it unplayable. The game is too cryptic for someone playing it on his own without any prior knowledge or rumours/magazines to help him.

By the standard of "you can beat it on your own" it's not a good game today. But not for the reasons you give.

>>3964824
>never had that happen to me. Stop playing like a fag.
>NES game
>It wasn't expect for you to get everything. You look at it the wrong way. They only wanted you to find what you could to make your experience different from others.
>and it's a damn good track. If you look at how the maps are programmed they wouldn't even be able to make another if they tried. Don't call it laziness call it limitations.

>>3964892
Kids can beat it better than you at your age. How do you feel?

>>3965346
>A painting with no depth will never be surpassed
The only thing it has going is its historical value

Honestly, I played it a lot as a kid, but looking back at it now: The system of secrets is utter bullshit and if I had any critical taste as a kid I'd get bored of this game very fast. Running around bombing/flame-ing/pushing every single object is not fun at all.

1) Valid complaint
2a) They were perfectly fine for the time.
2b) I could see either side on this one. Your side is valid in that it's annoy, but others may like discovering true secrets that aren't shouted at your via a glaring color or graphical difference
3) One is all you need, baby!

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-03-21-koji-igarashi-says-castlevania-sotn-was-inspired-by-zelda-not-metroid

>>3966145
It's historically significant because it was innovative. You don't need to be good to be historically significant. There was nothing like the first zelda when it came out. Here's another example. Pokemon red/blue were the most awful, dogshit games, just broken, yet they launched the franchise.

>>3966342
Alright, the secrets would be ok if you didn't need them to progress, but you do. You need to feed a ham to feed this goblin in a dungeon, and you need to know where the thing is. Also to whistle at the fucking pond for the seventh dungeon, lol. But then they'll complain about Simon's quest with the fucking tornado. You needed nintendo power for both, guys

>>3966619
Wow, historically significant game being inspirational to others, never woulda guessed (except when I said it multiple times in this fucking thread), wow you sure got me

what's with all the "woooows"? did DSP make this thread?
sounds like something he would complain about

>>3966789
Who's DSP?

>>3966339
I agree. It'd be fine if you weren't forced to find stupid shit

>>3965721
> Put cracks or some telltale signs of bombable structures outside, in dungeons, make striking walls with the sword sound different if it's bombable.
>make burnable trees slightly different

Making a different sound with the sword would be ok but the visual cues are a terrible idea as it negates even having secrets. I don't know why people pretend those little clues in any game are actually hiding anything. If you're going to do that you might as well just put the item out in the open.

Secret trees and bomb locations in the first Zelda are great because none of the secrets that aren't hinted at elsewhere are necessary to complete the game.

Those secrets were put in the game so that those who were willing to go through the trouble of searching would be rewarded. Also remember this was in an age before the internet where you couldn't just freely get every secret in a matter of seconds day one of the game's release. You would have either had to cough up money for a guide book assuming your parents were willing or wait until you could discuss the game in person with your friends at school. This made discovering something new a little bit more fun.

If all of Zelda's secrets were barriers to progressing through the game it would definitely be shit, but it isn't.

>>3964824
>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).
I have never once spawned into an enemy. I'm pretty sure the game has safeguards against it
>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders.
I disagree, the artstyle and sprite design is tight and serves it's purpose.
>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.
>Hating secrets
>3) One overworld soundtrack
A shit ton of modern open world games don't even have an overworld soundtrack.

As someone who grew up with Wind Waker I personally feel TLoZ is a timeless masterpiece that few games have managed to come close to.
>Simple but satisfying combat that has actual weight and responsiveness to it.
>Game isn't too hard but there is actual punishment for messing up
>Overworld exploration hasn't really been done better by any other game I've played. It manages to give the player a great deal of freedom while also providing a well crafted and structured world.
>Fucking fantastic secrets.

>>3966969
I look at it as like a puzzle. All the pieces need to be there before I try to solve it, otherwise I'm not gonna bother with the puzzle. They give me the solution, "find thr ham to feed the retarded goblin", but nothing else to get me there. Fuck you, I'm not gonna waste hours on this boring game looking for the breakable wall or bush. It's not challenging, engaging, nor does it make you feel good for having found it. It's just busywork.

>>3964824
Sure, I'll bite.
>>3965464
Pretty much sums it up, but I'll add a bit.
>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).
Nigga, have you even actually played the game?
>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders.
Have you played either of those games? Really. LoZ looks nothing like Space Invaders, again see: >>3965464
>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.
You actually don't have to do this. In the First Quest, there's all of one bush that you have to burn (entrance to 8) and they make it pretty fucking obvious and one overworld place to bomb (Spectacle Rock) and again it is pretty fucking obvious. Everywhere else is just a secret to find. Now in dungeons, you again don't have to bomb every wall. Every dungeon has a map and you can (and we did) make your own as you play. That's part of the experience. And when there were hidden rooms in dungeons, again they were usually pretty obvious. The game wasn't just to run through it as fast as you could, or even as optimally as you could. Exploration and discovery was a huge part of the game.
>3) One overworld soundtrack
Okay, sure, but again look back to what was available at the time. A lot of games didn't even have soundtracks, just noises, blips and beeps and bloops. And even as far as soundtracks go, it is actually a pretty good one. And you still have the different track for the dungeons and even a separate one for the final dungeon to let you know that shit just got real.

>>3967227
you literally took the bait, he's trolling you dude

>>3967264
Hence why I start with "Sure, I'll bite."

>>3967227
I'm not gonna make my own map. No one should expect that from the player.
>They make it pretty fucking obvious
Then why fucking hide it in the first fucking place? Face it, it's a boring game. I'll stick to Mario 3, Castlevania and Link to the Past, thanks very much.

>>3967227
You have no argument for the music. It's laziness on the devs' part. I keep saying it, Castlevania had a theme per level. No fucking excuse here. You're telling me they couldn't even make 8 original tracks to at least put in the dungeons? Give me a break, man

>>3967325
>Then why fucking hide it in the first fucking place?
It is less hidden and more of a barrier to entrance. You cannot just wander around straight out of starting the game and stumble into Dungeon 8 to get your shit pack in without first getting at least a candle. Yeah, the bush you have to burn is pretty obvious, and once you do and go in, you realize, "Oh, shit! This is Dungeon 8, maybe I shouldn't be here yet?" You are of course welcome to try, but you probably won't get very far. But it was more to contradict the point OP made that you have to burn every bush, bomb every wall, etc.

