/vr/ - Retro Games

No love for SNK?

Try the SNK general on /vg/ OP, they'll help you.

Always go with release order.

>>3677162
Thanks

>>3677171
To learn your way up?

>>3676898
With SNK you don't git gud, you get OKAY

>>3676898

King of Fighters '98 is arguably the most beginner-friendly game in the series, and it has one of the fullest rosters. I'd suggest sharpening your skills there, although personally I prefer '95.

>>3676898
Don't pay attention to this guy >>3677171 unless "getting into them" means playing through them like you would a series of beat em up games or something like that. Presumably if you're looking to play fighters it's so you can play against people because that's what the games excel at. So you'll want to focus on the most popular games, which fortunately for KoF also means the best ones.

So look at either KoF '98 or 2002. Some other years are good, but those two are among the best, the most played and a perfect starting point for someone getting into the series.

There is also Garou Mark of the Wolves or other FF's, but honestly that's a lot more like Street Fighter with an SNK flavor to it. If you want the full on SNK fighter experience King of Fighters is what you're looking for.

As for getting into it and good, first is practice your inputs. KoF is a little heavier on complex moves like cqf-hcb motions etc. So that's the first step. Also general things like lp+lk is a roll and hp+hk is a knockback attack, both of which are important.

Once you get the basics of everything coming out all the time when you want it to then you can move onto more in depth strategies.

garou mark of the wolves and lastblade II were both good: good animation and good gameplay
the other snk games have pretty sloppy mechanics compared to the flagship tekken and capcom fighters.

>>3677794
>the other snk games have pretty sloppy mechanics compared to the flagship tekken and capcom fighters.

lol wow. Please tell me this was supposed to be bait.

>>3676898
Many of em were janky and more like MK.

More spectacle than substance.

Fatal Fury 1 was shit since it was done by the people who did SF1 which also was shit.

>>3677794
>the other snk games have pretty sloppy mechanics compared to the flagship tekken and capcom fighters.

Nah, it's just that 3 vc 3 fighters have less frames of animation per character compared to super smooth 1 vs 1 ones.

That said, I highly recomend a start with Garou Mark of the Wolves. What a fine video game, holy shit.

>>3677858
>>3677906
>/vr/ fighting threads are nothing but weak bait now.

> Best projectile in the game, period
> Fully invincible DP with all hits connecting
> THAT rekka which can punish literally everything and deals tons of stun damage
> Insane crossup command normal, which also allows for super fast backdash
> Fast as fuck super with upper body invincibility that can punish everything and connects 100% of time
What were they thinking

>>3677937
>What were they thinking

He's got all that and he's not even unbalanced. KoF is awesome.

>>3677949
Yeah, remember when Kim had a projectile? Or a rekka which had a decent range? Or a mad cross-up command normal? Good times.

But seriously, that's the thing about Iori. He just has everything. Kim has his fast Ranbu, but it has a very short invincibility and only before it's active. He also has the rekkas, but their range is very short. And his flash kick is alright, but it's a charge move and I'm not sure it's as invincible.

Other characters have one or the other. They can't alternate between zoning and rushdown so easily, and their punish options are far more limited. And the fact that Iori can stun the opponent with 2 combos gives him even more advantage.

>>3677992
I've been playing KoF regularly for over 15 years now, Iori is a regular of mine but I've also faced him countless times with just about everyone. Sure he's an excellent character, but not unfairly excellent. I have never ever feel at a real disadvantage when going against him. I've wrecked many, many Ioris with Kim over the years.

>>3677365
Yeah will try KoF 98 and 02 now.
>like cqf-hcb motions etc. So that's the first step. Also general things like lp+lk is a roll and hp+hk is a knockback attack

Sorry, please explain. Have no idea.

>>3677794
Yeah I've been hearing a lot about Garou Mark of the Wolves. Was even recently re-released on PS4 and Steams after a poll from SNK. What's Last Blade like? Similar to FF or another flavor all together?

