/vr/ - Retro Games

>games age

>implying

Here's your (You).

>>3954458
Reminder that fighting games ruin the gaming community by being like, competitive and it makes people mad and not wanting to play like?

Smash 64 is extremely low poly, and looked relatively ugly even in its day.

Why you ask? 60FPS. Thats why.

>>3954458
I like it the best but i have a soft spot for n64 graphics.
Im such a ,90s kid xD

the level selection is lacking but I do like that aren't any meteor attacks

It's probably because of all the new and improved features of the new smash games that have pretty much left the original in the dust.

>>3954463
It's honestly hard to tell sometimes if you people are genuinely stupid or just trolling about things not aging. It's surreal though.

>>3954458
nah it's still really fun. pokemon level 4life. ness 4life

>>3954458
I played it just the other day with a few friends and we had a blast. I don't think it's "aged badly" at all.

I really like the sounds in the original Smash Bros.
I can't really explain it.

>>3954562

I think it's just denial.

>>3954474
Other Genres do that way worse than fighting does, see MOBA's.

Come to think of it, everything people hate about Meleefags is multiplied tenfold by Dota and Leaguefags.

Better than the rest of them. At least everyone can get together and play the original Smash Bros without some douchebag talking about his competitive Melee player friend and how he's better than everyone else there.

>>3954630
I would destroy with with jiggs on 64.

>>3954618

No need to deny the self-evident.

>>3954562

I am 100% serious: games do not age. It is either a good game or it is not.

>>3954834

I dunno man baseball has aged pretty badly

>>3954562
It's true. Excluding MMOs, retro games don't change. If it was great 20 years ago, it should objectively be just as great now. Your personal expectations are being tempered by modern games, which is a personal issue, not the game.

>>3954562

I can't help but feel that this is some sort of "reflect the insult back on them" because someone said something similar to you about aging games.

I can't describe to you how much of a fuckwit you are, but I'm going to try.

What if a person didn't play and never saw new games, would the old games not have aged then? If a game was fun back then it's the exact same experience now.

The idea of a game "aging" is something invented by the gaming press to make people excited about new games so they don't say fuck this and play all the old games for cheaper/free and noone cares about the new ones.

Smash 64 has aged perfectly well. Graphics hold up to anything on the system. The gameplay IMO is still the best in the series. Melee you need to be semi pro to even land a combo, Brawl is floaty as hell, and Smash WiiU had moves that made cookie cutter combos on ever character. The original feels the best. Characters feel is spot on and combos are not impossible at all. The game is quite balanced and the slightly simpler controls make the game even easier to pick up, but more difficult to master. Oh and it has the amazing BONG hit sound effect. To anyone who hasn't seen a good Smash 64 player, it is worth a watch. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DETLQInjL3o

>>3954545
What? The game is full of lightning fast meteor attacks.

>>3954950
Isai videos is what got me into Smash64.

>>3954934
Jesus Christ man

I only occasionally browse now but I wonder if I was this autistic when I used to browse 4chan a lot

At least spotting it is a good sign

>>3954986
>make a claim
>someone makes a counterpoint
>hurrr autism
Really man?

>>3954934
>old games
>cheaper
Stopped reading there. You're a fucking retard.

>>3954837
baseball has always had photorealistic graphics and extremely high fidelity audio

>>3954861
that's a historical issue, not a personal one

>>3954821
Same bro. Clutch down Bs all day.

>>3954834
>I am 100% serious: games do not age. It is either a good game or it is not.

Absolutely correct.

>>3954458
Melee was the pinnacle, but everyone I know only likes 64. It's fun, just sloooow.

>>3954458
No, it always sucked. I played it back in the day, laughed hartilly and returned it the next day.

>>3955185

It's called emulation, grandpa. Get with the times or get sent to a home.

>>3955213
It's not. It's all about standards and expectations.

>>3955278
>things that never happened

Just you.

>>3955017
4chan isn't one person my man

>>3954458
It's probably because each game has become more or less an update. I still enjoy the original though.

>>3954458
It's just you. You have aged really, really badly. For all 16 years of your life.

>>3954861

When people say games age, they mean they get outclassed. Everything it does, a newer game does better.

>>3954613
They sound like they have real impact, kinda old kung-fu movies or SF2 SFX.

>>3954458
Good thing you checked the catalog before making this thread, retarded faggot.

>>3954861
A game can come out and be excellent as its on the vanguard of whats it's trying to do, seeing those same features become standard will date a game that has hedged its bets on those features.