>>3967342
Hey cool map' I'd just google it though

>>3967018
>Combat with weight
That's not true. It has no weight to it whatsoever
>Overworld exploration hasn't really been done better by any other game I've played
Guess you haven't played Breath of the Wild. None of the items have a magic bar, they are tools to progress and explore however you see fit
>Fucking fantastic secrets
Yeah, if you think blowing up a wall to find an old man inside, or a goblin that gives you rupees are fantastic secrets. The only worthwhile secrets are heart containers and the sword upgrades.

>>3967454
>Breath of the Wild
I'm not a fan of Zelda 1 myself, but another Zelda 1 (sort of) with much more unnecessary bloat? No thanks.

>>3967227
It is out of space invaders. First time I saw an octorok, I didn't know what the fuck it was. "What are the developers trying to get at here?" That's what I thought. Then I thought, "they look like space invaders, lol", that's where that came from. The first thought I had about the game is how bad the graphics looked. Castlevania, not Zelda, should've been my first foray into the NES.

>>3967489
Breath of the Wild is the best Zelda. It took the stupid boring shit out of Zelda 1 while understanding what made the first impactful. It is the game Zelda 1 was always trying to be.

OP is going to be one of those people who gets so mad that he starts crying in the middle of a heated argument when the game he worshiped as a kid gets mocked by some little shit 30 years from now because you didn't have to inject it into your spine's nanite relays.

>>3967542
What the fuck are you talking about? That's what all the old fucks in this thread are doing, not me

>botw released in 2017

>1st zelda released in 1986

>gamers mad about being trolled in 2017

>gamers having fun in 1986

which is it

>>3967548
You are a big fool.

>>3967547
It's ok if you don't like Zelda. I don't particularly care for fighting games like Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter. That doesn't make them bad games.

i thought we agreed yesterday morrowind and oblivion is better... give it up guys

>>3967552
Hey, you're a nice guy :)

>>3967558
Symphony of the Night is better than those games.

>>3967593
Castlevania 3 is better than SOTN

>>3967656
Better than 1, not SotN, sorry

>Another "you shouldn't like this game because I say so" thread

Why do you even bother

>>3968028
I actually think SOTN is one of the worst "metroidvania" castlevanias

>>3968117
A bit of critical thinking is always welcome

>>3964824
it's the best in the series

>>3966148
>>3966969
Alright, rather than cracks, how about an item you can find that puts a small light on the HUD, when you enter a screen with something that can be bombed or burned, it lights up. The item itself would require you to go poking around to begin with.

>>3968028
but I like challenge in my games, that makes SOTN shit

>>3968304
It's just fun for me. It's cool and has swell characters. Also the artstyle is fantastic and the music is badass.

>>3964824
>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.

this is your only valid complaint (pic related; if the center bush held the secret, it would be more obvious, without being too obvious). but finding every secret is not necessary to beat the game, and the ones you have to find are all fairly obvious (and hinted at by npcs).

one cool thing about secrets being hard to find was that if you had friends playing the game, you could share secrets that the others had not discovered, unlike later zelda games, where all bombable walls were clearly marked by cracks, etc.

>>3965143
>James totally blew your game out of the water years ago and you still can't handle it.

his review was shit. egoraptor did a better job, but his wasn't great either. castlevania 2 is certainly a flawed game, but nowhere near as bad as many of these critics make it out to be.

>>3966128
>Metroid 1 you constantly get frustrated over how long it takes to get anywhere and you can only shoot in 4 directions, up down left right. This sucks because its difficult to kill shit this way, especially after playing sequels in the series.

sounds like you're the one that sucks. metroid is a fairly easy game. it does take some time to explore everything, but that was a good thing. i can understand that kids today don't have the patience for it, but back then, when you got a new game, you wanted it to last.

the original metroid is still my favourite, because it has such a wonderful mood, that i think later games failed to recreate. to me, at the time, playing metroid really felt like exploring a strange, alien planet.

>>3966829
Imagine, literally, the worst Let's Player ever.

This is not hyperbole. He is quite possibly, objectively the single worst one of all time.

>>3968226
Maybe so, yes, but I don't see much in the OP.

>>3969086
>This is your only valid complaint
I think the music (or lack thereof) is also a problem, no?

>>3964824
>Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).

Literally untrue. OP did you even play the game?

>>3969180

meh. it's an absolutely classic track, and the lack of variety it never bothered me. the overworld is fairly small and seamless, so sudden changes in music, as you go from one area to another, would probably just be jarring.

>>3969208
For me, it makes for a boring experience

>>3969192
I admit some hyperbole on my part

>>3969442
If you're going to lie about retro games, maybe do it on /v/ where people don't know the source material better than you do.

>>3967497
Then go play Castlevania. LoZ obviously isn't for you. See: >>3967552
>It's ok if you don't like Zelda. I don't particularly care for fighting games like Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter. That doesn't make them bad games.

>>3964824
I don't like the first Zelda game at all, and I grew up with that generation of games. Link to the Past is way better. But your list of complaints is pretty shit.

The problem with the game is that it's completely inscrutable and directionless, and the only thing you said that even comes close to that complaint is one half of one part of your list. The rest of your complaints are dumb as hell.

>>3967497
See, this right here is how I know you are full of shit. It is called read the fucking manual. One thing we always did before sliding those carts into our NES was to crack open the manual to get an idea of how the controls worked, get some background on the game, info on enemies, etc. And I don't care if you emulate or got the cart second hand, one very awesome thing about the internet is that almost all game manuals are available. So before you complain about the shit graphics or you have no fucking clue what an Octorok looks like, crack open the game manual.

>>3969931
Manuals should be supplementary, not required to make headway in the fucking game. Link to the Past didn't need one, and that's why it's actually a good game.

>>3969931
Well then we're different, because I never read manuals. You shouldn't have to.

>>3969959
Agreed 100%. That's why I don't read em.

>>3969959
>>3969965
So, wait, you complain about not know what something is in the game, and then refuse to read the fucking manual? Sure, reading the manual isn't mandatory, but then don't complain about not knowing what enemies are because you didn't read it and think the game has shit graphics for it.

>>3969931
>Need to see drawings of the enemies because they look too shitty in-game
That's not a positive thing. I didnt need to check the manual in Castlevania, nor mario 3, nor even zelda 2 to see what the enemies look like. That just proves the visuals aren't up to snuff.

>>3969979
He's not wrong, a good game doesn't need a manual (or tutorials for that matter) to teach you the game. Looking up information outside of the game is a failure of game design.