And what about Samurai Shodown? How does that compare to the others? Worth looking into?

Can't have a SNK thread without some music
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hXPcDwqTtlM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLLLYxBkwog
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghIl6Bl2ef8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQfHIVMCO9I&list=PL7391E208C6ADF463&index=7
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIJk5OEGQLE&list=PL7391E208C6ADF463&index=24
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdEa37Qdx4U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HKZfVCW3PUE&list=PL7BC0EF11249A56AA&index=13
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOBrRhfQ-lk&index=9&list=PL0AC6481A1A9C3780
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_TkANl0GELM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJ88yXEqOU0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERCcc3DGt2A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUputPERrdM&list=PLF69D87114F252411
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3rOeiiaVhg&index=2&list=PLF69D87114F252411
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-r8VbjSwbfc&list=PLF69D87114F252411&index=12
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiRSyKjiBR0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7n_zndwhGHQ&list=PLPQ7CCupHmGYPa5FsO3bTCaeM4WztqKX-&index=5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fwgyL6TxXQ&list=PLPQ7CCupHmGYPa5FsO3bTCaeM4WztqKX-&index=7

Have you ever noticed this? Top: KoF '95 AoF arena. Bottom: KoF '98 team old guys arena

>>3678076

Nice.

>>3678051
>First point
What anon is trying to say is joystick/button combination shorthand(something else you'll need to learn...it's easy, though). Quick review:
hcf = Half Circle Forward
qcb = Quarter Circle Back
HP = Heavy Punch
LK = Light Kick
As you imagine, the acronym letters are used interchangeably.

>Second point
I can only comment on Samurai Shodown: if you're expecting frantic, slashing fights, look elsewhere. SS is more about deliberate attacks/blocks(a duel, if you will). Frenzied close-in combat DOES happen, but very rarely. Give it a shot, but be aware of the huge change in engine.

>>3678219
Thanks for the explanation. Lots to learn, clearly.

>>3677937
>didn't even mention what 'game' out of a 20+ game series
>wrong
>wrong
>low proximity vulnerable
>wrong
They were thinking right, you're just an idiot. 3/10 you got me to reply

SNK's games are all very close to SF, but they all have certain twists. The games that aged the best are Garou, KoF'97-onwards, Last Blade 1&2 and several Fatal Fury and Samurai Shodown entries. Now a little about SNK franchises.

KoF is perhaps the most important of SNKs franchises, its flagship series, and maybe the one with most depth. It used to be SNK's "all stars" franchise, throwing together heroes from Fatal Fury, Art of Fighting and their other games; but it also has original characters (such as Iori Yagami), and quickly got a life of its own.

Early on (KoF'94–'95), it was very close to SSFII, except with several gimmicks and poorer balance. But gradually it got its own number of features which proved to be quite important, such as: hopping, running, super jumps, evasion rolls, guard cancelling at the cost of meter (into blowback attacks or roll), air knockdown attacks, ability to combo throws and command normals, longer combos with more conversions, proximity unblockable moves, etc.

KoF used to be plot-centric, revolving around Kyo Kusanagi and his friends/enemies; but after several games, SNK decided to take a break and instead has decided to focus on balance and flesh out what they had made so far, and thus KoF '98 was born, which is currently the most popular retro KoF game. It is a "dream match" game, bringing in all characters, even dead ones, and having no canonical plot, and so it has quite a big roster.

Later efforts by SNK introduced different mechanics, now borrowed from MvC. KoF'99–2001 had a striker mechanic much in the vein of Capcom's games, but generally they turned out pretty broken. KoF 2003 and XI went even further and took the whole tag team feature from MvC. But these things never managed to catch on, perhaps that's why in 2002 SNK made a second "dream match" game, KoF 2002. This is a second most-popular retro KoF game.

Your one stop to learn KoF, an introduction into the series' mechanic: https://youtu.be/r75Lz1Drp8g

>>3678346
Now, to other SNK franchises, which frankly never got as popular as KoF (for most part).

