/vr/ - Retro Games

>>3593763

you just have shitty taste.

>>3593763
played it but never owned it.
seems slower, handles not like the original nes 3
grew up with mario 1, 2 and 3 ... just seemed off compared to those 3 games

>>3593763
The massive, noticeable reduction in difficulty is what probably turned you off, judging by your criteria OP.

It's still a great game in it's own right though. If it really doesn't suit your fancy, I highly recommend Super Mario All-Stars.

>>3593763

Are you this guy? >>3584412

>>3593763
It was never the game I imagined it to be when I first saw it demoed in shops.

Good though. Yoshi's Island is more like the game I thought SMW was going to be when I saw it in shop.

>>3594476
>faked scanlines
He's definitely an asshole. That much is clear.

OK, this is not what OP asked, but: is there a point in collecting all dragon coins in SMW? It's hardly accounted in the game like, say, in NSMB. I feel they add another layer of challenge, but it's hard to keep track of them.

>>3594524
>is there a point in collecting all dragon coins in SMW?
Yes. The point is to play the game more.

>>3594524
Nope, but Super Mario Advance 2 has a menu that shows how many Dragon Coins you got in each level. I don't know if they actually have a purpose in that version, though.

>>3593763
If you played a lot of 1-3 it could just be you were burnt out on the Mario formula so by the time you played World it just didn't seem as special. Happens with many game series.

>>3594601
It's a nice premise for a collectathon, and the coins seem to deliberately be placed in hidden/tough to get to spots to create challenge. Too bad they hardly get counted anywhere.

Difficulty, graphics, map exploration as opposed to linear gameplay? Those are the reasons I dislike it.

>>3595934
>map exploration
Finding new secret exits over time was always fun for me, personally. I remember seeing Torpedo Ted in the ending credits and trying to find the only level he was in for years to no avail. Finally finding it, along with the secret back entrance to Bowser's Castle, felt great back in the day.
I totally get the appeal of linear game progression, though. I prefer it in most platformers, actually. At least the secrets in SMW are (mostly) optional. You're right about it being too easy, though.

There are no bricks for you to break.

Yoshi and the Cape are completely broken.

There's little variety in level envrionments. Most of the levels are grassy plains.

>>3595972
>There are no bricks for you to break.

>little variety

grass, underground, sky, underwater, ice (only a few, but still), forest, ghost house, I'd say there is a nice variety. Maybe you mean not enough variety in terms of "worlds" like in SMB3, but if you notice, levels on SMB3 are also divided like that, grass, underground, sky, etc. It's the basis of SMB level themes.

>Yoshi and cape broken

Do small-mario only runs.

After 25+ years of playing Mario games, they're all "broken" for me if I use powerups.

>>3593763
i got mine with the snes set on day one, smashed it with a hammer once i finished browser or what the fat fuck is called, out of pure hatred for mario in general

>>3596161
What did your parents do when they found out their son was autistically violent?

>>3596152
The problem is, a lot of passes in SMW require cape.

>>3596173
that's not true. you can complete 95 out of 96 exits without the cape.

>>3596164
Lol this

>>3596152
>they're all "broken" for me if I use powerups
yeah I remember when I skipped most of the levels in SMB3 with the Hammer Bro suit

oh wait that didn't happen

>>3596498
you know that you're allowed to play games in the way that you want to play them right?

like, you don't have to do something in a game if you don't want to.

this isn't that complicated.

>>3596480
I am no expert on SMW but I remember a lot of stuff that was hardly reachable without cape. E.g. that exit in the stage when you first get cape, for example. Another example: that place where you have the floor made of blocks. Sure, you can crunch them, but not rotate them without cape. Maybe not an exit, but still it had some interesting stuff lying there. Without cape it's nothing but sadness.

>>3596507
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STliwoEohMI

>>3596507
>that exit in the stage when you first get cape, for example
hit the green block switch and run up you fucking retard. other options are jumping off yoshi, or doing a shell jump.

>Another example: that place where you have the floor made of blocks.
you can reach every location in that stage without using the cape.

>>3596516
>>3596539
OK I was wrong. As I said I'm no expert

>>3593763
Because you're a faggot?

>>3593763
>Why do I hate this game so much?