>>3954458
Posit reasoning for your claim OP, or you're a shit sucking faggot.

Yeah, melee has aged really well, the N64 original has aged really poorly.

>>3955476
yeah it's him and you samefagging while i watch from the sidelines

>>3954934
Being dated doesn't mean it's shit, it means you can tell the game is old or a primitive example of the genre. Saying something doesn't age when it obviously does is ridiculous.

>>3955990

You're on a retro games board. If being either old or "primitive" is in any least way a problem for you vis-a-vis enjoyment of a game there is nothing here for you.

In the commonly used parlance, games do not "age".

>>3956001
>If being either old or "primitive" is in any least way a problem for you vis-a-vis enjoyment of a game

Which is why I said nothing of the sort. You're pretending like it's impossible to tell a new game from an old one.

If a game like Pole Position was released beside Ridge Racer, it would obviously look and play dated by comparison. It would have been seen as a "retro styled" game. Pretending otherwise is ridiculous.

>>3956186

But gameplay is timeless, Anon. Whether Pole Position is released now or 20 years ago, it would still be a great or a terrible game. The date would not matter. Just as with Ridge Racer.

>>3956198
>But gameplay is timeless, Anon.

It was an amazing game when it was released because there was nothing else like it to compare it to. By 10 years later when racers of that type had been iterated and improved upon it was much less impressive. Not that it's not still a fun game in it's own right, but by there's a reason that people into racing games in the 90's were playing Ridge Racer and Daytona over the original Pole Position.

Compared to say Tetris where even after all these years it's been very hard to improve much on the original.

Saying you can recognize a game as dated doesn't mean you think it's shit or not worth playing.

>>3954458
It's really solid actually. It plays very well.

Your problem is you're trying to play it on one of the most unresponsive controllers of all time.

You need a Hori or a Steel Stick mod to make it playable.

>>3956209
Seconding this. Aged badly doesn't mean it's total shit. It just didn't stand the test of time.

>>3956990

>It just didn't stand the test of time.

Except it did. Good games do not go out of style. You may, they don't.

>>3956209

>Compared to say Tetris where even after all these years it's been very hard to improve much on the original.

It is not a requirement that one must iterate on the original predecessor game for a game to be good.

Once again, the game is good or it is not. Criteria for a good or bad game may be endlessly debated, but the fact remains that whether it is ultimately good or bad will not change with age.

>read OP
>go put Smash into N64 and turn console on
>play
>game is as good as always

Nope, just you.

>>3956320
Unresponsive? The N64 stick is a lot more sensitive than the Hori or Gamecube sticks.

>>3954458
Was going to go college for graphic design and had barely started to smoke weed -- jokingly convinced myself the whole game was made in photoshop because it's so polygony, was dying laughing

>>3954458
I play this with friends even though I have Melee & Brawl. The only reason is because I don't have enough gamecube controllers to play the newer ones. The game is still really fun as long as you don't play it all of the time.

>>3955339
they change unavoidably based on the historical period in which you live. this applies to all arts, not just video games. the works of art that stood the test of time are the ones we still engage with, and the thousands of others that were made at the time, no one bothers with, b/c/ they're not as good in retrospect, though some of them might have seemed brilliant at the time.

though desu ssb is still a classic game. it's just melee is better (and the best in the series), so you should play that instead

>>3954562
Do you also refuse to watch movies if they're in black and white?

>>3957443
That's the dumbest fucking comparison I've ever heard in my life

>>3954934
>The idea of a game "aging" is something invented by the gaming press to make people excited about new games so they don't say fuck this and play all the old games for cheaper/free and noone cares about the new ones.

y-you know "not aged well" has been used outside of gaming right?

>>3957642
Answer the question.

>>3954458
I'd have to agree. There's really no reason to play it over Melee.

>>3954934
Smash is good but if you compare it to the newer Melee, which has more polished controls, graphics, modes, and pretty much every feature it looks worse by comparison and that's where "not aging well" comes from.

>>3957656
Kirby sucks in Melee

>>3957659

No. Melee is good. Smash is good.

Nothing to do with "aging".

>>3957443
black and white and silent movies are aged in a way. that doesn't mean they can't be masterpieces

>>3957736
btw teh addition of sounds was a much more enormous change to the art of cinema since it adds an entirely new modality rather than simply increasing the range of one

"Aged" or any of the words related should be banned from /vr/
Fucking retarded kids

>>3957736
But would the same movies be better with color and sound?