>>3965673
>>3965678
I don't wanna alarm you, but you might want to see a doctor.

>>3969979
I'm not that dude. My problem is not necessarily the enemies (though the level 2 boss was lol), but progression in general being too inscrutable. There are too many places that require bombing or burning some unmarked random place on the map in order to progress. Later Zelda games do a much better job at signposting what you're supposed to pay attention to.

>a good game doesn't need a manual

>>3970134
I don't know what that is

>>3970253
It's written in the filename

>>3964824
ExandShadow is that you?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vz6LX4mAXS0

Hi I'm one of the more fun items in this game, sorry you had to deal with my retarded slacker little brother for such a long time. Let's go burn shit.

>>3970703
Holy shit a talking candle

>>3970258
Oh I see. I still don't know what it is

>>3970707
Wait I'm a dumbo, for some reason it didn't click that "Ohare" is a flying sim :( I think I need to sleep

>>3970703
i like the cut of your wick

>>3970706

>>3965143
>Likes zelda
>Doesn't like Simon's quest even though it adds zelda esque elements
You large gay.

>>3970778
Not that guy, but I'm not overly fond of Simon's Quest either, at least not most of it, the false blocks and the invisible timer are bullshit, on the flipside I really like the subweapons in Simon's Quest, and I also like how certain subweapons don't consume ammo, like the holy water and the first dagger you get. Whip upgrades are pretty dope too, being able to carry a shield is also cool as hell.
But at the end of the day the bullshit the game makes you go through is too much for me.

>>3970828
Well damn, dude.

>>3970874
I'd actually love to see another game with that roaming style of gameplay in Simon's Quest, most of the newer castlevania games stay in the main castle but Simon's Quest had you wandering all over the damn place and going to different mansions to get shit done.
If someone took that formula and refined it a little, and made each mansion unique, you could have a rad as fuck game.

>>3970890
Order of Ecclesia? Many areas in that game, not just the castle. Though the thing is that they aren't cohesively connected to one another, you have to go to the map and select them to go there. Still, gives some variety.

>>3964824
>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything. (You could kill every enemy on every screen, but that slows the game down to a halt).
Not true

>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders.
It's not the finest the NES has to offer, but it's clear what every sprite is supposed to be.

>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.
You only need to burn every bush/bomb every wall if you want to find all the secrets. Otherwise you don't need to bomb/burn aimlessly. If I remember correctly, the only bush that needs burning to complete the game is the dungeon 8 entrance (where it is placed in a not-so-subtle location). And the only wall you need to bomb in the overworld is Spectacle Rock. All the walls you need to bomb inside dungeons are always in the center of the wall and you can usually tell because the dungeon map hints that there is a secret room. Plus I'm fairly certain that NPCs drop hints for all of these in the game, even if they are somewhat cryptic.

>3) One overworld soundtrack
And it's still one of the most memorable and classic tunes in video game history.

The first Zelda is a game that is still very enjoyable to this day. There are many NES games that sometimes feel cheap or have features that feel outdated, but Zelda isn't affected by these things.

>>3971456
>Classic tune
Got old fast for me

>>3964824
Wow op, you made all these autists have a tantrum, good job.

The game is flawed and is known to be a nintendo power game where beating it without a guide while doable, isnt fun at all.

/vr/ has gone to complete shit though, not one of these fucks can actually discuss a game anymore without throwing insults, calling people out on there age, which is actually the more childish thing to be doing. Instead of trying to counter an argument and trying prove OP wrong, you just have a tantrum. Well good job guys, /vr/ is now officially as shit as /v/.

>>3971554
I didn't expect to have as big a thread as this ended up being when I posted here, holy shit.

>>3971779
As well, I think the reason they call out age is that more than a few people here are young themselves. It's like the "I was born in the wrong generation" with music

>>3970134
Flight Sims as a genre are on life support for the precise accessibility problems we've been talking about in this thread.

>>3970134
Sims aren't games, people don't enjoy them for their game-like qualities if they have any at all.

>>3964938
What does it feel like to actually be retarded?

>>3964975
>yet it's still a bad game
Remember when anon had an opinion and wasted an entire afternoon shipping about it and convinced literally no one that he was right? Good shit.

>>3965492
Hurr I climbed a mountain in skyrim and found a box of [insert generic loot] and it was so cool guys. Every game should be easy, secrets aren't allowed unless they aren't secrets.

>>3965541
>I've probably played it beyond 200% completion twice and never died.
>probably
Oh, so you're lying.

>>3965764
Your arguments are shit tier and your game choice wasn't even a great one. Shoot yourself.

>>3964824
Zelda 1 was the prototype. Zelda 2 was a (mostly failed) experiment, and only Zelda 3 was the blueprint for the rest of the series.

>>3964824
The visuals are fine

The objects look the same because otherwise there would be no adventure in actually finding things. Looking at stuff like Zelda on NES makes me think that there really aren't any adventure games now, unless you consider following a waypoint an adventure. Kids now will never know the feel when you and your friend finally find how to progress in a game that nobody at school knew how to beat unless they bought nintendo power. I'll take the lack of direction and unfair obtuseness over hand holding and explaining any day, it's much more satisfying once you figure it out.

>>3972559

that's when the series started going downhill, with every subsequent game being the same formulaic crap, with excessive handholding, and little room for exploration. i haven't played botw, but it looks the most interesting zelda game in forever, and it was all about taking the series back to the roots.

>>3972439
You tell me, you'd know

>>3972558
"Woooooooooow, I'm a dickhead with no arguments! Your game choice sucks! Kill yourself!"
Yeah, I'm not gonna listen to a piece of shit like you.

>>3972536
I don't even like skyrim. That was a joke, and you fell for the ruse. I compared it to Zelda to make people like you mad. Cool it, hothead.

>>3972495
I made some people mad, and got a laugh out of it, that's all.

>>3969086

>his review was shit

Explain.

James literally goes down a checklist and none of those points can be properly countered. If they were you'd already have done so, but you lazily just said "his review was shit".

Castlevania 2 sucks ass anon. It was a huge disappointment growing up. My friends and I hated it to the point where we stopped caring about Castlevania till SCIV. The game just blows dick.

Anyway, now as far as OP is concerned:

Zelda I is a flawed but good game and deserves its place in the Hall of Fame. We all talked about the game and shared secrets with each other and I wouldn't trade that experience for anything else in the world. Was glorious.

No one says Zelda I is the best. OP is a faget. I'm just thankful so many of you called out OP on his bullshit.

