/vr/ - Retro Games

game came with a map, you're a babby

>>3740184
Give him a break, his emulated version doesn't have the map. Or he bought it used at any point in the last 30 years.

>>3740182
It isn't, you got memed

>>3740186
that's just the thing though, we have the Internet now, so these complaints are even less relevant. I'm just poking fun at OP, I get it, but at the same time, just look it up.

>>3740184
Isn't that just on NES? I am playing the FDS version and there is no evidence of a map in the manual.

>>3740182

The only hard enemies are blue wizrobes and darknuts but the difficulty scale is completely out of whack. Death Mountain is like a different game altogether.

>>3740194
They sold companion guide-books separately for Famicom games

>>3740182

>>3740184
>Buh... buh... it came with a map!
>Map wasn't complete.
>Map didn't have shit marked on it (no bombable walls, burnable tress, etc).
>Stop using this argument, you cock sucking homo faggot.

>>3740227
back then there were gaming magazines and there was also word of mouth

I'll also tell you that there are not infinity tiles in zelda. you can check all of them or even just all the suspicious ones in like a day if you're a bored 9 year old.

>>3740240
"Just bomb every tile! That's what a well designed game this is!"
>Bomb!
>Bomb!
>Bomb!
>Bomb!
>Bomb!
Wow! What compelling gameplay!

>>3740254
>i don't know how to look shit up because I'm underaged and i don't know how computers work.

>>3740254
It is literally better than any game you have ever made and anything you have ever done regardless.

>>3740254

>Oh no, I actually have to try and explore the map instead of the game telling me where to go, woe is me, I don't want to try things

>>3740268
>It is literally better than any game you have ever made
>hurrr lets see u do better
Quality deviantart logic there kid

>>3740271
>Planting bombs along every single tile of places you've already been to
>"Exploring"

>>3740261
>The year is 1984
>HURR Y DIDNT U USE THE INTERNET TO FIND THE ANSWER IDOIT

Any more gems you fucking manchildren wanna throw out there? I'm not even OP it's just some of these arguments are retarded for what really is a bad design choice

It's shit like this that makes me realize there are really no good or bad things, people will defend a thing they like for doing the same thing a thing they do not like does but in each case they will find a reasoning for why it's good or bad respectively.

>>3740182
The game was designed to be cryptic as fuck, and to be filled with secrets that kids would exchange on the playground. It was designed to be a social experience.

Is it well designed? In a way, yes, but your typical millennial (myself included) won't have the patience for it. It's very much a product of its time.

>>3740275
>Planting bombs along every single tile of places you've already been to

That's not even close to what is required, you can't be taken seriously at all. Bombs cover three tiles and there are only a couple places on each screen where a bomb could possibly even open something. The fact that you make it sound like every single tile is a potential secret makes it so obvious you are just baiting for replies.

>>3740182
>Real, non-troll reply here.


It was designed as well as pretty much anything else on the NES was at the time. Saying that it was because of limitations would be a lie, but calling it poorly designed is equally a lie.

Yes, the game did a poor job of telling you what to do next, and so much of it is simple trial and error which feels like a terrible gaming experience now. But let's be honest here, at time of release, there was literally nothing better that the average gamer could compare it to.

You don't bash the Model T for not having power steering when it was the first commercially viable mass produced car.

It's not about bombing every tile and burning every bush.

I think you only have to burn one bush in the game (the other ones are just little secrets like money or the casino game), and it's a weird looking bush placement.

The walls you need to bomb can be narrowed down by looking at relevant places to go on the dungeon maps.

Besides, the games back then intended you to draw your own paper maps or call Nintendo:

>>3740293
Except Zelda 1 IS poorly designed.
Walls aren't in any way marked for bombing. So the challenge doesn't come from having the right equipment, but from even finding the right place.
Zelda 3 was an improvement in every way and what Zelda 1 should have been.
Stuff that could be interacted with or hid a secret looked different or had "tells". Zelda 1 had no tells. It was just random bombing.

>>3740415

>Zelda 3 was an improvement in every way and what Zelda 1 should have been

literally laughed out loud at this nonsense

>>3740450
Right? Zelda 1 would have been much worse with cracks on bombable walls or bushes that have a distinguishing mark when they can be burned.
Half the fun of Zelda 1 is bombing every wall on every tile of the map...

