/vr/ - Retro Games

>>3628505
fuck off

>>3628509

Games look better emulated than having an original console hooked up to a CRT. Hope that makes you mad

>>3628536
they definitely don't and you are just baiting

>>3628542

Fuck off. There are better ways of playing nes games then blowing into carts and staring at a blurry x-ray box.

>>3628505

>>3628509
>>3628559

Now that the children have left the thread

>>3628505
I have no way of getting an acurate measurement of my frame lag but I use a sony bravia with retroarch and it is probably less than 2 frames off. I have compared them side by side and nobody could tell the difference

>>3628559

You just love any chance to start blowing

>>3628561

Something like that would be my dream set up. The only thing keeping me from ditching original consoles is input lag.

>>3628567
launchbox+bigbox+retroarch

>>3628505
I'm not convinced emulator lag is real. Maybe the high accuracy ones like MAME and Higan do, I don't have much experience with them, but everything I've used feels perfectly fine on a PC monitor.

>>3628578

Emulator lag is bad once it gets added to display lag, input lag, etc.. Noticeable lag makes games unplayable for me, and I'm really itching to ditch my old original hardware. Composite only consoles like news, hardware failure, high games prices...all things I won't miss

>>3628583
>Emulator lag is bad once it gets added to display lag, input lag
That's the thing though, it's usually the display lag not the emulator itself. Using a real console would be worse than a laptop running an emulator.

Then there's input lag. I still play Guitar Hero with a wii on a CRT. That's perfect too. I've tried the lag calibration and get 0ms.

It has to be the TV you're using, the other two are incredibly insignificant.

>>3628592

So there's no option to emulate without having a noticavle amount of lag?

Disabling vsync reduced lag for me (but added tearing).

Your best choice is of course using a CRT with emulators as well.

>>3628578
It is. Here's an article of a guy who wrote Higan: https://byuu.org/articles/latency/

Try games that directly measure your reaction time. The Kirby Minigames are usually a good test. It's there and it's heavy, but you are probably just calibrated to it.

>>3628583
>Composite only consoles
What consoles out there are composite only with no modification available? PC-FX (S-video and Composite). Anything else?

>>3628641
NES notably

>>3628639
I read it. I won't pretend that I understood all of it, but I accept that there is an amount of latency outside of the display. However, I still think it's a very small amount and over exaggerated on this board.

I downloaded Higan but my laptop's too weak for it. So I used snes9x, which should be fair since I specifically omitted MAME and Higan in my post.
I didn't have a snes growing up and there's no way I'm going to collect for it now, so I don't know what these results should have been.

For the punch contest minigame I wasn't able to land the markers perfectly. I was usually a few frames off, both too slow and too fast. Since it wasn't consistently too slow I'm calling it on my inexperience with the game's timing.
For the samurai minigame, on average I got 16. 15 was the fastest, 22 was the slowest. On my NES on a CRT playing Kirby's Adventure, I usually got 16 on the shootout minigame. So I assume that minigame played fine.

My conclusion: I still think the "heavy, horrible emulator lag" is due to using a television over a PC monitor. Either that or it's a placebo effect. You know there's some amount of lag so you begin to think that it's affecting your experience more than it actually is.

I spent too much time on this and have one last thing to say. I'm happy not being able to notice lag. I'm not looking for a reason to be dissatisfied. I have experienced legitimate display lag before and I'm not getting that on my current setup.

>>3628505
What about using something like a plasma screen? Yeah, I know image burn in can be a problem, and games would be particularly prone to causing it, with various HUDs layering in, but what about other factors?

Older screens would at least be far less likely to rely on HDMI ... I guess that would be a significant problem if some people would want to use it with an ODROID.

>>3628653
>with no modification available

>>3628759
>What about using something like a plasma screen?
They're just as laggy as LCD's

>>3628505
I spent my whole life emulating and while im pretty keen to input lag in games, that had never been a problem in emulators for mee, unless it runs at sub-100% speed.

>>3628707
>>3628639
All the autist proved was that RA shills and rapeberry pee are shitty with input lag. Non shills use real emulators without stupid bloated UI and muh filters.

Try again, faggot.

>>3628863
>runs sub-100%
Which never fucking happens unless you using lagdroid phones to emulate ...or rapeberry pie... or old pentium 1 machines dug out from a mormon garage sale..

>>3628868
You're full of shit. RetroArch with bsnes-mercury core has less lag than higan

http://libretro.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5428&page=32&p=44858&viewfull=1#post44858

RA confirmed better than a "real emulator".

>>3628868
I... I cant tell if you are being sarcastic or not. Firstly RA is a FREE product and second Its pretty well known raspis are not optimal emu machines.