BECAUSE BOWSER LIVES IN SOME UNDERGROUND LAS VEGAS INSTEAD OF A SHADY GRAVEYARD AND HE PILOTS SOME STUPID CLOWNMOBILE

>>3596507
>>3596573

well at least you gave your well qualified opinion

>>3593763
maybe something is wrong with you? Go to a doctor and get checked out.

But seriously, finding new secrets in this game was the thing that kept it going, back in the day when your only way of looking up for solutions was a strategy guide you were always hyped if you found out another way to open that sweet spot you haven't seen before
>The Star Road is not the end

>>3594438
>reduction in difficulty

wut? If you are going for difficulty then playing the first one only small is probably your best bet, but they are all piss easy as shit.

All in all imho Mario games are only still enjoyable when you give yourself limitations, e.g. small-runs, speed-runs, no warping, etc... If you use the cape to fly over every level and you don't like playing it that way...then don't...but hey, what do i know.

>>3596516
That video uses the Blue Yoshi which is even more broken than the cape.

>>3598621
SMB3 is much, much harder than SMW. I'm pretty sure that's what he meant.

>>3596516

I can do that in that time

>>3598637

>getting 99 lives in 1-1
>getting 99 lives in 1-2
>getting 2 whistles in world 1 and have access to all worlds

I think it is not that much, much harder

I agree with this guy >>3585801 .
The level design is flat and boring, and only star/special world had any remotely challenging levels while smb3 gets gradually more and more harder as you progress. Not to mention smb3 has more variety in world themes, while SMW is 1/3 generic grassland levels with some minor palette-swaps to give illusion of variety.

I also didn't like how they dropped multiple unique powerups, which really didn't come back until recently with 3D world.

Im not saying SMW is bad game in any way, but its definitely my second least replayed (main) mario game(with least being NSMB).

>>3598660
The levels themselves are harder, stupid. And not because they're really that hard, but SMW is piss-easy. The only levels that offer some remote kind of challenge are in the Special Zone.

I still love the game, but you should try playing both of them again and you'll notice the difference.

>>3598743

I have played both of them more times than probably any other game in my lifetime, smb3 isn't harder just different physics. I don't know what should be so hard compared to smw, please elaborate i guess i am too stupid for noticing the hard parts

>>3598767
Well on the top of my head, I would the level designs which have more enemies and occasions to get killed. The airship levels for example, there isn't anything quite like that in SMW.

As for the controls, I personally prefer SMB3, but SMW is solid as well. Especially after playing so much SMM.

>>3598774

well if you are talking about bullet hell and auto-moving levels, smw just had the same amount but split up. There are the underground autolevels with the gold sand blocks which can be quite a pain in the butt as well as the moving dungeons, and probably many people have died trying to get the rhythm. You have a bunch of levels with banzai bills and the cross-shooting bullets as well as your average bullet shooters and the underwater torpedos. Design-wise i would not say the one has less than the other it's more of an opinion as you can give both of the level design-difficulty to your liking.

Not knowing where the hidden block palaces are for example surely pushes the difficulty also, i just have to think of all the trapped moleppl and thwomps that would else ruin your run... it is not as obvious where all these palaces are from the start (just like the whistles in smb, whereas 'the wizard' at least showed you where to get the whistle before the game even came out blatantly commercialising the game). Knowing your ways in the game how to get through easy is not an excuse of how easy the game is in itself, i could map out how to get through smb3 as well as smw in a jiffy without much effort.

I think whole debate is as similar as the castlevania threads, one is just more linear as the other and focuses a bit on different playstyle, thus having less value for exploration and more of a trigger finger attitude, you can guess which one is which. Both good games, but both not hard (imo)

>3596152
>Do small-mario only runs.
That doesn't change the Cape and Yoshi being broken and poorly designed.

>>3598838

>what is p-wing, clouds and item hoarding

>>3598810
I agree it is mostly a matter of opinions. I believe SMB3 is harder, but I don't really care about finding an argument for it, especially since both are indeed easy when you know them by heart, which is most likely our case.

>>3593763
I like this game can't really fault it but i have to say i do find it to be a little bit bland, the stages feel very samey after a while and it becomes a chore to play all the way to the end. Mario 3 is a much more interesting game.

>>3598858
P-wing and cloud can only be used per level, plus if you use cloud to skip level and then die, you get sent back and have to beat the level you skipped. Plus items in smb3 are limited in quantity, and you don't get them that easily, most of them being hidden in levels or in world map. In SMW you can replay levels, have the top secret area and you can quit back to overworld on already beaten levels, so you can very easily get cape/fire flowers and yoshi with zero effort.