>>3740281
Millennials are who played it though.

>Convince me...

Enough with these stupid threads. Nobody wants to convince you of shit. Nobody cares if you like a game or not. If you want to shitpost/bash a popular game--do it.

You wouldn't even be talking about this game now if Nintendo didn't have a big Switch reveal where Zelda was discussed as the killer app.

Stop projecting buyer's remorse for whatever modern shit console/PC and get over your ego.

>>3740275
>>hurrr lets see u do better
>Quality deviantart logic there kid
There is literally nothing wrong with that logic. Haven't you ever heard of the saying "You can you up, no can no BB"?

>>3740463

Boo hoo the game didn't tell me what to do, I don't think adventure games are your thing, maybe try shooters on rails.

>>3740492
>There is literally nothing wrong with that logic
The logic is that nobody's ever allowed to criticize anything unless you're capable of doing better, which is fucking retarded because it's like saying you should eat shit and live in a squalid building because you yourself aren't capable of making a 5 star meal and building a mansion

>>3740495
See, you've just made a complete leap there, because you've gone from making it about what you can criticize, to what you can do/partake in.

>>3740498
I didn't make a leap, his argument was that you can't shit talk about Zelda because it's better than any game you've ever made, it's literally a 1:1 comparison to say you shouldn't complain about living in a shit building because it's better than any building you've ever made

>>3740518
Saying that you personally don't enjoy living in it, and saying it's an objectively shitty house despite the fact you can't even make something close to it and that many people enjoy living in it are not the same thing.

>>3740536
So by your logic you're not allowed to find any flaws in a dilapidated shit building just because a lot of junkies like living in it, just like it's impossible to criticize anything about Zelda because a lot of people like it

Again, real quality deviantart logic

>>3740541
Again, though, I think there's a difference between saying that you personally don't like and saying it's objectively shit. I also think that you have to take into account when it was made; norms of gaming were different then. Should we criticize Shakespeare for writing things that don't agree with our modern values?

>>3740182
>Convince me that The Legend of Zelda is a well designed game
Convince us that you're over 18.

>>3740548
>Again, though, I think there's a difference between saying that you personally don't like and saying it's objectively shit.
Again, there you go thinking you can't say anything about Zelda is objectively bad, the fact is what OP is complaining about is never mentioned anywhere in the game or in the manual or in the supplementary map, this isn't an opinion it's an objective fact. Yes I am aware this was a norm back in the 80s, Tower of Drauga is one of my favorite games and it thrives on bullshit like this, but it's not like I'm saying that's a good thing to have, anyone would agree that yes, having things hidden like that with absolutely no discernible way of knowing it's even hidden or there to begin with is bad, regardless of when the game was released.

>>3740573
>absolutely no discernible way of knowing it's even hidden or there to begin with is bad

But that's not even true. Even a fucking 10 year old can figure this shit out.

>>3740573
>things hidden like that with absolutely no discernible way of knowing it's even hidden or there to begin with
That's not entirely true. As pointed out above:
>I think you only have to burn one bush in the game ... and it's a weird looking bush placement.
It doesn't spoon-feed you, but it's not entirely arbitrary and impossible to guess either. Many of the locations where you need to bomb walls are in places that seem to be dead ends, for example.

The only poorly designed thing in this game is the use for the meat item, but anyone who's actually exploring the map naturally should have found the meat before you needed it and bought it out of curiosity. And unless your'e a dumb monkey, you should eventually try the meat on the Goriya.

>>3740227

The manual actively tells you to make your own more complete map, it was supposed to be part of the experience.

Also, those question marks on the map aren't meaningless you dumb idiot.

>>3740182
It's shit. You rent it, it comes with no manual or documentation, and you're just this dinky sprite in a shit graphics world that looks shit compared to the other NES games you could have rented. You wander around and a bunch of stupid shits attack you.

LAME / 10

>>3740594
The manual actively doesn't come with the game you fucking shill. You pay a massive fee to rent it and get nothing but a SHIT game.