>>3972816
>Likes Zelda, doesn't like SQ which adds zelda-like elements to Castlevania 1
You silly goose!

>>3973068
>>Likes Zelda, doesn't like SQ which adds zelda-like elements to Castlevania 1

>Like mystery, doesn't like Mario is Missing which adds mystery-like elements to Mario
>Likes poont-and-clicks, doesn't like the Zelda CD-i games which add point-and-click-like elements to Zelda
>Likes cake, doesn't like hurgin which adds cake-like elements to sandwich

You fucking retard!

>>3973115
But those examples are all also correct too

>>3973197
>also correct too
fuck my stupid life

>doesnt play zelda game (the one were talking about in the thread)

>talkes about it

>>3973206
but I did play the zelda game, that's why we're having a thread about it!

>>3972605
>with every subsequent game being the same formulaic crap, with excessive handholding, and little room for exploration
Not as bad as you explained it really, but okay. Anyways, they all compromise with mostly great dungeon design (maybe except for MM and to a lesser extent WW...) so I'm game!

>i haven't played botw, but it looks the most interesting zelda game in forever
I hope you like some of the shittiest dungeon design/bosses the series has seen in a long time, egregious and unnecessary voice acting, dressing Link up with various types of garish clothing and swords as if he was in a Princess Maker game, and most of your other items, maps & whatnot being relegated to A FUCKING SMARTPHONE

>>3973197
I'm not even upset, you have to live your shit taste.

>>3971554
There is nothing to discuss anymore around here (we could have a lot of discussions about crpgs, but this is japanese only territory).

I hope they allow to discuss next gen.

>>3973308
>Dressing him in various garish outfits
or a cool armor, Idk
>Bad bosses
as if they were better in the first, gimme a break

>>3973318
My taste is that of the patrician, yours, that of the peasant.

>>3972816
>James literally goes down a checklist and none of those points can be properly countered.

>point 1: day/night cycles

egoraptor addressed this in his video, and i agree with him. this is one of the cool things about simon's quest. yeah, the transition could have been faster. big deal.

>point 2: you die when you fall in water, you should be able to swim

this is just retarded. it's just a obstacle you have to clear. would the game somehow be better if there were spikes down there?

>point 3: items are too expensive, you have to grind

the only time grinding is really "required" is right at the start of the game, because you want both the white crystal and the holy water before you go anywhere. yeah, it's annoying to lose all your hearts when you die, so... git gud. it's no different from losing stuff when you die in dark souls or whatever. you can grind to get it back, or you can just move on with the game, and buy the weapon upgrades and stuff later. they are not required to progress in the game.

>point 4: you fall through certain blocks

this problem is way overblown. there are like five places in the entire game where you can fall through the floors, and only one where you lose significant progress when it happens: in the first mansion, right before the end, you can fall through a floor, and have to go through the whole mansion again to get back there. oh well, now you know. annoying, but not a huge problem.

>point 5: there are no bosses

sure, some more bosses would be cool.

>point 6: how are you supposed to know about the oak steak?

rtfm.

>point 7: some thing are too cryptic

there are hints in the game. they can be poorly translated, but i didn't have too much trouble figuring things out as a kid.

>point 9: entering passwords is tedious

yeah, ok.

>point 10: dracula's castle is anticlimactic

meh, i like it. he's right that dracula can be too easy if you cheese him.

>>3973392

somehow i deleted point 8, but i was out of space anyway. it was about him accidentally running into the hints, and canceling out the text popup before he could read it. i don't know how that's even possible, since they're mostly placed at dead ends in the mansions. why is he running against walls, mashing buttons on the controller like a spaz? like with most of his complaints though, he sort of has a point here. like i said earlier, simon's quest is certainly a flawed game. my main problem with his review is that he's just picking nits, and blowing every small problem way out of proportion. but that's his schtick, i guess.

>>3973409
>he's just picking nits
Kinda like what you're doing right now dipshit? Shoot yourself.

>>3973410

no, i'm countering his points, like i was asked to, you salty bitch.

>>3973392

>egoraptor addressed this in his video, and i agree with him. this is one of the cool things

Literally no one wants to wait for that shit. We hated that in the 80's and I hate it now.

>this is just retarded. it's just a obstacle you have to clear. would the game somehow be better if there were spikes down there?

Yeah it would have been better if there were spikes. It's like how its really stupid that Mega Man can't survive spikes so just make it spikes. Simon should be able to swim and you know it man. Ok argument I admit but you have to concede it makes no sense for Simon to not swim.

>the only time grinding is really "required" is right at the start of the game
>so..git gud
>its no differing from losing souls in Dark Souls

Yes it is. You can't get all the "souls" you lost back. Are you listening to yourself? Fucking god I can't believe you actually tried to say there is no difference. You're a loon man. You're desperately trying to defend this piece of shit game. None of it is fun. None of it. Castlevania I III and IV and Vampire and Rondo all of them are better than this fucking trash game partly because they don't do this shit to the player.

>this problem is way overblown.

No its not. It's retarded when it happens to you because now you're paranoid about it. Now you're just spamming holy water to make sure you don't fall. When it happens in Mega Man its usually just ONE screen and then you move on with the level.

>every other point you make

Bad and im reaching the comment limit. Dracula in II is a shit fight and looks like his servant death and the castle is empty and boring. The fact that you like it is a testament to your awful taste.

James tore this game apart much the same way my buds and I did back in the day. It's time you accept that you like a bad game. I like some bad games too but Castlevania II is not one of them. It's flat out a turd sandwich.

>>3973413

Countering?

You didn't counter shit dude. Every last point you made comes off as a poorly made excuse except for point 2.

>>3964824
>1) Enemies spawn from the edges of the screen, thus you get hit while moving screens, without being able to do anything.
Depends on the screen... sounds like you only played a few screens on the overworld. Normally you can't get hit moving screens. You're actually invincible until you move off the edge of the screen.

>2a) Shit visuals, straight out of space invaders.
The visuals are evocative. You have to use your imagination.

>2b) Every object, destructible or not, looks the same, so on your first time through, you have to place a bomb on every wall, and shoot fire on every bush.
This is how secrets should be. You get real satisfaction from finding one, You actually have to invest in bombs if you want to try bombing a bunch of walls. You need to wait until you get the red candle later in the game before trying to burn every bush. Secrets are too obvious nowadays.

>3) One overworld soundtrack
The greatest of all time soundtrack.