>>3957738
though you could argue silent films already include sound int he form of music, but music is only tied to the action on the screen in a symbolic sense, rather than a literal/concrete one

>>3957743
one of the problems with artistic masterpieces is that it's never really clear what you can change without ruining the work/decreasing its quality. you might not be able to add sound or color to an erich von stroheim film and maintain the quality for example. the issue though is that very few people today are making b&w or silent films, and for good reason: sound and color increase the range of possibilities for your art

>>3957746
>though you could argue silent films already include sound int he form of music

What was really cool about silent films that's lost these days is when they were in theaters the music was actually played by a live orchestra.

>>3957754
I think sometimes there are events where this is done for silent films, though I'm sure it's rare.

>>3954834
>I am 100% serious: games do not age. It is either a good game or it is not.
say that to goldeneye

>>3954562
People with autism struggle with figurative language, they can't help it and it's not fair to insult them over it.

>>3957017
>Once again, the game is good or it is not.

That's why I explicitly said that it doesn't make a game bad. But they also don't exist in a vacuum.

Pole Position was a lot more impressive when it was the only game like that around. It's not a bad game, but it's also not an amazing game. And with little else to compare it to, it was very impressive at the time. When you do compare it to other racers that would come later though, it's obviously primitive and in the end not as interesting to play.

That's the real concept here. Not that Pole Position isn't fun. But the reason why in 1982 someone wanting to play a racing game would very likely choose to play it, where as in 1992 they very likely would not.

I loved the hell out or Rogue as a kid and played it endlessly. It's not a bad game by any means. But there's also little reason to play it now since many others have now taken that base idea and improved upon it.

That doesn't make it bad.

>>3957443
No, just the way I don't refuse to play old games.

All I'm really saying is that you can look at an old black and white movie and tell that it's both old and in black and white and that that's part of what indicates it's age.

>>3954458
Just you, most people like the simplicity and cartoony fast paced design contrasting to the slower more complicated sequels. It's not better but it's distinct.

Only thing that feels dated to me are the low poly character models needed to maintain constant 60fps.

>>3955297
What does emulating a game have to do with its price?

>>3958053

GoldenEye is still fun. Perhaps your taste in games is shit?

>>3958371
Silky smooth 16fps.

>>3958369

Once high-accuracy emulators are available for a platform prices for it tend to start falling.

>>3958362
The models are gorgeous

>>3958130

I know exactly what he is trying to say, and I'm telling you both, quite patiently I feel, that it's a fucking garbage concept.

>>3958378
They are bad even for N64 standards, compare Smash Link with OoT Link

>>3958374

>fps faggot

No wonder you think it's shit. Why don't you go jack off with your PS4 in a corner over there?

Next you'll be telling me Perfect Dark was shit too.

>>3958387

>>3958389
Sorry anon the fps in Goldeneye aged terribly.

>>3958389
Pretending frame rate isn't important to games really doesn't help you anon.

>>3958462
A good framerate isn't a requirement of fun, unless you are playing a competitive fighting game. Or suffer from some form of autism.

>>3958482

>Or suffer from some form of autism.

Congratulations, you solved this thread.

>>3958482
Not a requirement but it helps a whole hell of a lot. And one of the reasons Goldeneye was really only popular with the console crowd.

>>3958530
>And one of the reasons Goldeneye was really only popular with the console crowd
Historical revisionism. Check out newsgroup archives sometime.

>>3958530
>console crowd

Real people aren't separated into type of systems like you think they are, anon-kun.

No fucking way. Original Smash is still to date the best smash easy. Having a perfect controller veer and friends helps.

>>3958482
Tell that to all the PAL users who claimed this game was shit because it was choppy.

I actually think Goldeneye is a perfect example of a game that was originally so massive because it brought vs fps games into the livingroom. It's really not an incredible game, but the novelty of it made it super popular.

Again, it's not that games like Goldeneye or Pole Position are bad. But they also don't exist in a vacuum.

>>3958375
Yes, that's why NES, SNES and Gameboy games have become much cheaper, right? Not at all did they double or even triple in price over the course of 5 years because of people being insecure about their e-penis trying to compensate with muh physical hardware and it being in demand more than ever, right?

Oh wait ...

>>3958549
The complaint of PAL users isn't that the games are choppy. Most games, nobody ever noticed. Story of Thor is a bit of a special case because it already ran at half of the framerate of a typical 2D game before PAL entered the equation. The real issue with PAL, the one people actually cared about, is game speed, not framerate. Sonic running slower, etc.