At earliest point that you get P-wing is after beating world1, while you get cape in second world in SMW, P-wing can only be used once, it goes away after beating level or getting hit, while losing cape is harder and you can get multiple ones in same level, which also can be replayed as many times as you want. So in comparison, any powerups and Yoshi ARE broken.

Before you bring up the smb3's hidden, white toad house in 1-4, its well hidden and in level you dont even need to beat(to progress), and again one-time only. Hoarding has nothing todo with anything since its not really hoarding when items are limited(how many there are and how many you can carry), and you need to play quite bit before one can even call it hoarding. Plus some of the items you dont even get that early, for example hammer suit appears in world6 at earliest, and you only get one freebie cloud from beating world.

TL;DR, items in smb3 are limited while in SMW you can get as many items you want, at any point.

>>3598858
Lets go by your own logic. Go do smw small only then mario 3 small only. Tell me which is harder

>>3599018

Actually SMW. Not activating the color switches also add challenge to the level design, since those basically add extra platforms.

Playing with small Mario actually makes it easier if you know how to play, this is true in most games as small character = smaller hitbox, but in SMW's case, small Mario is a great because he can fit through small places if you duck while jumping, making him on only able to go through special small-mario only passages, but also it's useful to dodge enemies or ceilings that would derive your trajectory if you touch them. High-level SMW gameplay feels a lot like controlling a fast, small ball.
Literally faster than sanic.

>>3599018
SMW by far.

>>3593763
Let's get this shit started.

SMB3>SMB2J>SMB1>SML2>SMW2>SMB2>SMW>SML

>>3599169
IMO:

SMB3 > SMB2U > SML2 > SMB2J > SMB1 > SML > SMW

>>3599169
>>3599192
>unironically bashing smw
shit taste both of you

>>3599121
Ducking while small mario doesn't change his hitbox at all in smw, its literally same when jumping and duck-jumping. And you can fit into small places with small mario in smb3 too same way you can in smw, so theres no differences with both games when it comes to that.

Also moving goalposts, nice.

T. TASfaggot

>>3599196
It's the weakest retro 2D Mario.

>>3599169

SMW > SMB3 > SMB2 > SMB > SML2 > SML > SMB2J

I don't dislike 2J, I've completed it many times and it's fun, but just the one I played the least. It is fun, but it's not necessarily better than the original, which I also like but not as much as the ones that came after it.
I consider Yoshi's Island a whole different beast, even if it does have a lot of elements from SMB2 and World. But if I had to rank it within the mainline Mario games, it would probably be on the top 3, easily.

>>3593763
>Why do I hate this game so much?

Because the NES games are platformers with enormous weight on physics and momentum. Running and stopping was harder in the earlier games, which meant a small learning curve and then sheer exhilaration as you command a man missle flying through levels. Super Mario World is much less slippery, and there's not much momentum behind jumps, so it feels more static and less dynamic. All the level design and new features in the world can't replace great core gameplay mechanics.

>>3599228

>SMW
>static
>less dynamic

Are we playing the same game?

>>3599242
Did you read the post or did you see trigger words and replied? Less dynamic meaning there are less physics behind every movement. It's not really subjective.

>>3599251
There are more dynamic physics in SM64 than any other Mario game. Guess it's the best Mario game.

>>3599256
It's pretty fun to fuck around in, jump and lunge, triple jump, wall jump, yeah. Not my favorite Mario though.

>>3599256
It undoubtedly is

>>3599251

What are you calling "physics" here? Help me follow your logic that SMW is "static".

>>3599267
>Running and stopping was harder in the earlier games

It's a feedback thing. If you're driving a car, it's fun to go fast because of the implications, which is that it's dangerous, and you feel that there are forces stripping you of control. If driving fast felt the same as sitting in park, you would never drive fast. SMW is more paper like, Mario can change direction in air and has very little weight. It's not as fun to run around in as the NES games.

>>3599276

>fun

I thought you said this was not subjective.
And I still don't get how SMW has "less physics" or how it's static.
Physics from earlier SMB games also let you change direction in mid-air. SMB3's physics are already different enough from SMB1.