>>3973534
>Literally no one wants to wait for that shit. We hated that in the 80's and I hate it now.

who's "we"? i've never heard anyone complain about it before avgn. it's a non-issue.

>Yeah it would have been better if there were spikes. It's like how its really stupid that Mega Man can't survive spikes so just make it spikes. Simon should be able to swim and you know it man. Ok argument I admit but you have to concede it makes no sense for Simon to not swim.

this is a stupid and pointless argument for a couple of reasons. for one thing, simon is fully clothed and wearing armour, so no it wouldn't make sense for him to be able to swim. more importantly, it's a fucking game. fall in water and you die. those are the rules of the game. deal with it.

>Yes it is. You can't get all the "souls" you lost back. Are you listening to yourself? Fucking god I can't believe you actually tried to say there is no difference. You're a loon man.

yeah, i'm the one freaking out and acting like a loon here. anyway, i said losing your stuff, not dropping it. you do realize the souls and humanity you drop upon death are gone permanently if you die again before recovering them, right?

>No its not. It's retarded when it happens to you because now you're paranoid about it.

maybe you were. i wasn't. and i never had any significant problems because of it, except the one i mentioned.

>every other point you make
>Bad

convincing.

>Dracula in II is a shit fight and looks like his servant death and the castle is empty and boring. The fact that you like it is a testament to your awful taste.

i didn't say i like that fight, i said i like the castle. the new graphics and music, and the fact that there are no enemies, sets it apart from the other mansions, and gives a nice sense of foreboding. you know something big is coming up. the fight itself is disappointing, i admit.

>>3973565
>James tore this game apart much the same way my buds and I did back in the day. It's time you accept that you like a bad game. I like some bad games too but Castlevania II is not one of them. It's flat out a turd sandwich.

the only people i knew who weren't into it, were people who couldn't figure out how to get anywhere. once i gave them some hints, the all came to appreciate the game. i do admit that nostalgia is part of the reason i like it as much as i do, and i've already said it's a flawed game. but you (and james) are exaggerating how bad it is, and james has even admitted this.

>>3973565

>who's "we"? i've never heard anyone complain about it before avgn. it's a non-issue.

Im sorry that you've never had friends anon. It isn't a non-issue. It sucks and happens too often. There is no point to it. Maybe it would be ok if it happened once after the game was turned on and stopped after that but it happens every single time.

>deal with it

Simon can jump and fight harder and faster than any normal human and you want to say he shouldn't be able to swim. Whatever dude. You're a loon.

>you do realize the souls and humanity you drop upon death are gone permanently if you die again before recovering them, right?

You said that there was "no difference". This is a clear difference. You're being a retard.

>maybe you were. i wasn't. and i never had any significant problems because of it, except the one i mentioned

This is a meaningless point and you know it. "Well anon, I DIDN'T HAVE PROBLEMS WITH IT!". Meanwhile the rest of the gaming world is fully aware that Castlevania 2 is a shit game. Grats dude.

>I said I like the castle

There is NOTHING to the castle. Your opinions are awful.

>>3973572

>and james has even admitted this

I'm aware. The game is still a bad game. It's okay to like bad games, but you're practically acting like its not the worst in the series when it clearly is.

>>3973573
>Im sorry that you've never had friends anon.

no, just wanting you to clarify who exactly you're speaking for, because you seem to think it's everyone.

>Simon can jump and fight harder and faster than any normal human and you want to say he shouldn't be able to swim. Whatever dude. You're a loon.

maybe you should complain about those other things being unrealistic instead then. or maybe you should realize it's just a video game, you fucking loon.

>You said that there was "no difference". This is a clear difference. You're being a retard.

nope. losing your stuff is losing your stuff. it's gonna be annoying, whether the game gave you a chance to recover it or not.

>This is a meaningless point and you know it. "Well anon, I DIDN'T HAVE PROBLEMS WITH IT!". Meanwhile the rest of the gaming world is fully aware that Castlevania 2 is a shit game. Grats dude.

there you go, speaking for everyone again. i very much doubt the entire gaming world went around throwing holy water at every floor tile in every mansion, because they were paranoid about falling though, despite the fact that 99% of floor tiles are solid. doing that would be much more time consuming than getting back to where you were if you fall down, so if you actually did this, you're an idiot.

>There is NOTHING to the castle. Your opinions are awful.

hey, at least i can explain my "awful" opinions. your post are mostly "hurr durr i'm right and everyone agrees with me".

>>3973580
>The game is still a bad game.

i think it's alright.

>It's okay to like bad games, but you're practically acting like its not the worst in the series when it clearly is.

no, i'm not. i admitted it's flawed. i admitted a part of the reason i like it so much is nostalgia. i just think the avgn review was weak. for some reason, you're freaking out over this. and then you call me a loon, lol.

>>3973604
The holy water on tile bullshit can be fixed if they made them different from the other tiles. Not even fully, maybe like a little broken corner to distinguish them. It would be such a good game if they only fixed little bullshit like that, and also not having the stupid cryptic secrets like where you kneel in front of the water. Really a shame.

>>3964827
Yeah I hate it when someone has a different opinion and expresses it rather than saying the same thing that's been said a million times over for the last 30 years.

>>3974183
>The holy water on tile bullshit can be fixed if they made them different from the other tiles. Not even fully, maybe like a little broken corner to distinguish them.

that would make sense if there were tons of them everywhere, but there aren't, so i'd rather just forget about it, instead of constantly worrying. it think it was mostly done to drag out certain areas of the game, and yeah, it's kinda cheap, but like i said, it's thankfully rare.

>It would be such a good game if they only fixed little bullshit like that, and also not having the stupid cryptic secrets like where you kneel in front of the water.

the clue telling you to kneel in front of the lake is one of the most clearly worded and obvious one, so it should be obvious what you need to do. if you can find the clue, that is. the real fuckup here is that an npc tells you to look for it in veros woods, when it's actually in aljiba woods. the japanese version has the same error, so the problem isn't the translation (for once).

>>3974216
I see. Well, I think the things that "drag out" certain areas shouldn't be there. The game could do with being a little quicker, so as to not bore the player.

>>3964824
1) Killing every enemy is usually unnecessary but surely killing a few per screen is not too much for you?
2a) You are free to dislike the visuals, I think they are serviceable
2b) The mandatory secrets are not too difficult to come across. Additionally, the secrets being unmarked gives people reason to talk together about the game.
3) Fair enough, it could stand to have tracks based on the area you are in.