Around 1991 or so, SNK managed to score some guys who worked on SF1. They helped SNK launch their foray into fighting games. The first one was Fatal Fury. The game was pretty much like SF1, blending a beat em up with a fighter. It didn't age so well, but introduced some of SNK's most popular chars: Terry and Andy Bogard, Joe Higashi, and their arch-enemy Geese Howard. Following SFII's release though, Fatal Fury became much closer to SFII, except retaining its 2-plane gimmick. The games were alright, but the mechanic never really became that popular.

However, in 1999, SNK made Garou—a game meant as an "answer" to SFIII. Similarly, it features a new generation of fighters, and also much improved animations and graphics. It threw away the 2-plane fighting of previous FF game, but not many cared about it anyway. Due to its graphics and easy to pick gameplay, it is also a great start for a new SNK fan; but that said, it's not as deep or balanced or original as KoF (or even Samurai Shodown, for that matter).

Next, a little bit about Art of Fighting. It was another of SNK's fighting series, and its "answer" to SFII. It featured ridiculously huge sprites and ripped off SFII pretty shamelessly (Dan from SFA was Capcom's mockery of SNK's Ryo and Robert). That said, it also had a meter used for performing special moves and even what could be considered an early example of super moves. But, you could only pick 2 characters. AoF2 fixed that, but frankly, most of the cast was poorly balanced. Still, the characters from the series remain in KoF to this day (Ryo, Robert, Takuma, Yuri, King, and some others). Art of Fighting 3 tried to change things drastically though: it eschewed SFII-style mechanics for more Virtua Fighter-inspired combos, but in 2D form. The series ran out of gas after that. It's not very popular today.

>>3678346
>aged

>>3678386
Next, Samurai Shodown. SNK's second-biggest IP, but perhaps not as popular in the West.

The first and the second installments was pretty much SFII, but with samurais. The game had several interesting features though, like very much more damaging sword attacks, rage moves (which inspired ultra moves in SFIV), dashing and several others. They play pretty good, not as balanced as SFII of course but pretty fun and bright. The rest got a bit more experimental, and I can't really say much about them. I'm not a pro, and SSV Special was a bit too complex for my understanding, and due to its lower popularity I abandoned it. Still, I can say it has a more "experimental" feel than other SNK series. The series allows to take off more than 2/3 of opponent's health with one lucky blow, for example.

Finally, Last Blade. A game is set in Japan, but in a later period than Samurai Shodown (in XIXth century). A beautiful game for sure—amazing backgrounds which are known beyond the fighting game community. Gameplay-wise, it features chain combos like in Darkstalkers and different modes (like in SFA3, for example). Also, it has a parry-like mechanic. I haven't played it that much though, it's not that popular today and feels a tiny bit style over substance.

As for the rest of SNK games… Some would remember World Heroes maybe, there are also games published on Neo Geo but not made by SNK. They have their fans, but frankly, they never were as popular.

A little last word on the later SNK games. They tried to go 3D with KoF but without much success (Maximum Impact sub series). KoFXIII and XIV are good and are totally worthy of being sequels (aside for XIV's disappointing graphics). As for the rest of the games, Samurai Shodown got a 3D game and it sucked. SNK had been in dire straits trying to make ends for most of the 2000s. Mostly they either made retro collections for every platform or milked their IPs with pachinko or date sims. Except Card Fighters was a banger.

>>3678408
Well I'm just saying that early SNK stuff hasn't aged that well—for the lack of better word. I mean take FF1 for example, you'd be baffled if you started there.

I love all SNK games, just to be clear. I've played a lot of FF Special for SNES, KoF'94 too. But they are more suited for fans of SNK, not for first-timers.

>>3678346
>>3678386
>>3678437

Thanks for the knowledge drop there anon.

>Except Card Fighters was a banger.
I actually have a pocket color and have been trying to hunt down a copy.

I think some additions need to be made to what I said.