Real men play real games like Ocarina of Time, with puzzles to solve and dungeons to explore...not just a bunch of stupid enemies that rush you with nowhere to go or explore and no dungeons.

>>3740578

Or anyone who actually bothers to take a minute to think about what the old men are saying.

"SECRET IS IN THE TREE AT THE DEAD END"

That tree is in a dead end, and really sticks out, so I immediately thought it was the solution when I played the game.

>>3740597

Was game rental even a thing when this game came out?

>>3740597

If you don't have a manual, you can find it online for free super easy, you fat pig.

Also, nice revealing your hand there, you're just another OOT dick sucker.

>>3740578
Pretty sure the walls you're supposed to bomb at the mountains aren't marked though.

>>3740607
>finding a manual online in 1988

You're just a NIGGERDICK sucker fucking faggot. You think the manual was available when we rented this? You just revealed your own ignorance like Tony Soprano. I thought spergs were supposed to be intelligent?

>>3740607
What number do I have my 80 baud modem dial to get the BBS that has the Zelda manual? Need to know so I can write it down and send it to 30 years ago.

>>3740606
Video rental places regularly had videogames as well. There were a few in my area when I was a kid and I wasn't even near a major town. Also thinking about this made me remember that my dad probably had an affair with the lady who ran one of said rental places.

>>3740607
>fat pig

Projecting mouthbreathing asthmatic autist. Hey Piggy, my favorite part was when your head opened up on that rock. Assume you're also projecting your gay fantasies with that dicksuck talk. Stay away from mine, no fatties allowed. Faggot. Scared of a Real Man. You know I'd eat your fucking ass.

>ITT people bitching about an iconic game not having quality of life innovations from the future.

>>3740614

hurr im wetarded

>>3740615
What kind of shit rental places did you have in your town? Almost every NES game my family ever rented came with the manual, or a scanned copy of it. If you lost the manual or fucked it up beyond being usable then you pretty much bought the game from the shop for full retail price.

>>3740614
Random walls for rupees or shops? They aren't marked nor important.

Now Death Mountain? It's hinted at by another one of the old men.

I figured all this shit out when I was 7, and I'm not particularly smart.

>>3740636
Nice job pointing the one instance they actually bothered to make it stand out.

>>3740641
In his defense I think at blockbuster you had to ask for the manuals behind the counter (and most minimum wage employees pretended they got lost so they wouldn't have to look for it), but the mom and pop places all had them photocopied in my town.

>>3740636
What about it? It only seems obvious to you because you've played these games to death.

>>3740652
That's literally the only rock wall in the entire game you NEED to bomb.

>>3740641
You think my town would allow a video rental place or any small business that didn't already exist for 100+ years (grandfathered) and threaten its Small Town Status? Hilarious. Should the video rental places in nearby pleb towns have an internet connection so I could "download the manual"?

>scanned copy of the manual
I'm sure they kept the scanner right next to the internet-connected computer

>>3740660
That's not even mediocre bait. You don't deserve an image.

>>3740662
Be sure to send the BBS number back 30 years along with your helpful tip to SCAN the manuals rather than rely on this strange Xerox technology that babbies like you think wasn't employed in the 1980s (everyone having moved on to scanners).

Everyone in this thread is a babby pretending to have existed prior to the mid-90s other than
>>3740663
>>3740660
>>3740656
>>3740619
>>3740615

>>3740660
You're fucking retarded dude. I grew up in a rural area and there were 2-4 rental shops. My town had less than 1000 people and it had its own video rental shop with videogames on the side. Also, believe it or not, scanners existed in the 80's / early 90's.

>You think my town would allow a video rental place or any small business that didn't already exist for 100+ years (grandfathered) and threaten its Small Town Status?
>I'm sure they kept the scanner right next to the internet-connected computer

The fuck are you on?

>>3740669
Because you're totally not the dude who posted all that bullshit. Get fucked samefag.

>>3740652

Is this better for you little baby?

>>3740670
Autistic Faggot Board AKA /vr/

Prove that scanners were in more wide employ than Xerox machines AKA copy machines in the 1980s and early 1990s. Right now.

>>3740674
I posted some of that. You seem upset at having been identified as a babby. Because you're a babby.