With all that said, even if I didn't have a counter to those three points what you said alone does not make the game outright bad. There is plenty to like about Zelda 1 such as its use of exploration, its addition of a second quest, and its non-linearity.

>>3974195
Right
>This is the only way you can think about things! Period! Don't try to think for yourself, just agree with us!
I thought /vr/ would be a little more mature, but 4chan is 4chan, no matter what board you're on

>>3974360
Eh, the game is boring for me, maybe I really don't get it.

>>3973565
>yeah, i'm the one freaking out and acting like a loon here. anyway, i said losing your stuff, not dropping it. you do realize the souls and humanity you drop upon death are gone permanently if you die again before recovering them, right?
Then just don't die again

300 posts later and you fools havent realised its is a bait thread

>>3974591
Yikes...

>>3965680
>2017
No, it's always been a thing. It just got really, irreversibly bad around 2007 with the Fox News invasion.

>>3974523

right. and if you don't want to lose your hearts in simon's quest, then just don't die.

>>3964824
1) The enemies are extra dimensional lovecraftian facsimiles of Julian monsters attempting to reconstruct Hyrules gene pool
1a) Mercy run
2a) It's a Sheikah wifi-scrying crystal set to low res meme mode
2b)Hero needs glasses or contacts
3)He's humming his favorite tune to fight immersion madness

>>3974935
>Golden Freeza
>Dragon Ball Z

>trhreads on /vr/

>>3964824
1) That's not a flaw
2a) Subjective opinion
2b) That's not a flaw
3) That's not a flaw
>boring game
Subjective opinion

>>3973617

The game is bad. You're bad. Your opinions are bad.

>>3973604

>hey at least I can explain my awful opinion

Very very poorly. There is a very clear difference between Dark Souls item recovery and the way you lose your shit in SQ

Simon's Quest is a terrible game anon. There is no getting around it. It's one of the most disappointing sequels of all time.

>>3976075
>The game is bad. You're bad. Your opinions are bad.

cool opinion, bro.

>There is a very clear difference between Dark Souls item recovery and the way you lose your shit in SQ

i already said i'm talking about losing your stuff in dark souls (permanently). in both cases, it means losing progress. explain the difference.

>Simon's Quest is a terrible game anon. There is no getting around it. It's one of the most disappointing sequels of all time.

it got good reviews on release; from personal experience, i can tell you that most people i knew at the time enjoyed it; even james has said the the game isn't actually that bad; and nobody in this thread is putting forth a particularly good argument for why it is.

>>3976096

Yeah they did. You just cant accept their take on it. Not our fault you enjoy shit games.

>>3976103

i've explained why i think they're wrong. you're contributing nothing.

>>3976108

You mean like how you failed to explain what makes SQs Dracula castle good?

Right. Dude your explanations are weak. Opinions may be like assholes but i just dont see what you see in the game. Its one of the worst sequels i have ever played.

>>3976128

i did explain what i like about dracula's castle.

>Opinions may be like assholes but i just dont see what you see in the game.

cool. i'm not here to convince anyone to like the game.

>>3976143

Yeaah you like that its empty and claim it helps give it a sense of foreboding when every other castlevania does it better while having shit to do in the castle.

I dont respect that opinion.

>>3976151

what the hell were you expecting, all of castlevania 1 to be stuffed into the very last part of castlevania 2? simon's quest wasn't about exploring dracula's castle.

>I dont respect that opinion.

i'll go cry myself to sleep.

>>3976161

I was expecting there to be shit to do in the castle. I have no idea why you think this is unreasonable anon. It is completely understandable.

Sure the game is still better than 90% of the NES library but I expect more from Castlevania. Get some standards my man.

>>3976184
>I was expecting there to be shit to do in the castle. I have no idea why you think this is unreasonable anon.

i don't. i think it's silly to compare it to other games in the series, when they were focused on exploring dracula's castle, and simon's quest was focused on exploring the transylvanian countryside. you wanted something there, i'm fine with it the way it is.

>>3976195

You constantly make excuses. Last part of the game was lazy af and you know it.

>>3976225

how is that a fucking excuse? you're basically claiming that the game was lazy because it ended with a boss fight, instead of another mansion and then a boss fight. this is a fucking stupid argument, because it doesn't take into account the amount of content in the rest of the game. if the game had another mansion somewhere else in the game, but kept the ending as it, would it still be lazy?

>>3976252

The context of the game doesnt matter. Give players something to do in the last stretch or youre just being lazy. Its quite simple man.

You come off as a retarded SQ fanboy. Ive never seen someone defend this game so vehemently.

>>3964824
You forgot that it was premium number Nintendo Hotline bait as well

>>3976256
>The context of the game doesnt matter.

of course it matters. how is putting an additional mansion somewhere else in the game still lazy, but putting an additional mansion at the very end not lazy. what's so special about this "last stretch"? you're basically saying the no matter how big the rest of the game is, and how many mansions there are to explore, dracula just needs to be in a mansions with enemies and shit. why?

>You come off as a retarded SQ fanboy. Ive never seen someone defend this game so vehemently.

i've said multiple times that it's a flawed game, and that my enjoyment of it is largely down to nostalgia. i just can't stand shitty arguments.

>>3976252
There was zero threat in Castlevania other than Dracula himself. It was just a long walk

>>3976294

yes. you walk through the ruins of dracula's castle, which was destroyed at the end of the first game, towards the final showdown. why would there need to be anything else?

>>3976278

>i just cant stand shitty arguments

Then how are you tolerating your own? Your last few posts in particular make you come off as a dumbass.

Youve said its a flawed game but anytime someone points out blatant and overdiscussed issues you ignore them. What are its flaws to you?

>>3976315
>Then how are you tolerating your own? Your last few posts in particular make you come off as a dumbass.

not an argument.

>>3976309

Grats. This is an apologists post right here. Its a boring ending to a less than mediocre game.

>>3976321

It is. Youre focusing on context like it helps make the game not shit. Your arguments are awful.

You wont even describe your perceived flaws with the game either

>>3976326

also not an argument. why can't you guys answer the simplest questions?

>>3976330


I did answer you.

BECAUSE IT IS BORING. That is why it shouldnt be empty. Youre a fucking idiot hypocrite. Youre not even answering questions but are deflecting to others peeceivably not perceivably not answering yours.

Eat shit SQ fanboy

>>3976309
It's established in-universe that Castlevania reappears in its entirety along with Dracula

Is this the part where we realize the SQ fanboy is baiting?