First, I forgot to mention one game: SNK vs Capcom: SVC Chaos (not to be confused with Capcom vs SNK). This one was made as a part of the contract between the 2 companies. It utilizes a system very close to KoF2002 except with 1-on-1 combat, and uses a lot of the sprites from KoF. It's not as popular as KoF or Garou, and personally I feel it's pretty flawed—the presentation is lacking, the overall feel is a bit wonky and Capcom characters felt too weak—but maybe it's just me.

Second, a note on the best ways to play SNK games. Since SNK consoles never got really popular, getting physical copies can be quite expensive and complicated, not to mention Neo Geo market is full of fakes and bootlegs. So, I'd say the most convenient way to play them is to either emulate or get the ports or KoF Ultimate Match games for whatever platform you use (except PS1 at least, those ports had awful loading times). Ultimate Match games come with netplay, can't say anything about other ports for sure though.

As for emulation, in a nutshell, the best emulator for Neo Geo is probably FBA (FinalBurn Alpha). It works perfectly from the box, all you really need is ROMs and BIOS. It must be mentioned though that all Neo Geo ROMs can be launched in two modes: arcade (MVS) or console (AES). I suggest the latter: this way, you won't have to care about credits and timers, and will also get settings, more playing modes, some secret characters and, most importantly, practice mode. You can also use Neo Geo Universe BIOS—it allows for more convenient settings, cheats/hidden options like turning on blood in games, and even viewing hitboxes.

You can also try netplay, for example Fightcade. After some easy setup, you can play most popular Neo Geo games online. But be warned that the players there are usually high level, KoF is like national sport in some countries like Mexico or China and Korea.

>>3678758
Yeah all sorter there anon. Pic related. Currently emulating on my arcade I built. I use FBA with the Neo Geo Universe BIOS. Hadn't thought to switch from MVS to AES mode though. Won't I need AES roms for that? Surely the arcade ROMs didn't come prepacked with all that.

I'd love to buy some of the original games and hardware, but boy are prices horrendously expensive.

>>3678815
>Won't I need AES roms for that?
Nope.

> Surely the arcade ROMs didn't come prepacked with all that.
They actually did, try for yourself. At Universe BIOS splash screen, press A+B+C for settings, then go to region setup and change it to console (any region is fine). You will have console version of the game with everything I mentioned. Except older KoFs, like '94 to '96 I think, don't have practice mode if I'm correct. But '98 has one, as well as every game after it.

> I'd love to buy some of the original games and hardware, but boy are prices horrendously expensive.
I read here on /vr/ that most of these might even be bootlegs. It's all so full of fakes that getting real stuff is like dealing drugs.

>>3678828
Sweet thanks for the tip. Will try.

Almost forgot. Shoryuken wiki has excellent articles for KoF and Garou. KoF'98 wiki for example has frame and hitbox data for all characters with move lists, tips, combos, and so on. Really good reads. Here are some links:

http://wiki.shoryuken.com/The_King_of_Fighters_%2798:_The_Slugfest
http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Garou:_Mark_of_the_Wolves
(scroll down for character pages)

Also, some advice on easy to use characters. First, let's talk about KoF '98 (most of it applies to 2002 too). Ryo is a very good starter character, close to a classic shoto and good to learn the basics. Clark is a good choice to get into KoF grapplers and learn their advantages. Some other relatively easy to use characters: Terry, Joe, Benimaru, Shingo. Conversely, I wouldn't recommend Kyo, Daimon, Chang, Choi or Chin for a beginner. Charge characters like Leona also aren't that easy, at least in '98. Side note: Extra mode is pretty much for lulz only in the game. If you don't want hassle, just choose Advanced like 99,9% of players do.

As for Garou, it's less obvious, but I certainly advice NOT to pick Rock. His game plan is far from obvious, and he's certainly not the strongest there is. Terry is very easy to pick up though, albeit somewhat limited. Jae Hoon is pretty good also. The rest requires some getting used to.