>>3740680
This guy gets it, majority of the thread = babbies who pretend they existed prior to 20 years ago.

>>3740684
Sure I'll just hope in my fucking time machine and ask the owners of the local shops what kind of copy machine they had. Fuck off dude.

You get in game hints for many of them teaching you to bomb/burn inconspicuous areas.

If you want a more subjective and meta justification, it encourages making maps and taking notes which was a common trope for old action-adventure games. Some people enjoy this but it's not a requirement.

>>3740684
>Nobody who's ever existed has ever been an early adopter of technology like photo copiers.
>Nobody has ever used the internet prior to AOL becoming popular.
>Video game rental places in my city didn't have a photo copier so it is impossible that someone elses video game rental place had one.

Ok.

>>3740702
Furthermore it encourages experimenting with different routes on repeat playthroughs and prepares you for the more obtuse design of the second quest.

>>3740705
SCANNER you fucking goalpost-moving bitch. Remember, to host your SCANS of the manual on your BBS / Usenet?

>>3740737
>Arguing semantics.
>No real argument to stand on just blatant shit posting at this point.

Ok.

>>3740749
Just download and print your own circuit board and chips and make your own Zelda cartridge. Technology that's common 30 years in the future is surely abundant and accessible today.

>>3740754
This is fucking pathetic lol. I'm sad for you dude, I really am. Later champ.

>>3740182
>>3740680
I remember getting Legend of Zelda for christmas and so did a few of my friends

The fact that shit was hard to find is what made it special. One guy would find sometging out and tell a friend and you couldnt wait to get back home and look for it

This is like the faggot rage chats on newgrounds of kids not being able to pass the water dungeon in OOT

>mfw I convinced a kid to delete his maxed out user file cuz I told him if he did it at midnight he will unlock a beta quest that has the triforce in it

>>3740685
To be fair, most people on /vr/ are babbies pretending to be old by gathering information off of youtube and wikipedia.

Why even bother lying about it?

>>3740828
>tfw the anon calling people in the thread babbies is the only anon who's pitching a childish autistic fit.

This really activates my almonds.

>>3740773

> Play cousin's copy a ton.
> Rent copy to play at home.
> Input zelda as the name because I wasn't particularly imaginative as a kid.
> Wonder why in the fuck the dungeons are all in different places.

It wasn't until years later that I realized I was skipping to second quest.

>>3740762
You're the pathetic faggot because you're a /vr/ babby.

>>3740472
How do you define a millennial then? Last I checked, millennials didn't grow up in the 1980s.

>>3740493
I think you're not getting the comment, dude

>>3740182
>hard
>Legend of Zelda

Never thought I'd hear somebody unironically imply that Zelda was hard.

>>3741043
You obviously don't talk to a lot of people that play the game then.

I'm not saying the game is hard, but every Zelda babby that started with Ocarina of Time or later thinks the game is "literally unbeatable without a guide" or something.

>>3740182
>>3740227
>>3740254
>>3740275
You destroyed them.

>>3740680
What exactly am i looking at?

>>3741043
I don't know man those Darknuts are pretty tricky

>>3741043
The second quest is hard.

I played it and I had fun.

I only have fun when a game is well designed.

Therefore it is a well designed game.

Case closed
/thread
OP got rekt and is a faggot.
Come at me.

the wall bombing wouldnt be a problem if the bombs were more plentiful. but they are very scarce. if i designed the game i would have let you carry like 100 bombs and made them common drops

>>3740227
oh man you hurt my feelings so bad

>>3741353
this. plus rupees are annoying to farm, so unless you get lucky drops you're going to waste a ton of time on trial and error bullshit.

>>3740597
>and no dungeons.
See now you're just proving you're stupid. If there's one thing the original Zelda is famous for it's dungeons. Well, that and open-world exploration. And battery-backup save game. So, more like, if there's three things the original Zelda is famous for, dungeons are one of them. But even so, you get my point.

>>3740737
Not him, but a photocopier is a type of scanner. It's just one that's hooked straight into a printer rather than into a computer.

>convince you to play a game
WHY?! If you're missing out on such a great gaming experience, then the only one hurt is yourself.