>>3976329
>You wont even describe your perceived flaws with the game either

it's just pretty underwhelming overall. the first game had interesting levels that all stood out and were memorable. simon's quest is all flat countryside and samey mansions.

>>3976334
you never answered >>3976278

>>3976335

when? before simon's quest.

>>3976348
>the only one making actually arguments
>baiting

>>3976376

that was supposed to be a question: "before simon's quest?"

>>3976368

I very clearly said it was a boring finish to a less than mediocre game.

Learn how to read. Learn how to assess a game better. Context is meaningless and sounds like an excuse to lazily put together the last stretch of the game. You care more about this argument than you do the game and that to me is priceless.

>>3976376

Your arguments have been destroyed dude. Theyre shit.

>>3976387

i can read just fine, and you haven't explained why the last stretch is special, and why it's lazy to not have anything there, regardless of how much content is in the rest of the game. why does dracula absolutely has to be in a castle with enemies? why is it somehow lazy not to have that at this particular point in the game?

>>3976393

oh yeah? well i say it's your arguments that have been destroyed! now what, smart guy?

>>3976361

Yeah and thats why its not even worth playing.

A game not worth playing is shit

>>3976405

Because its boring. What dont you get?

>>3976460
>Yeah and thats why its not even worth playing.

it makes up for it with by being an open world adventure. exploring the world, talking to npcs, finding secrets, collecting clues, and solving puzzles, was all very engrossing to me as a kid.

>Because its boring. What dont you get?

the laziness argument. if you're simply arguing that it's boring, i'd say that's a very minor complaint. it's a very short area.

>>3976480

It sucked as an open world adventure. To me, all of that shit wasnt Castlevania and wasnt fun at all.

And it is lazy btw. The rest of the games content doesnt make up for it like you keep insisting. You can eat shit for breakfast all you want man but stop acting like its redeemable to the majority of Castlevania fans. The game is a blight and even games like Lament of Innocence are more worth playing.

>>3976489
>And it is lazy btw.

so you keep insisting. what you fail to do is explain how. according to you, it seems that the developers could have made the biggest game ever, with endless areas to explore, but if there's a short empty arena before the final boss, they are lazy. because reasons.

>>3976498

Actually, ive been saying from the beginning that it should have had shit to do. Youre just the densest motherfucker i have ever seen on this board.

Hell it couldve been the same length but with a boss fight against death before Dracula and it wouldve been better.

Instead, there is nothing but Dracula and he mysteriously has the appearance of Death.

It couldve been ANYTHING other than what they gave us. That said its not even the worst thing about the game. Its the way the game is made. With 3 and 4 they returned to 1s style for a reason anon.

But really man grats to you. Youre the stupidest motherfucker I have ever seen post here.

>>3976512
>Actually, ive been saying from the beginning that it should have had shit to do.

no fucking shit, but why?!

if it was just that the area is boring, that would be fine. but's that's not a big deal, because it's very short. if your complaint was that the game was too short and should've had more content, that would be fine. but that's not your complaint. your complaint is that the game should have had additional content in this particular area, for reasons that you are unable to articulate.

>Youre the stupidest motherfucker I have ever seen post here.

likewise.

>>3976523

To help make the game better. More fun.

Just how autistic are you?

>>3976534
>To help make the game better. More fun.

by having another mansion to go through before fighting dracula?

>>3976548

Didnt have to be a whole mansion.

I already provided examples earlier bub. Instead of making Dracula Death we couldve fought Death before Drac. Hell, anything to make the last stretch not feel so lifeless and lazy.

Its clear to me you cant read or reason. We will never see eye ti eye and if i had this discussion in person with you I wouldve just laughed at you and left, which is a shame because we could probably find something we agree on eventually.

But you refuse to see SQ for what it is and address all my and others complaints as non issues. Again, the context of the game doesnt excuse that half assed segment. Case closed.

>>3976557
>lazy

you keep using that word...

>Its clear to me you cant read or reason

no u. you can't explain why an empty area is lazy. it was clearly done deliberately. it would cost them nothing to drop some enemies in there. they chose not to. you also can't explain why added content in that area would improve the game, but not added content in other areas. basically, you're making a huge deal out of a small empty room.

>Instead of making Dracula Death we couldve fought Death before Drac

you fight death earlier in the game.

>>3976572

Yeah and for some reason Dracula doesnt look like Dracula.

Every point you make with regard to how shitty that last segment is comes off as making excuses for the devs. The game fucking sucks. Fuck you.

>>3976604
>Dracula doesnt look like Dracula

most points people make against the game come off as nitpicking. which was my original complaint about the avgn video.

>Fuck you

love you too.

>>3975315
>No antacid tablets on hand and an overliteralist viewpoint today

>>3964824

>>3975731
Yes, 3 is a flaw. They didn't go to the effort to put in more music depending on the area, which other games at the time have done. It's lazy.

>>3976604
Well if you think about it, the last part of Dracula's castle in Castlevania 1 is a walk up empty steps, so as to create suspense. Perhaps they wanted to do the same thing in the second, but to make the whole of the castle suspenseful. Think about it like that. Also, since dracula has had his power weakened by being seperated into parts might mean that he doesn't have full control of the castle. In this way, it makes sense that fire glitches him, since Simon wants to ruin him upon his revival by burning him in the quickest way. The longer the fight lasts, the more chance dracula has of regaining his full power, removing Simon from the castle, reawakening the castle (and by that reviving every minion in the castle) and then reclaiming his control over Romania and terrorizing the populace.

>>3976613

>nitpicking

It's shit that drives me up the wall when I compare it to other castlevanias. The game is seriously weaker than the rest of them. I'd rather play Judgement.

>>3977023

Cool. Doesn't change the fact that all of that makes for an extremely boring last segment. It's the weakest entry. No contest. It gets shit on for a reason. Because its a meh game in a great classic series.

>>3977076
Aww, you're just a sourpuss

>>3977076
>Being this mad on a zelda bait thread
Come on, man have some self respect

>>3977392

Nah I just don't like bad Castlevania games. Sue me.

>>3977429

There was a time where this website was focused on baiting other places and not about cannibalizing itself. There is a reason I didn't discuss Zelda here and hopped into the SQ discussion.

Hell if you read through the whole thread, you'll see this entire off topic discussion started because that faggot got triggered over a bad opinion on SQ. Why he bothered replying I'll never know, it isn't like convincing one person is going to change the game's rep. Which is what really kills me, because the rep is forever damaged but he still defended it vehemently.