Goldeneye was massive, not only because it made FPS popular in the living room, but also because it redefined the genre into the post-Doom era. Halo, love or hate, also did much redefining.

>>3958532
>Goldeneye was as popular with pc fps fans as Quake and Quake 2
>Calls me revisionist

>>3958534
Sadly most gamers are though. Even more so back then.

>>3958556
>is game speed, not framerate.
This persisted into the PS2 era. Look up videos of the PAL version of Devil May Cry, Kingdom Hearts, or Final Fantasy X.

>>3958563
Who mentioned Quake?

>>3958563
>Sadly most gamers are though. Even more so back then.
Maybe in poor countries.

>>3954458
It's very stiff, it feels like you have to punish the controller to get them to do what you want

>>3958575
PCfats always use Quake as an example of good FPS. Don't ask me.

>>3958556
Point still remains though that when people think the game is choppy, they think it's shit.

I do totally agree with Goldeneye redefining fps games. It's not that I didn't think it was good. But you do understand why very few people still play it, right? The same with Pole Position. They're not bad games, but they are of a sort where once they get dated to a certain point there isn't as much reason to play them.

That's really all this whole aging thing is about. It's acknowledging that it's a process games go through. Some games, like Tetris are so good that there's little anyone can do to improve upon the original. Others like 3-Demon were amazing at the time (I certainly loved it) but as time goes on, the ideas in it were done so much better in later games.

>>3958575
It was the better fps that was being played more by the PC crowd.

>>3958587
It wasn't Highlander you dingus

>>3958592
Huh?

>>3958587
Iodrt here, I played both Goldeneye and Quake.
Quake was good for its fast-paced action, Goldeneye was better for its stealth and single-limb shooting.

It's possible to like more than 1 video game/system.

>>3958583
>very few people still play it

Probably true on the large but I have a ton of normalfag friends that still play it at parties all the damn time. That and the pokemon stadium minigames. Bitches seem to love those for whatever reason.

>>3958595
Look up the tagline for that movie

>>3954458
almost all of the n64 games aged like shite, especially compared to older consoles like the snes

3d was a neat niche when it first came but now everything just looks like ugly polygons

>>3958726
Theres a lot of good games for n64 people are just burnt out on it
It was always the one people were still playing during gamecube / wii times although i guess it wasnt that old then

>>3958605
Right. It's not that it turned into a bad game or became worthless to play, but it's also not as impressive as it was when it came out.

It's just a simple fact of reality that novelty plays a part in a game's popularity.

Nah smash 64 is still pretty damn good.

I still enjoy watching high level play to this day. Besides it's the only game in the series kirby is actually good.

>>3954474
>>3954626

Well dota is a teamgame while you 1v1 in Smash so the only oe to blame is yourself

>>3959639
It's worse in teamgames though, if you play bad everyone looks at you like they're going to kill you. At least in 1v1 you can disconnect if you're losing.

>>3959675
>At least in 1v1 you can disconnect if you're losing.

lol sore loser baby.

>>3957749
>increase the range of possibilities for your art

Most of the best pieces of art were created under strict limitations. Video games are not exempt from this.

>>3960483
Ultimately the artist is limited by the means available to create art (whether material or technical), and what the patron, if any, is looking for. Any other limitation is self-imposed. This is why, during the Renaissance, you typically see religious and, occasionally, mythological themes in art: the primary patrons were the church, royalty, and the wealthy. During the 17th and 18th centuries, art starts becoming more and more democratized, and you start seeing secular things like genre paintings, operas and fully instrumental music (as opposed to the sacred vocal music that dominated the Renaissance), and secular plays and, eventually, the novel. At this stage the artist is limited by the contents and standards of beauty expected by the middle class audience. When the Romantic era comes along in the late 18th and early 19th centuries, however, things become quite different. A cult of the artist emerges, and much more emphasis is put specifically on self-expression, and artists are more free to do strange things, eventually leading to the highly avant-garde proto-modernist works of people like Wagner, Baudelaire, and Manet. But of course, doing strange things was always a possibility: just look at the highly chromatic music of late Renaissance composer Carlo Gesualdo, the very distorted proto-expressionistic paintings of Mannerist artist El Greco, the extremely discursive and nonlinear narrative of the 18th century novel Tristram Shandy. Is this art created under strict limitations? Perhaps to an extent, but these were all artists willing to take risks, and willing to expand the range of artistic possibilities available to us, and we are grateful to them for it.