And the guy complaining about bombs, they're a common drop in the game, especially by the blue Goyiras (or whatever the boomerang guys are called). I was able to bomb everything with plenty of spare bombs to use as weapons.

You aren't intended to just place bombs on every wall, you're supposed to look at the layout of the map (unlike modern Zelda games, the map is VERY important).

You get bomb bag upgrades towards the end of the game and you can carry so many bombs you can only run out if you're a complete retard that refuses to think.

>>3741043
Fighting wizzrobes is always harrowing as fuck, and god help you if a likelike eats your shield.

>>3740227
The picture you posted pretty much undermines the entirety of the points you're trying to make in your greentext. That's what's hilarious.

>>3741243

There is an extra life heart in there and you need to bomb the wall to find it. babbies in this thread say it's not far that there are no hints where the hidden items are so that means its poor design. The picture is showing an alternative universe where Nintendo caters to babies.

>>3742392
I loved the original Zelda and I still think you're a massive faggot. Fuck off with this babbies shit.

This entire thread gave me terminal cancer.

>>3740182
It's really not hard. I've finished it, and I coudln't finish Ninja Gaiden, Megaman and Castlevania.

Also, I've played it without a map because I have a brain, you know the map perfectly within a few hours.

There's wasn't a single illogical bombing.

Bush burning can be random sometimes but those heart containers are not necessary, they just make the game easier. Once you get everything, the bracelet, the ring and the magic sword you're kinda invincible. And you gotta understand kiddo, this was released back in 1986, and it's price was $49.99 plus tax, at least in the USA. I wouldn't want it to be over in fucking 3 hours.

>>3740578
This, the first time I've seen it, even before getting the candle and knowing you can actually burn trees, I've thought to myself "I'll cut this down in one point".

I don't know how fucking dumb are modern games if a person who played a single game ever didn't figure this out.

>>3740182
Convince me that you're old enough to post here.

>>3742392
Ah, yes, that makes perfect sense to bomb the right side of the rocks there.
You know, since every dungeon places bombable areas in the center or middle. And there are no in game clues saying you need to bomb the right side of those rocks.
... You're an idiot.

Better design would have been to make the rock have an alcove like pic. At least then there is SOME indication that something isn't right.

>>3742635
How about they just have the fucking cave there already open for your so your dumbass cant possibly miss it.

>>3742647
Because solving something for yourself is a rewarding experience.
BUT only when you are given the tools to do so and it is fair.
Random hidden cave with no indication is not fair. Something looking not quite right and you finding the cave yourself is fair.
Learn to game design, faggot.

>>3742635

It's literally the only fucking rock in the whole game that looks like that and there is literally nothing else on that screen that is important. If you actually played the game instead of being a 16 year old faggot you would know that every screen had something special about it. Besides, the heart piece is supposed to be a secret, it's not even required. Do you think hidden 1ups in Super Mario are bad design?

Why didnt the game have a quest marker?

I couldnt find the first weapon since there was no indicator to go in the first cave and caves are inherently dangerous.

>>3742781
What people think Morrowind was "I shall seek out this man and get my rewards."

What Morrowind actually was "WELCOME TO THE HIDE AND SEEK WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP! First prize is 300 septims!"

Don't even deny it.

>>3742651
>Because solving something for yourself is a rewarding experience
Yes

>BUT only when you are given the tools to do so and it is fair

No

>Random hidden cave
That the game tells you about is fair.

>Something looking not quite right and you finding the cave yourself is fair
Which is what the game does

>Learn to game design, faggot
Isn't talking about yourself in the third person a sign of crazy?

>>3742772
Hmm... every screen? Really?
Let's find out!
Okay, there are 128 screen on the overworld (8×16). Of those 67 have nothing special about them.
Oops, looks like you're a faggot, huh?

>>3742893
>Every screen must have a treasure! I can't deal with not being rewarded!

Your favorite game is Wind Waker, isn't it?

>>3742893
Actually, I left off 2 screens that have 'something special'. So there are 65 screens of the 128 that have nothing special about them.

Hmm... every screen? Really?
Let's find out!
Okay, there are 128 screen on the overworld (8×16). Of those 62 have nothing special about them.
Oops, looks like you're a faggot, huh?