>>3964824
I know this is obviously bait, but would someone care to tell me how he's wrong about 2b?
I played through it for the first time recently and it seems like a genuine complaint.

>>3977475

Probably because the way the game is "supposed" to be played is by discussing and sharing secrets with friends who are also playing the game. Also Nintendo Power's Player's Guide. You know, gotta make that guide money and get those mag subs.

These days, that complaint is very valid but easily solved by asking for a tip or using a guide. It's already been said that the game is good and deserves its place in history, but the game has been surpassed by others in its series and genre.

If you actually give a shit about games, its worth playing for historical reasons alone though.

>>3977495
For sure. That's the impression I got, it wasn't such a big deal since, as you said, I'd check a guide, but it was still a blemish on an otherwise good experience.

Fuck Nintendo Power.

>>3977509

Yeah no kidding.

>>3977495
Secrets are just a gimmick, man

>>3970017
> a good game doesn't need a manual (or tutorials for that matter) to teach you the game.

Chess is a bad game because I can't just look at the board and pieces to figure it out.

>>3977475
Because none of the true secrets (ones that aren't hinted at by NPC's) are required to beat the game in the slightest. People pretending that burning every tree is required to solve some sort of "puzzle" of game progression are straight retarded or lying, period.

If you take the time to find those secrets you just get some cooler items or extra hearts. That's it. They're just a bonus for exploring.

You could release A Link to the Past as a completely new game today, and it would still feel amazing and modern.

You cant really say the same for Zelda 1.

The groundwork was necessary though, and it was amazing for its time.

Same goes for Metroid vs Super Metroid.

>>3979682
We're talking videogames, you're talking chess. How can we see eye to eye?

>>3979713

Zelda 1 actually feels like a mysterious game and you have to explore. ALttP only feels "modern" because modern gaming conventions are shitty and stale. ALttP just feels like going through the motions

And yes the same DOES go for metroid vs Super Metroid, the NES original feels alien and inhospitable, while Super Metroid feels especially tailored for you which really takes the immersion out of it

>>3980224
You know what's a mysterious game? Kong on gba. That game fucked me up as a kid.

>>3980224
i can't imagine being so jaded by advances in game design to actually believe the original metroid is more immersive than its SNES predecessor. that is some deep-seeded backwards-ass thinking.

>>3980238
not retro

>>3980240

You mean successor, anon.

Cheers. Get some rest!

so basically

>all threads are trolles... guys have you even looked that post was a tropl;;l come on./

>>3979532

And?

Simon's Quest was discussed in this thread and funny enough, it too was a game that you needed Nintendo Power for, or tips from friends.

Except it was far worse. I'm bringing it up because it just was how the era all too often treated its players.

>buy mag sub
>buy guides
>buy friends

Okay maybe not the last one, but either way you can get around this by not being a proud mother fucker and just using a guide or asking around to stimulate discussion on it. It's not a very big issue but of course this is 4chan and everything is a huge deal.

>>3980296
No trolls or ogres in this thread anon, only a bunch of people passionate about their games.

>>3980304
>just get a guide
No, I shouldn't have to. You didn't need a guide for donkey kong in arcade. You didn't need a guide for space invaders, or galaga. These games will be played over zelda 1 for centuries to come.

>>3980224
>Feels alien and inhospitable
Super metroid did it twice as good in my opinion. Much better atmosphere, and the set pieces really sell the inhospitable aspect.

>>3980304
I could use a guide, or I could play a game for which a guide is not needed. For example, the mario trilogy, or Castlevania 1 and 3. Those games have better design.

>>3980314

It's like you didn't get the point of my post or the last few before mine. No one is saying that its a plus, but if you want to play Zelda 1 without a guide or asking for tips(which I encourage because it stimulates discussion) its sort of your own fault when you get mad, and you seem upset going by your post.

Zelda 1 is still a fine game despite this.

>>3980704

What's so wrong with asking for a tip?

>Those games have better design

I agree with you. You seem to be under the impression I think Zelda 1 is Zelda or 8-bit perfection when in reality its just a fun yet cryptic game that kickstarted a great series. It's a product of its era.

This is 4chan and nitpicks are huge deals. It's nothing new to me, but you guys really should learn how to lighten up.

>>3981254
Im sorry man, it's just the impression I have from anons in this thread is that Zelda 1 is the end all be all of the nes.

>>3981508

I've been present in the thread off and on since the start, and don't really see where you're getting that.

It's a must-play NES game if you give a shit about the NES but be all end all? Eh. I don't really see anyone saying that here. They just love the game and the memories it gave them. At the time, there was truly nothing like this game. It is historically significant and still a fine game to play. I enjoyed it for the first time on Gamecube 10 years ago, and got tips from my older brother. I had a blast. So to say that it doesn't stand the test of time might be slightly accurate, but its still a significant game and plays significantly better than a large majority of its competition at the time.

Try not to let people's positive opinions work you up.

>>3981674
It's a must play game, but that doesn't mean I have to think it's good. The other anons disagree with me, though.

>>3981254
Cryptic to a fault.

>>3984007

Perhaps for you. I had a great time with it.

The complaint is valid but it doesnt make the game unplayable or unfun.

>>3984175
Doesn't make it unfun for you. I just don't care about zelda. Play it for 5 minutes, put it down, move on to Contra or Castlevania.

>>3984183

Love me some Castlevania and Contra.

Shame you couldnt get into Zelda. Oh well.

>>3966242
If you bought the game, it came with an incomplete map. This map let's you find at least the first 4 dungeons and marks a few ?'s on the map for secrets (one of the bushes you need to burn, etc.) I had this opinion as well until I knew that the game came with the map. You can find a scan of it online.

>>3984228
That's cool I guess. They knew the game needed a map even back then. If they waited a few years they would've put it in the game.

>>3984436
>>3984228
>>3982875
>>3984007
>>3981674
>>3981254

This conversation is missing one key element. I grew up during the era so let me chime in: Damn near 50000 callers a day called into Nintendo's 800 number help hotline to ask for gaming tips.

>50000 callers a day

Let that sink in. For the time and for what the service was, that's crazy. Nintendo was aware of the limitations that caused certain games to be cryptic and they provided services to players.

People still loved this shit back then, and if you manage to have fun with this game and end up loving it despite not being a part of that well kudos to you. Like some have said, asking for a tip stimulates discussion. We all know these old adventure games are flawed and cryptic, but they are still great games. If you can't see it, your loss.

>>3984228
>Put the map in the box, not in the game
Yeah wow that's soooooooo cool, dude