They are not comparable

>>3628762
Modding the NES with an NESRGB is literally putting a PPU emulator in your console, you might as well actually emulate or buy a FPGA clone. The NES/FC is composite only, unless you happen to have a Famicom Titler or PlayChoice-10 floating around, you should just deal with playing the machine how intended.

>>3629203
Now compare it to Kega Fusion, nintendofag autist.

>>3629260
>Its pretty well known raspis are not optimal emu machines.
What do you think everyone else was trying to say, besides the shills?

>>3628759
Plasmas have better response time, but they still introduce lag in their scaling and processing.

>>3628868
You *do* realize the point of that article was that RA is actually the emulator with the *least* input lag (and it's still bad)

>>3629316
Nice goal post shifting.

Here is a good article on addressing the concerns about input lag

https://byuu.org/articles/latency/

tldr lots of things going on that can cause input lag. Drivers, tv you're playing on,input polling, emulator itself. Disabling windows aero and vsync helps tremendously in removing a large amount of lag. Disabling windows aero and having a <1 frame input monitor goes a long way to having a good experience. Also keep in mind input lag is cumulative, which is why it is hard to diagnose when so many things are contribute to it.

If im not mistaken, I don't think its possible to get 1:1 input lag for emulators vs the real thing while maintaining accuracy. You can get very close with specific builds (around 1 frame or less) like shmupmame with SSF2T

>>3628578
I have a pretty fast LCD, not great but good enough for modern FPS, and I don't notice very much input lag. The OLED on my phone is better though, I have completed games on it I can't on my PC monitor. If you guys are willing to play on a small screen an OLED phone with a controller and a stand might be a decent solution if you don't have space for a CRT

>>3629554

This is the point I'm trying to get to. I understand that lag is inevitable, but reducing it as much as possible so games like Tyson's punch out are playable again.

>>3629348
Scalling? Since we're talking emulation here, shouldn't it be sometimes possible to do the scaling outside the monitor, by feeding the screen it's native resolution over DVI?

A few years ago I started speed running Super Mario Bros 3 for the NES. I started on my ZSNES emulator (Lots of experience playing other games on it with no problems before I started speed running) and I got the timing down for the first world and used save states to practice the parts I was having troubles with.

Eventually I plugged in using the original hardware and my timing was completely off because the game was running faster on the original hardware (North American NES with a CRT screen).

After getting the first 4 worlds memorized on my original hardware I visited a friend with a new flat screen HDTV (This was 2015). We played a few NES games and had to troubles, then when I wanted to show him my SMB3 skills my timing was off because I noticed the input lag. He was able to play fine but I was running into enemies constantly because my jumps were delayed, but I didn't have this problem playing Megaman or any of the other games because I wasn't used to the specific timing for my speedrunning.

This is my opinion, that it does exist but most people say it doesn't exist because they get accustomed to the lag and adapt to it. Like I said, I had no problems playing any other games on an emulator or on his HDTV but I noticed it when trying to speedrun a game.

>>3628505
Most emulators have near zero actual lag or delay. It is a meme or idiots parroting something they heard once, that is unfounded and untrue.

Sony 1080p LEDs, at least a good portion of them, since 2011 have had about a little delay as possible in total. Samsung UHD tvs since 2014 are in the same boat.

With PC mode on, Samsung UHDs (8000 and 9000 specifically) have gaming monitor levels of delay. More TV's in the past 5 years than not, have had less than 20ms of total delay, that is BEFORE game/PC mode is activated.

If 5-15ms total delay is causing you trouble on some games, you might be the problem.

>>3631961
See my above post

>>3631905

>tfw nobody notices but me and I can't show off my super sweet speedrunning skills
>next time I hook up to the CRT downstairs and everybody is impressed
> :)

>>3631961

5-15ms isn't the issue. My post said I'd be good with 30ms or less. How expensive would a laptop be that could do sub 30ms with a wired control? I'd only be aiming to emulate ps1 and earlier. Could a Windows tablet pull this off too?

>>3628547
>Implying there are better ways of playing nes games than* blowing into carts and staring at a blurry x-ray box.

>>3631905
>ZSNES

>>3628505
I have a Sony TV that supposedly has 16ms input latency, which is 1 frame. I haven't done any initial tests but I was playing ST on it the other week and I can hit 1 frame reversals almost every time and react to things just like I can on the real arcade machine.

>>3632875

I like the sound of that. I'd l9ve to have an emulator box with a nice LCD screen. Games look soon goddamn good on them.(As you can tell, I don't give a goddamn about scanlines)

>>3628505
>LCD tv

Not going to happen.

Now, if you said LCD monitor, then maybe.