And one more thing. KoF '98 has several hidden characters. To pick them you just hold Start on character's portrait. Now some of them are kinda gimmicky slight alterations of themselves, but there are 2 in particular which are pretty different and strong at the same time: I'm speaking of Orochi Chris and Orochi Yashiro. Try them just in case you get bored with the rest. You can also try old versions of Kyo and Ryo more akin to KoF '95, they're nothing special but interesting to try.

>>3678858
Sweet, thanks. Will have a read.

>>3678346
What about Kabuki klash and waku waku 7?

If you're looking to play against others, KOF '98 UM and 2002 UM are your answer. If you're just playing for the solo experience, trying all the KOFs isn't bad. As ridiculous as it is playing a fighting game for the "story", the one arena where SNK always beat Capcom hands down was in the small details that made their characters really shine.

As far as other games people haven't mentioned go, the Playmore Era SNK (after their bankruptcy) has some fun games that people often dismiss. Neo Geo Battle Coliseum is a dreammatch situation with characters from all of SNK's fighters; it borrows a lot of sprites from SNK vs Capcom: SVC Chaos and in certain ways is kind of a spirtual successor. KOF XI was the real beginning of SNK Playmore's return to form, and probably has one of the most interesting roster of any KOF. The only real disappointment was that it never got a UM version to give it some final polish.

If you're actually playing on real hardware and don't have an actual Neo Geo AES or consolized MVS, (Japanese) PS2 is probably your best bet. In a rush to make money, SNK Playmore ported pretty much their entire fighter library to the PS2, and they hold up better than the PS1, Saturn, or Dreamcast versions in terms of fidelity to the original.

>>3678926
Different developers, SNK only published those. Still fun games though.

Are cps 1-2-3 and NeoGeo the only formats supported on fightcade?

Cause i kinda like Dan Ku Ga, Rabbit, martial masters, etc.

>>3678929
>Neo Geo Battle Coliseum is a dreammatch situation with characters from all of SNK's fighters

Yeah I've been trying to hunt down a copy for PS2. Looks to be a great game.

>In a rush to make money, SNK Playmore ported pretty much their entire fighter library to the PS2

Sweet, I'll be on the look out for more titles then.


>>3678950
The site states it uses FBA (FinalBurn Alpha) so anything that will run on that emulator should work. It did support more than just CPS and NeoGeo

>>3678051

The Samurai Shodown series has more of a slow, deliberate pace. Some matches can be over in a half-dozen moves or so.

Here are the games you'll want to play to get into each series:

>KOF
King of Fighters '98

>SamSho
Samurai Shodown II

>Fatal Fury
Real Bout Fatal Fury 2
Garou Mark of the Wolves

>Last Blade
Last Blade 2

>>3676898
>Samurai Shodown which to me seems like Fatal Fury with a different skin

They're COMPLETELY different.

>>3678998
Noted down, thanks.

>>3678437
>I can say it has a more "experimental" feel than other SNK series
This is true.
>1 and 2
SF2 with swords
>III
You got 3 slashes and a single kick button. you're movement options are limited as you have to rely on dodging, blocking or disarming.
All characters have two versions of them with different moves each. Insane damage, even more so with the percentile based counter hit bonuses. Sadly buggy and pretty unbalanced, still fun though

>IV
Expanded on III. Gave everyone a dial a combo, including a 15-hit combo which if you successfully pull off gives you full meter. Apparently their solution for the high damage problem was doubling the size of the life bar and yet add more ways for high damage, including a "Issen" slash that does more damage according to your remaining health.

>V
Life bars went back to normal, no more Slash or Bust versions.Went to two slash buttons, one kick button and a dedicated dodge button. Damage is mitigated by the "Sword meter". Similar to Legendary Axe and Astyanax attack bar. Has the "neverland mode" in which you can activate a bullet time state but only in a round where you would lose the match and you can use your super meter to increase the length of neverland by meditating mid match.
V special is a refinement of the above but adds a fatality move which you can do only in a round that you can win the match in.