You fucking spergs. When this game was released people wanted to get as much out of games as humanly possible. They gave people this by sprinkling in a ton of secret caves and entrances that gave you anything from rupees to heart containers. Showing up at school the next day to let your pal Timmy know that you found a heart container in a cave that you found was part of the experience. You can call it "bad game design" all you want, but you're fucking wrong. It was a calculated move to make the game like that, and was likely seen as a fucking FEATURE. Both from an extending the life of the game perspective, and from giving kids shit to talk about at school perspective.

>>3742976
Huh... and all this time I thought it was designed that way to sell Nintendo Powers and discourage renting...

>>3742910

The map is so wrong it's comical. I'm not going to waste my time pointing out all the mistakes because it's obvious you didn't even play the game to see all the things you missed.

All I have to see is that you don't even know what the lost woods are because you marked them not special to see you have no familiarity with the game and just want to have a special contrarian viewpoint for the sake of feeling superior.

>>3740182
>and without it, it's too hard because of random enemy movement and attack patterns.
Bush burning and wall bombing doesn't affect random enemy movement or attack patterns. Also those patterns were largely not difficult and were fine. So that argument is nonsense entirely.

The burning and wall bombing was sort of overkill for hiding secrets everywhere especially some quest specific stuff. The second quest goes and adds other shit like wall humping for five seconds to go through invisible walls on top of that and some other bullshit.
That being said, that wasn't good design. But it was cutting edge design for the time all around. The game did some good, some bad. The game will always have a place in my heart and be nostalgic for me but it's not a game without some bad design choices and flaws.

>>3740197
Wizzrobes aren't shit. Darknuts are sort of annoying especially with the wonky controls.

>>3743025
The map he posted shows just shows all the portions with secrets on them as 'special' you both seem to have a disagreement on what the term means. Though I'm guessing I'd agree with his conclusion a bit more than yours.

>>3743036
>The map he posted shows just shows all the portions with secrets on them as 'special' you both seem to have a disagreement on what the term means. Though I'm guessing I'd agree with his conclusion a bit more than yours.

You're a dipshit too, he missed heart pieces, the motherfucking power bracelet, like I said I could name a lot more, not going to waste my time.

>>3740873
>How do you define a millennial then?

You don't and it's a hazy and shitty term. Because no matter how you define it I can always tell you of a story of two similar brothers one to a few years apart on who grew up in nearly identical situations who, one who fits your definition the other who doesn't despite both basically having very similar lives and making similar choices and similar attitudes.

Listing genre's of people is useless for actually discussing them as people rather than trends of people. That is, Millenials had computers around most of their lives. That's a factual trend. Most people in any definition of Millenials that will be true even if not all of them did even the latest batch. It doesn't define any one individual but it's a fact of the times.

That being said, the definitions of millenials very much does include people who grew up in the 80's. Some definitions have millenials as anyone who grew up largely in the 80's and after, some those who were born in the eighties. Either way, applying the term to an individual is stupid as already demonstrated. People as well as generations of people are not black and white cleanly defineable things. Just like evolution there is no one all fitting prototypical example of most things, there are just things which fit grey fuzzy molds of concepts that hold multiple truths.

>>3743041
Let me translate for you:
"I got proven wrong and now I'm butthurt also, I'm a huge faggot."

That about right?

>>3743057

I'm not the one who autistically tried to prove a point with a map that is completely wrong.

>>3743041
>he missed heart pieces
PIECE. One. He shaded 4 screens of the five heart pieces on the overworld. He left out the one sitting out in the open that you need the step ladder for. Which you somehow feel is 'special'. Like I said, I'd probably agree with him. I mean yeah there's a heart piece there, not exactly rocket surgery finding it since you just kind of go hey there's a heart piece.

The closest thing you'd to an argument for that being special is it's the closest thing to a learning design mechanic that say, oh there has to be something to let me cross over to that in the game. But we already know that because it's in the fucking manual, so, not so much.

>>3743059
Okay, so discounting the heart piece and power bracelet. That is still 60 of the 128 screens that have no secret.
Try again?