>>3593763
This game was specifically designed for tard americans and elementary school kids. The football guys, superman cape, a dinosaur (jurassic park). The whole game is a cash in. It was a nice showcase of graphics at the time, but it was no SMB3.

>>3599307

>implying

It was made to appeal to the japanese public, the west is an afterthought.

>>3599297
>I thought you said this was not subjective.

I said it's not subjective that it takes longer to stop running. You suck dick at reading.

>And I still don't get how SMW has "less physics" or how it's static.

Reread the above.

>Physics from earlier SMB games also let you change direction in mid-air.

It's much, much more difficult. The whole reasoning behind this argument is that since it's arguable which games have the best levels, items, enemies, etc, and since a lot of people enjoy playing around with physics, (obviously not you), it may be a pretty big reason why someone enjoys the NES games better.

>>3599307
Jurassic Park came out like 3 years after SMW first came out in Japan.

>>3593763
you're an autist easier to figure out than the game itself....really makes you think?

>>3599320
HAHAHAHA

>>3599313
>It's much, much more difficult.
It's not really at all.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7Yl7rfUnGA

>>3599325
Can't move as much as SMW

They're different games though, so it makes sense.

>>3599228
>Running and stopping was harder in the earlier games, which meant a small learning curve and then sheer exhilaration as you command a man missle flying through levels. Super Mario World is much less slippery, and there's not much momentum behind jumps, so it feels more static and less dynamic
I agree with that.

>All the level design and new features in the world can't replace great core gameplay mechanics.
How does the above equate to great core mechanics? On the opposite, I would say SMW is better because you have more control over Mario than in SMW.

>>3599307
>>3599315
Dinosaurs were very popular during that time, not just because of Jurassic Park.

>>3599325
SMB and SMB2J were much more stiff than this.

>>3599424
Than in SMB*, obviously.

>>3598972
>>3598972
>if you use cloud to skip level and then die
>>3598972
>it goes away after getting hit

well ya see,i think there is your problem :^)

I don't know how you play, but my last item always gets relaced by the next one i pick up, so indeed it's three long slots full of items which i consider just as many options as you would have when holding items in smw throughout the game.

>>3599018
I have done both many times in form of speeding through the game and still would say smw is trickier to pull off, since the enemies have more directional options. Most of SMB3's enemie movement is horizontal with some form of gimmick, e.g. boomerang, big berta + little fish, the falling beetles...

The sun, lakitu, boo and maybe a flying shitting goomba are the only ones that differ from that playstyle
>run past goomba or use block to kill from bottom
>sun is allergic to shells
>lakitu and boo are the same bitch as ever
both the sun and lakitu show up like 2 times in the game, and the goomba shitter isn't very hard at all.

Other than that, right to left + gimmick. SMW at least has some sort of variety with flying enemies like koopas and bats or auto-homing shells,rip van fish and moles. Each chuck is like a boom boom with faster hit detection and different abilities.

Again, I love both games but i would not say that one is harder than the other, the franchise is made piss easy from the getgo,the only difficulty was your age

>>3599307
>but it was no SMB3.
You are right in only that. It was far better.

>>3593763

I never liked this game either. The powerups, Yoshi included, are boring, the dinosaur theme is boring (I would have loved it if the levels reflected the food themes more). The game just doesn't have the exciting sense of playing with physics or momentum as the NES games did. It is too refined. The ghost houses, water levels, and fortresses are all chores. Finding all the secret exits should be exciting but instead it just feels like work.

Controlling Mario just doesn't feel that fun in the game, as it did in the others.

it's ok to not like a game

>>3599871

This.

Also I feel like SMB threads turned into the same kind of "poser hardcore gamer" bullshit that other series' threads also became, like Castlevania.

>it's bad because it's too easy! cape too OP! Mario moves too well and it should be stiffer!

What do you want, a "hardcore gamer" medal?
Fuck off already.

>>3599874
This, i believe there's some kind of issue in this board where some people think they are better for playing mario without dying or they think hating series like resident evil after 3 and castlevania after the 16 bit era is absolutely radical.

The thing they seem to miss is that these games were never intended to be some kind of "hardcore gaming", they were some of the most popular and loved games of their times. Just because modern gaming allows you to save whenever you want doesn't mean that all old games were some kind of "easy to learn, hard to master" masterpieces.

>>3599874
Yes, fuck off already!