>>3743036

4 hearts for each godamn wave that hits you though. Darknuts are only a bitch when they fill the room.

>>3743065
>Try again?

No thanks, you win helmet boy, it's a bad game because you only find a secret half the time which is unfair

>>3743064
>rocket surgery
That's something Senor Cardgage would say.

>>3743051
Someone who logs on a gook toon image board about how they aren't a millennial.

Played Zelda for the first time ever at 23, found everything on my own except:
>bow and arrow (never realized I missed it in dungeon 1)
>one heart container
I also didn't know you could bomb walls or burn bushes, but I found out from an AVGN video that randomly showed footage from Zelda. I beat the game without a guide otherwise

Pic related, my notes so I didn't forget how to get to Gannon after dying the first time. I had a lot of fun and thought it was a well-designed game.

I played Zelda for the first time ever at 23, and I managed to beat it without a guide or map. The only things I did look up were:
>things in the manual
>bow and arrow (never realized I missed it in dungeon 1)
>one heart container
I also didn't know you could bomb walls or burn bushes, but I found out from an AVGN video that randomly showed footage from Zelda.

Pic related, my notes so I didn't forget how to get to Gannon after dying the first time. I had a lot of fun and thought it was a well-designed game, although I don't think I have the energy to do the second quest

I played Zelda for the first time ever at 23, and I managed to beat it without a guide or map. The only things I did look up were:
>things in the manual
>bow and arrow (never realized I missed it in dungeon 1)
>one heart container
I also didn't know you could bomb walls or burn bushes, but I found out from an AVGN video that randomly showed footage from Zelda.

Pic related, my notes so I didn't forget how to get to Gannon after dying the first time. I had a lot of fun and thought it was a well-designed game, although I don't think I have the energy to do the second quest

>>3743184
minecraft players from /v/ can't imaging things like this. they don't like to use those old treeware things outside of classroom. and brains also.

>>3740182
Fuck off Aonuma, and don't forget to take your moron son with you.

>>3743153
You should take classes on reading comprehension. You're fairly poor at it.

>>3740773
>The fact that shit was hard to find is what made it special. One guy would find sometging out and tell a friend and you couldnt wait to get back home and look for it

Except this isn't 1987 and we're not 8 years old. Now if you can't figure out where shit is hidden you have three choices: look it up on gamefaqs like a cheater; be ridiculed because clearly everybody should have played the game 30 years ago so if you don't know where something is you're a retard or underage; or quit the game, call it a piece of shit, and have everybody call you a contrarian faggot.

Stop comparing it to other games and you will begin to love it. You miss what it does well because you focus on what it doesn't do.

It's a quirky game with fun strategies for navigation you only find out while playing it. For instance few people mention that if you attack dodongo's by dropping two bombs in a row instead of one, they will drop 4 bombs. Allowing you to always replenish.

>but how do I proceed, it's so cryptic!

As a general rule every square on the map has something suspicious about it. After enough time you just learn to have a feel for these things. Call it intuition, or perseverance. For instance, in the OP pic, doesn't that conspicuous corner look odd to you? Well what can you do in this instance? Trees burn. Let's burn it!

Except to find the gauntlets by fighting Armos, the game never asks you for any great bounds of logic. Level 9's location is not explicitly given to you, but hey, you should have read the manual by this point.

>>3740606
Yep.

>>3740641
This, otherwise borrow the game from a friend.

>>3740656
The grocery stores I rented games from almost always had the manuals rubber banded to the cartridge.

>>3740182
Why do you care what we think? If you don't like it, play something else. You shouldn't force yourself to try and enjoy something because some people on the net said you ought to.

>>3744050
>You miss what it does well because you focus on what it doesn't do
>muh waifus
>muh graphics
>muh shitty puzzles
>muh handholding

>>3740182
It's a classic, but it hasn't aged that well. I don't mind the absence of a world map, but there are no indications of the locations of the secrets, and the dungeons are all flat, with the same copypasted room over and over again. I enjoy it, but it is archaic.

It was revolutionary in its day, but ultimately ALTTP has aged much better. There is plain and simply no dungeon in the original which even compares to something like The Dark Palace.

The only mistake theis game made are those fucking blue mages.
Fuck them and fuck whoever thought it was fun to stuff rooms full of blue mages, likelikes, bubbles, obstacles and other shit.

>>3744203
i don't see why you wrote this post to that particular anon, but everything starting with muh here is the problem. these kids who come from /v/.

>>3742813
Emm, what? If you cant find ppl or places in Morrowind, go get your autistic license or something.

>>3744050
>As a general rule every square on the map has something suspicious about it.

Already disproven here >>3742910
Less than half have 'something suspicious'.

>>3744087
Not OP, but that's some shit mentality you got there. First of all, he might be wrong or overlooked something. Having a discussion about it will solve that.

Secondly, if he is right, that it is in fact a badly designed game, it is still worth having a discussion about it. Maybe not to you, but some of us do enjoy having that discussion. And no game, not Zelda or whatever you favorite game is, should be above critique. That just lead to blind fanboyism.

>If you don't like it, play something else
He should probably not continue to play it, assuming his reason for playing it is to have fun or some enjoyment. But that does not mean he shouldn't discuss it. Especially since it is a famous game like the original Zelda.

>>3740281
Pretty much this. I remember being like 8 years old and having to explain to one of my fathers friends over the phone where to find the last dungeon.

It was "nintendo hard" in a different way, you had to figure things out rather than just deal with impossible obstacles/enemies.

Its fucking zelda part 1 goddammit!

>>3740873
According to Wikipedia, it's Generation Y, or in other words,

>demographers and researchers typically use the early 1980s as starting birth years and ending birth years ranging from the mid-1990s to early 2000s.

>>3740254
>>3740578
> obvious bush is fucking obvious as fuck

The Blue Candle only puffs one flame per screen, its practically useless but can burn a bush if you know where its at.

You get the Red Candle later on and can burn the fuck out of shit left and right. Its when you go around looking and burning bushes because (yknow, that one bush you burned was a fucking dungeon)

So then you'll make notes and be like - yippeee, as soon as I start a new game im getting that Blue Candle and im going to these spots.

> and having the Master Quest right afterward doubles up your ability to explore in this way.

Bombing Rocks is a nutty pain but having the White Sword or Magic Sword makes it pretty easy to kill the moblins (dudes who shoot arrows) and a bunch of them drop bombs.

So you usually got a steady supply of bombs and nothing to do with them.

With 8 bombs you can blast most of the length of an entire rock wall in one screen. If you know nothing came of it, you're never going to bother bombing there again.
> sounds like an intelligence test for kids actually, you just going to drop bombs at random or are you going to go about it in an organized manner?

>>3740659
This

And im not sure if I remember accurately but, I bombed that at random and found that dude who says only people who have the triforce can enter.

I remember dying a few times getting so pissed at him trying to kill him and getting ded from the fireballs.

Didnt know until years later thats just a pass-gate for making sure you conquer all the other dungeons first. Didnt know the BBEG was in there.

> for being a BBEG that rules the whole world with an iron fist, he sure makes himself hard as fuck to find to seek an audience with
>>3740353
fucking saved that like a motherfucker
> even the online guides dont have it all in one place like this, got that shit split up into a bunch of chapter walkthroughs

>>3740182
>Zelda
>hard

Don't know whether I should laugh at you or pity you for being such a massive fucking pleb.

>>3744260

T H I S

I swear, beat the first three dungeons and thought they were decent (the tower of hera was a worthwhile challenge).

Then this bullshit, talk about a difficulty leap, I mean I was really going around the world map looking for Some Other Place to go first and the designers cleverly made that impossible without the magic hammer.

And the boss wasnt a pushover either, those fireballs were no joke.

At least unlike OOT the magic hammer is a worthwhile combat item too (does it do Sword Mk4 damage? I dont remember) so it was Very Rewarding to beat this dungeon.

>>3740182
The game is a shit ton easier once you learn item dropping enemies will always drop bombs on the 10th kill by a bomb if you didnt get hit in those 10 kills, and will always drop a fairy on the 16th kill without being hit.

>>3746119
>T H I S
>Says something completely contradictory

You.... You realize the post you are linking to is PRAISING the Dark Palace, yes?